Antenna optimization
 

Is there a software which can design an antenna (like EZNEC or similar )
then allows to automatically optimize its dimensions according to given
requirements: max gain, F/B, min swr... and accepted dimensional parameters
changes: boom length, spacing....
JC

Antenna optimization
 

Yes!

I think EZNEC has a optimization function as you stated. I know 4NEC2
does as I have used it many times..

Cheers Bob VK2YQA

JC wrote:
Is there a software which can design an antenna (like EZNEC or similar )
then allows to automatically optimize its dimensions according to given
requirements: max gain, F/B, min swr... and accepted dimensional parameters
changes: boom length, spacing....
JC

Antenna optimization
 

"JC" wrote in message
...
Is there a software which can design an antenna (like EZNEC or
similar )
then allows to automatically optimize its dimensions according to
given
requirements: max gain, F/B, min swr... and accepted dimensional
parameters
changes: boom length, spacing....
JC
----------------------------------------------------------------------
-------
Dear JC,

You don't need software. What you describe is non-existent anyway.
What you want is a long experienced antenna designer who can be
permanently engaged on your behalf. There are very few of such
creatures about.

You will have to be numerically quite specific about particular
problems. And even then you will get solutions which, with luck, are
probably only in the right ball-park.

On the other hand, ball-park solutions are perfectly satisfactory. In
the nature of events, no-one has ever solved an antenna problem which
is other than in a ball-park. Fortunately, antennas work quite well
even when in the wrong ball-park.

Download a free copy of EZNEC and in a few months time you may have
solved your first complicated, specific problem. As time goes on, you
will become more adept and there will be no need to engage a long
experienced antenna designer. You will have become one youself and
can offer your services for hire.

If you have a specific problem you may, if you are lucky, find a
computer program written by someone who has already solved it. But its
highly unlikely to be exactly the same problem. It will be in a
somewhat different ball-park.

Optimisation is out! You will have to contend with whatever you can
get your hands on. What's been done before. Take it or leave it!
----
Reg.

Antenna optimization
 

Thanks for help, I think I wrongly explained my problem, here is the
question:
1/ I design an antenna, for instance a 3 el 20m beam.
2/ I enter into EZNEC wires dimensions, spacing, height, source.....
3/ EZNEC calculates gain, F/B, SWR....and results are acceptable.
4/ Now let's suppose my objectives are max F/B as I have a QRM source
opposed to my favourite transmitting direction and SWR 1.5 on a given
frequency range as my transceiver is very SWR sensitive and I can't use an
antenna tuner.
I accept changing wire lengths and spacing but not boom length.
Is there a way to have EZNEC, or another software, doing automatic
iterations until it reaches the best F/B-SWR compromise ?

JC - F8ND


"Reg Edwards" a écrit dans le message de
news: ...

"JC" wrote in message
...
Is there a software which can design an antenna (like EZNEC or
similar )
then allows to automatically optimize its dimensions according to
given
requirements: max gain, F/B, min swr... and accepted dimensional
parameters
changes: boom length, spacing....
JC
----------------------------------------------------------------------
-------
Dear JC,

You don't need software. What you describe is non-existent anyway.
What you want is a long experienced antenna designer who can be
permanently engaged on your behalf. There are very few of such
creatures about.

You will have to be numerically quite specific about particular
problems. And even then you will get solutions which, with luck, are
probably only in the right ball-park.

On the other hand, ball-park solutions are perfectly satisfactory. In
the nature of events, no-one has ever solved an antenna problem which
is other than in a ball-park. Fortunately, antennas work quite well
even when in the wrong ball-park.

Download a free copy of EZNEC and in a few months time you may have
solved your first complicated, specific problem. As time goes on, you
will become more adept and there will be no need to engage a long
experienced antenna designer. You will have become one youself and
can offer your services for hire.

If you have a specific problem you may, if you are lucky, find a
computer program written by someone who has already solved it. But its
highly unlikely to be exactly the same problem. It will be in a
somewhat different ball-park.

Optimisation is out! You will have to contend with whatever you can
get your hands on. What's been done before. Take it or leave it!
----
Reg.

Antenna optimization
 

JC wrote:

4/ Now let's suppose my objectives are max F/B as I have a QRM source
opposed to my favourite transmitting direction and SWR 1.5 on a given
frequency range as my transceiver is very SWR sensitive and I can't use an
antenna tuner.
I accept changing wire lengths and spacing but not boom length.
Is there a way to have EZNEC, or another software, doing automatic
iterations until it reaches the best F/B-SWR compromise ?

K6STI's Yagi Optimizer 7.0 does a very nice job of this. You can
choose the weighting of Gain, F/R, SWR or Impedance and optimize over
any choice of frequencies. See my results for a pair of stacked KLM
Yagis on 28 MHz he

http://users.vnet.net/btippett/yagi_optimizer_7_0.htm

Unfortunately K6STI no longer markets his software to hams (due to
software piracy issues). Hopefully you can find someone with a copy
who can optimize your initial results.

73, Bill W4ZV

Antenna optimization
 

Unfortunately K6STI no longer markets his software to hams (due to
software piracy issues). Hopefully you can find someone with a copy
who can optimize your initial results.

73, Bill W4ZV


You could try ARRL's "YW", available with the "Antenna Book".

Frank

Antenna optimization
 

On 2006-07-11, wrote:

Unfortunately K6STI no longer markets his software to hams (due to
software piracy issues). Hopefully you can find someone with a copy
who can optimize your initial results.

Careful, you're pegging my irony meter.

--
Ben Jackson AD7GD

http://www.ben.com/

Antenna optimization
 

"JC" wrote
Thanks for help, I think I wrongly explained my problem, here is the
question:
1/ I design an antenna, for instance a 3 el 20m beam.
2/ I enter into EZNEC wires dimensions, spacing, height, source.....
3/ EZNEC calculates gain, F/B, SWR....and results are acceptable.
4/ Now let's suppose my objectives are max F/B as I have a QRM
source
opposed to my favourite transmitting direction and SWR 1.5 on a
given
frequency range as my transceiver is very SWR sensitive and I can't
use an
antenna tuner.
I accept changing wire lengths and spacing but not boom length.
Is there a way to have EZNEC, or another software, doing automatic
iterations until it reaches the best F/B-SWR compromise ?

----------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------

Let us see what would be involved if you had EZNEC and had to do
everything else yourself the hard way. You already have a crude,
satisfactory design for 3 elements, wire lengths, wire diameters,
spacing, height, etc.

Only the boom length and presumably wire diameters and height are
fixed and you wish to optimise everything else for maximum F/B ratio
and minimum SWR.

Everything else comprises : 3 lengths and 1 spacing. This makes a
total of 4 independent variables.

You now vary the first variable over a range of say 4 increments,
keeping all the other variables constant and keeping a record of the 4
results of F/B ratio and SWR

You then vary the second variable over a range of 4 increments,
keeping all the other variables constant and keeping a record of the
results.

You continue to do this until you have done all possible combinations
of the 4 variables. You will have a 4-dimension array of results of
F/B ratio and SWR, making a total of 512 observations.

Now search the observations until you can find the maximum of F/B
ratio combined with minimum of SWR

If it looks as though the minimum SWR or the maximum F/B ratio lies
outside the 4-dimensional array then shift the variables in an
appropriate direction and repeat the whole procedure until a max and
min are found.

The trouble with modelling programs is you have to enter element
lengths and spacing via the keyboard. It would be nice to have a
program to do it for you. I am unfamiliar with the situation. Such a
program might exist - one which outputs F/B ratio and SWR.
----
Reg.

Antenna optimization
 

As mentioned in another posting, YO (Yagi Optimizer) would be a good
bet. Strange that piracy caused the author to quit offering it
completely; seems like any sales are better than none, and not selling
a program only makes piracy more likely, not less.

But check out the EZNEC co-pilot program from Dan Maguire, AC6LA, at
http://www.ac6la.com/. That page lists several of his offerings; it's
MultiNEC that you'll be most interested in. Though it may not
completely automate the optimization, it should make the process much
easier and faster for you.

Cheers,
Tom


JC wrote:
Thanks for help, I think I wrongly explained my problem, here is the
question:
1/ I design an antenna, for instance a 3 el 20m beam.
2/ I enter into EZNEC wires dimensions, spacing, height, source.....
3/ EZNEC calculates gain, F/B, SWR....and results are acceptable.
4/ Now let's suppose my objectives are max F/B as I have a QRM source
opposed to my favourite transmitting direction and SWR 1.5 on a given
frequency range as my transceiver is very SWR sensitive and I can't use an
antenna tuner.
I accept changing wire lengths and spacing but not boom length.
Is there a way to have EZNEC, or another software, doing automatic
iterations until it reaches the best F/B-SWR compromise ?

JC - F8ND


"Reg Edwards" a écrit dans le message de
news: ...

"JC" wrote in message
...
Is there a software which can design an antenna (like EZNEC or
similar )
then allows to automatically optimize its dimensions according to
given
requirements: max gain, F/B, min swr... and accepted dimensional
parameters
changes: boom length, spacing....
JC
----------------------------------------------------------------------
-------
Dear JC,

You don't need software. What you describe is non-existent anyway.
What you want is a long experienced antenna designer who can be
permanently engaged on your behalf. There are very few of such
creatures about.

You will have to be numerically quite specific about particular
problems. And even then you will get solutions which, with luck, are
probably only in the right ball-park.

On the other hand, ball-park solutions are perfectly satisfactory. In
the nature of events, no-one has ever solved an antenna problem which
is other than in a ball-park. Fortunately, antennas work quite well
even when in the wrong ball-park.

Download a free copy of EZNEC and in a few months time you may have
solved your first complicated, specific problem. As time goes on, you
will become more adept and there will be no need to engage a long
experienced antenna designer. You will have become one youself and
can offer your services for hire.

If you have a specific problem you may, if you are lucky, find a
computer program written by someone who has already solved it. But its
highly unlikely to be exactly the same problem. It will be in a
somewhat different ball-park.

Optimisation is out! You will have to contend with whatever you can
get your hands on. What's been done before. Take it or leave it!
----
Reg.

Antenna optimization
 

As I just posted in another followup, MultiNEC (add-on for EZNec and
other NEC programs) takes care of just this sort of thing for you, and
takes much of the tedium out of the process. As an Excel spreadsheet,
it does require that you have Excel on the computer you're using.

Cheers,
Tom

Reg Edwards wrote:
"JC" wrote
Thanks for help, I think I wrongly explained my problem, here is the
question:
1/ I design an antenna, for instance a 3 el 20m beam.
2/ I enter into EZNEC wires dimensions, spacing, height, source.....
3/ EZNEC calculates gain, F/B, SWR....and results are acceptable.
4/ Now let's suppose my objectives are max F/B as I have a QRM
source
opposed to my favourite transmitting direction and SWR 1.5 on a
given
frequency range as my transceiver is very SWR sensitive and I can't
use an
antenna tuner.
I accept changing wire lengths and spacing but not boom length.
Is there a way to have EZNEC, or another software, doing automatic
iterations until it reaches the best F/B-SWR compromise ?

----------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------

Let us see what would be involved if you had EZNEC and had to do
everything else yourself the hard way. You already have a crude,
satisfactory design for 3 elements, wire lengths, wire diameters,
spacing, height, etc.

Only the boom length and presumably wire diameters and height are
fixed and you wish to optimise everything else for maximum F/B ratio
and minimum SWR.

Everything else comprises : 3 lengths and 1 spacing. This makes a
total of 4 independent variables.

You now vary the first variable over a range of say 4 increments,
keeping all the other variables constant and keeping a record of the 4
results of F/B ratio and SWR

You then vary the second variable over a range of 4 increments,
keeping all the other variables constant and keeping a record of the
results.

You continue to do this until you have done all possible combinations
of the 4 variables. You will have a 4-dimension array of results of
F/B ratio and SWR, making a total of 512 observations.

Now search the observations until you can find the maximum of F/B
ratio combined with minimum of SWR

If it looks as though the minimum SWR or the maximum F/B ratio lies
outside the 4-dimensional array then shift the variables in an
appropriate direction and repeat the whole procedure until a max and
min are found.

The trouble with modelling programs is you have to enter element
lengths and spacing via the keyboard. It would be nice to have a
program to do it for you. I am unfamiliar with the situation. Such a
program might exist - one which outputs F/B ratio and SWR.
----
Reg.

Antenna optimization
 

In message , JC
writes
Thanks for help, I think I wrongly explained my problem, here is the
question:
1/ I design an antenna, for instance a 3 el 20m beam.
2/ I enter into EZNEC wires dimensions, spacing, height, source.....
3/ EZNEC calculates gain, F/B, SWR....and results are acceptable.
4/ Now let's suppose my objectives are max F/B as I have a QRM source
opposed to my favourite transmitting direction and SWR 1.5 on a given
frequency range as my transceiver is very SWR sensitive and I can't use an
antenna tuner.
I accept changing wire lengths and spacing but not boom length.
Is there a way to have EZNEC, or another software, doing automatic
iterations until it reaches the best F/B-SWR compromise ?


MMANA does what you want and it's free.

http://mmhamsoft.amateur-radio.ca/ and I see there's a new release out.

Read this too. http://g7rau.demon.co.uk/sm5bsz/

Brian GM4DIJ
--
Brian Howie

Antenna optimization
 

I downloaded MMANA but I can't seem to unzip it. What program will
unzip it ? I have WinZip 7.0

Thanks
Ron WA0KDS


Brian Howie wrote:
In message , JC
writes

Thanks for help, I think I wrongly explained my problem, here is the
question:
1/ I design an antenna, for instance a 3 el 20m beam.
2/ I enter into EZNEC wires dimensions, spacing, height, source.....
3/ EZNEC calculates gain, F/B, SWR....and results are acceptable.
4/ Now let's suppose my objectives are max F/B as I have a QRM source
opposed to my favourite transmitting direction and SWR 1.5 on a given
frequency range as my transceiver is very SWR sensitive and I can't
use an
antenna tuner.
I accept changing wire lengths and spacing but not boom length.
Is there a way to have EZNEC, or another software, doing automatic
iterations until it reaches the best F/B-SWR compromise ?



MMANA does what you want and it's free.

http://mmhamsoft.amateur-radio.ca/ and I see there's a new release out.

Read this too. http://g7rau.demon.co.uk/sm5bsz/

Brian GM4DIJ

Antenna optimization
 

Ben AD7GD wrote:

On 2006-07-11, wrote:

Unfortunately K6STI no longer markets his software to hams (due to
software piracy issues). Hopefully you can find someone with a copy
who can optimize your initial results.

Careful, you're pegging my irony meter.

Why? The documentation says:

************************************************** **********************
This software is copyrighted. It has been provided to
you on the condition that you will not sell, rent, lend, give
away, or otherwise transfer the software to others.
************************************************** **********************

As I read it, there is no problem if I use it to optimize a model
for someone else. I'm NOT volunteering to do that however.

73, Bill W4ZV

Antenna optimization HELP
 

Ron wrote:

I downloaded MMANA but I can't seem to unzip it. What program will
unzip it ? I have WinZip 7.0

Thanks
Ron WA0KDS

Antenna optimization HELP
 

Ron wrote:

I downloaded MMANA but I can't seem to unzip it. What program will
unzip it ? I have WinZip 7.0

Thanks
Ron WA0KDS

Antenna optimization
 

FWIW, FilZip unzipped it fine: one file, MMANGAL_Setup.exe. It's
possible that the zip file became corrupted when you downloaded it,
too.

Cheers,
Tom

Ron wrote:
I downloaded MMANA but I can't seem to unzip it. What program will
unzip it ? I have WinZip 7.0

Thanks
Ron WA0KDS


Brian Howie wrote:
In message , JC
writes

Thanks for help, I think I wrongly explained my problem, here is the
question:
1/ I design an antenna, for instance a 3 el 20m beam.
2/ I enter into EZNEC wires dimensions, spacing, height, source.....
3/ EZNEC calculates gain, F/B, SWR....and results are acceptable.
4/ Now let's suppose my objectives are max F/B as I have a QRM source
opposed to my favourite transmitting direction and SWR 1.5 on a given
frequency range as my transceiver is very SWR sensitive and I can't
use an
antenna tuner.
I accept changing wire lengths and spacing but not boom length.
Is there a way to have EZNEC, or another software, doing automatic
iterations until it reaches the best F/B-SWR compromise ?



MMANA does what you want and it's free.

http://mmhamsoft.amateur-radio.ca/ and I see there's a new release out.

Read this too. http://g7rau.demon.co.uk/sm5bsz/

Brian GM4DIJ

Antenna optimization
 

Why on Earth anybody zips up software these days I can't imagine.

Antenna optimization
 

Reg Edwards wrote:
Why on Earth anybody zips up software these days I can't imagine.

I thought you'd have a better imagination than that, Reg.

o To reduce the size of the transferred file.
o To package a set of files together, e.g. documentation and sample
files along with a program, or a set of related programs.
o To secure it; it may not be very robust security but would
discourage
the casual user.

For the present example, though, the benefit is marginal at best.

Cheers,
Tom

Antenna optimization
 

Bob Bob wrote:
Yes!

I think EZNEC has a optimization function as you stated. I know 4NEC2
does as I have used it many times..

No, sorry, EZNEC doesn't have any optimization capability.

Roy Lewallen, W7EL

Antenna optimization
 

"JC" wrote in
:

Is there a software which can design an antenna (like EZNEC or similar
) then allows to automatically optimize its dimensions according to
given requirements: max gain, F/B, min swr... and accepted dimensional
parameters changes: boom length, spacing....
JC

http://mmhamsoft.amateur-radio.ca/fi...ANA-GAL-65.zip


--
Dave Oldridge+
ICQ 1800667

Antenna optimization
 

MMANA does what you want and it's free.

However, note that because MMANA being a MiniNec based program, when
using none vertical elements below 0.2 wavelengths accuracy rapidly
drops. If you'd like to optimize on (lower) HF, a Nec based program is
prefered

Furthermore, I don't think optimization is out. But, if it should be
so, it still will learn you very much about the effect of antenna
dimension changing on antenna performance.

And last but not least, because of being freeware, experimenting with
MMANA or 4nec2
[http://home.ict.nl/~arivoors/] will cost you nothing (besides a
little studying), weather you would like to use a traditional optimizer
of a genetic algorithm based optimizer.

Arie.

Antenna optimization
 

Richard Clark wrote:
On 11 Jul 2006 13:45:49 -0700, wrote:


Ben AD7GD wrote:

On 2006-07-11, wrote:

Unfortunately K6STI no longer markets his software to hams (due to
software piracy issues). Hopefully you can find someone with a copy
who can optimize your initial results.

Careful, you're pegging my irony meter.

Why? The documentation says:

************************************************* ***********************
This software is copyrighted. It has been provided to
you on the condition that you will not sell, rent, lend, give
away, or otherwise transfer the software to others.
************************************************* ***********************

As I read it, there is no problem if I use it to optimize a model
for someone else. I'm NOT volunteering to do that however.

Hi Bill,

Strange as it may seem, yes you would be in violation.

Copyright is the author's total monopoly to insure his revenue from
his creation. If you disrupt that revenue flow you are breaking the
law. You said it yourself, he doesn't market to amateurs - rather
professionals who will pay for the LICENSE to use it professionally.
If they choose to do someone a favor, and drop their fee, that is
their hit, not his. He granted them the right, by LICENSE and at a
cost, to lose money if they wish.

Hi Richard,

1. I paid for the non-professional version of K6STI's software while he
WAS selling to amateurs. If you read his agreement carefully, it only
prohibits transfer of the software itself.

2. I am not sure Brian markets YO to professionals any longer. There
was apparently one well-known antenna manufacturer who bought his
non-professional version and used it to design commercial antennas. I
understand that this contributed to Brian's decision to exit the
amateur business, but the main reason was someone in Europe hacked his
RITTY program and posted it publicly.

3. If I were to do a gratis optimization for someone today, that would
not violate the original license (i.e. transfer of the software itself)
and Brian's revenue flow is not being broken since he no longer has any
revenue flow from it. If a professional consultant were involved, they
would have to show they sustained actual damages (i.e. lost business)
which might be difficult to prove (not to mention the time and cost of
doing so).

Hence the irony meter being pegged.

No, that's the too-much-time-on-their-hands troll meter pegging. :-)

It's a shame the piracy issue drove K6STI from the ham business. He is
truly a genius and I love his AO, YO and DSP Blaster programs. I
believe he's now doing something in the audiophile business...their
gain and our loss.

73, Bill W4ZV.

Antenna optimization
 

On 12 Jul 2006 14:41:59 -0700, wrote:

Brian's revenue flow is not being broken since he no longer has any
revenue flow from it.

Hi Bill,

This is NOT a defense against infringement. The author's rights are
total, and the author's monopoly is total. There is nothing in the
law that suspends those rights or monopoly even in the event of death
of the author, so being out of the market place is a specious
argument.

This, and everything else you've had to offer may in fact be done, I
see folks run red lights frequently too.

If you read his agreement carefully, it only
prohibits transfer of the software itself.

I've read many agreements, but not this one. If you have a means to
render it faithfully here, then perhaps so; otherwise those others
I've read inform me better.

73's
Richard Clark, KB7QHC

Antenna optimization
 

I can't speak for Brian, but any output you produce from EZNEC is yours,
and you can sell it or give it away as you wish. I think this is typical
of software license agreements.

Roy Lewallen, W7EL

Richard Clark wrote:
On 12 Jul 2006 14:41:59 -0700, wrote:

Brian's revenue flow is not being broken since he no longer has any
revenue flow from it.

Hi Bill,

This is NOT a defense against infringement. The author's rights are
total, and the author's monopoly is total. There is nothing in the
law that suspends those rights or monopoly even in the event of death
of the author, so being out of the market place is a specious
argument.

This, and everything else you've had to offer may in fact be done, I
see folks run red lights frequently too.

If you read his agreement carefully, it only
prohibits transfer of the software itself.

I've read many agreements, but not this one. If you have a means to
render it faithfully here, then perhaps so; otherwise those others
I've read inform me better.

73's
Richard Clark, KB7QHC

Antenna optimization
 

Antenna optimization
 

Roy Lewallen wrote:

I can't speak for Brian, but any output you produce from EZNEC is yours,
and you can sell it or give it away as you wish. I think this is typical
of software license agreements.

I agree Roy. The **software** is licensed...not its output. Brian's
license agreement says absolutely nothing about output.

Am I correct about Brian going into the audio business? Thought you
might know.

73, Bill W4ZV

Antenna optimization
 

Does this also include ALL Public Libraries
(includeing the Library of Congress)??
Especially those that have Copying Machines?

If so, then DON'T support them, BAN'em!!
A thought-- Jim NN7K


Yuri Blanarovich wrote:
Is this lawyertwist's interpretation?
Like it is not COPYright it is REVENUEright?
Don't you anybody ask to read my copyrighted magazine issue! You will
disrupt the revenue flow of the publisher/authors. Oh, and don't read any
magazines in your dentist's office while you are shaking for the treatment.

Antenna optimization
 

wrote:

Am I correct about Brian going into the audio business? Thought you
might know.

Quick Google search resulted in the following. Not sure how Brian is
making money on this but his head is clearly not into ham radio any
longer. :-(

http://users.tns.net/~bb/index.html

73, Bill W4ZV

Antenna optimization
 

Back to antenna optimization, modeling software is a great tool and can save
a lot of tinkering with hardware in the freezing nights, but has to be taken
with a grain of salt. I treat it as a "bring me into the ballpark" tool,
rather than "gospel".

K6STI did great job with his YO and AO and W4ZV used it to optimize his KLM
stacks very closely.

I tried it on my 3 el. Quad design, which was originally designed on the 2m
antenna test range and then scaled to HF bands, which worked quite well,
within 50 kHz in resonant frequencies. When I tried to make it better by
sticking it into optimization software, the software made it better, on
paper. When I readjusted the dimensions accordingly, thing was off and worse
than before. Maybe software did not capture the color of spreaders. There
are still some parameters that modeling does not capture 100% and I am
always taking the modeling results with grain of salt.

There is whole "industry" of antenna "designers" doing it on models and
proclaiming as gospel. Reality is sometimes cruel and doesn't care what the
model says, especially when considering the environment in which antennas
are to operate. Just caution not believe 100% blindly what the model says,
as we saw in case of loading coils. I love the free space designs :-)

YO, AO, MMANA, 4NEC2 are great tools and to see how good they are, just let
them optimize the same design and see how close they get within each other.

Sorry to see Brian, K6STI quit producing ham stuff, but I do not blame him.
I was in the similar situation, developed Cyrillic languages support for
desktop publishing, sold few dozen copies, only to find that there were
hundreds if not thousands in use from Praha to Vladivostok. I can see my
stamp in the fonts files all over the world. So I quit producing the
software and let the Microsoft carry on, now it is built into Windoze.

73 Yuri, K3BU


"Jim - NN7K" wrote in message
.net...
Does this also include ALL Public Libraries (includeing the Library of
Congress)??
Especially those that have Copying Machines?

If so, then DON'T support them, BAN'em!!
A thought-- Jim NN7K


Yuri Blanarovich wrote:
Is this lawyertwist's interpretation?
Like it is not COPYright it is REVENUEright?
Don't you anybody ask to read my copyrighted magazine issue! You will
disrupt the revenue flow of the publisher/authors. Oh, and don't read any
magazines in your dentist's office while you are shaking for the
treatment.

Antenna optimization
 

Richard Clark wrote:


I've read many agreements, but not this one. If you have a means to
render it faithfully here, then perhaps so; otherwise those others
I've read inform me better.

73's
Richard Clark, KB7QHC

Well, searching the documemtation of version 6.04, I can find only this
in YO.DOC

Copyright 1995 by Brian Beezley, K6STI
All Rights Reserved

Version 5.0 is not quite the same, this is from READ.ME, nothing in
YO.DOC, or any other file

Copyright and License


This software is copyrighted. It is licensed for use by
the purchaser only. Copies may not be sold, rented, leased,
loaned, given away, or otherwise distributed. This copy is
licensed for amateur use only.


That's all there is in either version of YO that contains the
"copyright" in any form, case insensitive. I am ignoring the companion
programs. Interestingly, the .EXE files do not include a copyright
notice internal to the program, at least in plain text. The only thing
that shows when running the program (v6.x) is "Copyright 1995 by Brian
Beezley, K6STI All Rights Reserved" at the top line on the files menu.
I am writing the last from memory since it's a DOS program, so I might
not have it perfect.

tom
K0TAR

Antenna optimization
 

Tom Ring wrote:

That's all there is in either version of YO that contains the
"copyright" in any form, case insensitive. I am ignoring the companion
programs. Interestingly, the .EXE files do not include a copyright
notice internal to the program, at least in plain text. The only thing
that shows when running the program (v6.x) is "Copyright 1995 by Brian
Beezley, K6STI All Rights Reserved" at the top line on the files menu.
I am writing the last from memory since it's a DOS program, so I might
not have it perfect.

Under current U.S. law, a copyright notice isn't required in order to
secure a copyright; the copyright automatically exists as soon as the
work is created. Adding a copyright notice does bring some advantages
if a lawsuit is filed, however.

Disclaimer: I'm not an attorney.

Roy Lewallen, W7EL

Antenna optimization
 

Roy Lewallen wrote:


Under current U.S. law, a copyright notice isn't required in order to
secure a copyright; the copyright automatically exists as soon as the
work is created. Adding a copyright notice does bring some advantages
if a lawsuit is filed, however.

Disclaimer: I'm not an attorney.

Roy Lewallen, W7EL

I am only passing along what I have found. I have no dog in this fight,
hihi.

tom
K0TAR

Antenna optimization
 

Tom Ring wrote:
(snip)
I have no dog in this fight, hihi.

Tom, please define "hihi" in this context. Thank you.

Antenna optimization
 

On Wed, 12 Jul 2006 19:37:11 -0500, Tom Ring
wrote:

That's all there is in either version of YO that contains the
"copyright" in any form, case insensitive. I am ignoring the companion
programs.

Hi Tom,

Pretty unsophisticated, certainly. This redoubles my experience with
other licensing as being far more exclusive.

However, with five patents of my own, I can certainly attest that
these scraps offer protection that have all the muscle of paper. These
ego certificates allow you to get past a lawyer's secretary and spend
money trying to convince judges with the technically savvy of
troglodytes.

Franklin was right about these matters.

As for automated optimization, NASA spent huge bucks on this stuff to
design twisted paper clips to replace Walt's work of 30 years ago. I
can well bet that license runs pages. If the testimonials to Beezley
are any indicator, the utility of the software is in inverse
proportion to the length of its license.

73's
Richard Clark, KB7QHC

Antenna optimization
 

John Popelish wrote:

Tom Ring wrote:
(snip)
I have no dog in this fight, hihi.

Tom, please define "hihi" in this context. Thank you.


hihi, CW for laughter. Lots of dits in a row. Meant I am amused by the
whole thing.

Do you need more explanation, or was that adequate?

tom
K0TAR

Antenna optimization
 

Tom Ring wrote:
John Popelish wrote:

Tom Ring wrote:
(snip)
I have no dog in this fight, hihi.

Tom, please define "hihi" in this context. Thank you.


hihi, CW for laughter. Lots of dits in a row. Meant I am amused by the
whole thing.

Do you need more explanation, or was that adequate?

Perfectly adequate. Thank you.

I have seen this a lot, lately, and didn't know its meaning.

Antenna optimization
 

Richard Clark wrote:

As for automated optimization, NASA spent huge bucks on this stuff to
design twisted paper clips to replace Walt's work of 30 years ago. I
can well bet that license runs pages. If the testimonials to Beezley
are any indicator, the utility of the software is in inverse
proportion to the length of its license.

73's
Richard Clark, KB7QHC

However some of it does work very well. YO, when used correctly can
just barely beat K1FO's designs, which were done on a PDP11, using a
special version of BASIC, as I remember from conversations with him long
ago.

He got the designs as right as possible, using an EME'rs version of
right. He hit max gain for boomlength within less than 1dB, pattern is
wonderful, SWR BW is astonishing, and pattern and gain are all fairly
constant across the usable SWR BW. Input impedance is not too low, at
about 20-25 ohms, and efficient match can be had with a T-match. And it
handles ice and rain detuning perfectly. Build sensitivity is nice; you
can skew the design by induced errors of +-2mm element length and +-5mm
vertical off the boom and +-2mm element position on the boom with no
significant change. Gain not off by .1dB, pattern not off by 2dB,
normally less. I ran a lot of tests. And I could be misremembering a
bit, but probably by too high rather than too low.

And YO could beat K1FO by only hudredths of a dB. If he'd had more CPU
power to do more runs per day...

tom
K0TAR

Antenna optimization
 

Richard Clark wrote:

As for automated optimization, NASA spent huge bucks on this stuff to
design twisted paper clips to replace Walt's work of 30 years ago. I
can well bet that license runs pages. If the testimonials to Beezley
are any indicator, the utility of the software is in inverse
proportion to the length of its license.

73's
Richard Clark, KB7QHC

I forgot to mention that the K1FO designs referred to were at 432.

tom
K0TAR

Antenna optimization
 

John Popelish wrote:



Perfectly adequate. Thank you.

I have seen this a lot, lately, and didn't know its meaning.

As a Syrius Cybernetics construct would say "Glad to be of service!"

tom
K0TAR

Antenna optimization
 

On Wed, 12 Jul 2006 21:16:29 -0500, Tom Ring
wrote:

He got the designs as right as possible, using an EME'rs version of
right. He hit max gain for boomlength within less than 1dB, pattern is
wonderful, SWR BW is astonishing, and pattern and gain are all fairly
constant across the usable SWR BW. Input impedance is not too low, at
about 20-25 ohms, and efficient match can be had with a T-match. And it
handles ice and rain detuning perfectly. Build sensitivity is nice; you
can skew the design by induced errors of +-2mm element length and +-5mm
vertical off the boom and +-2mm element position on the boom with no
significant change. Gain not off by .1dB, pattern not off by 2dB,
normally less. I ran a lot of tests. And I could be misremembering a
bit, but probably by too high rather than too low.

Hi Tom,

This is all pretty significant stuff. Its success probably ties in
with what Reggie had to say about the quality of automated software
being tied to the competence of the user/designer (Reggie may wish to
distance himself from my paraphrase however).

As a negative example, some half decade or more ago we had a fractal
designer who threw as much computational horsepower at this as his
budget would allow in hiring eager, bright faced graduates building
parallel processors. They perhaps knew Genetic Algorithms (the hot
topic in academia whose bloom had long faded in cut-throat industry),
but certainly nothing about the bajillion degrees of freedom in
antenna design. Well, that stack of computers was more a marketing
paper weight than a design producer - I've never seen an independent
headline announcing the dawn of a new age of fractals in Boston. In
fact, it would seem that same NASA program stole their thunder - and
it is still a yawn.

73's
Richard Clark, KB7QHC