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Increasing Cable TV signal strength
On Sat, 11 Feb 2012 09:47:14 -0800, "Wayne"
wrote: "The_Giant_Rat_of_Sumatra" wrote in message .. . On Fri, 10 Feb 2012 20:52:11 -0600, tom wrote: On 2/10/2012 8:32 PM, Wayne wrote: He really needs to create a new file from which to cut and paste. Like most comedians', his jokes get stale after awhile. -- VWW, K6EVE - But you must admit that this normally quiet newsgroup finally has some activity. Who knows, this could take on the characteristics of the GFW. --Wayne W5GIE "GFW=Great Fractal Wars" Unfortunately the traffic has nothing to do with antennas. Things dried up here around 6 months ago. I suspect the people with brains and stories, and some of us remember who they are, are no longer with us or finally bailed due to the noise. I was playing with Moonrakers way back in the early seventies. - Moonrakers? LOL. Ok now we have you calibrated. No, you do not. I was 12 years old, and the gear was my dad's. You have nothing, and you know nothing. All you do is presume, and you presume wrong, boy. The antennas I work with now are everything from 18 foot diameter gateway heads to yagis for the military that we get in 20 foot long crates that put anything you ever worked with to shame. You should go see someone for that multiple personality disorder you are sporting there, "we" boy. More like "wee boy". I suppose Giant Rat of Sumatra was your "call sign". If you had any clue at all, you would be familiar with where the name comes from. So you fail there too, asshole. No surprise that you are a cultureless twit as well. That pretty much means that *I* have YOU calibrated. You are a total loser, or you would remember the art. The fact that you do not means that you were a drab loser ****tard back then as well. My fingernail clippings have more on the ball than you do, idiot. Bwuahahahaha! |
Increasing Cable TV signal strength
On 2/11/2012 2:08 AM, Sal wrote:
wrote in message . net... On Fri, 10 Feb 2012 05:52:31 -0800, The_Giant_Rat_of_Sumatra wrote: nuclear snippage tom K0TAR I plonked the guy days ago. It would be so-o-o-o great if people quoted him back little or none. I have no objection to appropriate profanity (and have been known to howl the unprintable on occasion, myself.) But when overused to no good end, ****/****ing,****er/****ed-up/****wad get tedious. "Sal" I was just making sure he was really the badass he's convinced that he is. He's not. He's actually kind of pitiful. Sooo, Plonk anyway! tom K0TAR |
Increasing Cable TV signal strength
Joerg wrote: Michael A. Terrell wrote: Joerg wrote: Michael A. Terrell wrote: Joerg wrote: Michael A. Terrell wrote: Joerg wrote: amdx wrote: Hi All, I'm on a boat, about 170ft from the utility post. Recently our cable company switched to the wonderful world of Digital TV. I got the new digital converter and had no picture. I took the box back and got a second box, still no picture. So now I suspect a weak signal and confirm that it is the cable length. The cable company came out and gave me a better cable than I had installed. At this point I have a picture but it is intermittent. The signal at the utility post has 3 outputs and had a four way splitter, I suggested the cable guy put in two 2 way splitters and give me the stronger (first) tap. That got my signal to work almost all the time. I'd like to get the signal to work 100% of the time. Looks like the cable guys screwed up. In your opinion. If their company cable box doesn't deliver a useful and reliable signal I call that screwed up. One pays for a service and expects to either get it delivered as promised or money back. ... If they are delivering the level called for in their franchise, they didn't screw up. It has always been up to the customer to pay for or provide extra equipment for non standard installs. Mike's install does not sound non-standard. 170ft cable drop towards premises which is fairly normal, plus the cable company's set-top box. Grow up. That is an excessive length drop. A standard drop is under 100 feet. You think you know everything, and that the world has to live by your rules. You don't, and it doesn't. ... http://www.starvision.tv/lineup_res.htm Quote "Maximum Drop Length 300 Feet" Now that's what I call good service. ... I'll bet you've never even seen a CATV franchise, or the dozen of pages of specifications agreed to by both the CATV company and the local government. The CATV company isn't a Santa Clause machine, and local governments know why there are limits to the service provided. If there were't, no one could afford to build or operate a CATV system. You've never designed a headend, or a physical plant If they build to supply higher port levels, it has to start at the headend, and requires closer spaced trunk amplifers. The system noise goes up from all of the cascaded amplifers, and the equipment runs hotter, withj a very reduced service life. When you can design an RF distribution system of more than 500 MHz bandwidth and has over 10,000 output ports, with the gain stabilized to a couple dBmv 20 miles from the headend and over a range from sub zero F to + 100 F then you can tell me I'm wrong. One headend I designed and built was only off by .1 dBmv at the test port on the first trunk amp which was a half mile from the head end. If you can do better than that, I'll listen to you and your opinions See above. Obviously others can. And yes, I have designed RF broadband power amps. Lots of them. Not just lashing up boxes but the actual transistor level circuitry including layout guidance for the nasty stuff. Fact is, if a cable company isn't competent to do a 170ft drop they should decline the job. Otherwise it is a screw-up, plain and simple. In our area they'd lose their shirts to the satellite guys because there are many houses like ours where there is no reasonable way to get from the street to the house with a 100ft limit. We have around 200ft that's still there from the early 90's and the previous owner said cable TV worked just fine for them. We are not subscribed because TV ain't that important to us. Yawn. You constantly harp about having to meet specs in medical, but whine like a drunken jackass when other businesses have to meet their specs. yes, they could design the sytems to 300 feet or more, but the cost to every customer on the system would go up. In medical I tend to push the envelope and so do the standards committees. Sometimes based on what we do. I designed all my cardiac stuff defibrillator-proof, always, although it was not the law yet. Then they made it law, because it makes sense. You do it because they wouldn't hire you if you couldn't meet specs, just like every other consultant, engineer or tech. They might even jail you for your incompetence for not meeting the specs. Believe it or not but I like to have to meet specs in medical because they protect people. Including you. Believe it or not, most technical people have that same standard. You're nothing special. ... Would you like to pay an extra 20% to 30% just so a very few locations can get better service? Out here we do not pay extra. Our cable companies out tend do use modern technology, not cheap stuff from the 70's. A cable company that isn't competent enough to do more than a measly 100ft would lose their franchise rather quickly. Once again the all knowing Jeorge shows his ignorance. 1: You don't know what you're talking about, about the cost of service. Any extra operating costs become part of the basic service that everyone pays. You won't work for nothing, and the utilities don't give them free electricity. The service companies don't repair the equipment for free. Do you have any idea how many amplifiers, taps and set top boxes are needed for 10,000 active ports? To provide hotter ports require more amplifiers, and raises the system noise floor. You 'designed an amplifier'. Big deal. A lot of engineers 'designed and amplifier' and those companies are long out of business. Current CATV amplifiers use hybrids designed specifically for the application and they use them for many reasons. That just leave the design of the 60V modified sine wave to DC power supplies, equalizers, gain control, equalization and remote switching. Some locations also have remote monitoring so the headend can check system status on a continuous basis. It can also report outages when some of the equipment doesn't respond. They can even detect power failures and monitor the battery status in the standby power supplies to give them time to get a portable generator to the area if it is an extended outage. The local Brighthouse system remained in operation here for over four weeks after a hurricane even though the only way to watch TV or access broadband was with battery power or a generator. 2: '70s CATV tech was 12 channel with no return path. It was crude, discrete point to point designs that looked like a ham put together from junk TVs while drinking cheap beer. They were touchy as hell, their tempco sucked, and they were impossible to service without a fully equipped test bed. the power supplies were simple, poorly regulated linear supplies with 85 C electrolytics that died quickly in the southern sun. The large diecast aluminum housing ran hot to the touch without the sun hitting them. That stuff was pretty well all scrapped out by the mid to late '80s by 36 or more channels with return capability. There was so much construction of upgraded systems that there was a severe shortage of new hardware through most of the mid '80s. That '80s tech was gone in all but the smallest systems by 2000. Today most systems are 450 MHz or higher, and are 'Fiber Enhanced' to provide telephone, broadband, movies on demand and pay per view services by breaking the system into cells that cover a few hundred homes, or less. 3: You know nothing about CATV franchises. 'A measly 100 feet' is more than adequate for a hell of a lot of drops & house wiring. If that is what the franchise calls for, THAT IS THE SPECIFICATION, no matter how much you whine like Sloman. A city or county won't pull a franchise over one or two people complaining about weak signals. They receive a fixed percentage of the system revenue every month, and the percentage was set when the economy was up. If they pull the franchise, another provider will offer a much lower percentage. It also involves legal fees, and causes the rates to go up for the users. Why put up with all that for a fraction of a percent of problems. Like people who built a private road a mile long and want to pay the standard install fee when it will cost about $15,000 to run a feeder for that one house. Or like that marina. It isn't a street. It's private property. If they want better service, let them pay for upgrades with .500 cable to each boat, with a .500 to 'F" connector for each boat. That would only cost a few hundred dollars a boat for materials. More if the cable is jacketed. If it isn't it won't last long in salt air. Double that for the hardware and labor to get a good idea of the costs. Oh, that's right. You're too cheap to even have cable TV. Read more carefully. I said TV doesn't matter to us, it is not about cost. Then why are you being such an ignorant prick about the issue when you have no horse in the race? You sound more like Dimbulb every day. I used to think highly of you, but no longer -- You can't have a sense of humor, if you have no sense. |
Increasing Cable TV signal strength
JIMMIE wrote: On Feb 10, 11:38 am, Jeff Liebermann wrote: On Fri, 10 Feb 2012 06:17:03 -0800 (PST), JIMMIE wrote: Jeff, I installed TVRO systems for several years and used a lot of F connectors. Suprisingly the ones I found that worked best were the ultra cheap ones that only took a pair of pliers to fasten These were the ones with the separate crimp rings. Used with some good quality heat shrink tubing this eliminated most of the problems you mention. I dont know why these connectors went away, my only guess is that someone wasn't making enough money on them. Jimmie Yech... Please try this test. Insert such a crimp type F connector and cable into some useless piece of equipment with a type F jack. Pull on the cable hard. In my experience, it doesn't take much to make the cable and connector part ways. Repeat with a screw on connector. Now, repeat the experiment using a properly assembled compression type F connector and cable. It takes considerably more brute force to break the connection. I think the official minimum pull test is 55 lbs, but I'm too lazy to Google for it now. Hiding the workmanship under shrink tube is not very functional. It will have little effect on the pull test. Most of the cable leakage problems I've seen (and found) were due to crimp type F connectors coming apart or badly crimped. That includes both the hex shaped crimp, and ones held together with a crimped ring. Bad: http://www.fconnector.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/12/F-Connector2.jpg Worse: http://www.showmecables.com/images/catalog/product/F-connector-RG59.j... Good: http://images.lowes.com/product/converted/783250/783250926510lg.jpg -- Jeff Liebermann 150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com Santa Cruz CA 95060http://802.11junk.com Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-255 Sorry Jeff but I never used my connectors to support my cables. You may be right but completely irrelevant to me. To me F connector and good connection shouldn't even be used in the same sentence. They are what that are, cheap connectors at best that uses the center conductor of the cable for a contact. Then you would hate most microwave connectors lit SMA. Now that is Yech. Heat shrink has nothing to do with the pull test or hiding poor workmanship but it does help keep corrosion down which is the biggest problem with F connectors. You didn't need heat shrink on good 'F' connectors. Ive never seen one pull apart except in the shoddiest of installations. One of the best things I have found to insure you maintain a good connection is to apply something like DeOxit to the connectors when you assemble them. Best done while all the parts are new. Not needed, if you use flooded outdoor cable. -- You can't have a sense of humor, if you have no sense. |
Increasing Cable TV signal strength
JIMMIE wrote: On Feb 10, 11:38 am, Jeff Liebermann wrote: On Fri, 10 Feb 2012 06:17:03 -0800 (PST), JIMMIE wrote: Jeff, I installed TVRO systems for several years and used a lot of F connectors. Suprisingly the ones I found that worked best were the ultra cheap ones that only took a pair of pliers to fasten These were the ones with the separate crimp rings. Used with some good quality heat shrink tubing this eliminated most of the problems you mention. I dont know why these connectors went away, my only guess is that someone wasn't making enough money on them. Jimmie Yech... Please try this test. Insert such a crimp type F connector and cable into some useless piece of equipment with a type F jack. Pull on the cable hard. In my experience, it doesn't take much to make the cable and connector part ways. Repeat with a screw on connector. Now, repeat the experiment using a properly assembled compression type F connector and cable. It takes considerably more brute force to break the connection. I think the official minimum pull test is 55 lbs, but I'm too lazy to Google for it now. Hiding the workmanship under shrink tube is not very functional. It will have little effect on the pull test. Most of the cable leakage problems I've seen (and found) were due to crimp type F connectors coming apart or badly crimped. That includes both the hex shaped crimp, and ones held together with a crimped ring. Bad: http://www.fconnector.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/12/F-Connector2.jpg Worse: http://www.showmecables.com/images/catalog/product/F-connector-RG59.j... Good: http://images.lowes.com/product/converted/783250/783250926510lg.jpg -- Jeff Liebermann 150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com Santa Cruz CA 95060http://802.11junk.com Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558 You are correct that the problem is in the hex crimp and part of this is because they started making the crimp made on to the connector. The other part is that you have to have a special tool to crimp them. All the pictures that you showed are require a special crimp tool. If these tools are worn or dont fit the particular plug/ cable combination you will get a bad crimp. The old style that is probably 40 years old now that you could crimp the little ring with a pair of pliers worked the best. Unfortunately you can no longer get them, well I do have a few. A 'special tool' that only cost about $20 and would do thousands of crimps before it was worn out. I've bought them new, on sale for $8 US. You admitted to using pliers on the cheap crap, and you certainly can't do that with a hex crimp. -- You can't have a sense of humor, if you have no sense. |
Increasing Cable TV signal strength
The_Giant_Rat_of_Sumatra wrote:
If you had any clue at all, you would be familiar with where the name comes from. So you fail there too, asshole. No surprise that you are a cultureless twit as well. That pretty much means that *I* have YOU calibrated. You are a total loser, or you would remember the art. The fact that you do not means that you were a drab loser ****tard back then as well. My fingernail clippings have more on the ball than you do, idiot. Bwuahahahaha! Which one are you? http://www.forward.com/articles/127941/ "A schmuck is, in short, someone who lacks not intelligence, but all insight into what is humanly appropriate and what is not. This makes his condition remediable. A schlemiel, a schlimazel and a schmendrik are irredeemably what they are. A schmuck can be enlightened. He can acquire, through a painful process of self-examination, the moral and social understanding that he has been missing. He can become, to revert to Wex’s dichotomy, a mentsh." -- VWW, P.E., K6EVE Using PCLOS |
Increasing Cable TV signal strength
"tom" wrote in message . net... On 2/11/2012 2:08 AM, Sal wrote: wrote in message . net... On Fri, 10 Feb 2012 05:52:31 -0800, The_Giant_Rat_of_Sumatra wrote: nuclear snippage tom K0TAR I plonked the guy days ago. It would be so-o-o-o great if people quoted him back little or none. I have no objection to appropriate profanity (and have been known to howl the unprintable on occasion, myself.) But when overused to no good end, ****/****ing,****er/****ed-up/****wad get tedious. "Sal" I was just making sure he was really the badass he's convinced that he is. He's not. He's actually kind of pitiful. Sooo, Plonk anyway! tom K0TAR :-)) "Sal" |
Increasing Cable TV signal strength
"The_Giant_Rat_of_Sumatra" wrote in message ... On Sat, 11 Feb 2012 09:47:14 -0800, "Wayne" wrote: "The_Giant_Rat_of_Sumatra" wrote in message .. . On Fri, 10 Feb 2012 20:52:11 -0600, tom wrote: On 2/10/2012 8:32 PM, Wayne wrote: He really needs to create a new file from which to cut and paste. Like most comedians', his jokes get stale after awhile. -- VWW, K6EVE - But you must admit that this normally quiet newsgroup finally has some activity. Who knows, this could take on the characteristics of the GFW. --Wayne W5GIE "GFW=Great Fractal Wars" Unfortunately the traffic has nothing to do with antennas. Things dried up here around 6 months ago. I suspect the people with brains and stories, and some of us remember who they are, are no longer with us or finally bailed due to the noise. I was playing with Moonrakers way back in the early seventies. - Moonrakers? LOL. Ok now we have you calibrated. No, you do not. I was 12 years old, and the gear was my dad's. You have nothing, and you know nothing. All you do is presume, and you presume wrong, boy. The antennas I work with now are everything from 18 foot diameter gateway heads to yagis for the military that we get in 20 foot long crates that put anything you ever worked with to shame. - So what? Before you were born, I was working on 2-30 MHz log periodic arrays that were collapsed into a nuc hard silo along with a telescoping tower. |
Increasing Cable TV signal strength
On Sat, 11 Feb 2012 08:02:37 -0800 (PST), JIMMIE
wrote: Sorry Jeff but I never used my connectors to support my cables. You may be right but completely irrelevant to me. Umm... you've never tripped over a cable, had the equipment fall off the table with the cables attached, run RG6a/u up a pole to where it has to support its own weight, moved furniture with cables still attached, flexed the connector when used as a test lead, pulled cable through the wall or conduit with connectors attached, etc? These are all very common situations which will stress the connector to cable connection. While it might not be a problem for a fixed (stapled in place) installation, it certainly will be a problem for the average home user. http://802.11junk.com/jeffl/pics/drivel/slides/mess01.html I find it odd that outdoor CATV uses quad shielded cable to prevent RF leakage and ingress, and having the cable swept to perfection, while you recommend using inferior F connectors. To me F connector and good connection shouldn't even be used in the same sentence. They are what that are, cheap connectors at best that uses the center conductor of the cable for a contact. Now that is Yech. I do have some issues with RG6a/u that uses copper plated steel core center wire. Mostly, it's a corrosion problem for outdoor connections where the home owner does their own wiring, and uses F connectors without the necessary rubber o-ring needed for waterproofing. I've swept F connectors on the bench and find them quite good and often superior to the rare 75 ohm TNC and BNC connectors near the top end (2GHz for satellite). Incidentally, most of the antennas (that survived a recent storm) on my roof use RG6a/u coax. The mismatch loss between 50 and 75 ohms is minimal. Some use F connectors, but most use BNC's made for RG6a/u. Heat shrink has nothing to do with the pull test or hiding poor workmanship but it does help keep corrosion down which is the biggest problem with F connectors. Ahem. I worked for a marine radio company during the 1970's. I learned a few things about waterproofing and corrosion. Heat shrink doesn't work. Capillary action along the heat shrink to connector boundary will suck the water into the connector. What I use (when needed) is a layer of 1" PTFE tape (or 1/2" if that's all I can find) over the connector. Once in place, a layer of Scotch 66 or other electrical tape to hold it in place. The PTFE will cold flow into the irregularities on the connector surface, and there will be zero capillary action. If I want UV resistance, I spray the tape with clear Krlyon (acrylic) spray. While we're on the topic, I've experimented with various allegedly waterproof enclosures and packages. The only ones I consider genuinely waterproof are sealed and pressurized with dry air. Anything less will eventually leak. Ive never seen one pull apart except in the shoddiest of installations. I have and all too often. I was at the neighbors trying to troubleshoot their Comcast cable tv and modem mess. They had some friend of theirs do the wiring. All the F connectors were crimp ring type and were falling apart. The coax was mostly RG-59 with maybe 80% coverage. I replaced the most disgusting and will finish the job when I have time. One of the best things I have found to insure you maintain a good connection is to apply something like DeOxit to the connectors when you assemble them. Best done while all the parts are new. DeOxit and Cramolin contain oleic acid, which will slightly corrode copper. It's good for CLEANING connectors by removing the oxides, but should not be left on the connector. If you want to make sure that you can take the connector apart after the threads rot in place due to galvanic action between the aluminum receptacle, and the nickel plated crimp type F connector, some silicon or lithium grease would probably be better. Some notes on the contents: http://www.antiqueradios.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=82058&start=40&sid=71ca160c8f60768 6916a0f355e9ecc34 Jimmie As for special tools, I love them. My various cable preparation tools for various coax cable have saved me countless hours of fumbling with a pocket knife and diagonal cutters. Using the various compression tools on F connectors almost guarantee a good connection, unless I did something dumb. Same with crimp lugs, various LMR-xxx coax cables, and Anderson Power Pole connectors. The days of using a hammer or vice grips to crimp a connector are over. The cost can be substantial, but is well worth it if you work with connectors regularly. http://802.11junk.com/jeffl/antennas/Misc/slides/crimpers.html About $35/ea. -- Jeff Liebermann 150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558 |
Increasing Cable TV signal strength
Michael A. Terrell wrote:
Joerg wrote: Michael A. Terrell wrote: Joerg wrote: Michael A. Terrell wrote: Joerg wrote: Michael A. Terrell wrote: Joerg wrote: amdx wrote: Hi All, I'm on a boat, about 170ft from the utility post. Recently our cable company switched to the wonderful world of Digital TV. I got the new digital converter and had no picture. I took the box back and got a second box, still no picture. So now I suspect a weak signal and confirm that it is the cable length. The cable company came out and gave me a better cable than I had installed. At this point I have a picture but it is intermittent. The signal at the utility post has 3 outputs and had a four way splitter, I suggested the cable guy put in two 2 way splitters and give me the stronger (first) tap. That got my signal to work almost all the time. I'd like to get the signal to work 100% of the time. Looks like the cable guys screwed up. In your opinion. If their company cable box doesn't deliver a useful and reliable signal I call that screwed up. One pays for a service and expects to either get it delivered as promised or money back. ... If they are delivering the level called for in their franchise, they didn't screw up. It has always been up to the customer to pay for or provide extra equipment for non standard installs. Mike's install does not sound non-standard. 170ft cable drop towards premises which is fairly normal, plus the cable company's set-top box. Grow up. That is an excessive length drop. A standard drop is under 100 feet. You think you know everything, and that the world has to live by your rules. You don't, and it doesn't. ... http://www.starvision.tv/lineup_res.htm Quote "Maximum Drop Length 300 Feet" Now that's what I call good service. ... I'll bet you've never even seen a CATV franchise, or the dozen of pages of specifications agreed to by both the CATV company and the local government. The CATV company isn't a Santa Clause machine, and local governments know why there are limits to the service provided. If there were't, no one could afford to build or operate a CATV system. You've never designed a headend, or a physical plant If they build to supply higher port levels, it has to start at the headend, and requires closer spaced trunk amplifers. The system noise goes up from all of the cascaded amplifers, and the equipment runs hotter, withj a very reduced service life. When you can design an RF distribution system of more than 500 MHz bandwidth and has over 10,000 output ports, with the gain stabilized to a couple dBmv 20 miles from the headend and over a range from sub zero F to + 100 F then you can tell me I'm wrong. One headend I designed and built was only off by .1 dBmv at the test port on the first trunk amp which was a half mile from the head end. If you can do better than that, I'll listen to you and your opinions See above. Obviously others can. And yes, I have designed RF broadband power amps. Lots of them. Not just lashing up boxes but the actual transistor level circuitry including layout guidance for the nasty stuff. Fact is, if a cable company isn't competent to do a 170ft drop they should decline the job. Otherwise it is a screw-up, plain and simple. In our area they'd lose their shirts to the satellite guys because there are many houses like ours where there is no reasonable way to get from the street to the house with a 100ft limit. We have around 200ft that's still there from the early 90's and the previous owner said cable TV worked just fine for them. We are not subscribed because TV ain't that important to us. Yawn. You constantly harp about having to meet specs in medical, but whine like a drunken jackass when other businesses have to meet their specs. yes, they could design the sytems to 300 feet or more, but the cost to every customer on the system would go up. In medical I tend to push the envelope and so do the standards committees. Sometimes based on what we do. I designed all my cardiac stuff defibrillator-proof, always, although it was not the law yet. Then they made it law, because it makes sense. You do it because they wouldn't hire you if you couldn't meet specs, just like every other consultant, engineer or tech. They might even jail you for your incompetence for not meeting the specs. Correct. And the spec for a competent cable company is typically 300ft, as I have shown in the link. Plus the one below. Believe it or not but I like to have to meet specs in medical because they protect people. Including you. Believe it or not, most technical people have that same standard. You're nothing special. Never said I was. Except that I do exceed standards at times where I believe it is necessary. In the case of med electronics that has likely saved lives. I do not subscribe to the idea that a standard is always good enough. Because sometimes they are not. ... Would you like to pay an extra 20% to 30% just so a very few locations can get better service? Out here we do not pay extra. Our cable companies out tend do use modern technology, not cheap stuff from the 70's. A cable company that isn't competent enough to do more than a measly 100ft would lose their franchise rather quickly. Once again the all knowing Jeorge shows his ignorance. No. I suppose you know what MoCA is. Do you consider them ignorant? Because they say the very same thing that I said. What matters is today's state-of-the-art. Nobody cares about what it was in the 80's. Today this is state-of-the-art: http://www.cablefax.com/ct/sections/...ier_44237.html Quote "The Multimedia Over Coax Alliance (MoCA) provides a standard ..." then Quote "The maximum cable distance supported between the root and the last outlet is 300 feet, with a maximum attenuation of 25 dB". And this is for MoCA, not just cable TV. 1: You don't know what you're talking about, about the cost of service. Any extra operating costs become part of the basic service that everyone pays. You won't work for nothing, and the utilities don't give them free electricity. The service companies don't repair the equipment for free. Do you have any idea how many amplifiers, taps and set top boxes are needed for 10,000 active ports? To provide hotter ports require more amplifiers, and raises the system noise floor. You 'designed an amplifier'. Big deal. A lot of engineers 'designed and amplifier' and those companies are long out of business. ... So how many linear RF amplifiers above 1W have you personally designed and guided through layout? Hint: All my clients are still in business and I am sure will be for a long time to come. ... Current CATV amplifiers use hybrids designed specifically for the application and they use them for many reasons. That just leave the design of the 60V modified sine wave to DC power supplies, equalizers, gain control, equalization and remote switching. Some locations also have remote monitoring so the headend can check system status on a continuous basis. It can also report outages when some of the equipment doesn't respond. They can even detect power failures and monitor the battery status in the standby power supplies to give them time to get a portable generator to the area if it is an extended outage. The local Brighthouse system remained in operation here for over four weeks after a hurricane even though the only way to watch TV or access broadband was with battery power or a generator. If that company can't do more than 100ft they'd fail miserably in our market. It's not just our house, it's also the neighbor to the west, and the one after that, and ... 2: '70s CATV tech was 12 channel with no return path. It was crude, discrete point to point designs that looked like a ham put together from junk TVs while drinking cheap beer. They were touchy as hell, their tempco sucked, and they were impossible to service without a fully equipped test bed. the power supplies were simple, poorly regulated linear supplies with 85 C electrolytics that died quickly in the southern sun. The large diecast aluminum housing ran hot to the touch without the sun hitting them. That stuff was pretty well all scrapped out by the mid to late '80s by 36 or more channels with return capability. There was so much construction of upgraded systems that there was a severe shortage of new hardware through most of the mid '80s. That '80s tech was gone in all but the smallest systems by 2000. Today most systems are 450 MHz or higher, and are 'Fiber Enhanced' to provide telephone, broadband, movies on demand and pay per view services by breaking the system into cells that cover a few hundred homes, or less. 3: You know nothing about CATV franchises. 'A measly 100 feet' is more than adequate for a hell of a lot of drops & house wiring. ... No, it is not. If you don't believe me check out Cameron Park, CA, especially the area of the Estates. Then tell me how you want to do that with 100ft drops. ... If that is what the franchise calls for, THAT IS THE SPECIFICATION, ... And the franchise would get kicked out of the market around here. You can't serve this market with a sub-par spec. The big automotive companies had once exhibited a "Well, this is the spec and that's that" attitude like you do in this thread. Then they learned, the hard way. In part by essentially going on welfare which was embarrassing. ... no matter how much you whine like Sloman. A city or county won't pull a franchise over one or two people complaining about weak signals. ... They will if there's a whole big crowd showing up at the next meeting. Now I won't because I only watch the evening news via antenna. But I know a whole lot of folks who would be miffed to be declined service because they are literally addicted to the sports channels. Many would just get satellite though, they market that quite aggressively these days. ... They receive a fixed percentage of the system revenue every month, and the percentage was set when the economy was up. If they pull the franchise, another provider will offer a much lower percentage. It also involves legal fees, and causes the rates to go up for the users. The county folks have one much more important thing on their mind: How to get re-elected. That's what'll matter most to them. They know that seeing complaints about what many people perceive as a utility service they have "rights to" in the paper is not the way to get re-elected. ... Why put up with all that for a fraction of a percent of problems. Like people who built a private road a mile long and want to pay the standard install fee when it will cost about $15,000 to run a feeder for that one house. Or like that marina. It isn't a street. It's private property. If they want better service, let them pay for upgrades with .500 cable to each boat, with a .500 to 'F" connector for each boat. That would only cost a few hundred dollars a boat for materials. More if the cable is jacketed. If it isn't it won't last long in salt air. Double that for the hardware and labor to get a good idea of the costs. Then answer a question I asked you before but you did not comment on it: Why did Mike's cable provider not decline service? Obviously it worked reliably in the analog days and now with DTV it doesn't. If they can't handle the 170ft drop after the digital switch, why did they not inform Mike, cancel the service on their part and send someone out to pick up the set-top box? [...] -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ |
Increasing Cable TV signal strength
"VWWall" wrote in message m... The_Giant_Rat_of_Sumatra wrote: If you had any clue at all, you would be familiar with where the name comes from. So you fail there too, asshole. No surprise that you are a cultureless twit as well. That pretty much means that *I* have YOU calibrated. You are a total loser, or you would remember the art. The fact that you do not means that you were a drab loser ****tard back then as well. My fingernail clippings have more on the ball than you do, idiot. Bwuahahahaha! Which one are you? http://www.forward.com/articles/127941/ "A schmuck is, in short, someone who lacks not intelligence, but all insight into what is humanly appropriate and what is not. This makes his condition remediable. A schlemiel, a schlimazel and a schmendrik are irredeemably what they are. A schmuck can be enlightened. He can acquire, through a painful process of self-examination, the moral and social understanding that he has been missing. He can become, to revert to Wex’s dichotomy, a mentsh." VWW, P.E., K6EVE Using PCLOS - My money is on him being a schlimazel...the guy the schlemiel spills the soup on. Wayne W5GIE /W6 |
Increasing Cable TV signal strength
"tom" wrote in message . net... On 2/11/2012 2:08 AM, Sal wrote: wrote in message . net... On Fri, 10 Feb 2012 05:52:31 -0800, The_Giant_Rat_of_Sumatra wrote: nuclear snippage tom K0TAR I plonked the guy days ago. It would be so-o-o-o great if people quoted him back little or none. I have no objection to appropriate profanity (and have been known to howl the unprintable on occasion, myself.) But when overused to no good end, ****/****ing,****er/****ed-up/****wad get tedious. "Sal" I was just making sure he was really the badass he's convinced that he is. He's not. He's actually kind of pitiful. Sooo, Plonk anyway! - Guess if you are going to plonk him, I'll have to do it also... :) Wayne W5GIE /W6 tom K0TAR |
Increasing Cable TV signal strength
"Michael Coslo" wrote in message ... But the only time there might be an issue was if the system was over-amped, then there could be problems with proof of performance certification. I saw a case of that twenty years ago in Key West, Florida. I suspect the authorities had to look the other way because affordable technology to do it better didn't exist. The Florida Keys were served out of a headend that was close enough to the mainland to get decent OTA signals. however, by the time those Miami signals got to Key West, they were pretty bad. I have no idea how many amps were used. (IIRC, local origination channels were OK.) I think five amps is about the limit due to added noise and cross-mod. "Sal" |
Increasing Cable TV signal strength
In message , Sal writes
"Michael Coslo" wrote in message ... But the only time there might be an issue was if the system was over-amped, then there could be problems with proof of performance certification. I saw a case of that twenty years ago in Key West, Florida. I suspect the authorities had to look the other way because affordable technology to do it better didn't exist. The Florida Keys were served out of a headend that was close enough to the mainland to get decent OTA signals. however, by the time those Miami signals got to Key West, they were pretty bad. I have no idea how many amps were used. (IIRC, local origination channels were OK.) I think five amps is about the limit due to added noise and cross-mod. "Sal" In practice, without serious and constant TLC, the length of cascades of amplifiers is usually limited by the frequency response flatness (or lack of it), and the ability to maintain it. I think that the maximum I've been involved with was a cascade of about 20 normal trunk amplifiers plus three or four distribution amps / line extenders on the end. Thank heavens these days for optical. -- Ian |
Increasing Cable TV signal strength
"Ian Jackson" wrote in message ... In message , Sal writes snip I think five amps is about the limit due to added noise and cross-mod. In practice, without serious and constant TLC, the length of cascades of amplifiers is usually limited by the frequency response flatness (or lack of it), and the ability to maintain it. I think that the maximum I've been involved with was a cascade of about 20 normal trunk amplifiers plus three or four distribution amps / line extenders on the end. Thank heavens these days for optical. 20! Wow! That would have to be some high-grade stuff. Thanks. "Sal" |
Increasing Cable TV signal strength
On Sat, 11 Feb 2012 11:29:35 -0800, VWWall wrote:
but all insight into what is humanly appropriate and what is not. So, you think his retarded suppositions were "appropriate"? You really are a ****ing total retard. THAT was an appropriate assessment. |
Increasing Cable TV signal strength
Joerg wrote: Michael A. Terrell wrote: Joerg wrote: You do it because they wouldn't hire you if you couldn't meet specs, just like every other consultant, engineer or tech. They might even jail you for your incompetence for not meeting the specs. Correct. And the spec for a competent cable company is typically 300ft, as I have shown in the link. Plus the one below. Believe it or not but I like to have to meet specs in medical because they protect people. Including you. Believe it or not, most technical people have that same standard. You're nothing special. Never said I was. Except that I do exceed standards at times where I believe it is necessary. In the case of med electronics that has likely saved lives. I do not subscribe to the idea that a standard is always good enough. Because sometimes they are not. ... Would you like to pay an extra 20% to 30% just so a very few locations can get better service? Out here we do not pay extra. Our cable companies out tend do use modern technology, not cheap stuff from the 70's. A cable company that isn't competent enough to do more than a measly 100ft would lose their franchise rather quickly. Once again the all knowing Jeorge shows his ignorance. No. I suppose you know what MoCA is. Do you consider them ignorant? Because they say the very same thing that I said. What matters is today's state-of-the-art. Nobody cares about what it was in the 80's. Today this is state-of-the-art: http://www.cablefax.com/ct/sections/...ier_44237.html Did you miss: "IN THE NEXT DECADE"? Quote "The Multimedia Over Coax Alliance (MoCA) provides a standard ..." then Quote "The maximum cable distance supported between the root and the last outlet is 300 feet, with a maximum attenuation of 25 dB". And this is for MoCA, not just cable TV. 1: You don't know what you're talking about, about the cost of service. Any extra operating costs become part of the basic service that everyone pays. You won't work for nothing, and the utilities don't give them free electricity. The service companies don't repair the equipment for free. Do you have any idea how many amplifiers, taps and set top boxes are needed for 10,000 active ports? To provide hotter ports require more amplifiers, and raises the system noise floor. You 'designed an amplifier'. Big deal. A lot of engineers 'designed and amplifier' and those companies are long out of business. ... So how many linear RF amplifiers above 1W have you personally designed and guided through layout? Hint: All my clients are still in business and I am sure will be for a long time to come. ... Current CATV amplifiers use hybrids designed specifically for the application and they use them for many reasons. That just leave the design of the 60V modified sine wave to DC power supplies, equalizers, gain control, equalization and remote switching. Some locations also have remote monitoring so the headend can check system status on a continuous basis. It can also report outages when some of the equipment doesn't respond. They can even detect power failures and monitor the battery status in the standby power supplies to give them time to get a portable generator to the area if it is an extended outage. The local Brighthouse system remained in operation here for over four weeks after a hurricane even though the only way to watch TV or access broadband was with battery power or a generator. If that company can't do more than 100ft they'd fail miserably in our market. It's not just our house, it's also the neighbor to the west, and the one after that, and ... 2: '70s CATV tech was 12 channel with no return path. It was crude, discrete point to point designs that looked like a ham put together from junk TVs while drinking cheap beer. They were touchy as hell, their tempco sucked, and they were impossible to service without a fully equipped test bed. the power supplies were simple, poorly regulated linear supplies with 85 C electrolytics that died quickly in the southern sun. The large diecast aluminum housing ran hot to the touch without the sun hitting them. That stuff was pretty well all scrapped out by the mid to late '80s by 36 or more channels with return capability. There was so much construction of upgraded systems that there was a severe shortage of new hardware through most of the mid '80s. That '80s tech was gone in all but the smallest systems by 2000. Today most systems are 450 MHz or higher, and are 'Fiber Enhanced' to provide telephone, broadband, movies on demand and pay per view services by breaking the system into cells that cover a few hundred homes, or less. 3: You know nothing about CATV franchises. 'A measly 100 feet' is more than adequate for a hell of a lot of drops & house wiring. ... No, it is not. If you don't believe me check out Cameron Park, CA, especially the area of the Estates. Then tell me how you want to do that with 100ft drops. ... If that is what the franchise calls for, THAT IS THE SPECIFICATION, ... And the franchise would get kicked out of the market around here. You can't serve this market with a sub-par spec. The big automotive companies had once exhibited a "Well, this is the spec and that's that" attitude like you do in this thread. Then they learned, the hard way. In part by essentially going on welfare which was embarrassing. ... no matter how much you whine like Sloman. A city or county won't pull a franchise over one or two people complaining about weak signals. ... They will if there's a whole big crowd showing up at the next meeting. Now I won't because I only watch the evening news via antenna. But I know a whole lot of folks who would be miffed to be declined service because they are literally addicted to the sports channels. Many would just get satellite though, they market that quite aggressively these days. A big crowd is what percentage of their customer base? ... They receive a fixed percentage of the system revenue every month, and the percentage was set when the economy was up. If they pull the franchise, another provider will offer a much lower percentage. It also involves legal fees, and causes the rates to go up for the users. The county folks have one much more important thing on their mind: How to get re-elected. That's what'll matter most to them. They know that seeing complaints about what many people perceive as a utility service they have "rights to" in the paper is not the way to get re-elected. No one has a 'right to' cable TV. I was at one meeting where a citizen was demanding that they revoke our franchise. They told him that one complaint out of 10,000 customers wasn't enough reason to revoke. he was as arrogant as you. Everything had to be his way. He got really ****ed when they told him to buy a satellite dish and go away. His demand was a s ignorant as yours. He was demanding that he bring back CBS ARTS, and wouldn't listen that CBS had dropped the service. One other complaint was from a woman demanding that our franchise be pulled because CSPAN was down for a couple days during the modification of a 5 meter dish to multiple feeds. ... Why put up with all that for a fraction of a percent of problems. Like people who built a private road a mile long and want to pay the standard install fee when it will cost about $15,000 to run a feeder for that one house. Or like that marina. It isn't a street. It's private property. If they want better service, let them pay for upgrades with .500 cable to each boat, with a .500 to 'F" connector for each boat. That would only cost a few hundred dollars a boat for materials. More if the cable is jacketed. If it isn't it won't last long in salt air. Double that for the hardware and labor to get a good idea of the costs. Then answer a question I asked you before but you did not comment on it: Why did Mike's cable provider not decline service? Obviously it worked reliably in the analog days and now with DTV it doesn't. If they can't handle the 170ft drop after the digital switch, why did they not inform Mike, cancel the service on their part and send someone out to pick up the set-top box? Sigh. Just because there is a new agreement for the industry doesn't mean that all existing have to comply. Some companies are FIOS. By your standards, everything else should be replaced overnight. Then the distance won't matter at all. I doubt that the income from that marina will ever pay back the construction costs. the system worked for analog, when it was installed. There are no guarantees in life. Stop trying to walk on water, you'll drown. -- You can't have a sense of humor, if you have no sense. |
Increasing Cable TV signal strength
In message , Sal writes
"Ian Jackson" wrote in message ... In message , Sal writes snip I think five amps is about the limit due to added noise and cross-mod. In practice, without serious and constant TLC, the length of cascades of amplifiers is usually limited by the frequency response flatness (or lack of it), and the ability to maintain it. I think that the maximum I've been involved with was a cascade of about 20 normal trunk amplifiers plus three or four distribution amps / line extenders on the end. Thank heavens these days for optical. 20! Wow! That would have to be some high-grade stuff. Thanks. I think the equipment was fairly typical of its type. -- Ian |
Increasing Cable TV signal strength MoCA
Joerg wrote: http://www.cablefax.com/ct/sections/...ier_44237.html Quote "The Multimedia Over Coax Alliance (MoCA) provides a standard ..." then Quote "The maximum cable distance supported between the root and the last outlet is 300 feet, with a maximum attenuation of 25 dB". And this is for MoCA, not just cable TV. MoCA is home networking, hence the 300 foot figure. A drop at +10 dBmv already allows a 25 dB loss for the cable modem, since they are designed to work to -15 dBmv. That webpage also mentions verifing that a "drop amplifier does not block Moca". In other words, it's home networking for multimedia devices and has nothing to do with the length of the cable drop. It is to allow customers to stream audio and video within their home, and use services like Netflix & Hulu on their TV sets. -- You can't have a sense of humor, if you have no sense. |
Increasing Cable TV signal strength
Michael A. Terrell wrote:
Joerg wrote: Michael A. Terrell wrote: Joerg wrote: You do it because they wouldn't hire you if you couldn't meet specs, just like every other consultant, engineer or tech. They might even jail you for your incompetence for not meeting the specs. Correct. And the spec for a competent cable company is typically 300ft, as I have shown in the link. Plus the one below. Believe it or not but I like to have to meet specs in medical because they protect people. Including you. Believe it or not, most technical people have that same standard. You're nothing special. Never said I was. Except that I do exceed standards at times where I believe it is necessary. In the case of med electronics that has likely saved lives. I do not subscribe to the idea that a standard is always good enough. Because sometimes they are not. ... Would you like to pay an extra 20% to 30% just so a very few locations can get better service? Out here we do not pay extra. Our cable companies out tend do use modern technology, not cheap stuff from the 70's. A cable company that isn't competent enough to do more than a measly 100ft would lose their franchise rather quickly. Once again the all knowing Jeorge shows his ignorance. No. I suppose you know what MoCA is. Do you consider them ignorant? Because they say the very same thing that I said. What matters is today's state-of-the-art. Nobody cares about what it was in the 80's. Today this is state-of-the-art: http://www.cablefax.com/ct/sections/...ier_44237.html Did you miss: "IN THE NEXT DECADE"? Where do you live? The parts of FL I have seen were are technologically advanced, I guess. This stuff is rolled out here in CA, big time. Things like the DCX3200M box and their DVR are MoCA. In case you've missed it, MoCA has already release 2.0. More than a year ago ... -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ |
Increasing Cable TV signal strength MoCA
Michael A. Terrell wrote:
Joerg wrote: http://www.cablefax.com/ct/sections/...ier_44237.html Quote "The Multimedia Over Coax Alliance (MoCA) provides a standard ..." then Quote "The maximum cable distance supported between the root and the last outlet is 300 feet, with a maximum attenuation of 25 dB". And this is for MoCA, not just cable TV. MoCA is home networking, hence the 300 foot figure. A drop at +10 dBmv already allows a 25 dB loss for the cable modem, since they are designed to work to -15 dBmv. That webpage also mentions verifing that a "drop amplifier does not block Moca". In other words, it's home networking for multimedia devices and has nothing to do with the length of the cable drop. It is to allow customers to stream audio and video within their home, and use services like Netflix & Hulu on their TV sets. It is the modern cable TV, like it or not. Companies not playing will likely be packing some day. Personally I doubt it'll do much for home networking, at least not appliance control. Computing, yes, and that's the new game in town. Cable companies offering "all-in-one" packages where you get phone, Internet, TV and all that from the "company store". Pretty pricey, last time I looked it was $99/mo and that only for the first year. Probably goes up afterwards. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ |
Increasing Cable TV SIGNAL LEVELS
On 2/10/2012 8:11 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Fri, 10 Feb 2012 11:47:54 -0600, wrote: The Box is a CISCO RNG100 Only data I know how to get is; Tuner 537.00 Mhz 2dbmv TDC 75.25 Mhz 5dbmv RDC 20.00 Mhz 30.0dbmv Yes 30.0 It's the same as the Cisco Explorer 1540C with some features removed by Comcast. http://www.cincinnatibell.com/shared_content/pdf/tv/exp1540_uguide.pdf How to get into the diagnostics: Press and hold SELECT on front of unit until the MAIL light starts to flash, then press INFO. Or Press and hold PAUSE on remote until MAIL light starts to flash (around 10-15 seconds), then press PAGE-UP (-). On some remotes, PAGE (+) might need to be used instead. See if you can excavate the SNR numbers. Maybe there's RF garbage on the systems (oscillating distribution amp, ingress, whatever, etc). Hi Jeff, I don't seem to be able to follow your directions, I don't think I have enough buttons. To get the info I posted, Push and hold the power button until the power light blinks, then push power again and the info screen comes up. I don't know what the MAIL light is, I don't have a select button nor a INFO button. Hey started pushing buttons on the remote, found I can scroll through 15 pages off stuuf I don't have a clue about. Got some "RF Statistics on page 5" Current FDC Freq. 75.250 Level 5 dbmv S/N 29db Errs/Ave 0/0 Current Qam Freq. 513 Mhz Level -1dbmv S/N 35db Errs/Ave 11/0 or 11/1 or 11/3 but mostly 11/0 That's all I can see. Mikek |
Increasing Cable TV signal strength MoCA
Joerg wrote: Michael A. Terrell wrote: ? Joerg wrote: ?? http://www.cablefax.com/ct/sections/...ier_44237.html ?? ?? Quote "The Multimedia Over Coax Alliance (MoCA) provides a standard ..." ?? ?? then ?? ?? Quote "The maximum cable distance supported between the root and the ?? last outlet is 300 feet, with a maximum attenuation of 25 dB". And this ?? is for MoCA, not just cable TV. ? ? ? MoCA is home networking, hence the 300 foot figure. A drop at +10 ? dBmv already allows a 25 dB loss for the cable modem, since they are ? designed to work to -15 dBmv. That webpage also mentions verifing that a ? "drop amplifier does not block Moca". In other words, it's home ? networking for multimedia devices and has nothing to do with the length ? of the cable drop. It is to allow customers to stream audio and video ? within their home, and use services like Netflix ? Hulu on their TV ? sets. ? It is the modern cable TV, like it or not. Sigh. You never back down, even when you are shown that you are wrong. You are wrong and it's eating you alive. Even the title of the article in your link states: "Testing And Deployment: Making MoCA In-Home Networking Easier" and the article starts with: "Market growth and competition for enhanced video services revenue have MSOs and telcos scrambling for technology and operational advantages. In the next decade, consumer electronics with embedded Internet and IP video support will be widely available." No where does it mention a cable drop. It is a method to transmit digital data between a DVR and any TV connected to the system. Nothing more. It's no wonder you can't get a computer to run properly, when you can't even read a simple networking article like this and understand it. Show me anywhere in that article that states a 300 foot cable TV drop is required. The word drop shows up twice and the first is part of another word: 1: "Additionally, the technician can monitor the MoCA channel for bit errors based on corrected or dropped MoCA packets." ^^^^ 2: "A drop amplifier that does not bypass the MoCA spectrum." ^^^^ This means that some installations require a bi-directional amplifier to compensate for long drops just as they always have. 'Drop Amplifier' refers to a single output CATV amplifier as opposed to the multiport CATV distribution amplifiers used in apartment complexes and condos. Companies not playing will likely be packing some day. Maybe in 30 years, when tiny rural systems can't find anything cheaper on the market and upgrade in bits and pieces. YOU know all about being a cheapskate. Personally I doubt it'll do much for home networking, at least least not appliance control. Why should it? Why would your DVR need to talk to your refrigerator? It is strictly a streaming system for home Entertainment. It's been available here, for years. Hell, even my dad's Direct TV sat system w/DVR does it. Appliances don't need a TV tuner and other crap for a simple ethernet interface. Computing, yes, and that's the new game in town. Cable companies offering "all-in-one" packages where you get phone, Internet, TV and all that from the "company store". Phone and internet are delivered via a cable modem that works to -15 dBmv. Pretty pricey, last time I looked it was $99/mo and that only for the first year. Probably goes up afterwards. It goes a hell of a lot higher than that. That $99 doesn't get you basic cable, internet and phone here. Add on more tiers and hgher bandwith internet and it can pass $250 a month. You are so ignorant that it's scary. Read ALL of the page you linked to and look at the images. It is a lousy home network via coax streaming media standard and nothing more. Not that I ever expect you to be man enough to admit you are wrong. Everything is always someone else's fault. No one ever does anything right but you. The fact that you design medical electronics scares the hell out of me. -- You can't have a sense of humor, if you have no sense. |
Increasing Cable TV SIGNAL LEVELS
amdx wrote: On 2/10/2012 8:11 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote: ? On Fri, 10 Feb 2012 11:47:54 -0600, ? ? wrote: ? ?? The Box is a CISCO RNG100 ?? Only data I know how to get is; ?? Tuner 537.00 Mhz 2dbmv ?? TDC 75.25 Mhz 5dbmv ?? RDC 20.00 Mhz 30.0dbmv Yes 30.0 ?? ? ? It's the same as the Cisco Explorer 1540C with some features removed ? by Comcast. ? ?http://www.cincinnatibell.com/shared...40_uguide.pdf? ? ? How to get into the diagnostics: ? Press and hold SELECT on front of unit until the MAIL light ? starts to flash, then press INFO. ? Or ? Press and hold PAUSE on remote until MAIL light starts to ? flash (around 10-15 seconds), then press PAGE-UP (-). ? On some remotes, PAGE (+) might need to be used instead. ? See if you can excavate the SNR numbers. Maybe there's RF garbage on ? the systems (oscillating distribution amp, ingress, whatever, etc). Hi Jeff, I don't seem to be able to follow your directions, I don't think I have enough buttons. To get the info I posted, Push and hold the power button until the power light blinks, then push power again and the info screen comes up. I don't know what the MAIL light is, I don't have a select button nor a INFO button. Hey started pushing buttons on the remote, found I can scroll through 15 pages off stuuf I don't have a clue about. Got some "RF Statistics on page 5" Current FDC Freq. 75.250 Level 5 dbmv S/N 29db Errs/Ave 0/0 Current Qam Freq. 513 Mhz Level -1dbmv S/N 35db Errs/Ave 11/0 or 11/1 or 11/3 but mostly 11/0 It shows that you have a 6 dB slope, and the high end is 1 dBmv below the standard level. It also shows a lot of errors in the recovered data. QAM is the digital TV signal. Unscrambled channels are referred to as Clear QAM -- You can't have a sense of humor, if you have no sense. |
Increasing Cable TV SIGNAL LEVELS
On 2/12/2012 10:27 AM, amdx wrote:
On 2/10/2012 8:11 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote: On Fri, 10 Feb 2012 11:47:54 -0600, wrote: The Box is a CISCO RNG100 Only data I know how to get is; Tuner 537.00 Mhz 2dbmv TDC 75.25 Mhz 5dbmv RDC 20.00 Mhz 30.0dbmv Yes 30.0 I just noted I didn't have a picture on ch 42. I went to the RF page, my 537 Mhz numbers were Level 6dbmv S/N 0 db Errs/Ave 0/7 changed to later 0/1742 Status Unlocked VS. When it was working Level -1dbmv S/N 35db Errs/Ave 11/0 or 11/1 or 11/3 but mostly 11/0 Status Locked Mikek |
Increasing Cable TV SIGNAL LEVELS
In message , Michael A.
Terrell writes amdx wrote: On 2/10/2012 8:11 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote: ? On Fri, 10 Feb 2012 11:47:54 -0600, ? ? wrote: ? ?? The Box is a CISCO RNG100 ?? Only data I know how to get is; ?? Tuner 537.00 Mhz 2dbmv ?? TDC 75.25 Mhz 5dbmv ?? RDC 20.00 Mhz 30.0dbmv Yes 30.0 ?? ? ? It's the same as the Cisco Explorer 1540C with some features removed ? by Comcast. ? ?http://www.cincinnatibell.com/shared...40_uguide.pdf? ? ? How to get into the diagnostics: ? Press and hold SELECT on front of unit until the MAIL light ? starts to flash, then press INFO. ? Or ? Press and hold PAUSE on remote until MAIL light starts to ? flash (around 10-15 seconds), then press PAGE-UP (-). ? On some remotes, PAGE (+) might need to be used instead. ? See if you can excavate the SNR numbers. Maybe there's RF garbage on ? the systems (oscillating distribution amp, ingress, whatever, etc). Hi Jeff, I don't seem to be able to follow your directions, I don't think I have enough buttons. To get the info I posted, Push and hold the power button until the power light blinks, then push power again and the info screen comes up. I don't know what the MAIL light is, I don't have a select button nor a INFO button. Hey started pushing buttons on the remote, found I can scroll through 15 pages off stuuf I don't have a clue about. Got some "RF Statistics on page 5" Current FDC Freq. 75.250 Level 5 dbmv S/N 29db Errs/Ave 0/0 Current Qam Freq. 513 Mhz Level -1dbmv S/N 35db Errs/Ave 11/0 or 11/1 or 11/3 but mostly 11/0 It shows that you have a 6 dB slope, and the high end is 1 dBmv below the standard level. It also shows a lot of errors in the recovered data. QAM is the digital TV signal. Unscrambled channels are referred to as Clear QAM Presumably 75.25MHz is an analogue signal? In the UK, at least while the cable system has carried a mixture of analogues and digitals, the digitals have been run 10dB below the analogues. If 75.25MHz had been digital, it would be set at -5dBmV, so there would be a rising slope of 4dB, LF to HF. In any case, if the 513MHz digital is -1dBmV, and other HF signals are similar, that is more than sufficient for a digital set-top box. I would think it should work reliably down to around -15dBmV. If I'm right, whatever the problem is, it isn't being caused by a lack of signal level. -- Ian |
Increasing Cable TV signal strength MoCA
Michael A. Terrell wrote:
Joerg wrote: Michael A. Terrell wrote: ? Joerg wrote: ?? http://www.cablefax.com/ct/sections/...ier_44237.html ?? ?? Quote "The Multimedia Over Coax Alliance (MoCA) provides a standard ..." ?? ?? then ?? ?? Quote "The maximum cable distance supported between the root and the ?? last outlet is 300 feet, with a maximum attenuation of 25 dB". And this ?? is for MoCA, not just cable TV. ? ? ? MoCA is home networking, hence the 300 foot figure. A drop at +10 ? dBmv already allows a 25 dB loss for the cable modem, since they are ? designed to work to -15 dBmv. That webpage also mentions verifing that a ? "drop amplifier does not block Moca". In other words, it's home ? networking for multimedia devices and has nothing to do with the length ? of the cable drop. It is to allow customers to stream audio and video ? within their home, and use services like Netflix ? Hulu on their TV ? sets. ? It is the modern cable TV, like it or not. Sigh. You never back down, even when you are shown that you are wrong. Because I am not. http://publicservice.vermont.gov/con...rts_cable.html Quote "If its under 300 feet, its free to the consumer". Yes, it is as simple as that. You are within 300ft and the cable company must serve you. This is state-of-the-art. Now you'll probably declare the whole State of Vermont to be wrong? [...] -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ |
Increasing Cable TV signal strength MoCA
On Sun, 12 Feb 2012 13:54:36 -0800, Joerg wrote:
Michael A. Terrell wrote: Joerg wrote: Michael A. Terrell wrote: ? Joerg wrote: ?? http://www.cablefax.com/ct/sections/...ier_44237.html ?? ?? Quote "The Multimedia Over Coax Alliance (MoCA) provides a standard ..." ?? ?? then ?? ?? Quote "The maximum cable distance supported between the root and the ?? last outlet is 300 feet, with a maximum attenuation of 25 dB". And this ?? is for MoCA, not just cable TV. ? ? ? MoCA is home networking, hence the 300 foot figure. A drop at +10 ? dBmv already allows a 25 dB loss for the cable modem, since they are ? designed to work to -15 dBmv. That webpage also mentions verifing that a ? "drop amplifier does not block Moca". In other words, it's home ? networking for multimedia devices and has nothing to do with the length ? of the cable drop. It is to allow customers to stream audio and video ? within their home, and use services like Netflix ? Hulu on their TV ? sets. ? It is the modern cable TV, like it or not. Sigh. You never back down, even when you are shown that you are wrong. Because I am not. http://publicservice.vermont.gov/con...rts_cable.html Quote "If its under 300 feet, its free to the consumer". Yes, it is as simple as that. You are within 300ft and the cable company must serve you. This is state-of-the-art. Now you'll probably declare the whole State of Vermont to be wrong? The whole state? Na, there's probably three sane people left. |
Increasing Cable TV signal strength
On Sat, 11 Feb 2012 05:35:37 -0800, The_Giant_Rat_of_Sumatra
wrote: On Fri, 10 Feb 2012 21:41:38 -0800, John Larkin wrote: Why are you so angry? You've been cursing and ranting here all day, flailing at everyone. This isn't healthy. All that anger will wreck your immune system and make you old fast. You'll stroke out eventually, and not have much fun meanwhile. Really. Why do you not refrain from attacking me? Oh that's right... that is your true goal. FOAD, John Larkin. And the problem with that is???? |
Increasing Cable TV signal strength
On Fri, 10 Feb 2012 18:56:16 -0800, The_Giant_Rat_of_Sumatra
wrote: On Fri, 10 Feb 2012 16:47:52 +0000, Pomegranate ******* wrote: On Thu, 09 Feb 2012 20:27:00 -0800, The_Giant_Rat_of_Sumatra wrote: On Thu, 09 Feb 2012 16:02:35 +0000, Pomegranate ******* wrote: On Thu, 09 Feb 2012 06:44:45 -0800, The_Giant_Rat_of_Sumatra wrote: On Thu, 09 Feb 2012 13:12:15 +0000, Pomegranate ******* wrote: Would you please supply some evidence of your claims? You don't even know what a 10Gb/s optical port looks like either, jackass. You are truly pathetic, and a total loser. The only response a retard like you knows is "stalk and jab". Would you please supply some evidence of your claims? You wouldn't know what a constellation measurement was if one bit you in the ass, much less understand it. Nuff said. Would you please supply some evidence of your claims? You failed to respond with a definition of the term. That is proof that you are an uneducable twit. Would you please supply some evidence of your achievements? |
Increasing Cable TV signal strength
On Fri, 10 Feb 2012 19:13:12 -0800, The_Giant_Rat_of_Sumatra
wrote: On Fri, 10 Feb 2012 08:48:06 -0800, Jeff Liebermann wrote: On Fri, 10 Feb 2012 05:52:31 -0800, The_Giant_Rat_of_Sumatra wrote: I was system engineering director for several military satellites systems, And now you are a withering old **** who comes in here mouthing petty horse**** about someone as if you know them, when you, in fact, have no clue about anything about them. What you are doing is jumping on the petty, immature asshole bandwagon. You are a special case type asswipe. I tend to judge people by their willingness and abilities to learn new things. List the "new things" you or any other ****tard here has ever tried to instruct me on. Oh... THAT'S RIGHT... YOU CANNOT. You and your petty jack-offs are total failures. You fail. I am fine. You are an idiot who think he can make a valid assessment based on some other dumb****tard's stupid remarks, taking them as if they are factual. You are even more pathetic than the retarded ******* who spouted the lies to begin with. You may know something about CATV and fiber, I know a lot about a lot of things. For you to assess the level of my skills or knowledge based on the stupid horse**** some lame ****tard spewed in this thread, is more of a tell about your inability than it is about my abilities. but it doesn't show. You're an idiot. Half the ****tards in here don't even know what Digicipher II is, and you likely don't have much of a grasp of it either, ****head. Instead of taking the time to educate those whom you suspect of being in error, WTF are you attempting to do here, asswipe? you waste our time with insults and unsubstantiated opinions. You are an idiot. The insults go to assholes who have been haranguing me for years. Every now and then, some completely uniformed retard like you comes in and makes a stupid assessment based on a single thread. You are so ****ing stupid, you probably believe the retarded ****s claiming I am a janitor. IF I were a janitor, 98% of you ****tards would be in a landfill by now. Your command of profanity is truly impressive, You are a goddamned idiot to make any assessment about it at all, dumb****. but misplaced. That is an opinion. Just like mine that you are about as stupid as it gets, because you are not informed enough to know what has been taking place for years here. **** you and your horse blinders, dumb****. If someone presented you with your comments, what you would think of the author? When I was presented with insults years ago, I returned the favor. The immature retards have yet to stop being the total ****ing retards that they are, so I will continue pointing out their utter stupidity to them, and dumb****s like you. You are just too ****ing stupid to see it for what it is. The Pommy Retard has ALWAYS stalked my posts, and made stupid remarks, and you are jumping on me for calling him the total piece of **** that he is? Have a nice day, Mr Nymbecile. :-) You are dumber than dog****, boy! I can't imagine what personal tragedy has occurred in your life, Idiots like you. That's what happened. that you find it necessary to demonstrate your competence You have no clue as to my competence in any field or endeavor, you stupid ****. The fact that you use a Usenet post to form your pathetic assessment says more about your immature stupidity than anything about me. When will you realize that your ****ing guesses about someone have no basis in reality? at the expense of others. I would charge you your entire life if I could. Many of you should be cleared from the gene pool. If you're truly competent, Make up your mind, ****HEAD. You are either on the make **** up about me bandwagon or you are not. Either way, you have already stepped over the line. such a crutch is not necessary. Such opinions about what my motives are, are truly more stupid than the pother idiots and their petty bull**** jabs. If you clean up your act, I do not have to measure up to your pathetic, unqualified, unprofessional, unsolicited retarded assessments, IDIOT! there may be hope for you remaining. If you were here, there might be hope for you to eat without a straw after I turned your ****ing jaw sideways. You are pathetic. Go judge your mother, ****head. She is a criminal bitch for not flushing you the moment the retarded slut shat your retarded ass. |
Increasing Cable TV signal strength
On Fri, 10 Feb 2012 22:19:19 -0800, The_Giant_Rat_of_Sumatra
wrote: On Fri, 10 Feb 2012 21:15:36 -0800, Jeff Liebermann wrote: Correct. I supplied the minimum necessary for you to notice that there is a problem. You are too goddamned blind to see WHERE the problem is located. I have been telling you all there is a problem for years! Were I to say "Are you all ready to be nice now?" there are always six or eight who still want to take jabs, and then it ensues again. You getting it yet? If you all want to be nice, we can do that, but you can bet someone will start again, and THEN I will reciprocate. I play by those rules of engagement. That is why YOU got schmacked. Because you are on the stupid, snide remark bandwagon too. Character compromises shall not pass. So, get started on *them* as well.. and yourself, Jeffy Fixit. Every time I try to be like anyone else, an army of idiots start with their sub-Jr High mentality horse****. They will get their plates of **** back in their faces. Don't you go thinking you can start feeding me one too, boy. And then some dope thinks that because I cuss, I am wrong from the start. That is pretty stupid too. Call them "colorful metaphors". I have the entire archive. Nearly two decades. The names these idiots use to refer to me with do not match any I have ever used. They can have that back in their faces. Cussing doesn't mean a ****ing thing. You getting it yet? I can chronicle every time each asshole started it, from over a decade ago in some cases. Sometimes I feel quite sorry for you, Nymbecile. Can it really be the case that you don't realise that you are the easiest wind-up ever? The sad thing is that you can't see when you are being wound-up. |
Increasing Cable TV signal strength MoCA
" wrote: On Sun, 12 Feb 2012 13:54:36 -0800, Joerg wrote: Michael A. Terrell wrote: Joerg wrote: Michael A. Terrell wrote: ? Joerg wrote: ?? http://www.cablefax.com/ct/sections/...ier_44237.html ?? ?? Quote "The Multimedia Over Coax Alliance (MoCA) provides a standard ..." ?? ?? then ?? ?? Quote "The maximum cable distance supported between the root and the ?? last outlet is 300 feet, with a maximum attenuation of 25 dB". And this ?? is for MoCA, not just cable TV. ? ? ? MoCA is home networking, hence the 300 foot figure. A drop at +10 ? dBmv already allows a 25 dB loss for the cable modem, since they are ? designed to work to -15 dBmv. That webpage also mentions verifing that a ? "drop amplifier does not block Moca". In other words, it's home ? networking for multimedia devices and has nothing to do with the length ? of the cable drop. It is to allow customers to stream audio and video ? within their home, and use services like Netflix ? Hulu on their TV ? sets. ? It is the modern cable TV, like it or not. Sigh. You never back down, even when you are shown that you are wrong. Because I am not. http://publicservice.vermont.gov/con...rts_cable.html Quote "If its under 300 feet, its free to the consumer". Yes, it is as simple as that. You are within 300ft and the cable company must serve you. This is state-of-the-art. Now you'll probably declare the whole State of Vermont to be wrong? The whole state? Na, there's probably three sane people left. The FCC says the requirement is 100 feet in CFR 47-46.606, section three, quoted below: --- (3) The visual signal level, across a terminating impedance which correctly matches the internal impedance of the cable system as viewed from the subscriber terminal, shall not be less than 1 millivolt across an internal impedance of 75 ohms (0 dBmV). Additionally, as measured at the end of a 30 meter (100 foot) cable drop that is connected to the subscriber tap, it shall not be less than 1.41 millivolts across an internal impedance of 75 ohms (+3 dBmV). (At other impedance values, the minimum visual signal level, as viewed from the subscriber terminal, shall be the square root of 0.0133 (Z) millivolts and, as measured at the end of a 30 meter (100 foot) cable drop that is connected to the subscriber tap, shall be 2 times the square root of 0.00662(Z) millivolts, where Z is the appropriate impedance value.) --- That mess in Vermont involves Adelphia cable, and the settlement of a huge fraud lawsuit. They agreed to build to a minimum of 14 homes per mile, when the industry usually stops at 35-40 homes per mile as ever paying back the construction costs. Vermont had them by the balls, if they wanted to renew their franchisee. Adelphia is also heavily invested in FIOS. The other franchises I looked at only had a 300 foot limit if it was Fiber to the structure, which doesn't have the roll off and insertion loss of coax. Here is a typical RG6 from Belden: Freq. (MHz) Attenuation (dB/100 ft.) 5 .67 55 1.60 211 2.87 270 3.24 300 3.43 350 3.72 400 4.00 450 4.26 550 4.71 750 5.59 870 6.00 1000 6.54 This shows the loss at 12.78 dB at 450 MHz which would be a very old system. -- You can't have a sense of humor, if you have no sense. |
Increasing Cable TV signal strength
On Mon, 13 Feb 2012 09:19:31 +0000, Pomegranate *******
wrote: Sometimes I feel quite sorry for you, Nymbecile. Can it really be the case that you don't realise that you are the easiest wind-up ever? The sad thing is that you can't see when you are being wound-up. The sad thing is the actual state of mind, and lack of maturity of those doing it. And they would call themselves civil. You are not even in the same boat. Sub-humans don't get to be rated with us. |
Increasing Cable TV signal strength
On Mon, 13 Feb 2012 02:38:11 -0800, The_Giant_Rat_of_Sumatra
wrote: On Mon, 13 Feb 2012 09:19:31 +0000, Pomegranate ******* wrote: Sometimes I feel quite sorry for you, Nymbecile. Can it really be the case that you don't realise that you are the easiest wind-up ever? The sad thing is that you can't see when you are being wound-up. The sad thing is the actual state of mind, and lack of maturity of those doing it. And they would call themselves civil. You are not even in the same boat. Sub-humans don't get to be rated with us. Who do you mean by "us"? |
Increasing Cable TV signal strength
On Thu, 09 Feb 2012 20:57:06 -0800, The_Giant_Rat_of_Sumatra
wrote: On Thu, 09 Feb 2012 20:34:43 -0600, tom wrote: And I was leading 10M$ engineering projects while you were installing cable. Yes, and now I am leading $400M (yes, idiot, the dollar sign goes in front) telecom projects which include spaceborne elements and the fastest gateways on the planet and put Americans to work all over the nation in support, and you get to type stupid **** in Usenet and on your facebook facetard account and wither away like the old, dead **** you are. Soon enough, you'll be as senile as krw is and you won't even be able to cut a cable fitting, and I will be still taking cross country tours and racing on my bike and barefoot water skiing and living until 2110. Hell, I'll set records. I am just getting started. Yes, idiot... you are amusing, sometimes. Bwuahahahahahaha! My, that's a nasty cough, Nymbecile. You should think about seeing a doctor. Not for the cough but for your mental instability. |
Increasing Cable TV signal strength
On Fri, 10 Feb 2012 20:30:24 -0800 The_Giant_Rat_of_Sumatra
wrote in Message id: : On Fri, 10 Feb 2012 20:52:11 -0600, tom wrote: On 2/10/2012 8:32 PM, Wayne wrote: He really needs to create a new file from which to cut and paste. Like most comedians', his jokes get stale after awhile. -- VWW, K6EVE - But you must admit that this normally quiet newsgroup finally has some activity. Who knows, this could take on the characteristics of the GFW. --Wayne W5GIE "GFW=Great Fractal Wars" Unfortunately the traffic has nothing to do with antennas. Things dried up here around 6 months ago. I suspect the people with brains and stories, and some of us remember who they are, are no longer with us or finally bailed due to the noise. I was playing with Moonrakers way back in the early seventies. I was reading the CRC handbook at 11 yo. I was working with fractals before you even knew what they were. I was playing with Moonrakers way back in the early seventies at 15 yo. Then he woke up with his pin-dick in his hand and sticky fingers. Yuck. |
Increasing Cable TV signal strength
On Sat, 11 Feb 2012 10:05:03 -0800 The_Giant_Rat_of_Sumatra
wrote in Message id: : On Sat, 11 Feb 2012 09:47:14 -0800, "Wayne" wrote: "The_Giant_Rat_of_Sumatra" wrote in message . .. On Fri, 10 Feb 2012 20:52:11 -0600, tom wrote: On 2/10/2012 8:32 PM, Wayne wrote: He really needs to create a new file from which to cut and paste. Like most comedians', his jokes get stale after awhile. -- VWW, K6EVE - But you must admit that this normally quiet newsgroup finally has some activity. Who knows, this could take on the characteristics of the GFW. --Wayne W5GIE "GFW=Great Fractal Wars" Unfortunately the traffic has nothing to do with antennas. Things dried up here around 6 months ago. I suspect the people with brains and stories, and some of us remember who they are, are no longer with us or finally bailed due to the noise. I was playing with Moonrakers way back in the early seventies. - Moonrakers? LOL. Ok now we have you calibrated. No, you do not. I was 12 years old, and the gear was my dad's. Message-ID: "I was playing with Moonrakers way back in the early seventies at 15 yo." For ****'s sake, can't you at least keep your LIES straight, you utter ****ing imbecile? |
tom "k0TAR" shows his immaturity level yet again. What a sad excuse for a man
On Fri, 10 Feb 2012 21:40:07 -0600 tom wrote in
Message id: : On 2/10/2012 9:34 PM, The_Giant_Rat_of_Sumatra wrote: Cut lots of stuff More pathetic jabbing horse**** from a jerk who actually would like folks to think he has been making "helpful' comments in a hope to 'aid' someone. Your bull**** here shows you for the total ****ing retarded jerk, who jumped onto the retarded jerk bandwagon with the rest of the retarded jerks. Yer doin real good, boy... NOT! now that you mention it, and is trying to compensate for his lack of success and low IQ with insults. I did more in the last week to make the world a better place than you will in your entire pathetic life, boy. Usenet. You gotta love the kooks. Go back to the kook group, you retarded ****. You will never be loved, because you are too retarded to even know what love is. tom K0TAR A complete and utter retard. He really likes the word "retard". Wonder why? He also loves fecal references. An expert in Scatology. |
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