Lostgallifreyan wrote:
Richard Clark wrote in
:

On Sat, 05 Dec 2009 02:44:40 -0600, Lostgallifreyan
wrote:

Richard Clark wrote in
news
The principal player
endeavoured to behave as though under the illusion that he was alone
in his glory, but he failed.

Interesting. A very different Art comes to mind he Arthur Daley. Fits
like the proverbial.
I am not familiar with Arthur Daley, but your close editing has very
much converged on the psychology of this side-topic. We have with us
now a late-coming ankle bighter kinetically trying to compete for that
humorous wig.


Daley's great, well worth trying to see. (Minder, TV shows circa 1979 or so).
The books aren't high literature but they are good (written by Anthony
Masters) and do offer something beyond the shows, and they stand some repeat
reading too. I think Wodehouse is better and funnier, but Minder really has
its perks. Cheerful Charlie Chisolm, for example... Best detective since
Clouseau.

However, that aside and in fitting to the context of the group, I
offered a link to an equally old reference of Bellini and Tosi that
should be very interesting to you, as a SWLer. If you revisit that
reference, then take note of the goniometer where its receive
application would allow you to perform your own crude beam steering
using two orthogonal long wire antennas (or crossed dipoles).

73's
Richard Clark, KB7QHC


Yes, I ought to have said, that IS interesting to me. I've often wondered
about direction finding so I earmarked it on the strength of that for a full
read soon. (Didn't have time today..)

This discussion has significantly diverged from allowable r.r.a.a
specifications. This non-group discussion is almost certainly
disturbing others within this group since many are very sensitive and
can't use the delete key. Please discontinue further discussions using
this mode.

Thank you.

On Dec 5, 7:14*pm, tom wrote:
*This non-group discussion is almost certainly
disturbing others within this group since many are very sensitive and
can't use the delete key. *Please discontinue further discussions using
this mode.

Thank you.

I suspect Art is about to have a litter of kittens.. :/

wrote:
On Dec 5, 7:14 pm, tom wrote:
This non-group discussion is almost certainly
disturbing others within this group since many are very sensitive and
can't use the delete key. Please discontinue further discussions using
this mode.

Thank you.

I suspect Art is about to have a litter of kittens.. :/



Art probably doesn't care a rat's rear end for anyone but Art. And I'm
not sure he even cares or know about himself. He is a total nutjob
after all.

tom
K0TAR

On Dec 6, 1:14*am, tom wrote:
Lostgallifreyan wrote:
Richard Clark wrote in
:

On Sat, 05 Dec 2009 02:44:40 -0600, Lostgallifreyan
wrote:

Richard Clark wrote in
news

The principal player
endeavoured to behave as though under the illusion that he was alone
in his glory, but he failed.

Interesting. A very different Art comes to mind he Arthur Daley. Fits
like the proverbial.
I am not familiar with Arthur Daley, but your close editing has very
much converged on the psychology of this side-topic. *We have with us
now a late-coming ankle bighter kinetically trying to compete for that
humorous wig.

Daley's great, well worth trying to see. (Minder, TV shows circa 1979 or so).
The books aren't high literature but they are good (written by Anthony
Masters) and do offer something beyond the shows, and they stand some repeat
reading too. I think Wodehouse is better and funnier, but Minder really has
its perks. Cheerful Charlie Chisolm, for example... Best detective since
Clouseau.

However, that aside and in fitting to the context of the group, I
offered a link to an equally old reference of Bellini and Tosi that
should be very interesting to you, as a SWLer. *If you revisit that
reference, then take note of the goniometer where its receive
application would allow you to perform your own crude beam steering
using two orthogonal long wire antennas (or crossed dipoles).

73's
Richard Clark, KB7QHC

Yes, I ought to have said, that IS interesting to me. I've often wondered
about direction finding so I earmarked it on the strength of that for a full
read soon. (Didn't have time today..)

This discussion has significantly diverged from allowable r.r.a.a
specifications. *This non-group discussion is almost certainly
disturbing others within this group since many are very sensitive and
can't use the delete key. *Please discontinue further discussions using
this mode.

Thank you.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

at least it is a civil discourse and the material is at least well
grounded in basic facts as opposed to the way the thread started.

On Dec 3, 9:10*pm, tom wrote:
Art Unwin wrote:
Of course one can go back to the basics of mathematics way back in
Arabic times where
the mere presence of an equal sign denotes equilibrium or balance. The
equal sign is part of Maxwells equations so equilibrium is in effect.

"the mere presence of an equal sign denotes equilibrium or balance"

So sayeth the master of the physical universe - Art Unwin...

Hmmm, so if there is an equal sign, it means it's in equilibrium.

So a half wave antenna = 468/f(Mhz).

It is therefore in equilibrium.

tom
K0TAR

The book what you read lied to you!
When you look at a sinosoidal curve the area above and below the datum
line is never equal ! If it were you have invented perpetual motion.
Power is continually being injected to make up for frictional
losses incurred. After a full cycle you get to what is a repeatable
point termed as a period where you have adjusted the energy contained
to equal that of the beginning. With the areas not being equal because
of frictional losses the curve crosses the datum line at a point not
at the half way point of a period. This point is resistive, where as.
if you put it next to the true half way point you would see that the
points were not one and the same. This sequence of events is that of a
"tank circuit"
which you would learn about if you went to college!
Resonance is the point where the curve is totally resistive only and
it does not represent a point of equilibrium. A period or a FW point
is also totally resistive and in a state of equilibrium, a point of
repeatablity which the half wave point does not
When dealing with the laws of Maxwell, which includes an equal sign,
metrics used are only those that represent equilibrium which, in the
case of radiation requires multiples of a full wave (FW) where the use
of the half wave would nullify the equal sign and the whole equation
No where does Maxwell's equations suggests a particular shape or
elevation or even straght when describing a radiator, only that it is
at a state of equilibrium. Thus a radiator can conform to Maxwell's
equations when totally compressed to a point source which certanly
would not require a reflector representing a straight length of the
magnitude you have stated.
Note also that Maxwells equations refer to distributed loads only and
not lumped loads which, if present, MUST therefore be canceled.
Art Unwin KB9MZ....xg (uk)
Hopefully you are now back on track with respect to the science of
radiation.

On Dec 6, 4:49*pm, Art Unwin wrote:
On Dec 3, 9:10*pm, tom wrote:





Art Unwin wrote:
Of course one can go back to the basics of mathematics way back in
Arabic times where
the mere presence of an equal sign denotes equilibrium or balance. The
equal sign is part of Maxwells equations so equilibrium is in effect.

"the mere presence of an equal sign denotes equilibrium or balance"

So sayeth the master of the physical universe - Art Unwin...

Hmmm, so if there is an equal sign, it means it's in equilibrium.

So a half wave antenna = 468/f(Mhz).

It is therefore in equilibrium.

tom
K0TAR

The book what you read lied to you!
When you look at a sinosoidal curve the area above and below the datum
line is never equal ! If it were you have invented perpetual motion.
Power is continually being injected to make up for frictional
losses incurred. After a full cycle you get to what is a repeatable
point termed as a period where you have adjusted the energy contained
to equal that of the beginning. With the areas not being equal because
of frictional losses the curve crosses the datum line at a point not
at the half way point of a period. This point is resistive, where as.
if you put it next to the true half way point you would see that the
points were not one and the same. This sequence of events is that of a
"tank circuit"
which you would learn about if you went to college!
Resonance is the point where the curve is totally resistive only and
it does not represent a point of equilibrium. A period or a FW point
is also totally resistive and *in a state of equilibrium, a point of
repeatablity which the half wave point does not
When dealing with the laws of Maxwell, which includes an equal sign,
metrics used are only those that represent equilibrium which, in the
case of radiation requires multiples of a full wave (FW) where the use
of the half wave would nullify the equal sign and *the whole equation
No where does Maxwell's equations suggests a particular shape or
elevation or even straght when describing a radiator, only that it is
at a state of equilibrium. Thus a radiator can conform to Maxwell's
equations when totally compressed to a point source which certanly
would not require a reflector representing a straight *length of the
magnitude you have stated.
Note also that Maxwells equations refer to distributed loads only and
not lumped loads which, if present, MUST therefore be canceled.
Art Unwin KB9MZ....xg (uk)
Hopefully you are now back on track with respect to the science of
radiation.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

rotflmao

On Sun, 6 Dec 2009 some gomer wrote:

No where does Maxwell's equations suggests a particular shape or
elevation or even straght when describing a radiator

Hmmmm,

Did Maxwell design antennas? Did he describe them? If he had no
particular shape in mind, did that mean it was a mesh like a fish net
cast over the rocks? Did he try working the international space
station with this limp radiator powered by the feeble force?

WWMD?

73's
Richard Clark, KB7QHC

On Dec 6, 1:10*pm, Richard Clark wrote:
On Sun, 6 Dec 2009 some gomer wrote:

No where does Maxwell's equations suggests a particular shape or
elevation or even straght when describing a radiator

Hmmmm,

Did Maxwell design antennas? *Did he describe them? *If he had no
particular shape in mind, did that mean it was a mesh like a fish net
cast over the rocks? *Did he try working the international space
station with this limp radiator powered by the feeble force?

WWMD?

73's
Richard Clark, KB7QHC

Maxwell dealt only with the mathematics of the time where many people
had arrived at equations with respect to scientific observations.
Many of these equations from different countries were actually
duplicates so he was able to side line some. reduce some and even
combined some such that he has a set of equations. Ofcourse he was
aware that with observations within the Universe one must obey the
requirement of equilibrium. You can do this by placing all metrics on
one side of the equal or equal ibrium side and zero ion the other
side.
One of his final equations did not, in fact, equal zero and in fact
the metric of time was missing among other things. Now he couldn't go
back to Gauss or anybody for an explanation. If he had spoken to Gauss
he may have told him that if he made a static field dynamic he could
correct the initial equations provided as the product was one and the
same! Instead Maxwell concerned himself only with the metrics of the
equations and not the scale. So he cancelled the metrics that were
available and then added some metrics so he could cancel what was
remaining which implied equil ibrium noy knowing what the additions
added signified. At that time he could not have cared less as he
primarily a mathematician.
When Yagi and Uda came along they stumbled on intercoupling of planar
forms with out any regard to Maxwells equations. For them, the use of
half wave length was of no concern as it provided answers that
were within 10% of real life. That aproach lasted to this very day
when I came along and pointed out that by using the Gaussian law of
statics
they could then account for the remaining 10% of radiation by
accounting for other forces which could provide for 100% efficiency.
When this observation was shared on the internet it met with disdain
by those who in the absence of knoweledge followed the trend of the
written books of science known for their plagarisms. After all, those
who followed the books to the letter were resting on the mantle of
perceived experts where all agreed on the same thing. Rather than
learning new things about physics they decided to agree to bestow on
the teacher the myth that he was wearing no clothes and threw away all
the mesh available . To this day nobody can apply a time varying field
and note that it radiated more efficiently than any radiater known and
occupy a smaller volume than previously .possible thus preventing
those with small gardens become such loud mouths as others were that
were preventing the advance of science.
Now the antenna industry realizes that with the gaussian knowledge
being denied to them the only resort they had for advancement was to
invent a new technology so they could carry the battle to those who
cannot accept change. Unfortunately God made only one technology for
radiation leaving the industry to ponder for another 100 years.
Art Unwin KB9MZ.....xg

Richard Clark wrote:
On Sun, 6 Dec 2009 some gomer wrote:

No where does Maxwell's equations suggests a particular shape or
elevation or even straght when describing a radiator

Hmmmm,

Did Maxwell design antennas? Did he describe them? If he had no
particular shape in mind, did that mean it was a mesh like a fish net
cast over the rocks? Did he try working the international space
station with this limp radiator powered by the feeble force?

WWMD?

73's
Richard Clark, KB7QHC

What Would Unwin Do?

Make up an answer, of course!

tom
K0TAR

On Dec 6, 2:52*pm, Art Unwin wrote:
On Dec 6, 1:10*pm, Richard Clark wrote:



On Sun, 6 Dec 2009 some gomer wrote:

No where does Maxwell's equations suggests a particular shape or
elevation or even straght when describing a radiator

Hmmmm,

Did Maxwell design antennas? *Did he describe them? *If he had no
particular shape in mind, did that mean it was a mesh like a fish net
cast over the rocks? *Did he try working the international space
station with this limp radiator powered by the feeble force?

WWMD?

73's
Richard Clark, KB7QHC

Maxwell dealt only with the mathematics of the time where many people
had arrived at equations with respect to scientific observations.
Many of these equations from different countries were actually
duplicates so he was able to side line some. reduce some and even
combined some such that he has a set of equations. Ofcourse he was
aware that with observations within the Universe one must obey the
requirement of equilibrium. You can do this by placing all metrics on
one side of the equal or equal ibrium side and zero ion the other
side.
One of his final equations did not, in fact, equal zero and in fact
the metric of time was missing among other things. Now he couldn't go
back to Gauss or anybody for an explanation. If he had spoken to Gauss
he may have told him that if he made a static field dynamic he could
correct the initial equations provided as the product was one and the
same! Instead Maxwell concerned himself only with the metrics of the
equations and not the scale. So he cancelled the metrics that were
available and then added some metrics so he could cancel what was
remaining which implied equil ibrium noy knowing what the additions
added signified. At that time he could not have cared less as he
primarily a mathematician.
When Yagi and Uda came along they stumbled on intercoupling of planar
forms with out any regard to Maxwells equations. For them, the use of
half wave length was of no concern as it provided answers that
were within 10% of real life. That aproach lasted to this very day
when I came along and pointed out that by using the Gaussian law of
statics
they could then account for the remaining 10% of radiation by
accounting for other forces which could provide for 100% efficiency.
When this observation was shared on the internet it met with disdain
by those who in the absence of knoweledge followed the trend of the
written books of science known for their plagarisms. After all, those
who followed the books to the letter were resting on the mantle of
perceived experts where all agreed on the same thing. Rather than
learning new things about physics they decided to agree to bestow on
the teacher the myth that he was wearing no clothes and threw away all
the mesh available . To this day nobody can apply a time varying field
and note that it radiated more efficiently than any radiater known and
occupy a smaller volume than previously .possible thus preventing
those with small gardens become such loud mouths as others *were that
were preventing the advance of science.
Now the antenna industry realizes that with the gaussian knowledge
being denied to them the only resort they had for advancement was to
invent a new technology so they could carry the battle to those who
cannot accept change. Unfortunately God made only one technology for
radiation leaving the industry to ponder for another 100 years.
Art Unwin KB9MZ.....xg

Ofcourse the biggest thing to come from the Gaussian observation was
that his static particles must be in equilibrium and also could only
come to rest without harm was a diamagnetic material which could
encapsulate vie their density. Most other things on earth are
considered diamagnetic including water. Many people have seen beads of
water that can exist in a pherical shape as you see with mercury and
the like. This is because the liquid is bound so tight by the resting
particles that they assume the shape of a sphere where internal
pressure equates to the outside pressure. When the winds pick up
particles are drawn up while clinging to the water where the surface
area of water diminishes with altitude The resting electrons or
particles receive a charge via the assending movement while at the
same time struggle to look for a viable new resting place such as a
close by cloud while all the time gathering increased charge. These
electrons collect in a cloud like form themselves as points of rest
diminish such they are attracted away from the higher elevation back
to earth which is now the easiest place to reach and rest. Thus we
have lightning produced when the cloud of electrons hit the ground
such that the charge removes itself from the charge.
You might also notice that the radiation resistance increases as the
metallic resistance decreases. This is due to the encapsulating
electrons carry more and more of the current available such that the
skin depth starts to disapear such that we have to review what the
lowest impedance that can be handled for radiatiation. The action that
removes the encapsulating particles is both a directive force and one
of spin. These same two forces are responsible for all actions on
earth such as gravity associated with spin all the way back to the big
bang where equilibrium is broken via a emerging particle from the suns
boundary. So what was originall thought of as being a wave is now seen
as a total error as the particle is the initial subject of force
together with spin which thus brings to the fore the formation of
voltage, light magnetism and even gravity byt he adherance to Newtons
law that require s from every action an equal and opposite reaction
which travels thru the Universe by the single ejection of a particle
creating the two basic forces from which everything comes about. Even
the Faraday shield follows the same pattern where the field outside
equals the field inside until the internal or external equilibrium is
broken creating the same two originating forces of the universe. Now
if I made all that up myself wouldn't one think of me as a visionary
that really should write a physics book to steer the world in the
right direction of fictional law?
Had a great long week end in StLouis which has revitalised me back
home in Central Illinois to with stand the new oncomming insults who
feel that they know all about antennas before I was born.