Get your Trophy US Extra Callsign (A KH0x call would be nice!)
 

What's wrong with this Hamfest announcement?

73, de Hans, K0HB

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Hamvention 2004

Program of Activities
Nov 27, 2004
Ecotech Center, Cebu City, Philippines

7:00 Registration of Delegates
8:00 Opening Ceremonies
Invocation -
National Anthem - Joan Jayme
Welcome Address - Emilio B. Borja, DU7EBB
Declaration of Hamvention Open - Steve Tan,DW7MCC
8:30 FCC VEC Exam
9:00 Packet Radio Seminar - Bilfredo Canas, DU9BC
9:45 Echolink Seminar - Maximino Santos, 4F1BYN
10:30 Snacks
11:00 Congress of Presidents
Open Forum
12:00 Lunch Break
13:00 WRC / Satellite - Eddie Valdez, DU1EV
13:45 ARES - Eli E. Yongco, DU1YEE
14:30 PARA Awards Program - Serafin A. Nepomuceno,
DU1SAN
15:00 Snacks
15:30 General Assembly / Election
2005 Hamvention Host Bidding
17:30 PARA Board Meeting
19:00 Dinner
19:00 Fellowship Night
Roll Call of Clubs - Steve Tan, DW7MCC
Message from PARA Pres. - Jose Mari Gonzales,
DU1JMG
Introduction of Guest Speaker - Jet Manuel,4F7MHZ
Inspirational Talk - Danilo T. Sy,
Regional Director - NTC 7
Intermission
Awards and Recognition
Intermission
Raffle Draw
21:45 Free Time

Subject: Get your Trophy US Extra Callsign (A KH0x call would be nice!)
From: "KØHB"
Date: 11/22/2004 11:00 AM Central Standard Time
Message-id: et

What's wrong with this Hamfest announcement?

Are you refering to the fact that it's held in one of the southern island
provinces of the Philippines, or that they fail to render oaths and allegiance
to Hans Brakob?

Or perhaps it's the FCC VEC testing...???

Had you been to the RP you'd know there are a great number of US residents
who hold dual citizenship, and VE testing is routinely held outside the
territorial limits of the United States for their benefit. However this is
also a moot point since US citizenship is not required for FCC licensure.

Furthermore, review of FCC rules and regulations does not specifiy where
VE exams must be held. It does require prior public announcement of testing to
be held, and it would appear that this announcement meets the test of US law.

Therefore, there seems to be nothing wrong with the announcement.

Your point was?

Steve, K4YZ

"Steve Robeson K4YZ" wrote

or that they fail to render oaths and allegiance
to Hans Brakob?

Steve, could you point out to me where this "render oaths and
allegiance" bull**** comes from? Had to double check and make sure the
post didn't come from Len Anderson!


Your point was?


If you have to ask, you probably won't "get it", but I've got a hot news
flash for you. Those fellas taking the FCC tests at DU and JA hamfests
aren't dual citizens of DU (or JA) and Saipan, they're souveneir
collectors and reciprocal-licensing cheats.

There are a small handful of "will-call" PO boxes in KH0 and KH2 which
are the "home address" for hundreds of JA and DU citizens. (What do all
these calls have in common? KH2O KH0JQ KH0JU KH0KW AH0BB KH0BZ KH0CG
KH0CQ KH0HQ KH0HZ WH0V NH0F WH0B WH0C AH0AS AH0AU KH0CN KH0DD ......and
I could go on for hundreds of desirable KH0/KH2 call signs held by
foreign nationals who've never set foot on Guam/Saipan/US soil and
likely have no intention to ever do so.)

Here's how it works. DU1XYZ or JA1XYZ knows a guy on KH0 or KH2 and has
him rent a PO Box. Then he gets himself and a couple of buddies a W5YI
VE certificate and holds exams. Applicants are given the KH0 or KH2 PO
Box address (for a "consideration") and "bingo", they have their
souveneir US call sign. Over half of the KH0 and KH2 2x1 calls have
been scarfed up by JA's and DU's. Meanwhile some kid on Guam or Saipan
who upgrades to Extra has to wait until a JA or DU fella croaks over to
capture a desireable call, unless some other JA or DU captures it first
for a souvenier.

Besides "souveniers" I mentioned reciprocal-licensing cheats, which is a
primary reason so many KH0/KH2 calls go to JA's..... Because JA only
has reciprocal agreements with a dozen or less countries, a US license
is an essential tool for JA DXpeditioners --- let's say they'd like to
do a DXpedition to V7 or VP9 . Their JA license is useless, but let
them flash a KH0 license and wham, he's VP9DX with no questions asked.
Meanwhile some kid on Guam or Saipan who upgrades to Extra has to wait
until a JA fella croaks over to capture a desireable call (unless some
other JA captures it first for his reciprocal-cheat scheme).

On Tue, 23 Nov 2004 04:06:31 GMT, "KØHB"
wrote:

There are a small handful of "will-call" PO boxes in KH0 and KH2 which
are the "home address" for hundreds of JA and DU citizens.

That's correct. And in California and a few other places too.

Besides "souveniers" I mentioned reciprocal-licensing cheats, which is a
primary reason so many KH0/KH2 calls go to JA's..... Because JA only
has reciprocal agreements with a dozen or less countries, a US license
is an essential tool for JA DXpeditioners --- let's say they'd like to
do a DXpedition to V7 or VP9 . Their JA license is useless, but let
them flash a KH0 license and wham, he's VP9DX with no questions asked.

That's also correct.

But now that all the KH2 and KH0 extra calls are gone, the JA's are
having to suffer with continental U.S. calls or Hawaii calls, poor
babies. N3FW, AD7AL, NB6A, NH7IG, KK2H, K8VR, N1VF, etc.

No, Frank Wilson, you can't get your intials for your call sign, even
though you do REALLY live in Maryland. You have to wait until Fujimoto
Wazawari in Tokyo dies and then wait two more years.

My favorite at QRZ.COM:

"KK2H - Please send QSL to my home call, JL1UXH. If you send anything
to the address in the U.S., my cousin has to forward it to Japan."

That sucks. Hate wasting good Yen buying U.S. stamps.

The official position of the WTB in Washington, D.C., when I talked to
them on the phone about all of the above and a few other questionable
items a few years back was:

"It's not our job to verify addresses. It's our job to issue
licenses."

Which they continue to do, to anybody that wants one and who
passed a "test"....

So..... Any U.S. address + V.E. "exam" in a foreign country
(administered by foreign nationals who could never be extradited to
the U.S. to face charges for holding "funny" exams) = U.S. Extra Class
Souvenir Call Sign and International Reciprocal Radio Passport.

Good system. A U.S. V.E. makes a mistake on the paperwork and the FCC
nails his nuts to the wall, but nobody notices when Yoshi, Toshi, and
Schosi send their paperwork in from Japan.

W5YI or the ARRL make six bucks everytime a JA gets a U.S. license at
a VE test held in Tokyo, so everybody is fat, dumb, and happy. Turn
your head, cash the check, ten more extra's, what the heck......

Welcum to the Wunnerful Werld of Ham Radio. Nobody cares.

At least the FCC did do something about club calls. They took 42 of
them away from a JA few years back :-) But for some strange reason,
they let him keep his primary station license, a W9 extra class U.S.
call.

73, Jim KH2D

At least the FCC did do something about club calls. They took 42 of
them away from a JA few years back :-) But for some strange reason,
they let him keep his primary station license, a W9 extra class U.S.
call.

73, Jim KH2D


Maybe they should get calls like WJ#XXX, or KJ#XXX...
If the FCC decides that it's proper for foriegners to
get American ham licenses.....

Robert Casey wrote in news:PxAod.10361$Qh3.9984
@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net:


At least the FCC did do something about club calls. They took 42 of
them away from a JA few years back :-) But for some strange reason,
they let him keep his primary station license, a W9 extra class U.S.
call.

73, Jim KH2D


Maybe they should get calls like WJ#XXX, or KJ#XXX...
If the FCC decides that it's proper for foriegners to
get American ham licenses.....


Foreigners have been able to get US licences for many decades. I'm one.

Only representatives of a foreign government can't get a US call. Try
reading Part 97.

73 de Alun, N3KIP

Subject: Get your Trophy US Extra Callsign (A KH0x call would be nice!)
From: Robert Casey
Date: 11/23/2004 12:13 AM Central Standard Time
Message-id: .net


At least the FCC did do something about club calls. They took 42 of
them away from a JA few years back :-) But for some strange reason,
they let him keep his primary station license, a W9 extra class U.S.
call.

73, Jim KH2D


Maybe they should get calls like WJ#XXX, or KJ#XXX...
If the FCC decides that it's proper for foriegners to
get American ham licenses.....

Perhaps you'd consider a Constitutional Amendment that restricts US rights
and privileges to US citizens or persons legally landed here.

The FCC has already decided that it's proper for foreign nationals to have
US license if they complete the prerequisites for that license and exercise it
within the parameters of Part 97.
Citizenship is not one of them.

Specific callsigns would be discriminatory under present US
interpretations of the Constitution.

73

Steve, K4YZ

Subject: Get your Trophy US Extra Callsign (A KH0x call would be nice!)
From:
Date: 11/23/2004 12:01 AM Central Standard Time
Message-id:

On Tue, 23 Nov 2004 04:06:31 GMT, "KØHB"
wrote:

There are a small handful of "will-call" PO boxes in KH0 and KH2 which
are the "home address" for hundreds of JA and DU citizens.

That's correct. And in California and a few other places too.

Perhaps. But do we know "for sure" that all those people are truly not
residing here, Jim? Or they NEVER visit US soil and use those calls?

QST, CQ, etc are replete with stories of AMERICAN Amateurs scoring
"souvenier" calls. Why teh double standard over foreign persons who do the
same with American calls?

Besides "souveniers" I mentioned reciprocal-licensing cheats, which is a
primary reason so many KH0/KH2 calls go to JA's..... Because JA only
has reciprocal agreements with a dozen or less countries, a US license
is an essential tool for JA DXpeditioners --- let's say they'd like to
do a DXpedition to V7 or VP9 . Their JA license is useless, but let
them flash a KH0 license and wham, he's VP9DX with no questions asked.

That's also correct.

But now that all the KH2 and KH0 extra calls are gone, the JA's are
having to suffer with continental U.S. calls or Hawaii calls, poor
babies. N3FW, AD7AL, NB6A, NH7IG, KK2H, K8VR, N1VF, etc.

Sorry, Jim, but that's not accurate.

There ARE 2 x I calls left

No, Frank Wilson, you can't get your intials for your call sign, even
though you do REALLY live in Maryland. You have to wait until Fujimoto
Wazawari in Tokyo dies and then wait two more years.

My favorite at QRZ.COM:

"KK2H - Please send QSL to my home call, JL1UXH. If you send anything
to the address in the U.S., my cousin has to forward it to Japan."

That sucks. Hate wasting good Yen buying U.S. stamps.

The official position of the WTB in Washington, D.C., when I talked to
them on the phone about all of the above and a few other questionable
items a few years back was:

"It's not our job to verify addresses. It's our job to issue
licenses."

Which they continue to do, to anybody that wants one and who
passed a "test"....

So..... Any U.S. address + V.E. "exam" in a foreign country
(administered by foreign nationals who could never be extradited to
the U.S. to face charges for holding "funny" exams) = U.S. Extra Class
Souvenir Call Sign and International Reciprocal Radio Passport.

Good system. A U.S. V.E. makes a mistake on the paperwork and the FCC
nails his nuts to the wall, but nobody notices when Yoshi, Toshi, and
Schosi send their paperwork in from Japan.

W5YI or the ARRL make six bucks everytime a JA gets a U.S. license at
a VE test held in Tokyo, so everybody is fat, dumb, and happy. Turn
your head, cash the check, ten more extra's, what the heck......

Welcum to the Wunnerful Werld of Ham Radio. Nobody cares.

At least the FCC did do something about club calls. They took 42 of
them away from a JA few years back :-) But for some strange reason,
they let him keep his primary station license, a W9 extra class U.S.
call.

Do you (or anyone else) know for sure that these tests are not being held
in accordance with expected professional conduct, Jim? Hans' first post seems
to indicate that the test was being announced (and one would have to assume) in
accordance with FCC requirements.

Are any laws being broken?

73

Steve, K4YZ

Subject: Get your Trophy US Extra Callsign (A KH0x call would be nice!)
From: (Steve Robeson K4YZ)
Date: 11/23/2004 4:45 AM Central Standard Time
Message-id:

Subject: Get your Trophy US Extra Callsign (A KH0x call would be nice!)
From:
Date: 11/23/2004 12:01 AM Central Standard Time

But now that all the KH2 and KH0 extra calls are gone, the JA's are
having to suffer with continental U.S. calls or Hawaii calls, poor
babies. N3FW, AD7AL, NB6A, NH7IG, KK2H, K8VR, N1VF, etc.

Sorry, Jim, but that's not accurate.

There ARE 2 x I calls left.

And in both call areas. Granted, there are only four 2 x 1 KH2 calls left
(AH2L, AH2Q, WH2H and WH2M), but they are there none-the less. As I noted in
my other post, there are quite a few KH0 calls available..

I spot checked a few calls in the 2 x 2 "AH2" group, and found all of them
to be available, including AH2YZ.

I note with some irony that many of the 2 x 1 calls from KH2 were listed
as CONUS calls to WASP-sounding names. This included one in Florida, that same
person also "sponsoring" a Japanese sounding person's Guam-based address.
Wonder who's picking up THAT mail...???

73

Steve, K4YZ

"KØHB" wrote in message ink.net...
"Steve Robeson K4YZ" wrote

or that they fail to render oaths and allegiance
to Hans Brakob?

Steve, could you point out to me where this "render oaths and
allegiance" bull**** comes from? Had to double check and make sure the
post didn't come from Len Anderson!


Your point was?


If you have to ask, you probably won't "get it", but I've got a hot news
flash for you. Those fellas taking the FCC tests at DU and JA hamfests
aren't dual citizens of DU (or JA) and Saipan, they're souveneir
collectors and reciprocal-licensing cheats.

There are a small handful of "will-call" PO boxes in KH0 and KH2 which
are the "home address" for hundreds of JA and DU citizens. (What do all
these calls have in common? KH2O KH0JQ KH0JU KH0KW AH0BB KH0BZ KH0CG
KH0CQ KH0HQ KH0HZ WH0V NH0F WH0B WH0C AH0AS AH0AU KH0CN KH0DD ......and
I could go on for hundreds of desirable KH0/KH2 call signs held by
foreign nationals who've never set foot on Guam/Saipan/US soil and
likely have no intention to ever do so.)

Here's how it works. DU1XYZ or JA1XYZ knows a guy on KH0 or KH2 and has
him rent a PO Box.

Or KH6. I recall a ham on Hawaii who loaned out his PO Box to Mike
Deignan. Same ham had a Guam call, never lived on Guam. Said he had
a job offer there that never panned out, and got the call in "prep"
for moving there.

In article et, "KØHB"
writes:

If you have to ask, you probably won't "get it", but I've got a hot news
flash for you. Those fellas taking the FCC tests at DU and JA hamfests
aren't dual citizens of DU (or JA) and Saipan, they're souveneir
collectors and reciprocal-licensing cheats.

I don't like this setup any more than you do, Hans.

But how is it a cheat?

Is it because those fellas never set foot on US soil, but hold US licenses?

---

Regardless of the legality, I know a lot of hams in CONUS who'd be ticked off
if they couldn't have a 1x2 because those fellas elsewhere in the world had
scarfed them all up.

73 de Jim, N2EY

Subject: Get your Trophy US Extra Callsign (A KH0x call would be nice!)
From: Alun
Date: 11/23/2004 7:07 AM Central Standard Time
Message-id:

(William) wrote in
om:

(Steve Robeson K4YZ) wrote in message
...
Subject: Get your Trophy US Extra Callsign (A KH0x call would be
nice!) From: Robert Casey
Date: 11/23/2004 12:13 AM Central Standard Time
Message-id: .net


At least the FCC did do something about club calls. They took 42 of
them away from a JA few years back :-) But for some strange reason,
they let him keep his primary station license, a W9 extra class
U.S. call.

73, Jim KH2D


Maybe they should get calls like WJ#XXX, or KJ#XXX...
If the FCC decides that it's proper for foriegners to get American
ham licenses.....

Perhaps you'd consider a Constitutional Amendment that restricts
US rights
and privileges to US citizens or persons legally landed here.

The FCC has already decided that it's proper for foreign
nationals to have
US license if they complete the prerequisites for that license and
exercise it within the parameters of Part 97.
Citizenship is not one of them.

Specific callsigns would be discriminatory under present US
interpretations of the Constitution.

73

Steve, K4YZ


Inneresting. Steve has pushed Phil Kane aside as our resident
communications attorney.

"You miss the point, Steve. The purpose of r.r.a.p. is no longer
discussion of policy, or learning something, or study of
communications
theory.

The purpose is to FIGHT and to denegrate the dignity of all who do not
agree with you! Any other post is off topic and is not welcome here.

Get with the program. No one is "mistaken" or "partially correct" on
r.r.a.p. They either 100% totally agree with you, or they are "a
lying,
scum sucking, bottom feeding no-code beeper." There is no in between,
and there must be at least one of each in every conversation here.
Anything which resembles a rational exchange of ideas and useful
information will either be ignored, or some enterprising induhvidual
will hijack the thread and turn it into an argument about Morse. No
other "Policy" conversation is allowed to survive unmolested.

72, de Hans, K0HB"


Steve is right, though.

Thanks, Alun. Not a single word about the use of Morse Code in any of the
original posts, yet PuppetBoy cites one of Hans' trolls responses arguing about
hijacking a thread about Morse Code use.

He wonders why I call him an idiot.

Discrimination against resident aliens has been prohibited since Yick Wo v
Hopkins, which relied on the equal protection clause of the 14th amendment.

"Yick Wo"...?!?!

This is a little way off Phil Kane's speciality of communications law,
although no doubt the FCC can't discriminate against aliens. Maybe Phil
knows of some case law regarding aliens and the FCC?

I am not a lawyer, just an alien.

Alf would be proud! (J/K ! ! !)

Alf's "host" was a Ham, BTW!

73

Steve, K4YZ

"Steve Robeson K4YZ" wrote in message
...

Alf would be proud! (J/K ! ! !)

Alf's "host" was a Ham, BTW!

73

Steve, K4YZ

Steve,

Do you mean the character or the actor? I ask because, IMHO, there is a
fairly well-known Ham who bears a striking resemblance to that character.

--
Vy 73 de Bert
WA2SI
FISTS #9384
QRP ARCI #11782

Subject: Get your Trophy US Extra Callsign (A KH0x call would be nice!)
From: "Bert Craig" OSPAM
Date: 11/23/2004 8:48 AM Central Standard Time
Message-id:


"Steve Robeson K4YZ" wrote in message
...

Alf would be proud! (J/K ! ! !)

Alf's "host" was a Ham, BTW!

73

Steve, K4YZ

Steve,

Do you mean the character or the actor? I ask because, IMHO, there is a
fairly well-known Ham who bears a striking resemblance to that character.

Hey Bert!

The character, actually...I am afraid I don't remember the "family's" name,
but there were a couple episodes where his "station" was part of the scene. I
don't remember a "callsign" ever being mentioned.

73

Steve, K4YZ

"KØHB" wrote in message
nk.net...
What's wrong with this Hamfest announcement?

73, de Hans, K0HB

I see that Hans has never been to the Philippines.......(grin)

"Mireca Eliade" wrote


I see that Hans has never been to the Philippines.......(grin)


Au contraire! During the years I was a member of the Tonkin Bay Yacht
Club, Subic was practically our home port, and the social life in
Olongapo along Magsaysay Drive was 'interesting'. BSEG

73, de Hans, K0HB/4ID

On 23 Nov 2004 06:29:39 GMT, Alun wrote:

Foreigners have been able to get US licences for many decades. I'm one.

Only representatives of a foreign government can't get a US call. Try
reading Part 97.

73 de Alun, N3KIP

I have read it. A few times. If you live in the U.S. and get a U.S.
license, I doubt there's any complaints. If you live in Germany,
have never been to the U.S., and never intend to go to the U.S.,
I doubt many people would deem it necessary for you to have a
U.S. license.

73, Jim KH2D

On Tue, 23 Nov 2004 06:13:03 GMT, Robert Casey
wrote:


At least the FCC did do something about club calls. They took 42 of
them away from a JA few years back :-) But for some strange reason,
they let him keep his primary station license, a W9 extra class U.S.
call.

73, Jim KH2D


Maybe they should get calls like WJ#XXX, or KJ#XXX...
If the FCC decides that it's proper for foriegners to
get American ham licenses.....

Or maybe they should just operate as JA1xxx/W7, which they are
entitled to do with NO paperwork required. You're missing the point.

If somebody from outside the U.S. lives in U.S., and wants to get
a U.S. call, very few people would have a problem with that. I
sure don't have a problem with that.

The problem is the use of bogus addresses by people who have
never set foot in the U.S. to get U.S. licenses.

The FCC a long time ago decided it was proper for non U.S. citizens
in the U.S. to get U.S. licenses, they removed the citizenship
requierment years ago. I doubt they ever intended for the JA ham
club in Tokyo to get a P.O. Box in California so they could get a
thousand U.S. licenses as souvenirs.....

And the other problem is with V.E. tests that are administered
outside of the U.S. by foreign nationals. Yes, there should be U.S.
amateur radio tests available in Japan - at the U.S. embassy so
that U.S. citizens and U.S. military personel could take them - but
not at the sushi bar administered by three JA's who have U.S.
souvenir call signs. And there should not be U.S. license exams
at a hamfest in the Philippines so that anybody who wants a U.S.
license can buy one.

Why can't I take a test for a Japanese ham license in Florida ?

73, Jim KH2D

On 23 Nov 2004 03:33:06 -0800, (William) wrote:
Same ham had a Guam call, never lived on Guam. Said he had
a job offer there that never panned out, and got the call in "prep"
for moving there.

Lot's of people who never lived in Guam had KH2 calls. When I used
to do the KH2 QSL bureau, there was a constant flow of licenses that
would show up in the KH2 bureau's P.O. box for people we never
heard of.

1. Take a V.E. test.

2. Use the KH2 QSL bureau's P.O. box number as your address.

3. Get a Guam call.

4. Look on the internet and figure out what your new Guam call is.

5. Send in a change of address, to your real address in New Jersey,
or your cousins address in California (since you live in Italy)
so you can get a copy of your license.

A friend of mine in Saipan went to get his mail one day and found
seven FCC licenses for seven people from Japan he didn't know....

The system is too easy to beat.

73, Jim KH2D

On Tue, 23 Nov 2004 09:01:42 +0000, Walt Davidson
wrote:

It would solve a lot of the problems if KH2's had to trade in their
callsigns in exchange for a W4 when they went to live in Florida!
:-))))

73 de G3NYY

Used to be if I lived in Maryland, and I moved to Florida, I had to
give up my 3 call for a new 4 call that the FCC computer spit out for
me.

Used to be that if you lived in the 4th call district, you couldn't
get a vanity call with any number but 4 in it, but now you can.

We don't do that anymore. Paperwork reduction act, Walter.
No more W4 extra calls left. The guys in California got them all :-)

FCC is too busy issuing licenses to JA's :-)

Personally, I think the FCC should charge $100 a year for a license,
which would give them an extra $70 million a year to administer the
system properly.

73, Jim KH2D

On 23 Nov 2004 13:07:17 GMT, Alun wrote:

Arguably, the equal protection clause of the 14th amendment only applies to
the states, but there are cases invoking the due process clause of the 5th
amendment, which is applicable to the federal government.

Do not forget that holding an amateur license does not convey any
civil rights - _Howard v City of Burlingame_

I beleive there was a Puerto Rican case in federal district court that
relied on either the 5th or the 14th in the alternative, allowing aliens to
become registered as professional engineers. I don't have the citation for
that one.

This is a little way off Phil Kane's speciality of communications law,

Not really. I am also a Registered Professional Engineer (by exam,
not waiver) and I have to keep up with such things.

although no doubt the FCC can't discriminate against aliens. Maybe Phil
knows of some case law regarding aliens and the FCC?

We all know that an alien can unilaterally cause a change in FCC
rules without a public hearing - JY1 and the Medical Code Waiver.

Seriously, about 20 years ago The Congress amended Section 318 of
the Comm Act - the section that required US citizenship to be
allowed to hold an operator license. This was part of the Ronald
Reagan privitization move to enable non-citizens to seek employment
as radio broadcast DJs which at that time required a Radiotelephone
Third Class Permit (or better). The citizenship requirement for an
amateur operator license was swept away at the same time.

I am not a lawyer, just an alien.

I hope not as bad as some of the space-aliens who post here...

--
73 de K2ASP - Phil Kane

wrote in message
.. .
On Tue, 23 Nov 2004 09:01:42 +0000, Walt Davidson
wrote:

It would solve a lot of the problems if KH2's had to trade in their
callsigns in exchange for a W4 when they went to live in Florida!
:-))))

73 de G3NYY

Used to be if I lived in Maryland, and I moved to Florida, I had to
give up my 3 call for a new 4 call that the FCC computer spit out for
me.

Used to be that if you lived in the 4th call district, you couldn't
get a vanity call with any number but 4 in it, but now you can.

We don't do that anymore. Paperwork reduction act, Walter.
No more W4 extra calls left. The guys in California got them all :-)


The 4 land Extra calls other than the 2x2 beginning with A disappeared 10
years ago. That's before the vanity system even went into effect. So you
can't blame California! ( Yes I saw the :-) )

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE

Subject: Get your Trophy US Extra Callsign (A KH0x call would be nice!)
From:
Date: 11/23/2004 12:31 PM Central Standard Time
Message-id:

Personally, I think the FCC should charge $100 a year for a license,
which would give them an extra $70 million a year to administer the
system properly.

Perhaps instead of charging the rest of us a C-Note for a yearly license
we could get some of those who hold Pacific area "trophy calls" while living in
CONUS to voluntarily surrender their calls for appropriate CONUS
callsigns...?!?!

73 with a jab in the ribs...!

Steve, K4YZ

"Phil Kane" wrote in
et:

On 23 Nov 2004 13:07:17 GMT, Alun wrote:

Arguably, the equal protection clause of the 14th amendment only
applies to the states, but there are cases invoking the due process
clause of the 5th amendment, which is applicable to the federal
government.

Do not forget that holding an amateur license does not convey any
civil rights - _Howard v City of Burlingame_

I'm not sure what implications that has. I think I'd better try and find
that case and read it.

I've never actually researched any case law on ham radio. I already had
other reasons to have looked up Yick Wo, etc.


I beleive there was a Puerto Rican case in federal district court that
relied on either the 5th or the 14th in the alternative, allowing
aliens to become registered as professional engineers. I don't have the
citation for that one.

This is a little way off Phil Kane's speciality of communications law,

Not really. I am also a Registered Professional Engineer (by exam,
not waiver) and I have to keep up with such things.

although no doubt the FCC can't discriminate against aliens. Maybe Phil
knows of some case law regarding aliens and the FCC?

We all know that an alien can unilaterally cause a change in FCC
rules without a public hearing - JY1 and the Medical Code Waiver.

Seriously, about 20 years ago The Congress amended Section 318 of
the Comm Act - the section that required US citizenship to be
allowed to hold an operator license. This was part of the Ronald
Reagan privitization move to enable non-citizens to seek employment
as radio broadcast DJs which at that time required a Radiotelephone
Third Class Permit (or better). The citizenship requirement for an
amateur operator license was swept away at the same time.

I am not a lawyer, just an alien.

I hope not as bad as some of the space-aliens who post here...

--
73 de K2ASP - Phil Kane




I think there has been a move generally away from requiring citizenship for
ham radio licences. Very few countries do anymore.

BTW, did you now that citizenship restrictions for lawyers were swept away
by In Re Griffiths, which in turn relied on Yick Wo (Rehnquist dissented in
Griffiths, on an officer of the court line of argument). My interest is
that as a patent agent and an alien I can be disbarred for simply ceasing
to reside in the US. This is not the case with any state bar. The
difficulty in applying this line of authority (Griffiths and Yick Wo) is
that the equal protection clause of the 14th is directed to the states, and
the patent agent licence is federal.

This is definitely getting a bit OT!

KØHB wrote:
What's wrong with this Hamfest announcement?

73, de Hans, K0HB

10:30 Snacks
12:00 Lunch Break


Morning snacks were too close to lunch.

Jeff KH6O


--
Chief Petty Officer, U.S. Coast Guard
Mathematics Lecturer, University of Hawaii System

William wrote:

Or KH6. I recall a ham on Hawaii who loaned out his PO Box to Mike
Deignan. Same ham had a Guam call, never lived on Guam. Said he had
a job offer there that never panned out, and got the call in "prep"
for moving there.


Geez, I wonder who that was?

Jeff KH6O (ex KH2PZ)

P.S. KH0-KH9 are all in the same call area: 13.


--
Chief Petty Officer, U.S. Coast Guard
Mathematics Lecturer, University of Hawaii System

"KØHB" wrote:

What's wrong with this Hamfest announcement?

73, de Hans, K0HB

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

Hamvention 2004

Program of Activities
Nov 27, 2004
Ecotech Center, Cebu City, Philippines

7:00 Registration of Delegates
8:00 Opening Ceremonies
Invocation -
National Anthem - Joan Jayme
Welcome Address - Emilio B. Borja, DU7EBB
Declaration of Hamvention Open - Steve Tan,DW7MCC
8:30 FCC VEC Exam
9:00 Packet Radio Seminar - Bilfredo Canas, DU9BC
9:45 Echolink Seminar - Maximino Santos, 4F1BYN
10:30 Snacks
11:00 Congress of Presidents
Open Forum
12:00 Lunch Break
13:00 WRC / Satellite - Eddie Valdez, DU1EV
13:45 ARES - Eli E. Yongco, DU1YEE
14:30 PARA Awards Program - Serafin A. Nepomuceno,
DU1SAN
15:00 Snacks
15:30 General Assembly / Election
2005 Hamvention Host Bidding
17:30 PARA Board Meeting
19:00 Dinner
19:00 Fellowship Night
Roll Call of Clubs - Steve Tan, DW7MCC
Message from PARA Pres. - Jose Mari Gonzales,
DU1JMG
Introduction of Guest Speaker - Jet Manuel,4F7MHZ
Inspirational Talk - Danilo T. Sy,
Regional Director - NTC 7
Intermission
Awards and Recognition
Intermission
Raffle Draw
21:45 Free Time


FCC VEC exam?

No biggie. K3FK, WE3A and I used to administer them in Helsinki. A
number of the Finns passed all exam up through the Extra in one sitting.

WA8JOC handled QSLing for all of my DX operations. His mailman, Freddie
was used to the piles of QSL cards following a CQ WW DX 'test operation
but when the FCC documents began arriving with all sorts of lengthy
Finnish names, he asked Shep if he had rented the garage to a bunch of
guys from Finland. They, after all, had to provide a U.S. address
through which they could be contacted by the FCC.

Dave K8MN

On 24 Nov 2004 01:27:16 GMT, Alun wrote:

Do not forget that holding an amateur license does not convey any
civil rights - _Howard v City of Burlingame_

I'm not sure what implications that has. I think I'd better try and find
that case and read it.

_Howard v City of Burlingame_, 937 F2nd 1376, (9th Cir., 1991)

"Uncle Vern" Howard got into a dispute with the city about getting
a permit for his tower as against neighbor complaints. (In the
meanwhile he put up a 65 foot tower where the original dispute was
over a 51 foot tower).

The District Court held that under the "reasonable accommodation"
factor in PRB-1 the permit had to be granted but it denied Vern's
claim for damages under 42 U.S.C. s. 1963 which awardss damages
where a local government (but not Federal) violates an individual's
civil rights "under color of law" and for attorney fees under 42 U.S.C.
s. 1988.

The parties cross-appealed to the 9th Circuit , the city appealing
the PRB-1 preemption and Vern appealing to reinstate his claim
for a declaration of protected rights and therefore eligibility for
1963 damages and 1988 fee award.

The 9th Circuit upheld the lower court but also ruled that holding
an amateur license did not confer any protected right (such as First
Amendment rights) to the licensee, and specifically the right to put
up any antenna of choice - the jurisdiction must still consider those
factors specified in PRB-1 to reach a "reasonable accommodation":

"In fact, the most significant section of the [Communications
Act] forecloses rather than supports Howard's claim: "no such
license shall be construed to create any right, beyond the terms,
conditions, and periods of the license." 47 U.S.C. Sec. 301. Such
language is evidence that no enforceable right exists under Sec.
1983, and that Congress intended to foreclose claims such as
Howard's. See Golden State, 110 S. Ct. at 449; Wilder, 110 S. Ct.
at 2523. Cf. Wright, 479 U.S. at 430. The Act thus grants no Sec.
1983 right to licensees to erect antennas."

Vern was getting up in years and didn't want to carry this to the
SCOTUS - it was a shot in the dark, as he said - so there it stands.

--
73 de K2ASP - Phil Kane

Lloyd wrote:
You are Full of **** Kane.

Care to mention where he is full of it?
Otherwise you're just trolling.

Dave Heil wrote in message ...


FCC VEC exam?

No biggie. K3FK, WE3A and I used to administer them in Helsinki. A
number of the Finns passed all exam up through the Extra in one sitting.

Wonder what they used for an address?

WA8JOC handled QSLing for all of my DX operations. His mailman, Freddie
was used to the piles of QSL cards following a CQ WW DX 'test operation
but when the FCC documents began arriving with all sorts of lengthy
Finnish names, he asked Shep if he had rented the garage to a bunch of
guys from Finland. They, after all, had to provide a U.S. address
through which they could be contacted by the FCC.

Dave K8MN

Of course. And you provided it. Typical Extra attitude. Just help
yourself to whatever you want, pass some around to your friends.

Callsign: K3FK Class: Extra Codes: HAI USA
Name: RICHARD A IRVING
Addr1: PSC 78, Box 33
Addr2: APO, AP 96326-1000
Country: USA
Effective: 14 Nov 2002 Expires: 04 Nov 2007
FRN: 0007938624 What's this?
FCC: ULS Listing
Lookups: 211

Callsign: WE3A Class: Extra Codes: HAI USA
Name: VILHO K HIILESMAA
Addr1: 2721 Halifax Court, c/o Steinman
Addr2: McKinney, TX 75070
Country: USA
Effective: 06 Sep 2000 Expires: 06 Sep 2010
FRN: 0006405997 What's this?
FCC: ULS Listing
Lookups: 118

Callsign: WA8JOC Class: Extra Codes: HAI USA
Name: Kenneth S Scheper
Addr1: 5875 Cedaridge Dr
Addr2: Cincinnati, OH 45247
Country: USA
Effective: 03 Mar 2004 Expires: 31 May 2014
FRN: 0003051612 What's this?
FCC: ULS Listing
Lookups: 1075

William wrote:

Dave Heil wrote in message ...


FCC VEC exam?

No biggie. K3FK, WE3A and I used to administer them in Helsinki. A
number of the Finns passed all exam up through the Extra in one sitting.

Wonder what they used for an address?

I already provided the callsign of the Cincinnati amateur whose address
they used.

WA8JOC handled QSLing for all of my DX operations. His mailman, Freddie
was used to the piles of QSL cards following a CQ WW DX 'test operation
but when the FCC documents began arriving with all sorts of lengthy
Finnish names, he asked Shep if he had rented the garage to a bunch of
guys from Finland. They, after all, had to provide a U.S. address
through which they could be contacted by the FCC.

Dave K8MN

Of course. And you provided it.

No, I didn't. WA8JOC provided it.

Typical Extra attitude.

I think so. We performed a service to those desiring to legally obtain
U.S. licenses. If you don't like it, I can live with that.

Just help
yourself to whatever you want, pass some around to your friends.

I helped myself to nothing. I helped others to obtain that which they
desired. Neither U.S. nor Finnish laws were broken. Almost all of
those who tested have visited the U.S. at least once and have used the
licenses they obtained. Again, if it bothers you, I can live with that.

Callsign: K3FK Class: Extra Codes: HAI USA
Name: RICHARD A IRVING
Addr1: PSC 78, Box 33
Addr2: APO, AP 96326-1000
Country: USA
Effective: 14 Nov 2002 Expires: 04 Nov 2007
FRN: 0007938624 What's this?
FCC: ULS Listing
Lookups: 211

Yep, that's K3FK

Callsign: WE3A Class: Extra Codes: HAI USA
Name: VILHO K HIILESMAA
Addr1: 2721 Halifax Court, c/o Steinman
Addr2: McKinney, TX 75070
Country: USA
Effective: 06 Sep 2000 Expires: 06 Sep 2010
FRN: 0006405997 What's this?
FCC: ULS Listing
Lookups: 118

Yep, that's Ville.

Callsign: WA8JOC Class: Extra Codes: HAI USA
Name: Kenneth S Scheper
Addr1: 5875 Cedaridge Dr
Addr2: Cincinnati, OH 45247
Country: USA
Effective: 03 Mar 2004 Expires: 31 May 2014
FRN: 0003051612 What's this?
FCC: ULS Listing
Lookups: 1075

Yep, that's Shep.

My name is Dave and exams were administered under the Laurel, MD VEC.

Rant away.

Dave K8MN

On 24 Nov 2004 01:31:47 GMT, Alun wrote:

Quite true, but if you live in Germany and nip down to your local USAF
facility for a VE sesion you can get a US licence, all legal and above
board.

There's an obvious solution. If someone takes a VE test overseas and has no
US address, they ought to be given a sequentially issued call in one of the
less populous FCC districts, say the 1st district.

Or they should be told to buzz off. Why should any U.S. license be
issued to someone in a foreign country that has no intention of using
it in the U.S. ?

And with the CEPT stuff, there's even more reason not to issue U.S.
licenses in many countries.

73, Jim KH2D