wrote in message
...
On Sun, 23 Oct 2005 21:52:17 GMT, "Dan/W4NTI"

I talked with the ARRL on the subject. And there IS a memorandum of
understanding.
Apparantly most to all at RC don't read or are unable to comprehend. OR
are
just
plain ignorant. Take your pick. Bottom line is THEY dropped the ball.

taking about the Red Croos in such terms as you use above as of course
sure to endear the ARS to them,

even if the words were valid

guess you missed any lession concerning the word "Tact"


Well asshole if you knew me you would know I could care less about TACT.
And when you deal with me you learn TWO things. ONE; I say it the way I
see it. TWO: If you don't like that you wont ask again.

That is EVERYONE but YOU. Your too damn stupid to figure that out. And
don't
give me the crap about your being brain damaged. You are just a world class
asswipe
that needs his ass kicked.\

could you make up you mind?

Still don't get it do you? ****OFF MORON.



Dan/W4NTI


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"Mike Coslo" wrote in message
...
Comdr Buzz Corey wrote:
wrote:


Cell phone does indeed show signs of being usable as a true emergency
network


How? The entire cell network was down in NO. The only way to get cell
coverage there was out on some remote point a few people managed to get
to and make a few calls.

Yeah, I heard that the network was down too! I guess it depends on if you
hate hams or not. If you hate hams, one message getting out means that
Cell phones work great in an emergency.

- Mike KB3EIA -

Maybe MSNBC put up their own cell phone system just so they could impress
Markey the Moron.

Dan/W4NTI

"Mike Coslo" wrote in message
...
wrote:
Cmdr Buzz Corey wrote:

Mike Coslo wrote:

I think the idea is that person 1 transmits to the end of his block,
then person 2 transmits to the end of their block. And so on and so on.
Be just like the olde days when the "relay" meant something in ARRL.
They will need every one of those "millions" of FRS radio owners.

When a kid did you ever play the party game 'pass it on'? You know where
you whisper something in someone's ear, they then pass it on to the next
person, then the next, then the next, ect. By the time it gets to the
last person it isn't anything like the orginal message. You don't need
that when you are trying to get critical information to a destination.


So the "Relay" in ARRL is a useless construct?

Wunnerful in theory, useless in practice?

Probably why there are forms to use, and that hams who are trained in
communications use 'em. Relaying messages would seem to be a simple thing.
But if several hundred people do the relaying without any training, I'd
bet that the message will look a little different at the end as compared
to just one or two relays by trained people.

- Mike KB3EIA -

Wrong....Markey told me that he heard that MSNBC relayed all sorts of
messages and they came out perfect.

Dan/W4NTI

Dee Flint wrote:
wrote in message
oups.com...

Cmdr Buzz Corey wrote:

Mike Coslo wrote:

I think the idea is that person 1 transmits to the end of his
block,
then person 2 transmits to the end of their block. And so on and so on.
Be just like the olde days when the "relay" meant something in ARRL.
They will need every one of those "millions" of FRS radio owners.

When a kid did you ever play the party game 'pass it on'? You know where
you whisper something in someone's ear, they then pass it on to the next
person, then the next, then the next, ect. By the time it gets to the
last person it isn't anything like the orginal message. You don't need
that when you are trying to get critical information to a destination.

So the "Relay" in ARRL is a useless construct?

Wunnerful in theory, useless in practice?



No it simply means that without a structured format, message training, means
of checking the message (such as word count), etc that the system breaks
down. The formal message handling systems have these. The FRS system does
not.

Absolutely.

wrote:
On Sun, 23 Oct 2005 17:59:39 GMT, "Dan/W4NTI"
wrote:


Of course you won't believe me, or anyone else. But the cell phone network
was down for the majority of New Orleans. I know people that went there to
repair it.


I would believe some trust worthy


New Orleans Phones, Cell Networks Still Down

September 2, 2005
New Orleans remains shut off from the outside world, with virtually no
phone service and repair crews not yet allowed to enter the flooded,
battered city.

The various telephone companies have been unable to estimate when
service might resume, since they have not yet been able to physically
inspect the damage to their equipment.

The landline network has been out in most of the New Orleans area since
the storm hit *and most cell towers failed during the first few hours.*
Emergency generators kept some facilities up but they soon ran out of
fuel or became water-logged

http://www.consumeraffairs.com/news0...na_phones.html

TOM wrote:


Exactly... the amateur service had an unprecedented golden opportunity for
PR at New Orleans and they blew-it big time.

Sure couldn't tell they blew it big time by this article from MSNBC, or
dozens of others like it.

Ham radio operators to the rescue after Katrina
Amateur radio networks help victims of the hurricane

With telephones down and wireless service disrupted, at least one group
of people did manage last week to use technology to come to the rescue
of those in need.

Often unsung, amateur radio operators regularly assist in emergency
situations. Hurricane Katrina was no exception. For the past week,
operators of amateur, or ham, radio have been instrumental in helping
residents in the hardest hit areas, including saving stranded flood
victims in Louisiana and Mississippi.

Public service has always been a large part of being an amateur radio
operator. All operators, who use two-way radios on special frequencies
set aside for amateur use, must be tested and licensed by the federal
government, which then issues them a unique call sign. (Mine is W2GSK.)

Ham operators communicate using voice, computers, televisions and Morse
code (the original digital communication mode.) Some hams bounce their
signals off the upper regions of the atmosphere, so they can talk with
hams on the other side of the world; others use satellites. Many use
short-range, handheld radios that fit in their pockets.

When disaster strikes, ham networks spring into action. The Amateur
Radio Emergency Service (ARES) consists of licensed amateurs who have
voluntarily registered their qualifications and equipment for
communications duty in the public service.

In this disaster a number of ham emergency stations and networks have
been involved in providing information about this disaster – from
WX4NHC, the amateur radio station at the National Hurricane Center to
the Hurricane Watch Net, the Waterway Net, Skywarn and the Salvation
Army Team Emergency Radio Network (SATERN).

On Monday, Aug. 29, a call for help involving a combination of cell
telephone calls and amateur radio led to the rescue of 15 people
stranded by floodwaters on the roof of a house in New Orleans. Unable to
get through an overloaded 911 system, one of those stranded called a
relative in Baton Rouge. That person called another relative, who called
the local American Red Cross.

Using that Red Cross chapter’s amateur radio station, Ben Joplin,
WB5VST, was able to relay a request for help on the SATERN network via
Russ Fillinger, W7LXR, in Oregon, and Rick Cain, W7KB, in Utah back to
Louisiana, where emergency personnel were alerted. They rescued the 15
people and got them to a shelter.

Such rescues were repeated over and over again. Another ham was part of
the mix that same Monday when he heard over the same Salvation Army
emergency network of a family of five trapped in an attic in Diamond
Head, La. The family used a cell phone to call out. Bob Rathbone,
AG4ZG, in Tampa, says he checked the address on a map and determined it
was in an area struck by a storm surge.

He called the Coast Guard search-and-rescue station in Clearwater,
explained the situation and relayed the information. At this point, the
Coast Guard office in New Orleans was out of commission. An hour later
he received a return call from the South Haven Sheriff’s Department in
Louisiana, which informed him a rescue operation was under way.

Another search-and-rescue operation involved two adults and a child
stuck on a roof. The person was able to send a text message from a cell
phone to a family member in Michigan. Once again, the Coast Guard
handled the call.

Relief work is not just relegated to monitoring radios for distress
calls. The organization representing amateur radio operators, The
American Radio Relay League or ARRL, now is seeking emergency volunteers
to help supplement communication for American Red Cross feeding and
sheltering operations in Mississippi, Alabama and the Florida Panhandle
— as many as 200 locations in all.

Hams who wish to volunteer their time and services should contact the
Hurricane Katrina volunteer registration and message traffic database.

And, for the first time, the federal government will help hams help
others. The Corporation for National and Community Service (CNCS) will
provide a $100,000 grant supplement to ARRL to support its emergency
communication operators in states affected by Hurricane Katrina. The
grant will help to fund what is being termed “Ham Aid,” a new program to
support amateur radio volunteers deployed in the field in
disaster-stricken areas.

One last note for ham operators in the stricken area: The FCC has
announced that it’s extending amateur license renewal deadlines until
October 31, 2005.

Sucks when anyone does it. Looks like Steve has mentored lots of folks
on RRAP.

Dr.Ace wrote:
Sucks when Mark does that, doesn't it!
Ace - WH2T


wrote in message
oups.com...

Mike Coslo wrote:

You toss the "liar" pejorative around when someone voices an opinion,
and you tell people to shut up when they express an opinion.

Sucks when people do that, doesn't it?

Dee Flint wrote:
wrote in message
oups.com...

Cmdr Buzz Corey wrote:
Mike Coslo wrote:

I think the idea is that person 1 transmits to the end of his
block,
then person 2 transmits to the end of their block. And so on and so on.
Be just like the olde days when the "relay" meant something in ARRL.
They will need every one of those "millions" of FRS radio owners.

When a kid did you ever play the party game 'pass it on'? You know where
you whisper something in someone's ear, they then pass it on to the next
person, then the next, then the next, ect. By the time it gets to the
last person it isn't anything like the orginal message. You don't need
that when you are trying to get critical information to a destination.

So the "Relay" in ARRL is a useless construct?

Wunnerful in theory, useless in practice?

No it simply means that without a structured format, message training, means
of checking the message (such as word count), etc that the system breaks
down. The formal message handling systems have these. The FRS system does
not.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE

So not only can't hams work in a weak signal environment, but we would
also lose the ability to format messages while monitoring FRS?

wrote:
From: "Dee Flint" on Sun 23 Oct 2005 10:19


wrote in message
Cmdr Buzz Corey wrote:
Mike Coslo wrote:

I think the idea is that person 1 transmits to the end of his block,
then person 2 transmits to the end of their block. And so on and so on.
Be just like the olde days when the "relay" meant something in ARRL.
They will need every one of those "millions" of FRS radio owners.

When a kid did you ever play the party game 'pass it on'? You know where
you whisper something in someone's ear, they then pass it on to the next
person, then the next, then the next, ect. By the time it gets to the
last person it isn't anything like the orginal message. You don't need
that when you are trying to get critical information to a destination.

So the "Relay" in ARRL is a useless construct?

Wunnerful in theory, useless in practice?

No it simply means that without a structured format, message training, means
of checking the message (such as word count), etc that the system breaks
down.

Perhaps that is why the first two trans-continental attempts at
early messaging across the USA broke down? They were "sponsored"
by the ARRL. History. The ARRL doesn't like to talk of those
early days much, though, so you have to go to Thomas White's
Early US Radio History site to find out. :-)

The formal message handling systems have these.

Tell us all about it, Dee. I worked in that a mere 52 years ago.
Professionally. On HF. We can compare notes...

Tell us how the GMDSS works and all the "formality" and "word
counts" apply to SOLAS.

The FRS system does not.

The Family Radio Service was NEVER envisioned as some kind of
"message system." :-) The average pair of FRS transceivers
(handheld) sold across the counter will reach out 1 to 5 miles
(depending on terrain, etc.), ideal to keep track of family
members at a large outing. Or a small one. :-)

Did you think FRS handhelds have little "text" screens or
sockets for keyboards, printers, etc.? :-)



It must be on amateur frequencies or nothing will work. With enough
amateurs involved, they'll make sure it doesn't work.

On Mon, 24 Oct 2005 00:48:48 GMT, "Dan/W4NTI"
wrote:


wrote in message
.. .
On Sun, 23 Oct 2005 21:29:44 GMT, "Dan/W4NTI"
wrote:

Un Trustworthy eh? Beats the hell out of being a fagot and a child
molester
though don't it? You piece of garbage.

Dan what do you expect to be called other than a bigot when you use
such language?

I am not a child molestor I am bisexual

you are clearly untrustworthy when you believe that the one equates to
the other

makes it hard to rely on anything you say when you spout **** like
that

Dan/W4NTI

wrote in message
...
On Sun, 23 Oct 2005 17:59:39 GMT, "Dan/W4NTI"
wrote:


You don't like my language fagot? Then STAY THE HELL OUT OF MY
CONVERSATIONS. PUT ME IN YOUR ****IN KILL FILE YOU FAGOT.

they are not YOUR conversations

you are posting in a public forum you dolt

and you contnue to spew forth your hate certainly not putting a good
face on the ARS

if you want to have a private conversation find a private medium

if you want to have a public conversation without any presense you
find disqueiting then you need to find or create a moderated one, with
a moderator of YOUR liking

not trying to "run you off" but dem is the facts

Dan/W4NTI


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