"Hans K0HB" wrote in message
om...
(N2EY) wrote


It is a fact of human nature that most people value a thing more if it
took some investment of themselves to acquire.


Jim, you really need to retire this old mantra.

'It is a fact of human nature' that real people don't value a thing
based on it's 'investment' or 'cost', but rather based on the
usefulness, utility, comfort, satisfaction, or enjoyment that comes
from having it.

My amateur license cost me virtually nothing in terms of 'investment
of myself', and the curbs and gutters the city just installed at one
of my places cost me an $8,200 assessment. I value my amateur license
a LOT more than I value the city's new street curbing!

You invested your time, interest, and self in the amateur license. You
merely put money into the curbs and gutters. In the minds of many people,
the investment in your amateur license was far greater that your investment
in curbs and gutters.


The things that I value the very most quite honestly are literal gifts
which I have recieved without an ounce of 'investment' or 'cost' ---
the love of my wife, the smiles of my grandkids, the whisper of the
wind at sunset on Lake Vermilion, the conversation with an old friend,
or my healthy heart. I value all of these more than my homes, my RV,
my boat, or the QSL collection in the closet.


The love of your wife and all these things are not free and are not gifts.
A loving relationship requires a large and continuous investment of self
(not money) to endure and to be worth while. Each of the other items also
requires some type of investment from you that doesn't necessary involve
money.

Investment is not exclusively a monetary term.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE

"Dee D. Flint" wrote in message
.com...

"Hans K0HB" wrote in message
om...
(N2EY) wrote


It is a fact of human nature that most people value a thing more if it
took some investment of themselves to acquire.


Jim, you really need to retire this old mantra.

'It is a fact of human nature' that real people don't value a thing
based on it's 'investment' or 'cost', but rather based on the
usefulness, utility, comfort, satisfaction, or enjoyment that comes
from having it.

My amateur license cost me virtually nothing in terms of 'investment
of myself', and the curbs and gutters the city just installed at one
of my places cost me an $8,200 assessment. I value my amateur license
a LOT more than I value the city's new street curbing!

You invested your time, interest, and self in the amateur license. You
merely put money into the curbs and gutters. In the minds of many people,
the investment in your amateur license was far greater that your
investment
in curbs and gutters.


The things that I value the very most quite honestly are literal gifts
which I have recieved without an ounce of 'investment' or 'cost' ---
the love of my wife, the smiles of my grandkids, the whisper of the
wind at sunset on Lake Vermilion, the conversation with an old friend,
or my healthy heart. I value all of these more than my homes, my RV,
my boat, or the QSL collection in the closet.


The love of your wife and all these things are not free and are not gifts.
A loving relationship requires a large and continuous investment of self
(not money) to endure and to be worth while. Each of the other items also
requires some type of investment from you that doesn't necessary involve
money.

Investment is not exclusively a monetary term.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE


Absolutely. Were they as free as Hans seems to think they are, I really
wonder how valuable they would be.

Kim W5TIT

"Kim W5TIT" wrote


Were they as free as Hans seems to think they are, I really
wonder how valuable they would be.


I will try to end your wondering. First, I don't "seem to think"; for
my value system I "know". All of the things I mentioned are among the
things I value the very most in life. They come to me as free
unconditional gifts which no amount of 'investment' would earn. In
other words, their value is completely independent of their cost.

Without putting words in anyones mouth, it appears from the posts of
you, Jim and Dee, that your value system is based on 'investment gives
beneficial results'. In my value system, the 'results' are valued
solely on merit without regard to how I acquired them.

As a kind of crude example, the value of two $10.00 bills, one which I
found on the street and the other which I performed hard labor to earn
are exactly equal. What I 'invested' in either one is absolutely
immaterial when calculating their value --- the corner grocer will
take either one and give me precisely the same change when I purchase
a jar of olives.

Taking it back to the context of this thread, my amateur license or my
drivers license or my fishing license have value to me based on the
beneficial things I can do with them. The value is not related in any
fashion to the 'cost' or 'effort' that it took to obtain the license.

73, de Hans, K0HB
--

"I came to see your beautiful new baby, not to
listen to a description of your labor pains."
-- K0HB

Hans K0HB wrote:
"Kim W5TIT" wrote


Were they as free as Hans seems to think they are, I really
wonder how valuable they would be.



I will try to end your wondering. First, I don't "seem to think"; for
my value system I "know". All of the things I mentioned are among the
things I value the very most in life. They come to me as free
unconditional gifts which no amount of 'investment' would earn. In
other words, their value is completely independent of their cost.

Without putting words in anyones mouth, it appears from the posts of
you, Jim and Dee, that your value system is based on 'investment gives
beneficial results'. In my value system, the 'results' are valued
solely on merit without regard to how I acquired them.

As a kind of crude example, the value of two $10.00 bills, one which I
found on the street and the other which I performed hard labor to earn
are exactly equal. What I 'invested' in either one is absolutely
immaterial when calculating their value --- the corner grocer will
take either one and give me precisely the same change when I purchase
a jar of olives.

Taking it back to the context of this thread, my amateur license or my
drivers license or my fishing license have value to me based on the
beneficial things I can do with them. The value is not related in any
fashion to the 'cost' or 'effort' that it took to obtain the license.

Good post, and good argument, Hans.

But I wonder if there is no place for pride of accomplishment? In my
other hobby, I spent several years making a large telescope. It was an
intense project, and took a lot of effort. In the end, I was rewarded
with a wonderful, beautiful, and very high quality instrument. It won
first place in the only competition I entered it in.

I'm very proud of it, and very proud of being able to accomplish such a
feat with my own hands. I would have no such thoughts about the purchase
of a commercial telescope of somewhat similar style. So something must
be going on there.



"I came to see your beautiful new baby, not to
listen to a description of your labor pains."

oy!

- Mike KB3EIA -

Mike Coslo wrote


Good post, and good argument, Hans.

But I wonder if there is no place for pride of accomplishment? In my
other hobby, I spent several years making a large telescope. It was an
intense project, and took a lot of effort. In the end, I was rewarded
with a wonderful, beautiful, and very high quality instrument. It won
first place in the only competition I entered it in.


Of course there's room for pride of accomplishment! You ought to see
the walls of my shack covered with awards, the one of most proud of
being "A-1 Operators Club". You ought to see the walls of my office
covered with engineering and business related awards! You ought to
see me beam when I come back off the lake..... well, you get the
picture.

But getting back to the tone of this thread, while I highly value my
amateur license for the benefits it gives me (including trying to
"accomplish" things to be proud of), acquiring the license itself was
a pretty modest accomplishment.

73, de Hans, K0HB

"Hans K0HB" wrote in message
m...
"Kim W5TIT" wrote


Were they as free as Hans seems to think they are, I really
wonder how valuable they would be.


I will try to end your wondering. First, I don't "seem to think"; for
my value system I "know". All of the things I mentioned are among the
things I value the very most in life. They come to me as free
unconditional gifts which no amount of 'investment' would earn. In
other words, their value is completely independent of their cost.

Without putting words in anyones mouth, it appears from the posts of
you, Jim and Dee, that your value system is based on 'investment gives
beneficial results'. In my value system, the 'results' are valued
solely on merit without regard to how I acquired them.

As a kind of crude example, the value of two $10.00 bills, one which I
found on the street and the other which I performed hard labor to earn
are exactly equal. What I 'invested' in either one is absolutely
immaterial when calculating their value --- the corner grocer will
take either one and give me precisely the same change when I purchase
a jar of olives.

Taking it back to the context of this thread, my amateur license or my
drivers license or my fishing license have value to me based on the
beneficial things I can do with them. The value is not related in any
fashion to the 'cost' or 'effort' that it took to obtain the license.

73, de Hans, K0HB

I agree with Hans 100%+ on this one ... the value is in what they let
you do, not what you had to do to get them.

Carl - wk3c

Carl R. Stevenson wrote:
"Hans K0HB" wrote in message


Taking it back to the context of this thread, my amateur license or my
drivers license or my fishing license have value to me based on the
beneficial things I can do with them. The value is not related in any
fashion to the 'cost' or 'effort' that it took to obtain the license.

73, de Hans, K0HB


I agree with Hans 100%+ on this one ... the value is in what they let
you do, not what you had to do to get them.

Well, I wouldn't say so for everyone. Not that I feel all that warm and
fuzzy about getting my drivers license, but there are many labors in my
life that I do feel proud of.

Probably just my disposition. 8^)

- Mike KB3EIA -

"Dee D. Flint" wrote


You invested your time, interest, and self in the amateur license.


Sorry, but the 'investment' was trivial. Long before I thought about
getting an amateur license I already knew Morse code and electronics.
A couple hours brushing up on the common-sense rules was all the
'self' I put into it.

I value my amateur privileges very highly, but the 'cost of entry' was
almost non-existent.

73, Hans, K0HB