OT solar cell power information?
 

Anyone hooked up any photovoltaic panels for battery charging? I've been
offered two 75 watt panels and it might be fun to power some small loads
through a battery storage setup.

Major pitfalls? Clouds?

(off to do some research...)





mike

"m II" wrote in message
news:rqt1d.1338$t61.136@clgrps13...
Anyone hooked up any photovoltaic panels for battery charging? I've been
offered two 75 watt panels and it might be fun to power some small loads
through a battery storage setup.

Major pitfalls? Clouds?

(off to do some research...)

Panels that big should work fine in cloudy weather. Make sure you get a
charge controller though.

On Tue, 14 Sep 2004 03:18:47 +0000, m II wrote:

Anyone hooked up any photovoltaic panels for battery charging? I've been
offered two 75 watt panels and it might be fun to power some small loads
through a battery storage setup.

Major pitfalls? Clouds?

(off to do some research...)

mike

There is PLENTY of info on the web about it. Google for more!

On Tue, 14 Sep 2004 03:18:47 GMT, m II
wrote:

Anyone hooked up any photovoltaic panels for battery charging? I've been
offered two 75 watt panels and it might be fun to power some small loads
through a battery storage setup.

Major pitfalls? Clouds?

Determining battery charge level at any given time.
which is directly related to choosing the cell
chemistry/properties for the application/s needs
For 75 watts, perhaps some over engineering (depends on
application) since that is a peak rarely achieved power output
spec no doubt..

alt.solar.photovoltaic
sci.electronics.misc

m II wrote:

Anyone hooked up any photovoltaic panels for battery charging? I've been
offered two 75 watt panels and it might be fun to power some small loads
through a battery storage setup.

Major pitfalls? Clouds?

(off to do some research...)





mike


Yes, been there, done that. All my radios and most of my computer
gear run off solar power. Also makes for a great backup for 'fridge.

I'd tell you how to do it if you weren't such a hateful ****head. In
other words, you're on your own.

Eric F. Richards wrote:

I'd tell you how to do it if you weren't such a hateful ****head. In
other words, you're on your own.

I'm hurt.

I hate seeing a country on the other side of the globe invaded and
destroyed for political and monetary gain by a bunch of corrupt, immoral
monsters.

There is NO evidence to support being there.

I'm sorry we disagree on that and I hope you can sleep with your conscience.




mike

m II wrote:

Eric F. Richards wrote:

I'd tell you how to do it if you weren't such a hateful ****head. In
other words, you're on your own.

I'm hurt.

I hate seeing a country on the other side of the globe invaded and
destroyed for political and monetary gain by a bunch of corrupt, immoral
monsters.

There is NO evidence to support being there.

I'm sorry we disagree on that and I hope you can sleep with your conscience.




mike

Be hurt. Assume your holier-than-thou point of view. Become what you
despise. Make generalizations about people you don't know. But most
of all, make your statements in an inappropriate place, and shove them
down everyone's throat. You'd be the type to bring a porno movie to a
wedding reception.

You don't know jack about me. Or my point of view. Maybe my sig will
give you a hint.



--
Eric F. Richards,
"Making me root for a sanctimonious statist blowhard like Kerry isn't
the worst thing Bush has done to the country. But it's the offense
that I take most personally."
-- http://www.reason.com/links/links071304.shtml

Eric F. Richards wrote:

Be hurt. Assume your holier-than-thou point of view. Become what you
despise. Make generalizations about people you don't know.

Exactly what Bush, the lunatic religious right and the Neocon gangsters
are doing to the occupants of the Middle East.



But most
of all, make your statements in an inappropriate place, and shove them
down everyone's throat.

I asked for an opinion on solar panels. *YOU* called me names. Let's get
the story straight here.



You'd be the type to bring a porno movie to a
wedding reception.


Making generalizations about people you don't know?



You don't know jack about me. Or my point of view. Maybe my sig will
give you a hint.

Yes it did. You hate everyone that isn't like you and has oil under
their sovereign land. The words xenophobic and uneducated also come to mind.

Now, with your permission, I'd like to stop this little tete a tete
before you get uglier. Remember...YOU started this little episode with
an unprovoked comment, not me. Now, please go and resume your Devil worship.




mike

m II wrote:

Eric F. Richards wrote:

Be hurt. Assume your holier-than-thou point of view. Become what you
despise. Make generalizations about people you don't know.

Exactly what Bush, the lunatic religious right and the Neocon gangsters
are doing to the occupants of the Middle East.


So that makes it okay for you to do the same thing, then?



But most
of all, make your statements in an inappropriate place, and shove them
down everyone's throat.

I asked for an opinion on solar panels. *YOU* called me names. Let's get
the story straight here.


Your reputation and posting history precede you. I gave you that
answer because you JUST WON'T SHUT UP about non RADIO related things
in this newsgroup.



You'd be the type to bring a porno movie to a
wedding reception.


Making generalizations about people you don't know?


Drawing a conclusion based on your posting history, which, BTW, will
live on forever. You can't erase it.



You don't know jack about me. Or my point of view. Maybe my sig will
give you a hint.

Yes it did. You hate everyone that isn't like you and has oil under
their sovereign land. The words xenophobic and uneducated also come to mind.

That's interesting. Do you have any "logic" to back that up? Or just
ideology?


Now, with your permission, I'd like to stop this little tete a tete
before you get uglier. Remember...YOU started this little episode with
an unprovoked comment, not me. Now, please go and resume your Devil worship.

mike

I worship no devil.

Permission *denied.*

So, what IS it with you and some of your countrymen that the only way
they can make themselves feel good is to belittle the U.S. in one
broad sweep? You have a fine country -- why don't you be proud of it
on its merits rather than puff yourself up by belittling others, in
one broad sweep, as if 300,000,000 people can be summed up by one
venom-laced sentence?

--
Eric F. Richards,
"I have in mind a bloodbath that is thoroughly bipartisan. Let the
Clintons be the first to go. American politics will not be healthy until
they are purged from the system. Issue exit visas to Trent Lott and Tom
DeLay, to Dick Armey, to the ancient and awful Strom Thurmond and the
odious Jesse Helms. Let the ostraca fall upon the bombastic charlatan
Jesse Jackson, upon Henry Hyde and Maxine Waters, upon Barbara Boxer
and Orrin Hatch." - Lance Morrow,
http://www.time.com/time/nation/arti...,88598,00.html

From: Eric F. Richards

You have a fine country -- why don't you be proud of it
on its merits rather than puff yourself up by belittling others, in
one broad sweep, as if 300,000,000 people can be summed up by one
venom-laced sentence?

We have a fine country, here in the US, but there are plenty of posters in this
newsgroup that belittle about 150,000,000 citizens of this country everyday
with their demeaning generalizations. No rebuke of them, eh?

Why can you only see things in one direction? Ideology blinding your logic?






Michael Bryant, WA4009SWL
Louisville, KY
R75, S800, RX320, SW77, ICF2010K,
DX398, 7600G, 6800W, RF2200, 7600A,
Degen 1102, Degen 1103, GE SRll,
Pro-2006, Pro-2010, Pro-76
(remove "nospam" to reply)

ospam (Michael Bryant) wrote:

We have a fine country, here in the US, but there are plenty of posters in this
newsgroup that belittle about 150,000,000 citizens of this country everyday
with their demeaning generalizations. No rebuke of them, eh?

Had one of them asked for help that I could provide, especially since
some of the information he got from other posters was misleading and
would send him down the garden path, I would have said exactly the
same thing.

Probably word-for-word.


Why can you only see things in one direction? Ideology blinding your logic?


I do not see things in one direction. I hate to say it, but I have
contempt for those who do, be they Ann Coulter or Michael Moore.


ObOntopic: It's always a pleasure during hurricane season that
despite Fidel's bluster that "he will take no aid" and Bush's absurd
offer for $50k of aid, that the hams on 14.325 and the weather people
get along just fine.

--
Eric F. Richards,
"Al-Maydan's spittle-spraying, six-count indictment of America illustrates the
principle that a person, when ranting about others, often describes himself."
Lance Morrow, http://www.cnn.com/ALLPOLITICS/time/.../arrogant.html

In article ,
Eric F. Richards wrote:
m II wrote:

Anyone hooked up any photovoltaic panels for battery charging? I've been
offered two 75 watt panels and it might be fun to power some small loads
through a battery storage setup.

Major pitfalls? Clouds?

(off to do some research...)
....
I'd tell you how to do it if you weren't such a hateful ****head. In
other words, you're on your own.

So anyone with a concern for truth and justice, (and a bit of a flippant
attitude) is hateful?

Solar cells have a voltage vs. current curve that's roughly square.

|___ Open Circuit voltage
| ====____. maximum power point
V| \ \
| \ \ "Constant" Current
| \ \
| \ \
|---------------
I ^ available current depends on incident light

The no load voltage is determined by quantum physics and is roughly
constant. The current available is determined by the cell area and
the incident sunlight.

In practical terms, if you don't put the cells in a situation where
they're outputting enough current to damage their internal wiring,
you can hook them up and they'll provide a roughly constant current for
charging a battery. You wouldn't want to use too high a voltage array,
as you could damage the battery. And if the sunlight goes away, as it
does every day, leakage back through the cell can discharge the battery.
So the simple "chargers" I've seen where switches to disconnect the
battery when its voltage got too high, or there wasn't enough sunlight.

If you want to be cost effective, you get a fancy charger that
transforms the load on the solar array to the maximum power point
to get the most bang for the buck.

Mark Zenier Washington State resident

(Mark Zenier) wrote:


So anyone with a concern for truth and justice, (and a bit of a flippant
attitude) is hateful?

If his concern was about "truth and justice" AND he'd redirect his
postings to ANY politics group instead of flooding us with them here,
it would be a different story.

In my OPINION (note that I know when to use that word), his worldview
is colored by an unfortunate anti-US bias that a small but vocal
minority in Canada have. Were you here 'round 9/11/01? Remember
psycho-Jim, who was mad on 9/11 for two reasons? 1) not enough
Americans were killed and 2) he couldn't get any music on his radio
that day?

As for his point of view, I might share some of his views. But I
would never, ever consider him an objective observer.


Solar cells have a voltage vs. current curve that's roughly square.

|___ Open Circuit voltage
| ====____. maximum power point
V| \ \
| \ \ "Constant" Current
| \ \
| \ \
|---------------
I ^ available current depends on incident light

The no load voltage is determined by quantum physics and is roughly
constant. The current available is determined by the cell area and
the incident sunlight.

In practical terms, if you don't put the cells in a situation where
they're outputting enough current to damage their internal wiring,
you can hook them up and they'll provide a roughly constant current for
charging a battery. You wouldn't want to use too high a voltage array,
as you could damage the battery.

Bzzzzzt. You were doing fine up to there. Unless you are addressing
alkaline (Ni-Cd) batteries instead of Lead-acid batteries

And if the sunlight goes away, as it
does every day, leakage back through the cell can discharge the battery.

Bzzzzt. Minor problem, not a concern unless you have massively
parallel arrays.

So the simple "chargers" I've seen where switches to disconnect the
battery when its voltage got too high, or there wasn't enough sunlight.

Bzzzt. All chargers are solid-state, PWM based.


If you want to be cost effective, you get a fancy charger that
transforms the load on the solar array to the maximum power point
to get the most bang for the buck.

Back on track again.


Mark Zenier Washington State resident

Obontopic: 14.325 USB hopping, a report of a tornado tearing through
Panama City -- Back Beach Road.



--
Eric F. Richards,
"Don't destroy the Earth! That's where I keep all of my stuff!"
- Squidd on www.fark.com

On Wed, 15 Sep 2004 01:38:02 GMT, m II
wrote:

Eric F. Richards wrote:

I'd tell you how to do it if you weren't such a hateful ****head. In
other words, you're on your own.

I'm hurt.

I hate seeing a country on the other side of the globe invaded and
destroyed for political and monetary gain by a bunch of corrupt, immoral
monsters.

There is NO evidence to support being there.

I'm sorry we disagree on that and I hope you can sleep with your conscience.

I must memorize this paralyzingly clear logic you use in
refutation to the prior posting.

Mark Zenier wrote:

Solar cells have a voltage vs. current curve that's roughly square.

|___ Open Circuit voltage
| ====____. maximum power point
V| \ \
| \ \ "Constant" Current
| \ \
| \ \
|---------------
I ^ available current depends on incident light

The no load voltage is determined by quantum physics and is roughly
constant. The current available is determined by the cell area and
the incident sunlight.

I laid out the panels on the lawn today. It was overcast and I had about
a forty five degree from the panel to the sun. I measured the short
circuit current at **1** amp. That's disgusting. The rated current in
specified light is roughly 4.5 amps per panel. I've paralleled them and
put the bypass diodes in. I also added a blocking diode in each one, as
I want to parallel a small toyish windmill laster on. Open circuit
voltage was a bit over 20 volts.

That 1 amp is troubling. I'll try again at noon tomorrow and pray it
improves.



In practical terms, if you don't put the cells in a situation where
they're outputting enough current to damage their internal wiring,
you can hook them up and they'll provide a roughly constant current for
charging a battery. You wouldn't want to use too high a voltage array,
as you could damage the battery. And if the sunlight goes away, as it
does every day, leakage back through the cell can discharge the battery.
So the simple "chargers" I've seen where switches to disconnect the
battery when its voltage got too high, or there wasn't enough sunlight.

Hopefully the blocking diode is of use.


If you want to be cost effective, you get a fancy charger that
transforms the load on the solar array to the maximum power point
to get the most bang for the buck.

I did a search for that when I saw your post. This one looks
straightforward. I'm wondering if the paralleled setup will work ok, or
if one of these is needed per panel..

http://www.solorb.com/elect/solarcirc/scc2/


This thing is getting interesting. I think I might have found a few 12
volt (six individual cells) fork lift batteries. If they're any good,
I'll be in photovoltaic paradise...



Mark Zenier Washington State resident


Thank you kindly



mike

Eric F. Richards wrote in message . ..
(Mark Zenier) wrote:


So anyone with a concern for truth and justice, (and a bit of a flippant
attitude) is hateful?

If his concern was about "truth and justice" AND he'd redirect his
postings to ANY politics group instead of flooding us with them here,
it would be a different story.

In my OPINION (note that I know when to use that word), his worldview
is colored by an unfortunate anti-US bias that a small but vocal
minority in Canada have. Were you here 'round 9/11/01? Remember
psycho-Jim, who was mad on 9/11 for two reasons? 1) not enough
Americans were killed and 2) he couldn't get any music on his radio
that day?

As for his point of view, I might share some of his views. But I
would never, ever consider him an objective observer.


Solar cells have a voltage vs. current curve that's roughly square.

|___ Open Circuit voltage
| ====____. maximum power point
V| \ \
| \ \ "Constant" Current
| \ \
| \ \
|---------------
I ^ available current depends on incident light

The no load voltage is determined by quantum physics and is roughly
constant. The current available is determined by the cell area and
the incident sunlight.

In practical terms, if you don't put the cells in a situation where
they're outputting enough current to damage their internal wiring,
you can hook them up and they'll provide a roughly constant current for
charging a battery. You wouldn't want to use too high a voltage array,
as you could damage the battery.

Bzzzzzt. You were doing fine up to there. Unless you are addressing
alkaline (Ni-Cd) batteries instead of Lead-acid batteries

And if the sunlight goes away, as it
does every day, leakage back through the cell can discharge the battery.

Bzzzzt. Minor problem, not a concern unless you have massively
parallel arrays.

So the simple "chargers" I've seen where switches to disconnect the
battery when its voltage got too high, or there wasn't enough sunlight.

Bzzzt. All chargers are solid-state, PWM based.


If you want to be cost effective, you get a fancy charger that
transforms the load on the solar array to the maximum power point
to get the most bang for the buck.

Back on track again.


Mark Zenier Washington State resident

Can I put the solar cells in my basement?

Mike Terry.










Obontopic: 14.325 USB hopping, a report of a tornado tearing through
Panama City -- Back Beach Road.

= = = ospam (Michael Bryant) wrote in message
= = = ...
From: Eric F. Richards

You have a fine country -- why don't you be proud of it
on its merits rather than puff yourself up by belittling others, in
one broad sweep, as if 300,000,000 people can be summed up by one
venom-laced sentence?

We have a fine country, here in the US, but there are plenty
of posters in this newsgroup that belittle about 150,000,000
citizens of this country everyday with their demeaning
generalizations. No rebuke of them, eh?

Why can you only see things in one direction ?
Ideology blinding your logic ?


MWB - Maybe 'EFR' is simply using your "Telescope" :o) ~ RHF
[ Speaking of someone having a case of "Tunnel Vision". ]
..
..
Michael Bryant, WA4009SWL
Louisville, KY
R75, S800, RX320, SW77, ICF2010K,
DX398, 7600G, 6800W, RF2200, 7600A,
Degen 1102, Degen 1103, GE SRll,
Pro-2006, Pro-2010, Pro-76
(remove "nospam" to reply)
..

"Mike Terry" wrote in message
om...
Can I put the solar cells in my basement?

Mike Terry.

Sure, right next to your non-existent radios.

In article ,
Eric F. Richards wrote:
(Mark Zenier) wrote:


So anyone with a concern for truth and justice, (and a bit of a flippant
attitude) is hateful?

If his concern was about "truth and justice" AND he'd redirect his
postings to ANY politics group instead of flooding us with them here,
it would be a different story.

In my OPINION (note that I know when to use that word), his worldview
is colored by an unfortunate anti-US bias that a small but vocal
minority in Canada have. Were you here 'round 9/11/01? Remember
psycho-Jim, who was mad on 9/11 for two reasons? 1) not enough
Americans were killed and 2) he couldn't get any music on his radio
that day?

As for his point of view, I might share some of his views. But I
would never, ever consider him an objective observer.


Solar cells have a voltage vs. current curve that's roughly square.

|___ Open Circuit voltage
| ====____. maximum power point
V| \ \
| \ \ "Constant" Current
| \ \
| \ \
|---------------
I ^ available current depends on incident light

The no load voltage is determined by quantum physics and is roughly
constant. The current available is determined by the cell area and
the incident sunlight.

In practical terms, if you don't put the cells in a situation where
they're outputting enough current to damage their internal wiring,
you can hook them up and they'll provide a roughly constant current for
charging a battery. You wouldn't want to use too high a voltage array,
as you could damage the battery.

Bzzzzzt. You were doing fine up to there. Unless you are addressing
alkaline (Ni-Cd) batteries instead of Lead-acid batteries

Er, alkaline batteries are primary cells usually, except for those doggy
Rayovac rechargeables. And why would anybody use Nicads or NiMH cells
on a stationary system? Too small, too expensive. For Mike, at
a max of 4.5 amps, a single marine deep discharge lead acid would
probably be good enough.

And if the sunlight goes away, as it
does every day, leakage back through the cell can discharge the battery.

Bzzzzt. Minor problem, not a concern unless you have massively
parallel arrays.

So the simple "chargers" I've seen where switches to disconnect the
battery when its voltage got too high, or there wasn't enough sunlight.

Bzzzt. All chargers are solid-state, PWM based.

Not if you build your own. (Or dig back and look at a few magazine
construction projects).

If you want to be cost effective, you get a fancy charger that
transforms the load on the solar array to the maximum power point
to get the most bang for the buck.

Back on track again.

And if you're just hacking around, you probably won't want to spend
the $$$ for one if it only gets you from 50 watts to 80 watts.

Mark Zenier Washington State resident

MnMikew schrieb:
"Mike Terry" wrote in message
om...

Can I put the solar cells in my basement?

Mike Terry.


Sure, right next to your non-existent radios.

For sure M.T. has more radio(s) than you have brain cells.....




:-)