On Jun 27, 1:38*pm, Keith Dysart wrote:
In any region, the energy flowing in (i.e. power) to the region minus
the energy flowing out (i.e. power) is equal to the additional energy
per unit time (i.e. power) being stored in the region. While not
called the "conservation of power law" it is an obvious corollary
to "conservation of energy".

I'm sorry, that is simply not true for power. The energy content of a
1us pulse containing one joule and the energy content of a one sec
pulse containing one joule are equal and that one joule is all that
must be conserved. The 1us pulse containing 1,000,000 watts can be
converted to a one second pulse containing 1 watt. Where did the other
999,999 watts go??? Energy has been conserved but the power changed
from 1,000,000 watts to 1 watt using exactly the same energy. Perhaps
this characteristic of power is what you are missing. Also, all the
energy can be conserved in reactance while power falls to absolute
zero. This often happens during a fraction of a cycle. That is what is
wrong with you trying to track instataneous power - it doesn't work
unless one standardizes to at least one cycle. Within each fraction of
a cycle, any principle of conservation of power will surely be
violated. If it appears that power is ever conserved, it is only by
accident. Such is the case with many megacycles/second where the
result of a fraction of a cycle will have a negligible effect on the
joules/sec.

The obvious alternative is that the computed energy in the reflected
wave is sometimes just a figment.

And God created the heavens and earth in six days and rested on the
seventh. I'm glad you are happy with your faith-based physics. In the
field of real-world physics, EM waves cannot exist without ExH energy.
The only way to win this argument is to prove to everyone that they
are not really detecting reflected waves containing energy when they
look at themselves in the mirror. Good luck on that one.

Question: How were the first three days measured before the creation
of the sun on the 4th day?

Not to mention that in your 1/8 wavelength example (http://www.w5dxp.com/nointfr.htm)
you do not explain where the energy is stored so that it can be
returned at a different time.

Energy is stored in the transmission line and delivered as needed to
satisfy the conservaton of energy principle. Years ago, I showed how
energy can flow *into the source* (negative power) during a fractional
part of a cycle in a conjugately matched system.

Such declarations do permit an easy out, despite not aligning with
reality.

If you can take one joule per microsecond (1 megawatt) and conserve
that one megawatt of power over a century, you can get rich selling
it. Let us know when you get your patent on conservation of power. :-)
Good Grief!

If that is the case, the whole concept of reflected energy seems
somewhat bogus. Over a whole cycle, the power delivered by the
generator is passed on towards the load. If that is all you want
to know, then there is no need at all for "reflected power".

But, as you can grok from the subject of this thread, that is not all
that is needed to know. The last gasp of the loser is that it didn't
matter anyhow. Reflected energy has always mattered to optical
physicists who know it obeys the laws of physics. Now it seems to
matter to some hams. If it doesn't matter to you, why do you continue
posting?

And to stop besmirching Hecht, it seems most probable that his
comment was in the context of optics. After all, the book had that
title.

Hint: RF waves are covered in every physics book whose title is
"Light". There is absolutely no difference, from a physics standpoint,
between a coherent light wave and a coherent RF wave except for
frequency. The both obey exactly the same laws of physics which you
seem to concede for visible light but not for light at RF frequencies.
--
73, Cecil, w5dxp.com