When that is done we can remove all references to training and
technical/operational competency from the Basis and Purpose of Part 97.

"Technical" is still covered in the written tests. Aside from
no more CW test, "operational" still has a few questions in the
writtens. Oh, people newly licensed will make newbie errors,
but most people are smart enough to soon spot and correct
such errors.


Remember that 14.313 was that way back in the days of 13wpm
generals... And that HF didn't go down the toilet after
Restructuring 2000 happened.

Remember that 14.313 was that way back in the days of 13wpm
generals... And that HF didn't go down the toilet after
Restructuring 2000 happened.

Yep Bob it is not the end of western civilization as we know it ...that will
come when we will get a work any where with an any mode structure. I really
can't see the need for this to happen but it will. At present there are
loads of bandwidth out there that are not being utilized. Anyone who has
been on the air over the last 20 years can see the decline in usage of CW
and I may also add phone. This is just the way it is ...all one has to do
is to look with in 3 feet of them and they will find the answer. The
computer has been an adjunct to ham radio and a very interesting one at that
but it also has swept ops off of the bands. We will survive in one form or
another ...progress is progress or so it seems. I am sure that there will be
someone 2-300 yrs from now on CW ....it is just to eloquent to simply dry
up and blow away. Back to 40 CW and my state of the art EICO 723.

Take care everyone ..... KI3R Tom Popovic Belle Vernon Pa.

"K4YZ" wrote in message
ups.com...


wrote:
wrote:

I agree with Dee, the only visible impact this
latest "restructing"
will be is another quickie bubble of upgrades and nothing more then
back then the bands as usual.

Yup. Then the "barrier" folks will find another excuse.

Yep.

Just like with Novice Enhancement, the introduction of the NCT and
Restructuring...

I find it laughable that the FCC would use the same worn out and
obviously untrue language that "this" change will bring all those
technically-oriented people into the Amateur fold. They said the exact
same thing with the last three aforementioned evolutions and it wasn't
true then.

Indeed we dropped the Code Test in 91 for 97% of all Amateur
allocations, including the highly sought after VHF/UHF spectrum. The
REAL argument has been over that last 3%, or the HF allocations. So
where were all those engineering-types then?

People like "You-Know-Who" have been arguing that his ilk don't
get licenses due to not being able to get on HF...Yet they ALSO argue
that the license is most valuable for experimenting. Well...All of the
REAL "experimenting" is going on ABOVE 30MHz, not below it, so the
argument is moot. They, like everyone else, want to get on HF and
"shoot skip", nothing more.

I'm betting that it remains CW for Extra, and no code for
Generals, unless the FCC want's to disband the phone-vs-narrow band
subdivisions. I think there will be sufficient argument to keep that
much.

The next two arguments are going to be to squeeze all of the
non-voice modes into 50 or 75KHz of spectrum on each band since all of
those new codeless Generals will want to spead out, and to have only
one or two license classes.

When that is done we can remove all references to training and
technical/operational competency from the Basis and Purpose of Part 97.
Shortly thereafter we can move all of Part 97 to Part 95. Maybe
re-write both parts into one, new, Part 96?

Perhaps we can also add new bands at 061, 08, 04, 03 etc Meters so
those claiming unfairness in testing criteria due to "dyslexia" can
operate legally...?!?!

73

Steve, K4YZ

May not be all that far removed from reality there Steve.

Dan/W4NTI

wrote in message
ups.com...
wrote:
wrote:
http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_publi...C-05-143A1.doc

Ugly. Really ugly. But who of us in the PCTA camp,
realistically,
actually had themselves deluded into thinking the FCC would
take any other path?

As I often said in the past 5 years, when FCC wrote that
code testing served no regulatory purpose other than
treaty compliance, the deal was essentially done.

The amazing thing was that it's taken two years to get
this far.

That's because the people wanting to eliminate the code "shot themselves in
the foot" with a plethora of wide ranging petitions.


This "NPRM" is not "an opportunity to comment", it's an
announcement
about the way it's absolutely gonna be. Period. They'll go
thru the
NPRM motions only because the law sez they have to and they'll
patiently tap their fingers on the table until the deluge of
desparate
commnents is over then declare the POS they published today a
done deal.

I'll comment, like always.

I agree with Dee, the only visible impact this
latest "restructing"
will be is another quickie bubble of upgrades and nothing more then
back then the bands as usual.

Yup. Then the "barrier" folks will find another excuse.

Got my antenna back up last night (had to take it down Sunday for
the new siding to go on the house). 40 was full of CW signals.
Nice chat with a VE2 on 7031. Life is good.

Yup it is. And I will continue as always to try to introduce amateur radio
to new people.


I could care less about any of it at this late date because
none of it
has any effect at all on me. I've been allowed to beep, yak and PSK my
buns off everywhere band edge to band edge ever since I did 13 wpm fast
enough for the examiner to make me a General over a half
century ago.
With an annoying side trip in 1968 to do 20 wpm to reconfirm my abilty
to beep good enough to retain my privs under that particular FCC
"restructuring" brainfart.

Exactly.

Game over, I'm opting out of any further participation in any
of this
BS. Seeya in the pileups on 14.020. Ya dunno how to do 14.020? Good:
Less QRM for me. Eat yer heart out.

bwaahaahaa

73 de Jim, N2EY

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE

From: Dee Flint on Jul 21, 6:01 pm


wrote in message
wrote:
wrote:
http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_publi...C-05-143A1.doc

Ugly. Really ugly. But who of us in the PCTA camp,
realistically,
actually had themselves deluded into thinking the FCC would
take any other path?

As I often said in the past 5 years, when FCC wrote that
code testing served no regulatory purpose other than
treaty compliance, the deal was essentially done.

Errr....the FCC "said that" (wrote it, actually) in 1990
in regards to 90-53 on the creation of the no-code-test
Technician class. So, what did you do between 15 and 5
years ago? :-)

The amazing thing was that it's taken two years to get
this far.

That's because the people wanting to eliminate the code "shot themselves in
the foot" with a plethora of wide ranging petitions.

Tsk. Dee, you should really READ the NPRM more carefully,
especially pages 6 through 9 and the footnotes on page 2. Then
go to pages 26 through 28 to see which Petition was DENIED and
which was granted in part.

I've read all 18 Petitions as they were put on the ECFS...and
Commented on all 18. Did YOU Comment on any of those
Petitions or were you too busy doing DX in the morning before
work?

Hello? There was a WIDE RANGE of "restructuring" in those 18
Petitions. Had you actually studied them you would have seen
that the more Byzantine plans were done by the PCTAs. shrug


This "NPRM" is not "an opportunity to comment", it's an announcement
about the way it's absolutely gonna be. Period. They'll go thru the
NPRM motions only because the law sez they have to and they'll
patiently tap their fingers on the table until the deluge of desparate
commnents is over then declare the POS they published today a done deal.

Was that "disparate" or "desperate?" :-)

I'll comment, like always.

Tsk. You will comment on anything, especially about subjects not
germane to this newsgroup! :-)

I agree with Dee, the only visible impact this latest "restructing"
will be is another quickie bubble of upgrades and nothing more then
back then the bands as usual.

Yup. Then the "barrier" folks will find another excuse.

Tsk. The "barrier" has been up for over 92 years. The "olde
folkes' home" (in radio) has been established, located on the
HF ham bands. Remarkable "new technology" on those HF ham
bands? Only that devised by those in the UK and Europe...and
the designer-manufacturers in Asia.

Got my antenna back up last night (had to take it down Sunday for
the new siding to go on the house). 40 was full of CW signals.
Nice chat with a VE2 on 7031. Life is good.

Yup it is. And I will continue as always to try to introduce amateur radio
to new people.

Keep on plugging that vital to the nation's needs, morse code,
the one that "saves lives" etc., and supposedly "gets through
when nothing else will." Is it "pioneering the (radio) airwaves
through HF QSOs?" :-)

I'll continue boosting ALL of ELECTRONICS...of which radio is
a subset. It's a good occupation, interesting, challenging,
constantly evolving, breaking new ground, on the cutting edges
of electronics technology. Pays reasonably well, too. I've
been in it for 53 years as a professional, as a hobbyist for
about 58 years.

Life IS good. The NPRM has finally arrived!

The light at the end of the tunnel is not another train, just
a representative of the rest of the radio world with
Diogenes' borrowed lantern wondering where in the hell amateur
radio has been... :-)

As I often said in the past 5 years, when FCC wrote that
code testing served no regulatory purpose other than
treaty compliance, the deal was essentially done.

The amazing thing was that it's taken two years to get
this far.

More likely it took that long because the FCC had more
important stuff to deal with.


They didn't ban Morse Code. They just dropped the
license test for it. CW will survive anyway.

We ought to start CW training nets to get hams to
get into CW. Use the old novice subbands for it.
Sure, you'll hear lots of bad sending at first, but
people will improve over time.

robert:

Yes, in fact you should get ready for the flood of anxious cw'ers...

I'd go there now and wait if I were you, and wait, and wait, and
wait... grin

.... don't kid yourself.

John

"robert casey" wrote in message
nk.net...



As I often said in the past 5 years, when FCC wrote that
code testing served no regulatory purpose other than
treaty compliance, the deal was essentially done.

The amazing thing was that it's taken two years to get
this far.

More likely it took that long because the FCC had more
important stuff to deal with.


They didn't ban Morse Code. They just dropped the
license test for it. CW will survive anyway.

We ought to start CW training nets to get hams to
get into CW. Use the old novice subbands for it.
Sure, you'll hear lots of bad sending at first, but
people will improve over time.

John Smith wrote:
robert:

Yes, in fact you should get ready for the flood of anxious cw'ers...

I'd go there now and wait if I were you, and wait, and wait, and
wait... grin

... don't kid yourself.


Well, it was a fantasy of sorts. Probably not gonna
happen....

Try 30 meters, good CW band.

Dan/W4NTI

wrote in message
ups.com...
wrote:
wrote:
http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_publi...C-05-143A1.doc

Ugly. Really ugly. But who of us in the PCTA camp,
realistically,
actually had themselves deluded into thinking the FCC would
take any other path?

As I often said in the past 5 years, when FCC wrote that
code testing served no regulatory purpose other than
treaty compliance, the deal was essentially done.

The amazing thing was that it's taken two years to get
this far.

This "NPRM" is not "an opportunity to comment", it's an
announcement
about the way it's absolutely gonna be. Period. They'll go
thru the
NPRM motions only because the law sez they have to and they'll
patiently tap their fingers on the table until the deluge of
desparate
commnents is over then declare the POS they published today a
done deal.

I'll comment, like always.

I agree with Dee, the only visible impact this
latest "restructing"
will be is another quickie bubble of upgrades and nothing more then
back then the bands as usual.

Yup. Then the "barrier" folks will find another excuse.

Got my antenna back up last night (had to take it down Sunday for
the new siding to go on the house). 40 was full of CW signals.
Nice chat with a VE2 on 7031. Life is good.

I could care less about any of it at this late date because
none of it
has any effect at all on me. I've been allowed to beep, yak and PSK my
buns off everywhere band edge to band edge ever since I did 13 wpm fast
enough for the examiner to make me a General over a half
century ago.
With an annoying side trip in 1968 to do 20 wpm to reconfirm my abilty
to beep good enough to retain my privs under that particular FCC
"restructuring" brainfart.

Exactly.

Game over, I'm opting out of any further participation in any
of this
BS. Seeya in the pileups on 14.020. Ya dunno how to do 14.020? Good:
Less QRM for me. Eat yer heart out.

bwaahaahaa

73 de Jim, N2EY

wrote in message
oups.com...

wrote:
http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_publi...C-05-143A1.doc

Ugly. Really ugly. But who of us in the PCTA camp, realistically,
actually had themselves deluded into thinking the FCC would take any
other path?

This "NPRM" is not "an opportunity to comment", it's an announcement
about the way it's absolutely gonna be. Period. They'll go thru the
NPRM motions only because the law sez they have to and they'll
patiently tap their fingers on the table until the deluge of desparate
commnents is over then declare the POS they published today a done
deal.

I agree with Dee, the only visible impact this latest "restructing"
will be is another quickie bubble of upgrades and nothing more then
back then the bands as usual.

I could care less about any of it at this late date because none of it
has any effect at all on me. I've been allowed to beep, yak and PSK my
buns off everywhere band edge to band edge ever since I did 13 wpm fast
enough for the examiner to make me a General over a half century ago.
With an annoying side trip in 1968 to do 20 wpm to reconfirm my abilty
to beep good enough to retain my privs under that particular FCC
"restructuring" brainfart.

Game over, I'm opting out of any further participation in any of this
BS. Seeya in the pileups on 14.020. Ya dunno how to do 14.020? Good:
Less QRM for me. Eat yer heart out.


73 de Jim, N2EY

w3rv


Rest assured the FCC is going to do whatever is easiest for THEM.

There may be a upward surge of new "Ultra Lite Extra's" (Did I really say
that???).....and in a short time the bands will still sound deserted.

There is a lot more at work here then just dropping CW.

Check out the bands lately? Where are all those new "light" hams anyway?
Danged if I can find them.

All you that gloat over losing one of the glues that hold/held ham radio
together will rue this day. And no I'm not a stuck in the mud, cw only
operator, I just see the hand writing on the wall.

Lennie is happy now. He can sneak over to a test session and get his
General......

Dan/W4NTI