Shill bidding?
 

Sure looks like it. What would the play be here?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...MEWA%3AIT&rd=1

I reckon I am too poor or too cheap (both) to bid.
cuhulin

"Unrevealed Source" wrote in message
...
Sure looks like it. What would the play be here?

This one does not smell like a "shill-bid setup" to me.
More like a feeding frenzy as the R-1000 was not a
common radio (low production numbers) and the one
shown looks to be in near-mint and well kept.

Like most e-bay ham and related auctions
the price is way overblown. The most I would pay
for an Kenwood R-1000 would be $250 in mint
shape or $165.00 worn and well used.

Again, this don't look like a shill-bid situation.
The clear tipoff to a classic ham radio dealer
shill-auction is bids where 30% or more of
the total bids are "Undisclosed Bidders" on
the Bid History.

I would not touch ANY e-Bay auction that has 'undisclosed' bids
at any time with a 20' Lineman's Hotstick pole in rubber gloves.
Anyone who does is asking to be taken as such are RAMPANT
in the Ham Radio categories on e-Bay and are exclusively run
by ex-hamfest dealers who will steal you blind in a heartbeat.

Unrevealed Source wrote:
Sure looks like it. What would the play be here?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...MEWA%3AIT&rd=1

Several low/no feedback bidders are suspicious to me.

I wouldn't touch it with a million mile long pole.
cuhulin

Unrevealed Source wrote:
Sure looks like it. What would the play be here?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...MEWA%3AIT&rd=1

A few weeks ago they were going for around $200-$250, when a few were
up for auction at any given time. Then a week and a half went by with
none available, followed by two in excellent condition (this one being
practically new-look at the color of the pushbuttons). For a collector
of pristine equipment, I can see it. Not for anyone else.

For a collector, I could see $300, or MAYBE even $400. These two brand-new
ebay members have bid this up to over $500! No way this is real, or at
least these are not bids by people that know anything about the used radio
market.


wrote in message
oups.com...

Unrevealed Source wrote:
Sure looks like it. What would the play be here?


http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...MEWA%3AIT&rd=1

A few weeks ago they were going for around $200-$250, when a few were
up for auction at any given time. Then a week and a half went by with
none available, followed by two in excellent condition (this one being
practically new-look at the color of the pushbuttons). For a collector
of pristine equipment, I can see it. Not for anyone else.

In article .com,
"John S." wrote:

Unrevealed Source wrote:
Sure looks like it. What would the play be here?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...=1&sspage nam
e=STRK%3AMEWA%3AIT&rd=1

Several low/no feedback bidders are suspicious to me.

I don't like the fact that one bidder has moved the price from $301 to
$510 by himself. This looks fishy.

--
Telamon
Ventura, California

Unrevealed Source wrote:

For a collector, I could see $300, or MAYBE even $400. These two brand-new
ebay members have bid this up to over $500! No way this is real, or at
least these are not bids by people that know anything about the used radio
market.

I just love it when someone sees shill bidding around every corner, under every rock and behind every
tree.

dxAce
Michigan
USA

http://www.iserv.net/~n8kdv/dxpage.htm

Telamon wrote:

In article .com,
"John S." wrote:

Unrevealed Source wrote:
Sure looks like it. What would the play be here?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...=1&sspage nam
e=STRK%3AMEWA%3AIT&rd=1

Several low/no feedback bidders are suspicious to me.

I don't like the fact that one bidder has moved the price from $301 to
$510 by himself. This looks fishy.

Not hard to do. You'd have to read up on how the bidding process works.

dxAce
Michigan
USA

In article ,
dxAce wrote:

Telamon wrote:

In article .com,
"John S." wrote:

Unrevealed Source wrote:
Sure looks like it. What would the play be here?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...358&rd=1&sspag
enam
e=STRK%3AMEWA%3AIT&rd=1

Several low/no feedback bidders are suspicious to me.

I don't like the fact that one bidder has moved the price from $301 to
$510 by himself. This looks fishy.

Not hard to do. You'd have to read up on how the bidding process works.

Well yeah I can understand how it can happen. A person just keeps
putting in another bid but why? I can only speculate as to the reason.
Maybe the guy is doing this to off put other bidders but it does not
look right to me because he has nearly doubled the price and established
a bidding trend. Based on what he has done I can predict his next bid.

--
Telamon
Ventura, California

$510 and no photo with the frequency display on? I would want to see it for
that kind of money.....



"dxAce" wrote in message
...


Unrevealed Source wrote:

For a collector, I could see $300, or MAYBE even $400. These two
brand-new
ebay members have bid this up to over $500! No way this is real, or at
least these are not bids by people that know anything about the used
radio
market.

I just love it when someone sees shill bidding around every corner, under
every rock and behind every
tree.

dxAce
Michigan
USA

http://www.iserv.net/~n8kdv/dxpage.htm

I believe the play here is that the shills bid it up, then the seller
contacts the next-highest bidder and offers to sell it off eBay (since the
high bidder "backed out"), for that seller's high bid. That way, there is
no PayPal buyer protection or negative feedback that can be left.


"Frank Bals" wrote in message
...
$510 and no photo with the frequency display on? I would want to see it
for
that kind of money.....



"dxAce" wrote in message
...


Unrevealed Source wrote:

For a collector, I could see $300, or MAYBE even $400. These two
brand-new
ebay members have bid this up to over $500! No way this is real, or at
least these are not bids by people that know anything about the used
radio
market.

I just love it when someone sees shill bidding around every corner,
under
every rock and behind every
tree.

dxAce
Michigan
USA

http://www.iserv.net/~n8kdv/dxpage.htm

"John S." wrote in message
oups.com...

Unrevealed Source wrote:
Sure looks like it. What would the play be here?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...MEWA%3AIT&rd=1

Several low/no feedback bidders are suspicious to me.


Right John

This one guy guy just joined Aug.4th. Now he could have just joined for this
auction. The thing is, even though it looks like shill bidding at first
glance, I doubt it is. If this is a shill bidder, he went haywire and lost
all control! No one is going to outbid this guy and pay so much for a
R-1000. I know some collectors will but I doubt this guy is a collector.

But, yes, sometimes I'm amazed at the prices some of these older radios go
for.
But you know what? At this point in my life I can understand it now. Life is
short and may get even shorter with the way this world is politically.
Anything could go down and who knows what.

So, if paying 5 or 6 bills for this radio is going to bring happiness and
joy into this guys life, it's worth it to him and that's that.

Lucky

"Frank Bals" wrote in message
...
$510 and no photo with the frequency display on? I would want to see it
for that kind of money.....



"dxAce" wrote in message
...


Unrevealed Source wrote:

For a collector, I could see $300, or MAYBE even $400. These two
brand-new
ebay members have bid this up to over $500! No way this is real, or at
least these are not bids by people that know anything about the used
radio
market.

I just love it when someone sees shill bidding around every corner, under
every rock and behind every
tree.

dxAce
Michigan
USA

http://www.iserv.net/~n8kdv/dxpage.htm





I never, ever, ever will pay a radio off someone unless they take Paypal for
credit cards or just credit cards alone. If the person is honest, and knows
he has a good working radio, and he sees you have good feedback too, there
is NO reason he would be scared to take a CC.

It protects all parties except a scam artist.
Me like a dummy was so tempted by a new Lowe HF-250 last week, I was ready
to send off cash to some guy in Germany for it. Yes he had great feedback,
but as much as I wanted the rig, and even watched acution to completion, I
never bid on it.

So if they don't take a credit cards, and the radio is over $80, then no go.

Lucky

A few weeks ago,I wanted to buy something from www.geeks.com
geeks.com doesn't have a toll free phone number (if they have one
now,they didn't have one a few weeks ago and I will not waste my time to
check out their website again) and they only had a few of the items in
stock.So I emailed geeks.com about the item I wanted to buy.I never did
get an email reply from geeks.com Any company like that,that doesn't at
least have a toll free phone number is not worth dong business with,in
my opinion.I understand all the jazz about toll free phone numbers and
perhaps geeks.com can't have somebody sitting around there to pick up
the phone to reply to a toll free phone call,but if they can reply to a
local or long distance non toll free phone call,they can certainly reply
to a toll free phone call,it doesn't cost all that much money to have a
toll free phone number.geeks.com lost a sale of about $85.00 to me.
cuhulin

What is it called if somebody puts something (a radio,for instance) on
ebay and starts a bidding price and then he or she uses a different name
at a different computer with a different IP address? To keep driving up
the price more than the item or items are worth.Does that sort of thing
happen much on ebay? Frankly,I dont like auctions at all.
cuhulin

I might be incorrect, but it looks like the guy bid against himself. It
seems this might be his first time bidding in an auction on EBay.

He obviously has his heart set on getting this radio!

Lee

"Lee Smith" wrote in message
...
I might be incorrect, but it looks like the guy bid against himself. It
seems this might be his first time bidding in an auction on EBay.

He obviously has his heart set on getting this radio!

Can't bid against yourself. (unless you're using two accounts). You can
keep raising your bid, but the bid that shows is only the one that beats the
last bid of the other bidder.

What I suspect is happening is that the other bidder (whom he topped with
his last bid) was 'feeling' for his high bid to try to get the bid as
cheaply as he could. I've done this myself (usually unsuccessfully).

"Unrevealed Source" wrote in message
...
I believe the play here is that the shills bid it up, then the seller
contacts the next-highest bidder and offers to sell it off eBay (since the
high bidder "backed out"), for that seller's high bid. That way, there
is
no PayPal buyer protection or negative feedback that can be left.


"Frank Bals" wrote in message
...
$510 and no photo with the frequency display on? I would want to see it
for
that kind of money.....



"dxAce" wrote in message
...


Unrevealed Source wrote:

For a collector, I could see $300, or MAYBE even $400. These two
brand-new
ebay members have bid this up to over $500! No way this is real, or
at
least these are not bids by people that know anything about the used
radio
market.

I just love it when someone sees shill bidding around every corner,
under
every rock and behind every
tree.

dxAce
Michigan
USA

http://www.iserv.net/~n8kdv/dxpage.htm







I didn't think of that. Very astute on your part and I think it would work
rather well if the other person goes for it. I wouldn't . I want some sort
of protection at those prices.

Lucky

Unrevealed Source wrote:
I believe the play here is that the shills bid it up, then the seller
contacts the next-highest bidder and offers to sell it off eBay (since the
high bidder "backed out"), for that seller's high bid. That way, there is
no PayPal buyer protection or negative feedback that can be left.


And one other possibility is that seller is enforcing a reserve without
having to pay Ebay fees. Seen that many times.

Lucky wrote:
"Unrevealed Source" wrote in message
...

I believe the play here is that the shills bid it up, then the
seller contacts the next-highest bidder and offers to sell it off
eBay (since the high bidder "backed out"), for that seller's high
bid. That way, there is no PayPal buyer protection or negative
feedback that can be left.

I don't believe that the above is true... The name of the "next-highest
bidder" came from eBay and eBay calls this type of transaction a "second
chance" offer, with all the rights, privileges and protection that that
the highest bidder has. Also, the price in this case is what the
*second* highest bidder offered, not the first highest. However, if
someone does offer you something "off eBay", watch out!
73,
Carter

John S. wrote:

I believe the second bidders bid becomes recognized by Ebay only if the
seller cancels the high bid.

Partially correct--but there's more than just "canceling": could be he
is a deadbeat bidder who won't/can't pay, is an actual shill who had no
intention of paying, says he bid wrong item (or wrong amount), dies
before he can send the payment, buyer's regret...there are no end of
real (or bogus) reasons that would allow the second highest bidder to
kick in...

Carter-K8VT wrote:
John S. wrote:

I believe the second bidders bid becomes recognized by Ebay only if the
seller cancels the high bid.

Partially correct--but there's more than just "canceling": could be he
is a deadbeat bidder who won't/can't pay, is an actual shill who had no
intention of paying, says he bid wrong item (or wrong amount), dies
before he can send the payment, buyer's regret...there are no end of
real (or bogus) reasons that would allow the second highest bidder to
kick in...

The original point being that to get Ebay to recognize the second bid
and to obtain whatever protection Ebay offers the seller would have to
go through the steps of cancelling the sale.

The second-highest bidder never just "kicks in". If the seller wishes to
offer it formally through eBay to the next-highest bidder, he can send a
Second Chance offer, which the buyer may choose to accept or decline.

However, the seller/scammer may also take his new list of potential buyers
and offer the item to one or all of them privately, giving a story about
deadbeat bidder, the guy died, whatever. The mark thinks he has lucked out
and sends his money, but receives something that is far different than what
was listed (in this case, perhaps, a totally non-working radio). Since the
deal went down outside of eBay, the seller is stuck with no recourse; no
PayPal Buyer Protection, or opportunity to even leave negative feedback.
It's an old trick.

In any case, since this R-1000 closed at $610, something fishy definitely
went down. These are great radios (I have one myself) but they aren't very
rare and certainly aren't worth that kind of money. It could be simply
seller's remorse. Decided he didn't want to sell it after all but already
had bids, so just had his buddies bid it up and out.



"Carter-K8VT" wrote in message
. ..
John S. wrote:

I believe the second bidders bid becomes recognized by Ebay only if the
seller cancels the high bid.

Partially correct--but there's more than just "canceling": could be he
is a deadbeat bidder who won't/can't pay, is an actual shill who had no
intention of paying, says he bid wrong item (or wrong amount), dies
before he can send the payment, buyer's regret...there are no end of
real (or bogus) reasons that would allow the second highest bidder to
kick in...