"Stinger" wrote in message
. ..
Frank,

As I mentioned to Wes, nobody forces you to buy into a neighborhood
with
covenants. I also mentioned that they are not for everybody. In my
case,
they are a good idea, and one of the reasons I built my house where I
did
was specifically because I knew what to expect from neighbors as they
built
nearby.

I don't feel bad that I can't let my yard get waist high, park junk
cars on
the lawn, or paint my roof purple. Rather, I feel good knowing my
neighbor
won't.

By the way, I happen to be a Republican Kung-Fu black belt (Dragon
Claw
1992) that knows a good, honest mechanic that helped me teach my son
how to
change the heads on his antique T-Bird in his garage.

So much for your lily-livered weenie who won't fix their own car
argument.

I honestly don't understand the hostility in your tone, Frank. What's
the
real problem?

-- Stinger




I am hostile to the whole concept to a Homeowner's Association. These
are contractual arrangements, and not laws. If a person is penalized,
he doesn't have his usual legal rights. He either pays the penalty,
sells the property or sues the Homeowner's Association. If he sues,
it's the Homeowner's Association which will get the benefit of doubt in
Court. Policing power is one of genuine responsibilities of the
publicly elected government, and it ought to be done by public employees
who are directly answerable to the courts.

And there's the related issue of ownership. Let's say, after another
marathon session of listening to SW kooks, I completely lose it and
paint my roof purple. It's my roof, isn't it? If it does cause some
damage to someone else it should be provable. But the complainer ought
to be prepared to put up some sort of evidence.

So, yeah, homeowner's associations ain't for me.

I could go on with my opinions about the public sector getting
improperly in the private sector and vice versa.

My brother and I practically rebuilt his 64 T-Bird right in the
driveway. If I was bothering anybody, nobody spoke up.

"Stinger" wrote in message
. ..
Frank,

I don't feel bad that I can't let my yard get waist high, park junk cars
on
the lawn, or paint my roof purple. Rather, I feel good knowing my
neighbor
won't.


As I said before, cities and communities have ordinances against these
things (except the purple roof). Except in decaying neighborhoods, such
city ordinances are enforced.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE

Stinger, HOA are mostly comprised of residents that never have had a
job where they supervised other humans and now is their chance to tell
someone what to do. I do agree that no one want's a junk yard in their
neighborhood. But I don't agree that the guy next door can/should be
able to tell you what you are permitted to do on property you pay the
mortgage, taxes and up keep on. He/she or they can frankly go to hell.
The plan I (for DOC) "BOUGHT" a home in even has restrictions of 18'
satellite dishes, part of the antenna restriction clause. Since the
latest FCC decision the HOA can kiss that part good by. And yes,
receiving antennas can be hidden quite well. Some of us are licensed ham
and enjoy our hobby as you do. Just because we move into a new home in a
new area why should we give up the hobby we so enjoy? We shouldn't have
too. Not all hams have gigantic towers and beams, some of use are
satisfied to use a piece of wire to TRANSMIT on. I have and will
continue to do so when I move. HOA's bring out the evils in good people,
we have to get sneaky and stealthy to enjoy life as we have for many
years.

I know, I've heard this before. It was our choice to purchase in a plan
with restrictions, show me a plan or find me a plot (1/2 acre) of land
where there there are no restrictions in the U.S.A.. If the politicians
arn't telling you what to do it's some nosey neighbor.

Ya'll have a positive day.

Stinger wrote:

Homeowners associations are a good thing! They are basically an agreement
that you and your neighbors will follow some clearly defined rules for the
specific purpose of maintining optimum property values for everyone. In
other words, you won't have to worry about buying an expensive house and
having your next-door neighbor decide to use his yard to store a dozen
wrecked automobiles while he builds a hot-rod or runs a car-repair business.
Common sense should tell anyone that their rights end when they start to
infringe on anyone else's, but sometimes you need it in writing. ;^)

Receiving antennas are easily concealed. If you can find mine from the
street, you were born on Krypton. I think this is an overly-hyped problem.

Broadcasting antennas are another animal, though. For instance, nobody
wants to live next to some clown running a bunch of linear amps through a CB
"base station." It will literally be "seen" on well-shielded cable
television connections, and is a nuisance. I think that's a lot of what the
"external antenna" rules are meant to curb.

-- Stinger

We've strayed pretty far from radio, so this will be my last post on this
subject. I hardly want to be in the position of defending ALL homeowner's
associations.

I think the key to being happy with a homeowner's association is to have
clear, concise, SPECIFIC covenants that aren't subject to liberal
interpretations and that cannot be amended by the board without 100%
approval from every single property owner. The ones in my neighborhood
follow that model and are just that -- simple, and basically just
commonsense good-neighbor policies.

There is a neighborhood in our town that did not follow that key, and they
do indeed have problems. A bunch of retired busybodies managed to get
control of the board, and have become a pain in the neck for working
families or people trying to build new homes. I would never have built
there. Their problem is that the development was originally designed to be
a resort / weekend home development, but retirees have moved in and want to
pretend that it's a high-end property.

Meanwhile, our neighborhood is great, and is in high demand.

Again, the point I am making is that neighborhood covenants are not ALL
bad -- just some of them. (But these are the examples I'm seeing time and
again on this thread, mostly from people that don't live in covenated
neighborhoods anyway).

Frankly, I think that anyone that doesn't have their attorney help them
review neighborhood covenants before they purchase property deserves exactly
what they get. I'll bet most of these people don't have a Will, either,
which is an similarly foolish situation.

-- Stinger

wrote in message ...
Stinger, HOA are mostly comprised of residents that never have had a
job where they supervised other humans and now is their chance to tell
someone what to do. I do agree that no one want's a junk yard in their
neighborhood. But I don't agree that the guy next door can/should be
able to tell you what you are permitted to do on property you pay the
mortgage, taxes and up keep on. He/she or they can frankly go to hell.
The plan I (for DOC) "BOUGHT" a home in even has restrictions of 18'
satellite dishes, part of the antenna restriction clause. Since the
latest FCC decision the HOA can kiss that part good by. And yes,
receiving antennas can be hidden quite well. Some of us are licensed ham
and enjoy our hobby as you do. Just because we move into a new home in a
new area why should we give up the hobby we so enjoy? We shouldn't have
too. Not all hams have gigantic towers and beams, some of use are
satisfied to use a piece of wire to TRANSMIT on. I have and will
continue to do so when I move. HOA's bring out the evils in good people,
we have to get sneaky and stealthy to enjoy life as we have for many
years.

I know, I've heard this before. It was our choice to purchase in a plan
with restrictions, show me a plan or find me a plot (1/2 acre) of land
where there there are no restrictions in the U.S.A.. If the politicians
arn't telling you what to do it's some nosey neighbor.

Ya'll have a positive day.

Stinger wrote:

Homeowners associations are a good thing! They are basically an
agreement
that you and your neighbors will follow some clearly defined rules for
the
specific purpose of maintining optimum property values for everyone. In
other words, you won't have to worry about buying an expensive house and
having your next-door neighbor decide to use his yard to store a dozen
wrecked automobiles while he builds a hot-rod or runs a car-repair
business.
Common sense should tell anyone that their rights end when they start to
infringe on anyone else's, but sometimes you need it in writing. ;^)

Receiving antennas are easily concealed. If you can find mine from the
street, you were born on Krypton. I think this is an overly-hyped
problem.

Broadcasting antennas are another animal, though. For instance, nobody
wants to live next to some clown running a bunch of linear amps through
a CB
"base station." It will literally be "seen" on well-shielded cable
television connections, and is a nuisance. I think that's a lot of what
the
"external antenna" rules are meant to curb.

-- Stinger

"Stinger" wrote in message
...

[snip]


Frankly, I think that anyone that doesn't have their attorney help
them
review neighborhood covenants before they purchase property deserves
exactly
what they get. I'll bet most of these people don't have a Will,
either,
which is an similarly foolish situation.

-- Stinger


Richard Oulton is an attorney. And mo

http://www.ccfj.net/flyoldgloryOulton.html

Frank Dresser

wrote in message ...

And yes,
receiving antennas can be hidden quite well. Some of us are licensed ham
and enjoy our hobby as you do. Just because we move into a new home in a
new area why should we give up the hobby we so enjoy?

Why, if ham radio is such an importaint part of your life, was it not
included in your plans for a new home?
If I wanted an antenna farm the last place I would look for property would
be in a housing project.
I would be looking at a rual area where there is lots of trees to hang wire
from and lots of ground to plant towers.

Willee

receiving antennas can be hidden quite well. Some of us are licensed ham
and enjoy our hobby as you do. Just because we move into a new home in a
new area why should we give up the hobby we so enjoy?

Why, if ham radio is such an importaint part of your life, was it not
included in your plans for a new home?
If I wanted an antenna farm the last place I would look for property would
be in a housing project.
I would be looking at a rual area where there is lots of trees to hang
wire
from and lots of ground to plant towers.

Willee


That is what I am in the process of doing now. As I was a ham when I bought
my first house and was very much into VHF weak signal work I told the real
estate agent the house had to be on a hill and no restrictions. He found me
one that is about 200 feet above most of the county. As I would rather play
radio than mow the grass, the second requirement was no restrictions on the
land.

I am now looking for another house or some land to build on after 25 years
in this house. I have turned down several places just because of the
height. Turned down one just because it was in a development that met most
of the other requirements.

"WilleeCue" wrote in message
...

I would be looking at a rual area where there is lots of trees to hang
wire
from and lots of ground to plant towers.

How dare anyone be forced to have to drive 20 miles to Wal-mart or nice
restaurants to eat!!

wrote in message ...
Some of us are licensed ham
and enjoy our hobby as you do. Just because we move into a new home in a
new area why should we give up the hobby we so enjoy? We shouldn't have
too.

I collect junk Hondas (to sell parts and repair them at a garage) and need
my yard to store them on. I shouldn't have to give that up just because I
move into a new home in a new area. Why should I have to give up the hobby
I so enjoy? I souldn't have too!!!!!!

"Stinger" wrote in message
. ..
Homeowners associations are a good thing! They are basically an agreement
that you and your neighbors will follow some clearly defined rules for the
specific purpose of maintining optimum property values for everyone. In
other words, you won't have to worry about buying an expensive house and
having your next-door neighbor decide to use his yard to store a dozen
wrecked automobiles while he builds a hot-rod or runs a car-repair
business.
Common sense should tell anyone that their rights end when they start to
infringe on anyone else's, but sometimes you need it in writing. ;^)


Don't need a homeowner's association to prevent those kinds of violations.
Cities have ordinances against them. If someone violates the ordinance you
can file a complaint.

Receiving antennas are easily concealed. If you can find mine from the
street, you were born on Krypton. I think this is an overly-hyped
problem.

Broadcasting antennas are another animal, though. For instance, nobody
wants to live next to some clown running a bunch of linear amps through a
CB
"base station." It will literally be "seen" on well-shielded cable
television connections, and is a nuisance. I think that's a lot of what
the
"external antenna" rules are meant to curb.

-- Stinger


Again such CB operation is illegal and they can be just as big or bigger a
nuisance with a mobile operation. Some of these guys have multikilowatt
amps in their vehicles.

Such association rules force the LEGALLY LICENSED operator to use low height
indoor and hidden antennas. Theses types of antennas are far more prone to
generate interference than something well up on a tower.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE