(Geoffrey S. Mendelson) ha scritto:

In article , Bob M. wrote:

The rest of your symptoms are very strange. I can offer no help at all.
Obviously something is wrong, but I can't even begin to tell you what to
look for.

They are very common. Kenwood potted the main PLL in a rubber compound
to isolate from thermal changes and mechanical shock. In plain English to
slow down the effect of temperature changes and prevent frequency jumping
if you tapped the radio, or when mobile went over a bump.

The problem is that over the years the rubber compound started to absorb
water from the air. If you were in a totaly dry enviornment this would
never happen. I have an R5000 (same problem). When I lived in the U.S. I
kept the radio in a basement that was so wet everything would rot in a
few days, so we kept a dehumidifier running and the basement was very
dry. The radio never had a problem.

After sitting in a box and then a freight container over the ocean, it
picked up enough moisture to fail in about 3 months.

The fix is simple in theory and is documented on the Kenwood web site.
You remove the shield from the main PLL, remove the rubber compound,
replace any parts damaged due to corrosion and readjust the PLL.

An experienced technician, such as Cliff at AAVID, can do it for
about $100 for parts and labor. Unless you have the correct tools
and equipment, I'm not sure you can do it, but many people have.

Geoff.

--
Geoffrey S. Mendelson 972-54-608-069
Icq/AIM Uin: 2661079 MSN IM: (Not for email)
Carp are bottom feeders, koi are too, and not surprisingly are ferrets.


Well, others already said that, but I have looked pratically
every board in the TS-450 and found no rubber compunds.
Indeed, now I know buch better my rig and I was amazed on how
well the parts are put and fixed and how it is easy to unmount
them.

What I found up to know is in another message.

In article , Bob M. wrote:

The rest of your symptoms are very strange. I can offer no help at all.
Obviously something is wrong, but I can't even begin to tell you what to
look for.

They are very common. Kenwood potted the main PLL in a rubber compound
to isolate from thermal changes and mechanical shock. In plain English to
slow down the effect of temperature changes and prevent frequency jumping
if you tapped the radio, or when mobile went over a bump.

The problem is that over the years the rubber compound started to absorb
water from the air. If you were in a totaly dry enviornment this would
never happen. I have an R5000 (same problem). When I lived in the U.S. I
kept the radio in a basement that was so wet everything would rot in a
few days, so we kept a dehumidifier running and the basement was very
dry. The radio never had a problem.

After sitting in a box and then a freight container over the ocean, it
picked up enough moisture to fail in about 3 months.

The fix is simple in theory and is documented on the Kenwood web site.
You remove the shield from the main PLL, remove the rubber compound,
replace any parts damaged due to corrosion and readjust the PLL.

An experienced technician, such as Cliff at AAVID, can do it for
about $100 for parts and labor. Unless you have the correct tools
and equipment, I'm not sure you can do it, but many people have.

Geoff.

--
Geoffrey S. Mendelson 972-54-608-069
Icq/AIM Uin: 2661079 MSN IM: (Not for email)
Carp are bottom feeders, koi are too, and not surprisingly are ferrets.

W3 connects to the TU-8 tone unit, which uses DIP switches to generate one
of about 40 PL or other tones. This would only be activated if you enabled
the front panel TONE switch, and probably would only be useful on FM.

My unit draws a solid 20 amps when transmitting, and if the power supply is
set to current limit at that point, it will do so. I'm using an Astron
VS-35M supply set to about 14v and full current, which should be good for 35
amps max, and have only had a problem when the current limit was set lower.
I doubt your power supply is a problem on receive, unless it's very low
(less than 8 volts) or very high (more than 18 volts).

The lithium battery should be used just for memory retention, and they're
normally around 3.6v, so 3.28 isn't too bad, but probably time to be
replaced anyway. My unit is 11 years old and I should look into the same
battery replacement in mine.

The rest of your symptoms are very strange. I can offer no help at all.
Obviously something is wrong, but I can't even begin to tell you what to
look for.

Bob M.
======
"James" wrote in message
...
I wish to repair my own Kenwood TS-450S-AT and to begin from
somewhere, I'd like to know what other 450's users think of the
current situation:

1) When I power the rig, I have no audio at all and no
trasmitting. The display shows a row of dots. If I move the
main dial, the frequency appears normally, but if I release it,
after half a second the dots appear again.

2) Some other times, when I give power I have both audio and
trasmitting and the display works well, but the audio in SSB/CW
modes is totally distorted, while it is ok in AM/FM modes.
However after 5-20 minutes of rx, the situation becomes that
described at point 1.

3) I have read of the battery problem in the 450, so I found
the lithium battery and measured it. It gives 3.28 V, is that
normal? Since the rig is approaching ten years I think I will
change it anyway, but I don't know if it is a problem now!

4) On the bottom side of the rig, near the place for the 455 kHz
cw filter (I have the 8.83 one, so this place is empty), there
is a 3-wire connector labeled "W3". The short cable, with a
similar connector on the other side, is attached to... nothing.
But I don't see any place to attach it, even if I look at the
whole board. Unfortunately I lack the 450/690 service manual
and I did not find this connector on the istruction manual
schemes. This MAY be normal, though.

My conclusions, for now:

a) When things are ok, except for SSB/CW, the problem should
arise in the second IF at 455 kHz. Either the CAR Unit does
not give a correct 455 kHz carrier or something is wrong in
the IF mixer chip or near it. In fact this chip is used only
in ssb/cw/fsk modes.

b) When the rig is almost dead, perhaps there is something wrong
in the digital/display unit. Lithium battery? Some digital chip,
which one?

c) Also the mere power could be a problem. My supply, 13.8 V 40 A
max, looks good, but internally there are circuits to obtain the
different voltages required and these could be damaged.


I am mainly looking for the service manual (someone has scanned
it?), but all other advices are welcome.

James

One simple thing to try: loosen and retighten all screws that
hold down circuit boards; wiggle all jumper connectors, so
they are reseated and the contacts wiped a bit. This cured
several really strange problems on my very old TS-930.

--

... Hank

Hank: http://horedson.home.att.net
W0RLI: http://w0rli.home.att.net

"James" wrote in message
...
I wish to repair my own Kenwood TS-450S-AT and to begin from
somewhere, I'd like to know what other 450's users think of the
current situation:

1) When I power the rig, I have no audio at all and no
trasmitting. The display shows a row of dots. If I move the
main dial, the frequency appears normally, but if I release it,
after half a second the dots appear again.

2) Some other times, when I give power I have both audio and
trasmitting and the display works well, but the audio in SSB/CW
modes is totally distorted, while it is ok in AM/FM modes.
However after 5-20 minutes of rx, the situation becomes that
described at point 1.

3) I have read of the battery problem in the 450, so I found
the lithium battery and measured it. It gives 3.28 V, is that
normal? Since the rig is approaching ten years I think I will
change it anyway, but I don't know if it is a problem now!

4) On the bottom side of the rig, near the place for the 455 kHz
cw filter (I have the 8.83 one, so this place is empty), there
is a 3-wire connector labeled "W3". The short cable, with a
similar connector on the other side, is attached to... nothing.
But I don't see any place to attach it, even if I look at the
whole board. Unfortunately I lack the 450/690 service manual
and I did not find this connector on the istruction manual
schemes. This MAY be normal, though.

My conclusions, for now:

a) When things are ok, except for SSB/CW, the problem should
arise in the second IF at 455 kHz. Either the CAR Unit does
not give a correct 455 kHz carrier or something is wrong in
the IF mixer chip or near it. In fact this chip is used only
in ssb/cw/fsk modes.

b) When the rig is almost dead, perhaps there is something wrong
in the digital/display unit. Lithium battery? Some digital chip,
which one?

c) Also the mere power could be a problem. My supply, 13.8 V 40 A
max, looks good, but internally there are circuits to obtain the
different voltages required and these could be damaged.


I am mainly looking for the service manual (someone has scanned
it?), but all other advices are welcome.

James

This was posted to ARLI, I don't know how many subscribe, but in spite of the numerous comments against BPL (transmitting wideband internet data over power lines, which will destroy the HF radio spectrum), the FCC seems disposed
to encourage it anyway. evil! evil! just look up BPL on the web. The noise from the radiated signals trashed the ham bands thoroughly.

-------------------

From:
Amateur Radio Station N0JAA
4:00 PM

Subject:
[ARLI] FCC Commissioner's Comments Concerning BPL
To:
, ,




The following is a transcript from a recent speech given by FCC Commissioner Kathleen Q. Abernathy at the United PowerLine
Council's annual conference regarding BPL. It seems that she is all for it. It also seems that BPL is going to become a reality, regardless
of what ARRL, the military, or anyone else says. As usual, big industry wins over everyone else because they have the money.

This is from today's FCC Digest.

Paul, N0JAA

----------------------


Reaching Broadband Nirvana
United PowerLine Council Annual Conference Remarks of Commissioner Kathleen Q. Abernathy
September 22, 2003 (As prepared for delivery)


Thank you very much for inviting me to speak with you. I am very excited about broadband-over-powerline technology. I
have seen it in action, and I believe it has a very bright future. It is a real honor to be your keynote speaker at this
important juncture for BPL.

As a regulator, I am keenly interested in BPL technology for a number of reasons. One of my central objectives as an FCC commissioner is to facilitate the deployment of broadband services to all Americans. I also fundamentally
believe that the FCC can best promote consumer welfare by relying on market forces, rather than heavy-handed regulation. The development of BPL networks will serve both of these key goals. It will not only bring broadband to
previously unserved communities, but the introduction of a new broadband pipeline into the home will foster the kind of competitive marketplace that will eventually enable the Commission to let go of the regulatory reins. I
want consumers to have a choice of multiple, facilities-based providers, including not only cable and DSL, but also powerline, wireless, and satellite services. Such a robustly competitive and diversified marketplace is
something I would call broadband Nirvana. We will not get there overnight, but the continuing development of BPL technology is a major step forward.

While the long-term objective is a robustly competitive marketplace that is free of regulatory distortions, a more immediate question is: What should the FCC do to help foster such an environment? Sticking with my Nirvana
metaphor, I guess the question would be, what is the path to enlightenment?

I believe the answer, in short, is regulatory restraint. It is tempting for regulators to take every new technology or service that comes along and apply the same rules that govern incumbent services. After all, regulatory
parity and a level playing field are intuitively appealing concepts. But I believe that it would be a huge mistake to carry forward legacy regulations whenever new technology platforms are established. Many of our regulations
are premised on the absence of competition, and when that rationale is eroded, we must not reflexively hold on to regulations that no longer serve their intended purpose. In fact, many of our old rules not only become
unnecessary as markets evolve, but they can be fatal to new services that need room to breathe.

The Nascent Services Doctrine applying more stringent regulations to wireline providers at a minimum must be reconsidered. As other platforms, including BPL and wireless, become more widely available, that will further
undermine the justification for regulating incumbent LECs broadband services as if they were the only available offerings. When the Commission completes this rulemaking, I expect that we will eliminate many existing rules and
substantially modify others; the central question is the degree of regulation that will remain during the transition to a more robustly competitive market.

Finally, it is important to recognize that although the emergence of new platforms like BPL will eliminate the need for many competition-related regulations, other types of regulation may well remain necessary. For example, the
FCC must implement public policy goals unrelated to competition, or even at odds with competition. Universal service and access for persons with disabilities are examples of this kind of regulation. These public policy goals
generally should be applied to all service providers, to the extent permitted by the Communications Act. The FCC also must intervene to prevent competitors from imposing externalities on one another and to protect consumers
where market failures are identified. Although, as I have noted, the Commission was right to refrain from imposing heavy-handed price and service-quality regulations on PCS services when the were introduced, it was also right
to adopt strict interference rules to prevent competitors from externalizing their costs. The same principle will apply to BPL. They key point is that, while some degree of regulation is both inevitable and desirable, we
should ensure that it is narrowly tailored to the particular governmental interests at stake. I appreciate the opportunity to share these thoughts with you, and I would be happy to answer a few questions if we have time.


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"opcom" wrote in message
...
This was posted to ARLI, I don't know how many
subscribe, but in spite of the numerous comments
against BPL (transmitting wideband internet data
over power lines, which will destroy the HF radio
spectrum), the FCC seems disposed to encourage
it anyway. evil! evil! just look up BPL on the web. T
the noise from the radiated signals trashed the ham bands thoroughly.

I guess you never heard that money talks and bull**** walks eh?

Did you *REALLY THINK* that a couple hundred
aging HF operating tightwad ham radio operators
are going to stop an emerging technology that will
conceivably network home appliances to the internet
and be worth $BILLIONS$ in potential revenue ??

Jeezehus-H-christ...get F-N real !!

"recalcitrant ham op" wrote in message
...


Another no-callsign anti-ham Troll.

(yawn)

Charles Brabham, N5PVL

"recalcitrant ham op" wrote in message
...


Another no-callsign anti-ham Troll.

(yawn)

Charles Brabham, N5PVL

recalcitrant ham op wrote:

Did you *REALLY THINK* that a couple hundred
aging HF operating tightwad ham radio operators
are going to stop an emerging technology that will
conceivably network home appliances to the internet
and be worth $BILLIONS$ in potential revenue ??

Hams are the least of the problems. There are many other users of the
HF range who will be effected other than hams. Here's just a few:

US Coast Guard makes high use of HF
All branches of the military
Many long distance marine comms are still on HF
TransAtlantic and Pacific Air Traffic Control Comms are HF
(Imagine if the ATC ground station can't hear an Aircraft call is
position).


And that's just a few services who are heavy uses of HF.

George
http://www.MilAirComms.com
With DSL who needs BPL?

Right on --
retired merchant marine R/O
N4GL

GeorgeF wrote:

recalcitrant ham op wrote:

Did you *REALLY THINK* that a couple hundred
aging HF operating tightwad ham radio operators
are going to stop an emerging technology that will
conceivably network home appliances to the internet
and be worth $BILLIONS$ in potential revenue ??

Hams are the least of the problems. There are many other users of the
HF range who will be effected other than hams. Here's just a few:

US Coast Guard makes high use of HF
All branches of the military
Many long distance marine comms are still on HF
TransAtlantic and Pacific Air Traffic Control Comms are HF
(Imagine if the ATC ground station can't hear an Aircraft call is
position).

And that's just a few services who are heavy uses of HF.

George
http://www.MilAirComms.com
With DSL who needs BPL?