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people in the know refer to Degen as innovative, producing BETTER radios than Sony
news.rcn.com wrote: wrote in message ups.com... The whole problem is that people in the know have started to refer to Gegen as an innovative company which produces BETTER radios than Sony, especially after a bit of development. Which people in the know started referring Gegen as producing better radios than Sony. What's a Gegen. Degen is the company which seems to go under a variety of names. It produces for Grundig amongst others: See http://www.radiointel.com/review-kaitoka1101.htm (Kaito being another of their names) I know what Degen is. What is a Gegen. Another reviewer said: " By no means will this be the final word on this impressive little radio. The DE1102 will no doubt be talked about and debated when it makes its way to the global Shortwave listening community. Some will like the DE1102's page system while others may find it confusing or irritating. But as with all radios, it's how well the radio receives radio signals in the end determines mostly if it is a "good radio". The DE1102 is a good radio." in http://www.radiointel.com/review-degende1102.htm A company which goes against the grain of development of Chinese companies which tend to produce amazing technological achievements in prototype form to show to their corporate customers which then become tinny bits of junk with all corners cut to save money when put into production (see made-in-China versions of Sony VCRs which Sony tells you to they will swap out or you can throw away if they ever go wrong) I however have this radio and have noticed an alarming tendency towards 'the Phillips effect', - putting features, knobs, mechanisms on it which don't actually do anything. Really. Which specific knobs don't do anyhting on this radio. What it calls the ATS feature. Also possibly the scan feature? Have you tried it? Are you saying that those knobs do not work? If you are then what do you base that statement on. It says it is dual conversion on Kaito's radios page but then on its own page doesn't make any such claim. Which being the case it should have some pretty advanced circuitry to compensate for this but it doesn't make any such claim. What would it be compensating for by having dual conversion circuitry. You will have to look that one up for precise details on pages too numerous to mention You said the dual conversion circuitry was compensating for this, but never said what "this" was. Please explain. only sports those 'Phillips' features. Which features. The scan feature? What are Phillips features and why would they be on a Degen radio, unless Degen was designing radios for Phillips. What specifically is wrong with the scan feature. Mine doesn't actually pick up any stations and when I bought it for this amazing auto-memorising of 1000 short wave stations It doesn't pick up ANY radio stations? I find that hard to believe unless you forgot to put the batteries in. (See later in my message for the meaning of this) I am glad to hear that someone doesn't regard this piece as a toy and look forward to your informed review of it? It could well be that I am doing something wrong and I did indicate that Degen doesn't normally do this type of thing. Once again, you said it was not picking up any stations. I find it impossible to believe it does not pick up any stations on any bands. |
people in the know refer to Degen as innovative, producing BETTER radios than Sony
ha scritto nel messaggio ups.com... | | news.rcn.com wrote: | wrote in message | ups.com... | | | The whole problem is that people in the know have started to refer to | Gegen | as an innovative company which produces BETTER radios than Sony, | especially | after a bit of development. | | Which people in the know started referring Gegen as producing better | radios than Sony. | | What's a Gegen. | Degen is the company which seems to go under a variety of names. It | produces for Grundig amongst others: See | http://www.radiointel.com/review-kaitoka1101.htm (Kaito being another of | their names) | | I know what Degen is. What is a Gegen. | | Degen = Kaito http://www.eham.net/reviews/detail/5071 http://www.eham.net/reviews/detail/4226 |
people in the know refer to Degen as innovative, producing BETTER radios than Sony
wrote in message I know what Degen is. Well that is a relief: I thought for a moment you were a troll for making a statement about this in a thread where everyone else seems to know what they are talking about ! What is a Gegen. Another reviewer said: " By no means will this be the final word on this impressive little radio. The DE1102 will no doubt be talked about and debated when it makes its way to the global Shortwave listening community. Some will like the DE1102's page system while others may find it confusing or irritating. But as with all radios, it's how well the radio receives radio signals in the end determines mostly if it is a "good radio". The DE1102 is a good radio." in http://www.radiointel.com/review-degende1102.htm You dont say whether you agree that this is a company which produces quality products? This is quite important under the circumstances of your general comments on not having heard of them? Really. Which specific knobs don't do anyhting on this radio. What it calls the ATS feature. Also possibly the scan feature? Have you tried it? Are you saying that those knobs do not work? If you are then what do you base that statement on. I based it on pressing the scan button and the radio not picking up any stations and enabling the ATS feature adn it only tuning to static. I would have thought that somewhat obvious? It says it is dual conversion on Kaito's radios page but then on its own page doesn't make any such claim. Which being the case it should have some pretty advanced circuitry to compensate for this but it doesn't make any such claim. What would it be compensating for by having dual conversion circuitry. You will have to look that one up for precise details on pages too numerous to mention You said the dual conversion circuitry was compensating for this, but never said what "this" was. Please explain. The "this" means, in effect, not being dual conversion. only sports those 'Phillips' features. Which features. The scan feature? What are Phillips features and why would they be on a Degen radio, unless Degen was designing radios for Phillips. I see you have never owned a Phillips product like a short wave radio or a pair of noise reducing headphones which have features and buttons on them which do nothing! (It is not for me to tell you to go out and buy one and see) What specifically is wrong with the scan feature. It scans past perfectly strong stations. And tunes to white noise. Mine doesn't actually pick up any stations and when I bought it for this amazing auto-memorising of 1000 short wave stations It doesn't pick up ANY radio stations? I find that hard to believe unless you forgot to put the batteries in. (See later in my message for the meaning of this) I am glad to hear that someone doesn't regard this piece as a toy and look forward to your informed review of it? It could well be that I am doing something wrong and I did indicate that Degen doesn't normally do this type of thing. Once again, you said it was not picking up any stations. I find it impossible to believe it does not pick up any stations on any bands. |
people in the know refer to Degen as innovative, producing BETTER radios than Sony
In article ,
"news.rcn.com" news.rnc.com wrote: "Telamon" wrote in message The whole problem is that people in the know have started to refer to Gegen as an innovative company which produces BETTER radios than Sony, especially after a bit of development. A company which goes against the grain of development of Chinese companies which tend to produce amazing technological achievements in prototype form to show to their corporate customers which then become tinny bits of junk with all corners cut to save money when put into production (see made-in-China versions of Sony VCRs which Sony tells you to they will swap out or you can throw away if they ever go wrong) Keep on dreaming your dreamy dreams. It is not clear whether you know what you are talking about with this comment: My statement came from an American who spends most of his time living in China where he has to deal with this attitude on what I mentioned were OTHER Chinese companies. I know what I am talking about. My vague general statement refers to the quality of Chinese produced products compared to a Japanese company such as Sony. The Chinese are not up to that quality level but I have no doubt that with the investment American companies have made in China it will not be long before they will be up to that same level. Maybe in a few more years. Or is your point that you don't agree that Degen aren't one of these companies and DO produce junk? Not sure anyone around here agrees with you on this controversial point? From comments on the news group, Internet research, and my direct experience with Chinese made products the Chinese are not up to the quality level the majority of Japanese companies have attained. I don't think the Degen's are junk but at the same time many have raised quality issues in the news group with Degen radios. Hopefully Degen will one day produce a high quality radio. -- Telamon Ventura, California |
people in the know refer to Degen as innovative, producing BETTER radios than Sony
Telamon wrote: In article , "news.rcn.com" news.rnc.com wrote: "Telamon" wrote in message The whole problem is that people in the know have started to refer to Gegen as an innovative company which produces BETTER radios than Sony, especially after a bit of development. A company which goes against the grain of development of Chinese companies which tend to produce amazing technological achievements in prototype form to show to their corporate customers which then become tinny bits of junk with all corners cut to save money when put into production (see made-in-China versions of Sony VCRs which Sony tells you to they will swap out or you can throw away if they ever go wrong) Keep on dreaming your dreamy dreams. It is not clear whether you know what you are talking about with this comment: My statement came from an American who spends most of his time living in China where he has to deal with this attitude on what I mentioned were OTHER Chinese companies. I know what I am talking about. My vague general statement refers to the quality of Chinese produced products compared to a Japanese company such as Sony. The Chinese are not up to that quality level but I have no doubt that with the investment American companies have made in China it will not be long before they will be up to that same level. Maybe in a few more years. Or is your point that you don't agree that Degen aren't one of these companies and DO produce junk? Not sure anyone around here agrees with you on this controversial point? From comments on the news group, Internet research, and my direct experience with Chinese made products the Chinese are not up to the quality level the majority of Japanese companies have attained. Cato responds - I remember as a kid back in the 50's & 60's that if anyone mentioned that something was "Made in Japan", the immediate thought that came to mind was it was cheaply made junk of the very lowest quality. "Made in Japan" had that junk reputation, because for the first couple of decades after WW II, that's what the Japanese were known for making. Lots of cheaply made very poor quality goods to sell to us westerners in the U.S., Canada, and Europe. Especially lots of cheap plastic stuff. Even the plastic was the lowest quality plastic. North America was flooded with the stuff. You saw it everywhere you went. "Made in Japan!!! No wonder it isn't any good! What did you expect huh?" sound's very familiar. Cheaply made little transistor pockedt radios. cheaply made plastic toys, cheap motor cycles and thousands of other items. Foir a number of years the label "Made in Taiwan" had the same reputation. Maybe it still does with some people. But it wasn't that many years, into the 70's and 80's, before everyone wanted a Sony Walkman cassette player, followed by the Walkman CD player, and Sony T.V.'s. Other Japanese companys, like Hitachi started to make some good stuff. Honda started to make a not bad motorcycle, Honda's first cars rusted out like crazy and fell apart. But look at them today. Much improved, and they've really hurt G.M. & Ford plants in the U.S. and Canada haven't they? Along with the other foreign companys that have taken U.S. and Canadian business. I suppose the same has happened in Europe, but I am most familiar with how all these imports have hurt the traditional automotive companys in the U.S. and Canada. Adapting to these changes is very painful for a great many North Americans. I worked for G.M. of Canada Ltd. for more than thirty years, and saw how this was effecting the North American auto industry first hand. I just couldn't understand why Americans and Canadians where buying foreign cars built in Japan, Korea, and elsewhere. I expected them to buy G.M., Ford, and Chrysler to support our American and Canadian auto industry here at home. Ane then Honda, Toyota, and others started building plants in North America!!! O.K., sorry, I've gotten off topic...... What you are starting to see, is that now some good stuff is starting to come out of China, and people don't want to believe it. That's understandable. Same thing happened before when Japan started to produce some good stuff, and then Taiwan, and a few others, including South Korea. And history just keeps repeating! But times change. I don't think the Degen's are junk but at the same time many have raised quality issues in the news group with Degen radios. Hopefully Degen will one day produce a high quality radio. -- Telamon Ventura, California |
people in the know refer to Degen as innovative, producing BETTER radios than Sony
In article .com,
"Cato" wrote: Telamon wrote: In article , "news.rcn.com" news.rnc.com wrote: "Telamon" wrote in message The whole problem is that people in the know have started to refer to Gegen as an innovative company which produces BETTER radios than Sony, especially after a bit of development. A company which goes against the grain of development of Chinese companies which tend to produce amazing technological achievements in prototype form to show to their corporate customers which then become tinny bits of junk with all corners cut to save money when put into production (see made-in-China versions of Sony VCRs which Sony tells you to they will swap out or you can throw away if they ever go wrong) Keep on dreaming your dreamy dreams. It is not clear whether you know what you are talking about with this comment: My statement came from an American who spends most of his time living in China where he has to deal with this attitude on what I mentioned were OTHER Chinese companies. I know what I am talking about. My vague general statement refers to the quality of Chinese produced products compared to a Japanese company such as Sony. The Chinese are not up to that quality level but I have no doubt that with the investment American companies have made in China it will not be long before they will be up to that same level. Maybe in a few more years. Or is your point that you don't agree that Degen aren't one of these companies and DO produce junk? Not sure anyone around here agrees with you on this controversial point? From comments on the news group, Internet research, and my direct experience with Chinese made products the Chinese are not up to the quality level the majority of Japanese companies have attained. Cato responds - I remember as a kid back in the 50's & 60's that if anyone mentioned that something was "Made in Japan", the immediate thought that came to mind was it was cheaply made junk of the very lowest quality. "Made in Japan" had that junk reputation, because for the first couple of decades after WW II, that's what the Japanese were known for making. Lots of cheaply made very poor quality goods to sell to us westerners in the U.S., Canada, and Europe. Especially lots of cheap plastic stuff. Even the plastic was the lowest quality plastic. North America was flooded with the stuff. You saw it everywhere you went. "Made in Japan!!! No wonder it isn't any good! What did you expect huh?" sound's very familiar. Cheaply made little transistor pockedt radios. cheaply made plastic toys, cheap motor cycles and thousands of other items. Foir a number of years the label "Made in Taiwan" had the same reputation. Maybe it still does with some people. But it wasn't that many years, into the 70's and 80's, before everyone wanted a Sony Walkman cassette player, followed by the Walkman CD player, and Sony T.V.'s. Other Japanese companys, like Hitachi started to make some good stuff. Honda started to make a not bad motorcycle, Honda's first cars rusted out like crazy and fell apart. But look at them today. Much improved, and they've really hurt G.M. & Ford plants in the U.S. and Canada haven't they? Along with the other foreign companys that have taken U.S. and Canadian business. I suppose the same has happened in Europe, but I am most familiar with how all these imports have hurt the traditional automotive companys in the U.S. and Canada. Adapting to these changes is very painful for a great many North Americans. I worked for G.M. of Canada Ltd. for more than thirty years, and saw how this was effecting the North American auto industry first hand. I just couldn't understand why Americans and Canadians where buying foreign cars built in Japan, Korea, and elsewhere. I expected them to buy G.M., Ford, and Chrysler to support our American and Canadian auto industry here at home. Ane then Honda, Toyota, and others started building plants in North America!!! O.K., sorry, I've gotten off topic...... What you are starting to see, is that now some good stuff is starting to come out of China, and people don't want to believe it. That's understandable. Same thing happened before when Japan started to produce some good stuff, and then Taiwan, and a few others, including South Korea. And history just keeps repeating! But times change. I don't think the Degen's are junk but at the same time many have raised quality issues in the news group with Degen radios. Hopefully Degen will one day produce a high quality radio. I don't know what that "good stuff" is coming out of China. The made in China products are low quality in general. Take for example the electronic calipers I bought a few weeks ago that is a knockoff of a Mitutoyo unit. The design is solid being a knockoff and it worked out of the box but was kind of sticky to operate. Taking a closer look in the external nooks and crannies revealed dirt and grit. I figured if the external surfaces looked this way the insides must be worse so I took it apart and it looked like a disaster inside chock full of metal dust and grit. I carefully cleaned the interior (and exterior), reassembled the unit and it works smoothly now. Basically even if they knockoff a good design the execution is crude. The internal parts were crudely made and had nicks, scratches, machining errors but you would not see that unless you took it apart. The exterior looked fine until you took a closer look at it. I have come across electronic products using wall wart power supplies made in China that were supposed to be UL approved and they were not compliant. The design would not make the safety standards and would also fail EMI/RFI standards. I have no idea how they are getting away with selling this stuff in the USA. Complaints about radios made in China indicate that once again the environment the units were assembled in are not clean. Switches on the radios would start to fail in a short period of time. This indicates contaminants in the switch assemblies. The radios would malfunction in high humidity conditions. This indicates poor cleaning of circuit boards of ionic solder fluxes used in assembly. The operating design of the radios have some odd quirks but that might be a cultural thing. China has a ways to go before they come up to the consumer standards we get from Taiwan and Japan. I do expect that they will get there but it will take a few more years of improvements. -- Telamon Ventura, California |
people in the know refer to Degen as innovative, producing BETTER radios than Sony
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people in the know refer to Degen as innovative, producingBETT...
I have an electronic calipers.I don't remember if it is a Mitutoyo brand
name because I haven't used them in years.I don't doubt if the battery needs to be replaced. cuhulin |
people in the know refer to Degen as innovative, producingBETT...
Model Trains?
www.devilfinder.com Metrocenter Station Click on where it says,Jackson Society of Model Engineers. cuhulin |
people in the know refer to Degen as innovative, producing BETTERradios than Sony
news.rcn.com wrote:
wrote in message I know what Degen is. Well that is a relief: I thought for a moment you were a troll for making a statement about this in a thread where everyone else seems to know what they are talking about ! He was referring to your posting earlier, which said: ========================================== The whole problem is that people in the know have started to refer to Gegen as an innovative company which produces BETTER radios than Sony, especially after a bit of development. ========================================== When you said 'Gegen', he was naturally curious as to the brand name. mike |
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