On Feb 24, 10:10 pm, "Bill Horne, W1AC"
wrote:
Fellow hams,

-SNIP-
All ideas appreciated.

73,

Bill W1AC

I know there's a lot of designs to make a 12v supply from a deisel
truck alternator and a push lawnmower engine. You might need a couple
extra pulleys to get it geared down to where it's comfortable to crank
by hand (or foot), but it ought to be possible. The reasons for using
a semi alternator are that the 12v regulator is built in and it
simplifies things; also these trucks typically idle at about 1/3 the
rate of a gasoline engine, they have to maintain voltage at low speed.
You can idle down that Toro and run your rig all night on a gallon or
two, it would seem like running a receiver, QRP rig, or even 100w for
short bursts ought to be possible on a meat powered rig.

Jon - KC2PNF/A

BNB Sound wrote:

I know there's a lot of designs to make a 12v supply from a deisel
truck alternator and a push lawnmower engine. You might need a couple
extra pulleys to get it geared down to where it's comfortable to crank
by hand (or foot), but it ought to be possible. The reasons for using
a semi alternator are that the 12v regulator is built in and it
simplifies things; also these trucks typically idle at about 1/3 the
rate of a gasoline engine, they have to maintain voltage at low speed.
You can idle down that Toro and run your rig all night on a gallon or
two, it would seem like running a receiver, QRP rig, or even 100w for
short bursts ought to be possible on a meat powered rig.

Jon - KC2PNF/A



Jon,

Thanks for the info: these are good ideas.

I'd like to talk some more about solutions like these: the problem I'm
thinking about is the lack of power in the days immediately after a
Katrina-type event, where the only sources will be the ones found on
every street corner.

There are automobile batteries on every street corner, there are cars,
and there are lawnmowers. The question is how they could be combined to
provide power for ham rigs: I'd bet that 12v batteries would be the
first step, since most ham transceivers run off 12v now, and the
batteries could at least be rotated between cars and radio for charging
and use, respectively.

The question would be how to charge the batteries without relying on
cars, since working vehicles are a valuable asset in themselves and fuel
may also be in short supply: I suppose we could devise a "standard"
method to hook batteries to working vehicles so they could be carried
around while being charged, but that's about it.

That leaves the charging problem. If we can make a "standard" set of
plans that allow a team to dismount an auto alternator and connect it to
any source of torque, we'd have a lot more flexibility: broken-down cars
are always in good supply.

Lawnmower engines interest me because there are only three or four major
manufacturers, which means a lot of common parts and so forth. Nobody's
looking to mow their lawn right after a hurricane, so it's not a
resource conflict.

I don't want to get too far afield, so I'll leave it that: the idea is
to prepare response teams to improvise from local materials, but we need
something in between jumper-cables and windmills.

Bill


--
73,

Bill W1AC

(Remove "73" and change top level domain for direct replies)

Bill Horne, W1AC wrote:

The question would be how to charge the batteries without relying on
cars, since working vehicles are a valuable asset in themselves and fuel
may also be in short supply: I suppose we could devise a "standard"
method to hook batteries to working vehicles so they could be carried
around while being charged, but that's about it.

I have been looking into the utility of "ground batteries" as either a
charging source or even a source in itself. This is a source that I
haven't considered despite knowing of it's existence for some time. When
the ground thaws I'm going to plant some electrodes in front of the
house and see what generates....



That leaves the charging problem. If we can make a "standard" set of
plans that allow a team to dismount an auto alternator and connect it to
any source of torque, we'd have a lot more flexibility: broken-down cars
are always in good supply.

Another alternator application might be a "low head" turbine. I once
saw a television show that included a person who powered his house from
the creek running alongside it. Envision a alternator/generator attached
to what looks like one of those roof vent turbines. Place it in the
creek, and it charges batteries.


Lawnmower engines interest me because there are only three or four major
manufacturers, which means a lot of common parts and so forth. Nobody's
looking to mow their lawn right after a hurricane, so it's not a
resource conflict.

Connecting an alternator to a lawnmower engine would be an excellent
method of generating power. It is also something that could be rigged in
an emergency fairly easily. Mount the engine on top of a box, couple the
alternator and driveshaft, wire in the regulator and battery, and there
ya go.


I don't want to get too far afield, so I'll leave it that: the idea is
to prepare response teams to improvise from local materials, but we need
something in between jumper-cables and windmills.

Bill, I don't know if you remember the program on Discovery channel
where teams of people were let loose in a junkyard with a task of
building some sort of contraption from materials they had to scrounge
within the yard.

Imagine the fun of setting groups of hams down with instructions that
they would have to put together a power source and power their radios
from non standard materials. First group on the air wins - or some other
criteria of course - Power, reliability, etc.

- 73 de Mike KB3EIA -

"Bill Horne, W1AC" wrote ...
I don't want to get too far afield, so I'll leave it that: the idea is to
prepare response teams to improvise from local materials, but we need
something in between jumper-cables and windmills.

As a result of this discussion, I looked up DIY fuel cells yesterday
and concluded that they are still impractically expensive. Is it because
of the precious metals content? Are there any similar DIY power
sources that amateurs could develop for emergency/disaster use?

"Michael Coslo" wrote ...
Bill, I don't know if you remember the program on Discovery channel where
teams of people were let loose in a junkyard with a task of building some
sort of contraption from materials they had to scrounge
within the yard.

"Junkyard Wars" (US) / "Scrapheap Challenge" (UK)
http://us.imdb.com/title/tt0169491/
One of my favorite shows. It it were still on, I would keep my
TVRO subscription, otherwise, 120 channels and literally
nothing worth watching. :-(


Imagine the fun of setting groups of hams down with instructions that they
would have to put together a power source and power their radios from non
standard materials. First group on the air wins - or some other criteria
of course - Power, reliability, etc.

I like it. Could be combined/cooridnated with Field Day events(?)

On 27 Feb 2007 10:23:35 -0500, Michael Coslo wrote:

Envision a alternator/generator attached
to what looks like one of those roof vent turbines. Place it in the
creek, and it charges batteries.

That, on steroids, is what Boulder Dam is !!
--

73 de K2ASP - Phil Kane

From a Clearing in the Silicon Forest
Beaverton (Washington County) Oregon

e-mail: k2asp [at] arrl [dot] net

"Michael Coslo" wrote in message
...
Bill Horne, W1AC wrote:

The question would be how to charge the batteries without relying on
cars, since working vehicles are a valuable asset in themselves and fuel
may also be in short supply: I suppose we could devise a "standard"
method to hook batteries to working vehicles so they could be carried
around while being charged, but that's about it.


Hi All,

I know this requires some power source , but it is none the less an
interesting and possibly useful concept.

3 Dollar Battery Charger
http://www.alpharubicon.com/elect/3dollarbattggn.htm

Ace - WH2T


..

"Dr.Ace" wrote in message
...

"Michael Coslo" wrote in message
...
Bill Horne, W1AC wrote:

The question would be how to charge the batteries without relying on
cars, since working vehicles are a valuable asset in themselves and fuel
may also be in short supply: I suppose we could devise a "standard"
method to hook batteries to working vehicles so they could be carried
around while being charged, but that's about it.


Hi All,

I know this requires some power source , but it is none the less an
interesting and possibly useful concept.

3 Dollar Battery Charger
http://www.alpharubicon.com/elect/3dollarbattggn.htm

Ace - WH2T


At our last club meeting, our guest speaker had a small generated that was
operated by pedaling it like a bicycle. It was quite interesting.

Dee, N8UZE