RadioBanter - What if this actually happend......

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- - What if this actually happend...... (https://www.radiobanter.com/shortwave/40196-what-if-actually-happend.html)

"Tony Meloche" wrote in message
...

[snip]

That said, here's a possible other side of the coin: I DO remember
reading, about five years ago, a journal article about "unexplained
phenomena". I apologize for the sketchiness of the details, but it
has
been years, as I said.
Supposedly it was cross-verified by several sources: A TV station in
England received about 22 minutes of very snowy transmission of an
old,
American broadcast out of nowhere. It was traced to a local TV show
from the 1950's in some American city. The show had not been filmed
or
vieotaped (this was before videotape) and it had not been kinescoped,
either. Old program logs traced it to the actual day it had aired.
It
lasted about 22 minutes and quickly faded
This was in 1976 or thereabouts - more than two decades after the
broadcast. It has never been explained. I wish I could remember where
I
read that, but it was NOT a "National Enquirer" or "Weekly World News"
story - it was an article about such things (and there are plenty of
them). It doesn't mean "aliens", it doesn't
mean "spooks", it just means we don't understand some things yet.

Tony

I also have a dim memory of the same or a similar story. It's worth
mentioning that there were two standards for English TV back then, one
for monochrome and one for color. If I recall, the mono standard was on
VHF and the color standard was on UHF. Both standards had different
sweep frequencies, and both differed from the US standard. The mono
standard had the opposite video modulation and the sound was AM. So I
don't know how well either type of TV set would sync to a US TV signal
and a mono set would show a negative picture and distorted or no sound.

However, I think a determined hoaxter could pull it off.

Frank Dresser

In theory when a radio wave goes off in to space, it just keeps going. But,
it decreases in intensity at the inverse square law factor. This means that
it gets exponentially weaker by inverse square law per unit distance. There
would be a point where the strength of the radio wave would be as weak or
weaker than the natural full spectrum of the background noise radiation that
exists in space. At this point, it would not be easily detectable.

As for the standard long wave, medium wave, and short wave communications,
most of the energy from these bounces off the ionosphere back to the earth
again. They keep going in their path until they disperse or wear down to a
level that is no longer detectable. There has been some experiments were a
radio wave pulse was sent out in a single direction, and about a half a
second later it was picked up again from the opposite direction. This radio
wave travelled around the world, bouncing between the ionosphere and the
earths surface.

VHF, UHF, and higher frequencies can escape the ionosphere and go out in to
space. There are scientists and even some hobbyists with a descent budget
who have experimented in bouncing radio waves off the moon for research.
This requires some specialized equipment and knowledge to implement, and
work with.

As for receiving radio waves coming back from out in space that have been
sent from the earth is another thing. There are some theories and people who
have claimed this to be. There is the theory that the wave may go out
somewhere, and bounce off some type of planet or object that can amplify it
in some manner. This is only speculative, and there are some theories that
support this.

There have been a few claims of people getting both radio and TV signals a
few days or even a month or so after its broadcast. I can recall reading
about a case that in about 1954 there was a family in Newfoundland that
claimed to have picked up a TV station from Florida that was broadcasted
about 8 days prior. The Florida TV station did say that they did not repeat
this program in any way at that time. There is no actual proof of this
other than the descriptions of the people who claimed this to be. They said
that the picture was very snowy, but was able to be made out along with the
sound. It supposedly only lasted about 3 minutes or so.

There have been actual documented cases where TV stations have been picked
up over excessively very long distances. But these were normal broadcasts,
and were not delayed out of the ordinary. By some chance there was a skip
effect caused by the ionosphere. The reception conditions were ideal at that
time.

There is speculation in this case, was that some of the family members may
have been to Florida, or a friend of their who has been, was over at their
place at the time. They may have picked up some distant station from the US
at the time, which is most likely possible, and thought they were watching
an older program. It is possible that the program that was on TV was a
similar program to what they thought they were watching.

From the background that I have in engineering, I personally cannot see in
practice a broadcast signal going far out in space and then returning even a
few minutes later. Then again, I am not authority in this type of
phenomenon. I can see this able to be done over a few seconds by beaming
the signal to a close body in space such as the moon, if directly intended
for this type of purpose, using the proper set-up, resources, and equipment
to do this. In theory if they can do this to mars, then it would be a few
minutes. But, one would have to be a dead on aim to do this, because the
reflected signal would be very critical, and the bodies are moving in space.
Considering the power required, and the losses involved, I cannot see in
practice to reflect a signal off of anything much farther than the moon.

Then again, in theory a signal that goes out in space should have that very
small chance of reflecting back to the earth. But, being able to sustain any
reception of it, or even make it out any intelligence in it, would be
another matter.

This is my personal opinion only...

--

Greetings,

Jerry Greenberg GLG Technologies GLG
=========================================

"Current_gothic" wrote in message
...
Just think what if this actually happened
maybe it has to a few of you, or maybe it hasen't
some may see this as a troll or a joke. but actually it isin't
i was thinking about this today and was wondering what the rest of u
on here might say..
so here it goes.

Have you ever thought to your self. or known some one who maybe has,
heard strange singnals. now i dont mean number stations, or odd BCB
stations. i mean like have u ever sat spinning the dials on ur radio
and then all of the sudden heard something odd that wasen't from this
ear. ur probably thinking ok get to what ur talking about

well what i mean is maybe a airplane sent off a message over shortwave
radio lets say back in 1940 and maybe just now from 1990 on to 2004
maybe u heard the message over ur radio , and found out it was from a
plane or something else in a back farther date over shortwave.

now i mean its a weird phenomenom (bad spelling) but can it happen .
or maybe it has happened to you,,

would like to hear your input

thanks

The Wizard (channels 19,11,27,35..on the CB)
VE3010SWL-Professional shortwave listener
NAMA1380-Professional scanner operator

Keep your heads up high but your antennas up higher

On Sun, 18 Jan 2004 23:00:54 -0500, "matt's sludge"
wrote:

snip

Are you sure you didn't call Art Bell last night
and claimed to be a six-toed spawn of an alien
love affair with Michael Jackson..? (grin)

Even Art wouldn't let that caller go on the air - too easily disproven
as everyone knows that there are some things an alien just won't do
......... and Michael Jackson is one of them. 8-}

Currrent:

Problem usually is that there is no character development,
pacing, or reasonable dialogue in lots of the books written today. Most of
which never get published.

- On the other hand, Consider " Salems Lot" as an example of what I consider
good character development, pacing, dialogue, etc, etc., etc.

Totally crazy Idea, but good writing makes it work !

Dan

There was a Twilight Zone episode about someone tuning in broadcasts from
the past on a MW radio. It wasn't a shoddy plot, nor a bad movie.

If your writing a peice of fiction, you have to have rules for what goes on,
and then follow them
Even if it's static on the radio before the Monster shows up where the kids all
park,

- & JUST before it gets interesting -

you then have to have Static on the radio when the poor lone Cop, driving out
to chase a racoon off someones porch gets attaked .

- So if your picking up signals from the 1940s there has to be some corollary
local behavior to go along with this.
I think in " Signals", it was northern lights...
- And you have to give Poor Doomed " Lone Cop" a real personality & some
thoughts while he's driving out there in the dark, making his last call..

Dan
'

In article , (Frank White)
writes:

According to our current knowledge of physics and the universe,
this should not be possible. A radio signal is an energy burst;
it cannot just hang around for 50-60 years. Even if it
traveled out into space, hit something, and bounced back,
the signal would be so degraded when it reached your radio
it would be incoherent. And time travel, except in the
neighborhood of black holes, doesn't exist. If I *did* pick up
such a signal, I would assume I was listening to a re-
enactment or historical tape, not an original transmission
that had somehow bypassed the normal rules of existance.

FW

Supposedly it was cross-verified by several sources: A TV station in
England received about 22 minutes ...
This was in 1976 or thereabouts - more than two decades after the
broadcast. It has never been explained. I wish I could remember where I
read that...

I recall reading about that as a kid. I believe that it was in a book
called "Strange Stories and Amazing Facts," published by Reader's
Digest (I think) in the mid 70s. Pretty interesting reading, as I
recall.

Same thing happened with my kill-file.

It's a shame that a radio hobbyist would rather insult the guy and his
question than think about and contribute possible solutions and scenarios --
but he's much too busy being a jerk and self-appointed lord over the
newsgroup. Ignore the troll.

As for the question, yes -- I think it could happen, and here's why: As
shortwave listeners, we depend upon an eclectic combination of magnetism and
radiation for their ability to reflect radio waves. Otherwise, we'd be
stuck with local, line-of-sight radio sources.

We know that these conditions are found in other places besides earth.
They're found in massive amounts in nebulae, especially ones with neutron
stars (among others) in close proximity.

Since radio waves travel at the speed of light, signals from the early days
of broadcasting have travelled pretty far (60 light-years for the 1940
signals). There are plenty of places with lots of ionized radiation within
60 light years of earth. However, we only need to consider 30 light-years
for this example, because the return trip takes the same amount of time.

If one of these radio reflecting objects (nebulae?) were to have the right
properties (size, shape, AND MOST IMPORTANTLY -- correct bounce angle --
remember, the Earth is a moving target), we might actually be lucky enough
to be in the path of a reflected transmission.

Obviously, the chances for this are extremely small, or we would be hearing
about really old "skip" much more often.

-- Stinger

"Soliloquy" wrote in message
4...
(Current_gothic) wrote in
:

Since I have killfiled so many people from this group, I didn't get to
see their response, other than as it is quoted in your reply.
Unfortunately, so few people have an imagination these days, as the TV
supplies what their creative impulses should have driven them to think
of for themselves.

People that question are creative enough to write the materials that
placate the masses. If we were all rigidly scientific, how truly dull
the world would be.

Confer the movie "Frequency" http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0186151/

Feast thou eyes on the brief description at the above site.

"Plot Outline: An accidental cross-time radio link connects father and
son across 30 years. The son tries to save his father's life, but then
must fix the consequences".

In brief,
A relatively young man, policeman by trade, despondent at the recent
breakup with his wife, happens to get his father's HAM radio from the
closet. He plugs the radio in, and while using it converses with another
man, a man that subsequently turns out to be his father. Problem is, his
father had died many years prior. An unusual aurora activity in the NY
area offered this man a chance to change his past, but with unexpected
results.

Awesome movie, and just think, some people laugh their asses off over
such creative ideas.

Please watch the movie, the difficulty with changing the past is quite
intriguing, and a way to get evidence from the past to the present is
interestingly done. And at the end, changes in the past result in
dramatic changes in the present.

Keep thinking those creative ideas.

Regards.

Think what you want i was just asking a question if thast how u treat
every one in this newsgroup when they ask a question just a curious
one at that i wasent refering to UFOS or anything in that matter. but
i guess if ur gooing to be an ass about something that some one asked
just for a change of topic and maybe even see if its happend. maybe
some one is interested u ever think about that

On Sun, 18 Jan 2004 20:38:14 -0500, N8KDV
wrote:

Current_gothic wrote:

Just think what if this actually happened

well what i mean is maybe a airplane sent off a message over
shortwave radio lets say back in 1940 and maybe just now from 1990
on to 2004 maybe u heard the message over ur radio

would like to hear your input

thanks

--
Never say never.
Nothing is absolute.