art wrote:

Look at Edisons' invention, the light bulb.

It makes a much better heater than a light source (only a few percent of
the energy consumed is given off as usable light!)

Besides, perhaps next they will find out that the rf power can be
reduced a hundrend-fold if the proper catalyst is used. Perhaps
attacking the hydrogen/oxygen bond on multi-levels will finally be found
to be feasible ...

I have never seen in any book ANY speculation that rf could break
hydrogen/oxygen bonds--only that microwaves could boil water! That in
itself seems a major break through that the brain dead have glossed over
in their claim of "it won't work!" Besides all that, it appears to me
that the bond is being broken well below the boiling point of the salt
water--seems like sodium chloride is already working as some sort of
catalyst--let's all hope a magnitudes better catalyst is found!

JS

John Smith I wrote:

In the above:


.... and it is difficult to draw a line between BIG MONEY (oil, drug
companies, military contractors, etc.) and gov't.

Should have been:

.... and it is difficult to draw a line between BIG MONEY (oil, drug
companies, military contractors, etc.), gov't AND THE NEWS.

JS

"John Smith I" wrote in message
...
art wrote:

Look at Edisons' invention, the light bulb.

It makes a much better heater than a light source (only a few percent of
the energy consumed is given off as usable light!)

Besides, perhaps next they will find out that the rf power can be
reduced a hundrend-fold if the proper catalyst is used. Perhaps
attacking the hydrogen/oxygen bond on multi-levels will finally be found
to be feasible ...

I have never seen in any book ANY speculation that rf could break
hydrogen/oxygen bonds--only that microwaves could boil water! That in
itself seems a major break through that the brain dead have glossed over
in their claim of "it won't work!" Besides all that, it appears to me
that the bond is being broken well below the boiling point of the salt
water--seems like sodium chloride is already working as some sort of
catalyst--let's all hope a magnitudes better catalyst is found!

JS

John

Commercial microwave ovens have always worked on the principle of heating
water by being tuned to the vibrational frequency of water molecules. It
seems obvious that if sufficiently focused, the microwave energy would cause
spontaneous decomposition of the water molecules into their constituent
oxygen and hydrogen molecules. The addition of sodium chloride, or any salt,
to the water can act as a catalyst by causing energy to become more tightly
focused or by 'tuning' the molecules to become more susceptable to the
microwave frequency(ies) involved. Sugared drinks heat more quickly than
plain water in a microwave oven. While this may reduce the energy input
requirements, there is no possibility of recovering a greater amount of
energy than was input to initiate the reaction. This sounds like another
version of the cold fusion debate, albeit not so cold.

There is no magic here. A kilowatt of energy focused into an area of less
than a tenth of a cubic millimetre will instantaneously disassociate
virtually any substance known to science.

A commercial fusion reactor is currently being built in France. It will cost
billions of dollars to complete, but when it becomes operational there will
be a surplus of energy generated. That is our future and the future of
energy production. A jar full of salty water will never power the average
home or car unless it is surrounding several pounds of Plutonium. :-)

Mike G0ULI

Mike Kaliski wrote:
A jar full of salty water will never power the average
home or car unless it is surrounding several pounds of Plutonium. :-)

Can you prove that "never" assertion? :-)
--
73, Cecil http://www.w5dxp.com

Mike Kaliski wrote:


Commercial microwave ovens have always worked on the principle of heating
water by being tuned to the vibrational frequency of water molecules.


Hmmm. The first resonant peak of the
water molecule is around 1THz, while at
the microwave operating frequency of
2.45GHz there are no resonances of the
water molecule.

The 2.45GHz frequency has no particular
connection to the resonant frequencies
of candidate food molecules.

Chuck

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Mike Kaliski wrote:

...

It would be interesting to know what freq was being used in the video ...

If it were microwave, I wouldn't think that guy would be keeping his
vision too much longer. A KW (heck, even a hundred watts or less over
time!) turned into the room would be working on his cataracts, BIG TIME!

JS

John Smith I wrote:
Mike Kaliski wrote:

...

It would be interesting to know what freq was being used in the video ...

If it were microwave, I wouldn't think that guy would be keeping his
vision too much longer. A KW (heck, even a hundred watts or less over
time!) turned into the room would be working on his cataracts, BIG TIME!

JS

Amazing it takes so much to get me motivated ...

I have a 2.5 KW lab microwave bought at auction in the garage. Just
walked out, wiped an inch of dust off it, plugged it in and placed a cup
of super saturated salt water in and turned it on. Boiled the water is
under 15 seconds--NO RELEASE OF HYDROGEN!

1) It appears that phenomenon is freq dependent!

2) Or, is the whole video a sham?

There is more to that video than I at first thought ...

JS

"John Smith I" wrote in message
...
John Smith I wrote:
Mike Kaliski wrote:

...

It would be interesting to know what freq was being used in the video ...

If it were microwave, I wouldn't think that guy would be keeping his
vision too much longer. A KW (heck, even a hundred watts or less over
time!) turned into the room would be working on his cataracts, BIG TIME!

JS

Amazing it takes so much to get me motivated ...

I have a 2.5 KW lab microwave bought at auction in the garage. Just
walked out, wiped an inch of dust off it, plugged it in and placed a cup
of super saturated salt water in and turned it on. Boiled the water is
under 15 seconds--NO RELEASE OF HYDROGEN!

1) It appears that phenomenon is freq dependent!

2) Or, is the whole video a sham?

There is more to that video than I at first thought ...

JS

He didnt say the flame was caused by hydrogen, ratheris was a chemist
friend. How much BS have you heard start out as I dont know but I have this
friend........

Jimmie

There's one thing we can count on, for sure, no question, no doubt:
Whatever magical catalyst is found, whatever wonderful principle is
discovered, whatever bonds are broken. . .

It will require more energy to turn the water into hydrogen and oxygen
than you'll get back when the hydrogen and oxygen are recombined. By any
method -- burning, in a fuel cell, whatever.

You can take that to the bank. Anyone claiming otherwise is ignorant,
delusional, a charlatan, or some combination of those. Anyone believing
it is sadly lacking in the most basic of science education.

Roy Lewallen, W7EL

Mike Kaliski wrote:
"John Smith I" wrote in message
...
art wrote:

Look at Edisons' invention, the light bulb.

It makes a much better heater than a light source (only a few percent of
the energy consumed is given off as usable light!)

Besides, perhaps next they will find out that the rf power can be
reduced a hundrend-fold if the proper catalyst is used. Perhaps
attacking the hydrogen/oxygen bond on multi-levels will finally be found
to be feasible ...

I have never seen in any book ANY speculation that rf could break
hydrogen/oxygen bonds--only that microwaves could boil water! That in
itself seems a major break through that the brain dead have glossed over
in their claim of "it won't work!" Besides all that, it appears to me
that the bond is being broken well below the boiling point of the salt
water--seems like sodium chloride is already working as some sort of
catalyst--let's all hope a magnitudes better catalyst is found!

JS

John

Commercial microwave ovens have always worked on the principle of heating
water by being tuned to the vibrational frequency of water molecules. It
seems obvious that if sufficiently focused, the microwave energy would cause
spontaneous decomposition of the water molecules into their constituent
oxygen and hydrogen molecules. The addition of sodium chloride, or any salt,
to the water can act as a catalyst by causing energy to become more tightly
focused or by 'tuning' the molecules to become more susceptable to the
microwave frequency(ies) involved. Sugared drinks heat more quickly than
plain water in a microwave oven. While this may reduce the energy input
requirements, there is no possibility of recovering a greater amount of
energy than was input to initiate the reaction. This sounds like another
version of the cold fusion debate, albeit not so cold.

There is no magic here. A kilowatt of energy focused into an area of less
than a tenth of a cubic millimetre will instantaneously disassociate
virtually any substance known to science.

A commercial fusion reactor is currently being built in France. It will cost
billions of dollars to complete, but when it becomes operational there will
be a surplus of energy generated. That is our future and the future of
energy production. A jar full of salty water will never power the average
home or car unless it is surrounding several pounds of Plutonium. :-)

Mike G0ULI

Roy Lewallen wrote:

...

I'd say there were two possibilities the

1) It ain't happened yet--so it never will.

2) It ain't happened yet--because we don't yet know enough.

Frankly, I think those coming up with new ideas will subscribe to the
second ...

I do know that manganese dioxide can act as a catalyst in different
situations as to seem "magical." (i.e. over come bonds at lower energy
levels.)

Regards,
JS