Dave Heil wrote:
bb wrote:
Dave Heil wrote:

wrote:

From: "bb" on Wed,May 4 2005 4:13 pm



wrote:


From: "K0HB" on Tues,May 3 2005 5:59 pm



"bb" wrote

Yup, everyone just got through saying that there's a problem

attracting


Technicians to the organization. No one seems to be able to put

their

finger on exactly why, only because they reject the -correct-

answer

(reminds me of the OJ case). And they still wring their hands
and

bite


their knuckles and ask, "Why?"


It's awful. Those olde-tymers just CAN'T understand
why all the newcomers DON'T worship the olde-tymers'
ideals of long ago.

Hell, I'm OLDER than most of them and I STARTED on
HF...but NOT doing a bit of "CW." :-)

Then again, you still aren't a ham. :-)

And he still hasn't worked any out-of-band Frenchmen. You're way
ahead
on that one.

I certainly am.

Yes, you certainly are.

From: on Thurs,May 12 2005 3:26 pm

wrote:


But note that the hamdata.com numbers include licenses
that are expired but in the grace period. They also
include club and other non-operator licenses. The numbers I
post here twice a month include only current, unexpired licenses
held by individuals.

So sayeth the Keeper of the Amateur Census. :-)

I think the totals I post are a more accurate snapshot of the
license situation than the numbers on hamdata.com, because the
inclusion of expired-but-in-the-grace-period licenses skews the
totals considerably.

I don't think so. Many others don't think so.

Now PROVE you are the ONLY ACCURATE voice of
what goes on in this "amateur community."

The FCC doesn't appear to think as you do, Jimmie.
If a licensee is in their grace period and then
renews their license before that period is up,
it just resets the FCC data. The licensed amateur
still retains his/her license after renewal.

It should be noted that the peak of U.S. amateur
radio license numbers was on 2 Jul 03 with a total
of 737,938 then (number of club calls not known).
The Hamdata statistics are derived automatically
by downloading the publicly-available FCC database
(massive in size) and sorting for classes.

How massive?

You have to ask?!? :-) MANY megabytes, Jimmie.
The information is THERE, publicly accessible.
As Kellie exhorts, "get off your duff and go find
it!" :-)

Hint: The actual numbers change on database size.



Who claimed that would happen? I sure didn't.

Tsk, tsk. My posting was NOT directed to you. :-)

You are NOT on trial. Tell your legal counsel to
quit billing you for legal representation. This
is NOT a court. :-)



Of course Technician
Pluses who renew as Technicians keep their HF privileges, and
Technicians who pass Element 1 get them, even though their
licenses don't change class.

So an unknown number of "Technicians" can legally operate on some HF
amateur bands. Also, any amateur with a Technician Plus or Novice
license, current, grace period, or expired, can get a General or Extra
without any further code testing.

Tsk, tsk, tsk. Jimmie Noserve is still trying to foist
off his OWN concept of "the real amateur community"
where the Technician classes are "not real hams"
(REAL hams work DX on HF with CW?).

Jimmie boy, give us your EXACT numbers on those Tech
class licensees who ONLY "work" above 30 MHz. Then
PROVE that they all hunger for or desire to "work CW"
on the HF bands...as all "real hams" should. :-)

What's your point in all this, Len? You give a lot of numbers but
never
seem to say why they matter.

"Sweetums," I don't INTERPRET raw data. I just quote
it from the public database downloaded by one website
from the FCC.

I HAVE said "why it matters." You don't want to listen.
You don't want to believe anything contrary to your
immaculate concept of "real ham radio."

Why does that bother you so much, Jimmie? Do you suspect
I gored your sacred cow or something? Has your "honor"
been sullied? Are you "appealing a court ruling" in
here? Must be. You take things SO seriously!

And why does all this concern you so much?

I dunno, Jimmie, YOU are going to TELL me WHY "I am so
concerned" because you KNOW everything. :-)

Maybe I might want to get a ham license someday? Or
maybe I just like to get to the TRUTH of matters
without all the smoke and mirrors of some fanatics
who take their HOBBY as a Life Calling?

You're not a radio
amateur, and it appears that you'll never become one either -

Tsk, tsk. Jimmie boy, YOU don't CONTROL anything or
anybody.

I'm a PROFESSIONAL in radio-electronics. Have been for
53 years. I'm a HOBBYIST in radio-electronics too,
have been for about 57 years.

[ sunnuvagun! ]

your "out of the box" claim of almost 5-1/2 years ago notwithstanding.

Poor baby. Poor Brother Jimmie, monk at the Church of
Saint Hiram, having doubts about his LIFE CALLING in
the AMATEUR ORDER. Tsk, tsk, tsk.

A HOBBY is NOT a Life Calling, Jimmie. It doesn't
require LIFELONG DEVOTION and Absolute Adherence to
the VOWS taken when one entered the Order.

I never made a SACRED VOW in HERE on anything,
"Sweetums." You are trying to MANUFACTURE that
condition. Nice misdirection on what HAD been a
discussion of public database numbers versus Bro.
Jimmie's concept of U.S. ham radio (as seen from
the insides of his mind's monastery).

I've taken ONE VOW absolute. In my marriage
ceremony. I wear only ONE ring, a wedding ring.
I've taken ANOTHER VOW absolute...that of defending
the U.S. Constitution when I was inducted into the
U.S. Army. I still hold to BOTH those vows.
NO problem to me. Those are absolute.

You apparently think some newsgroup content is
EQUIVALENT to such an absolute VOW to be held
forever. If so, you are as nuts as your buddy
and amateur extra role-model for all hams, Stebie
the Avenging Angle of Dearth.

Go step out of your monastery, Bro. Jimmie.

Peace be unto you.

wrote:
From: on Thurs,May 12 2005 3:26 pm
wrote:

N2EY wrote:

But note that the hamdata.com numbers include licenses
that are expired but in the grace period. They also
include club and other non-operator licenses. The numbers I
post here twice a month include only current, unexpired
licenses held by individuals.

I think the totals I post are a more accurate snapshot of the
license situation than the numbers on hamdata.com, because the
inclusion of expired-but-in-the-grace-period licenses skews the
totals considerably.

I don't think so.

That's fine.

Many others don't think so.

How many? Who are they?

Now PROVE you are the ONLY ACCURATE voice of
what goes on in this "amateur community."

Why, Len? I don't claim to be the only accurate voice. Just more
accurate than you.

The FCC doesn't appear to think as you do, Jimmie.

Sure they do.

If a licensee is in their grace period and then
renews their license before that period is up,
it just resets the FCC data. The licensed amateur
still retains his/her license after renewal.

That's right. Also irrelevant.

I've pointed out that the numbers I post are of currently-licensed
individuals. You fail to mention that the numbers
on hamdata.com include clubs and other non-individual licenses
(over 9,000 of them) and expired-but-in-the-grace-period
licenses.

It should be noted that the peak of U.S. amateur
radio license numbers was on 2 Jul 03 with a total
of 737,938 then (number of club calls not known).
The Hamdata statistics are derived automatically
by downloading the publicly-available FCC database
(massive in size) and sorting for classes.

How massive?

You have to ask?!? :-)

I don't have to. I just did. Don't you know?

MANY megabytes, Jimmie.

How many?

Who claimed that would happen? I sure didn't.

Tsk, tsk. My posting was NOT directed to you. :-)

Just answer the question, please.

Of course Technician
Pluses who renew as Technicians keep their HF privileges, and
Technicians who pass Element 1 get them, even though their
licenses don't change class.

So an unknown number of "Technicians" can legally operate on
some HF
amateur bands. Also, any amateur with a Technician Plus or
Novice
license, current, grace period, or expired, can get a General or
Extra
without any further code testing.

Tsk, tsk, tsk. Jimmie Noserve is still trying to foist
off his OWN concept of "the real amateur community"
where the Technician classes are "not real hams"
(REAL hams work DX on HF with CW?).

That's simply not true, Len.

You're just making up bull****. Typical jackass behavior for you.

;-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-)

I've repeatedly said that "radio amateur" means anyone licensed
in the Amateur Radio Service. License class, band and mode don't
matter. VHF/UHF is as much "real amateur radio" as HF.

What's your point in all this, Len? You give a lot of numbers but
never seem to say why they matter.

"Sweetums,"

I'm not your sweetums, Len.

I don't INTERPRET raw data.

That's true. You MISINTERPRET raw data...

I just quote
it from the public database downloaded by one website
from the FCC.

So you accept hamdata.com without question...

I HAVE said "why it matters."

Where?

You don't want to listen.

Sure I do. But I don't wade through the mountains of posts you
make here.

Tell us again "why it matters", Len. You've got plenty of time
and no shortage of verbiage to spout.

You don't want to believe anything contrary to your
immaculate concept of "real ham radio."

Just tell us why it matters.

Why does that bother you so much, Jimmie? Do you suspect
I gored your sacred cow or something? Has your "honor"
been sullied? Are you "appealing a court ruling" in
here? Must be. You take things SO seriously!

I don't take you seriously at all, Len. But I do point out
the holes in your arguments, and your factual/logical mistakes,
which seems to enrage you no end..

And why does all this concern you so much?

I dunno, Jimmie, YOU are going to TELL me WHY "I am so
concerned" because you KNOW everything. :-)

Maybe I might want to get a ham license someday?

Nope. We can rule that right out.

Or
maybe I just like to get to the TRUTH of matters
without all the smoke and mirrors of some fanatics
who take their HOBBY as a Life Calling?

Nope. Truth is one thing you avoid....

You're not a radio
amateur, and it appears that you'll never become one either -

Tsk, tsk. Jimmie boy, YOU don't CONTROL anything or
anybody.

Sure I do. I don't control everything or everybody, though.

I'm a PROFESSIONAL in radio-electronics. Have been for
53 years. I'm a HOBBYIST in radio-electronics too,
have been for about 57 years.

So what? You're not a radio amateur, never been one, and it appears
that you'll never become one either. That's the TRUTH.

your "out of the box" claim of almost 5-1/2 years ago
notwithstanding.

Poor baby. Poor Brother Jimmie, monk at the Church of
Saint Hiram, having doubts about his LIFE CALLING in
the AMATEUR ORDER. Tsk, tsk, tsk.

Why no, Len, it's not about me at all.

A HOBBY is NOT a Life Calling, Jimmie. It doesn't
require LIFELONG DEVOTION and Absolute Adherence to
the VOWS taken when one entered the Order.

I never made a SACRED VOW in HERE on anything,
"Sweetums."

No, you didn't. I never claimed you did.

You are trying to MANUFACTURE that
condition.

Nope - I'm simply pointing out what you claimed you would do,
but haven't done yet.

Nice misdirection on what HAD been a
discussion of public database numbers versus Bro.
Jimmie's concept of U.S. ham radio (as seen from
the insides of his mind's monastery).

I've taken ONE VOW absolute. In my marriage
ceremony. I wear only ONE ring, a wedding ring.
I've taken ANOTHER VOW absolute...that of defending
the U.S. Constitution when I was inducted into the
U.S. Army. I still hold to BOTH those vows.
NO problem to me. Those are absolute.

So what?

Seems to me you're telling us that we should only believe you
on those two things where you made a "vow absolute". And you're saying
that the rest of what you say isn't reliable at all.

You apparently think some newsgroup content is
EQUIVALENT to such an absolute VOW to be held
forever.

Nope. I'm simply pointing out what you claimed you would do,
but haven't done yet. And will probably never do.

That TRUTH appears to bother you a lot.

From: on Sun,May 15 2005 5:43 am

wrote:
From: on Thurs,May 12 2005 3:26 pm
wrote:



Why, Len? I don't claim to be the only accurate voice. Just more
accurate than you.

Heh heh heh...only by YOUR "authority!" :-)


The FCC doesn't appear to think as you do, Jimmie.

Sure they do.

Tsk, tsk, Jimmie...in the REAL reality of now they
do NOT think as you do.

The ONLY one who "thinks like you do" is YOU. :-)


I've pointed out that the numbers I post are of currently-licensed
individuals. You fail to mention that the numbers
on hamdata.com include clubs and other non-individual licenses
(over 9,000 of them) and expired-but-in-the-grace-period
licenses.

Tsk, tsk. Early symptoms of Alzheimer's?

I've written "exclusive of club calls" on quoting
the Hamdata statistics.

Jimmie, get your definitions correct. Those amateur
licensees who are IN the 2-year grace period for
renewal are NOT "expired." The FCC doesn't call them
that. If those renewals are done within that grace
period, they retain their old call.

"Expired" applies AFTER the total 10-year plus 2-year
grace period.


Just answer the question, please.

No. :-)



That's simply not true, Len.

You're just making up bull****. Typical jackass behavior for you.

Tsk, tsk, very Very VERY WRONG, Jimmie Noserve.

Try to use CIVIL language in here...or are you
studying under your buddie, Stebie da Avenging Angle
of Dearth, aka today's Amateur Extra role-model?


I've repeatedly said that "radio amateur" means anyone licensed
in the Amateur Radio Service. License class, band and mode don't
matter. VHF/UHF is as much "real amateur radio" as HF.

No, you have NOT.



I'm not your sweetums, Len.

Heaven forbid, NO! :-)

I was using familiar terms to I-had-dinner-with-the-
Captain Kellie...ya know da Philly "tuff tawk?" :-)

Or is your last hoagie disagreeing with you?


I don't INTERPRET raw data.

That's true. You MISINTERPRET raw data...

Poor baby...I do NOT INTERPRET as Jimmie Noserve
"interprets." That's why you are so disturbed and
angry, compelled to try to "put me right." :-)

I just quote
it from the public database downloaded by one website
from the FCC.

So you accept hamdata.com without question...

NO. You are WRONG!

I question almost everything. I accept Hamdata figures
for the simple reason that they do NOT go into ARRL-
style sinning-by-omission on radio history and their
minority viewpoint on How Amateur Radio SHOULD Be.

Does the ARRL download the daily FCC database on
U.S. amateur radio licensees? No? Tsk, tsk.


You don't want to listen.

Sure I do. But I don't wade through the mountains of posts you
make here.

No, Jimmie, you do NOT want to listen to anything but
the fantasy you've come to believe about a hobby.

Jimmie, do NOT engage in word "food fights." Your
aim is WAY off and you cause too much collateral
damage.


I don't take you seriously at all, Len.

No sweat, Jimmie Noserve. I've never taken you as anything
but a Believer, a toady to ARRL group-think, and a liver in
the past before your time.

But I do point out
the holes in your arguments, and your factual/logical mistakes,
which seems to enrage you no end..

No, No, NO, Jimmie, you got it WRONG again.

All you do is engage in some odd word play to try
and "justify" your rationalizations of your fantasy
ideas about a hobby. That is NOT "correcting
mistakes."

Maybe I might want to get a ham license someday?

Nope. We can rule that right out.

Who are YOU to judge?

You are NOT in the FCC.

You are NOT an official in the ARRL.

All you are is acting like a snide little hamlet who
can't accept that you do NOT "rule" anything (except
with a pencil and paper).


Nope. Truth is one thing you avoid....

WRONG...WRONG...WRONG...WRONG...


Tsk, tsk. Jimmie boy, YOU don't CONTROL anything or
anybody.

Sure I do. I don't control everything or everybody, though.

Tsk, you've LOST CONTROL of YOURSELF there... :-)


So what? You're not a radio amateur, never been one, and it appears
that you'll never become one either. That's the TRUTH.

WHO said "I will never become one?" :-)

Jimmie Noserve predicts the future? Should he be
called Jimmie Nostradamus? :-)

Jimmie, I've been an UNLICENSED radio-electronics
hobbyist longer than you've been alive...and that IS
the truth...in REALITY.

I've been a LICENSED PROFESSIONAL in radio-electronics
about as long as you've been alive...and that IS the
truth...in REALITY.

I was OPERATING on HF BEFORE you were born, Jimmie,
IN the military...the military you've NEVER been in.
That is reality...whether or not you care to accept it.

Don't even ATTEMPT to CONTROL what I am "allowed" to
do in the FUTURE...because you CANNOT and you do NOT
know the future.

Quit acting like a spoiled child who demands obediance
to you and your ideas.


Why no, Len, it's not about me at all.

This thread is about the ARRL and the FUTURE, Jimmie.

It isn't about the PAST that you glorify.

It is about NUMBERS and who is getting what license
in amateur radio. [the Technicians are getting the
overwhelming majority of new licenses, upsetting
your cherished ideals of How Amateur Radio Should Be]


I never made a SACRED VOW in HERE on anything,
"Sweetums."

No, you didn't. I never claimed you did.

You are trying to MANUFACTURE that
condition.

Nope - I'm simply pointing out what you claimed you would do,
but haven't done yet.

You aren't being CONSISTENT. Try to get it straight.
Is it what *I* "might" do or is it about "what I will
'never' do?"

You are (seemingly) bringing up an OLD piece of a
posting to IMPLY that I "must" do it...EXACTLY as
I wrote it. :-) YOU be the "jackass" when you keep
on doing that.

Jimmie, this thread is NOT about me. Why do you want
to convene a kangaroo court? Are you that unhappy
with things that you NEED to antagonistically "pick
on" others? Get CONTROL of YOUR life. Get OFF of
mine.



Nope. I'm simply pointing out what you claimed you would do,
but haven't done yet. And will probably never do.

That TRUTH appears to bother you a lot.

See, that OLD piece of posting is still sticking to the
roof of your brain. Are you an Effluent?

FANTASY doesn't bother me. You have much FANTASY
going...especially when you come up with What Amateur
Radio Should Be (according to your god-like perceptions
and beliefs). Fantasy can be FUN as entertainment.
FANTASY should NOT be any basis for REGULATIONS...yet
that is what you think is "truth."

TRUTH is what the FCC database has...the FCC grants
the licenses, can tally up what it grants. The TRUTH
is that the increase in NEW Technician licenses in the
USA is averaging about 26 per day, over four times the
total of other-class licenses put together. The ARRL
is still busy keeping up the charade that U.S. ham
radio is like it was many decades ago. It isn't. They
aren't really trying to entice Technician class
licensees into League membership. The post that Hans
Brakob made addresses that FACT.

YOU don't seem to like that TRUTH. You want to call
such facts "wrong" because they are against your
BELIEFS. You want to "strike back" at those that
present the TRUTH because such TRUTHs are uncomfortable
to your fantasy.

wrote:

You're just making up bull****. Typical jackass behavior for you.


;-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-);-)

Jim defrocked after episode of potty mouth.

wrote:
From: on Sun,May 15 2005 5:43 am
wrote:
From: on Thurs,May 12 2005 3:26 pm
wrote:


Why, Len? I don't claim to be the only accurate voice. Just
more accurate than you.

Heh heh heh...only by YOUR "authority!" :-)

Which is more reliable than *your* "authority", Len....;-) ;-) ;-)

The FCC doesn't appear to think as you do, Jimmie.

Sure they do.

Tsk, tsk, Jimmie...in the REAL reality of now they
do NOT think as you do.

Yes, they do.

The ONLY one who "thinks like you do" is YOU. :-)

Prove it.

I've pointed out that the numbers I post are of currently-
licensed
individuals. You fail to mention that the numbers
on hamdata.com include clubs and other non-individual licenses
(over 9,000 of them) and expired-but-in-the-grace-period
licenses.

Tsk, tsk. Early symptoms of Alzheimer's?

Not in me.

I've written "exclusive of club calls" on quoting
the Hamdata statistics.

Jimmie, get your definitions correct. Those amateur
licensees who are IN the 2-year grace period for
renewal are NOT "expired."

The licensees may or may not have expired. Their
licenses *have* expired.

The FCC doesn't call them that.

Yes, they do.

Quoting FCC rules, 97.21 iii:

"b) A person whose amateur station license grant has expired may apply
to the FCC for renewal of the license grant for another term during a 2
year filing grace period. The application must be received at the
address specified above prior to the end of the grace period. Unless
and until the license grant is renewed, no privileges in this Part are
conferred."

The licensee may not have expired but the license sure has.

I suggest you actually read Part 97, Len.

If those renewals are done within that grace
period, they retain their old call.

Of course. But until FCC acts on the renewal application,
the license is expired.

"Expired" applies AFTER the total 10-year plus 2-year
grace period.

No, it doesn't. See 97.21. FCC also uses the term "expire"
elsewhere in Part 97, to refer to licenses that have reached
the end of the 10 year term, but not the grace period.

Just answer the question, please.

No. :-)

Then why should I answer any of yours?

That's simply not true, Len.

You're just making up bull****. Typical jackass behavior for
you.

Tsk, tsk, very Very VERY WRONG, Jimmie Noserve.

No Len. Would you prefer if I called you a diminutive nickname?

Try to use CIVIL language in here...

I have - for years. It doesn't work with you, Len. You exhibit
jackass behavior in accordance with a predictable profile
regardless - if a person disagrees with your opinions and/or
points out errors in your postings here.

I've repeatedly said that "radio amateur" means anyone licensed
in the Amateur Radio Service. License class, band and mode
don't
matter. VHF/UHF is as much "real amateur radio" as HF.

No, you have NOT.

Sure I have. You're in error again, Len.

I just quote
it from the public database downloaded by one website
from the FCC.

So you accept hamdata.com without question...

NO. You are WRONG!

I question almost everything. I accept Hamdata figures
for the simple reason that they do NOT go into ARRL-
style sinning-by-omission on radio history and their
minority viewpoint on How Amateur Radio SHOULD Be.

I see, You use ad-hominem criteria.

Does the ARRL download the daily FCC database on
U.S. amateur radio licensees?

Yes.

But I do point out
the holes in your arguments, and your factual/logical mistakes,
which seems to enrage you no end..

No, No, NO, Jimmie, you got it WRONG again.

All you do is engage in some odd word play to try
and "justify" your rationalizations of your fantasy
ideas about a hobby. That is NOT "correcting
mistakes."

See above about the word "expire" as used by FCC in Part 97.
You made a mistake, Len. I pointed it out.

Maybe I might want to get a ham license someday?

Nope. We can rule that right out.

Who are YOU to judge?

Who do I have to be? You judge everyone else here, why shouldn't I?

You are NOT in the FCC.

Neither are you.

You are NOT an official in the ARRL.

Neither are you.

All you are is acting like a snide little hamlet who
can't accept that you do NOT "rule" anything (except
with a pencil and paper).

That's more a description of you than me, Len.


So what? You're not a radio amateur, never been one, and it
appears
that you'll never become one either. That's the TRUTH.

WHO said "I will never become one?" :-)

It appears you will never become one. Just an observation.

Jimmie, I've been an UNLICENSED radio-electronics
hobbyist longer than you've been alive...and that IS
the truth...in REALITY.

So what? All that means is that you are old and that you
have fooled with some electronic stuff. Lots of people
can say the same thing.

I've been a LICENSED PROFESSIONAL in radio-electronics
about as long as you've been alive...and that IS the
truth...in REALITY.

So what? All that means is that you are old and that you
passed a written test for an FCC *commercial* license once upon a time.
Lots of people can say the same thing.

I was OPERATING on HF BEFORE you were born, Jimmie,
IN the military...the military you've NEVER been in.
That is reality...whether or not you care to accept it.

So what? All that means is that you are old and that you
once served in the Army, where you were trained to do certain
transmitter adjustments, as part of a large team of specialists. Lots
of people can say the same thing.

Don't even ATTEMPT to CONTROL

Control? Another mistake by you. I just observe and predict.

what I am "allowed" to
do in the FUTURE...because you CANNOT and you do NOT
know the future.

I do know your behavior here, though, and that's a clear predictor of
what you will and won't do. For example, I've
predicted that you'll make up insulting nicknames for those
who disagree with you no matter how they address you. So far
you've proved that prediction 100% correct.

Quit acting like a spoiled child who demands obediance
to you and your ideas.

"Don't even ATTEMPT to CONTROL what I am "allowed" to
do in the FUTURE...because you CANNOT and you do NOT
know the future." - Len Anderson

Apply your own rules for others to your own behavior, Len.

Why no, Len, it's not about me at all.

This thread is about the ARRL and the FUTURE, Jimmie.

"Don't even ATTEMPT to CONTROL what I am "allowed" to
do in the FUTURE...because you CANNOT and you do NOT
know the future." - Len Anderson

It isn't about the PAST that you glorify.

It is about NUMBERS and who is getting what license
in amateur radio. [the Technicians are getting the
overwhelming majority of new licenses,

That's true. But so what?

upsetting
your cherished ideals of How Amateur Radio Should Be]

Not true.

The fact is that a lot of those Technicians are going on to other
licenses.

Some time back you posted the snippet that the Technician class was
growing at a rate of 26 per day. I asked how many Technician Pluses
were being renewed as Technicians, but you didn't answer.

It turns out that the Technician Plus class is *losing* about 26 per
day. Of course not all of them are renewing as Technicians - some are
upgrading and some are being removed from the database. (the above is
from hamdata.com)

I never made a SACRED VOW in HERE on anything,
"Sweetums."

No, you didn't. I never claimed you did.

You are trying to MANUFACTURE that
condition.

Nope - I'm simply pointing out what you claimed you would do,
but haven't done yet.

You aren't being CONSISTENT. Try to get it straight.
Is it what *I* "might" do or is it about "what I will
'never' do?"

You claimed you were going for Extra "right out of the box". January
19, 2000, more than 5-1/4 years ago. But you haven't even got a
Technician license yet.

As I wrote befo

You're not a radio amateur, never been one, and it
appears that you'll never become one either. That's the TRUTH.

Note the phrase "it appears that you'll never".

You are (seemingly) bringing up an OLD piece of a
posting to IMPLY that I "must" do it...EXACTLY as
I wrote it. :-)

Not at all, Len. I'm simply pointing out what you said you would
do, but haven't done yet. And that it appears you'll never do it.

YOU be the "jackass" when you keep
on doing that.

Hmmm...now who doesn't like the truth?

Jimmie, this thread is NOT about me. Why do you want
to convene a kangaroo court? Are you that unhappy
with things that you NEED to antagonistically "pick
on" others? Get CONTROL of YOUR life. Get OFF of
mine.

Sounds like you're telling me to shut up. Here's a clue, Len:

"Don't even ATTEMPT to CONTROL what I am "allowed" to
do in the FUTURE...because you CANNOT and you do NOT
know the future." - Len Anderson


Nope. I'm simply pointing out what you claimed you would do,
but haven't done yet. And will probably never do.

See? That's what you want to control.

That TRUTH appears to bother you a lot.

See, that OLD piece of posting is still sticking to the
roof of your brain. Are you an Effluent?

FANTASY doesn't bother me. You have much FANTASY
going...especially when you come up with What Amateur
Radio Should Be (according to your god-like perceptions
and beliefs). Fantasy can be FUN as entertainment.
FANTASY should NOT be any basis for REGULATIONS...yet
that is what you think is "truth."

TRUTH is what the FCC database has...the FCC grants
the licenses, can tally up what it grants. The TRUTH
is that the increase in NEW Technician licenses in the
USA is averaging about 26 per day, over four times the
total of other-class licenses put together.

No, that's not what hamdata.com says. You're wrong, Len.

Hamdata.com says that the number
of Technician licenses is increasing at the rate of about 25
per day - *from all sources*. Not just new licenses - *ALL* sources.
Got that?

It means Technician Pluses
renewed as Technicians, Novices who pass Element 2, and new
licenses.

Hamdata.com also shows that the Tech Plus license class is
*decreasing* by about 25 per day over the same time period.

You misinterpreted hamdata.com.

The ARRL
is still busy keeping up the charade that U.S. ham
radio is like it was many decades ago.

How are they doing that?

It isn't. They
aren't really trying to entice Technician class
licensees into League membership.

How do you know?

The post that Hans
Brakob made addresses that FACT.

YOU don't seem to like that TRUTH. You want to call
such facts "wrong" because they are against your
BELIEFS. You want to "strike back" at those that
present the TRUTH because such TRUTHs are uncomfortable
to your fantasy.

Not me.

You're simply saying that your *opinions* about ARRL are "THE TRUTH".
That's just bull**** on your part. No other word to describe it.

wrote:
wrote:

Jimmie, get your definitions correct. Those amateur
licensees who are IN the 2-year grace period for
renewal are NOT "expired."

The licensees may or may not have expired. Their
licenses *have* expired.

The FCC doesn't call them that.

Yes, they do.

Quoting FCC rules, 97.21 iii:

"b) A person whose amateur station license grant has expired may
apply
to the FCC for renewal of the license grant for another term during a
2
year filing grace period. The application must be received at the
address specified above prior to the end of the grace period. Unless
and until the license grant is renewed, no privileges in this Part
are
conferred."

The licensee may not have expired but the license sure has.

I suggest you actually read Part 97, Len.

Now THAT would be refreshing...

Of course you've cited that exact same paragraph to Lennie on
several occassions before when he's made the same error, yet he
continues to make THE SAME ERROR.

Just answer the question, please.

No.

Then why should I answer any of yours?

Indeed.

Lennie's been asked MANY questions by many persons on numerous
subjects...The only answer (paraphrased) "I don't have to answer the
questions of mighty morsemen".

But he has point-blank DEMANDED answers from us...Hence my refusal
to further address my Armed Forces service outside the realm of
radio...I love seeing him twist in his seat...Burns him up to know he
doesn't have control.

Try to use CIVIL language in here...

I have - for years. It doesn't work with you, Len. You exhibit
jack### behavior in accordance with a predictable profile
regardless - if a person disagrees with your opinions and/or
points out errors in your postings here.

Lennie's nickname should be "Diode"...things are only one way with
him...

But I do point out
the holes in your arguments, and your factual/logical mistakes,
which seems to enrage you no end..

No, No, NO, Jimmie, you got it WRONG again.

All you do is engage in some odd word play to try
and "justify" your rationalizations of your fantasy
ideas about a hobby. That is NOT "correcting
mistakes."

See above about the word "expire" as used by FCC in Part 97.
You made a mistake, Len. I pointed it out.

Facts are NOT Lennie's forte.

Jimmie, I've been an UNLICENSED radio-electronics
hobbyist longer than you've been alive...and that IS
the truth...in REALITY.

So what? All that means is that you are old and that you
have fooled with some electronic stuff. Lots of people
can say the same thing.

And obviously not very proud of what he's allegedly done...No
details..no pics....Nothing...

I was OPERATING on HF BEFORE you were born, Jimmie,
IN the military...the military you've NEVER been in.
That is reality...whether or not you care to accept it.

So what? All that means is that you are old and that you
once served in the Army, where you were trained to do certain
transmitter adjustments, as part of a large team of specialists. Lots
of people can say the same thing.

He was a radio mechanic. Nothing more...nothing less.

Quit acting like a spoiled child who demands obediance
to you and your ideas.

"Don't even ATTEMPT to CONTROL what I am "allowed" to
do in the FUTURE...because you CANNOT and you do NOT
know the future." - Len Anderson

That was the pot calling the kettle black!

Apply your own rules for others to your own behavior, Len.

Yeah...riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight...Wanna see the pics from my weekend
soire with Britney Spears too...?!?!

You aren't being CONSISTENT. Try to get it straight.
Is it what *I* "might" do or is it about "what I will
'never' do?"

You claimed you were going for Extra "right out of the box". January
19, 2000, more than 5-1/4 years ago. But you haven't even got a
Technician license yet.

Exactly what HAS Lennie done with ANY "radio hobby" activity since
he joined this forum? Other than "DX" the ATIS at LAX with a scanner,
that is...?!?!

You are (seemingly) bringing up an OLD piece of a
posting to IMPLY that I "must" do it...EXACTLY as
I wrote it. :-)

Not at all, Len. I'm simply pointing out what you said you would
do, but haven't done yet. And that it appears you'll never do it.

Why WOULDN'T we expect you to do what you said you'd do, Lennie?

Is your written word not of any value?

YOU don't seem to like that TRUTH. You want to call
such facts "wrong" because they are against your
BELIEFS. You want to "strike back" at those that
present the TRUTH because such TRUTHs are uncomfortable
to your fantasy.

Not me.

You're simply saying that your *opinions* about ARRL are "THE TRUTH".
That's just bull#### on your part. No other word to describe it.

I'm still waiting to see if Lennie ever ponies up any proof for his
assertion that the "ARRL is dishonest".

73

Steve, K4YZ

wrote:
wrote:

Just answer the question, please.

No. :-)

Then why should I answer any of yours?

There is no reason so don't.

"Don't Feed the Animaks"

That's simply not true, Len.

You're just making up bull****. Typical jackass behavior for
you.

Tsk, tsk, very Very VERY WRONG, Jimmie Noserve.

No Len. Would you prefer if I called you a diminutive nickname?

Probably.

"Jackass" doesn't really do him justice James. Jackasses are gentle
little guys, he's more like a big horse's ass.

w3rv

K4YZ wrote:
wrote:
wrote:

Jimmie, get your definitions correct. Those amateur
licensees who are IN the 2-year grace period for
renewal are NOT "expired."

The licensees may or may not have expired. Their
licenses *have* expired.

The FCC doesn't call them that.

Yes, they do.

Quoting FCC rules, 97.21 iii:

"b) A person whose amateur station license grant has expired may
apply
to the FCC for renewal of the license grant for another term during
a
2
year filing grace period. The application must be received at the
address specified above prior to the end of the grace period.
Unless
and until the license grant is renewed, no privileges in this Part
are
conferred."

The licensee may not have expired but the license sure has.

I suggest you actually read Part 97, Len.

Now THAT would be refreshing...

Don't hold your breath....

Of course you've cited that exact same paragraph to Lennie on
several occassions before when he's made the same error, yet he
continues to make THE SAME ERROR.

Not really. You are mistaken, Steve.

Back around the end of last year, Len posted here that *all* licensees
were perfectly legal to operate in the grace period. That's simply not
true.

The way it works is that if someone files for renewal in a timely
fashion (meaning during the 90 day window at the end of a license
term), FCC allows them to keep their license privileges (and keep
operating legally) while the renewal action is pending. But if the end
of the 10 year license passes - even by one day! - the licensee is
*not* allowed to operate until the renewal is actually processed by
FCC.

So there are some licensees who can "legally operate in the grace
period" - those who filed their renewals in a timely fashion. The rest
cannot. Len wrote that all licensees could legally operate in the grace
period - that's simply wrong.

His mistake this time is different - he claims FCC doesn't use the term
"expired" to mean licenses whose 10 year term is past but which have
not
been renewed. That's wrong too - the term "expired" is used by FCC for
just that purpose.

Len made two different mistakes on the same section of Part 97, Steve,
not one.

Just answer the question, please.

No.

Then why should I answer any of yours?

Indeed.

Lennie's been asked MANY questions by many persons on numerous
subjects...The only answer (paraphrased) "I don't have to answer the
questions of mighty morsemen".

Brian Burke does the same thing. So I ignore him.

But he has point-blank DEMANDED answers from us...Hence my
refusal
to further address my Armed Forces service outside the realm of
radio...I love seeing him twist in his seat...Burns him up to know he
doesn't have control.

Try to use CIVIL language in here...

I have - for years. It doesn't work with you, Len. You exhibit
jack### behavior in accordance with a predictable profile
regardless - if a person disagrees with your opinions and/or
points out errors in your postings here.

Lennie's nickname should be "Diode"...things are only one way
with
him...

Hmmm...

But I do point out
the holes in your arguments, and your factual/logical mistakes,
which seems to enrage you no end..

No, No, NO, Jimmie, you got it WRONG again.

All you do is engage in some odd word play to try
and "justify" your rationalizations of your fantasy
ideas about a hobby. That is NOT "correcting
mistakes."

See above about the word "expire" as used by FCC in Part 97.
You made a mistake, Len. I pointed it out.

Facts are NOT Lennie's forte.

Jimmie, I've been an UNLICENSED radio-electronics
hobbyist longer than you've been alive...and that IS
the truth...in REALITY.

So what? All that means is that you are old and that you
have fooled with some electronic stuff. Lots of people
can say the same thing.

And obviously not very proud of what he's allegedly done...No
details..no pics....Nothing...

No website. AOL allows a website for each screen name - Len could have
seven websites, showing us what he's done "in radio". He has none.

I was OPERATING on HF BEFORE you were born, Jimmie,
IN the military...the military you've NEVER been in.
That is reality...whether or not you care to accept it.

So what? All that means is that you are old and that you
once served in the Army, where you were trained to do certain
transmitter adjustments, as part of a large team of specialists.
Lots
of people can say the same thing.

He was a radio mechanic. Nothing more...nothing less.

Not a bad thing.

Quit acting like a spoiled child who demands obediance
to you and your ideas.

"Don't even ATTEMPT to CONTROL what I am "allowed" to
do in the FUTURE...because you CANNOT and you do NOT
know the future." - Len Anderson

That was the pot calling the kettle black!

Apply your own rules for others to your own behavior, Len.

Yeah...riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight...Wanna see the pics from my
weekend
soire with Britney Spears too...?!?!

AAAAHHHHHH!!!! MY EYES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

You aren't being CONSISTENT. Try to get it straight.
Is it what *I* "might" do or is it about "what I will
'never' do?"

You claimed you were going for Extra "right out of the box".
January
19, 2000, more than 5-1/4 years ago. But you haven't even got a
Technician license yet.

Exactly what HAS Lennie done with ANY "radio hobby" activity
since
he joined this forum? Other than "DX" the ATIS at LAX with a
scanner,
that is...?!?!

You are (seemingly) bringing up an OLD piece of a
posting to IMPLY that I "must" do it...EXACTLY as
I wrote it. :-)

Not at all, Len. I'm simply pointing out what you said you would
do, but haven't done yet. And that it appears you'll never do it.

Why WOULDN'T we expect you to do what you said you'd do, Lennie?

Is your written word not of any value?

Bingo!

YOU don't seem to like that TRUTH. You want to call
such facts "wrong" because they are against your
BELIEFS. You want to "strike back" at those that
present the TRUTH because such TRUTHs are uncomfortable
to your fantasy.

Not me.

You're simply saying that your *opinions* about ARRL are "THE
TRUTH".
That's just bull#### on your part. No other word to describe it.

I'm still waiting to see if Lennie ever ponies up any proof for
his
assertion that the "ARRL is dishonest".

The claim was that there was no way the children pictured could have
obtained their licenses honestly.

73 de Jim, N2EY

wrote:
K4YZ wrote:

Of course you've cited that exact same paragraph to Lennie on
several occassions before when he's made the same error, yet he
continues to make THE SAME ERROR.

Not really. You are mistaken, Steve.

You're right, of course...However Lennie DOES still refuse to
acknowledge the error and correct himself.

Still wrong.

Lennie's been asked MANY questions by many persons on numerous
subjects...The only answer (paraphrased) "I don't have to answer
the
questions of mighty morsemen".

Brian Burke does the same thing. So I ignore him.

I guess I am getting there. After our last "rounds" it appeared
that Brian might actually be open to communication, however he started
right back into the same rants, the same lies, and the same refusal to
substantiate his own claims.

Pity that. Pity what his kids will see someday.

And obviously not very proud of what he's allegedly done...No
details..no pics....Nothing...

No website. AOL allows a website for each screen name - Len could
have
seven websites, showing us what he's done "in radio". He has none.

Seven more opportunities to REALLY participate in the radio hobby
squandered. I am not surprised, though.

He was a radio mechanic. Nothing more...nothing less.

Not a bad thing.

No...not a bad thing...but not what he has been representing his
service as...

Quit acting like a spoiled child who demands obediance
to you and your ideas.

"Don't even ATTEMPT to CONTROL what I am "allowed" to
do in the FUTURE...because you CANNOT and you do NOT
know the future." - Len Anderson

That was the pot calling the kettle black!

Apply your own rules for others to your own behavior, Len.

Yeah...riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight...Wanna see the pics from my
weekend
soire with Britney Spears too...?!?!

AAAAHHHHHH!!!! MY EYES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Exactly.

I'm still waiting to see if Lennie ever ponies up any proof for
his
assertion that the "ARRL is dishonest".

The claim was that there was no way the children pictured could have
obtained their licenses honestly.

I'm not going to dig it out, Jim, but Lennie DID use the exact
words "...the ARRL BoD is dishonest..." on several occassions. I
quoted and requoted his comments on numerous occassions asking him to
validate that claim...Needless to say, he never did.

73...An A B S O L U T E L Y gorgeous day here in SE
Tennessee...Sorry I ahve to work this afternoon!

Steve, K4YZ