| Page 1 of 2 | 1 | 2 |
|
|
It's all over for Monitoring Times
On 2013-07-28 18:56:37 +0000, extra class said:
3. Gen Xers have not interest or desire in dyi projects Considering that we Gen Xers are responsible for everything from the Maker movement to creating affordable 3D printing machines, I think you're way off base here. |
It's all over for Monitoring Times
On Sat, 3 Aug 2013, Oregonian Haruspex wrote:
On 2013-07-28 18:56:37 +0000, extra class said: 3. Gen Xers have not interest or desire in dyi projects Considering that we Gen Xers are responsible for everything from the Maker movement to creating affordable 3D printing machines, I think you're way off base here. The "Maker Movement" is hype, it rides on the people who've always been interested in building things. Since the magazine hasnt't been around a decade, there hasn't been enough time for many to start from point zero and get good enough by now, so it rests on the existing hobbyists. A 3D "printer" is interesting, but once the hype disappears, what's the point? I rarely think "I wish I could make an exact copy of that plastic piece". I have other ways to make pieces i need, or make do. The field is just about plastic now, so it's not like you can make something really signficiant. The notion of making a gun out of plastic, not only is that not going to stand up that well after much use, but one could always make some sort of gun out of bits and pieces, or so I gather. 3D printing is another dumbing down. Yes, it will be valuable to some, but once the masses get their hands on it, they will simply let other people create the parts, and it will just be a matter of "printing" them at their house. No skill required. And like I said, that's some of the hype of the maker movement, more people can follow instructions, but it doesn't raise them up. I've been going through old magazines, a local bookstore having found a stash of them. The skill level to build the projects was much higher than in "Make", but it was a whole wide field. "Build a two man sub for about $400" says an article in Popular Science from about 1968. YOu can't tell me the kids have invented something new when building things had such a large infrastructure decades ago. And it wasn't just Popular Science (and it's projects and tips), it was Popular Mechanics, Mechanix Illustrated, Popular Electronics, Radio Electronics, Electronics Illustrated, Elementary Electronics, Science and Mechanichs, endless annuals and semiannuals like that one I found a few years ago about prospecting for uranium and "Communciation WOrld" a quarterly that carried White's Radio Log forty years ago, QST, 73, CQ, Ham Radio and some glorified newsletters dedciated to niche amateur radio topics like RTTY and VHF. The astronomy magazines that often included projects about building telescopes or accessories. Woodworking magazines and model railroad magazines. The magazines were endless, and they all had projects you could learn from, projects you could build. Michael |
It's all over for Monitoring Times
On Sunday, August 4, 2013 2:03:43 PM UTC-5, Michael Black wrote:
On Sat, 3 Aug 2013, Oregonian Haruspex wrote: On 2013-07-28 18:56:37 +0000, extra class said: 3. Gen Xers have not interest or desire in dyi projects Considering that we Gen Xers are responsible for everything from the Maker movement to creating affordable 3D printing machines, I think you're way off base here. The "Maker Movement" is hype, it rides on the people who've always been interested in building things. Since the magazine hasnt't been around a decade, there hasn't been enough time for many to start from point zero and get good enough by now, so it rests on the existing hobbyists. A 3D "printer" is interesting, but once the hype disappears, what's the point? I rarely think "I wish I could make an exact copy of that plastic piece". I have other ways to make pieces i need, or make do. The field is just about plastic now, so it's not like you can make something really signficiant. The notion of making a gun out of plastic, not only is that not going to stand up that well after much use, but one could always make some sort of gun out of bits and pieces, or so I gather. 3D printing is another dumbing down. Yes, it will be valuable to some, but once the masses get their hands on it, they will simply let other people create the parts, and it will just be a matter of "printing" them at their house. No skill required. And like I said, that's some of the hype of the maker movement, more people can follow instructions, but it doesn't raise them up. I've been going through old magazines, a local bookstore having found a stash of them. The skill level to build the projects was much higher than in "Make", but it was a whole wide field. "Build a two man sub for about $400" says an article in Popular Science from about 1968. YOu can't tell me the kids have invented something new when building things had such a large infrastructure decades ago. And it wasn't just Popular Science (and it's projects and tips), it was Popular Mechanics, Mechanix Illustrated, Popular Electronics, Radio Electronics, Electronics Illustrated, Elementary Electronics, Science and Mechanichs, endless annuals and semiannuals like that one I found a few years ago about prospecting for uranium and "Communciation WOrld" a quarterly that carried White's Radio Log forty years ago, QST, 73, CQ, Ham Radio and some glorified newsletters dedciated to niche amateur radio topics like RTTY and VHF. The astronomy magazines that often included projects about building telescopes or accessories. Woodworking magazines and model railroad magazines. The magazines were endless, and they all had projects you could learn from, projects you could build. Michael A guy in New Zealand is using his 3D printer to build an Aston Martin car. |
It's all over for Monitoring Times
DhiaDuit wrote: On Sunday, August 4, 2013 2:03:43 PM UTC-5, Michael Black wrote: On Sat, 3 Aug 2013, Oregonian Haruspex wrote: On 2013-07-28 18:56:37 +0000, extra class said: 3. Gen Xers have not interest or desire in dyi projects Considering that we Gen Xers are responsible for everything from the Maker movement to creating affordable 3D printing machines, I think you're way off base here. The "Maker Movement" is hype, it rides on the people who've always been interested in building things. Since the magazine hasnt't been around a decade, there hasn't been enough time for many to start from point zero and get good enough by now, so it rests on the existing hobbyists. A 3D "printer" is interesting, but once the hype disappears, what's the point? I rarely think "I wish I could make an exact copy of that plastic piece". I have other ways to make pieces i need, or make do. The field is just about plastic now, so it's not like you can make something really signficiant. The notion of making a gun out of plastic, not only is that not going to stand up that well after much use, but one could always make some sort of gun out of bits and pieces, or so I gather. 3D printing is another dumbing down. Yes, it will be valuable to some, but once the masses get their hands on it, they will simply let other people create the parts, and it will just be a matter of "printing" them at their house. No skill required. And like I said, that's some of the hype of the maker movement, more people can follow instructions, but it doesn't raise them up. I've been going through old magazines, a local bookstore having found a stash of them. The skill level to build the projects was much higher than in "Make", but it was a whole wide field. "Build a two man sub for about $400" says an article in Popular Science from about 1968. YOu can't tell me the kids have invented something new when building things had such a large infrastructure decades ago. And it wasn't just Popular Science (and it's projects and tips), it was Popular Mechanics, Mechanix Illustrated, Popular Electronics, Radio Electronics, Electronics Illustrated, Elementary Electronics, Science and Mechanichs, endless annuals and semiannuals like that one I found a few years ago about prospecting for uranium and "Communciation WOrld" a quarterly that carried White's Radio Log forty years ago, QST, 73, CQ, Ham Radio and some glorified newsletters dedciated to niche amateur radio topics like RTTY and VHF. The astronomy magazines that often included projects about building telescopes or accessories. Woodworking magazines and model railroad magazines. The magazines were endless, and they all had projects you could learn from, projects you could build. Michael A guy in New Zealand is using his 3D printer to build an Aston Martin car. A Revell model on steroids? |
It's all over for Monitoring Times
"Hils" wrote in message ... People generally have become users not makers. I sometimes feel an anachronism. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Chin up. We anachronisms will be able to pick up the pieces when it all (inevitably) comes tumbling down. |
It's all over for Monitoring Times
On Sunday, August 4, 2013 5:45:44 PM UTC-4, Hils wrote:
On 2013-08-04 20:03, Michael Black wrote: And like I said, that's some of the hype of the maker movement, more people can follow instructions, but it doesn't raise them up. I've been going through old magazines, a local bookstore having found a stash of them. The skill level to build the projects was much higher than in "Make", but it was a whole wide field. "Build a two man sub for about $400" says an article in Popular Science from about 1968. YOu can't tell me the kids have invented something new when building things had such a large infrastructure decades ago. My father had been a mechanical engineer during WW2, and my older brother's first jobs had been in engineering and later aerospace. My father started teaching me maths and engineering when I was about four, but I think he became rather disillusioned when I started school and they insisted on teaching me their curriculum at their speed. Still, between them they'd taught me to solder before I left primary school, and I'd been repairing radio receivers for years before I eventually got an amateur radio licence. My uncles seemed to be forever discussing engines and how to get the best performance from them. My brother bought Practical Wireless and Practical Electronics, and occasionally Short Wave Magazine and Wireless World, I remember one PE project that stuck in my mind was a home-made EEG. The young people closest to me now have piano lessons, violin lessons, ballet, yoga, rugby and cricket lessons, but they're learning no practical skills because their parents (about the same age as me) have almost none themselves. My mother's sewing machine rarely seemed to stop working; their mother buys everything off-the-shelf and replaces rather than repairs. Their father collects electric guitars, but he pays a technician to modify and repair them and refuses all my attempts to teach him basic electronics and soldering. When his electronic car key stopped working recently he paid £200 for a replacement. People generally have become users not makers. I sometimes feel an anachronism. This is probably the biggest problem in most advanced countries today- young people cannot do /make anything . Very disturbing, to say the least... |
It's all over for Monitoring Times
|
It's all over for Monitoring Times
"Hils" wrote in message ... I sometimes feel an anachronism. The last time I did, I got my face slapped. |
It's all over for Monitoring Times
On 08/04/2013 12:03 PM, Michael Black wrote:
On Sat, 3 Aug 2013, Oregonian Haruspex wrote: On 2013-07-28 18:56:37 +0000, extra class said: 3. Gen Xers have not interest or desire in dyi projects Considering that we Gen Xers are responsible for everything from the Maker movement to creating affordable 3D printing machines, I think you're way off base here. The "Maker Movement" is hype, it rides on the people who've always been interested in building things. Since the magazine hasnt't been around a decade, there hasn't been enough time for many to start from point zero and get good enough by now, so it rests on the existing hobbyists. A 3D "printer" is interesting, but once the hype disappears, what's the point? I rarely think "I wish I could make an exact copy of that plastic piece". I have other ways to make pieces i need, or make do. The field is just about plastic now, so it's not like you can make something really signficiant. The notion of making a gun out of plastic, not only is that not going to stand up that well after much use, but one could always make some sort of gun out of bits and pieces, or so I gather. 3D printing is another dumbing down. Yes, it will be valuable to some, but once the masses get their hands on it, they will simply let other people create the parts, and it will just be a matter of "printing" them at their house. No skill required. And like I said, that's some of the hype of the maker movement, more people can follow instructions, but it doesn't raise them up. I've been going through old magazines, a local bookstore having found a stash of them. The skill level to build the projects was much higher than in "Make", but it was a whole wide field. "Build a two man sub for about $400" says an article in Popular Science from about 1968. YOu can't tell me the kids have invented something new when building things had such a large infrastructure decades ago. And it wasn't just Popular Science (and it's projects and tips), it was Popular Mechanics, Mechanix Illustrated, Popular Electronics, Radio Electronics, Electronics Illustrated, Elementary Electronics, Science and Mechanichs, endless annuals and semiannuals like that one I found a few years ago about prospecting for uranium and "Communciation WOrld" a quarterly that carried White's Radio Log forty years ago, QST, 73, CQ, Ham Radio and some glorified newsletters dedciated to niche amateur radio topics like RTTY and VHF. The astronomy magazines that often included projects about building telescopes or accessories. Woodworking magazines and model railroad magazines. The magazines were endless, and they all had projects you could learn from, projects you could build. Michael Get off my lawn! |
It's all over for Monitoring Times
|
It's all over for Monitoring Times
On 08/05/2013 07:14 AM, D. Peter Maus wrote:
"Hils" wrote in message ... I sometimes feel an anachronism. The last time I did, I got my face slapped. He made a funny! |
It's all over for Monitoring Times
|
It's all over for Monitoring Times
On Monday, August 5, 2013 11:45:23 AM UTC-5, Hils wrote:
On 2013-08-05 16:15, D. Peter Maus wrote: On 8/5/13 24:37 , wrote: This is probably the biggest problem in most advanced countries today- young people cannot do /make anything . Very disturbing, to say the least... Industry has wanted this for generations. The individual buys what she/he cannot build. Prices can rise, warranties can be revised. And the whole tenor of Customer Service can be dumbed down to "Policies" and procedures read from a computer screen. Heath, Dyna, and their like and kind in kit form are gone. Even Hafler were products built with parts and circuit designs from David Hafrler's Dyna days, and many of the manuals were reprints of Dynaco manusals with a new logo and front page. Convenience, higher wages, and lower costs of production have made kits, and a lot of DIY obsolete. Even DIY at the Home Depot is backed up by a league of installers who can drop a new cartridge for a water faucet in place for you. Codes, government permit policies, and oversight in your own home have made much of DIY repair impractical. In some developments, DIY is not permitted by CC&R's. Even painting your own home must be done by approved conractors. Often at elevated prices. And state law has facilitated much of this. Here in the Land of Lincoln, any new construction project, condominium, housing development, and subdivision MUST, by law, have a homeowner's association in place before construction may begin. And CC&R's must be approved by an oversight committee answering to the State. So, we become serf's to the contracting and construction trades. We become serfs to plumbers, electricians. Painters. And even lawn maintenance contractors. A few years ago the government here proposed banning all home electrical work: if you wanted to so much as rewire a mains plug, you'd have to hire a "qualified" electrician. There was enough of an outcry to persuade the government to drop the proposal, and many of the media tried to blame it all on the European Union, but the idea could only have come from trade associations lobbying politicians. I wonder how many politicians know how to rewire a mains plug? I wonder how many have any experience of real industry, either in management or on the factory floor? ISTM most of them come straight from economics and politics degrees or banking. And doing things for ourselves....well that becomes a case of atrophy. A thing no exercised wastes away. The last thing politicians and their corporate paymasters want is self-reliant citizens. communities........ www.wired.com |
It's all over for Monitoring Times
On Monday, August 5, 2013 11:45:23 AM UTC-5, Hils wrote:
On 2013-08-05 16:15, D. Peter Maus wrote: On 8/5/13 24:37 , wrote: This is probably the biggest problem in most advanced countries today- young people cannot do /make anything . Very disturbing, to say the least... Industry has wanted this for generations. The individual buys what she/he cannot build. Prices can rise, warranties can be revised. And the whole tenor of Customer Service can be dumbed down to "Policies" and procedures read from a computer screen. Heath, Dyna, and their like and kind in kit form are gone. Even Hafler were products built with parts and circuit designs from David Hafrler's Dyna days, and many of the manuals were reprints of Dynaco manusals with a new logo and front page. Convenience, higher wages, and lower costs of production have made kits, and a lot of DIY obsolete. Even DIY at the Home Depot is backed up by a league of installers who can drop a new cartridge for a water faucet in place for you. Codes, government permit policies, and oversight in your own home have made much of DIY repair impractical. In some developments, DIY is not permitted by CC&R's. Even painting your own home must be done by approved conractors. Often at elevated prices. And state law has facilitated much of this. Here in the Land of Lincoln, any new construction project, condominium, housing development, and subdivision MUST, by law, have a homeowner's association in place before construction may begin. And CC&R's must be approved by an oversight committee answering to the State. So, we become serf's to the contracting and construction trades. We become serfs to plumbers, electricians. Painters. And even lawn maintenance contractors. A few years ago the government here proposed banning all home electrical work: if you wanted to so much as rewire a mains plug, you'd have to hire a "qualified" electrician. There was enough of an outcry to persuade the government to drop the proposal, and many of the media tried to blame it all on the European Union, but the idea could only have come from trade associations lobbying politicians. I wonder how many politicians know how to rewire a mains plug? I wonder how many have any experience of real industry, either in management or on the factory floor? ISTM most of them come straight from economics and politics degrees or banking. And doing things for ourselves....well that becomes a case of atrophy. A thing no exercised wastes away. The last thing politicians and their corporate paymasters want is self-reliant citizens. One time that married Irish woman wayyyyy over yonder across the big pond, she hired old Tony to work on her bathroom. Tony was an old guy who mostly hung out in the pubs. He tried soldering a water pipe leak to her bath tub. She finally wound up calling Broughs plumbing to come over and do the job right. |
It's all over for Monitoring Times
On 8/5/13 11:45 , Hils wrote:
On 2013-08-05 16:15, D. Peter Maus wrote: On 8/5/13 24:37 , wrote: This is probably the biggest problem in most advanced countries today- young people cannot do /make anything . Very disturbing, to say the least... Industry has wanted this for generations. The individual buys what she/he cannot build. Prices can rise, warranties can be revised. And the whole tenor of Customer Service can be dumbed down to "Policies" and procedures read from a computer screen. Heath, Dyna, and their like and kind in kit form are gone. Even Hafler were products built with parts and circuit designs from David Hafrler's Dyna days, and many of the manuals were reprints of Dynaco manusals with a new logo and front page. Convenience, higher wages, and lower costs of production have made kits, and a lot of DIY obsolete. Even DIY at the Home Depot is backed up by a league of installers who can drop a new cartridge for a water faucet in place for you. Codes, government permit policies, and oversight in your own home have made much of DIY repair impractical. In some developments, DIY is not permitted by CC&R's. Even painting your own home must be done by approved conractors. Often at elevated prices. And state law has facilitated much of this. Here in the Land of Lincoln, any new construction project, condominium, housing development, and subdivision MUST, by law, have a homeowner's association in place before construction may begin. And CC&R's must be approved by an oversight committee answering to the State. So, we become serf's to the contracting and construction trades. We become serfs to plumbers, electricians. Painters. And even lawn maintenance contractors. A few years ago the government here proposed banning all home electrical work: if you wanted to so much as rewire a mains plug, you'd have to hire a "qualified" electrician. There was enough of an outcry to persuade the government to drop the proposal, and many of the media tried to blame it all on the European Union, but the idea could only have come from trade associations lobbying politicians. I wonder how many politicians know how to rewire a mains plug? I wonder how many have any experience of real industry, either in management or on the factory floor? ISTM most of them come straight from economics and politics degrees or banking. And doing things for ourselves....well that becomes a case of atrophy. A thing no exercised wastes away. The last thing politicians and their corporate paymasters want is self-reliant citizens. The last thing I would have ever believed in the US, is a political motive for something like this assinine proposal. But, the more I run into this kind of crap, and the more I become convinced that what's behind this, is a political motive. And very much in line with your observation. In the end, it doesn't much matter what we speculate is behind it. In the end, it's the resultant inability for the citizen to rely on his/her self that benefits the power structure. If trade unions drive the point, and the bill passes, the power structure still benefits. Opportunism is as much an evil as direct pursuit of an abuse. |
It's all over for Monitoring Times
On Monday, August 5, 2013 4:30:32 PM UTC-5, D. Peter Maus wrote:
On 8/5/13 11:45 , Hils wrote: On 2013-08-05 16:15, D. Peter Maus wrote: On 8/5/13 24:37 , wrote: This is probably the biggest problem in most advanced countries today- young people cannot do /make anything . Very disturbing, to say the least... Industry has wanted this for generations. The individual buys what she/he cannot build. Prices can rise, warranties can be revised. And the whole tenor of Customer Service can be dumbed down to "Policies" and procedures read from a computer screen. Heath, Dyna, and their like and kind in kit form are gone. Even Hafler were products built with parts and circuit designs from David Hafrler's Dyna days, and many of the manuals were reprints of Dynaco manusals with a new logo and front page. Convenience, higher wages, and lower costs of production have made kits, and a lot of DIY obsolete. Even DIY at the Home Depot is backed up by a league of installers who can drop a new cartridge for a water faucet in place for you. Codes, government permit policies, and oversight in your own home have made much of DIY repair impractical. In some developments, DIY is not permitted by CC&R's. Even painting your own home must be done by approved conractors. Often at elevated prices. And state law has facilitated much of this. Here in the Land of Lincoln, any new construction project, condominium, housing development, and subdivision MUST, by law, have a homeowner's association in place before construction may begin. And CC&R's must be approved by an oversight committee answering to the State. So, we become serf's to the contracting and construction trades. We become serfs to plumbers, electricians. Painters. And even lawn maintenance contractors. A few years ago the government here proposed banning all home electrical work: if you wanted to so much as rewire a mains plug, you'd have to hire a "qualified" electrician. There was enough of an outcry to persuade the government to drop the proposal, and many of the media tried to blame it all on the European Union, but the idea could only have come from trade associations lobbying politicians. I wonder how many politicians know how to rewire a mains plug? I wonder how many have any experience of real industry, either in management or on the factory floor? ISTM most of them come straight from economics and politics degrees or banking. And doing things for ourselves....well that becomes a case of atrophy. A thing no exercised wastes away. The last thing politicians and their corporate paymasters want is self-reliant citizens. The last thing I would have ever believed in the US, is a political motive for something like this assinine proposal. But, the more I run into this kind of crap, and the more I become convinced that what's behind this, is a political motive. And very much in line with your observation. In the end, it doesn't much matter what we speculate is behind it. In the end, it's the resultant inability for the citizen to rely on his/her self that benefits the power structure. If trade unions drive the point, and the bill passes, the power structure still benefits. Opportunism is as much an evil as direct pursuit of an abuse. ''Theater'', T'IS. |
It's all over for Monitoring Times
On 08/05/2013 03:03 PM, DhiaDuit wrote:
On Monday, August 5, 2013 4:30:32 PM UTC-5, D. Peter Maus wrote: On 8/5/13 11:45 , Hils wrote: On 2013-08-05 16:15, D. Peter Maus wrote: On 8/5/13 24:37 , wrote: ''Theater'', T'IS. http://www.elecraft.com/elecraft_products_page.htm http://www.electronickits.com/kit/complete/complete.htm http://www.jameco.com/webapp/wcs/sto...jameco_page=54 etc. I bet there are way more kits today than there were during the Eico Heath days. They just aren't for shortwave radios very much, although the Elecraft radios are the best in the world and totally suitable for serious SWL. |
It's all over for Monitoring Times
On Monday, August 5, 2013 2:09:04 AM UTC-4, Geoffrey S. Mendelson wrote:
wrote: This is probably the biggest problem in most advanced countries today- young people cannot do /make anything . Very disturbing, to say the least... It's not just young people. Once the Apollo program was canceled NASA, and the entire aerospace industry started to fold. By the 1980's there no longer existed in the US the capability of putting another man on the moon. Now, the US has no capability of launching a person into orbit and have to rely on the Soviets ^H^H^H^H^H Russian Federation to do so. There still is the capability of using a missile to launch a satellite, but the trick of using the space shuttle to catch one, and bring it back for repair is done. Along with this decline the 1959 rush to get everyone in the US a college education, along with the cheap student loans, subsidized tution and government funded expansion of colleges and universities is gone. The only thing that is left is the much more competivie admission polices and the restuctured college boards. Around the turn of the century, the tests were "re-normed" to lower the standards (raise the scores by 100 points on each test). That did not do very well, so an essay was added. The thing about essays is that they are all scored by people and are very culture dependent. So a mathematical genius with communications issues will fail misserably, along with a child who has had a different education than what they are looking for. But don't lose hope, things have changed. Children no longer live in isolation with only newspapers to find out what has happened. As my parents learned about the world via radio, I learned via television, my children learn through the internet. My oldest son does not live with me, he's married and off with his own family, so I don't keep track of him. He is a "world class" (i.e. published) expert in data visualization, something did not exist on the TTY that I had in my bedroom (with modem) in high school. His brothers have high speed internet, cellular phones, pocket devices (both have iPods touch, one has an android phone, the other an android tablet), and see the world a lot differently than we did. When I was a teenager, you could feed a family of 6 at the local burger joint for the cost of a one minute phone call between New York and LA. We all have unlimited cellular plans with international calling in 26 countries and they use text voice chat everyday to communicate with people around the world. The only continent they don't regularly communicate with is Antartica. Making things is a problem, yes, they have no interest in what we called "shop". I had wood, metal, ceramic, and auto in high school, I did not have electrical shop so I went into computers instead of becoming a ham radio operator, something I did in my 40's. We shall see what happens as 3d printers are coming down in price, and I think all the stuff they used to make from Legos, paper and scotch tape will in a few years be made on them. Eventually they will design things on the computer, print them out in plastic on their 3d printer and have them made in metal if needed. Geoff. -- Geoffrey S. Mendelson, N3OWJ/4X1GM/KBUH7245/KBUW5379 I don't see how a cancellation of just one space program could have caused the future generation not try building/constructing/inventing new gadjets . Oh, btw the Russians may lose Baikonur Cosmodrome in 2014... That is very difficult to comprehend, considering it has been operating (non-stop) all the way since 1957! |
It's all over for Monitoring Times
On Monday, August 5, 2013 5:52:27 PM UTC-5, wrote:
On Monday, August 5, 2013 2:09:04 AM UTC-4, Geoffrey S. Mendelson wrote: wrote: This is probably the biggest problem in most advanced countries today- young people cannot do /make anything . Very disturbing, to say the least... It's not just young people. Once the Apollo program was canceled NASA, and the entire aerospace industry started to fold. By the 1980's there no longer existed in the US the capability of putting another man on the moon. Now, the US has no capability of launching a person into orbit and have to rely on the Soviets ^H^H^H^H^H Russian Federation to do so. There still is the capability of using a missile to launch a satellite, but the trick of using the space shuttle to catch one, and bring it back for repair is done. Along with this decline the 1959 rush to get everyone in the US a college education, along with the cheap student loans, subsidized tution and government funded expansion of colleges and universities is gone. The only thing that is left is the much more competivie admission polices and the restuctured college boards. Around the turn of the century, the tests were "re-normed" to lower the standards (raise the scores by 100 points on each test). That did not do very well, so an essay was added. The thing about essays is that they are all scored by people and are very culture dependent. So a mathematical genius with communications issues will fail misserably, along with a child who has had a different education than what they are looking for. But don't lose hope, things have changed. Children no longer live in isolation with only newspapers to find out what has happened. As my parents learned about the world via radio, I learned via television, my children learn through the internet. My oldest son does not live with me, he's married and off with his own family, so I don't keep track of him. He is a "world class" (i.e. published) expert in data visualization, something did not exist on the TTY that I had in my bedroom (with modem) in high school. His brothers have high speed internet, cellular phones, pocket devices (both have iPods touch, one has an android phone, the other an android tablet), and see the world a lot differently than we did. When I was a teenager, you could feed a family of 6 at the local burger joint for the cost of a one minute phone call between New York and LA. We all have unlimited cellular plans with international calling in 26 countries and they use text voice chat everyday to communicate with people around the world. The only continent they don't regularly communicate with is Antartica. Making things is a problem, yes, they have no interest in what we called "shop". I had wood, metal, ceramic, and auto in high school, I did not have electrical shop so I went into computers instead of becoming a ham radio operator, something I did in my 40's. We shall see what happens as 3d printers are coming down in price, and I think all the stuff they used to make from Legos, paper and scotch tape will in a few years be made on them. Eventually they will design things on the computer, print them out in plastic on their 3d printer and have them made in metal if needed. Geoff. -- Geoffrey S. Mendelson, N3OWJ/4X1GM/KBUH7245/KBUW5379 I don't see how a cancellation of just one space program could have caused the future generation not try building/constructing/inventing new gadjets . Oh, btw the Russians may lose Baikonur Cosmodrome in 2014... That is very difficult to comprehend, considering it has been operating (non-stop) all the way since 1957! Russia is fixin to start charging America three times as much money to send Astronauts into space. |
It's all over for Monitoring Times
On 8/5/2013 12:45 PM, Hils wrote:
There was enough of an outcry to persuade the government to drop the proposal, and many of the media tried to blame it all on the European Union, but the idea could only have come from trade associations lobbying politicians. Speaking of the European Union...the common view over here is that they seem to have one foot in the grave and the other foot on a banana peel. What are your views on the chance of the EU falling apart? Will the PIIGS* cause its ultimate demise? (* Portugal, Ireland, Italy, Greece, Spain) |
It's all over for Monitoring Times
On 08/06/2013 05:45 AM, Joe from Kokomo wrote:
On 8/5/2013 12:45 PM, Hils wrote: There was enough of an outcry to persuade the government to drop the proposal, and many of the media tried to blame it all on the European Union, but the idea could only have come from trade associations lobbying politicians. Speaking of the European Union...the common view over here is that they seem to have one foot in the grave and the other foot on a banana peel. What are your views on the chance of the EU falling apart? Will the PIIGS* cause its ultimate demise? (* Portugal, Ireland, Italy, Greece, Spain) The reason several of your Pigs is failing can be found on a short street in Lower Manhattan, by the old slave market. |
It's all over for Monitoring Times
On Monday, August 5, 2013 6:13:25 PM UTC-4, dave wrote:
On 08/05/2013 03:03 PM, DhiaDuit wrote: On Monday, August 5, 2013 4:30:32 PM UTC-5, D. Peter Maus wrote: On 8/5/13 11:45 , Hils wrote: On 2013-08-05 16:15, D. Peter Maus wrote: On 8/5/13 24:37 , wrote: ''Theater'', T'IS. http://www.elecraft.com/elecraft_products_page.htm http://www.electronickits.com/kit/complete/complete.htm http://www.jameco.com/webapp/wcs/sto...jameco_page=54 etc. I bet there are way more kits today than there were during the Eico Heath days. They just aren't for shortwave radios very much, although the Elecraft radios are the best in the world and totally suitable for serious SWL. My favorite source of kits: http://www.qrpkits.com |
It's all over for Monitoring Times
On Tuesday, August 6, 2013 9:02:19 AM UTC-5, Steve wrote:
On Monday, August 5, 2013 6:13:25 PM UTC-4, dave wrote: On 08/05/2013 03:03 PM, DhiaDuit wrote: On Monday, August 5, 2013 4:30:32 PM UTC-5, D. Peter Maus wrote: On 8/5/13 11:45 , Hils wrote: On 2013-08-05 16:15, D. Peter Maus wrote: On 8/5/13 24:37 , wrote: ''Theater'', T'IS. http://www.elecraft.com/elecraft_products_page.htm http://www.electronickits.com/kit/complete/complete.htm http://www.jameco.com/webapp/wcs/sto...jameco_page=54 etc. I bet there are way more kits today than there were during the Eico Heath days. They just aren't for shortwave radios very much, although the Elecraft radios are the best in the world and totally suitable for serious SWL. My favorite source of kits: http://www.qrpkits.com You know how New York City's Wall Street got it's name? It was walled in to keep the Pigs out. Yes, really. |
It's all over for Monitoring Times
On Tuesday, August 6, 2013 10:02:02 AM UTC-5, DhiaDuit wrote:
On Tuesday, August 6, 2013 9:02:19 AM UTC-5, Steve wrote: On Monday, August 5, 2013 6:13:25 PM UTC-4, dave wrote: On 08/05/2013 03:03 PM, DhiaDuit wrote: On Monday, August 5, 2013 4:30:32 PM UTC-5, D. Peter Maus wrote: On 8/5/13 11:45 , Hils wrote: On 2013-08-05 16:15, D. Peter Maus wrote: On 8/5/13 24:37 , wrote: ''Theater'', T'IS. http://www.elecraft.com/elecraft_products_page.htm http://www.electronickits.com/kit/complete/complete.htm http://www.jameco.com/webapp/wcs/sto...jameco_page=54 etc. I bet there are way more kits today than there were during the Eico Heath days. They just aren't for shortwave radios very much, although the Elecraft radios are the best in the world and totally suitable for serious SWL. My favorite source of kits: http://www.qrpkits.com You know how New York City's Wall Street got it's name? It was walled in to keep the Pigs out. Yes, really. Google,,, Wall Street was a slave market |
It's all over for Monitoring Times
On 08/06/2013 08:14 AM, DhiaDuit wrote:
On Tuesday, August 6, 2013 10:02:02 AM UTC-5, DhiaDuit wrote: You know how New York City's Wall Street got it's name? It was walled in to keep the Pigs out. Yes, really. Google,,, Wall Street was a slave market The bottoms of the whipping posts are still in the sidewalk. Also the home of the Bill of Rights. Ironic that the banks that really destroyed America would be a half mile from Ground Zero. |
It's all over for Monitoring Times
On Tuesday, August 6, 2013 11:15:18 AM UTC-5, dave wrote:
On 08/06/2013 08:14 AM, DhiaDuit wrote: On Tuesday, August 6, 2013 10:02:02 AM UTC-5, DhiaDuit wrote: You know how New York City's Wall Street got it's name? It was walled in to keep the Pigs out. Yes, really. Google,,, Wall Street was a slave market The bottoms of the whipping posts are still in the sidewalk. Also the home of the Bill of Rights. Ironic that the banks that really destroyed America would be a half mile from Ground Zero. Where ya at Hils? Over there in U. K. do they still ground the positive automobile battery cable to ground? Most people don't know it but positive is really negative. I have known that since the 1940s. |
It's all over for Monitoring Times
On 08/06/2013 10:54 AM, DhiaDuit wrote:
On Tuesday, August 6, 2013 11:15:18 AM UTC-5, dave wrote: On 08/06/2013 08:14 AM, DhiaDuit wrote: The bottoms of the whipping posts are still in the sidewalk. Also the home of the Bill of Rights. Ironic that the banks that really destroyed America would be a half mile from Ground Zero. Where ya at Hils? Over there in U. K. do they still ground the positive automobile battery cable to ground? Most people don't know it but positive is really negative. I have known that since the 1940s. They have been teaching this for a long time. Positive means an excess of holes. |
It's all over for Monitoring Times
Don't agree at all. On Tuesday, August 6, 2013 2:41:30 PM UTC-4, dave wrote:
On 08/06/2013 10:54 AM, DhiaDuit wrote: On Tuesday, August 6, 2013 11:15:18 AM UTC-5, dave wrote: On 08/06/2013 08:14 AM, DhiaDuit wrote: The bottoms of the whipping posts are still in the sidewalk. Also the home of the Bill of Rights. Ironic that the banks that really destroyed America would be a half mile from Ground Zero. Where ya at Hils? Over there in U. K. do they still ground the positive automobile battery cable to ground? Most people don't know it but positive is really negative. I have known that since the 1940s. They have been teaching this for a long time. Positive means an excess of holes. No holes in this case- just negatively charged particles(electrons). |
It's all over for Monitoring Times
On Tuesday, August 6, 2013 2:14:55 PM UTC-5, wrote:
Don't agree at all. On Tuesday, August 6, 2013 2:41:30 PM UTC-4, dave wrote: On 08/06/2013 10:54 AM, DhiaDuit wrote: On Tuesday, August 6, 2013 11:15:18 AM UTC-5, dave wrote: On 08/06/2013 08:14 AM, DhiaDuit wrote: The bottoms of the whipping posts are still in the sidewalk. Also the home of the Bill of Rights. Ironic that the banks that really destroyed America would be a half mile from Ground Zero. Where ya at Hils? Over there in U. K. do they still ground the positive automobile battery cable to ground? Most people don't know it but positive is really negative. I have known that since the 1940s. They have been teaching this for a long time. Positive means an excess of holes. No holes in this case- just negatively charged particles(electrons). Google,,, douglasself.com Museum You will get a kick out of some of that stuff. |
It's all over for Monitoring Times
Hils wrote: On 2013-08-06 19:41, dave wrote: On 08/06/2013 10:54 AM, DhiaDuit wrote: On Tuesday, August 6, 2013 11:15:18 AM UTC-5, dave wrote: The bottoms of the whipping posts are still in the sidewalk. Also the home of the Bill of Rights. Ironic that the banks that really destroyed America would be a half mile from Ground Zero. So near, and yet, so far... Where ya at Hils? Over there in U. K. do they still ground the positive automobile battery cable to ground? Most people don't know it but positive is really negative. I have known that since the 1940s. They have been teaching this for a long time. Positive means an excess of holes. I'm in the county of Somerset, a long way from Blackburn, Lancashire. :-) I'm in the county of Ottawa, also a long way from Blackburn, Lancashire. :-) |
It's all over for Monitoring Times
On Tuesday, August 6, 2013 5:38:56 PM UTC-4, Hils wrote:
On 2013-08-06 19:41, dave wrote: On 08/06/2013 10:54 AM, DhiaDuit wrote: On Tuesday, August 6, 2013 11:15:18 AM UTC-5, dave wrote: The bottoms of the whipping posts are still in the sidewalk. Also the home of the Bill of Rights. Ironic that the banks that really destroyed America would be a half mile from Ground Zero. So near, and yet, so far... Where ya at Hils? Over there in U. K. do they still ground the positive automobile battery cable to ground? Most people don't know it but positive is really negative. I have known that since the 1940s. They have been teaching this for a long time. Positive means an excess of holes. I'm in the county of Somerset, a long way from Blackburn, Lancashire. :-) Is this where the Stanton Drew monolith circles are ? |
It's all over for Monitoring Times
On Tuesday, August 6, 2013 5:51:08 PM UTC-5, wrote:
On Tuesday, August 6, 2013 5:38:56 PM UTC-4, Hils wrote: On 2013-08-06 19:41, dave wrote: On 08/06/2013 10:54 AM, DhiaDuit wrote: On Tuesday, August 6, 2013 11:15:18 AM UTC-5, dave wrote: The bottoms of the whipping posts are still in the sidewalk. Also the home of the Bill of Rights. Ironic that the banks that really destroyed America would be a half mile from Ground Zero. So near, and yet, so far... Where ya at Hils? Over there in U. K. do they still ground the positive automobile battery cable to ground? Most people don't know it but positive is really negative. I have known that since the 1940s. They have been teaching this for a long time. Positive means an excess of holes. I'm in the county of Somerset, a long way from Blackburn, Lancashire. :-) Is this where the Stanton Drew monolith circles are ? A long way from where that married Irish woman lives too, Bognor Regis. I call it Booger Reegiz. About sixty miles South of London, West Sussex County.. Legend of Shelby The Swamp Man on the History channel tonight. Google,,, Legend of Shelby The swamp Man Youtube |
It's all over for Monitoring Times
"Hils" wrote in message ... On 2013-08-06 19:41, dave wrote: On 08/06/2013 10:54 AM, DhiaDuit wrote: On Tuesday, August 6, 2013 11:15:18 AM UTC-5, dave wrote: The bottoms of the whipping posts are still in the sidewalk. Also the home of the Bill of Rights. Ironic that the banks that really destroyed America would be a half mile from Ground Zero. So near, and yet, so far... Where ya at Hils? Over there in U. K. do they still ground the positive automobile battery cable to ground? Most people don't know it but positive is really negative. I have known that since the 1940s. They have been teaching this for a long time. Positive means an excess of holes. I'm in the county of Somerset, a long way from Blackburn, Lancashire. :-) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- But, do they REALLY know how many holes it takes to fill the Albert Hall? |
It's all over for Monitoring Times
On Wed, 7 Aug 2013, Brenda Dyer wrote:
"Hils" wrote in message ... On 2013-08-06 19:41, dave wrote: On 08/06/2013 10:54 AM, DhiaDuit wrote: On Tuesday, August 6, 2013 11:15:18 AM UTC-5, dave wrote: The bottoms of the whipping posts are still in the sidewalk. Also the home of the Bill of Rights. Ironic that the banks that really destroyed America would be a half mile from Ground Zero. So near, and yet, so far... Where ya at Hils? Over there in U. K. do they still ground the positive automobile battery cable to ground? Most people don't know it but positive is really negative. I have known that since the 1940s. They have been teaching this for a long time. Positive means an excess of holes. I'm in the county of Somerset, a long way from Blackburn, Lancashire. :-) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- But, do they REALLY know how many holes it takes to fill the Albert Hall? But is it really the ALbert Hall? There's that famous Bob Dylan "ALbert Hall COncert" but when I bought a legitimate copy when it was finally issued about fifteen years ago, the booklet said it wasn't really at the ALbert Hall, but some other venue. Michael |
It's all over for Monitoring Times
On Tuesday, August 6, 2013 10:26:49 PM UTC-5, Michael Black wrote:
On Wed, 7 Aug 2013, Brenda Dyer wrote: "Hils" wrote in message ... On 2013-08-06 19:41, dave wrote: On 08/06/2013 10:54 AM, DhiaDuit wrote: On Tuesday, August 6, 2013 11:15:18 AM UTC-5, dave wrote: The bottoms of the whipping posts are still in the sidewalk. Also the home of the Bill of Rights. Ironic that the banks that really destroyed America would be a half mile from Ground Zero. So near, and yet, so far... Where ya at Hils? Over there in U. K. do they still ground the positive automobile battery cable to ground? Most people don't know it but positive is really negative. I have known that since the 1940s. They have been teaching this for a long time. Positive means an excess of holes. I'm in the county of Somerset, a long way from Blackburn, Lancashire. :-) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- But, do they REALLY know how many holes it takes to fill the Albert Hall? But is it really the ALbert Hall? There's that famous Bob Dylan "ALbert Hall COncert" but when I bought a legitimate copy when it was finally issued about fifteen years ago, the booklet said it wasn't really at the ALbert Hall, but some other venue. Michael There is a Somerset County in New Jersey and a Jersey in England. |
It's all over for Monitoring Times
On 2013-08-04 21:45:44 +0000, Hils said:
On 2013-08-04 20:03, Michael Black wrote: And like I said, that's some of the hype of the maker movement, more people can follow instructions, but it doesn't raise them up. I've been going through old magazines, a local bookstore having found a stash of them. The skill level to build the projects was much higher than in "Make", but it was a whole wide field. "Build a two man sub for about $400" says an article in Popular Science from about 1968. YOu can't tell me the kids have invented something new when building things had such a large infrastructure decades ago. My father had been a mechanical engineer during WW2, and my older brother's first jobs had been in engineering and later aerospace. My father started teaching me maths and engineering when I was about four, but I think he became rather disillusioned when I started school and they insisted on teaching me their curriculum at their speed. Still, between them they'd taught me to solder before I left primary school, and I'd been repairing radio receivers for years before I eventually got an amateur radio licence. My uncles seemed to be forever discussing engines and how to get the best performance from them. My brother bought Practical Wireless and Practical Electronics, and occasionally Short Wave Magazine and Wireless World, I remember one PE project that stuck in my mind was a home-made EEG. The young people closest to me now have piano lessons, violin lessons, ballet, yoga, rugby and cricket lessons, but they're learning no practical skills because their parents (about the same age as me) have almost none themselves. My mother's sewing machine rarely seemed to stop working; their mother buys everything off-the-shelf and replaces rather than repairs. Their father collects electric guitars, but he pays a technician to modify and repair them and refuses all my attempts to teach him basic electronics and soldering. When his electronic car key stopped working recently he paid £200 for a replacement. People generally have become users not makers. I sometimes feel an anachronism. Blame EEs and their amazing invention, the SMT component, for reducing the amount of practical uses for electronics skills. Have you looked inside a piece of modern electronics? There is almost no ability to modify or even understand the circuit. An electronic car key is almost certainly not reproducible in a practical sense, and recent legislation may even make it illegal to try. Gen Xers are not the ones who passed these laws. |
It's all over for Monitoring Times
On 2013-08-05 22:13:25 +0000, dave said:
On 08/05/2013 03:03 PM, DhiaDuit wrote: On Monday, August 5, 2013 4:30:32 PM UTC-5, D. Peter Maus wrote: On 8/5/13 11:45 , Hils wrote: On 2013-08-05 16:15, D. Peter Maus wrote: On 8/5/13 24:37 , wrote: ''Theater'', T'IS. http://www.elecraft.com/elecraft_products_page.htm http://www.electronickits.com/kit/complete/complete.htm http://www.jameco.com/webapp/wcs/sto...jameco_page=54 etc. I bet there are way more kits today than there were during the Eico Heath days. They just aren't for shortwave radios very much, although the Elecraft radios are the best in the world and totally suitable for serious SWL. While the Elecraft radios can and do perform well on shortwave, the widest crystal filter at 4.2 KHz (on the KX3) is still a bit narrow for real hi-fi SWL. I say this as a very happy KX3 owner. It gets the job done, but the Elecraft rigs are really meant for hams and not SWLs. |
It's all over for Monitoring Times
On Friday, August 9, 2013 7:48:09 PM UTC-4, Oregonian Haruspex wrote:
On 2013-08-05 22:13:25 +0000, dave said: On 08/05/2013 03:03 PM, DhiaDuit wrote: On Monday, August 5, 2013 4:30:32 PM UTC-5, D. Peter Maus wrote: On 8/5/13 11:45 , Hils wrote: On 2013-08-05 16:15, D. Peter Maus wrote: On 8/5/13 24:37 , wrote: ''Theater'', T'IS. http://www.elecraft.com/elecraft_products_page.htm http://www.electronickits.com/kit/complete/complete.htm http://www.jameco.com/webapp/wcs/sto...jameco_page=54 etc. I bet there are way more kits today than there were during the Eico Heath days. They just aren't for shortwave radios very much, although the Elecraft radios are the best in the world and totally suitable for serious SWL. While the Elecraft radios can and do perform well on shortwave, the widest crystal filter at 4.2 KHz (on the KX3) is still a bit narrow for real hi-fi SWL. I say this as a very happy KX3 owner. It gets the job done, but the Elecraft rigs are really meant for hams and not SWLs. Just looked at the KX3 schematic. It is a direct conversion receiver. Where is the crystal filter located ? |
It's all over for Monitoring Times
On Fri, 9 Aug 2013, wrote:
On Friday, August 9, 2013 7:48:09 PM UTC-4, Oregonian Haruspex wrote: On 2013-08-05 22:13:25 +0000, dave said: On 08/05/2013 03:03 PM, DhiaDuit wrote: On Monday, August 5, 2013 4:30:32 PM UTC-5, D. Peter Maus wrote: On 8/5/13 11:45 , Hils wrote: On 2013-08-05 16:15, D. Peter Maus wrote: On 8/5/13 24:37 , wrote: ''Theater'', T'IS. http://www.elecraft.com/elecraft_products_page.htm http://www.electronickits.com/kit/complete/complete.htm http://www.jameco.com/webapp/wcs/sto...jameco_page=54 etc. I bet there are way more kits today than there were during the Eico Heath days. They just aren't for shortwave radios very much, although the Elecraft radios are the best in the world and totally suitable for serious SWL. While the Elecraft radios can and do perform well on shortwave, the widest crystal filter at 4.2 KHz (on the KX3) is still a bit narrow for real hi-fi SWL. I say this as a very happy KX3 owner. It gets the job done, but the Elecraft rigs are really meant for hams and not SWLs. Just looked at the KX3 schematic. It is a direct conversion receiver. Where is the crystal filter located ? Is it one of those new wave radios that do most of the filtering digitally? Perhaps the mentioned 4.2KHz filter is treated more like a "roofing filter" to limit bandwidth, but real selectivity comes later. Or maybe it's all done digitally, and there's no actual crystal filter, in which case it would mean the radio needs new software for wider bandwidth. Michael |
| All times are GMT +1. The time now is 05:20 PM. |
|
Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2025, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
RadioBanter.com