Senior,

One can only be made to feel inferior by one's own consent. If you
believe you are better than they are, then they can't hurt you no
matter what they say.

The Eternal Squire

wrote:

Oh, I LOVED the Galaxy V mark II.

The FT-101, Galaxy, Drake, and Swan are not $100 pieces of gear on
EBay, they are more like $300 to $400 pretty consistencly. I think a
fully loaded multiband fresh boatanchor should sell quite nicely for
$199.95 it if offers compareable features. That would imply a
wholesale price of about $100.00. That would imply that parts, labor,
and other indirect costs should be somewhere between $50 to $80. I
think I can get from Russia or China a single sweep tube plus a handful
of smaller tubes for about $30. The rest would have to be chassis,
discretes, power, labor, shipping, and customs.

Now, if I market direct through the net rather than through a retailer,
I think I could go self sustaining after a few build-sales cycles.

Since I dove into this water...I'll continue my nay-saying even tho I
love BAs.

You say FT-101, etc...aren't $100 pieces of gear on ebay. Thats too
broad and maybe your perspective is different than mine. As found
Galaxy V are lucky to get $100, as are HW-100. FT-101, Kwood TS-520,
Swan 350-500, Drake TR-3/4 will garner twice that in "last time I fired
it up it worked" condition. I've given away two Galaxy V in as found
condition this year because they couldn't be sold at any price.

I'm not clear if you are suggesting building these things from scratch
or taking older xcvrs and refurbing them. If you haven't walked this
talk I suspect you'd find out very quickly that paying $35 for an old
Galaxy and refurbing it at maybe a cost of a dozen hours of labour you
might get $125 on resale on a good day when there are no other buyers
that could do the same thing for their own purpose.

To do an equivalent Galaxy 5 from scratch for $199 commercial resale?
No way.

If the people on this topic would be willing to be a focus group for
the fresh boat-anchor of thier dreams, I would be quite grateful.

Well, you have my input. I'll never discourage rolling your own but
trying to make a bizness out of it is a whole nuther can of worms.

-Bill WX4A

Bill ) writes:

You say FT-101, etc...aren't $100 pieces of gear on ebay. Thats too
broad and maybe your perspective is different than mine. As found
Galaxy V are lucky to get $100, as are HW-100. FT-101, Kwood TS-520,
Swan 350-500, Drake TR-3/4 will garner twice that in "last time I fired
it up it worked" condition. I've given away two Galaxy V in as found
condition this year because they couldn't be sold at any price.

And of course, people want the boatanchors because they are old, because
they are the rig they had when they were first in the hobby or because
they lusted after the rig decades ago but couldn't afford it. I suspect
that is the major reason, rather than because they are tube-based. Take
away that familiarity, and the interested number will also drop.

People will pay more now the more expensive it was in the first place, but
that may be as much because fewer bought them back then (hence fewer
exist) than because they are better rigs.

Michael VE2BVW

You say FT-101, etc...aren't $100 pieces of gear on ebay. Thats too
broad and maybe your perspective is different than mine. As found
Galaxy V are lucky to get $100, as are HW-100. FT-101, Kwood TS-520,
Swan 350-500, Drake TR-3/4 will garner twice that in "last time I fired
it up it worked" condition. I've given away two Galaxy V in as found
condition this year because they couldn't be sold at any price.

Found condition is the key. I'm sorry, but I got into bidding wars at
least 3 or more times trying to get a Yaesu in guaranteed working
condition with recent maintenance.

I'm not clear if you are suggesting building these things from scratch
or taking older xcvrs and refurbing them. If you haven't walked this
talk I suspect you'd find out very quickly that paying $35 for an old
Galaxy and refurbing it at maybe a cost of a dozen hours of labour you
might get $125 on resale on a good day when there are no other buyers
that could do the same thing for their own purpose.

Nope, I am indeed talking scratch.

To do an equivalent Galaxy 5 from scratch for $199 commercial resale?
No way.

Why not?

Well, you have my input. I'll never discourage rolling your own but
trying to make a bizness out of it is a whole nuther can of worms.

Oh, and I so much appreciate that. That is not sarcasm.

The Eternal Squire

Michael:

How about a thought experiment? Assuming we don't consider copyright,
patent, trademark, or other issues. Say God gave me the gift of being
able to create a Collins-class rig at 1/2 to 1/3 the usual price on
Ebay? Would that be tempting?

The Eternal Squikre

And of course, people want the boatanchors because they are old
Collectors rather than operators, right?

they are the rig they had when they were first in the hobby
Yes, but also because they found later, purportedly more modern
equipment,
to be harder to operate or repair, or easier to break, with replacement
parts
and labor costing more than the rig itself?

they lusted after the rig decades ago but couldn't afford it.
And still can't, in the case of Collins for example.

I suspect that is the major reason, rather than because they are tube-based.
Really? I think it takes a different mentality to operate a tube rig
than a semiconductor or digital rig. I really think the casual tube
rigs were easier for children and adolescents to operate on HF. I had
the worst time trying to understand an ICOM during my 20's, for
example.

Take away that familiarity, and the interested number will also drop.
But what if I kept the familiarity of operation rather than the
familiarity of brand name? Would it drop drastically?

The Eternal Squire

wrote:



To do an equivalent Galaxy 5 from scratch for $199 commercial resale?
No way.


Why not?

At this point you are daydreaming. Start pricing the components.
You'll likely exceed $199 before you add in any labour.

-Bill

wrote:



But what if I kept the familiarity of operation rather than the
familiarity of brand name? Would it drop drastically?\

Doesn't work that way anymore. In the old days the manufacturer might
have included a card in the manual that you could stick on a 5 cent
stamp and ask why the rig didn't work.
People don't accept that level of service these days.

I'm not trying to be condescening...YOU buy a Gal V on ebay or swap meet
and try to get it playing to satisfaction for a single year of regular
operation...you'll gain a different perspective. I don't think you can
'homebrew' around these issues. Its always 'something'.

-Bill

Maybe not a Galaxy 5 itself, you could be right. Besides, it was a
hybrid rig, not an all- tube rig anyway.

But, what about this lineup for receiver:

1) 3 sets of switchable preselector filter with ganged variable
capacitor with a single dual triode amp, half of which are placed
between each filter.
2) Single dual triode as cascode IF converter, rather than a pentagrid
converter which are hardly made anymore.
3) Single dual triode as differential VFO, glass equivalent of recent
QEX circuit, with oscillator variable capacitor ganged to the
preselector capacitor as part of same set.
4) Single dual triode as pre and post amps to lattice crystal IF
filter.
5) Single dual triode as cascode baseband converter.
6) Single dual triode as differential BFO, similar design to VFO.
7) Push-pull audio power amp... reuse this in transmitter.

Transmitter lineup:

1) Single sweep tube operated class E for CW, modified to class H with
aid of receiver's push pull power amp.
2) Share the preselector for use in postfiltering of the power amp.
3) Use the same differential VFO as the input to the class E amp.

This isn't really SSB: it is more quick and dirty DSB/CW transmitter
with SSB receiver. (If anyone can modify a class E amp for SSB service
I would love to hear about it).

So, this lineup uses a single sweep tube, 6 dual trodes, and a pair of
6L6 equivalents.

Shuguang 807 as sweep tube: $16 retail
Shuguang 6SN7 (VFO) $11 retail
Shuguang 6SN7 (BFO) $11 retail
2 Shuguang 6L6 (Amp/Mod) $25 retail
4 CH-12AX7A $48 retail
-----------------
$111 retail ==
$55 wholesale if I can establish a dealer relationship with supplier.

Tubes: (presumed wholeale) $55
Resistors (NOS wholesale): $10
Caps (NOS wholesale): $10
Power transformer: $5 sheet metal stack
made in LDC
4-gang variable $25 (Soviet make
from EBAY)
Chassis: $20 sheet metal
Planetary gear drive: $15 (cast iron gears
from LDC)
Crystals (NOS wholesale) $5
Rotary Band Switch (NOS EBAY) $10
---------
$140
Labor (20 hours at $1/hour in an LDC) $ 20
---------
$160
Murphy Factor (20%) $ 32
----------
COGS w/labor $192

======================

OK, you are likely right that the wholesale cost is high. But I only
worked this out in 20 minutes using recent surfing, reading, and other
communication. Perhaps with further refinement I can get the cost
down. I added a murphy factor for amortized taxes, freight, and
customs.

BUT: I think I made it with $7 to spare, including labor, so long as I
do not rely on the US for a lot of things.

Maybe $250 would be a more realistic retail price... Not much profit
margin, though, but not much needed for mail order sales if I am only
intending to supplement income rather than support myself.

Thoughts?

The Eternal Squire

wrote:


$140
Labor (20 hours at $1/hour in an LDC) $ 20
---------
$160
Murphy Factor (20%) $ 32
----------
COGS w/labor $192

Where's the chassis, knobs, tuning caps, IF cans, tube sockets, xtal
filters, cabinet, dial, power xfmr, etc? Any radio homebrewer will tell
you that where the cost is. Tubes are incidental costs.

Bzzt, if you can provide labour for a $1 per hour and understimate the
Murphy factor then you have a chance of breaking even...well no, not
really. Using your figure of 20 hours I calculate that you'll clear an
income of $40 per week on 2 rigs, $60 if you work nites, if you do it
all yourself.

If I could build a Galaxy 5 equivalent in 20 hours...never mind...

Okay. Paying shipping for one single returned rig in this scenario will
have you WISHING you hadn't eaten last week's can of cat food for dinner.

Doesn't wash. You couldn't do this for less than $500 per rig (sans
labour and profit)....and thats why there isn't the market that you imagine.

-Bill