On Jan 3, 7:31*am, bpnjensen wrote:
Aiming to raise a new wire antenna here the next couple of weeks, and
I'd like to get some Flexweave for the run, probably 14 gauge will be
adequate for my purpose. *I'd like to get it coated with either PVC or
the shrinktube material.

Does anyone have any experience with either of these coverings? *Can
anyone say whether the material retains its flexibility, or if the
wire is stiffened by the covering? *I'd surely like the flexibility to
remain, if at all possible.

Thanks,
Bruce

IIRC the PAR EF-SWL Antenna uses Flexweave
as the Wire Antenna Element : Had one out for
many years (7~10) and it works well; the the
Flexweave wire has held-up a-ok.

-just-looked- Par Electronics EF-SWL Antenna
{End-Fed Short-Wave Listener Antenna}
http://www.universal-radio.com/catalog/sw_ant/2205.html
Uses 45 Feet of #14 Black Polyethylene Coated
Flex-Weave Wire made-up of 168 Strands of #36
AWG Woven Copper.
http://www.grove-ent.com/ANT8.html

First had it as a simple Inverted "L" Antenna with a 15-Foot
Up-Leg {Vertical} and a 30-Foot Out-Arm {Horizontal}.
Later changed it to a Off-Center-Fed* Dipole with a 17-Foot
Short-Arm and a 28-Foot Long-Arm.

* The PAR EF-SWL's Matching Transformer
http://www.parelectronics.com/pdf/EF-SWL.pdf
allows it to have the two Windings shorted together
with a Common Ground for an Inverted "L" Antenna
-or- Separate for a 'Floating' Two Terminal Antenna
Winding for a : Dipole; OCF-Dipole; Windom; Loop; etc.

-imho- the 'flex-weave' is good stuff - iane ~ RHF
http://www.davisrf.com/flexweave.php

On 01/03/2011 02:39 PM, RHF wrote:
On Jan 3, 7:31 am, wrote:
Aiming to raise a new wire antenna here the next couple of weeks, and
I'd like to get some Flexweave for the run, probably 14 gauge will be
adequate for my purpose. I'd like to get it coated with either PVC or
the shrinktube material.

Does anyone have any experience with either of these coverings? Can
anyone say whether the material retains its flexibility, or if the
wire is stiffened by the covering? I'd surely like the flexibility to
remain, if at all possible.

Thanks,
Bruce

IIRC the PAR EF-SWL Antenna uses Flexweave
as the Wire Antenna Element : Had one out for
many years (7~10) and it works well; the the
Flexweave wire has held-up a-ok.

-just-looked- Par Electronics EF-SWL Antenna
{End-Fed Short-Wave Listener Antenna}
http://www.universal-radio.com/catalog/sw_ant/2205.html
Uses 45 Feet of #14 Black Polyethylene Coated
Flex-Weave Wire made-up of 168 Strands of #36
AWG Woven Copper.
http://www.grove-ent.com/ANT8.html

First had it as a simple Inverted "L" Antenna with a 15-Foot
Up-Leg {Vertical} and a 30-Foot Out-Arm {Horizontal}.
Later changed it to a Off-Center-Fed* Dipole with a 17-Foot
Short-Arm and a 28-Foot Long-Arm.

* The PAR EF-SWL's Matching Transformer
http://www.parelectronics.com/pdf/EF-SWL.pdf
allows it to have the two Windings shorted together
with a Common Ground for an Inverted "L" Antenna
-or- Separate for a 'Floating' Two Terminal Antenna
Winding for a : Dipole; OCF-Dipole; Windom; Loop; etc.

-imho- the 'flex-weave' is good stuff - iane ~ RHF
http://www.davisrf.com/flexweave.php
.
.
If you want to get technical about it, RF doesn't like braided round
conductors as much as it likes smooth conductors with lots of surface. I
use #12 solid copper wire with green plastic insulation for my verticals.

On 01/05/2011 01:21 AM, bpnjensen wrote:
On Jan 3, 4:32 pm, wrote:


I have plenty of sensitivity - my biggest problem by far is RFI from
nearby sources, and it dwarfs any loss issues. Ideally, I would
either put the antennae at an illegally high elevation above the power
lines, or buy a new rural lot - neither of which is workable at this
moment.

I've done killer DXing in the heart of big cities. Have you tried
running down the interference sources one by one? The mere presence of
power lines shouldn't automatically indicate a lousy location.

On Jan 3, 4:32*pm, dave wrote:
On 01/04/2011 11:21 PM, bpnjensen wrote:



If you want to get technical about it, RF doesn't like braided round
conductors as much as it likes smooth conductors with lots of surface. I
use #12 solid copper wire with green plastic insulation for my verticals.- Hide quoted text -

-

Really? *I had not heard that before, but rather the opposite. *If
that's the case, why does anybody use a braided wire?

Little knowledge is a dangerous thing. The RF only travels on the
outside so as the strands weave toward the middle the RF has to find
other outside strands, and over and over again. This causes more loss.

How much loss are we talking about? It cannot be much...at least not
so's you'd notice.

I have plenty of sensitivity - my biggest problem by far is RFI from
nearby sources, and it dwarfs any loss issues. Ideally, I would
either put the antennae at an illegally high elevation above the power
lines, or buy a new rural lot - neither of which is workable at this
moment.

dave wrote:

On 01/05/2011 01:21 AM, bpnjensen wrote:
On Jan 3, 4:32 pm, wrote:


I have plenty of sensitivity - my biggest problem by far is RFI from
nearby sources, and it dwarfs any loss issues. Ideally, I would
either put the antennae at an illegally high elevation above the power
lines, or buy a new rural lot - neither of which is workable at this
moment.

I've done killer DXing in the heart of big cities.

Please elaborate on your 'killer DXing'...

On Jan 4, 7:21*am, bpnjensen wrote:
On Jan 3, 3:27*pm, dave wrote:



On 01/03/2011 02:39 PM, RHF wrote:

On Jan 3, 7:31 am, *wrote:
Aiming to raise a new wire antenna here the next couple of weeks, and
I'd like to get some Flexweave for the run, probably 14 gauge will be
adequate for my purpose. *I'd like to get it coated with either PVC or
the shrinktube material.

Does anyone have any experience with either of these coverings? *Can
anyone say whether the material retains its flexibility, or if the
wire is stiffened by the covering? *I'd surely like the flexibility to
remain, if at all possible.

Thanks,
Bruce

IIRC the PAR EF-SWL Antenna uses Flexweave
as the Wire Antenna Element : Had one out for
many years (7~10) and it works well; the the
Flexweave wire has held-up a-ok.

-just-looked- Par Electronics EF-SWL Antenna
{End-Fed Short-Wave Listener Antenna}
http://www.universal-radio.com/catalog/sw_ant/2205.html
Uses 45 Feet of #14 Black Polyethylene Coated
Flex-Weave Wire made-up of 168 Strands of #36
AWG Woven Copper.
http://www.grove-ent.com/ANT8.html

First had it as a simple Inverted "L" Antenna with a 15-Foot
Up-Leg {Vertical} and a 30-Foot Out-Arm {Horizontal}.
Later changed it to a Off-Center-Fed* Dipole with a 17-Foot
Short-Arm and a 28-Foot Long-Arm.

* The PAR EF-SWL's Matching Transformer
http://www.parelectronics.com/pdf/EF-SWL.pdf
allows it to have the two Windings shorted together
with a Common Ground for an Inverted "L" Antenna
-or- Separate for a 'Floating' Two Terminal Antenna
Winding for a : Dipole; OCF-Dipole; Windom; Loop; etc.

- - - -imho- the 'flex-weave' is good stuff - iane ~ RHF
- - - http://www.davisrf.com/flexweave.php

- - If you want to get technical about it,
- - RF doesn't like braided round conductors
- - as much as it likes smooth conductors
- - with lots of surface.
- - I use #12 solid copper wire with green plastic
- - insulation for my verticals.

- Really?
- I had not heard that before, but rather the opposite.
- If that's the case, why does anybody use a braided wire?

Dave & BpnJ,

It has always been my humble understanding :
That a Multi-Stranded Copper Wire where each
of the Strands has a very thin clear coating where
each of the individual Wires is separated from the
others is better than a single (1) Wire of the same
relative Size {DC Current Rating}.

"The Trick" is to get all those separate and individual
Stranded Wires in the Bundle to be 'connected*'
"Together" at the Fed-Point of the Antenna. {Joints}

* Usually this is done by Soldering the Wires all
'together' as one; with the Flow of Solder forming
an Electrical Bond between the Wires.
Soldering remotes the very thin clear coating and
allows for an optimum joining of the Wires as one.

Note : Crimping the Wires and other mechanical means
of fastening the Wires will always be something less
than the Maximum 100% Standard that Soldering the
Wires can achieve. -if-all-are-done-right-

For the same relative Physical Size Wire with the
same DC Current Handling Capabilities a group of
Stranded Wires will have more 'collective' Surface
Area for RF {Surface} Current than a Single Wire.
-roughly-

* 1 Single Wire to 7 Multi-Stranded Wires ~ 2X :
The Same DC Rating -but- Twice the RF Rating
* * Six Wires around a Center Wire

* 1 Single Wire to 19 Multi-Stranded Wires ~ 4X :
The Same DC Rating -but- Four-Times the RF Rating
* * Twelve Wires around Six Wires around a Center Wire

IMHO - For most average 'typical' 30 Feet to 120 Feet
Shortwave Radio Listener [SWL] Antennas an Insulated
Multi-Stranded Cooper Wire makes for a Good Durable
Long Lasting Wire Antenna Element.
http://www.davisrf.com/antenna-wire/flexweave.php
http://www.universal-radio.com/catalog/cable/4608.html
http://www.smeter.net/daily-facts/5/fact24.php

-however- for Non-Typical SWL Antennas from 150 Feet
and up Copper-Clad-Steel (CCS) Wire may be the better
option for Extra Strength and Durability in a Long-Larger
SWL Antenna.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copper-clad_steel
http://www.radioworks.com/cwire.html
http://www.radio-ware.com/products/antwire.htm
http://www.davisrf.com/antenna-wire/copperweld.php
http://www.universal-radio.com/catalog/cable/wire.html
* See #511
http://www.thewireman.com/antennap.html

-about- Shortwave Radio Listener [SWL] Antenna Wire
http://www.davisrf.com/antenna-wire/index.php

there you have it : 'my-opinion' - iane ~ RHF

On Jan 3, 11:30*pm, dave wrote:
On 01/05/2011 01:21 AM, bpnjensen wrote:

On Jan 3, 4:32 pm, *wrote:

I have plenty of sensitivity - my biggest problem by far is RFI from
nearby sources, and it dwarfs any loss issues. *Ideally, I would
either put the antennae at an illegally high elevation above the power
lines, or buy a new rural lot - neither of which is workable at this
moment.

I've done killer DXing in the heart of big cities. Have you tried
running down the interference sources one by one? The mere presence of
power lines shouldn't automatically indicate a lousy location.

I live cheek-to-jowl in a tight suburban neighborhood. I have the two
power lines front and back; PCs and fancy TVs in all neighbor's
houses; crackling streetlights; buzzing halogen porchlights; and etc.
An industrial park begins about 300 feet away across an active RR
track. I have three blowtorch AM transmitters located within a few
miles of here on the same sal****er bay plain where I am. I could
spend days tracking down the problems (and once or twice have done
so), only to find that some cannot be readily eliminated.

I have "heard" some tiny flea power stations and have logs and even
QSLs to prove it - but by and large, the noise level is onerous and on
the lower bands loud enough to obscure all but the loudest stations.

I know dang well that if I can get the radio and antenna away from
this crapola - the beach 50 miles away, for example, or out to one of
my astronomy sites - the problems largely disappear. This
neighborhood is a disaster.

The best thing I can do is get that wire up as high as legally
possible, and then if necessary turn on the attenuators.

On Jan 4, 6:32*pm, RHF wrote:

Dave & BpnJ,

It has always been my humble understanding :
That a Multi-Stranded Copper Wire where each
of the Strands has a very thin clear coating where
each of the individual Wires is separated from the
others is better than a single (1) Wire of the same
relative Size {DC Current Rating}.

"The Trick" is to get all those separate and individual
Stranded Wires in the Bundle to be 'connected*'
"Together" at the Fed-Point of the Antenna. {Joints}

* Usually this is done by Soldering the Wires all
'together' as one; with the Flow of Solder forming
an Electrical Bond between the Wires.
Soldering remotes the very thin clear coating and
allows for an optimum joining of the Wires as one.

Note : Crimping the Wires and other mechanical means
of fastening the Wires will always be something less
than the Maximum 100% Standard that Soldering the
Wires can achieve. -if-all-are-done-right-

For the same relative Physical Size Wire with the
same DC Current Handling Capabilities a group of
Stranded Wires will have more 'collective' Surface
Area for RF {Surface} Current than a Single Wire.
-roughly-

* 1 Single Wire to 7 Multi-Stranded Wires ~ 2X :
The Same DC Rating -but- Twice the RF Rating
* * Six Wires around a Center Wire

* 1 Single Wire to 19 Multi-Stranded Wires ~ 4X :
The Same DC Rating -but- Four-Times the RF Rating
* * Twelve Wires around Six Wires around a Center Wire

IMHO - For most average 'typical' 30 Feet to 120 Feet
Shortwave Radio Listener [SWL] Antennas an Insulated
Multi-Stranded Cooper Wire makes for a Good Durable
Long Lasting Wire Antenna Element.http://www.davisrf.com/antenna-wire/...s/5/fact24.php

-however- for Non-Typical SWL Antennas from 150 Feet
and up Copper-Clad-Steel (CCS) Wire may be the better
option for Extra Strength and Durability in a Long-Larger
SWL Antenna.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copper-...able/wire.html
* See #511http://www.thewireman.com/antennap.html

-about- Shortwave Radio Listener [SWL] Antenna Wirehttp://www.davisrf.com/antenna-wire/index.php

there you have it : 'my-opinion' - iane ~ RHF
*.
*.

Thanks for this. Do Flexweave and the product sold by Universal have
this thin clear coating?

On Jan 4, 9:57*pm, bpnjensen wrote:
On Jan 4, 6:32*pm, RHF wrote:



Dave & BpnJ,

It has always been my humble understanding :
That a Multi-Stranded Copper Wire where each
of the Strands has a very thin clear coating where
each of the individual Wires is separated from the
others is better than a single (1) Wire of the same
relative Size {DC Current Rating}.

"The Trick" is to get all those separate and individual
Stranded Wires in the Bundle to be 'connected*'
"Together" at the Fed-Point of the Antenna. {Joints}

* Usually this is done by Soldering the Wires all
'together' as one; with the Flow of Solder forming
an Electrical Bond between the Wires.
Soldering remotes the very thin clear coating and
allows for an optimum joining of the Wires as one.

Note : Crimping the Wires and other mechanical means
of fastening the Wires will always be something less
than the Maximum 100% Standard that Soldering the
Wires can achieve. -if-all-are-done-right-

For the same relative Physical Size Wire with the
same DC Current Handling Capabilities a group of
Stranded Wires will have more 'collective' Surface
Area for RF {Surface} Current than a Single Wire.
-roughly-

* 1 Single Wire to 7 Multi-Stranded Wires ~ 2X :
The Same DC Rating -but- Twice the RF Rating
* * Six Wires around a Center Wire

* 1 Single Wire to 19 Multi-Stranded Wires ~ 4X :
The Same DC Rating -but- Four-Times the RF Rating
* * Twelve Wires around Six Wires around a Center Wire

IMHO - For most average 'typical' 30 Feet to 120 Feet
Shortwave Radio Listener [SWL] Antennas an Insulated
Multi-Stranded Cooper Wire makes for a Good Durable
Long Lasting Wire Antenna Element.
http://www.davisrf.com/antenna-wire/.../www.universal....

-however- for Non-Typical SWL Antennas from 150 Feet
and up Copper-Clad-Steel (CCS) Wire may be the better
option for Extra Strength and Durability in a Long-Larger
SWL Antenna.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copper-clad_steel
http://www.radioworks.c...
* See #511
http://www.thewireman.com/antennap.html

-about- Shortwave Radio Listener [SWL] Antenna Wire
http://www.davisrf.com/antenna-wire/index.php

there you have it : 'my-opinion' - iane ~ RHF
*.
*.

- Thanks for this.
-*Do Flexweave and the product sold by Universal
- have this thin clear coating?

BpnJ,

I have never used the Antenna 'Rope' Wire from
Universal-Radio; and it appears to be 'un-coated'.
-follow-up-check- Actually this is also Flex-Weave
Antenna Wire FW14B-100 [14 Gauge @ 100 Foot]
http://www.universal-radio.com/catalog/cable/4608.html
-note- FW14'B' is #14 "Bare" Flex-Weave Copper Wire

From what I have read the Flex-Weave FW14CR
is Clear PVC with a High UV Resistant Cover.
http://www.davisrf.com/antenna-wire/flexweave.php

While the FW14P Flex-Weave is Black Polyethylene
[PE] and is more durable in Salt-Air and Trees.
http://www.radio-ware.com/products/fw.htm

*IF* you are talking about the very thin clear coating
{oxidation} on each of the Wires : Then FW14'T' #14
"Tinned" Flex-Weave has No Outer-Cover {Insulation];
and is easier to Solder plus offers 'extra oxidation
resistance'.
http://www.davisrf.com/antenna-wire/flexweave.php

Basically : Drawn 'Bare' {Pure} Copper Wire has "NO"
Coating but begins to 'Oxidize' in normal air and forms
a 'microscopic' {very thin} nearly 'clear' coating -or-
the newly drawn Wire is Coated with a very thin clear
coating to prevent/reduce 'Oxidize' -or- the newly drawn
Wire is "Tinned' to prevent/reduce 'Oxidize'.

-beyond-this-call- Davis RF Co. @ (800) 328-4773

*WHY* a Clear Coating : In general the People Buying
Copper Wire like to see the Color of "Copper" : So they
know that it is Pure 100% Copper Wire.
-it's-the-'sizzle'-!-in-the-sale-

Where-as Bare Copper "Magnet" Wire is usually coated
with an clear Enamel with a Color 'Tint' to clearly show
that it has been Coated to use in close-lay Windings.
-you-can-spot-it-in-an-instant-

iane ~ RHF

On Jan 4, 1:50*pm, dave wrote:
On 01/05/2011 01:54 PM, bpnjensen wrote:



I have "heard" some tiny flea power stations and have logs and even
QSLs to prove it - but by and large, the noise level is onerous and on
the lower bands loud enough to obscure all but the loudest stations.

I know dang well that if I can get the radio and antenna away from
this crapola - the beach 50 miles away, for example, or out to one of
my astronomy sites - the problems largely disappear. *This
neighborhood is a disaster.

The best thing I can do is get that wire up as high as legally
possible, and then if necessary turn on the attenuators.

Have you considered a remoted receiver? There are free programs to run a
modern transceiver (some rx only) over the web.

No offense, but that sounds like no fun at all :-(