N9OGL wrote:
K4YZ said...
There's no "thin line".
It's either an "information bulletin" or it's broadcasting.

There's a BIG difference between an information bulletin and a
broadcast. A broadcast is directed to the general public as a whole
while an information Bulletin is directed to a small group.

And your opinionated broadcasts are just that...Broadcasts.

Once it's "opinonated" it stops being an "information bulletin"
and becomes an editorial. Editorials are broadcasting.

Not necessary, You can get information out of an opinion, it's up to
the person hearing the opinion to determine if he go's along with that
train of thought.A good example is look at court cases, a ruling by a
court is not called a ruling but an opinion. At any rate Society is
based on two input General information and Opinions you can't just have
one.

Todd, The purpose of an "information bulletin" is to provide the
aforementioned "listener" with specific, timely INFORMATION wth which
to make operational decisions as they pertain to his/her Amateur
station...

And Todd...Society is ALSO based on specific facts.

As far as Amateur bulletins go, they should be timely, CONCISE
bits of information...propagation updates, rules changes by
FCC...operating activity parameters...short term emergency operation
limits...

But an information bulletin has to have INFORMATION in it.
Once tainted by editorialization, it's no longer objective

There is nothing in the FCC rules that stated that, Nor does the FCC
rules state that an Information Bulletin has to be a pure piece of
facts.

Anything LESS than a "pure piece of facts" dilutes the INFORMATION
and thus causes you to DIS-serve the audience you seek to cater to.

The Definition that YOU have given is the Genreral definition of the
word Information bulletin, However, It is NOT defined in the FCC rules.

Anything LESS than a "pure piece of facts" dilutes the INFORMATION
and thus causes you to DIS-serve the audience you seek to cater to.

The FCC has the power to define what a definition is in the rules, for
example the FCC can stated that an informational bulletin may only be a
bono fide newscast, but that is not what we see here. In other words
the FCC can limit what something is provided it the lease restrictive
means necessary to promote govenment interest.

Todd, you're dancing around here hoping to find some resolute hole
in the rules to justify being a junior disc jockey.

K1MAN is in the hot water he's in today partially because most
Amateurs consider his OPINIONATED, copy-cat bulletins to be

"97.1369 When in doubt about what constitutes an "information
bulletin" as opposed to a "broadcast", anything Todd McDaugherty says
is wrong."

Your going to have to quote that rule for me steve, I looked in the
rules and couldn't find it. here's what I found

97.3(a)(10)

"(10) Broadcasting. Transmissions intended for reception by the general
public, either direct or relayed. "

97.3(a)(25)

"(25) Information bulletin. A message directed only to amateur
operators consisting solely of subject matter of direct interest to the
amateur service."

97.111(b)(6)

"(b) In addition to one-way transmissions specifically authorized
elsewhere in this Part, an amateur station may transmit the following
types of one-way communications:

(6) Transmissions necessary to disseminate information bulletins; "

97.113(b)

"(b) An amateur station shall not engage in any form of broadcasting,
nor may an amateur station transmit one-way communications EXCEPT as
specifically provided in these rules; nor shall an amateur station
engage in any activity related to program production or news gathering
for broadcasting purposes, except that communications directly related
to the immediate safety of human life or the protection of property may
be provided by amateur stations to broadcasters for dissemination to
the public where no other means of communication is reasonably
available before or at the time of the event. " [EMP. ADDED]

But I didn't see the rule you stated.

No, you wouldn't since it was an "opinion", Todd.

NOW are you getting the idea...?!?!

And one has to be relatively objective in what constitutes
"amateur interest".

No...one has to be SUBJECTIVE...The SUBJECT being Amateur Radio.

I don't give a Rat's Kazoo about The OPINIONS of K1MAN, N9OGL, or
the Staffers at ARRL...When I hear an INFORMATION BULLETIN, I want
FACTS...I want to know what frequencies are off limits due to
disasters... I want to know the callsign of that DXpedition to Never
Never Land...I want to know about some new experimental technique that
folks are working with...

I do NOT want to wade through the "And here's what I think.."
crap.

Toiddie, the opinions of a foul mouthed, immature, basement
dwelling domestic parasite such as your self are of zero-point-squat
interest to the Amateur Radio service.
Set up 1000 blogs if you want to...Internet bandwidth is almost
limitless...Once your tripe hits the airwaves it's QRM.

That's YOUR opinion, and who said I use profanity on the air??? I very
civil on the radio. As for as QRM, as long as I'm using a unused
frequency it's legal.

It's my opinion and the opinion of almost everyone in THIS forum
who's cared to offer an OPNION on the subject.

Which in this case does not apply.
The only "content" issues were Baxter's pecuniary use of Amateur
Radio. Those are clearly within the FCC's purview to limit

K1MAN would of been legal if he would of these things

1. pick an Unused frequency
2. didn't discuss or promote his website
3. remained at the control point.

appart from that his INFORMATION BULLETINS were legal.

But the FACTS are they AREN'T legal.

And Amateurs have pretty well made it clear that W1AW's bulletins
are more than enough one-way stuff on the Amateur allocations.

Again...You keep avoiding the fact that the FCC C L E A R L Y is
allowed to prohibit commerical use of the Amateur Service.
This isn't about Baxter discussing religious preferences or the
color of his wallpaper

First the FCC over the last 10 to 15 years has allowed more commerical
use...SNIP TO

UNSNIP...As a matter of fact a club station running CW practice or an
Information bulletin 40 hours per week can compensate the operator. So
some "commercial" operations are allowed.

The payment of monies to an operator who is doing the work of
operating a station that otherwise is NON commercial does NOT make the
enterprise a commercial one. It means that someone got paid to turn
the thing off and on and to run the tapes at the appointed hour.

Steve, K4YZ

K4YZ wrote:
N9OGL wrote:
K4YZ said...
There's no "thin line".
It's either an "information bulletin" or it's broadcasting.

There's a BIG difference between an information bulletin and a
broadcast. A broadcast is directed to the general public as a whole
while an information Bulletin is directed to a small group.

And your opinionated broadcasts are just that...Broadcasts.

Stevie As I recall you sent a tape to FCC. am I right? if so what did
they do


Once it's "opinonated" it stops being an "information bulletin"
and becomes an editorial. Editorials are broadcasting.

Not necessary, You can get information out of an opinion, it's up to
the person hearing the opinion to determine if he go's along with that
train of thought.A good example is look at court cases, a ruling by a
court is not called a ruling but an opinion. At any rate Society is
based on two input General information and Opinions you can't just have
one.

Todd, The purpose of an "information bulletin" is to provide the
aforementioned "listener" with specific, timely INFORMATION wth which
to make operational decisions as they pertain to his/her Amateur
station...

Where did you get that definition?

Out of your twisted mind no doubt


And Todd...Society is ALSO based on specific facts.

such as?


As far as Amateur bulletins go, they should be timely, CONCISE
bits of information...propagation updates, rules changes by
FCC...operating activity parameters...short term emergency operation
limits...

according to whom?

You it seems


But an information bulletin has to have INFORMATION in it.
Once tainted by editorialization, it's no longer objective

There is nothing in the FCC rules that stated that, Nor does the FCC
rules state that an Information Bulletin has to be a pure piece of
facts.

Anything LESS than a "pure piece of facts" dilutes the INFORMATION
and thus causes you to DIS-serve the audience you seek to cater to.

according to whom? Never seen the FCC say someting this


The Definition that YOU have given is the Genreral definition of the
word Information bulletin, However, It is NOT defined in the FCC rules.

Anything LESS than a "pure piece of facts" dilutes the INFORMATION
and thus causes you to DIS-serve the audience you seek to cater to.

The FCC has the power to define what a definition is in the rules, for
example the FCC can stated that an informational bulletin may only be a
bono fide newscast, but that is not what we see here. In other words
the FCC can limit what something is provided it the lease restrictive
means necessary to promote govenment interest.

Todd, you're dancing around here hoping to find some resolute hole
in the rules to justify being a junior disc jockey.

K1MAN is in the hot water he's in today partially because most
Amateurs consider his OPINIONATED, copy-cat bulletins to be

Not accarding the FCC
cuting the rest of stevie ranting of his OPINION given without any
rreal facts

What don't you and your little bitch Normen go back to given each other
knob jobs and shut the hell up

an_old_friend wrote:
K4YZ wrote:
N9OGL wrote:
K4YZ said...
There's no "thin line".
It's either an "information bulletin" or it's broadcasting.

There's a BIG difference between an information bulletin and a
broadcast. A broadcast is directed to the general public as a whole
while an information Bulletin is directed to a small group.

And your opinionated broadcasts are just that...Broadcasts.

Stevie As I recall you sent a tape to FCC. am I right? if so what did
they do

As usual, Markie, you "recall" incorrectly.

Once it's "opinonated" it stops being an "information bulletin"
and becomes an editorial. Editorials are broadcasting.

Not necessary, You can get information out of an opinion, it's up to
the person hearing the opinion to determine if he go's along with that
train of thought.A good example is look at court cases, a ruling by a
court is not called a ruling but an opinion. At any rate Society is
based on two input General information and Opinions you can't just have
one.

Todd, The purpose of an "information bulletin" is to provide the
aforementioned "listener" with specific, timely INFORMATION wth which
to make operational decisions as they pertain to his/her Amateur
station...

Where did you get that definition?

Out of your twisted mind no doubt

Nope.

From the opinions of FCC personnel over the years.

K1MAN is NOT "the original".

California had WA6GVG for YEARS.

And Todd...Society is ALSO based on specific facts.

such as?

Such as the written law...Such as science...Such as case law...

As far as Amateur bulletins go, they should be timely, CONCISE
bits of information...propagation updates, rules changes by
FCC...operating activity parameters...short term emergency operation
limits...

according to whom?

You it seems

Obviously a LOT more people than me, Markie, since there's been
REAMS of complaints filed on K1MAN, but NONE of them by me.

But an information bulletin has to have INFORMATION in it.
Once tainted by editorialization, it's no longer objective

There is nothing in the FCC rules that stated that, Nor does the FCC
rules state that an Information Bulletin has to be a pure piece of
facts.

Anything LESS than a "pure piece of facts" dilutes the INFORMATION
and thus causes you to DIS-serve the audience you seek to cater to.

according to whom? Never seen the FCC say someting this

The FCC doesn't have to.

It's a fact of documentation.

"XX4XX is operating on 14.123Mhz" is a bit of information.

"XX4AA is operating on 14.123Mhz, but sometimes I think he's on
..250 or .321" is not information...it's speculation...It's opinion. It
further diverts the intended from the facts.

The Definition that YOU have given is the Genreral definition of the
word Information bulletin, However, It is NOT defined in the FCC rules.

Anything LESS than a "pure piece of facts" dilutes the INFORMATION
and thus causes you to DIS-serve the audience you seek to cater to.

The FCC has the power to define what a definition is in the rules, for
example the FCC can stated that an informational bulletin may only be a
bono fide newscast, but that is not what we see here. In other words
the FCC can limit what something is provided it the lease restrictive
means necessary to promote govenment interest.

Todd, you're dancing around here hoping to find some resolute hole
in the rules to justify being a junior disc jockey.

K1MAN is in the hot water he's in today partially because most
Amateurs consider his OPINIONATED, copy-cat bulletins to be

Not accarding the FCC

"according"

Where did I say "according to the FCC", Markie...?!?!

cuting the rest of stevie ranting of his OPINION given without any
rreal facts

"cutting" "real"

Re-inserting my comments as they ARE opinon...just like Markie's
comments...

QUOTE

N9OGL said:
K4YZ siad:
"97.1369 When in doubt about what constitutes an "information
bulletin" as opposed to a "broadcast", anything Todd McDaugherty says
is wrong."

Your going to have to quote that rule for me steve, I looked in the
rules and couldn't find it. here's what I found

97.3(a)(10)

"(10) Broadcasting. Transmissions intended for reception by the general
public, either direct or relayed. "

97.3(a)(25)

"(25) Information bulletin. A message directed only to amateur
operators consisting solely of subject matter of direct interest to the
amateur service."

97.111(b)(6)

"(b) In addition to one-way transmissions specifically authorized
elsewhere in this Part, an amateur station may transmit the following
types of one-way communications:

(6) Transmissions necessary to disseminate information bulletins; "

97.113(b)

"(b) An amateur station shall not engage in any form of broadcasting,
nor may an amateur station transmit one-way communications EXCEPT as
specifically provided in these rules; nor shall an amateur station
engage in any activity related to program production or news gathering
for broadcasting purposes, except that communications directly related
to the immediate safety of human life or the protection of property may
be provided by amateur stations to broadcasters for dissemination to
the public where no other means of communication is reasonably
available before or at the time of the event. " [EMP. ADDED]

But I didn't see the rule you stated.

No, you wouldn't since it was an "opinion", Todd.

NOW are you getting the idea...?!?!

And one has to be relatively objective in what constitutes
"amateur interest".

No...one has to be SUBJECTIVE...The SUBJECT being Amateur Radio.

I don't give a Rat's Kazoo about The OPINIONS of K1MAN, N9OGL, or
the Staffers at ARRL...When I hear an INFORMATION BULLETIN, I want
FACTS...I want to know what frequencies are off limits due to
disasters... I want to know the callsign of that DXpedition to Never
Never Land...I want to know about some new experimental technique that
folks are working with...

I do NOT want to wade through the "And here's what I think.."
crap.

Toiddie, the opinions of a foul mouthed, immature, basement
dwelling domestic parasite such as your self are of zero-point-squat
interest to the Amateur Radio service.
Set up 1000 blogs if you want to...Internet bandwidth is almost
limitless...Once your tripe hits the airwaves it's QRM.

That's YOUR opinion, and who said I use profanity on the air??? I very
civil on the radio. As for as QRM, as long as I'm using a unused
frequency it's legal.

It's my opinion and the opinion of almost everyone in THIS forum
who's cared to offer an OPNION on the subject.

Which in this case does not apply.
The only "content" issues were Baxter's pecuniary use of Amateur
Radio. Those are clearly within the FCC's purview to limit

K1MAN would of been legal if he would of these things

1. pick an Unused frequency
2. didn't discuss or promote his website
3. remained at the control point.

appart from that his INFORMATION BULLETINS were legal.

But the FACTS are they AREN'T legal.

And Amateurs have pretty well made it clear that W1AW's bulletins
are more than enough one-way stuff on the Amateur allocations.

Again...You keep avoiding the fact that the FCC C L E A R L Y is
allowed to prohibit commerical use of the Amateur Service.
This isn't about Baxter discussing religious preferences or the
color of his wallpaper

First the FCC over the last 10 to 15 years has allowed more commerical
use...SNIP TO
UNSNIP...As a matter of fact a club station running CW practice or an
Information bulletin 40 hours per week can compensate the operator. So
some "commercial" operations are allowed.

The payment of monies to an operator who is doing the work of
operating a station that otherwise is NON commercial does NOT make the
enterprise a commercial one. It means that someone got paid to turn
the thing off and on and to run the tapes at the appointed hour.

Steve, K4YZ

END QUOTE

So...Markie...Into censorship now?

Seems so...Most of your posts these days are filled with "cut" and
"cuting rest of..."

Seems I WAS correct that you don't cut those things you don't like
getting your nose rubbed in or that ruin YOUR rants.

Try again.

Steve, K4YZ

K4YZ Said...
But the FACTS are they AREN'T legal.

But you haven't quote a FCC rule nor a FCC final order stating it was
illegal. The only thing you've quoted was a paraphase from the
dictonary.

And Amateurs have pretty well made it clear that W1AW's bulletins
are more than enough one-way stuff on the Amateur allocations.

It seem to me like a monopoly....a monopoly on what should be free
speech.


Todd N9OGL

K4YZ wrote:
an_old_friend wrote:
K4YZ wrote:
N9OGL wrote:
K4YZ said...
There's no "thin line".
It's either an "information bulletin" or it's broadcasting.

There's a BIG difference between an information bulletin and a
broadcast. A broadcast is directed to the general public as a whole
while an information Bulletin is directed to a small group.

And your opinionated broadcasts are just that...Broadcasts.

Stevie As I recall you sent a tape to FCC. am I right? if so what did
they do

As usual, Markie, you "recall" incorrectly.

then why haven't you done so if you are so sure of yourself?

Oh I forgot what you realy want to rag on him not in fact settle
anything


Once it's "opinonated" it stops being an "information bulletin"
and becomes an editorial. Editorials are broadcasting.

Not necessary, You can get information out of an opinion, it's up to
the person hearing the opinion to determine if he go's along with that
train of thought.A good example is look at court cases, a ruling by a
court is not called a ruling but an opinion. At any rate Society is
based on two input General information and Opinions you can't just have
one.

Todd, The purpose of an "information bulletin" is to provide the
aforementioned "listener" with specific, timely INFORMATION wth which
to make operational decisions as they pertain to his/her Amateur
station...

Where did you get that definition?

Out of your twisted mind no doubt

Nope.

From the opinions of FCC personnel over the years.

must be that secrect font of knowledge that comes from knowing morse
code
cut
And Todd...Society is ALSO based on specific facts.

such as?

Such as the written law...Such as science...Such as case law...

so cite em

you refuse to cite Case law of written and yet claim ilegality


As far as Amateur bulletins go, they should be timely, CONCISE
bits of information...propagation updates, rules changes by
FCC...operating activity parameters...short term emergency operation
limits...

according to whom?

You it seems

Obviously a LOT more people than me, Markie, since there's been
REAMS of complaints filed on K1MAN, but NONE of them by me.

not at all

it is obvious that a lot of folks don't K1MAN, for what ever reason
(prehaps even good reason) but still where is it stated that " As
far as Amateur bulletins go, they should be timely, CONCISE bits of
information...propagation updates, rules changes by FCC...operating
activity parameters...short term emergency operation limits..."

is anything covered by rules

at least Riley in saying porr ham practice might be actionable
explianed himself

you have just made a pronoucenment.

But an information bulletin has to have INFORMATION in it.
Once tainted by editorialization, it's no longer objective

There is nothing in the FCC rules that stated that, Nor does the FCC
rules state that an Information Bulletin has to be a pure piece of
facts.

Anything LESS than a "pure piece of facts" dilutes the INFORMATION
and thus causes you to DIS-serve the audience you seek to cater to.

according to whom? Never seen the FCC say someting this

The FCC doesn't have to.

it sure as hell does or congress must
cuting more stevie BS

The Definition that YOU have given is the Genreral definition of the
word Information bulletin, However, It is NOT defined in the FCC rules.

Anything LESS than a "pure piece of facts" dilutes the INFORMATION
and thus causes you to DIS-serve the audience you seek to cater to.

The FCC has the power to define what a definition is in the rules, for
example the FCC can stated that an informational bulletin may only be a
bono fide newscast, but that is not what we see here. In other words
the FCC can limit what something is provided it the lease restrictive
means necessary to promote govenment interest.

Todd, you're dancing around here hoping to find some resolute hole
in the rules to justify being a junior disc jockey.

K1MAN is in the hot water he's in today partially because most
Amateurs consider his OPINIONATED, copy-cat bulletins to be

Not accarding the FCC

"according"

Where did I say "according to the FCC", Markie...?!?!

if K1MAN is in hot water for the FCC or Congress MUST say so or it is
just some hams blowing smoke


cuting the rest of stevie ranting of his OPINION given without any
rreal facts

"cutting" "real"
cut


But the FACTS are they AREN'T legal.

according to whom?

You deny it is the FCC haven't claimed it is congress so it can't be
ILLEGAL

And Amateurs have pretty well made it clear that W1AW's bulletins
are more than enough one-way stuff on the Amateur allocations.

So what?

Hams don't make the law, thank god
cut

So...Markie...Into censorship now?

no I just did not find worth comenting on

I am not required to coment on your every word

My failure to repeat your remarks is not censorship
cutingthe rest of the rant

N9OGL wrote:
K4YZ Said...
But the FACTS are they AREN'T legal.

But you haven't quote a FCC rule nor a FCC final order stating it was
illegal. The only thing you've quoted was a paraphase from the
dictonary.

But Todd don't you know Stevie makes the laws

And Amateurs have pretty well made it clear that W1AW's bulletins
are more than enough one-way stuff on the Amateur allocations.

It seem to me like a monopoly....a monopoly on what should be free
speech.

Naw it is just Stveie claiming that His Opinion is more important than
Law



Todd N9OGL

Fritz Wuehler wrote:
In article .com
"N9OGL" wrote:

What don't you

cuting sexual ranting

gee nothing left

an_old_friend wrote:

gee nothing left

A typical Markie post, then.