RadioBanter - Morse code contest on Jay Leno

From: "Bill Sohl" on Fri,May 20 2005 1:15 pm

wrote in message
oups.com...

Len,
I don't consider myself an "amateur morseman" but I
could see that morse would win out over current text
messaging via cellphone.

Agreed, Bill. :-) That bit of entertainment, and of
twitting the TXT-ers on their cell phones, was never
any "contest." :-)

Now if the input device for
text messaging had been a full keyboard, then I'd expect
the text messaging to win out as I belive records for
typing/keyboarding (100+ WPM I think) do exceed
the morse record (70+ per someone else's post).

Agreed again, but - again - that bit on the "Tonight
Show" was never any "contest" to "prove" anything.

A few things are evident in this newsgroup. Firstly,
there are the cast-in-concrete conservatives who have
been brainwashed into believing that the ULTIMATE
skill in amateur radio is morsemanship. Secondly,
there is that handful of irregular regulars in here
trying to "win out" over anyone expressing any
opinion other than theirs...those stop at nothing to
attempt damaging their "opponents" credibility
through the usual attempted intimidation and personal
insults.

It matters not - in this newsgroup environment - that
the rest of the radio world has "put morse to the test"
and found it wanting in favor of better communications
modes. The only practitioners of morsemanship still
active and USING it are in amateur radio in the USA.
All the other radio services in the USA have given up
on using any form of morse code for communications.
[automated station IDs in morse tones is not
communications]

Indeed, all the amateur morsemen in here do the cheering
and "morse-patriotism" thing because they, too, have been
brainwashed into thinking that morsemanship is "real
operating" in radio.

Sorry Len, I can't agree with your statements here.
Like it or not, morse operating IS real operating radio...
just as driving my antique cars is real automobile driving.

Bill, in all honesty, I was talking about the PCTA Extra
Double Standard brainwashed diehards in here...NOT
yourself...OR driving antique cars.

Witness the constant statements of that "expert military
communicator" who keeps insisting I was "only a radio
mechanic" or the critic who never served but "had dinner
with the Captain (of an aircraft carrier)." :-)

Morsemanship IS PART of radio operating...but ONLY of a
radio that actually DOES USE on-off keying of the RF
carrier with morse code. Morsemanship is NOT REQUIRED
by anyone operating an aircraft radio - either civilian
or military. Morsemanship is NOT REQUIRED of anyone
operating a broadcast services transmitter. Morsemanship
is NOT REQUIRED for anyone sending a GMDSS distress or
safety message. Morsemanship is NOT REQUIRED of any of
the radios (in the millions) used in Public Safety or
Private Land Mobile Radio Service. Not in the FCC
regulations for those radio services...and others.

Is morse commonplace outside of ham radio? No
it isn't, but that does not make the use of morse by
hams any less "operating radio" then any other mode.

Given that you (Len) believe morse is NOT operating
radio, would it be your desire to see morse banned
as a mode of use by amateurs?

Bill, that's NOT a "given." IF and only IF morse
code skills ARE REQUIRED in radio operation, then
morsemanship IS a PART of radio operation.

Do not try to put words in there that I am "banning
morse code operation" in amateur radio. I am NOT.

Others - in here - have already tried that. They
have failed...but they keep persisting in their
misguided attempts to suppress the real subjects by
their personal attacks and misstatements against others.

You haven't posed a viable question.

They (amateur morsemen) will leap and embrace the
slightest thing that makes morse "better" than any other
mode. :-)

I don't see anything in the morse win over text
messaging that suggests that. The morse win over
text messaging was a specific comparison only.

Call it a "loaded test" akin to a "loaded question."
A SETUP.

Cellular telephony does not, nor was it ever designed, to
send textual communications. Cellular telephony was
designed and implemented to communicate by VOICE.

The win did not prove nor did I see any amateur
in this newsgroup suggest that the win showed
that morse was "better than any other mode."

Bill, I will have to put you down as a LITERALIST then.
A "literalist" is one who takes all written text as it
is, unable to read in anything "between the lines" and
acting like some "language purist."

I'm sorry you've turned into that.

Yes, I've been around
this newsgroup long enough to know that there is
a handful (or at least was at one time) of hams that
might have held such "morse is better than any other
mode" perspective, but I think the issue has
ckarified significantly in recent years to the point that
the issue is the TEST and only the test for most
hams.

This newsgrope group is NOT "most hams." :-)

It is a handful of PCTA Extra Double Standard bearers
on some personal "mission" to "win supremacy" in a
newsgroup. They will readily fall-to anyone speaking
against the league-speak and attack them like starving
vultures after ripe carrion. :-)

As such, I applaud the morse win over Text
messaging because it was a good opportunity to
get some publicity for ham radio.

"Publicity," yes. But at what price? By putting other
means of communications DOWN in a rigged test?

If that's the only means of "getting publicity" nationally,
then it is of rather low taste.

WHERE has any ardent radio amateur run with this "victory
for morse code?" The only talk seems to be WITHIN amateur
radio circles. Does the general public give a damn one
way or another? The general public has seen morse code "in
action" in many western movies and TV shows, set in periods
well before anyone's time. The general public is bound to
have seen "TXT-ing" by teeners and others in the present
time, eye-witnessing it in person. Right now TXT-ing is
part of at least three commercial ads on TV...that I've
seen today. Haven't seen a thing on amateur radio lately
(discounting that non-contest "contest" on "Tonight").

Bill, it's NOT my job to promote amateur radio. I don't
have an amateur radio license nor any vested interest in
amateur radio. My purpose in here has been to argue
against the morse code TEST for any amateur radio license.
My "opponents" in here have generally been an insulting
little group of hypocritical moralsts "representing" the
"highest class" of USA radio amateurs. As EXAMPLES, they've
been far from good for the "amateur community."

Will text messaging
always be second (speed wise) to morse...who knows,
but without a full keyboard for entry, I suspect it
will be...but maybe someday there will be telepathic
input of text at which point all bets are off :-) :-)

Why do you bring up "telepathy" as a communications mode?
You have to understand that the PCTA Extra Double Standard
bearers ALREADY KBNOW that all amateurs "must" test for
morse code. They don't NEED "telepathy" when they have
proven morsemanship skills. ["CW gets through when nothing
else will"...probably including telepathy and electric power]

The discussions should be about the TEST for morsemanship.
It isn't. The contents of these newsgroper's messages is a
comical set of middle-school juvenile posturing and
adolescent cuss words...especially those of other languages
and dialects not native to those middle-aged adolescents.

So, 91 years after the ARRL was formed, the best national-
exposure "publicity for amateur radio" is a rigged late-night
TV show segment ridiculing cell phone TXT-ing?

According to the U.S. Census Bureau figures for 2004, there
are 100 million cell phone subscriptions in the USA. How
many morse code operators are there in radio in the USA?

wrote in message
ups.com...
From: "Bill Sohl" on Fri,May 20 2005 1:15 pm

wrote in message
roups.com...

Len,
I don't consider myself an "amateur morseman" but I
could see that morse would win out over current text
messaging via cellphone.

Agreed, Bill. :-) That bit of entertainment, and of
twitting the TXT-ers on their cell phones, was never
any "contest." :-)

Now if the input device for
text messaging had been a full keyboard, then I'd expect
the text messaging to win out as I belive records for
typing/keyboarding (100+ WPM I think) do exceed
the morse record (70+ per someone else's post).

Agreed again, but - again - that bit on the "Tonight
Show" was never any "contest" to "prove" anything.

A few things are evident in this newsgroup. Firstly,
there are the cast-in-concrete conservatives who have
been brainwashed into believing that the ULTIMATE
skill in amateur radio is morsemanship. Secondly,
there is that handful of irregular regulars in here
trying to "win out" over anyone expressing any
opinion other than theirs...those stop at nothing to
attempt damaging their "opponents" credibility
through the usual attempted intimidation and personal
insults.

Personally, if someone wants to believe that morse
is THE ULTIMATE skill in amateur radio, that's
their right and opinion. Clearly neither you nor I
agree with that.

It matters not - in this newsgroup environment - that
the rest of the radio world has "put morse to the test"
and found it wanting in favor of better communications
modes. The only practitioners of morsemanship still
active and USING it are in amateur radio in the USA.
All the other radio services in the USA have given up
on using any form of morse code for communications.
[automated station IDs in morse tones is not
communications]

Actually there are others in amateur radio "outside"
the USA that also embrace morse as a favored mode.

Indeed, all the amateur morsemen in here do the cheering
and "morse-patriotism" thing because they, too, have been
brainwashed into thinking that morsemanship is "real
operating" in radio.

Sorry Len, I can't agree with your statements here.
Like it or not, morse operating IS real operating radio...
just as driving my antique cars is real automobile driving.

Bill, in all honesty, I was talking about the PCTA Extra
Double Standard brainwashed diehards in here...NOT
yourself...OR driving antique cars.

OK, but that's not how it read.

Witness the constant statements of that "expert military
communicator" who keeps insisting I was "only a radio
mechanic" or the critic who never served but "had dinner
with the Captain (of an aircraft carrier)." :-)

I try to avoid all personal attack commentary.

Morsemanship IS PART of radio operating...but ONLY of a
radio that actually DOES USE on-off keying of the RF
carrier with morse code.

Which covers a considerable amount of radios. Additionally,
it is not simply CW (on-off keying of carrier) that allows
use of morse. I can send morse as an on/off tone via any
FM capable transmitter.

Morsemanship is NOT REQUIRED
by anyone operating an aircraft radio - either civilian
or military. Morsemanship is NOT REQUIRED of anyone
operating a broadcast services transmitter. Morsemanship
is NOT REQUIRED for anyone sending a GMDSS distress or
safety message. Morsemanship is NOT REQUIRED of any of
the radios (in the millions) used in Public Safety or
Private Land Mobile Radio Service. Not in the FCC
regulations for those radio services...and others.

Agreed and nothing I said contradicts that.

Is morse commonplace outside of ham radio? No
it isn't, but that does not make the use of morse by
hams any less "operating radio" then any other mode.

Given that you (Len) believe morse is NOT operating
radio, would it be your desire to see morse banned
as a mode of use by amateurs?

Bill, that's NOT a "given." IF and only IF morse
code skills ARE REQUIRED in radio operation, then
morsemanship IS a PART of radio operation.

Well at this point, morse as a requirement is only
required for General and Extra class licenses...which
is a requirement I am totally on record as opposing.

Do not try to put words in there that I am "banning
morse code operation" in amateur radio. I am NOT.

Good...thanks for the clarification.

Others - in here - have already tried that. They
have failed...but they keep persisting in their
misguided attempts to suppress the real subjects by
their personal attacks and misstatements against others.

You haven't posed a viable question.

The question was posed to see what role, if any,
you accept as valid via amateur radio.

They (amateur morsemen) will leap and embrace the
slightest thing that makes morse "better" than any other
mode. :-)

I don't see anything in the morse win over text
messaging that suggests that. The morse win over
text messaging was a specific comparison only.

Call it a "loaded test" akin to a "loaded question."
A SETUP.

Call it whatever. It makes no difference as I see it.

Cellular telephony does not, nor was it ever designed, to
send textual communications. Cellular telephony was
designed and implemented to communicate by VOICE.

Agree totally...which is why I would expect morse
to win as it did.

The win did not prove nor did I see any amateur
in this newsgroup suggest that the win showed
that morse was "better than any other mode."

Bill, I will have to put you down as a LITERALIST then.
A "literalist" is one who takes all written text as it
is, unable to read in anything "between the lines" and
acting like some "language purist."
I'm sorry you've turned into that.

I will wear the badge of "literalist" with pride. Frankly
there's too much reading between the lines anyway.
If people can't be straight-up, then I'm not here to
second guess their true intentions.

Yes, I've been around
this newsgroup long enough to know that there is
a handful (or at least was at one time) of hams that
might have held such "morse is better than any other
mode" perspective, but I think the issue has
ckarified significantly in recent years to the point that
the issue is the TEST and only the test for most
hams.

This newsgrope group is NOT "most hams." :-)

I didn't say it was.

It is a handful of PCTA Extra Double Standard bearers
on some personal "mission" to "win supremacy" in a
newsgroup. They will readily fall-to anyone speaking
against the league-speak and attack them like starving
vultures after ripe carrion. :-)

The newsgroup has "some" folks that might fit your
description...but they are fewer today than before and
they are not sole participants in the newsgroup as
others (you, me, etc) clearly have differing viewpoints.

As such, I applaud the morse win over Text
messaging because it was a good opportunity to
get some publicity for ham radio.

"Publicity," yes. But at what price? By putting other
means of communications DOWN in a rigged test?

Should we have a pity party for the poor text messaging
record holder. If the text message folks feared a put
down then they had the option to not play. They decided to
play and they lost....fair, square, contrived or how ever
you feel it was inevitable that text messaging would lose.

If that's the only means of "getting publicity" nationally,
then it is of rather low taste.

Why is it of low taste? Did the losers get razzed by the morse
winners?

WHERE has any ardent radio amateur run with this "victory
for morse code?" The only talk seems to be WITHIN amateur
radio circles. Does the general public give a damn one
way or another? The general public has seen morse code "in
action" in many western movies and TV shows, set in periods
well before anyone's time.

When was the last time you saw morse used on any TV
show...especially as a mode used by hams? I watch a fair
amount of TV and can't recall it. But the issue of publicity is
simple. The airing of the morse vs text messaging contest
was a brief opportunity to expose amateur radio to
the public. I have no doubt that there would not be a sudden
wave of new interest because of that airing, but perhaps
it stirred some interest in a few...which is fine by me.

The general public is bound to
have seen "TXT-ing" by teeners and others in the present
time, eye-witnessing it in person. Right now TXT-ing is
part of at least three commercial ads on TV...that I've
seen today. Haven't seen a thing on amateur radio lately
(discounting that non-contest "contest" on "Tonight").

Agreed which is why the contest at least was a positive
exposure for ham radio...whether one like or dislikes
morse code.

Bill, it's NOT my job to promote amateur radio. I don't
have an amateur radio license nor any vested interest in
amateur radio. My purpose in here has been to argue
against the morse code TEST for any amateur radio license.

Then argue against the test. Your post appeared to be
far more focused against morse use in general rather
than specifically the test requirement.

My "opponents" in here have generally been an insulting
little group of hypocritical moralsts "representing" the
"highest class" of USA radio amateurs. As EXAMPLES, they've
been far from good for the "amateur community."

As before, I try to stay out of the personal attack
commentary that I've seen some of these discussions
reduced to.

Will text messaging
always be second (speed wise) to morse...who knows,
but without a full keyboard for entry, I suspect it
will be...but maybe someday there will be telepathic
input of text at which point all bets are off :-) :-)

Why do you bring up "telepathy" as a communications mode?

Please note the two smilies at the end of the statement.

You have to understand that the PCTA Extra Double Standard
bearers ALREADY KBNOW that all amateurs "must" test for
morse code.

But we already know that morse is NOT a requirement for
every ham license and in more and more countries it is
being dropped completely. The USA will surely follow...it
is just a matter of time. It's not happening here fast enough
(IMHO), but it will.

They don't NEED "telepathy" when they have
proven morsemanship skills. ["CW gets through when nothing
else will"...probably including telepathy and electric power]

And we already know the FCC doesn't accept that argument.

The discussions should be about the TEST for morsemanship.
It isn't. The contents of these newsgroper's messages is a
comical set of middle-school juvenile posturing and
adolescent cuss words...especially those of other languages
and dialects not native to those middle-aged adolescents.

This discussion started when the contest was reported.
No one that I recall claimed it proved or otherwise
served to support justification of continued morse testing.
From my reading it was simply a bit of positive publicity
on a national TV show.

So, 91 years after the ARRL was formed, the best national-
exposure "publicity for amateur radio" is a rigged late-night
TV show segment ridiculing cell phone TXT-ing?

Who said it was "the best" publicity? It was a brief one-shot
opportunity. That's it.

According to the U.S. Census Bureau figures for 2004, there
are 100 million cell phone subscriptions in the USA. How
many morse code operators are there in radio in the USA?

Your point?

Cheers,
Bill K2UNK