Hello, fellow radio amateurs!

I am unlicensed and do not transmit except I send guitar voice mail on
the phone and also I send the guitar through FRS for fun.

With twenty feet of twinax from IEC, I am now able to receive WHFS in
stereo from Annapolis, MD, here in Seven Corners, VA reliably. We'll
see if it works at night.

Both the antenna and 1/8 stereo phone plug terminations need work, but
are working.

Could any of you tell me where I can buy some pretinned 1/8 stereo
phone plugs with metal sheilded barrels? The ones I buy at Radio Shack
don't tin well with rosin flux and a fresh tip, using 60/40 solder. I
have to scrape them to bare metal and heat them so much the plastic
insulators soften a little. At these frequencies, that matters. Yes, I
replaced the polyethylene between the legs with hot melt. Of course I
did. But still, see below, there are refinements.

I don't know what engineer at Wizard decided to run their dipole
antenna in through a phone jack. Fer cryin' out loud, was it just
because the line output is a phone jack and they couldn't spare two
cents? What a hassle.

What a nice radio, now it's done. I will get the serial port version
soon and have a free slot for a second OEM IBM speakerphone modem. But
that's another story.

By using the VU meter on my Cool Edit, I was able to point the
antenna. I braced it off the ceiling with a cigarette pack and a strip
of double sided foam adhesive tape, then tapped it with a wooden
paddle to move it about a degree at a time. It's not an RF meter, but
it does get an optimal result. T and I will switch positions next
time, so I can interpret the varying audio levels during transmission
as indicators of reception quality. Variability was over 30 db. I'll
provide a better estimate when we swap positions. I was the one moving
the antenna this time.

The transmission line hangs straight from the ceiling to the floor,
tensioning the twin leads to form an air spaced graduated line. If you
stand too close to it, the signal fades, even though it is sheilded. I
guess I need a good ground. This is twin wire in this older apartment,
not properly grounded. I can go up then rightwards into the heat pump
box and terminate to a ground there. No, not the Freon pipe, there
will be a proper ground there and I will find it. I've got the long
bit already. Best would be to replace the hard corner on the plaster
wall, burying the ground leading up from the baseboard behind it, or
to groove the face of the wall and bury the ground there. Yes, I know
that isn't to code.

Anyway, if you know where to buy a good quality, readily tinned phone
jack, please let me know. Likewise, if my soldering technique sounds
off, please, reply. If you know already through experience that Radio
Shack is not the place to go, let me know that and I'll visit
Arlington Electronic Wholesalers for a quality product. They are only
a bike ride away.

I'll give the details of the terminations later, once, as they are,
then again, after I've optimized them. I've got five extra feet of
cable so there's room to play with terminations at both ends.

God, I love new, local music.


Yours,

Doug Goncz
Replikon Research
Seven Corners, VA

Excerpting:

From: (Doug Goncz) (Me)

With twenty feet of twinax from IEC, I am now able to receive WHFS in
stereo from Annapolis, MD, here in Seven Corners, VA reliably.

Both the antenna and 1/8 stereo phone plug terminations need work, but
are working.

Could any of you tell me where I can buy some pretinned 1/8 stereo
phone plugs with metal sheilded barrels?

Anyway, if you know where to buy a good quality, readily tinned phone
jack, please let me know.

The ones I buy at Radio Shack
don't tin well


Yours,

Doug Goncz ( ftp://users.aol.com/DGoncz/incoming )
Student member SAE for one year.
I love: Dona, Jeff, Kim, Mom, Neelix, Tasha, and Teri, alphabetically.
I drive: A double-step Thunderbolt with 657% range.

Here are some pics of the antenna:

08/19/2004 07:45AM 112,318 CeilingSpacer.JPG
08/19/2004 07:45AM 111,110 HangerAndLead.JPG
08/19/2004 07:45AM 137,884 LeadCloseup.JPG

and links:

ftp://users.aol.com/DGoncz/Antenna/CeilingSpacer.JPG

ftp://users.aol.com/DGoncz/Antenna/HangerAndLead.JPG

ftp://users.aol.com/DGoncz/Antenna/LeadCloseup.JPG

I intend to air-space the twin leads down to above head height, then move the
remaining twinax to the hanger, after adding a _little bit_ of weight at the
bend to tension the leads. This should form an air spaced graduated impedance
"converter" without the need for a minimum loss pad.

If I could just get a more easily solderable stereo phone jack....

Maybe even one rated for RF....


Yours,
Doug Goncz ( ftp://users.aol.com/DGoncz/incoming )
Student member SAE for one year.
I love: Dona, Jeff, Kim, Mom, Neelix, Tasha, and Teri, alphabetically.
I drive: A double-step Thunderbolt with 657% range.

On 18 Aug 2004 11:47:24 -0700, (Doug Goncz) wrote:

Could any of you tell me where I can buy some pretinned 1/8 stereo
phone plugs with metal sheilded barrels? The ones I buy at Radio Shack
don't tin well with rosin flux and a fresh tip, using 60/40 solder. I
have to scrape them to bare metal and heat them so much the plastic
insulators soften a little. At these frequencies, that matters. Yes, I
replaced the polyethylene between the legs with hot melt. Of course I
did. But still, see below, there are refinements.

Hi Doug,

Sounds like you need more practice soldering. All this scraping you
describe is unnecessary because you should already have bare metal.

I don't know what engineer at Wizard decided to run their dipole
antenna in through a phone jack. Fer cryin' out loud, was it just
because the line output is a phone jack and they couldn't spare two
cents? What a hassle.

The jack is not particularly an issue for its use, it is your attempts
to connect the twin lead to it (if that is what you mean by twinax).
You need to go to radio shack and buy a TV-Coax BalUn. You can
recognize it as a small (little finger sized) device that transitions
from twin lead to Coax connections. It usually has a twin lead dangle
with female Coax connector. Then obtain some small diameter Coax (it
doesn't really matter what impedance, so go for esthetics). The small
Coax should more readily adapt to the phono plug and not be so stiff
as to strain it. Choose a long lead of this Coax and attach the phono
plug at one end, and the F connector at the other (make sure to buy
one you can solder to if you are getting smaller diameter cable, and
practice your soldering with the expectation of wasting something
before you succeed).

There is nothing particularly precision about this, so close attention
to spacing, such as you describe it, is not very productive. If what
you describe as twinax is Coaxial cable, you have more issues of
soldering skills and antenna placement (get it outside).

By using the VU meter on my Cool Edit, I was able to point the
antenna. I braced it off the ceiling with a cigarette pack and a strip
of double sided foam adhesive tape, then tapped it with a wooden
paddle to move it about a degree at a time. It's not an RF meter, but
it does get an optimal result. T and I will switch positions next
time, so I can interpret the varying audio levels during transmission
as indicators of reception quality. Variability was over 30 db. I'll
provide a better estimate when we swap positions. I was the one moving
the antenna this time.

For the distance between you and the station, try to get the antenna
higher (yes I know you are against the ceiling, this too may be an
issue). If you can, move it outdoors and UP. Your VU meter is all
you need to confirm signal strength (at least to find the signal). To
insure you are doing your best move the antenna left-right/up-down to
find all 4 points where the signal completely goes away, and then
split the difference for a center. From your pictures it looks like
you have an outside antenna and not rabbit ears anyway (you need a
picture more removed from just looking at wire connections).

If you
stand too close to it, the signal fades, even though it is sheilded.

Skip all considerations of ground. Your problem is YOU reflecting
signal and acting as a second antenna - another reason to get the
antenna outside.

73's
Richard Clark, KB7QHC

Dear Richard,

You have my thanks for your reply.

From: Richard Clark

Sounds like you need more practice soldering. All this scraping you
describe is unnecessary because you should already have bare metal.

I have 36 years of experience soldering.

Have you tried tinning Radio Shack's 274-284 connector? It acts as if it's made
of stainless steel. Maybe a chisel tip would work better.

One problem I am having is all my tools are at my home shop and the antenna and
radio are here at my office. Going back and forth confuses me.



The jack is not particularly an issue for its use

I think there's a reflection at the jack, forming a resonant tank. The
frequency depends on the cable length. A little less than 20 feet.

it is your attempts
to connect the twin lead to it (if that is what you mean by twinax).

I had used twinlead. I went to twinxial cable, two 20 gage conductors with
polyethylene around them, in a polyethylene carrier, with a foil shield and
what must be close to 100% overbraid. It is Coleman Cable 99301 20 gage 100 ohm
twinaxial type CL2.

You need to go to radio shack and buy a TV-Coax BalUn.

No, this is a stereo phone plug with balanced signal on tip and ring. I have
added ground on the barrel. The original antenna is a 22 gage dipole insulated
with polyethylene, not PVC. Each leg is 30 inches long. The pair to the plug
is 39 1/2 inches long.

If what
you describe as twinax is Coaxial cable, you have more issues of
soldering skills and antenna placement (get it outside).

The condominium association will not permit an outside antenna.

For the distance between you and the station, try to get the antenna
higher (yes I know you are against the ceiling, this too may be an
issue).

We're on the third floor. I note that if the antenna is allowed to tilt, the
signal fades. I have replaced the cigarette pack spacer by a foam block. It's
level now. The boom surface is three inches from the ceiling. Should it be
farther from the ceiling?

I just filed up a chisel tip.

This morning I lengthened the lead from the antenna to the twinax by stripping
more shield, foil, and filler. Now it works very badly. No stereo reception of
WHFS. Extending the sheild with foil helped. The legs are 18 inches long.

What I need is:

How long should the legs be at the antenna end?

How long should the filler alone be?

How long should the section with foil over filler be? (Should this foil be
tapered?)

How long should the braid be?

How long should the rest of cable, in its natural condition be?

What's a good way to terminate the twinaxial cable to the phone plug?

I have a short connection but no picture.

After I tin the plug, I really don't know how to do this best.

Ok, I've tinned the plug. It was much faster and easier with the chisel tip.

Now what, I wonder?


Yours,
Doug Goncz ( ftp://users.aol.com/DGoncz/incoming )
Student member SAE for one year.
I love: Dona, Jeff, Kim, Mom, Neelix, Tasha, and Teri, alphabetically.
I drive: A double-step Thunderbolt with 657% range.

On 19 Aug 2004 14:29:13 GMT, ( Doug Goncz ) wrote:

Dear Richard,

You have my thanks for your reply.

From: Richard Clark

Sounds like you need more practice soldering. All this scraping you
describe is unnecessary because you should already have bare metal.

I have 36 years of experience soldering.

Have you tried tinning Radio Shack's 274-284 connector? It acts as if it's made
of stainless steel. Maybe a chisel tip would work better.

Why would Radio Shack spend more for stainless steel? Who in their
right mind would produce it? I have never had any problems with the
cheapest of materials to wet with solder. You are having some other
difficulty and it may be this wire you are trying to use (ever try
soldering old telephone wire?). Does it wet easily?

I think there's a reflection at the jack, forming a resonant tank. The
frequency depends on the cable length. A little less than 20 feet.

20 feet is not resonant (first resonance that is) at any particular
commercial frequency.

it is your attempts
to connect the twin lead to it (if that is what you mean by twinax).

I had used twinlead. I went to twinxial cable, two 20 gage conductors with
polyethylene around them, in a polyethylene carrier, with a foil shield and
what must be close to 100% overbraid. It is Coleman Cable 99301 20 gage 100 ohm
twinaxial type CL2.

You need to go to radio shack and buy a TV-Coax BalUn.

No, this is a stereo phone plug with balanced signal on tip and ring. I have
added ground on the barrel.

Sleeve.

The original antenna is a 22 gage dipole insulated
with polyethylene, not PVC.

Immaterial really.

Each leg is 30 inches long. The pair to the plug
is 39 1/2 inches long.

Still rather immaterial. There are optimal lengths, but trivial for
receivers.

We're on the third floor. I note that if the antenna is allowed to tilt, the
signal fades.

Indicative of multipath rather than actually pointing at the
transmitter. Your antenna is looking into a soup of direct
transmission waves, and reflections, re-reflections and so on.

Alternatively, you don't have enough signal, and all the tilting,
wiring, jacking, and soldering in the world is not going to make up
for it. Add about 10dB of amplification at the antenna.

I have replaced the cigarette pack spacer by a foam block. It's
level now. The boom surface is three inches from the ceiling. Should it be
farther from the ceiling?

There is nothing good about its close proximity. However, it may be
benign. You should not be as close as the length of any antenna
element from other conductors (you don't know what is in the ceiling
for the thirty odd inches proximity).

I just filed up a chisel tip.

That is poor practice. You are already melting the connector's
plastic. Solder should flow within seconds at these small dimensions
for even a 30W iron with a pencil tip.

This morning I lengthened the lead from the antenna to the twinax by stripping
more shield, foil, and filler. Now it works very badly. No stereo reception of
WHFS. Extending the sheild with foil helped. The legs are 18 inches long.

Like I said, this is all futile reminiscent of tin foil rabbit ears
aligned with the rising moon and setting Venus. Your signal is
marginal and suffering from multipath to boot.

What I need is:

How long should the legs be at the antenna end?

Length is not an issue, separation is. Even here it is of no
particular concern. The enforcement of that is dictated by the
mechanical connections at the antenna and the taper to the usual,
conventional twin line has been commonplace for 60 years.

How long should the filler alone be?

How long should the section with foil over filler be? (Should this foil be
tapered?)

How long should the braid be?

These are unconventional and cannot be said to be aiding you whatever
optimal values may be offered.

How long should the rest of cable, in its natural condition be?

The only criteria is that it should not be so long as to attenuate the
signal through loss. Conventional installations for years went tens
of feet to a hundred feet - depending upon signal strength. You don't
have signal strength.

What's a good way to terminate the twinaxial cable to the phone plug?

I seriously doubt you have a female stereo connector to plug into -
this too is unconventional. If you do, the sleeve connection was
never used in the original configuration (the original antenna only
had two leads to begin with by your description).

Twinax (Triax) is not conventional and you give every appearance of
either shorting out the antenna, and only picking up opportunistic
signal strength; or you have a floating shield that is picking up
opportunistic signal strengths and coupling it randomly into the
receive signal from the antenna. Either way, there is something
definitely fishy about the arrangement. If you want to persist with
using twinax, connect the two shields together at both ends (and at
the phono end, going to the ring, and the center conductor to the
tip), and do not make any sleeve connection at the radio.

Now what, I wonder?

Buy an amplifier.

73's
Richard Clark, KB7QHC

Doug Goncz wrote:
I have 36 years of experience soldering.

Don't worry, Doug, your apprenticeship will be up soon.



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On 19 Aug 2004 14:29:13 GMT, ( Doug Goncz ) wrote:

Dear Richard,

You have my thanks for your reply.

From: Richard Clark

Sounds like you need more practice soldering. All this scraping you
describe is unnecessary because you should already have bare metal.

I have 36 years of experience soldering.

Have you tried tinning Radio Shack's 274-284 connector? It acts as if it's made
of stainless steel. Maybe a chisel tip would work better.


Doug,
I too have found that RatShack audio connectors do not take to solder
well. Not always, perhaps a quarter to a third of the ones I've used.
A narrow chisel tip has worked well for me as has going to one of the
diminishing number of electronics supply shops for my parts. However,
I realize not every area has such a place. If you have a Fry's
Electronics store in your area it is worth looking there for both
audio and RF connectors as well as soldering equipment - pick out a
few different tips

Howard

OK, I've got it.

ftp://users.aol.com/DGoncz/Antenna/

08/22/2004 05:43AM 161,463 BoomClip.JPG
08/19/2004 07:45AM 112,318 CeilingSpacer.JPG
08/22/2004 05:43AM 180,516 ConnectionDetail.JPG
08/22/2004 05:43AM 190,270 ConnectorDetail.JPG
08/19/2004 07:45AM 111,110 HangerAndLead.JPG
08/22/2004 05:43AM 192,334 HangerDetail.JPG
08/22/2004 05:44AM 126,769 HangerOverall.JPG
08/19/2004 07:45AM 137,884 LeadCloseup.JPG
08/22/2004 05:43AM 157,620 OverallConnection.JPG
08/22/2004 05:43AM 129,931 OverallView.JPG
08/22/2004 05:43AM 128,858 OverallView2.JPG
08/22/2004 05:43AM 133,346 PlugCovered.JPG
08/22/2004 05:43AM 100,341 PlugFilled.JPG
08/22/2004 05:43AM 96,303 PlugSoldered.JPG
08/22/2004 05:43AM 102,568 PlugTaped.JPG
08/22/2004 05:43AM 146,279 PlugWhipped.JPG
08/22/2004 05:43AM 172,030 ShieldClip.JPG
08/22/2004 05:43AM 199,604 StrainRelief.JPG

WHFS in stereo at 3 AM.

I note the plug has to be in just more than half way, not all the way for best
results. Maybe I should be using a balun, coax, and a phone jack adapter as
suggested.

But the original antenna was a dipole. So what did they do, ground one leg? I
have checked and the sleeve/barrel at the computer is grounded. I'll pull the
board and have another look at the traces. I'm sure tip and ring are balanced
but we'll just have a look under the hood....

The flat chisel tip did a much better job of transferring heat to the connector
lug and hardly any plastic melted this time. The lug heated quickly and the tip
drew a film of solder over it. My apprenticeship ended in 1986.

I filled the space with hot melt, and applied a little over the connection,
then taped it, drew over the braid, and whipped the braid down over the end,
with the ends of the braid falling neatly into the groove between the threads
and the flange. Then I lacquered the whipping with nail polish. I'll heat
shrink over it some day.

The boom and therefore the reflector elements are grounded, as they normally
would be. I don't know if this does anything. They are grounded from the sheild
through a clip lead to a bracket supporting a reflector element.

No active amplification is used.

It works just great. No rabbit ears, no aluminum foil, and it picks up pointed
due east as it should. All 10 FM stations on my dial read the same on the VU
meter, all are in stereo, and there is very little noise or interference.

Just one thing. There's a cable dangling from the middle of the ceiling.

For now, primary Teri can live with this. We will be sharing this whole space
soon. Right now I am renting 26 square feet of office space and paying towards
the cable modem and fax line.


Yours,
Doug Goncz ( ftp://users.aol.com/DGoncz/incoming )
Student member SAE for one year.
I love: Dona, Jeff, Kim, Mom, Neelix, Tasha, and Teri, alphabetically.
I drive: A double-step Thunderbolt with 657% range.

On 22 Aug 2004 10:01:17 GMT, ( Doug Goncz ) wrote:

OK, I've got it.

ftp://users.aol.com/DGoncz/Antenna/

WHFS in stereo at 3 AM.

I note the plug has to be in just more than half way, not all the way for best
results. Maybe I should be using a balun, coax, and a phone jack adapter as
suggested.

Yes, very much if things are this touchy. You are trying to feed a
high Z antenna into a low Z cable. Radio Shack has a very common
BalUn product designed to take care of this very simply (and using
common coaxial products they sell too).


No active amplification is used.

That's fine, but by all of your accounts, you are on the thin edge.

For now, primary Teri can live with this.

Hi Doug,

Teri may be able to get along with it much more, if you realized you
have two antennas in one and simply remove one of them. Simple, is
easier said than simple.

By all appearances you have a combination FM-TV antenna as I see at
least 5 elements (you don't show the entire antenna by the way) and
you are only using 3 of them. Your connection should be at the end
that is pointing (east) at the station you want to hear. If it is
not, you have it pointed backwards and this may explain why things are
so hinky. Another clue that you can verify. There should be another
set of antenna connections (like wing nuts that presently you connect
to) at the OPPOSITE end of the boom - n'est pas? They should be on
the next to last elements before the end of the boom.

73's
Richard Clark, KB7QHC