On 29 Jan 2004 00:03:45 GMT, (Tdonaly) wrote:


|
|O.k., so he is writing about a moment method analysis. I hope Yuri and
|Cecil read this along with your results, Wes. Cecil can't possibly argue
|with this... I take that back, Cecil could argue with the Devil about how
|hot hell should be, so maybe this won't stop him after all.

Hi Tom,

Cecil and Yuri have been uncharacteristically silent, at least about
this thread since I started it. Frankly I expected some flak.

Regards,

Wes

Cecil and Yuri have been uncharacteristically silent, at least about
this thread since I started it. Frankly I expected some flak.

Regards,

Wes



Howdy anteneers,
I have been characteristically absent from the freezing NE, enjoying Bahama
Mammas near Nassau, shaking off cold or flu, operating as C6AYB in CQ 160m
contest (beat world Low Power world record) with IC706 and piece of wire in the
form of Half Sloper from the balcony down to a palm tree and getting some badly
needed tan for my sickly pale complexion. Sorry for missing some of the coil
battles.

As far as flak, I glanced over the mentioned paper and deducted that relates to
some calculated "facts" rather than measured. So far I have concluded that we
have reached point of (dis)agreement between two sides, and as I mentioned,
there is not much point in arguing. W8JI tried to prove his "truth," only to
measure differences in coil current (not showing details about the setup) and
while insisting he is right, proving that he is wrong. As I mentioned, weather
permitting, I will do more measurements, describe them in an article. In the
mean time, if anyone else made the measurements, please describe them along
with the description of setup (length of radiator parts, placements of coil,
frequencies, etc.) Otherwise, you have to patient until I get around doing it,
I have life and priorities outside of NG.

I started reading Marc Seifer book "Wizard" - The life and times of Nikola
Tesla, fascinating insight and chronology of this greatest engineering genius
and the hurdles he had to overcome from the flat earth society.

73 Yuri, K3BU

Wes Stewart wrote:
Cecil and Yuri have been uncharacteristically silent, at least about
this thread since I started it. Frankly I expected some flak.

I haven't been paying attention. What's the bottom line? Another
software package that assumes current travels through a coil at
faster than the speed of light?
--
73, Cecil http://www.qsl.net/w5dxp



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Cecil wrote,

Wes Stewart wrote:
Cecil and Yuri have been uncharacteristically silent, at least about
this thread since I started it. Frankly I expected some flak.

I haven't been paying attention. What's the bottom line? Another
software package that assumes current travels through a coil at
faster than the speed of light?
--
73, Cecil http://www.qsl.net/w5dxp


How fast does light travel in copper, Cecil?
73,
Tom Donaly, KA6RUH

Tdonaly wrote:
How fast does light travel in copper, Cecil?

Slower than air so the current into and out of a coil cannot
possibly be identical. It takes ~1 nS for light to travel
one foot through air. How on earth can it possibly travel
faster than that through a one foot long copper coil? You
guys are worshiping a religion completely divorced from
scientific fact.
--
73, Cecil http://www.qsl.net/w5dxp



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Cecil wrote,

Tdonaly wrote:
How fast does light travel in copper, Cecil?

Slower than air so the current into and out of a coil cannot
possibly be identical. It takes ~1 nS for light to travel
one foot through air. How on earth can it possibly travel
faster than that through a one foot long copper coil? You
guys are worshiping a religion completely divorced from
scientific fact.
--
73, Cecil http://www.qsl.net/w5dxp



O.k., Cecil, let's suppose you're right. Since there's more
current going into a coil than coming out, then the coil must be
storing charge, somewhere. Charge is conserved, Cecil. You
can't create it or destroy it. If the coil is storing charge somewhere
it must be acting like a capacitor, which is famous for doing just
that. Where does the coil store its charge?
73,
Tom Donaly, KA6RUH

Tdonaly wrote:

SNIP


O.k., Cecil, let's suppose you're right. Since there's more
current going into a coil than coming out, then the coil must be
storing charge, somewhere. Charge is conserved, Cecil. You
can't create it or destroy it. If the coil is storing charge somewhere
it must be acting like a capacitor, which is famous for doing just
that. Where does the coil store its charge?
73,
Tom Donaly, KA6RUH


Two possibilities exist: 1) Charge is stored in the interwinding
capacitance; or, 2) EM radiation is occurring in the coil i.e. the
winding length is a significant portion of a wavelength!!

What's your Physics say?

Dave Shrader wrote:
Two possibilities exist: 1) Charge is stored in the interwinding
capacitance; or, 2) EM radiation is occurring in the coil i.e. the
winding length is a significant portion of a wavelength!!

What's your Physics say?

Don't know about Tom's physics, but mine says the net current in an
unterminated transmission line can be zero at one point and 100 amps
1/4 WL away. Tom (apparently) thinks that is a violation of the
conservation of charge principle.
--
73, Cecil http://www.qsl.net/w5dxp



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Dave wrote,

Tdonaly wrote:

SNIP


O.k., Cecil, let's suppose you're right. Since there's more
current going into a coil than coming out, then the coil must be
storing charge, somewhere. Charge is conserved, Cecil. You
can't create it or destroy it. If the coil is storing charge somewhere
it must be acting like a capacitor, which is famous for doing just
that. Where does the coil store its charge?
73,
Tom Donaly, KA6RUH


Two possibilities exist: 1) Charge is stored in the interwinding
capacitance; or, 2) EM radiation is occurring in the coil i.e. the
winding length is a significant portion of a wavelength!!

What's your Physics say?


It says you can radiate energy, but radiating charge is another
proposition. Also, charge has to be stored on the surface of
the conductor, not in it's own field. Energy can be stored there,
though.
73,
Tom Donaly, KA6RUH

Tdonaly wrote:
O.k., Cecil, let's suppose you're right. Since there's more
current going into a coil than coming out, then the coil must be
storing charge, somewhere.

Tom, Tom, Tom, we are talking about *net* current. The net current
in an unterminated transmission line can be zero while 1/4WL away,
it is 100 amps. Are you asserting that transmission lines don't
conserve charge? Would you please put your brain in gear?
--
73, Cecil http://www.qsl.net/w5dxp



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