In article , "Carl R. Stevenson"
writes:

Carl:

I consider the use of the term "Morse myths" to be derogatory and
inflammatory. Thus, you have also failed to meet Mike's challenge.

73 de Larry, K3LT


Larry,

I don't recall Mike appointing your the judge and arbiter ...

Carl:

In that case, consider my services to have been donated out of my own
generosity.

"Morse Myths" is, as you well know by now, simply a term
that refers to all of the patently false, old wives' tales, such as
"Morse gets through when nothing else will.",

This one is true…

"Morse is essential
for emergency communications.",

Who said that? Provide correctly attributed quote.

"Morse acts as a 'lid filter' to
keep us from being overrun by the "mongul hordes' of CBers
who are lurking in the wings waiting to take over the ham bands."
etc.

I've never said that whatsoever -- in fact, on many occasions, I've gone
out of my way to note that a lot of the problems on HF phone are being
caused by 20-WPM code tested Extras.

I reject your claim that the term "Morse Myths" is derogatory and
inflamatory.

Reject all you want, Carl, but the fact remains that it is. You have taken
the low road, while claiming the opposite.

It is simply a term that refers in "shorthand" form to
a panoply of falacies that are often cited as "reasons why we MUST
keep Morse testing" ... none of which hold water and all of which
have been rejected by the FCC.

I have always presented well-reasoned, factual, and unemotional
arguments in support of code testing. Please don't hold me up to
the same light as those who may have transgressed in the manner
which you refer to above. Above all, please remember that by far,
the largest portion of the QRM in the code/no-code debate has been
from the NCTA side. Also remember that as one who has never
used the Morse/CW mode to an extent which would have allowed
you to gain useful proficiency in the mode, you are not qualified to
judge the value of this mode at all. I'm not sitting here trying to
argue technical topics with you, so don't you try to tell me that the
Morse/CW mode and testing aren't of value to the ARS. We are
not on each other's respective levels of expertise. Since I'm
more than willing to respect your technical expertise, don't presume
to challenge my qualifications to make judgments about CW and
code testing, because you don't know what your talking about.

73 de Larry, K3LT

"Larry Roll K3LT" wrote in message
...

I have always presented well-reasoned, factual, and unemotional
arguments in support of code testing.


*Cough* WHAT?????!!!!! Sure, Larry. That is why you are so endeared by
many in this newsgroup, alone. Sure.



Please don't hold me up to
the same light as those who may have transgressed in the manner
which you refer to above.


PHULEEZE. You are the *BEACON* to those whom Carl depicted, Larry! Forget
about being held up to any light. You *ARE* the light.


Above all, please remember that by far,
the largest portion of the QRM in the code/no-code debate has been
from the NCTA side. Also remember that as one who has never
used the Morse/CW mode to an extent which would have allowed
you to gain useful proficiency in the mode, you are not qualified to
judge the value of this mode at all. I'm not sitting here trying to
argue technical topics with you, so don't you try to tell me that the
Morse/CW mode and testing aren't of value to the ARS. We are
not on each other's respective levels of expertise. Since I'm
more than willing to respect your technical expertise, don't presume
to challenge my qualifications to make judgments about CW and
code testing, because you don't know what your talking about.

73 de Larry, K3LT


And, you obviously think that what you just said, above, is well-reasoned,
factual, and unemotional??!! I've broken my own rule and just responded to
a post from you that was none of the above.

Kim W5TIT

In article , "Kim W5TIT"
writes:

"Larry Roll K3LT" wrote in message
...

I have always presented well-reasoned, factual, and unemotional
arguments in support of code testing.


*Cough* WHAT?????!!!!! Sure, Larry. That is why you are so endeared by
many in this newsgroup, alone. Sure.

Why, Kim, I thought you were ignoring me because I don't post anything
here worthy of your response. Where did I go wrong this time?

Please don't hold me up to
the same light as those who may have transgressed in the manner
which you refer to above.

PHULEEZE. You are the *BEACON* to those whom Carl depicted, Larry! Forget
about being held up to any light. You *ARE* the light.

Sorry, Kim, not me. Jesus is the "light."

Above all, please remember that by far,
the largest portion of the QRM in the code/no-code debate has been
from the NCTA side. Also remember that as one who has never
used the Morse/CW mode to an extent which would have allowed
you to gain useful proficiency in the mode, you are not qualified to
judge the value of this mode at all. I'm not sitting here trying to
argue technical topics with you, so don't you try to tell me that the
Morse/CW mode and testing aren't of value to the ARS. We are
not on each other's respective levels of expertise. Since I'm
more than willing to respect your technical expertise, don't presume
to challenge my qualifications to make judgments about CW and
code testing, because you don't know what your talking about.

73 de Larry, K3LT


And, you obviously think that what you just said, above, is well-reasoned,
factual, and unemotional??!! I've broken my own rule and just responded to
a post from you that was none of the above.

Well, Kim, please feel free to go back to following your "rule." In fact, I
must insist that you do. I wouldn't want you to do anything that would
cause you any inconvenience.

73 de Larry, K3LT

"Larry Roll K3LT" wrote in message
...
In article , "Carl R. Stevenson"
writes:

Carl:

I consider the use of the term "Morse myths" to be derogatory and
inflammatory. Thus, you have also failed to meet Mike's challenge.

73 de Larry, K3LT


Larry,

I don't recall Mike appointing your the judge and arbiter ...

Carl:

In that case, consider my services to have been donated out of my own
generosity.

I guess I got what I paid for :-)

"Morse Myths" is, as you well know by now, simply a term
that refers to all of the patently false, old wives' tales, such as
"Morse gets through when nothing else will.",

This one is true…

Bluntly - baloney ... there ARE modes that will get through at
s/n ratios where Morse would be totally undetectable, let alone
decodable ... ignore the facts if it preserves your fantasy world
where Morse is all-important (the "legend in your own mind"),
but the rest of the world will pass you by without your even
understanding why ...

"Morse is essential
for emergency communications.",

Who said that? Provide correctly attributed quote.

Read any number of absurd pro-code-testing comments
filed with the FCC ...

"Morse acts as a 'lid filter' to
keep us from being overrun by the "mongul hordes' of CBers
who are lurking in the wings waiting to take over the ham bands."
etc.

I've never said that whatsoever -- in fact, on many occasions, I've gone
out of my way to note that a lot of the problems on HF phone are being
caused by 20-WPM code tested Extras.

I didn't say that YOU necessarily said that ... though you HAVE refered
to the "knuckle-draggers" and other terms that fall into a similar category.

I reject your claim that the term "Morse Myths" is derogatory and
inflamatory.

Reject all you want, Carl, but the fact remains that it is. You have
taken
the low road, while claiming the opposite.

It is simply a term that refers in "shorthand" form to
a panoply of falacies that are often cited as "reasons why we MUST
keep Morse testing" ... none of which hold water and all of which
have been rejected by the FCC.

I have always presented well-reasoned, factual, and unemotional
arguments in support of code testing.

RTFLMAO!!!

Please don't hold me up to
the same light as those who may have transgressed in the manner
which you refer to above. Above all, please remember that by far,
the largest portion of the QRM in the code/no-code debate has been
from the NCTA side.

ROTFLMAO some more ...

Also remember that as one who has never
used the Morse/CW mode to an extent which would have allowed
you to gain useful proficiency in the mode, you are not qualified to
judge the value of this mode at all.

You are totally wrong on this assertion ... I know the code, had
"useful proficiency" (nearly 20 wpm at my peak), but haven't used
it in a long time ... I am certainly qualified to judge the value of the
mode (at least for my purposes, and also in more general terms).

I'm not sitting here trying to
argue technical topics with you, so don't you try to tell me that the
Morse/CW mode and testing aren't of value to the ARS. We are
not on each other's respective levels of expertise. Since I'm
more than willing to respect your technical expertise, don't presume
to challenge my qualifications to make judgments about CW and
code testing, because you don't know what your talking about.

Larry, I don't demean your "real ham-ness" because you are not
my equal on the technical plane, but you demean the "real ham-ness"
of anyone who is up to your "standards" of Morse prowess ...
I think you're arrogance and narrow-mindedness are showing again.

Carl - wk3c

"Carl R. Stevenson" wrote in message
...

"Larry Roll K3LT" wrote in message
...
In article , "Carl R. Stevenson"
writes:

Carl:

I consider the use of the term "Morse myths" to be derogatory and
inflammatory. Thus, you have also failed to meet Mike's challenge.

73 de Larry, K3LT


Larry,

I don't recall Mike appointing your the judge and arbiter ...

Carl:

In that case, consider my services to have been donated out of my own
generosity.

I guess I got what I paid for :-)

"Morse Myths" is, as you well know by now, simply a term
that refers to all of the patently false, old wives' tales, such as
"Morse gets through when nothing else will.",

This one is true.

Bluntly - baloney ... there ARE modes that will get through at
s/n ratios where Morse would be totally undetectable, let alone
decodable ... ignore the facts if it preserves your fantasy world
where Morse is all-important (the "legend in your own mind"),
but the rest of the world will pass you by without your even
understanding why ...

"Morse is essential
for emergency communications.",

Who said that? Provide correctly attributed quote.

Read any number of absurd pro-code-testing comments
filed with the FCC ...

"Morse acts as a 'lid filter' to
keep us from being overrun by the "mongul hordes' of CBers
who are lurking in the wings waiting to take over the ham bands."
etc.

I've never said that whatsoever -- in fact, on many occasions, I've gone
out of my way to note that a lot of the problems on HF phone are being
caused by 20-WPM code tested Extras.

I didn't say that YOU necessarily said that ... though you HAVE refered
to the "knuckle-draggers" and other terms that fall into a similar
category.

I reject your claim that the term "Morse Myths" is derogatory and
inflamatory.

Reject all you want, Carl, but the fact remains that it is. You have
taken
the low road, while claiming the opposite.

It is simply a term that refers in "shorthand" form to
a panoply of falacies that are often cited as "reasons why we MUST
keep Morse testing" ... none of which hold water and all of which
have been rejected by the FCC.

I have always presented well-reasoned, factual, and unemotional
arguments in support of code testing.

RTFLMAO!!!

Please don't hold me up to
the same light as those who may have transgressed in the manner
which you refer to above. Above all, please remember that by far,
the largest portion of the QRM in the code/no-code debate has been
from the NCTA side.

ROTFLMAO some more ...

Also remember that as one who has never
used the Morse/CW mode to an extent which would have allowed
you to gain useful proficiency in the mode, you are not qualified to
judge the value of this mode at all.

You are totally wrong on this assertion ... I know the code, had
"useful proficiency" (nearly 20 wpm at my peak), but haven't used
it in a long time ... I am certainly qualified to judge the value of the
mode (at least for my purposes, and also in more general terms).

I'm not sitting here trying to
argue technical topics with you, so don't you try to tell me that the
Morse/CW mode and testing aren't of value to the ARS. We are
not on each other's respective levels of expertise. Since I'm
more than willing to respect your technical expertise, don't presume
to challenge my qualifications to make judgments about CW and
code testing, because you don't know what your talking about.

Larry, I don't demean your "real ham-ness" because you are not
my equal on the technical plane, but you demean the "real ham-ness"
of anyone who is up to your "standards" of Morse prowess ...
I think you're arrogance and narrow-mindedness are showing again.

Carl - wk3c


One major problem that is being ignored is that these alleged 20 wpm Extras
are the multiple guess guys. Probably doing good to make it to ten WPM.
Just hunt, peck and hope.

One other 'minor' detail, is that they ALL were taught on 11 meters.

How many real hams. Say those that were not infected by the CB crap do
these things? Dang few I would venture.

Unless they were like Polly and Billy Jack....Conditionals that were
Grandfathered in back in the early 60s.

Lets see some real figures. Not conjecture.

Dan/W4NTI

In article .net, "Dan/W4NTI"
w4nti@get rid of this mindspring.com writes:

Carl:

I consider the use of the term "Morse myths" to be derogatory and
inflammatory. Thus, you have also failed to meet Mike's challenge.

73 de Larry, K3LT


Larry,

I don't recall Mike appointing your the judge and arbiter ...

Carl:

In that case, consider my services to have been donated out of my own
generosity.

I guess I got what I paid for :-)

"Morse Myths" is, as you well know by now, simply a term
that refers to all of the patently false, old wives' tales, such as
"Morse gets through when nothing else will.",

This one is true.

Bluntly - baloney ... there ARE modes that will get through at
s/n ratios where Morse would be totally undetectable, let alone
decodable ... ignore the facts if it preserves your fantasy world
where Morse is all-important (the "legend in your own mind"),
but the rest of the world will pass you by without your even
understanding why ...

"Morse is essential
for emergency communications.",

Who said that? Provide correctly attributed quote.

Read any number of absurd pro-code-testing comments
filed with the FCC ...

"Morse acts as a 'lid filter' to
keep us from being overrun by the "mongul hordes' of CBers
who are lurking in the wings waiting to take over the ham bands."
etc.

I've never said that whatsoever -- in fact, on many occasions, I've gone
out of my way to note that a lot of the problems on HF phone are being
caused by 20-WPM code tested Extras.

I didn't say that YOU necessarily said that ... though you HAVE refered
to the "knuckle-draggers" and other terms that fall into a similar
category.

I reject your claim that the term "Morse Myths" is derogatory and
inflamatory.

Reject all you want, Carl, but the fact remains that it is. You have
taken
the low road, while claiming the opposite.

It is simply a term that refers in "shorthand" form to
a panoply of falacies that are often cited as "reasons why we MUST
keep Morse testing" ... none of which hold water and all of which
have been rejected by the FCC.

I have always presented well-reasoned, factual, and unemotional
arguments in support of code testing.

RTFLMAO!!!

Please don't hold me up to
the same light as those who may have transgressed in the manner
which you refer to above. Above all, please remember that by far,
the largest portion of the QRM in the code/no-code debate has been
from the NCTA side.

ROTFLMAO some more ...

Also remember that as one who has never
used the Morse/CW mode to an extent which would have allowed
you to gain useful proficiency in the mode, you are not qualified to
judge the value of this mode at all.

You are totally wrong on this assertion ... I know the code, had
"useful proficiency" (nearly 20 wpm at my peak), but haven't used
it in a long time ... I am certainly qualified to judge the value of the
mode (at least for my purposes, and also in more general terms).

I'm not sitting here trying to
argue technical topics with you, so don't you try to tell me that the
Morse/CW mode and testing aren't of value to the ARS. We are
not on each other's respective levels of expertise. Since I'm
more than willing to respect your technical expertise, don't presume
to challenge my qualifications to make judgments about CW and
code testing, because you don't know what your talking about.

Larry, I don't demean your "real ham-ness" because you are not
my equal on the technical plane, but you demean the "real ham-ness"
of anyone who is up to your "standards" of Morse prowess ...
I think you're arrogance and narrow-mindedness are showing again.

Carl - wk3c


One major problem that is being ignored is that these alleged 20 wpm Extras
are the multiple guess guys. Probably doing good to make it to ten WPM.
Just hunt, peck and hope.

One other 'minor' detail, is that they ALL were taught on 11 meters.

Tsk, tsk, tsk... :-)

Did you mean the 11 meter HAM band or what it was reallocated
to in 1958 and afterwards? :-)

I learned to communicate on HF over 5 years before 1958. :-)

How many real hams. Say those that were not infected by the CB crap do
these things? Dang few I would venture.

"Real hams" again, big tuff guy?

Working for the FDA now?

Unless they were like Polly and Billy Jack....Conditionals that were
Grandfathered in back in the early 60s.

Lets see some real figures. Not conjecture.

Let's see more of that "definition and purpose" of Real Hams as in 97.1,
you know, the part about "spreading goodwill" and all that... :-)

LHA

In article , ospam
(Larry Roll K3LT) writes:

In article , "Carl R. Stevenson"
writes:

I have always presented well-reasoned, factual, and unemotional
arguments in support of code testing.

Only in your mind, Tatoo.

Please don't hold me up to
the same light as those who may have transgressed in the manner
which you refer to above. Above all, please remember that by far,
the largest portion of the QRM in the code/no-code debate has been
from the NCTA side.

Again, only in your mind, Tatoo.

Also remember that as one who has never
used the Morse/CW mode to an extent which would have allowed
you to gain useful proficiency in the mode, you are not qualified to
judge the value of this mode at all.

Tatoo has his stash up in the bell tower while looking for de blane.

Back here in the Real World (not on Fantasy Island), poor Tatoo
would have to contend with all the long-ago, much more qualified
in many more aspects of Real World communications in all other
radio services have either: Never considered on-off morse in the
first place; dropped on-off morse as a required mode; relegated it
to an optional mode, good only for things like automatic ID.

I'm not sitting here trying to
argue technical topics with you, so don't you try to tell me that the
Morse/CW mode and testing aren't of value to the ARS. We are
not on each other's respective levels of expertise.

Carl lives in the Real World. So do I. Try visiting it some time.

Since I'm
more than willing to respect your technical expertise, don't presume
to challenge my qualifications to make judgments about CW and
code testing, because you don't know what your talking about.

Hmmm...the Radio God has spoken! :-)

Hey, Larrah, you should have lent your "qualifications" to the US
Army way back when the USAF was part of it. The ACAN (Army
Command Administrative Network) was organized to NOT use
morse code for long-distance primary communications...a couple
years after WW2 was ended.

Now get back up in the bell tower, de blane is coming soon.

LHA