ground is ground the whole world round......

Hi,

How about using the ground in a 3 prong electrical socket???? Better than
nothing??? Dangerous??? I'm in a high rise

--
Take Care
Abb N

"AbbN" wrote in message
...
Hi,

How about using the ground in a 3 prong electrical socket???? Better than
nothing??? Dangerous??? I'm in a high rise


In those circumstances, it's a crapshoot. Often connecting to a building
ground like that will add more noise than signal. If you do want to give it
a go, connect to the screw that holds the plate on, don't just stuff a wire
in the hole, as it can find it's way to the hot side.

If you do want to give it a go, connect to the screw that holds the plate
on, don't just stuff a wire in the hole, as it can find it's way to the hot
side.

Good idea re the screw, if the outlet box is metal and if metal conduit is used
to house the wiring. Whatever is done, if it works, when giving it a try, then
get a cheap plug from Ace. Remove the ground pin and use it as a connector on
the jumper wire from the radio.

73,
Bill, K5BY

Brenda Ann wrote:

"AbbN" wrote in message
...
Hi,

How about using the ground in a 3 prong electrical socket???? Better than
nothing??? Dangerous??? I'm in a high rise


In those circumstances, it's a crapshoot. Often connecting to a building
ground like that will add more noise than signal. If you do want to give it
a go, connect to the screw that holds the plate on, don't just stuff a wire
in the hole, as it can find it's way to the hot side.

If the building has a steel frame, you might do better to connect to the
structure than the electrical ground system.


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On Sun, 12 Oct 2003 18:37:51 -0400, "AbbN"
wrote:

Hi,

How about using the ground in a 3 prong electrical socket???? Better than
nothing??? Dangerous??? I'm in a high rise
These are often very poor radio frequency grounds. A DC ground, or
for that matter a 60Hz ground has a very large skin depth (about .85cm
at 60Hz), so the entire conductor is useful, and the DC resistance to
ground is about all you have to worry about.

A good DC or even 60Hz ground can be an awful Radio frequency ground.
Even at 1 Mhz, the skin depth is a small fraction of a 1 mm, so all of
the corrosion and garbage occurs on the part of the conductor you
need. In addition the length of wire to the physical ground can be
very large, and even a straight wire has inductance, so long ground
line in addition to having poor conductivity, may also have
substantial inductance. Both make for a high impedance path to ground,
which is the last thing you want.

If it is a steel frame building, the building frame is probably a
much better RF ground then the ground lead in an outlet.

"matt weber" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 12 Oct 2003 18:37:51 -0400, "AbbN"
wrote:

Hi,

How about using the ground in a 3 prong electrical socket???? Better than
nothing??? Dangerous??? I'm in a high rise
These are often very poor radio frequency grounds. A DC ground, or
for that matter a 60Hz ground has a very large skin depth (about .85cm
at 60Hz), so the entire conductor is useful, and the DC resistance to
ground is about all you have to worry about.

A good DC or even 60Hz ground can be an awful Radio frequency ground.
Even at 1 Mhz, the skin depth is a small fraction of a 1 mm, so all of
the corrosion and garbage occurs on the part of the conductor you
need.


Wait a minute. Are you saying the depth of the skin effect is the same for
poor conductors as good ones? Wouldn't the increased skin depth of a poor
conductor get the current down to the good conductor?


In addition the length of wire to the physical ground can be
very large, and even a straight wire has inductance, so long ground
line in addition to having poor conductivity, may also have
substantial inductance. Both make for a high impedance path to ground,
which is the last thing you want.

Inductance and capacitance! And they work together in such a way that if
your ground conductor is 1/4 wave or an odd multiple of a 1/4 wave it
presents such a high impedance that it isn't an RF ground at all :-(.

But wait. It still might work just fine, because now it's a counterpoise
:-)!



If it is a steel frame building, the building frame is probably a
much better RF ground then the ground lead in an outlet.

Steel frame buildings are almost always commercial buildings. Shouldn't you
ask the building supervisor to help find the framing and punch a hole
through the wallboard? And wouldn't the steel beams have a thicker buildup
of rust and paint and crud than galvanized steel conduit?

To the original poster, I say -- Experiment safely and keep track of your
results!

Frank Dresser