In article , Mike Coslo
writes:

Lenof21 wrote:

In article , Mike Coslo
writes:



I'm TRYING to argue against the morse code test. You are trying
to squelch such arguments by misdirection into defamation of any
who are against the morse code test.

Hmm, you possibly could:

Start a Morse code thread


I have.


Try to refrain from the pejoratives


Sorry. Someone insults me, I give 'em back lots more.

So when have I insulted you? You aren't considering disagreement as
insulting are you?


So far, in this Din of Inequity, the few, the proud (of themselves),
the murines (eyewash) wan't to pummel and pound on any
NCTA...especially using personal pejoratives.

Bill Sohl seems to have escaped that fate when he posts here.

You never know what might happen.


Sorry, sweetums, I've seen what has already happened. So have
you and everyone else accessing this newsgrope.

Chicken and egg syndrome? Given the history of posters here, I would
suspect that if you were to adopt a different strategy, there would be
some posts that would be provoking. However, if ignored, that stuff goes
away.

Given the "history of posters here," especially the PCTA extras,
your good idea is merely impractical bull****.

PCTA extras all pretend to be "superior" and let everyone know it.


Then again, I suspect you enjoy things just the way they are. 8^)


You are WRONG.

Seriously? You don't enjoy tweaking people?

The "tweaking" is easy for me to do. Most of the postings I do
simply "write themselves." :-)

You seem to forget that I've had a long career of working in electronics.
Electrons (in electronics) do NOT get influenced by human desires.
All humans who work with electrons have to play be electron's rules.
I enjoy that kind of work. It appears cold, hard, logical but can be
quite creative once you learn electron's rules. Once that is done, they
CAN follow human orders.

The odd part of human nature is that the PCTA extras think that all
must follow Their rules, obey them, etc., and some get quite
fanciful in imagining the "motivations" of the NCTA.

So another description of
what you are doing is that you are engaging in something that you hate
to do, in the interests of eliminating the Morse code test, in a Usenet
newsgroup?

Incorrect. Your speculation is nonsense.

You forget that many more readers follow what goes on in here.
They, too, can see/read the propaganda nonsense about the
nobility and efficacy of morse code and the alleged "necessity"
of the amateur radio morse code test. Those readers need a bit
of boost on the reasons AGAINST it. Myself and others have
presented opposing reasons for that code test.

Are you making some sort of Quixotic sacrifice in a Usenet
newsgroup in an attempt to eliminate Morse code testing?

No. If you will bother to read the 18 petitions at the FCC you
would see that it isn't some Cervantes fictional character
exercise...but, some of the proponents of the code test are
indeed human windmills whirling in dead air.

The PCTA just can't take opposing views
on the morse code test. They get so very bitchy and angry
and demand to get all who argue against the retention that it
becomes a repeated comedy of brainwashing phrases by them.

No problem on my replying in kind to the PCTA...if I have the
time to spend on their trite, tired, tintabulation of olde-tyme
phrases. I'm busy with lots of other things, but I can find time
once in a while to puncture their arrogant balloons of old, stale,
hot air.

All the arguments are old and we've heard them a lot. From both sides.

Poor baby. You seem distressed. Or perhaps your lordship
wishes better entertainment?

Here is a suggestion for your lordship: Use your amateur radio
license and operate your mighty transceiver on the air instead of
accessing this newsgroup. Chat with other human beings (or what
passes for same).

Or, your lordship could take the lead and open up a real Chat Room
all about morse code on amateur radio and how wonderful it is and
that morsemanship should be done by all the "superior" beings. You
could develop a real following and become a Name in Chat Room
circles, get known, develop a "rep." Or even a website where you
could post "awards" given by the certificate makers and praise
yourself for being so damn good.

This is NOT a "Chat Room" for idle gossip and cracker-barrel
philosophy by a few regulars who have grown overly full of themselves.
Even though they think they own the place (and can therefore dictate
who gets to sit in), they don't. True. They don't even when their
feathers get very ruffled by opposing opinions. (poor things...)

Morse code is an old, primitive communications mode. The first
morse code was used in 1844...on a commercial wired system, not
on radio (radio had yet to be proved to exist). Early radio used on-
off keying codes because that was the ONLY practical way to
communicate given that there were no vacuum tubes and certainly
no transistors. Primitive stuff that was first demonstrated in 1896.
What passes for truisms about morse code "superiority" as
spouted by the ARRL was formed in the 1930s, seven decades ago.
Of course the reasons to maintain morse code testing are OLD.

The silly part of it is that so many olde-tymers insist that the old
is "best" and that nothing should change. They can't devise any
good reasons to keep that code test, nothing new during the seven
decades they've tried. All those reasons are tired, trite, cliches'
and the reasons against them are true, familiar, easy to repeat.
Again, refutation of the pro-code-test-advocates' "reasons" almost
"write themselves."

The only thing "new" with the PCTA extras is their propensity for
"replying" by personal insults against the NCTA. All NCTA are
"inferior" to them and their mighty accomplishments with morse.
In short, they are so full of themselves that they cannot accept
any others' inputs. They are stuffed and over-stuffed. Some go to
the bursting point. Two former PCTA extras in here may have
done just that. Other PCTA extras are expected to follow.

Perhaps you should go to Church more often...such as to the
Church of St. Hiram, the patron saint of Newington. There you
could mass with other morsemen and celebrate the mode in
chorus with a heavenly choir. Wash your brain regularly lest all
the old, tired, trite cliches' fall out. By all means, exercise your
morsemanship regularly to be ready for the Second Coming of
Aliens so you can defeat them via morse code and thereby
Save the World. After all, you are "superior" through morse code.



Posted on 19 Jan 05

Len Over 21 wrote:
In article , Mike Coslo
writes:

Lenof21 wrote:

In article , Mike Coslo
writes:



I'm TRYING to argue against the morse code test. You are
trying
to squelch such arguments by misdirection into defamation of
any
who are against the morse code test.

Hmm, you possibly could:

Start a Morse code thread


I have.


Try to refrain from the pejoratives


Sorry. Someone insults me, I give 'em back lots more.

So when have I insulted you? You aren't considering disagreement as

insulting are you?


So far, in this Din of Inequity, the few, the proud (of
themselves),
the murines (eyewash) wan't to pummel and pound on any
NCTA...especially using personal pejoratives.

Bill Sohl seems to have escaped that fate when he posts here.

You never know what might happen.


Sorry, sweetums, I've seen what has already happened. So have
you and everyone else accessing this newsgrope.

Chicken and egg syndrome? Given the history of posters here, I
would
suspect that if you were to adopt a different strategy, there would
be
some posts that would be provoking. However, if ignored, that stuff
goes
away.

Given the "history of posters here," especially the PCTA extras,
your good idea is merely impractical bull****.

In your very first sentence of reply, Lennie, you prove Mike
correct.

The "impracticality" comes from YOUR unwillingness to stop lying,
deceiving and being antagonistic. It's just not in what little bit of
a character you have to do....

And your use of emphatic profanity to try and "make your point"
only further serves to demonstrate just how angry you get when someone
makes such a well said and valid observation.

You've been bested once again, Lennie, and it cuts to the core.
Bravo, Mike

Steve, K4YZ

Len Over 21 wrote:

In article , Mike Coslo
writes:


Lenof21 wrote:


In article , Mike Coslo
writes:




I'm TRYING to argue against the morse code test. You are trying
to squelch such arguments by misdirection into defamation of any
who are against the morse code test.

Hmm, you possibly could:

Start a Morse code thread


I have.



Try to refrain from the pejoratives


Sorry. Someone insults me, I give 'em back lots more.

So when have I insulted you? You aren't considering disagreement as
insulting are you?



So far, in this Din of Inequity, the few, the proud (of themselves),
the murines (eyewash) wan't to pummel and pound on any
NCTA...especially using personal pejoratives.

Bill Sohl seems to have escaped that fate when he posts here.


You never know what might happen.


Sorry, sweetums, I've seen what has already happened. So have
you and everyone else accessing this newsgrope.

Chicken and egg syndrome? Given the history of posters here, I would
suspect that if you were to adopt a different strategy, there would be
some posts that would be provoking. However, if ignored, that stuff goes
away.


Given the "history of posters here," especially the PCTA extras,
your good idea is merely impractical bull****.

PCTA extras all pretend to be "superior" and let everyone know it.



Then again, I suspect you enjoy things just the way they are. 8^)


You are WRONG.

Seriously? You don't enjoy tweaking people?


The "tweaking" is easy for me to do. Most of the postings I do
simply "write themselves." :-)

You seem to forget that I've had a long career of working in electronics.
Electrons (in electronics) do NOT get influenced by human desires.
All humans who work with electrons have to play be electron's rules.
I enjoy that kind of work. It appears cold, hard, logical but can be
quite creative once you learn electron's rules. Once that is done, they
CAN follow human orders.

The odd part of human nature is that the PCTA extras think that all
must follow Their rules, obey them, etc., and some get quite
fanciful in imagining the "motivations" of the NCTA.


So another description of
what you are doing is that you are engaging in something that you hate
to do, in the interests of eliminating the Morse code test, in a Usenet
newsgroup?


Incorrect. Your speculation is nonsense.

Correct, And it was written as such. Problem is, now we are running out
of motives.

You forget that many more readers follow what goes on in here.
They, too, can see/read the propaganda nonsense about the
nobility and efficacy of morse code and the alleged "necessity"
of the amateur radio morse code test. Those readers need a bit
of boost on the reasons AGAINST it. Myself and others have
presented opposing reasons for that code test.


Are you making some sort of Quixotic sacrifice in a Usenet
newsgroup in an attempt to eliminate Morse code testing?


No. If you will bother to read the 18 petitions at the FCC you
would see that it isn't some Cervantes fictional character
exercise...but, some of the proponents of the code test are
indeed human windmills whirling in dead air.


The PCTA just can't take opposing views
on the morse code test. They get so very bitchy and angry
and demand to get all who argue against the retention that it
becomes a repeated comedy of brainwashing phrases by them.

No problem on my replying in kind to the PCTA...if I have the
time to spend on their trite, tired, tintabulation of olde-tyme
phrases. I'm busy with lots of other things, but I can find time
once in a while to puncture their arrogant balloons of old, stale,
hot air.

All the arguments are old and we've heard them a lot. From both sides.


Poor baby. You seem distressed. Or perhaps your lordship
wishes better entertainment?

Hmm, no distress here.

Here is a suggestion for your lordship: Use your amateur radio
license and operate your mighty transceiver on the air instead of
accessing this newsgroup. Chat with other human beings (or what
passes for same).

Or, your lordship could take the lead and open up a real Chat Room
all about morse code on amateur radio and how wonderful it is and
that morsemanship should be done by all the "superior" beings. You
could develop a real following and become a Name in Chat Room
circles, get known, develop a "rep." Or even a website where you
could post "awards" given by the certificate makers and praise
yourself for being so damn good.

If I didn't know better, I would think you are being sarcastic and sardonic.


This is NOT a "Chat Room" for idle gossip and cracker-barrel
philosophy by a few regulars who have grown overly full of themselves.
Even though they think they own the place (and can therefore dictate
who gets to sit in), they don't. True. They don't even when their
feathers get very ruffled by opposing opinions. (poor things...)

Correct, This is not a chat room.

Morse code is an old, primitive communications mode. The first
morse code was used in 1844...on a commercial wired system, not
on radio (radio had yet to be proved to exist). Early radio used on-
off keying codes because that was the ONLY practical way to
communicate given that there were no vacuum tubes and certainly
no transistors. Primitive stuff that was first demonstrated in 1896.
What passes for truisms about morse code "superiority" as
spouted by the ARRL was formed in the 1930s, seven decades ago.
Of course the reasons to maintain morse code testing are OLD.

The silly part of it is that so many olde-tymers insist that the old
is "best" and that nothing should change. They can't devise any
good reasons to keep that code test, nothing new during the seven
decades they've tried. All those reasons are tired, trite, cliches'
and the reasons against them are true, familiar, easy to repeat.
Again, refutation of the pro-code-test-advocates' "reasons" almost
"write themselves."

The only thing "new" with the PCTA extras is their propensity for
"replying" by personal insults against the NCTA. All NCTA are
"inferior" to them and their mighty accomplishments with morse.
In short, they are so full of themselves that they cannot accept
any others' inputs. They are stuffed and over-stuffed. Some go to
the bursting point. Two former PCTA extras in here may have
done just that. Other PCTA extras are expected to follow.

Perhaps you should go to Church more often...such as to the
Church of St. Hiram, the patron saint of Newington. There you
could mass with other morsemen and celebrate the mode in
chorus with a heavenly choir. Wash your brain regularly lest all
the old, tired, trite cliches' fall out. By all means, exercise your
morsemanship regularly to be ready for the Second Coming of
Aliens so you can defeat them via morse code and thereby
Save the World. After all, you are "superior" through morse code.

Oh dear. You really don't have a whole lot else to say do you?

So anyhow, how do you feel about the VEC rates increasing?

- Mike KB3EIA

Len Over 21 wrote:

In article , Mike Coslo
writes:

Lenof21 wrote:

In article , Mike Coslo
writes:

You never know what might happen.


Sorry, sweetums, I've seen what has already happened. So have
you and everyone else accessing this newsgrope.

Chicken and egg syndrome? Given the history of posters here, I would
suspect that if you were to adopt a different strategy, there would be
some posts that would be provoking. However, if ignored, that stuff goes
away.

Given the "history of posters here," especially the PCTA extras,
your good idea is merely impractical bull****.

But that's what you post now. If changing your tactics didn't work,
you'd be no worse off than you are now.

PCTA extras all pretend to be "superior" and let everyone know it.

All licensed radio amateurs; Techs, Generals and Extras; are your
superiors in that they have been issued amateur radio licenses. That is
something you don't have. Ah, but I forgot--this is your week not to
desire such a license.

Then again, I suspect you enjoy things just the way they are. 8^)


You are WRONG.

Seriously? You don't enjoy tweaking people?

The "tweaking" is easy for me to do. Most of the postings I do
simply "write themselves." :-)

....and they have that look. :-) :-)

You seem to forget that I've had a long career of working in electronics.
Electrons (in electronics) do NOT get influenced by human desires.

Have you noticed that your posts here have about the same effect upon
readers of r.r.a.p? Almost no one has been influenced by your human
desires as pertain to amateur radio.

The odd part of human nature is that the PCTA extras think that all
must follow Their rules, obey them, etc., and some get quite
fanciful in imagining the "motivations" of the NCTA.

One of more odd bits of human nature has you attributing beliefs to all
PCTA Extras as if we all had the exact same thoughts and experiences.

So another description of
what you are doing is that you are engaging in something that you hate
to do, in the interests of eliminating the Morse code test, in a Usenet
newsgroup?

Incorrect. Your speculation is nonsense.

You forget that many more readers follow what goes on in here.
They, too, can see/read the propaganda nonsense about the
nobility and efficacy of morse code and the alleged "necessity"
of the amateur radio morse code test. Those readers need a bit
of boost on the reasons AGAINST it. Myself and others have
presented opposing reasons for that code test.

Wow! Talk about speculation! How about it, lurking, never-posting
readers of r.r.a.p? Let us know if you support the self-appointed
advocate for morse code test removal of the group. Tell us if you
believe his method is effective. Let us hear if you have been swayed by
his posts.

Are you making some sort of Quixotic sacrifice in a Usenet
newsgroup in an attempt to eliminate Morse code testing?

No. If you will bother to read the 18 petitions at the FCC you
would see that it isn't some Cervantes fictional character
exercise...but, some of the proponents of the code test are
indeed human windmills whirling in dead air.

That's the same kind of charm you turned on for a couple of your
submissions to the Commission. Do you think your words swayed anyone
there or might they have thought you a crackpot?

All the arguments are old and we've heard them a lot. From both sides.

Poor baby. You seem distressed. Or perhaps your lordship
wishes better entertainment?

Are you trying to sway him to accepting your view, Len? Do you think
your comment above has been effective?

Here is a suggestion for your lordship: Use your amateur radio
license and operate your mighty transceiver on the air instead of
accessing this newsgroup. Chat with other human beings (or what
passes for same).

Do you think your charm offensive is working, Leonard?

Or, your lordship could take the lead and open up a real Chat Room
all about morse code on amateur radio and how wonderful it is and
that morsemanship should be done by all the "superior" beings. You
could develop a real following and become a Name in Chat Room
circles, get known, develop a "rep." Or even a website where you
could post "awards" given by the certificate makers and praise
yourself for being so damn good.

You're outdoing yourself. What panache! What skill!

This is NOT a "Chat Room" for idle gossip and cracker-barrel
philosophy by a few regulars who have grown overly full of themselves.

You're a regular, Len.

Even though they think they own the place (and can therefore dictate
who gets to sit in), they don't. True. They don't even when their
feathers get very ruffled by opposing opinions. (poor things...)

Do your feathers get ruffled by opposing opinions?

They are stuffed and over-stuffed. Some go to
the bursting point. Two former PCTA extras in here may have
done just that. Other PCTA extras are expected to follow.

Your words about the dead are a tribute to your personal magnetism.

Perhaps you should go to Church more often...such as to the
Church of St. Hiram, the patron saint of Newington. There you
could mass with other morsemen and celebrate the mode in
chorus with a heavenly choir. Wash your brain regularly lest all
the old, tired, trite cliches' fall out. By all means, exercise your
morsemanship regularly to be ready for the Second Coming of
Aliens so you can defeat them via morse code and thereby
Save the World. After all, you are "superior" through morse code.

Yes, Len, your people skills rival those of Carl. Yessir, you really
have Mike on the verge of changing his mind. I'm sure the throng of
lurkers is cheering wildly.

Dave K8MN

In article , Dave Heil
writes:

Len Over 21 wrote:

In article , Mike Coslo
writes:

Lenof21 wrote:

In article , Mike Coslo
writes:

You never know what might happen.


Sorry, sweetums, I've seen what has already happened. So have
you and everyone else accessing this newsgrope.

Chicken and egg syndrome? Given the history of posters here, I
would
suspect that if you were to adopt a different strategy, there would be
some posts that would be provoking. However, if ignored, that stuff goes
away.

Given the "history of posters here," especially the PCTA extras,
your good idea is merely impractical bull****.

But that's what you post now. If changing your tactics didn't work,
you'd be no worse off than you are now.

PCTA extras all pretend to be "superior" and let everyone know it.

All licensed radio amateurs; Techs, Generals and Extras; are your
superiors in that they have been issued amateur radio licenses.

There you have it. In Poop Dave the 1st's idea of the radio
world, the amateurs are "superior" while the professionals
are "inferior."

That is
something you don't have. Ah, but I forgot--this is your week not to
desire such a license.

Tsk. There is NO requirement for newsgroup access to possess
an amateur radio license.

Tsk, tsk. There is NO requirement for access to the FCC requiring
an amateur radio license in order to comment on amateur radio
matters.

You make such fanciful imaginings, then pretend that whoever you
are trying to impugn really does what you say.


Then again, I suspect you enjoy things just the way they are. 8^)


You are WRONG.

Seriously? You don't enjoy tweaking people?

The "tweaking" is easy for me to do. Most of the postings I do
simply "write themselves." :-)

...and they have that look. :-) :-)

Poor baby. Never made much money writing for money?

Oh, that's RIGHT...you are an AMATEUR and don't desire to
make money! My apologies at forgetting your lofty, noble
attitudes...your attitude got hidden in all that "superiority."


You seem to forget that I've had a long career of working in electronics.
Electrons (in electronics) do NOT get influenced by human desires.

Have you noticed that your posts here have about the same effect upon
readers of r.r.a.p? Almost no one has been influenced by your human
desires as pertain to amateur radio.

Haven't you noticed that YOU are NOT winning any points in here,
heavenly fodder?

All you seem to be doing is being nasty to anyone who comments
about anything in here. :-)

The odd part of human nature is that the PCTA extras think that all
must follow Their rules, obey them, etc., and some get quite
fanciful in imagining the "motivations" of the NCTA.

One of more odd bits of human nature has you attributing beliefs to all
PCTA Extras as if we all had the exact same thoughts and experiences.

Tsk, tsk, tsk...not "EXACT," heavenly fodder. :-)

So another description of
what you are doing is that you are engaging in something that you hate
to do, in the interests of eliminating the Morse code test, in a Usenet
newsgroup?

Incorrect. Your speculation is nonsense.

You forget that many more readers follow what goes on in here.
They, too, can see/read the propaganda nonsense about the
nobility and efficacy of morse code and the alleged "necessity"
of the amateur radio morse code test. Those readers need a bit
of boost on the reasons AGAINST it. Myself and others have
presented opposing reasons for that code test.

Wow! Talk about speculation! How about it, lurking, never-posting
readers of r.r.a.p? Let us know if you support the self-appointed
advocate for morse code test removal of the group. Tell us if you
believe his method is effective. Let us hear if you have been swayed by
his posts.

You should really leave the polling to the ARRL. That would get
you biased results that would make you proud. :-)

Are you making some sort of Quixotic sacrifice in a Usenet
newsgroup in an attempt to eliminate Morse code testing?

No. If you will bother to read the 18 petitions at the FCC you
would see that it isn't some Cervantes fictional character
exercise...but, some of the proponents of the code test are
indeed human windmills whirling in dead air.

That's the same kind of charm you turned on for a couple of your
submissions to the Commission. Do you think your words swayed anyone
there or might they have thought you a crackpot?

Oooooo! You are now a PR Judge as well? :-)

Funny you should mention "crackpot" but then I guess it takes one
to think all his "enemies" are like that...

All the arguments are old and we've heard them a lot. From both sides.

Poor baby. You seem distressed. Or perhaps your lordship
wishes better entertainment?

Are you trying to sway him to accepting your view, Len? Do you think
your comment above has been effective?

Tsk. It's better than repeated calls of "Putz" on his person. :-)


Here is a suggestion for your lordship: Use your amateur radio
license and operate your mighty transceiver on the air instead of
accessing this newsgroup. Chat with other human beings (or what
passes for same).

Do you think your charm offensive is working, Leonard?

No, but then it isn't the blatently OFFENSIVE attitude you have...


Or, your lordship could take the lead and open up a real Chat Room
all about morse code on amateur radio and how wonderful it is and
that morsemanship should be done by all the "superior" beings. You
could develop a real following and become a Name in Chat Room
circles, get known, develop a "rep." Or even a website where you
could post "awards" given by the certificate makers and praise
yourself for being so damn good.

You're outdoing yourself. What panache! What skill!

Ah, but the words are TRUE...and that makes you ANGRY.

Well, word-wise, you are still an AMATEUR.


This is NOT a "Chat Room" for idle gossip and cracker-barrel
philosophy by a few regulars who have grown overly full of themselves.

You're a regular, Len.

I've been a regular Len since I was first named.

If my regularity isn't up to par, I just drop in here for some equivalent
Ex-Lax. Does the job every time. :-)

Even though they think they own the place (and can therefore dictate
who gets to sit in), they don't. True. They don't even when their
feathers get very ruffled by opposing opinions. (poor things...)

Do your feathers get ruffled by opposing opinions?

Don't have feathers, heavenly fodder.

If I did, it wouldn't bother me. THAT is what galls you, isn't it?

You should really see a health professional to have all that gall
removed.

They are stuffed and over-stuffed. Some go to
the bursting point. Two former PCTA extras in here may have
done just that. Other PCTA extras are expected to follow.

Your words about the dead are a tribute to your personal magnetism.

Tsk. I didn't say anything about the "dead."

If I would speak of the "dead" that would be a short form for
"dead-brained," that attribute of all those AMATEURS who insist
that the morse code test must be kept forever and ever.


Perhaps you should go to Church more often...such as to the
Church of St. Hiram, the patron saint of Newington. There you
could mass with other morsemen and celebrate the mode in
chorus with a heavenly choir. Wash your brain regularly lest all
the old, tired, trite cliches' fall out. By all means, exercise your
morsemanship regularly to be ready for the Second Coming of
Aliens so you can defeat them via morse code and thereby
Save the World. After all, you are "superior" through morse code.

Yes, Len, your people skills rival those of Carl. Yessir, you really
have Mike on the verge of changing his mind. I'm sure the throng of
lurkers is cheering wildly.

Tsk. Another bout of Nasties from the Dale Carneige drop-out.

"Carl" who? The pro in electronics who helped change S25.5 by
going to Geneva, Switzerland, for WRC-03? That "Carl" is also
an Amateur Extra. Trouble is, he is an NCTA and that REALLY
gets your robes flying, heavenly fodder.

Tsk, tsk, fewer and fewer are swearing by the words of ARRL and
rather swearing AT the code propaganda of the ARRL. You poor
self-righteous olde-tymers are soon going to lose your bragging
rights about morsemanship being essential to your self-important
rank/status/privilege in U.S. amateur radio.

NOBODY is kissing your ring, heavenly fodder. They aren't even
bothering to tell you to kiss their posterior either. One can't swear
effectively to so much QRM from the PCTA extra bull pen. Just
noise. Self-righteous noise about their nobility and devotion to some
imaginary "service." Tsk.

Len Anderson wrote:

In article , Dave Heil
writes:

Len Over 21 wrote:

In article , Mike Coslo
writes:

Lenof21 wrote:

In article , Mike Coslo
writes:

You never know what might happen.


Sorry, sweetums, I've seen what has already happened. So have
you and everyone else accessing this newsgrope.

Chicken and egg syndrome? Given the history of posters here, I
would
suspect that if you were to adopt a different strategy, there would be
some posts that would be provoking. However, if ignored, that stuff goes
away.

Given the "history of posters here," especially the PCTA extras,
your good idea is merely impractical bull****.

But that's what you post now. If changing your tactics didn't work,
you'd be no worse off than you are now.

PCTA extras all pretend to be "superior" and let everyone know it.

All licensed radio amateurs; Techs, Generals and Extras; are your
superiors in that they have been issued amateur radio licenses.

There you have it. In Poop Dave the 1st's idea of the radio
world, the amateurs are "superior" while the professionals
are "inferior."

There you have it. Len misses a couple of key phrases. I didn't write
of the "radio world", Leonard. I wrote "licensed radio amateurs" and
"amateur radio licenses".

That is
something you don't have. Ah, but I forgot--this is your week not to
desire such a license.

Tsk. There is NO requirement for newsgroup access to possess
an amateur radio license.

You're correct. Your posts here are proof of that.

Tsk, tsk. There is NO requirement for access to the FCC requiring
an amateur radio license in order to comment on amateur radio
matters.

You've commented to the FCC.

You make such fanciful imaginings, then pretend that whoever you
are trying to impugn really does what you say.

Something like that, Leonard, old boy. I just imagine that you have no
amateur radio license and *poof*, it comes to pass--you really have no
amateur radio license.

Seriously? You don't enjoy tweaking people?

The "tweaking" is easy for me to do. Most of the postings I do
simply "write themselves." :-)

...and they have that look. :-) :-)

Poor baby. Never made much money writing for money?

What does that have to do with your output? You'd think a professional
writer would be embarrassed by some of the style and substance errors
you make.

Oh, that's RIGHT...you are an AMATEUR and don't desire to
make money!

How you drift! I enjoy making money, Leonard. I don't make money for
operating an amateur radio station. You're a former professional. You
can't make any money operating an amateur radio station. You see, we
have something in common. Do you have an amateur radio station?

My apologies at forgetting your lofty, noble
attitudes...your attitude got hidden in all that "superiority."

Apology accepted.

You seem to forget that I've had a long career of working in electronics.
Electrons (in electronics) do NOT get influenced by human desires.

Have you noticed that your posts here have about the same effect upon
readers of r.r.a.p? Almost no one has been influenced by your human
desires as pertain to amateur radio.

Haven't you noticed that YOU are NOT winning any points in here,
heavenly fodder?

No, I haven't.

All you seem to be doing is being nasty to anyone who comments
about anything in here. :-)

"Leo's" been commenting about "anything" in here recently. I'm not
"being nasty" to "Leo". Hans has commented about "anything" in here.
I'm not being nasty to Hans. Besides, you've admitted to "making
nasty". Aren't you being just a tad two-faced? :-) :-)

The odd part of human nature is that the PCTA extras think that all
must follow Their rules, obey them, etc., and some get quite
fanciful in imagining the "motivations" of the NCTA.

One of more odd bits of human nature has you attributing beliefs to all
PCTA Extras as if we all had the exact same thoughts and experiences.

Tsk, tsk, tsk...not "EXACT," heavenly fodder. :-)

There you have it, Foghorn.

Incorrect. Your speculation is nonsense.

You forget that many more readers follow what goes on in here.
They, too, can see/read the propaganda nonsense about the
nobility and efficacy of morse code and the alleged "necessity"
of the amateur radio morse code test. Those readers need a bit
of boost on the reasons AGAINST it. Myself and others have
presented opposing reasons for that code test.

Wow! Talk about speculation! How about it, lurking, never-posting
readers of r.r.a.p? Let us know if you support the self-appointed
advocate for morse code test removal of the group. Tell us if you
believe his method is effective. Let us hear if you have been swayed by
his posts.

You should really leave the polling to the ARRL. That would get
you biased results that would make you proud. :-)

Maybe you should explain why I should leave informal polling of an
internet newsgroup to the ARRL. I'm still waiting to view the
outpouring of support you receive from the lurker element here.

Are you making some sort of Quixotic sacrifice in a Usenet
newsgroup in an attempt to eliminate Morse code testing?

No. If you will bother to read the 18 petitions at the FCC you
would see that it isn't some Cervantes fictional character
exercise...but, some of the proponents of the code test are
indeed human windmills whirling in dead air.

That's the same kind of charm you turned on for a couple of your
submissions to the Commission. Do you think your words swayed anyone
there or might they have thought you a crackpot?

Oooooo! You are now a PR Judge as well? :-)

Yeah, and a pretty darned good one. :-) :-)

Funny you should mention "crackpot" but then I guess it takes one
to think all his "enemies" are like that...

Are you my enemy, Len? I believed you were just a run of the mill
crackpot.

All the arguments are old and we've heard them a lot. From both sides.

Poor baby. You seem distressed. Or perhaps your lordship
wishes better entertainment?

Are you trying to sway him to accepting your view, Len? Do you think
your comment above has been effective?

Tsk. It's better than repeated calls of "Putz" on his person. :-)

Sure is. I've seen no indication that Mike is a putz. :-)

Here is a suggestion for your lordship: Use your amateur radio
license and operate your mighty transceiver on the air instead of
accessing this newsgroup. Chat with other human beings (or what
passes for same).

Do you think your charm offensive is working, Leonard?

No, but then it isn't the blatently OFFENSIVE attitude you have...

There it is, an admission from you that your tactics don't work.

Or, your lordship could take the lead and open up a real Chat Room
all about morse code on amateur radio and how wonderful it is and
that morsemanship should be done by all the "superior" beings. You
could develop a real following and become a Name in Chat Room
circles, get known, develop a "rep." Or even a website where you
could post "awards" given by the certificate makers and praise
yourself for being so damn good.

You're outdoing yourself. What panache! What skill!

Ah, but the words are TRUE...and that makes you ANGRY.

Those words you wrote--they're true? Really? I'm angry? Really?
I'm awfully sorry, Len, they aren't true and I'm not angry.

Well, word-wise, you are still an AMATEUR.

Word-wise? Do you consider yourself a PROFESSIONAL, word-wise? :-)

This is NOT a "Chat Room" for idle gossip and cracker-barrel
philosophy by a few regulars who have grown overly full of themselves.

You're a regular, Len.

I've been a regular Len since I was first named.

Oh, I don't believe that. There's something that sets you apart from
any other Len I've ever encountered. That aside, you ARE a regular here
and you seem full of yourself and there's seemingly no end to your
homespun views of the motivations of others.

If my regularity isn't up to par, I just drop in here for some equivalent
Ex-Lax. Does the job every time. :-)

Apparently, it does not. :-)

Even though they think they own the place (and can therefore dictate
who gets to sit in), they don't. True. They don't even when their
feathers get very ruffled by opposing opinions. (poor things...)

Do your feathers get ruffled by opposing opinions?

Don't have feathers, heavenly fodder.

Then what makes you believe that others who post here have feathers?

If I did, it wouldn't bother me.

If you had feathers, it wouldn't bother me either.

THAT is what galls you, isn't it?

That you don't have feathers?

You should really see a health professional to have all that gall
removed.

Is this about the feathers thing?

They are stuffed and over-stuffed. Some go to
the bursting point. Two former PCTA extras in here may have
done just that. Other PCTA extras are expected to follow.

Your words about the dead are a tribute to your personal magnetism.

Tsk. I didn't say anything about the "dead."

Then why not tell us to whom you referred? Who are the two former PCTA
Extras?

If I would speak of the "dead" that would be a short form for
"dead-brained," that attribute of all those AMATEURS who insist
that the morse code test must be kept forever and ever.

But a guy who isn't a participant in amateur radio and who decrees that
morse code testing in amateur radio should be eliminated--he's not
"dead-brained"?

Perhaps you should go to Church more often...such as to the
Church of St. Hiram, the patron saint of Newington. There you
could mass with other morsemen and celebrate the mode in
chorus with a heavenly choir. Wash your brain regularly lest all
the old, tired, trite cliches' fall out. By all means, exercise your
morsemanship regularly to be ready for the Second Coming of
Aliens so you can defeat them via morse code and thereby
Save the World. After all, you are "superior" through morse code.

Yes, Len, your people skills rival those of Carl. Yessir, you really
have Mike on the verge of changing his mind. I'm sure the throng of
lurkers is cheering wildly.

Tsk. Another bout of Nasties from the Dale Carneige drop-out.

Wouldn't I have to drop in before I could drop out?

"Carl" who? The pro in electronics who helped change S25.5 by
going to Geneva, Switzerland, for WRC-03? That "Carl" is also
an Amateur Extra.

That's the guy. He liked using the "Nazi" and "jackbooted thug" terms
too.

Trouble is, he is an NCTA and that REALLY
gets your robes flying, heavenly fodder.

Robes? What robes, Foghorn?

Tsk, tsk, fewer and fewer are swearing by the words of ARRL and
rather swearing AT the code propaganda of the ARRL. You poor
self-righteous olde-tymers are soon going to lose your bragging
rights about morsemanship being essential to your self-important
rank/status/privilege in U.S. amateur radio.

Are you related to Barbara Boxer?

NOBODY is kissing your ring, heavenly fodder. They aren't even
bothering to tell you to kiss their posterior either. One can't swear
effectively to so much QRM from the PCTA extra bull pen. Just
noise. Self-righteous noise about their nobility and devotion to some
imaginary "service." Tsk.

You really do rant like one of the homeless.

Dave K8MN

On Thu, 20 Jan 2005 19:39:23 GMT, Dave Heil
wrote:

Wow! Talk about speculation! How about it, lurking, never-posting
readers of r.r.a.p? Let us know if you support the self-appointed
advocate for morse code test removal of the group. Tell us if you
believe his method is effective. Let us hear if you have been swayed by
his posts.

To take the three questions in order...

1. Yes, I support the contention that the code test should be removed.

2. No, I do not believe that his method is effective. However, I also
basically believe that no other method would be any more effective
than his, which is one of the reasons why I'm mainly a lurker here and
rarely post.

3. No, I have not been swayed by his posts. In fact, I already
believed it was time to do away with code testing back in the
mid-1970's, which was twenty years before I ever discovered this
newsgroup and its various inhabitants.

John Kasupski, KC2HMZ
Tonawanda, New York

In article , John Kasupski
writes:

On Thu, 20 Jan 2005 19:39:23 GMT, Dave Heil
wrote:

Wow! Talk about speculation! How about it, lurking, never-posting
readers of r.r.a.p? Let us know if you support the self-appointed
advocate for morse code test removal of the group. Tell us if you
believe his method is effective. Let us hear if you have been swayed by
his posts.

Hello John. :-)

The heavenly fodder wishes to both troll and make nasty to another
in his "asking of questions."

To take the three questions in order...

1. Yes, I support the contention that the code test should be removed.

I say Good on You!

2. No, I do not believe that his method is effective. However, I also
basically believe that no other method would be any more effective
than his, which is one of the reasons why I'm mainly a lurker here and
rarely post.

"Effective," e-schmective...

Da heavenly fodder hasn't come close to being effective in doing
anything but reinforcing his image of the prussian offizier busy
mouthing the party line of the Church of St. Hiram.


3. No, I have not been swayed by his posts. In fact, I already
believed it was time to do away with code testing back in the
mid-1970's, which was twenty years before I ever discovered this
newsgroup and its various inhabitants.

The same for me but a bit earlier....like two decades before.

Back when I volunteered for U.S. Army duty, I really believed
that "radio expertise" required morsemanship skills. Lucking
out in being assigned to a large Army HF communications
station - and finding out they did NOT use a bit of morse code
anywhere on HF - I learned better. [that was in the 1950s]

Perhaps an oddity, the OIC (Officer in Charge) of ADA trans-
mitters, Capt. William Boss (apt surname) was a ham and the
maintenance NCOIC had both radiotelephone and radiotelegraph
commercial operator licenses in addition to an amateur radio
license.

Oh, yes, such "isn't about ham radio, is it" as some say,
especially those who have never served their country in the
military or, if they did, never did any REAL communications
duty at a large HF station. [the Angle of Dearth is one of those]

War stories of military days seem to fall into two categories in
he Fanciful, non-detailed braggadoccio or sea-going "radio
room adventures." Nothing wrong with the latter as far as I'm
concerned, but they seldom have 30+ high-power HF transmitters
working at the same time on a ship, not even on a carrier.

A half-dozen teleprinters in a large radio room with steel walls,
deck, and overhead do indeed make a racket as Jim Hampton
wrote. Wait until you get 200+ teleprinters working in a medium-
sized torn-tape relay room. Now, THAT is NOISE...and that is
how it was on the 2nd floor of the Chuo Kogyo Control for Army
station ADA...and ADA was only the 3rd largest Army station at
the time. :-)

That was a half century ago in my experience. Since then, I've
never encountered any civilian, commercial, or government/military
station that used or required morse code mode communications...
other than some amateurs and a few ships. A decade ago, the
major communications modes for ships was voice, by VHF or
SSB, or by data-teleprinter.

The pro-code-test-advocates (PCTA) seem to think that morseman-
ship is soooooo necessary that the FCC *must* test for it in order
to get a ham license for use below 30 MHz. Well, it may BE a
necessity...all those morsemen need to have playmates on their
little reserved slices of ham bands...their sandboxes aren't full yet
and more and more have signed off permanently. :-)



Posted on 22 Jan 05

Len Anderson wrote:
In article , John
Kasupski
writes:

On Thu, 20 Jan 2005 19:39:23 GMT, Dave Heil
wrote:

Wow! Talk about speculation! How about it, lurking, never-posting
readers of r.r.a.p? Let us know if you support the self-appointed
advocate for morse code test removal of the group. Tell us if you
believe his method is effective. Let us hear if you have been
swayed by
his posts.

Hello John.

The heavenly fodder wishes to both troll and make nasty to another
in his "asking of questions."

Oh, not "nasty" at all.

You perceive yourself as Don Quixote. We're just interested in
seeing if your rants actually have any support or if you're just the
slovenly, bile spitting idiot we all think you are.

So far, it seems "not".

To take the three questions in order...

1. Yes, I support the contention that the code test should be
removed.

I say Good on You!

Boy...isn't THAT a surprise...?!?!

2. No, I do not believe that his method is effective. However, I
also
basically believe that no other method would be any more effective
than his, which is one of the reasons why I'm mainly a lurker here
and
rarely post.

"Effective," e-schmective...

Da heavenly fodder hasn't come close to being effective in doing
anything but reinforcing his image of the prussian offizier busy
mouthing the party line of the Church of St. Hiram.

Lennie's ineffectiveness as a cheerleader is pretty well summed up
in the character of that paragraph.

3. No, I have not been swayed by his posts. In fact, I already
believed it was time to do away with code testing back in the
mid-1970's, which was twenty years before I ever discovered this
newsgroup and its various inhabitants.

The same for me but a bit earlier....like two decades before.

Uh huh...Was that before you allegedly learned code to 10 WPM or
after?

(I say it's yet another "LennieLie". I don't think you could tap
out SOS if it was etched in scars on your arms.

Back when I volunteered for U.S. Army duty...(SNIP)

More of his "I Was A Rear Area Radio Clerk War Hero" rants.

The pro-code-test-advocates (PCTA) seem to think that morseman-
ship is soooooo necessary that the FCC *must* test for it in order
to get a ham license for use below 30 MHz. Well, it may BE a
necessity...all those morsemen need to have playmates on their
little reserved slices of ham bands...their sandboxes aren't full
yet
and more and more have signed off permanently.

And we hope and pray YOUR QRT date is just around the same corner!
Steve, K4YZ

Len Anderson wrote:

In article , John Kasupski
writes:

On Thu, 20 Jan 2005 19:39:23 GMT, Dave Heil
wrote:

Wow! Talk about speculation! How about it, lurking, never-posting
readers of r.r.a.p? Let us know if you support the self-appointed
advocate for morse code test removal of the group. Tell us if you
believe his method is effective. Let us hear if you have been swayed by
his posts.

Hello John. :-)

The heavenly fodder wishes to both troll and make nasty to another
in his "asking of questions."


When you ask questions, is it trolling or "making nasty"? You've
already admitted to deliberately "making nasty", haven't you?

I'm polling, not trolling.

To take the three questions in order...

1. Yes, I support the contention that the code test should be removed.

I say Good on You!

2. No, I do not believe that his method is effective. However, I also
basically believe that no other method would be any more effective
than his, which is one of the reasons why I'm mainly a lurker here and
rarely post.

"Effective," e-schmective...

Da heavenly fodder hasn't come close to being effective in doing
anything but reinforcing his image of the prussian offizier busy
mouthing the party line of the Church of St. Hiram.

He said that he didn't believe your method was effective, Len.

3. No, I have not been swayed by his posts. In fact, I already
believed it was time to do away with code testing back in the
mid-1970's, which was twenty years before I ever discovered this
newsgroup and its various inhabitants.

The same for me but a bit earlier....like two decades before.

Back when I volunteered for U.S. Army duty, I really believed
that "radio expertise" required morsemanship skills. Lucking
out in being assigned to a large Army HF communications
station - and finding out they did NOT use a bit of morse code
anywhere on HF - I learned better. [that was in the 1950s]

Perhaps an oddity, the OIC (Officer in Charge) of ADA trans-
mitters, Capt. William Boss (apt surname) was a ham and the
maintenance NCOIC had both radiotelephone and radiotelegraph
commercial operator licenses in addition to an amateur radio
license.

Oh, yes, such "isn't about ham radio, is it" as some say,
especially those who have never served their country in the
military or, if they did, never did any REAL communications
duty at a large HF station. [the Angle of Dearth is one of those]

War stories of military days seem to fall into two categories in
he Fanciful, non-detailed braggadoccio or sea-going "radio
room adventures." Nothing wrong with the latter as far as I'm
concerned, but they seldom have 30+ high-power HF transmitters
working at the same time on a ship, not even on a carrier.

A half-dozen teleprinters in a large radio room with steel walls,
deck, and overhead do indeed make a racket as Jim Hampton
wrote. Wait until you get 200+ teleprinters working in a medium-
sized torn-tape relay room. Now, THAT is NOISE...and that is
how it was on the 2nd floor of the Chuo Kogyo Control for Army
station ADA...and ADA was only the 3rd largest Army station at
the time. :-)

That was a half century ago in my experience. Since then, I've
never encountered any civilian, commercial, or government/military
station that used or required morse code mode communications...
other than some amateurs and a few ships. A decade ago, the
major communications modes for ships was voice, by VHF or
SSB, or by data-teleprinter.

The pro-code-test-advocates (PCTA) seem to think that morseman-
ship is soooooo necessary that the FCC *must* test for it in order
to get a ham license for use below 30 MHz. Well, it may BE a
necessity...all those morsemen need to have playmates on their
little reserved slices of ham bands...their sandboxes aren't full yet
and more and more have signed off permanently. :-)

He said he hadn't been swayed by your posts, Len. Did you treat him to
the several paragraphs of blather for a reason?

John has posted here quite a number of times so he hardly counts as a
lurker. He has previously made his views on morse testing known. If we
discount him, we're left with an army of.....hmmmm...precisely.....uh...
no lurkers who have spoken up to say that they support your methods or
that they've been swayed by your posts. If we do decide to count John,
he states that he does not support your methods and that he has not been
swayed by your posts.

The lack of response from lurkers seems to indicate that there are not
an many people reading and not commenting as you believe.

Dave K8MN