Even a Caveman could do it
 

Stefan Wolfe wrote:
...
The new Monkey General class :-)




Tell me, what do you as being so difficult about amateur radio that
would make the test difficult, perhaps I am missing something? What
relevant and complex details are missing from the exams?

It may just have to do with the abundance of technical materials where
were available to me in my past. Or, perhaps it was my interest in all
things technical--but there didn't seem to be that type of mystery,
magic or difficulty involved in electronics or radio ...

Regards,
JS

Even a Caveman could do it
 

"John Smith I" wrote in message
...
Stefan Wolfe wrote:
...
The new Monkey General class :-)




Tell me, what do you as being so difficult about amateur radio that would
make the test difficult, perhaps I am missing something? What relevant
and complex details are missing from the exams?

It may just have to do with the abundance of technical materials where
were available to me in my past. Or, perhaps it was my interest in all
things technical--but there didn't seem to be that type of mystery, magic
or difficulty involved in electronics or radio ...

Regards,
JS

I think that may very well be the case. I've had occasion to teach ham
radio classes to people who have had little or no math beyond basic
arithmetic. I've taught people who have no technical background or exposure
to electronics or radio. If all you ever had was a general science class,
the ionosphere is a big mystery and so on. There are lots of hams from all
backgrounds and callings. Our club includes members who are truck drivers,
housewives, nurses, waiters, construction workers, etc. as well as
electronic technicians. Maybe you should do as you have said to me: You
need to get out more teasing and tongue in cheek.

Dee, N8UZE

Even a Caveman could do it
 

Dee Flint wrote:
I think that may very well be the case. I've had occasion to teach ham
radio classes to people who have had little or no math beyond basic
arithmetic. I've taught people who have no technical background or exposure
to electronics or radio. If all you ever had was a general science class,
the ionosphere is a big mystery and so on. There are lots of hams from all
backgrounds and callings. Our club includes members who are truck drivers,
housewives, nurses, waiters, construction workers, etc. as well as
electronic technicians. Maybe you should do as you have said to me: You
need to get out more teasing and tongue in cheek.

Dee, N8UZE



I see math as the smallest barrier to a ham ticket. Simple antenna
calculations are about the most complex an amateur needs; these are only
near the equivalent to what one needs to keep up their financial
affairs, double check their utility bills, measure a room for new
carpeting, etc.

Simple LC calculations, again, only use that same level of math, if say
one wishes to design an antenna tuner, balun, filter, etc.

If you could give me something "absolutely specific", an example,
perhaps I could see what is being suggested here ...

Regards,
JS

Even a Caveman could do it
 

"John Smith I" wrote in message
...
Dee Flint wrote:
I think that may very well be the case. I've had occasion to teach ham
radio classes to people who have had little or no math beyond basic
arithmetic. I've taught people who have no technical background or
exposure to electronics or radio. If all you ever had was a general
science class, the ionosphere is a big mystery and so on. There are lots
of hams from all backgrounds and callings. Our club includes members who
are truck drivers, housewives, nurses, waiters, construction workers,
etc. as well as electronic technicians. Maybe you should do as you have
said to me: You need to get out more teasing and tongue in cheek.

Dee, N8UZE

I see math as the smallest barrier to a ham ticket. Simple antenna
calculations are about the most complex an amateur needs; these are only
near the equivalent to what one needs to keep up their financial affairs,
double check their utility bills, measure a room for new carpeting, etc.

Simple LC calculations, again, only use that same level of math, if say
one wishes to design an antenna tuner, balun, filter, etc.

If you could give me something "absolutely specific", an example, perhaps
I could see what is being suggested here ...

Regards,
JS

The difficulties arise in series versus parallel circuits for resistors
versus inductors versus capacitors. They have no trouble with adding the
values of resistors in series as that is logical to the students but the
calculation procedure for resistors in parallel makes no sense to most when
they have no background in electronics. They are able to do the procedure
when you walk them through it. However, the fact that it doesn't make sense
to them makes it difficult to remember the procedure. Then you go to
capacitors and even though the equations are the same, it doesn't make sense
that the series calculation and parallel calculations are the opposite of
what you do with resistors. This is but one example.

Dee, N8UZE

Even a Caveman could do it
 

Dee Flint wrote:

The difficulties arise in series versus parallel circuits for resistors
versus inductors versus capacitors. They have no trouble with adding the
values of resistors in series as that is logical to the students but the
calculation procedure for resistors in parallel makes no sense to most when
they have no background in electronics. They are able to do the procedure
when you walk them through it. However, the fact that it doesn't make sense
to them makes it difficult to remember the procedure. Then you go to
capacitors and even though the equations are the same, it doesn't make sense
that the series calculation and parallel calculations are the opposite of
what you do with resistors. This is but one example.

Dee, N8UZE



For resistors in series:

R1 + R2 + R3 + ... = R(TOTAL)

For the special case of only two resistors in parallel:

R1 X R2
------- = R(TOTAL)
R1 + R2

general case:

1
----------------- = R(TOTAL)
1 1 1
--- + --- + --- + ...
R1 R2 R3

the above holds for inductance ...
and, as you say, capacitance the reverse ...

Really Dee, did that give you all that many problems? I see nothing
there but basic math.

Seriously, give me an avg. youngster, 8th grade or older, and I will
give you back a youngster capable of all the above ...

Regards,
JS

Even a Caveman could do it
 

John Smith I wrote:
For resistors in series:

R1 + R2 + R3 + ... = R(TOTAL)

For the special case of only two resistors in parallel:

R1 X R2
------- = R(TOTAL)
R1 + R2

general case:

1
----------------- = R(TOTAL)
1 1 1
--- + --- + --- + ...
R1 R2 R3

the above holds for inductance ...
and, as you say, capacitance the reverse ...

Really Dee, did that give you all that many problems? I see nothing
there but basic math.

Seriously, give me an avg. youngster, 8th grade or older, and I will
give you back a youngster capable of all the above ...

Regards,
JS

Oh yeah, what would you say to learn ALL of that, 1/2 hour?

JS

Even a Caveman could do it
 

"John Smith I" wrote in message
...
John Smith I wrote:
For resistors in series:

R1 + R2 + R3 + ... = R(TOTAL)

For the special case of only two resistors in parallel:

R1 X R2
------- = R(TOTAL)
R1 + R2

general case:

1
----------------- = R(TOTAL)
1 1 1
--- + --- + --- + ...
R1 R2 R3

the above holds for inductance ...
and, as you say, capacitance the reverse ...

Really Dee, did that give you all that many problems? I see nothing
there but basic math.

Seriously, give me an avg. youngster, 8th grade or older, and I will give
you back a youngster capable of all the above ...

Regards,
JS

Oh yeah, what would you say to learn ALL of that, 1/2 hour?

JS

It gave me no trouble whatsoever. It was a piece of cake compared to
differential calculus, etc.

However it doesn't make sense to a homemaker or secretary. Therefore it
becomes difficult for them to remember how to do it. It's not difficult for
them to do actually just difficult to remember how to do it as they have
nothing to tie it to so to speak.

Dee, N8UZE

Even a Caveman could do it
 

Dee Flint wrote:
However it doesn't make sense to a homemaker or secretary. Therefore it
becomes difficult for them to remember how to do it. It's not difficult for
them to do actually just difficult to remember how to do it as they have
nothing to tie it to so to speak.

Dee, N8UZE



And, that is why someone should just digest it, study the night before
with their mentor, then reguratate it at the exam ... then quickly
forget it ... if you need it in the future, a quick review and bam! it
is at your disposal.

Regards,
JS

Even a Caveman could do it
 

John Smith I wrote:

reguratate = regurgitate

sheepish smile
JS

Even a Caveman could do it
 

For resistors in series:

R1 + R2 + R3 + ... = R(TOTAL)

For the special case of only two resistors in parallel:

R1 X R2
------- = R(TOTAL)
R1 + R2

general case:

1
----------------- = R(TOTAL)
1 1 1
--- + --- + --- + ...
R1 R2 R3


For extra credit, prove that

R1 X R2
------- = R(TOTAL)
R1 + R2

is in fact the same as

1
----------- = R(TOTAL)
1 1
--- + ---
R1 R2


Unless you are a crackerjack math wiz, these equations look totally
different. Another point of confusion.


And the stuff cavemen knew would be stuff a city boy like myself doesn't
have a clue about. How to hunt animals with nothing better than crude
spears and rocks, knowing what plants are safe to eat and what's
poisonous, etc.... Different environments, they didn't need to know
about car insurance.

Even a Caveman could do it
 

"robert casey" wrote in message
ink.net...


[snip]


And the stuff cavemen knew would be stuff a city boy like myself doesn't
have a clue about. How to hunt animals with nothing better than crude
spears and rocks, knowing what plants are safe to eat and what's
poisonous, etc.... Different environments, they didn't need to know about
car insurance.

This is an item that people overlook when they talk about cavemen or
"primitive aborigines", etc. Most of us would die before we learned enough
to survive under the conditions they lived in. Even a genius, out of his
own environment, is helpless unless and until he learns how to survive in
the new one. Our caveman ancestors were no dummies.

Dee, N8UZE

Even a Caveman could do it
 

Dee Flint wrote:

This is an item that people overlook when they talk about cavemen or
"primitive aborigines", etc. Most of us would die before we learned enough
to survive under the conditions they lived in. Even a genius, out of his
own environment, is helpless unless and until he learns how to survive in
the new one. Our caveman ancestors were no dummies.

Dee, N8UZE



Ahhh, now you are looking good Dee.

This is what I have always known. It is not wrote memorization which is
a true sign of greater intelligence, it is the ability to meet the
unknown on uncertain terms and solve the riddles.

It is the ability to be dropped in the middle of the unknown and
unfamiliar and come walking out alive ... I think I am nearing the end
of this newsgroup now, damn jungle in here!!! tense-strained-look

To the true explorer, logic is his compass.

Warmest regards,
JS

Even a Caveman could do it
 

"robert casey" wrote in message news:A%imh.9733

And the stuff cavemen knew would be stuff a city boy like myself doesn't
have a clue about. How to hunt animals with nothing better than crude
spears and rocks, knowing what plants are safe to eat and what's
poisonous, etc.... Different environments, they didn't need to know about
car insurance.

I agree, stuff like how to walk upright, inventing the wheel, inventing fire
:-))

Even a Caveman could do it
 

John Smith I wrote:
Dee Flint wrote:

This is an item that people overlook when they talk about cavemen or
"primitive aborigines", etc. Most of us would die before we learned enough
to survive under the conditions they lived in. Even a genius, out of his
own environment, is helpless unless and until he learns how to survive in
the new one. Our caveman ancestors were no dummies.

And not all of the cavemen were our ancestors.

Ahhh, now you are looking good Dee.

This is what I have always known. It is not wrote memorization which is
a true sign of greater intelligence, it is the ability to meet the
unknown on uncertain terms and solve the riddles.

I think you missed the point.

It is the ability to be dropped in the middle of the unknown and
unfamiliar and come walking out alive ... I think I am nearing the end
of this newsgroup now, damn jungle in here!!! tense-strained-look

To the true explorer, logic is his compass.

But without background information, much of which is rote-memorized,
and learned skills, logic alone won't keep the person alive.

There's not just one type of intelligence, either.

Even a Caveman could do it
 

Even a Caveman could do it
 

John Smith I wrote:
wrote:
...

Yes N2EY, we know your mind set ... or, perhaps I speak for others, if
so, I KNOW!

You can't possibly know, John, there's been NO past postings
about that anyone can Google up to "prove" it! :-)

With most, it takes me a bit to decide if they are actually part of the
problem or part of the solution. Over a year ago we had previous
dialog, there you proved to me you are part OF the problem ...

Oh, my, that has to be SUBSTANTIATED! stern look

You'll have to post the posts where you PROVE that!

google-search frenzy in process

LA
not looking

Even a Caveman could do it
 

Even a Caveman could do it
 

From: John Smith I on Thurs, Jan 4 2007 4:54 pm

wrote:
...

Len:

To me, in my personal opinion, my personal "take on things", what I
believe, what I "feel":

N2EY is a legend in his own mind. To me, he is a petty individual who
is totally self-serving, controlling and disgusting--if he has a wife--I
pity her ... time and time again, here, all I have ever seen him do is
attempt to push his ideas and wants upon others--even to the point of
being belligerently self-serving!

But, this is only my personal opinion ...

My take is that the morsemen in here have some of the
thinest skin of all humankind. Not just Miccolis, but
Heil, Kelly, Wince Ficus (aka "Slow Code"), and a host
of other old-style morsemen, some of whom have gone
beyond to that great code room "up above."

Add to that a large measure of smug arrogance in
older days...days when they felt that morse code
testing would "never" go away...and morse code skill
is the epitome, the most important skill any amateur
could have...and the morsemen RULE hamdom.

I have to agree with you on the extreme pettiness
Miccolis has exhibited. In trying to salve his
personal word wounds (received in opinion "battle")
he goes to extremes in petty-pointing EXACT WORDS
on quotes with DEMANDS that all his challengers
bring back old, old areguments to "prove" he never
said what he said. The rationales are over the top.

The pettiness gets over the top when he INSISTS on
arguing subjects that are almost 8 years old (such
as my Reply to Comments on NPRM 98-143 which the
FCC marked as received in January 1999). It is over
the top when he implies my moral-ethical 'wrongness'
on not "carrying out my 'promise' to go for extra-
out-of-the-box in 2000." His world doesn't allow
anyone to change their mind...EVER! :-(

However, to even remotely disagree with these
Mighty Macho Morsemen is to invoke much wasted
bandwidth of beligerant, accusatory "charges" of
impropriety and "wrongness" of a personal nature,
all of which are designed and manufactured to
belittle, demean, and generally say nasty to all
NCTAs. Who needs that? Is that what US amateur
radio is "all about?" Fuggem I say.

LA