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Szczepan Bialek wrote:
"tom" napisal w wiadomosci . net... On 8/2/2010 2:12 PM, Szczepan Bia?ek wrote: You're missing something very important here, and you ask for the information and then discount it when it doesn't satisfy you. I encourage you to find the correct. Meaningless babble. The MEASURED CHARACTERISTICS of something cannot change just because the theory explaining it has changed. Yes. But the permittivity is the result of the conductivity measurement. Conductors, semiconductors and insulators are for students. It is simplification. The reality is more complex. More meaningless babble. And it is quite easy to find. I'm surprised since you seem to be able to find all the esoteric explanations of how the world works. I can find milions papers on the theory of glow and losses in AC network. The same should be for the radio frequences. I was thinking that somebody from you have a link to such. The AC glow is not simmetrical. So in the radio transmitter must be the netto electrons flow. Where can I find the DC ground current? S* Yet more babble and word salad. -- Jim Pennino Remove .spam.sux to reply. |
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Szczepan Bialek wrote:
"tom" wrote . net... I'm not sure you've hit it here. Mr B seems to understand language, he just ignores the responses if they don't support his skewed world view. Longitudinal electric waves were supported by all scientists. Maxwell-Heaviside's erroneous hipothesis is chosen to teach the field theory. Radio people should know that. S* More meaningless word salad. -- Jim Pennino Remove .spam.sux to reply. |
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Szczepan Bialek wrote:
"Michael Coslo" wrote ... Szczepan Bialek wrote: The was the additional question: "And what with the "natural" insulations: the ice and the wet? Sometimes are on your dipoles an ice or water. They should melt/evaporate in the places where are picks of the voltage. Is it observed? Are you assuming that because there is high voltage, there is current induced heating? Bill Miller calls it "the transverse current". Electrons must displace perpendicular to the antenna surface in AC. In insulators are the electric losses. Voltage does not translate diresctly to heat. In insulated antena are the transverse current and the displacement current. The all are facts. Should be easy to observe. Some topics ago somebody analised the antenna temperature. The end of the dipole should be the hottest. Have you any observations in this subject? S* All nonsense word salad. -- Jim Pennino Remove .spam.sux to reply. |
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Szczepan Bialek wrote:
"Michael Coslo" wrote ... Szczepan Bialek wrote: The was the additional question: "And what with the "natural" insulations: the ice and the wet? Sometimes are on your dipoles an ice or water. They should melt/evaporate in the places where are picks of the voltage. Is it observed? Are you assuming that because there is high voltage, there is current induced heating? Bill Miller calls it "the transverse current". Electrons must displace perpendicular to the antenna surface in AC. In insulators are the electric losses. Voltage does not translate diresctly to heat. Is a quantum effect current flow, and does heat emit from the process? If it isn't heat induced, the effect is almost certainly ionization. In insulated antena are the transverse current and the displacement current. The all are facts. Should be easy to observe. Some topics ago somebody analised the antenna temperature. The end of the dipole should be the hottest. Have you any observations in this subject? Aside from analysis, has anyone measured this effect? Is it to be expected in highly efficent antennas, or just inneficient ones in which there is substantial heating already? Is this assuming that the heat if given off is enough to raise the temperature surrounding th eantenna above 0deg C? - Mike - |
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On 8/3/2010 11:49 AM, Szczepan Bialek wrote:
"Michael wrote Bill Miller calls it "the transverse current". Electrons must displace perpendicular to the antenna surface in AC. In insulators are the electric losses. Voltage does not translate diresctly to heat. In insulated antena are the transverse current and the displacement current. The all are facts. Should be easy to observe. If it is easy to observe then you should be able to observe the effect yourself. What have you seen? t |
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"tom" wrote . net... On 8/3/2010 11:49 AM, Szczepan Bialek wrote: "Michael wrote Bill Miller calls it "the transverse current". Electrons must displace perpendicular to the antenna surface in AC. In insulators are the electric losses. Voltage does not translate diresctly to heat. In insulated antena are the transverse current and the displacement current. The all are facts. Should be easy to observe. If it is easy to observe then you should be able to observe the effect yourself. What have you seen? I have not any possibility or opportunity. Years ago I asked about the frequency doubling. The second answer was: Luxembourg efect. It was this what I was looking for. But next were two hundred post with word salad on me and non-linear effects. With the "polarisation" was the same. So I know that sooner or later appear the valuable information. Michael wrote: "Is it to be expected in highly efficent antennas, or just inneficient ones in which there is substantial heating already? " Lodge has seen the glow. You use the LED and VSWR.. Now everybody from you can measure the electron emission and heat emission. I was expected that you (radio people) know the results. S* |
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"Michael Coslo" wrote ... Szczepan Bialek wrote: "Michael Coslo" wrote ... Szczepan Bialek wrote: The was the additional question: "And what with the "natural" insulations: the ice and the wet? Sometimes are on your dipoles an ice or water. They should melt/evaporate in the places where are picks of the voltage. Is it observed? Are you assuming that because there is high voltage, there is current induced heating? Bill Miller calls it "the transverse current". Electrons must displace perpendicular to the antenna surface in AC. In insulators are the electric losses. Voltage does not translate diresctly to heat. Is a quantum effect current flow, and does heat emit from the process? If it isn't heat induced, the effect is almost certainly ionization. No heat only in superconductors. In gold is lower than in aluminium. In insulated antena are the transverse current and the displacement current. The all are facts. Should be easy to observe. Some topics ago somebody analised the antenna temperature. The end of the dipole should be the hottest. Have you any observations in this subject? Aside from analysis, has anyone measured this effect? Of course. The antennas on animalls have temperature rise below 15C. Is it to be expected in highly efficent antennas, or just inneficient ones in which there is substantial heating already? Is this assuming that the heat if given off is enough to raise the temperature surrounding th eantenna above 0deg C? I do not know. I am asking you (antenna owners). Working antenna is hotter than at rest. Which part of the dipole is the hottest? S* |
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Szczepan Bialek wrote:
I have not any possibility or opportunity. Years ago I asked about the frequency doubling. The second answer was: Luxembourg efect. It was this what I was looking for. But next were two hundred post with word salad on me and non-linear effects. With the "polarisation" was the same. So I know that sooner or later appear the valuable information. Michael wrote: "Is it to be expected in highly efficent antennas, or just inneficient ones in which there is substantial heating already? " Lodge has seen the glow. You use the LED and VSWR.. Now everybody from you can measure the electron emission and heat emission. I was expected that you (radio people) know the results. S* Yet another steaming pile of gibberish and word salad. -- Jim Pennino Remove .spam.sux to reply. |
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On Aug 4, 8:36*am, "Szczepan Bialek" wrote:
*"Michael Coslo" ... Szczepan Bialek wrote: *"Michael Coslo" wrote ... Szczepan Bialek wrote: The was the additional question: "And what with the "natural" insulations: the ice and the wet? Sometimes are on your dipoles an ice or water. They should melt/evaporate in the places where are picks of the voltage. Is it observed? Are you assuming that because there is high voltage, there is current induced heating? Bill Miller calls it "the transverse current". Electrons must displace perpendicular to the antenna surface in AC. In insulators are the electric losses. Voltage does not translate diresctly to heat. Is a quantum effect current flow, and does heat emit from the process? If it isn't heat induced, the effect is almost certainly ionization. No heat only in superconductors. In gold is lower than in aluminium. In insulated antena are the transverse current and the displacement current. The all are facts. Should be easy to observe. Some topics ago somebody analised the antenna temperature. The end of the dipole should be the hottest. Have you any observations in this subject? Aside from analysis, has anyone measured this effect? Of course. The antennas on animalls have temperature rise below 15C. Is it to be expected in highly efficent antennas, or just inneficient ones in which there is substantial heating already? Is this assuming that the heat if given off is enough to raise the temperature surrounding th eantenna above 0deg C? I do not know. I am asking you (antenna owners). Working antenna is hotter than at rest. Which part of the dipole is the hottest? S* the center part is the hottest. |
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On 8/4/2010 2:45 AM, Szczepan Bialek wrote:
wrote . net... On 8/3/2010 11:49 AM, Szczepan Bialek wrote: "Michael wrote Bill Miller calls it "the transverse current". Electrons must displace perpendicular to the antenna surface in AC. In insulators are the electric losses. Voltage does not translate diresctly to heat. In insulated antena are the transverse current and the displacement current. The all are facts. Should be easy to observe. If it is easy to observe then you should be able to observe the effect yourself. What have you seen? I have not any possibility or opportunity. Years ago I asked about the frequency doubling. The second answer was: Luxembourg efect. It was this what I was looking for. But next were two hundred post with word salad on me and non-linear effects. With the "polarisation" was the same. So I know that sooner or later appear the valuable information. Michael wrote: "Is it to be expected in highly efficent antennas, or just inneficient ones in which there is substantial heating already? " Lodge has seen the glow. You use the LED and VSWR.. Now everybody from you can measure the electron emission and heat emission. I was expected that you (radio people) know the results. S* Actually we do. You, who believe the 200 and 100 year old myths, don't believe us. And then you prattle on about us not knowing of what we speak when it is you who do not. *t |
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"tom" wrote . net... On 8/4/2010 2:45 AM, Szczepan Bialek wrote: Now everybody from you can measure the electron emission and heat emission. I was expected that you (radio people) know the results. Actually we do. You, who believe the 200 and 100 year old myths, don't believe us. And then you prattle on about us not knowing of what we speak when it is you who do not. Tesla wrote in XX century that EM is a myth. I simply agree with him. Tell me then who know better how the radio works: Tesla or you? S* |
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Uzytkownik "K1TTT" napisal w wiadomosci ... On Aug 4, 8:36 am, "Szczepan Bialek" wrote: I do not know. I am asking you (antenna owners). Working antenna is hotter than at rest. Which part of the dipole is the hottest? the center part is the hottest. If the junction with the transmission line is poor. As you see I cannot accept your answer because it do not fit to Tesla's radio. So the next question: The simplest dipole is made from a transmission cable. It is enough to stretch the wires in the oppsite directions (like arms). The no junctions. Which part is the hottest?: -Transmission cable, -The first part of the arm, -The end of the arm. S* |
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Szczepan Bialek wrote:
Uzytkownik "K1TTT" napisal w wiadomosci ... On Aug 4, 8:36 am, "Szczepan Bialek" wrote: I do not know. I am asking you (antenna owners). Working antenna is hotter than at rest. Which part of the dipole is the hottest? the center part is the hottest. If the junction with the transmission line is poor. Babbling nonsense and shows you have no clue as to the meaning of voltage, current, and power. As you see I cannot accept your answer because it do not fit to Tesla's radio. So the next question: No, you can't accept the answer because it doesn't fit your demented preconceptions. Tesla died insane a long time ago. The simplest dipole is made from a transmission cable. It is enough to stretch the wires in the oppsite directions (like arms). The no junctions. Which part is the hottest?: -Transmission cable, -The first part of the arm, -The end of the arm. S* The above is just babbling word salad and the question has been answered, whether you like the answer or not. -- Jim Pennino Remove .spam.sux to reply. |
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Szczepan Bialek wrote:
"tom" wrote . net... On 8/4/2010 2:45 AM, Szczepan Bialek wrote: Now everybody from you can measure the electron emission and heat emission. I was expected that you (radio people) know the results. Actually we do. You, who believe the 200 and 100 year old myths, don't believe us. And then you prattle on about us not knowing of what we speak when it is you who do not. Tesla wrote in XX century that EM is a myth. I simply agree with him. Tell me then who know better how the radio works: Tesla or you? S* Tesla died insane a long time ago. You babble on insanely. -- Jim Pennino Remove .spam.sux to reply. |
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On Aug 5, 7:55*am, "Szczepan Bialek" wrote:
Uzytkownik "K1TTT" napisal w ... On Aug 4, 8:36 am, "Szczepan Bialek" wrote: I do not know. I am asking you (antenna owners). Working antenna is hotter than at rest. Which part of the dipole is the hottest? the center part is the hottest. If the junction with the transmission line is poor. As you see I cannot accept your answer because it do not fit to Tesla's radio. So the next question: The simplest dipole is made from a transmission cable. It is enough to stretch the wires in the oppsite directions (like arms). The no junctions. Which part is the hottest?: -Transmission cable, -The first part of the arm, -The end of the arm. S* i know better than whatever you think you understand of tesla's work, and also have at least 60 years of research after he died to support it. the first part of the arm is hottest, just like the center part of the dipole that is not heated due to a bad connection... maybe you make bad connections to dipoles, i don't! |
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On Aug 5, 7:55*am, "Szczepan Bialek" wrote:
Uzytkownik "K1TTT" napisal w ... On Aug 4, 8:36 am, "Szczepan Bialek" wrote: I do not know. I am asking you (antenna owners). Working antenna is hotter than at rest. Which part of the dipole is the hottest? the center part is the hottest. If the junction with the transmission line is poor. As you see I cannot accept your answer because it do not fit to Tesla's radio. So the next question: The simplest dipole is made from a transmission cable. It is enough to stretch the wires in the oppsite directions (like arms). The no junctions. Which part is the hottest?: -Transmission cable, -The first part of the arm, -The end of the arm. S* i know better than whatever you think you understand of tesla's work, and also have at least 60 years of research after he died to support it. the first part of the arm is hottest, just like the center part of the dipole that is not heated due to a bad connection... maybe you make bad connections to dipoles, i don't! |
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On 8/5/2010 2:38 AM, Szczepan Bialek wrote:
wrote . net... On 8/4/2010 2:45 AM, Szczepan Bialek wrote: Now everybody from you can measure the electron emission and heat emission. I was expected that you (radio people) know the results. Actually we do. You, who believe the 200 and 100 year old myths, don't believe us. And then you prattle on about us not knowing of what we speak when it is you who do not. Tesla wrote in XX century that EM is a myth. I simply agree with him. Tell me then who know better how the radio works: Tesla or you? S* Me. *t |
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On 08/05/2010 05:13 PM, tom wrote:
On 8/5/2010 2:38 AM, Szczepan Bialek wrote: wrote . net... On 8/4/2010 2:45 AM, Szczepan Bialek wrote: Now everybody from you can measure the electron emission and heat emission. I was expected that you (radio people) know the results. Actually we do. You, who believe the 200 and 100 year old myths, don't believe us. And then you prattle on about us not knowing of what we speak when it is you who do not. Tesla wrote in XX century that EM is a myth. I simply agree with him. Tell me then who know better how the radio works: Tesla or you? S* Me. *t I hate to break in on private arguments, but Tesla was one of the smartest people to ever walk this earth. Are You? He invented Radio, but Marconi took the credit, using at least 6 of Tesla's patents. I can rant on Edison and Daguerre, but that gets long. Some of you guys need a 'TRUE' history lesson. Bill Baka, Listener only, since I rent these days. Had a 1st Class Radiotelephone with Marine RADAR, P1-12-24966, but gave it up some years back when they decided to do away with the first class distinction. Different numbers, but hard work to get anyway. |
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On 8/5/2010 7:37 PM, Bill Baka wrote:
On 08/05/2010 05:13 PM, tom wrote: On 8/5/2010 2:38 AM, Szczepan Bialek wrote: wrote . net... On 8/4/2010 2:45 AM, Szczepan Bialek wrote: Now everybody from you can measure the electron emission and heat emission. I was expected that you (radio people) know the results. Actually we do. You, who believe the 200 and 100 year old myths, don't believe us. And then you prattle on about us not knowing of what we speak when it is you who do not. Tesla wrote in XX century that EM is a myth. I simply agree with him. Tell me then who know better how the radio works: Tesla or you? S* Me. *t I hate to break in on private arguments, but Tesla was one of the smartest people to ever walk this earth. Are You? He invented Radio, but Marconi took the credit, using at least 6 of Tesla's patents. I can rant on Edison and Daguerre, but that gets long. Some of you guys need a 'TRUE' history lesson. Bill Baka, Listener only, since I rent these days. Had a 1st Class Radiotelephone with Marine RADAR, P1-12-24966, but gave it up some years back when they decided to do away with the first class distinction. Different numbers, but hard work to get anyway. I was specifically responding to the part where it is claimed that Tesla said EM is a myth. I feel quite safe, thanks. But I wouldn't have debated alternating current motors with Tesla. No sir. *t |
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On 8/5/2010 7:37 PM, Bill Baka wrote:
On 08/05/2010 05:13 PM, tom wrote: On 8/5/2010 2:38 AM, Szczepan Bialek wrote: wrote . net... On 8/4/2010 2:45 AM, Szczepan Bialek wrote: Now everybody from you can measure the electron emission and heat emission. I was expected that you (radio people) know the results. Actually we do. You, who believe the 200 and 100 year old myths, don't believe us. And then you prattle on about us not knowing of what we speak when it is you who do not. Tesla wrote in XX century that EM is a myth. I simply agree with him. Tell me then who know better how the radio works: Tesla or you? S* Me. *t I hate to break in on private arguments, but Tesla was one of the smartest people to ever walk this earth. Are You? He invented Radio, but Marconi took the credit, using at least 6 of Tesla's patents. I can rant on Edison and Daguerre, but that gets long. Some of you guys need a 'TRUE' history lesson. Bill Baka, Listener only, since I rent these days. Had a 1st Class Radiotelephone with Marine RADAR, P1-12-24966, but gave it up some years back when they decided to do away with the first class distinction. Different numbers, but hard work to get anyway. Just noticed the renter part. I've been renting for 35 years and haven't been too seriously constrained for most of it. And by not seriously constrained I mean 4 over 4 yagis at 25 and 37 feet with 1000 watts on 6m amongst other things. If you work with your landlord you can often get permission for a lot. And the right city helps, too. tom K0TAR |
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"tom" wrote . net... On 8/5/2010 7:37 PM, Bill Baka wrote: On 08/05/2010 05:13 PM, tom wrote: On 8/5/2010 2:38 AM, Szczepan Bialek wrote: Tesla wrote in XX century that EM is a myth. I simply agree with him. Tell me then who know better how the radio works: Tesla or you? Me. I hate to break in on private arguments, but Tesla was one of the smartest people to ever walk this earth. Are You? He invented Radio, but Marconi took the credit, using at least 6 of Tesla's patents. I can rant on Edison and Daguerre, but that gets long. Some of you guys need a 'TRUE' history lesson. Bill Baka, Listener only, since I rent these days. Had a 1st Class Radiotelephone with Marine RADAR, P1-12-24966, but gave it up some years back when they decided to do away with the first class distinction. Different numbers, but hard work to get anyway. I was specifically responding to the part where it is claimed that Tesla said EM is a myth. I feel quite safe, thanks. Nikola Tesla wrote: " I showed that the universal medium is a gaseous body in which only longitudinal pulses can be propagated, involving alternating compressions and expansions similar to those produced by sound waves in the air. Thus, a wireless transmitter does not propagate Hertz waves, which are a myth, but sound waves in the ether, behaving in every respect like those in the air, except that, owing to the great elastic force and extremely small density of the medium, their speed is that of light." Bill Baka wrote: "Some of you guys need a 'TRUE' history lesson." There is also wrote that EM wrote Heaviside not Maxwell. Maxwell's hypothesis was quite different. There were the molecullar magnetic vortices. Inside the solenoid were millions of them. They rotate the polarisation plane. What rotate it in Heaviside EM? Inside the solenoid is the flux. Any rotation. In our textbooks is wrote "whats a pity that to teaching was choosen Heaviside not Ampere". But Ampere is too sophisticated for students. So, "I feel quite safe, thanks." S* |
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On Aug 6, 7:42*am, "Szczepan Bialek" wrote:
*"tom" ouse.net... On 8/5/2010 7:37 PM, Bill Baka wrote: On 08/05/2010 05:13 PM, tom wrote: On 8/5/2010 2:38 AM, Szczepan Bialek wrote: Tesla wrote in XX century that EM is a myth. I simply agree with him.. Tell me then who know better how the radio works: Tesla or you? Me. I hate to break in on private arguments, but Tesla was one of the smartest people to ever walk this earth. Are You? He invented Radio, but Marconi took the credit, using at least 6 of Tesla's patents. I can rant on Edison and Daguerre, but that gets long. Some of you guys need a 'TRUE' history lesson. Bill Baka, Listener only, since I rent these days. Had a 1st Class Radiotelephone with Marine RADAR, P1-12-24966, but gave it up some years back when they decided to do away with the first class distinction. Different numbers, but hard work to get anyway. I was specifically responding to the part where it is claimed that Tesla said EM is a myth. *I feel quite safe, thanks. Nikola Tesla wrote: " I showed that the universal medium is a gaseous body in which only longitudinal pulses can be propagated, involving alternating compressions and expansions similar to those produced by sound waves in the air. Thus, a wireless transmitter does not propagate Hertz waves, which are a myth, but sound waves in the ether, behaving in every respect like those in the air, except that, owing to the great elastic force and extremely small density of the medium, their speed is that of light." Bill Baka wrote: "Some of you guys need a 'TRUE' history lesson." There is also wrote that EM wrote Heaviside not Maxwell. Maxwell's hypothesis was quite different. There were the molecullar magnetic vortices. Inside the solenoid were millions of them. They rotate the polarisation plane. What rotate it in Heaviside EM? Inside the solenoid is the flux. Any rotation. In our textbooks is wrote "whats a pity that to teaching was choosen Heaviside not Ampere". But Ampere is too sophisticated for students. So, "I feel quite safe, thanks." S* maybe in your 19th century text books, mine has plenty of Ampere in it. you must remember, those guys were working things out as they went along, their early writings were likely replaced by later ones that changed with improved observations that disproved what they thought at first. and then many things changed after the michaelson- morley experiment dispelled the last believers in aether. so unless you are studying things after that you are likely reading outdated and well disproved early theories. |
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Szczepan Bialek wrote:
"tom" wrote . net... On 8/5/2010 7:37 PM, Bill Baka wrote: On 08/05/2010 05:13 PM, tom wrote: On 8/5/2010 2:38 AM, Szczepan Bialek wrote: Tesla wrote in XX century that EM is a myth. I simply agree with him. Tell me then who know better how the radio works: Tesla or you? Me. I hate to break in on private arguments, but Tesla was one of the smartest people to ever walk this earth. Are You? He invented Radio, but Marconi took the credit, using at least 6 of Tesla's patents. I can rant on Edison and Daguerre, but that gets long. Some of you guys need a 'TRUE' history lesson. Bill Baka, Listener only, since I rent these days. Had a 1st Class Radiotelephone with Marine RADAR, P1-12-24966, but gave it up some years back when they decided to do away with the first class distinction. Different numbers, but hard work to get anyway. I was specifically responding to the part where it is claimed that Tesla said EM is a myth. I feel quite safe, thanks. Nikola Tesla wrote: " I showed that the universal medium is a gaseous body in which only longitudinal pulses can be propagated, involving alternating compressions and expansions similar to those produced by sound waves in the air. Thus, a wireless transmitter does not propagate Hertz waves, which are a myth, but sound waves in the ether, behaving in every respect like those in the air, except that, owing to the great elastic force and extremely small density of the medium, their speed is that of light." And close to 100 years worth of experimental testing say Tesla was wrong, get over it. -- Jim Pennino Remove .spam.sux to reply. |
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"K1TTT" wrote ... On Aug 5, 7:55 am, "Szczepan Bialek" wrote: The simplest dipole is made from a transmission cable. It is enough to stretch the wires in the oppsite directions (like arms). There no junctions. Which part is the hottest?: -Transmission cable, -The first part of the arm, -The end of the arm. S* i know better than whatever you think you understand of tesla's work, and also have at least 60 years of research after he died to support it. the first part of the arm is hottest, just like the center part of the dipole that is not heated due to a bad connection... maybe you make bad connections to dipoles, i don't! Michaels answer was the best: "Aside from analysis, has anyone measured this effect? Is it to be expected in highly efficent antennas, or just inneficient ones in which there is substantial heating already? I have found that ice (hoar-frost) and rain do not disturbs radiating. But the ice-water strongly. The ice-water is in a moment when the hoar-frost is melting and in the pores is water (normally is air). It is agreement with: " "In fact, most dipolar solids exhibit extremely small dielectric losses since W tends to be extremely large. Water-free ice, for example does not heat significantly under microwave irradiation." I have found also that the temperature is measured for antennas for annimals. The temperature rise must be below 15C. Of course they know the details. So no additional questions from me. S* |
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"K1TTT" wrote ... On Aug 6, 7:42 am, "Szczepan Bialek" wrote: In our textbooks is wrote "whats a pity that to teaching was choosen Heaviside not Ampere". But Ampere is too sophisticated for students. So, "I feel quite safe, thanks." maybe in your 19th century text books, mine has plenty of Ampere in it. you must remember, those guys were working things out as they went along, their early writings were likely replaced by later ones that changed with improved observations that disproved what they thought at first. Ampere, Gauss, Weber, Maxwell are too difficult for student. and then many things changed after the michaelson- morley experiment dispelled the last believers in aether. MMX proved that no motionless solid ether. Such was necessary for the transverse waves. so unless you are studying things after that you are likely reading outdated and well disproved early theories. Now is the plasma physics: "Waves in plasmas can be classified as electromagnetic or electrostatic according to whether or not there is an oscillating magnetic field. Applying Faraday's law of induction to plane waves, we find , implying that an electrostatic wave must be purely longitudinal. An electromagnetic wave, in contrast, must have a transverse component, but may also be partially longitudinal" For Tesla ether is: "but sound waves in the ether, behaving in every respect like those in the air, except that, owing to the great elastic force and extremely small density of the medium, their speed is that of light." For Dirac it was an electrons see. Now we know that in the electron see are the positive ions, So the plasma is neutral. As you see people step by step go ahead. Only you are standing in the Heaviside's water (hydraulic analogy). S* |
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wrote ... Szczepan Bialek wrote: Nikola Tesla wrote: " I showed that the universal medium is a gaseous body in which only longitudinal pulses can be propagated, involving alternating compressions and expansions similar to those produced by sound waves in the air. Thus, a wireless transmitter does not propagate Hertz waves, which are a myth, but sound waves in the ether, behaving in every respect like those in the air, except that, owing to the great elastic force and extremely small density of the medium, their speed is that of light." And close to 100 years worth of experimental testing say Tesla was wrong, get over it. Tesla like Ampere are not in the teaching program. Teaching programs are written by Ministry of Education. Not all is in the teaching programs. Up to now I have never seen opinion that Ampere and Tesla was wrong. Remember that all scientists discard the Maxwell's hypothesis. Heavisde made the EM.: http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Electr..._moving_charge But he wrote: " I must, however, disagree with Prof. Thomson's assumption that the motion must be irrotational. It would appear, by the above, that this limitation is unnecessary." The magnetic whirl was born. Teachers like it. They can write divrot H = 0. It seems that you also like it. S* |
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On Aug 7, 7:44*am, "Szczepan Bialek" wrote:
*"K1TTT" ... On Aug 6, 7:42 am, "Szczepan Bialek" wrote: In our textbooks is wrote "whats a pity that to teaching was choosen Heaviside not Ampere". But Ampere is too sophisticated for students. So, "I feel quite safe, thanks." maybe in your 19th century text books, mine has plenty of Ampere in it. *you must remember, those guys were working things out as they went along, their early writings were likely replaced by later ones that changed with improved observations that disproved what they thought at first. Ampere, Gauss, Weber, Maxwell are too difficult for student. they are not hard they are the basis of teaching modern electromagnetics. Any introductory electromagnetics course uses their stuff. if they are too hard for you that explains why you have all those strange ideas, you are stuck 100 years ago with outdated over simplified theories that have been disproved many times. |
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On Aug 7, 7:44*am, "Szczepan Bialek" wrote:
*"K1TTT" ... On Aug 6, 7:42 am, "Szczepan Bialek" wrote: In our textbooks is wrote "whats a pity that to teaching was choosen Heaviside not Ampere". But Ampere is too sophisticated for students. So, "I feel quite safe, thanks." maybe in your 19th century text books, mine has plenty of Ampere in it. *you must remember, those guys were working things out as they went along, their early writings were likely replaced by later ones that changed with improved observations that disproved what they thought at first. Ampere, Gauss, Weber, Maxwell are too difficult for student. they are not hard they are the basis of teaching modern electromagnetics. Any introductory electromagnetics course uses their stuff. if they are too hard for you that explains why you have all those strange ideas, you are stuck 100 years ago with outdated over simplified theories that have been disproved many times. |
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Szczepan Bialek wrote:
Ampere, Gauss, Weber, Maxwell are too difficult for student. A lot of college students would disagree with you. snip remaing insane babbling -- Jim Pennino Remove .spam.sux to reply. |
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"Szczepan Bia?ek" wrote:
wrote ... Szczepan Bialek wrote: Nikola Tesla wrote: " I showed that the universal medium is a gaseous body in which only longitudinal pulses can be propagated, involving alternating compressions and expansions similar to those produced by sound waves in the air. Thus, a wireless transmitter does not propagate Hertz waves, which are a myth, but sound waves in the ether, behaving in every respect like those in the air, except that, owing to the great elastic force and extremely small density of the medium, their speed is that of light." And close to 100 years worth of experimental testing say Tesla was wrong, get over it. Tesla like Ampere are not in the teaching program. Tesla's stuff before he went insane is in the text books and so is Ampere. Teaching programs are written by Ministry of Education. Not all is in the teaching programs. Insane babble. snip remaing insane babble -- Jim Pennino Remove .spam.sux to reply. |
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"K1TTT" wrote ... On Aug 7, 7:44 am, "Szczepan Bialek" wrote: In our textbooks is wrote "whats a pity that to teaching was choosen Heaviside not Ampere". But Ampere is too sophisticated for students. Ampere, Gauss, Weber, Maxwell are too difficult for student. they are not hard they are the basis of teaching modern electromagnetics. Electromagnetics is a one form of Electrodynamics. The only form in teaching program. The others is for selfteaching. Here are the review: http://www.df.lth.se/~snorkelf/Longitudinal/node4.html Any introductory electromagnetics course uses their stuff. EM made by Heaviside is a simplification of electrodynamics. Teachers choose it for teaching. if they are too hard for you that explains why you have all those strange ideas, you are stuck 100 years ago with outdated over simplified theories that have been disproved many times. Ampere's longitudinal force was derived experimentally. So it cannot be disproved. Current elements (electrons) repel each others and thanks this the radio works. S* |
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wrote ... "Szczepan Bia?ek" wrote: Tesla like Ampere are not in the teaching program. Tesla's stuff before he went insane is in the text books and so is Ampere. Where in teachin program is Ampere's longitudinal force? S* |
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On Aug 8, 7:53*am, "Szczepan Białek" wrote:
.... "Szczepan Bia?ek" wrote: Tesla like Ampere are not in the teaching program. Tesla's stuff before he went insane is in the text books and so is Ampere. Where in teachin program is Ampere's longitudinal force? S* just because he is in the books doesn't mean that everything he ever wrote is correct. much of the early writings of all those guys was wrong, it isn't until later when they had learned from their mistakes that the final correct formulas of electromagnetics were agreed on. for best results read modern textbooks, if you try to sort out all the dead ends they went down from the early guesses you will need 100 years to figure it all out again. |
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Szczepan Bialek wrote:
"K1TTT" wrote ... On Aug 7, 7:44 am, "Szczepan Bialek" wrote: In our textbooks is wrote "whats a pity that to teaching was choosen Heaviside not Ampere". But Ampere is too sophisticated for students. Ampere, Gauss, Weber, Maxwell are too difficult for student. they are not hard they are the basis of teaching modern electromagnetics. Electromagnetics is a one form of Electrodynamics. The only form in teaching program. The others is for selfteaching. You have obviously never gone to school and have no idea what is taught in schools. Your posts are babbling nonsense. -- Jim Pennino Remove .spam.sux to reply. |
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"Szczepan Bia?ek" wrote:
wrote ... "Szczepan Bia?ek" wrote: Tesla like Ampere are not in the teaching program. Tesla's stuff before he went insane is in the text books and so is Ampere. Where in teachin program is Ampere's longitudinal force? S* Why don't you go to school and find out? -- Jim Pennino Remove .spam.sux to reply. |
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"K1TTT" wrote ... On Aug 8, 7:53 am, "Szczepan Białek" wrote: ... Tesla like Ampere are not in the teaching program. Tesla's stuff before he went insane is in the text books and so is Ampere. Where in teaching program is Ampere's longitudinal force? S* just because he is in the books doesn't mean that everything he ever wrote is correct. much of the early writings of all those guys was wrong, it isn't until later when they had learned from their mistakes that the final correct formulas of electromagnetics were agreed on. I am not interesting in electromagnetics. It is the hydraulic analogy. In Ampere electroDYNAMICS no magnetism. for best results read modern textbooks, if you try to sort out all the dead ends they went down from the early guesses you will need 100 years to figure it all out again. The XXI century will be the century of Ampere ElectroDYNAMICS. It is the common opinion. S* |
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Szczepan Bialek wrote:
"K1TTT" wrote ... On Aug 8, 7:53 am, "Szczepan Bia?ek" wrote: ... Tesla like Ampere are not in the teaching program. Tesla's stuff before he went insane is in the text books and so is Ampere. Where in teaching program is Ampere's longitudinal force? S* just because he is in the books doesn't mean that everything he ever wrote is correct. much of the early writings of all those guys was wrong, it isn't until later when they had learned from their mistakes that the final correct formulas of electromagnetics were agreed on. I am not interesting in electromagnetics. It is the hydraulic analogy. No, it is not, that is babbling nonsense. In Ampere electroDYNAMICS no magnetism. for best results read modern textbooks, if you try to sort out all the dead ends they went down from the early guesses you will need 100 years to figure it all out again. The XXI century will be the century of Ampere ElectroDYNAMICS. It is the common opinion. S* More babbling nonsense. -- Jim Pennino Remove .spam.sux to reply. |
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On Aug 8, 6:23*pm, "Szczepan Bialek" wrote:
"K1TTT" ... On Aug 8, 7:53 am, "Szczepan Białek" wrote: .... Tesla like Ampere are not in the teaching program. Tesla's stuff before he went insane is in the text books and so is Ampere. Where in teaching program is Ampere's longitudinal force? S* just because he is in the books doesn't mean that everything he ever wrote is correct. *much of the early writings of all those guys was wrong, it isn't until later when they had learned from their mistakes that the final correct formulas of electromagnetics were agreed on. I am not interesting in electromagnetics. It is the hydraulic analogy. In Ampere electroDYNAMICS no magnetism. for best results read modern textbooks, if you try to sort out all the dead ends they went down from the early guesses you will need 100 years to figure it all out again. The XXI century will be the century of Ampere ElectroDYNAMICS. It is the common opinion. S* what good is a theory without magnetism. it obviously doesn't fit the real world as we know it today. maybe it is your opinion, but its not anywhere i have heard of. ampere's theory dates from almost 200 years ago and was the predecessor of electromagnetics, so you seem to have taken another step backwards, now you are almost 2 centuries out of date. |
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"K1TTT" wrote ... On Aug 8, 6:23 pm, "Szczepan Bialek" wrote: In Ampere electroDYNAMICS no magnetism. The XXI century will be the century of Ampere ElectroDYNAMICS. It is the common opinion. what good is a theory without magnetism. it obviously doesn't fit the real world as we know it today. maybe it is your opinion, but its not anywhere i have heard of. Gravity force, electrostatic force and magnetic force are the real world for the most people. But not for scientists. They know that in the space is the place for the one of them. So step by step they decrease the number of them. The first was Aepinus who proved that gravity and electrostatic are the same. The last step was made by Ampere who build the artifical magnet - solenoid. It means that magnetism is an ilussion like gravity. The all forces are electric. ampere's theory dates from almost 200 years ago and was the predecessor of electromagnetics, so you seem to have taken another step backwards, now you are almost 2 centuries out of date. Heaviside was not scientists and he has taken another step backwards to Poisson's fluids. He did not understand Maxwell and Stokes. Teachers must be in "real world" and wait for the end of works on the Unification of gravity, electricity and magnetism (they are pending). S* |
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