Richard Clark wrote:
Barring startling results demonstrating how either of the two coils
offered here in evidence reveal multiple resonances, that is enough to
kill the thread without needing tedious computations.¹

Last night I posted 1/4WL, 3/4WL, and 5/4WL measured resonant
points using the same coil stock as W8JI but with a shorter
50 uH coil. This coil 2" dia, 8 tpi, 8.5" long. It was
sitting on a mag mount on my metal desk.

When the speculation is that the coil presents a 1:1 replacement for
the delay of the "missing" segment of the resonant antenna, then this
premise stumbles at the starting blocks.

Nobody said anything about a 1:1 replacement. That was just
somebody's strawman.
--
73, Cecil http://www.qsl.net/w5dxp

Cecil Moore wrote:
Last night I posted 1/4WL, 3/4WL, and 5/4WL measured resonant
points using the same coil stock as W8JI but with a shorter
50 uH coil. This coil 2" dia, 8 tpi, 8.5" long. It was
sitting on a mag mount on my metal desk.

I think what we have here is Cecil has bought into the idea that
radically different behavior on one or more self-resonant frequencies
means we can apply an analogy of that behavior to all other
frequencies.

Most of us probably want a theory that works all the time, and we
probably think only one situation that proves the theory wrong is
required to dismiss the theory as being incorrect.

What Cecil is asking us all to do is is agree to a theory that only
works in special cases and ignore the times it does not.

73 Tom

On Thu, 09 Mar 2006 21:40:40 GMT, "Cecil Moore"
wrote:

Your 100uH coil above exhibits 60 degrees of phase shift
even for the voltage and that's 1/6 wavelength

On Thu, 16 Mar 2006 08:56:19 GMT, Cecil Moore wrote:

When the speculation is that the coil presents a 1:1 replacement for
the delay of the "missing" segment of the resonant antenna, then this
premise stumbles at the starting blocks.

Nobody said anything about a 1:1 replacement. That was just
somebody's strawman.

We all know who "somebody" is. [threadbuster #4]

But if this is news to you, it must have been one of your other
personalities (Hokum's Razor?) at the keyboard who posted the message
at the top.

On Thu, 16 Mar 2006 09:09:40 -0800, Richard Clark
wrote:

On Thu, 09 Mar 2006 21:40:40 GMT, "Cecil Moore"
wrote:

Your 100uH coil above exhibits 60 degrees of phase shift
even for the voltage and that's 1/6 wavelength

On Thu, 16 Mar 2006 08:56:19 GMT, Cecil Moore wrote:

When the speculation is that the coil presents a 1:1 replacement for
the delay of the "missing" segment of the resonant antenna, then this
premise stumbles at the starting blocks.

Nobody said anything about a 1:1 replacement. That was just
somebody's strawman.

We all know who "somebody" is. [threadbuster #4]

But if this is news to you, it must have been one of your other
personalities (Hokum's Razor?) at the keyboard who posted the message
at the top.


:-) :-) :-) :-) :-)

It just occurred to me that those two posts were a week apart (more or
less) and denote a phase change (the one cancels the other if they
were to vectorally combined).

Thus and forever more, this proves that newsgroups (when heavily fed
from a source of confusion, linearly loaded with nonsense, and
terminated with a embarrassing revelation) exhibit transmission line
properties and can transform a stupid idea (at the top) into a
brilliant one (at the bottom) - or versa vice.

In conformance to transmission line properties, this cycle of phase
reversals is repeated every
1 / [1 + tan (c · Vf / posts)]² Years

Richard Clark" wrote:
On Thu, 09 Mar 2006 21:40:40 GMT, "Cecil Moore"
wrote:

Your 100uH coil above exhibits 60 degrees of phase shift
even for the voltage and that's 1/6 wavelength.

That does NOT say the coil replaces 60 degrees of wire in the antenna.
One who thinks such is mistaken. The phase shift in the coil is what it
is. It usually does NOT correspond to the phase shift of the wire it
replaces.
The point of that statement was that real world phase shift is never zero.
The one-way phase shift is known to be 90 degrees at the self-resonant
frequency.

On Thu, 16 Mar 2006 08:56:19 GMT, Cecil Moore wrote:

When the speculation is that the coil presents a 1:1 replacement for
the delay of the "missing" segment of the resonant antenna, then this
premise stumbles at the starting blocks.

Nobody said anything about a 1:1 replacement. That was just
somebody's strawman.

We all know who "somebody" is. [threadbuster #4]

But if this is news to you, it must have been one of your other
personalities (Hokum's Razor?) at the keyboard who posted the message
at the top.

Some people have misunderstood the meaning of that statement. See above.
So many jumping to conclusions - so few trying to understand.
--
73, Cecil, W5DXP

On Thu, 16 Mar 2006 18:20:19 GMT, "Cecil Moore"
wrote:
On Thu, 09 Mar 2006 21:40:40 GMT, "Cecil Moore"
wrote:
Your 100uH coil above exhibits 60 degrees of phase shift
even for the voltage and that's 1/6 wavelength.
That does NOT say the coil replaces 60 degrees of wire in the antenna.
Of course not. 1/6 wavelength of wire doesn't exhibit 60 degrees
phase shift - does it?
One who thinks such is mistaken.
Less than a week to this new phase shift in the non-linear dynamics of
Newsgroups-as-transmissionline. ;-)

The phase shift in the coil is what it is.

More Zen from the edge of Nirvana. Let me try mine:
The soup spoon in a magnetron is what Campbell's is to Andy Warhol.

Give us another!