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So who won the "when does NoCode happen" pool?
"Alun L. Palmer" wrote in message . .. I'd say we will get more Generals, including some who are new hams, and a few new Techs. There are definitely some Techs who are no longer active due to cellphones, but as long as they remain licenced it doesn't affect the question. There is definitely a problem in that you can no longer get test manuals in Radio Shack, or in any other store AFAIK. I tried to buy a General book for my XYL yesterday, but couldn't. My vote is 2-6% increase. 73 de N3KIP I've added your guess to the list. I hope that your prediction is correct. But since the non-hams I have talked to about ham radio don't know what the requirements for a license are, they are not apt to jump into ham radio because the code test was dropped. Most of them glaze over at the mention of a license and we never even get to the requirements. I expect that most of the active Techs will upgrade to General or even Extra. Beyond that, I don't expect to see much change. Over the long haul, I don't expect much change. Compared to other countries, we actually have a fairly high percentage of people who have ham licenses. Other than Japan, most countries have around 0.1% (or less) of their population licensed. We have about 0.2% which puts us very high on the list. I would expect our ham population numbers to stabilize but wouldn't make any guesses as to what that number will be. I'd really like to use a longer baseline for this pool but I don't think very many of us are really up for a 5 or 10 year pool. Dee, N8UZE |
So who won the "when does NoCode happen" pool?
"Alun L. Palmer" wrote in message . .. [snip] There is definitely a problem in that you can no longer get test manuals in Radio Shack, or in any other store AFAIK. I tried to buy a General book for my XYL yesterday, but couldn't. I think this symptomatic of the real issue. Our field don't get enough exposure to the general public and materials on it are hard to come by unless you already know that ham radio exists and you use the internet to find study materials. Dee, N8UZE |
So who won the "when does NoCode happen" pool?
From: Dave Heil on Fri, Dec 29 2006 7:33 am
wrote: From: Dave Heil on Wed, Dec 27 2006 10:22 am John Smith I wrote: Dave Heil wrote: I submit that many entered the "Big Leagues of HF Radio" about the same time as you. You are but one of them. You betcha, but, as far as I can find, the ONLY one who posted a photo essay (20 pages worth) about it on the Internet. See: http://sujan.hallikainen.org/Broadca...y/My3Years.pdf So, how do you feel that a station with 40+ transmitters all at 1 KW MINIMUM RF output on HF is "NOT Big Time?" How do you feel over 200,000 messages per month sent is "NOT Big Time?" How do you feel that a Signal Battalion directly attached to an area headquarters is "NOT Big Time?" Kiss my yes. Wow, you think being IN the Department of State comms "IS" a bigger time? Of course you do. ANYTHING you do is (in your words here) bigger and better than what anyone else in here has done, ever... You are the only one of them comparing learning the Morse Code to an "AUTISTIC TALENT". Sorry, sweetums, but I'm the SECOND one intimating that the "talent" is so. Have you forgetten the words of "John Smith" (another Angeleno) so quickly? Of course you will. You ALWAYS try to "blame" someone else as "being in error" whenever they disagree with you. As with so many other things you've written here, you are in error. Hey, Davie boy, in the immortal words of the ByteBrothers, * F * Y * D * I * T * M * ! Typing in capital letters and adding a "Tsk, tsk" here and there don't make your views true. Being the archtypical Prussian pedantic literalist who only "obeys orders" of directives from the ARRL does NOT make YOU "true," sweetie. You are one HUMORLESS buzzard whose skin is SO thin that it rivals the shaving thickness from a microtome output. Leonard, I have little doubt that once all of the smoke clears away, you'll still be attempting to open the box containing your Extra Class amateur radio license. So, other than you and Jimmie Noserve, who gives a ****? I got my PROFESSIONAL radio operator license in 1956 and used it. I got my (no test whatsoever) CB license in 1959 and used it. I got my COMMERCIAL PLMRS station license in the 80s (as co-owner but responsible for technical operation) and used it. Are you going to say that an AMATEUR radio license is "more Big Time" than what I've gotten already? That I MUST have a ham license from the FCC to prove my strength, force, agility, and intelligence MORE than a whole career IN the radio-electronics industry?!? Of course you do! Anyone who has done less than you is always the lesser in your comments. * F * Y * D * I * T * M * ! If you want to wave a metaphor, make certain that it is a valid one. Oh! YOU are the Guardian of English as she are wrote? Of course you are! You ALWAYS "correct" others' "mistakes" since they are always lesser than YOU. Tsk, you should be writing in Hunnish...of which you claimed to be a Master once in another of your petulant, ****ed-off rants at me. :-) * F * Y * D * I * T * M * ! Finally, CW is consigned to the trash heap with sword swallowing--CW, a skill whose time has come, and gone ... Sorry, "John", Morse Code is not being consigned to any trash heap. It is used daily in making thousands of contacts by radio amateurs. Really? I thought RADIOS were needed first...? Your juvenile behavior is showing, Leonard. Tsk, tsk, the pedantic Prussian literalist, in his smug arrogance, cannot recognize SARCASM? You mean that ALL one needs is closing and opening a circuit in the proper morse manner? Wow! What a mode! If that's what you come away with after reading a sentence which includes the words "by radio amateurs", so be it. Poor baby, unable to recognize SARCASM and you start in on another fabricated finger-pointing? "Bad form, old man." Tell us what OTHER radio services still use morse code for communications. [that should be easy...there ain't none] It is then peculiar that I'm still hearing aviation beacons which use Morse Code. What, the old pre-WW2 "A-N" beacons on LF? Good grief, Snoopy, those aren't being used by Real pilots these days. If you mean VOR or ILS with the periodic morse code tone identifier, those ARE being used in civil aviation. But, the VOR isn't called a "beacon" and the ILS certainly isn't one of those. The 75 MHz marker beacons are "beacons" but they do NOT have any morse identifier, just a constant AM tone denoting Outer, Middle, or Inner beacon. Your AMATEUR license does NOT authorize you to transmit in the Aviation Radio Services. I hear utility stations in the HF bands using Morse Code for two way communication. Then feel free to listen to those "utility stations" and enjoy what they have to say, if anything comprehensible to you. Your AMATEUR license doesn't authorize you to transmit outside the HF amateur bands. That aside, I have little interest in the modes other radio services use. Of course you don't...you are a smug, arrogant Extra class AMATEUR. You don't seem to give a **** about "the pool of trained operators" (in amateur radio) for national needs, only your own. Since morse code is all but DEAD in all other US radio services, that "pool of trained" morsemen is so much ARRL propaganda. The rest of the radio world just does NOT need morsemen. Try...TRY to get used to it. What's it to you, Len? NOTHING "in it" for me, pedantic Prussian literalist. It's just a thing to MODERNIZE a HOBBY radio activity. Most of the other radio services in the USA have been modernized, but amateur radio has been (mostly) stuck in the standards and practices of the 1930s. You aren't a radio amateur and you aren't likely to be one. Hey, pedantic Prussian literalist, go auto-fornicate. I MIGHT get an amateur radio license later and I MIGHT NOT. It's NOT up to YOU to decide whether I can or can't. Don't let your smug, arrogant Prussian attitude go to far like you did with sentence. The US amateur radio regulation morse code test was about GETTING INTO amateur radio via authorized licensing. Since you've been licensed as an AMATEUR since your teen years, have you spent all your AMATEUR radio time GETTING INTO amateur radio? I don't think so. No matter, pedantic Prussian literalist, the FCC *HAS* *DECIDED* to END US amateur radio licensing morse code TESTING. Gone, finito, adieu, bye-bye to it as soon as the R&O is published in the Federal Register giving the legal END to that testing. ... I made a number of 160m contacts last night with Nordic and Russian radio amateurs. We used CW. I do hope that's okay with you. Perhaps we should have thought to check. You can do anything LEGAL that you want. It's not up to me to DICTATE what others do or don't do, what opinions one "should have" or "should not have." You might reflect on the latter since you are ALWAYS "telling me" what attitudes I "should have." * F * Y * D * I * T * M * ! BTW, did any of those Nordic and Russian amateurs have French amateur radio licenses too? Did you check THEIR authorized operating privileges? No one involved had tossed the Morse Code into any dumpster. The FCC *IS* going to toss morse code TESTING in the big federal dumpster. They already announced it. All it takes is to add the final effective date and publish that in the Federal Register. [ain't that sumthin' tho?] Wow! In Scouting! Oh, my, I was never in the Scouts. I have no trouble believing that. Tsk, you ALWAYS have "trouble believing" whatever I write, yet you make a Big thing of "believability" when you see some opening to "win" message points. :-) My uniform was REAL and the first duty was "closing with and destroying the enemy." shrug My Cub Scout and Boy Scout uniforms were very real. One could see and touch them. We didn't receive any instructions on closing with and destroying any enemy. No Primary Duty of soldiering? Tsk, tsk, the Scouts were originally formed to BE devoted to uniforms, organization, survival in the wilderness just like the troops of the Boer War. Scouting has since changed to be more of a social organization with lots of fundamental skills that CAN be gained (but are not absolutely required). Come to think of it, I never received any instructions from the Air Force about my duty to close with and destroy any enemies. Tsk, try to be honest about "your time" in the USAF. Enlisted specialists were NOT taught-trained-exercised as land soldiers. During the 1960s. I've seen too many of them of the 50s and 60s to believe they could ever soldier in the field. I put you down as just another braggart REMF who wants to IMPLY he was "in combat" but never was. Just like Robesin and his "seven hostile actions." I.e., bull****. In your time in the Army, did you ever close with and/or destroy any enemy, Len? No, I was never "closing with or destroying any enemy" from March 1952 through February 1956. What's it to you, Heil? I voluntarily enlisted in the US Army in March 1952 and didn't get assigned to the Far East until January 1953. "Permanent truce" in Korea was established in July 1953. Did you expect me to violate the UCMJ and go AWOL to Korea in order to "fight?" I stayed where assigned by orders, did my duty. That's all explained in my photo essay mentioned earlier. I have NO problem with explaining what I did and what I worked on and when in Japan during my Army enlistement. But, YOU have a great deal of "trouble" is going into ANY detail about exactly what you did and where. Typical REMF "military career explanation" just like the Robesin. Yes, I was assigned to a REAR AREA. You could label me as a "RE-F" since my sexual partners hadn't - to the best of my knowledge - been mothers yet. But, that REAR AREA duty that was mine involved HIGH FREQUENCY RADIO COMMUNICATIONS...and VHF, UHF, and microwave radio communications. Concentration was on transmitters but also involved receivers. I won't bother asking the pedantic Prussian literalist what HE did "during the war" as another REMF. He hasn't said and I don't think he will ever say what it was. Typical of the smug, arrogant "I am always better than you extra class." ... I never received any Morse Code training in the Air Force either, though I passed a Morse Code receiving test as a part of my Bypassed Specialist exams. That's what you SAY but somehow it rings false and always has. USAF enlisted 'specialists" of the 50s and 60s were NOT some kind of radio-electronics whizzes in the REAR AREAS. Most of the enlisted ranks were simply trying to get OUT of being soldiers on land where the enemy was trying to kill them. Tell us all about the strong, mighty, virile warriors of the USAF enlisted ranks of the 50s and 60s and how they conquered the (radio) airwaves then? By the time of the ending of the draft in 1973, the USAF had to smarten-up and start to make the enlisted ranks be a lot better than the draft-dodging dummies doing their time before then. As a civilian engineer in the 60s through now, I've seen the USAF improve their technical smarts a great deal. But, before the end of the draft, the USAF enlisted smarts were akin to the AMATEUR hobbyist level of experience in their 'specialties." That's just how it was, Vietnam REMF. I never had to learn any morsemanship in 1952, 1962, 1972, 1982, 1992, 2002...for work or play. shrug You don't have to learn any now. Riiiight. Between 1952 and time now I NEVER had to learn or use morse code as a PROFESSIONAL *OR* as a hobbyist. That's a 54-year span of time. That's operating a transmitter LEGALLY in the EM spectrum from VLF to about 25 GHz, all the decade-wide sections of the spectrum. Let's call it one more thing that I know and that you don't. Let's call it the *ONLY* thing in radio-electronics that You "know more than I"...as a MORSEMAN on the AMATEUR bands, using a morse code that has been relatively unchanged since 1844 (162 years ago). That "Extra right out of the box" has certainly given you more trouble, hasn't it? No "trouble" at all. I haven't pursued it in the last six years. I lost interest in getting a legal amateur radio license four decades ago. Who needed morse code in the 1960s? Only the Recreationists trying to copy the "radio pioneering of the 1920s and 1930s using an already out-of- date mode. Hardly any sort of "advancing the state of the communications art" was it? Many of us have more experience than you in commercial, military or governmental HF radio operations. Live with it. News Flash, pedantic Prussian: That "us" does NOT include YOU. Besides, to toss the literalist stuff right back in your face, "commercial, military or governmental HF radio operations" is NOT AMATEUR RADIO! :-) Live with THAT! :-) I'd already worked three years on spanning the Pacific Ocean on HF. With Big radio equipment. Amateur stuff would somehow "teach me" such things via a federal amateur license? Yes, Len, it could have. How in the HELL do YOU know? You really need to download my photo essay and examine what was pictured and what I wrote. Tell us all about the SEMICONDUCTOR-based equipment that ham radio was using in the 1950s and how "I could have learned from (getting a ham license)" back then? You speak BULL****. Big Dave is the Mighty Macho Morseman...unstoppable in his refusual to recognize others having a different opinion than his godly wisdom... You don't react well to folks who don't share your opinions, Len. Google and the FCC electronics records are loaded with examples of how you react. Google archives are LOADED WITH EXAMPLES of "how badly YOU react" to those that don't meet your versions of What Should Be in US amateur radio. Pedantic Prussianism, literally quoted from the publications of the ARRL. My correspondence with the FCC is a matter of public record and are strongly worded AGAINST morse code testing. In those public records (which include the "electronic" archives... actually magnetic archives) you will find that I do NOT think the FCC's rulings should be to appease the emotional hunger of the rabid amateur morsemen determined to keep code testing forever and ever. Nobody can tell Big Leonard what to do. YES they can...and DO. You've been trying to do it for years! When the Morse Code exam is removed, you'll still be trying to open the box holding that Extra ticket. What "box?" What "ticket?" I've acquired three other FCC licenses in my time and still pursue a hobby of electronics and radio in retirement. I am secure in what I am and what I know. I've made a good living in radio-electronics over the last half century and don't need more "licenses." I sure as hell don't need to take up an on-off code "skill" that's been around for 162 years...and then DROPPED by ALL other radio services (if they ever considered morse code to begin with)! My object in here was to advocate the ELIMINATION of the code exam. Except for the legal posting in the Federal Register, THAT ELIMINATION HAS BEEN ACCOMPLISHED! Learn to live with it. ["into the valley of dearth rode the four hundred..."] How many? Is this quote another of your factual errors? Note the spelling of the word DEARTH. That's called a play on words. A bit of HUMOR, a subject that has eluded your correspondence in here. Humorless pedantic Prussian literalists have GREAT difficulty with any sort of humor or even whimsy. Try to accept that. The no-code-test advocates aren't all hidebound to keep code testing forever and ever, always marching in ranks to the morse drumbeat under the direction of the ARRL old folks. But, the humorless pedantic Prussian literalist will be always on the lookout for "errors" and chastize those who don't think as He does...then berate them for not being as good as He is. FCC 06-178 is almost LAW. That's a fact of amateur radio life for those seeking a hobby radio activity. Too bad for the adamant pro-coders busy sneering and insulting all the no-coders. But, times change, new laws will come in to change the lives of some. The pro-coders have had their emotional sustenance long enough. Now its time for THEM to Get Off Federal Welfare and be good hobbyists of modern times. David, to you as always * F * Y * D * I * T * M * ! 8.544, |
So who won the "when does NoCode happen" pool?
" wrote in
oups.com: http://sujan.hallikainen.org/Broadca...y/My3Years.pdf Hey Len, The link wouldn't work for me. - Mike KB3EIA - |
So who won the "when does NoCode happen" pool?
Mike Coslo wrote: " wrote in oups.com: http://sujan.hallikainen.org/Broadca...y/My3Years.pdf Hey Len, The link wouldn't work for me. Please accept my apologies for omitting a part of the link...here is correct one: http://sujan.hallikainen.org/Broadca...s/My3Years.pdf If you try just to the 'BroadcastHistory' part you will see a page of lots and lots of information on what was originally a site for "Saving History from the Dumpster." My upload is under the "Military Radio" link where I've got a few other uploads besides the one above. BTW, Hallikainen himself is a ham. :-) LA |
So who won the "when does NoCode happen" pool?
" wrote in
oups.com: From: Dave Heil on Fri, Dec 29 2006 7:33 am wrote: From: Dave Heil on Wed, Dec 27 2006 10:22 am John Smith I wrote: Dave Heil wrote: I submit that many entered the "Big Leagues of HF Radio" about the same time as you. You are but one of them. You betcha, but, as far as I can find, the ONLY one who posted a photo essay (20 pages worth) about it on the Internet. See: http://sujan.hallikainen.org/Broadca...y/My3Years.pdf So, how do you feel that a station with 40+ transmitters all at 1 KW MINIMUM RF output on HF is "NOT Big Time?" How do you feel over 200,000 messages per month sent is "NOT Big Time?" How do you feel that a Signal Battalion directly attached to an area headquarters is "NOT Big Time?" Kiss my yes. Wow, you think being IN the Department of State comms "IS" a bigger time? Of course you do. ANYTHING you do is (in your words here) bigger and better than what anyone else in here has done, ever... You are the only one of them comparing learning the Morse Code to an "AUTISTIC TALENT". Sorry, sweetums, but I'm the SECOND one intimating that the "talent" is so. Have you forgetten the words of "John Smith" (another Angeleno) so quickly? Of course you will. You ALWAYS try to "blame" someone else as "being in error" whenever they disagree with you. As with so many other things you've written here, you are in error. Hey, Davie boy, in the immortal words of the ByteBrothers, * F * Y * D * I * T * M * ! Typing in capital letters and adding a "Tsk, tsk" here and there don't make your views true. Being the archtypical Prussian pedantic literalist who only "obeys orders" of directives from the ARRL does NOT make YOU "true," sweetie. You are one HUMORLESS buzzard whose skin is SO thin that it rivals the shaving thickness from a microtome output. Leonard, I have little doubt that once all of the smoke clears away, you'll still be attempting to open the box containing your Extra Class amateur radio license. So, other than you and Jimmie Noserve, who gives a ****? I got my PROFESSIONAL radio operator license in 1956 and used it. I got my (no test whatsoever) CB license in 1959 and used it. I got my COMMERCIAL PLMRS station license in the 80s (as co-owner but responsible for technical operation) and used it. Are you going to say that an AMATEUR radio license is "more Big Time" than what I've gotten already? That I MUST have a ham license from the FCC to prove my strength, force, agility, and intelligence MORE than a whole career IN the radio-electronics industry?!? Of course you do! Anyone who has done less than you is always the lesser in your comments. * F * Y * D * I * T * M * ! If you want to wave a metaphor, make certain that it is a valid one. Oh! YOU are the Guardian of English as she are wrote? Of course you are! You ALWAYS "correct" others' "mistakes" since they are always lesser than YOU. Tsk, you should be writing in Hunnish...of which you claimed to be a Master once in another of your petulant, ****ed-off rants at me. :-) * F * Y * D * I * T * M * ! Finally, CW is consigned to the trash heap with sword swallowing--CW, a skill whose time has come, and gone ... Sorry, "John", Morse Code is not being consigned to any trash heap. It is used daily in making thousands of contacts by radio amateurs. Really? I thought RADIOS were needed first...? Your juvenile behavior is showing, Leonard. Tsk, tsk, the pedantic Prussian literalist, in his smug arrogance, cannot recognize SARCASM? You mean that ALL one needs is closing and opening a circuit in the proper morse manner? Wow! What a mode! If that's what you come away with after reading a sentence which includes the words "by radio amateurs", so be it. Poor baby, unable to recognize SARCASM and you start in on another fabricated finger-pointing? "Bad form, old man." Tell us what OTHER radio services still use morse code for communications. [that should be easy...there ain't none] It is then peculiar that I'm still hearing aviation beacons which use Morse Code. What, the old pre-WW2 "A-N" beacons on LF? Good grief, Snoopy, those aren't being used by Real pilots these days. If you mean VOR or ILS with the periodic morse code tone identifier, those ARE being used in civil aviation. But, the VOR isn't called a "beacon" and the ILS certainly isn't one of those. The 75 MHz marker beacons are "beacons" but they do NOT have any morse identifier, just a constant AM tone denoting Outer, Middle, or Inner beacon. Your AMATEUR license does NOT authorize you to transmit in the Aviation Radio Services. I hear utility stations in the HF bands using Morse Code for two way communication. Then feel free to listen to those "utility stations" and enjoy what they have to say, if anything comprehensible to you. Your AMATEUR license doesn't authorize you to transmit outside the HF amateur bands. That aside, I have little interest in the modes other radio services use. Of course you don't...you are a smug, arrogant Extra class AMATEUR. You don't seem to give a **** about "the pool of trained operators" (in amateur radio) for national needs, only your own. Since morse code is all but DEAD in all other US radio services, that "pool of trained" morsemen is so much ARRL propaganda. The rest of the radio world just does NOT need morsemen. Try...TRY to get used to it. What's it to you, Len? NOTHING "in it" for me, pedantic Prussian literalist. It's just a thing to MODERNIZE a HOBBY radio activity. Most of the other radio services in the USA have been modernized, but amateur radio has been (mostly) stuck in the standards and practices of the 1930s. You aren't a radio amateur and you aren't likely to be one. Hey, pedantic Prussian literalist, go auto-fornicate. I MIGHT get an amateur radio license later and I MIGHT NOT. It's NOT up to YOU to decide whether I can or can't. Don't let your smug, arrogant Prussian attitude go to far like you did with sentence. The US amateur radio regulation morse code test was about GETTING INTO amateur radio via authorized licensing. Since you've been licensed as an AMATEUR since your teen years, have you spent all your AMATEUR radio time GETTING INTO amateur radio? I don't think so. No matter, pedantic Prussian literalist, the FCC *HAS* *DECIDED* to END US amateur radio licensing morse code TESTING. Gone, finito, adieu, bye-bye to it as soon as the R&O is published in the Federal Register giving the legal END to that testing. ... I made a number of 160m contacts last night with Nordic and Russian radio amateurs. We used CW. I do hope that's okay with you. Perhaps we should have thought to check. You can do anything LEGAL that you want. It's not up to me to DICTATE what others do or don't do, what opinions one "should have" or "should not have." You might reflect on the latter since you are ALWAYS "telling me" what attitudes I "should have." * F * Y * D * I * T * M * ! BTW, did any of those Nordic and Russian amateurs have French amateur radio licenses too? Did you check THEIR authorized operating privileges? No one involved had tossed the Morse Code into any dumpster. The FCC *IS* going to toss morse code TESTING in the big federal dumpster. They already announced it. All it takes is to add the final effective date and publish that in the Federal Register. [ain't that sumthin' tho?] Wow! In Scouting! Oh, my, I was never in the Scouts. I have no trouble believing that. Tsk, you ALWAYS have "trouble believing" whatever I write, yet you make a Big thing of "believability" when you see some opening to "win" message points. :-) My uniform was REAL and the first duty was "closing with and destroying the enemy." shrug My Cub Scout and Boy Scout uniforms were very real. One could see and touch them. We didn't receive any instructions on closing with and destroying any enemy. No Primary Duty of soldiering? Tsk, tsk, the Scouts were originally formed to BE devoted to uniforms, organization, survival in the wilderness just like the troops of the Boer War. Scouting has since changed to be more of a social organization with lots of fundamental skills that CAN be gained (but are not absolutely required). Come to think of it, I never received any instructions from the Air Force about my duty to close with and destroy any enemies. Tsk, try to be honest about "your time" in the USAF. Enlisted specialists were NOT taught-trained-exercised as land soldiers. During the 1960s. I've seen too many of them of the 50s and 60s to believe they could ever soldier in the field. I put you down as just another braggart REMF who wants to IMPLY he was "in combat" but never was. Just like Robesin and his "seven hostile actions." I.e., bull****. In your time in the Army, did you ever close with and/or destroy any enemy, Len? No, I was never "closing with or destroying any enemy" from March 1952 through February 1956. What's it to you, Heil? I voluntarily enlisted in the US Army in March 1952 and didn't get assigned to the Far East until January 1953. "Permanent truce" in Korea was established in July 1953. Did you expect me to violate the UCMJ and go AWOL to Korea in order to "fight?" I stayed where assigned by orders, did my duty. That's all explained in my photo essay mentioned earlier. I have NO problem with explaining what I did and what I worked on and when in Japan during my Army enlistement. But, YOU have a great deal of "trouble" is going into ANY detail about exactly what you did and where. Typical REMF "military career explanation" just like the Robesin. Yes, I was assigned to a REAR AREA. You could label me as a "RE-F" since my sexual partners hadn't - to the best of my knowledge - been mothers yet. But, that REAR AREA duty that was mine involved HIGH FREQUENCY RADIO COMMUNICATIONS...and VHF, UHF, and microwave radio communications. Concentration was on transmitters but also involved receivers. I won't bother asking the pedantic Prussian literalist what HE did "during the war" as another REMF. He hasn't said and I don't think he will ever say what it was. Typical of the smug, arrogant "I am always better than you extra class." ... I never received any Morse Code training in the Air Force either, though I passed a Morse Code receiving test as a part of my Bypassed Specialist exams. That's what you SAY but somehow it rings false and always has. USAF enlisted 'specialists" of the 50s and 60s were NOT some kind of radio-electronics whizzes in the REAR AREAS. Most of the enlisted ranks were simply trying to get OUT of being soldiers on land where the enemy was trying to kill them. Tell us all about the strong, mighty, virile warriors of the USAF enlisted ranks of the 50s and 60s and how they conquered the (radio) airwaves then? By the time of the ending of the draft in 1973, the USAF had to smarten-up and start to make the enlisted ranks be a lot better than the draft-dodging dummies doing their time before then. As a civilian engineer in the 60s through now, I've seen the USAF improve their technical smarts a great deal. But, before the end of the draft, the USAF enlisted smarts were akin to the AMATEUR hobbyist level of experience in their 'specialties." That's just how it was, Vietnam REMF. I never had to learn any morsemanship in 1952, 1962, 1972, 1982, 1992, 2002...for work or play. shrug You don't have to learn any now. Riiiight. Between 1952 and time now I NEVER had to learn or use morse code as a PROFESSIONAL *OR* as a hobbyist. That's a 54-year span of time. That's operating a transmitter LEGALLY in the EM spectrum from VLF to about 25 GHz, all the decade-wide sections of the spectrum. Let's call it one more thing that I know and that you don't. Let's call it the *ONLY* thing in radio-electronics that You "know more than I"...as a MORSEMAN on the AMATEUR bands, using a morse code that has been relatively unchanged since 1844 (162 years ago). That "Extra right out of the box" has certainly given you more trouble, hasn't it? No "trouble" at all. I haven't pursued it in the last six years. I lost interest in getting a legal amateur radio license four decades ago. Who needed morse code in the 1960s? Only the Recreationists trying to copy the "radio pioneering of the 1920s and 1930s using an already out-of- date mode. Hardly any sort of "advancing the state of the communications art" was it? Many of us have more experience than you in commercial, military or governmental HF radio operations. Live with it. News Flash, pedantic Prussian: That "us" does NOT include YOU. Besides, to toss the literalist stuff right back in your face, "commercial, military or governmental HF radio operations" is NOT AMATEUR RADIO! :-) Live with THAT! :-) I'd already worked three years on spanning the Pacific Ocean on HF. With Big radio equipment. Amateur stuff would somehow "teach me" such things via a federal amateur license? Yes, Len, it could have. How in the HELL do YOU know? You really need to download my photo essay and examine what was pictured and what I wrote. Tell us all about the SEMICONDUCTOR-based equipment that ham radio was using in the 1950s and how "I could have learned from (getting a ham license)" back then? You speak BULL****. Big Dave is the Mighty Macho Morseman...unstoppable in his refusual to recognize others having a different opinion than his godly wisdom... You don't react well to folks who don't share your opinions, Len. Google and the FCC electronics records are loaded with examples of how you react. Google archives are LOADED WITH EXAMPLES of "how badly YOU react" to those that don't meet your versions of What Should Be in US amateur radio. Pedantic Prussianism, literally quoted from the publications of the ARRL. My correspondence with the FCC is a matter of public record and are strongly worded AGAINST morse code testing. In those public records (which include the "electronic" archives... actually magnetic archives) you will find that I do NOT think the FCC's rulings should be to appease the emotional hunger of the rabid amateur morsemen determined to keep code testing forever and ever. Nobody can tell Big Leonard what to do. YES they can...and DO. You've been trying to do it for years! When the Morse Code exam is removed, you'll still be trying to open the box holding that Extra ticket. What "box?" What "ticket?" I've acquired three other FCC licenses in my time and still pursue a hobby of electronics and radio in retirement. I am secure in what I am and what I know. I've made a good living in radio-electronics over the last half century and don't need more "licenses." I sure as hell don't need to take up an on-off code "skill" that's been around for 162 years...and then DROPPED by ALL other radio services (if they ever considered morse code to begin with)! My object in here was to advocate the ELIMINATION of the code exam. Except for the legal posting in the Federal Register, THAT ELIMINATION HAS BEEN ACCOMPLISHED! Learn to live with it. ["into the valley of dearth rode the four hundred..."] How many? Is this quote another of your factual errors? Note the spelling of the word DEARTH. That's called a play on words. A bit of HUMOR, a subject that has eluded your correspondence in here. Humorless pedantic Prussian literalists have GREAT difficulty with any sort of humor or even whimsy. Try to accept that. The no-code-test advocates aren't all hidebound to keep code testing forever and ever, always marching in ranks to the morse drumbeat under the direction of the ARRL old folks. But, the humorless pedantic Prussian literalist will be always on the lookout for "errors" and chastize those who don't think as He does...then berate them for not being as good as He is. FCC 06-178 is almost LAW. That's a fact of amateur radio life for those seeking a hobby radio activity. Too bad for the adamant pro-coders busy sneering and insulting all the no-coders. But, times change, new laws will come in to change the lives of some. The pro-coders have had their emotional sustenance long enough. Now its time for THEM to Get Off Federal Welfare and be good hobbyists of modern times. David, to you as always * F * Y * D * I * T * M * ! 8.544, Len, get a ham licence. You might even enjoy it. 73 de Alun, N3KIP |
So who won the "when does NoCode happen" pool?
Alun L. Palmer wrote:
" wrote in massive rant snipped Len, get a ham licence. You might even enjoy it. Alun, I don't think Len wants a ham license - with or without a code test. If he did, he'd have gotten one years or even decades ago. Way back on January 19, 2000, Len said he was "going for Extra right out of the box". But he hasn't done so yet - nor obtained any sort of amateur radio license. 73 de Jim, N2EY |
So who won the "when does NoCode happen" pool?
"Dee Flint" wrote in message . .. "Alun L. Palmer" wrote in message . .. wrote in ups.com: I think after the dust settles the big issue will be grandfathering Novices and Advanceds to the next class up, i.e. tidying up the licence scheme. and of course I still want more phone on 40, 20 and 15, but it will be a while before the FCC will get back to these things. Maybe petitions on these things would be dismissed if they were filed right now, but later on they might succeed. As adamant as the FCC has been on this, it's very doubtful that grandfathering will ever happen. They've made it plain that they consider it reasonable for people to pass the written tests for the upgrades. In addition, at the rate the Novice licenses are decreasing they will be all but gone in less than 10 years anyway. I tend to agree with that prediction since Novice already had code credit and the only thing between the Novice and Tech has been the written test itself. If a Novice hasn't upgraded in the last 5 or 10 years, odds are they have dropped from the ham radio ranks already. (SNIP) I do wonder why this took 3 1/2 years. Maybe the large number of petitions (18) and comments (zillions) had something to do with it. Maybe even Riley had something to do with delaying it? Does he have that much influence? 73 de N3KIP I'm firmly convinced that the number of petitions was a major hang-up on processing this. Each petition had a slightly different spin and each had a significant number of comments. The FCC staff had to digest all this and come to an agreement on just what approach would be taken. Dee, N8UZE I suspect it is just "low priority" within the FCC's scope of authority. Cheers and Happy New Year to all, My wish for the New Year is that this forum once again become a place for rational thought and discussion. The personal attacks and other slimeball commentary by those who know who they are should end. It is tragic that some people can't abide by simply repecting the medium and using it in a positive manner. OK, soapbox mode off :-) Bill K2UNK |
So who won the "when does NoCode happen" pool?
"Bill Sohl" wrote in message ink.net... "Dee Flint" wrote in message . .. "Alun L. Palmer" wrote in message . .. wrote in ups.com: [snip] 73 de N3KIP I'm firmly convinced that the number of petitions was a major hang-up on processing this. Each petition had a slightly different spin and each had a significant number of comments. The FCC staff had to digest all this and come to an agreement on just what approach would be taken. Dee, N8UZE I suspect it is just "low priority" within the FCC's scope of authority. Yup, I believe that was also a significant factor. It wouldn't surprise me if the only reasons they got to it now was because the office was slow and they wanted to clean up some loose ends before the end of the year. Cheers and Happy New Year to all, Thanks and same to you. My wish for the New Year is that this forum once again become a place for rational thought and discussion. The personal attacks and other slimeball commentary by those who know who they are should end. It is tragic that some people can't abide by simply repecting the medium and using it in a positive manner. I hope so too. OK, soapbox mode off :-) Bill K2UNK Dee, N8UZE |
So who won the "when does NoCode happen" pool?
Dee Flint wrote:
... Yup, I believe that was also a significant factor. It wouldn't surprise me if the only reasons they got to it now was because the office was slow and they wanted to clean up some loose ends before the end of the year. ... Dee, N8UZE Like any bureaucracy, the last thing they will do is move to save their lives. This is what they did here, in a last move and hoping that it is not too late, they removed the CW test hoping to save the amateur bands .... they know how to save their jobs! JS |
So who won the "when does NoCode happen" pool?
"Bill Sohl" wrote:
I tend to agree with that prediction since Novice already had code credit and the only thing between the Novice and Tech has been the written test itself. If a Novice hasn't upgraded in the last 5 or 10 years, odds are they have dropped from the ham radio ranks already. I disagree somewhat. There will always be a segment which is 'inactive', but will keep their license active so they can pick it up again someday when they want. After the restructuring of 2000, I wondered why we didn't see a mass-exodus from the General and the Advanced ranks to Extra. There has been a continual decrease in the General/Advanced licenses and increase in the Extra class, but not as much as I would have expected. Without that nasty, 'hard' 20wpm code test, wouldn't you expect those licensees to flock to Extra? Perhaps a segment of those licensees are either inactive, or simply happy with the operating privileges they have and have no need to upgrade? If so, wouldn't those same reasons apply to some Novices not upgrading? My wish for the New Year is that this forum once again become a place for rational thought and discussion. The personal attacks and other slimeball commentary by those who know who they are should end. When you put most of the nitwits in your killfile, the group is surprisingly quiet and civil :) 73 KH6HZ |
So who won the "when does NoCode happen" pool?
KH6HZ wrote:
... 73 KH6HZ I put lot in the kill file and rarely read their posts (only if I feel a great need to pity someone)--such as those spouting filth and perversion. The nitwits? I just put 'em in the nitwit file in the brain, I still read 'em. grin Regards, JS |
So who won the "when does NoCode happen" pool?
"John Smith I" wrote in message ... Dee Flint wrote: ... Yup, I believe that was also a significant factor. It wouldn't surprise me if the only reasons they got to it now was because the office was slow and they wanted to clean up some loose ends before the end of the year. ... Dee, N8UZE Like any bureaucracy, the last thing they will do is move to save their lives. This is what they did here, in a last move and hoping that it is not too late, they removed the CW test hoping to save the amateur bands ... they know how to save their jobs! JS I doubt the number of amateurs would cause them to worry about their jobs. They have a lot of areas besides amateur radio under them. And they are not elected officials so they don't have to worry there either. Dee, N8UZE |
So who won the "when does NoCode happen" pool?
"KH6HZ" wrote in message ... "Bill Sohl" wrote: I tend to agree with that prediction since Novice already had code credit and the only thing between the Novice and Tech has been the written test itself. If a Novice hasn't upgraded in the last 5 or 10 years, odds are they have dropped from the ham radio ranks already. I disagree somewhat. There will always be a segment which is 'inactive', but will keep their license active so they can pick it up again someday when they want. After the restructuring of 2000, I wondered why we didn't see a mass-exodus from the General and the Advanced ranks to Extra. There has been a continual decrease in the General/Advanced licenses and increase in the Extra class, but not as much as I would have expected. Without that nasty, 'hard' 20wpm code test, wouldn't you expect those licensees to flock to Extra? Perhaps a segment of those licensees are either inactive, or simply happy with the operating privileges they have and have no need to upgrade? If so, wouldn't those same reasons apply to some Novices not upgrading? Yes the same reasons would apply and I do believe that the number of Novice licensees won't drop to zero. However looking at the slope of the curve from the time the no-code Tech was implemented to now continues to show a steep and steady drop. The rate of decline has been nearly constant with no sign yet of leveling out for that license class. I would expect to see a few hundred Novices continuing to renew as Novices but they will be statistically insignificant. Looking at the lack of activity in the Novice segments of the HF bands, the novice segments in the 220 band, and the fact that we now have no Novice licensees left in our local club, it would appear to me that the trend has been for the active Novices to upgrade and the inactive ones not to renew on the whole. There will be exceptions of course. My wish for the New Year is that this forum once again become a place for rational thought and discussion. The personal attacks and other slimeball commentary by those who know who they are should end. When you put most of the nitwits in your killfile, the group is surprisingly quiet and civil :) 73 KH6HZ Dee, N8UZE |
So who won the "when does NoCode happen" pool?
Alun L. Palmer wrote: " wrote in oups.com: From: Dave Heil on Fri, Dec 29 2006 7:33 am wrote: From: Dave Heil on Wed, Dec 27 2006 10:22 am John Smith I wrote: Dave Heil wrote: Len, get a ham licence. You might even enjoy it. 73 de Alun, N3KIP Hello, Alun. Okay, I'll write a letter to the FDA and post it Wednesday... I wasn't aware one needed a ham license to purchase and eat ham. My wife and I had ham during the holidays. He tasted like chicken... Best regards, |
So who won the "when does NoCode happen" pool?
John Smith I wrote: Dee Flint wrote: ... Yup, I believe that was also a significant factor. It wouldn't surprise me if the only reasons they got to it now was because the office was slow and they wanted to clean up some loose ends before the end of the year. ... Dee, N8UZE Like any bureaucracy, the last thing they will do is move to save their lives. This is what they did here, in a last move and hoping that it is not too late, they removed the CW test hoping to save the amateur bands ... they know how to save their jobs! JS John, I think your thinking is becoming too focussed about the FCC. Amateur radio is one of the LESSER radio services the FCC must, by law of Congress, regulate. That same law does NOT empower them to "boost" (support, encourage) amateur radio in any way, despite what so many ardent, life-style radio amateurs think. Think back on FCC 99-412, the R&O establishing "restructuring." It was issued on 30 December 1999, just about the last document released in 1999 by the FCC. Since their official end of commentary on the NPRM for restructuring was 15 January 1999, that left them nearly a year to decide on the final R&O. FCC 06-178 only has to be fitted into the publication schedule of the Federal Register to become effective...it's all set to go except for the effective date. It's taken roughly a year for the FCC to decide on that (give or take a few months). Given much MORE important subjects before the FCC, such as the recent decision to allow AT&T to buy BellSouth, amateur radio pales in significance. All one needs to do is check the home page of the FCC to see their workload on US civil radio regulations...it isn't small and those regulations on non-amateur communications subjects affect millions of Americans more than a hobby radio activity. Amateur radio is lucky to get as quick decisions as with other radio services at the FCC. One thing for sure, it didn't seem that NCI was badgering the FCC to decide...it took NCI about a week to post the news of the pending FCC 06-178 R&O! No sweat with the ARRL...the League has two groups in DC to pester the FCC, a Lobbying service and a legal firm...they can get "advance" notice of things quicker than a non- dues civilian group...makes them look as if they are "in the know." One must be patient. eyebrows akimbo LA |
So who won the "when does NoCode happen" pool?
Dee Flint wrote:
... I doubt the number of amateurs would cause them to worry about their jobs. They have a lot of areas besides amateur radio under them. And they are not elected officials so they don't have to worry there either. Dee, N8UZE I think you have little respect for "The Straw Which Broke the Camels Back" or just plain attrition ... at least in this definition of attrition: " Attrition refers to a method of achieving a reduction in personnel by not refilling positions that are vacated through resignation, reassignment, transfer, retirement, or means other than layoffs." Regards, JS |
So who won the "when does NoCode happen" pool?
|
So who won the "when does NoCode happen" pool?
John Smith I wrote: wrote: Hello, Alun. Okay, I'll write a letter to the FDA and post it Wednesday... ... Len: Yanno, mooseluums don't eat swine! Are you mooseluum? straight face JS OK, maybe I'll send a copy to Jimmy Dean... ...I've known a few "mooses" in Japan, BTASE. :-) warmest regards, LA |
So who won the "when does NoCode happen" pool?
Dave Heil wrote:
wrote: From: Dave Heil on Fri, Dec 29 2006 7:33 am wrote: From: Dave Heil on Wed, Dec 27 2006 10:22 am John Smith I wrote: Dave Heil wrote: [long, long windy "reply" considerably edited to save others' eyes...] David, to you as always * F * Y * D * I * T * M * ! I'm not familiar with it. What does it mean, Len? You can't guess? :-) Ask your buddie, Jimmie Miccolis. No, don't bother...he couldn't find anything on ByteBrothers either. Tsk, so MANY who aren't aware of older computer- modem comms! 8.544, I'll give it a 5.3 since it doesn't have a good beat and the lyrics don't do much for me. Tsk, math-deficient. 8.544 is the square-root of 73...to four places. Sayonara, Sore Loser, LA |
So who won the "when does NoCode happen" pool?
"Dee Flint" wrote:
Yes the same reasons would apply and I do believe that the number of Novice licensees won't drop to zero. However looking at the slope of the curve from the time the no-code Tech was implemented to now continues to show a steep and steady drop. This is entirely expected. With the codeless Tech license in 92 the de-facto entry-level license became the Tech. Your observations are right on. The rate of decline has been nearly constant with no sign yet of leveling out for that license class. I would expect to see a few hundred Novices continuing to renew as Novices but they will be statistically insignificant. Yes, at some point I think that steep drop will begin to level off. Much like a graph of Y = 1/X 73 KH6HZ |
So who won the "when does NoCode happen" pool?
wrote:
Dave Heil wrote: wrote: From: Dave Heil on Fri, Dec 29 2006 7:33 am wrote: From: Dave Heil on Wed, Dec 27 2006 10:22 am John Smith I wrote: Dave Heil wrote: [long, long windy "reply" considerably edited to save others' eyes...] That's another of your factual errors, Len. The long, windy part was your post. My response did not even come close to your word count. David, to you as always * F * Y * D * I * T * M * ! I'm not familiar with it. What does it mean, Len? You can't guess? :-) I might be able to come up with a guess, but I don't know what it means, Len. Ask your buddie, Jimmie Miccolis. My "buddie"? I consider Jim as a buddy or a friend, but I didn't ask him. He didn't post the term several times. You did. No, don't bother...he couldn't find anything on ByteBrothers either. Well, make up your mind. Tsk, so MANY who aren't aware of older computer- modem comms! I'm quite aware of older computer-modem comms. I'm not familiar with the term you're using. Is it something someone said to you one or more times? Is that how you are so familiar with it? 8.544, I'll give it a 5.3 since it doesn't have a good beat and the lyrics don't do much for me. Tsk, math-deficient. 8.544 is the square-root of 73...to four places. Heck, Len, my comment doesn't make me math deficient. I thought it was your rating of your own post. Sayonara, Sore Loser, Nakemiin, pikku paskianen. LA Boston Dave K8MN |
So who won the "when does NoCode happen" pool?
" wrote in
oups.com: http://sujan.hallikainen.org/Broadca...s/My3Years.pdf If you try just to the 'BroadcastHistory' part you will see a page of lots and lots of information on what was originally a site for "Saving History from the Dumpster." My upload is under the "Military Very enjoyable! It was an unusual work week. Was there any rationale for that? Also, your lady friend Ada was kinda cute, did some lucky soldier run off with her? ;^) - Mike KB3EIA - |
So who won the "when does NoCode happen" pool?
"KH6HZ" wrote in message ... "Dee Flint" wrote: Yes the same reasons would apply and I do believe that the number of Novice licensees won't drop to zero. However looking at the slope of the curve from the time the no-code Tech was implemented to now continues to show a steep and steady drop. This is entirely expected. With the codeless Tech license in 92 the de-facto entry-level license became the Tech. Your observations are right on. The rate of decline has been nearly constant with no sign yet of leveling out for that license class. I would expect to see a few hundred Novices continuing to renew as Novices but they will be statistically insignificant. Yes, at some point I think that steep drop will begin to level off. Much like a graph of Y = 1/X The only question is where will the asymptote lie on that graph. Dee, N8UZE |
So who won the "when does NoCode happen" pool?
Mike Coslo wrote:
" wrote in oups.com: http://sujan.hallikainen.org/Broadca...s/My3Years.pdf If you try just to the 'BroadcastHistory' part you will see a page of lots and lots of information on what was originally a site for "Saving History from the Dumpster." My upload is under the "Military Very enjoyable! It was an unusual work week. Was there any rationale for that? It was part of a private document that came about after experimenting with restoring a bunch of digitized color slides (roughly 600) using the Adobe photo program back in 2000. Over 500 slides got restored and emulsion reticulation erased. Once that was done, the explanations for the photos suggested the photo essay. The final digitized slides were transferred to a CD for safekeeping. Note: Not even Kodachrome will last 40+ years without change... The original essay was 30 pages and several copies were printed out on inkjet, given out. I edited it down to 20 pages for electronic distribution. Since Hal's website is up the coast towards Santa Barbara and was open for submission of material, I sent it up there. BTW, I got exactly nothing for all that work. It was a "labor of love" (so stated by a retired civilian engineer who worked for the Army there when I was in the Company) and a place where I spent three years of my life doing things in radio that were unique to just about everyone in this newsgroup. :-) Also, your lady friend Ada was kinda cute, did some lucky soldier run off with her? ;^) No, just as her frosty demeanor began to thaw, her heart melted and that was that. :-) [only her eyes remained true...] Happy New Year, |
So who won the "when does NoCode happen" pool?
" wrote in
ups.com: Alun L. Palmer wrote: " wrote in oups.com: From: Dave Heil on Fri, Dec 29 2006 7:33 am wrote: From: Dave Heil on Wed, Dec 27 2006 10:22 am John Smith I wrote: Dave Heil wrote: Len, get a ham licence. You might even enjoy it. 73 de Alun, N3KIP Hello, Alun. Okay, I'll write a letter to the FDA and post it Wednesday... I wasn't aware one needed a ham license to purchase and eat ham. My wife and I had ham during the holidays. He tasted like chicken... Best regards, The thing is Len, you don't need a licence to comment on the subject, but if you are that interested then why don't you get one? There's no reason you couldn't get an Extra licence now, so why not do it? |
So who won the "when does NoCode happen" pool?
Alun L. Palmer wrote:
" wrote in ups.com: Alun L. Palmer wrote: " wrote in oups.com: From: Dave Heil on Fri, Dec 29 2006 7:33 am wrote: From: Dave Heil on Wed, Dec 27 2006 10:22 am John Smith I wrote: Dave Heil wrote: Len, get a ham licence. You might even enjoy it. 73 de Alun, N3KIP Hello, Alun. Okay, I'll write a letter to the FDA and post it Wednesday... I wasn't aware one needed a ham license to purchase and eat ham. My wife and I had ham during the holidays. He tasted like chicken... The thing is Len, you don't need a licence to comment on the subject, but if you are that interested then why don't you get one? There's no reason you couldn't get an Extra licence now, so why not do it? Sigh...Alun, this whole "charge" of "PROMISING to get an extra out of the box" dates back six years and is, itself, a FALSE charge of "impropriety." Miccolis has the "polite insult" tactic of taking things out of context, then fabricating some kind of "indignation" or even "outrage" at such alleged perfidy. :-) SIX YEARS AGO I wrote what amounts to a throw-away comment as part of a longer message and Miccolis apparently got hit in his mental eye and remembered it. He then manufactured a FALSE charge of my "not keeping promises." Decades ago I promised myself to never get married again. Then I re-connected with my high-school sweetheart and "broke" my "promise." COULD I get an extra class amateur license now? Yes, I COULD. But I am NOT promising to do so. I never promised to do so six years ago...despite what Miccolis "charges." Radio-electronics is - to me - a totally fascinating part of still- advancing technology. So much so that I changed my life career goals from being an illustrator-artist to electronic engineering. I've never regretted that despite having an aptitude and some skill and experience in professional illustration before my military service. There is no visible end to changes possible or forth- coming in radio-electronics (or electronics-radio) and it is fun to see it all evolve, grow, become a part of our lives. I look forward every month to see what is new, exciting, indeed revolutionary in electronics technology described in the many trade magazines I receive. Do I "need" an amateur radio license? Personally speaking, NO. But, it might be fun...or it might not...depending who there is to communicate with and how to communicate. Having gotten into HF radio communications over a half century ago (on a more massive scale than most amateurs in this group experienced), I have absolutely NO desire to do, learn (once again), or bother with on-off keying CW just on the HF bands. If one has spent three years of their life keeping 40+ HF transmitters running 24/7 on long-distance (over 2000 miles) radio circuits, the thought of collecting 10, 100, or a 1000 "DX" contacts (each one a sporadic, minimal exchange of information) just for the act of collecting them is a non-starter to me. Do I "need" some fancy certificates framed and hung on the wall or a federally-authorized operator license station callsign so that I can put that next to my name (as if it were a PhD or similar)? No. I have no use for Titles and the only thing on my home office wall is paint. [one 13-foot long wall is mostly bookshelves which are fairly well filled] One of the LAST things I need is some certificate announcing "expertise" in a manual skill that was already mature before the turn of the century befoe the latest one. My wife has two post-graduate degrees which makes her two up on mine, yet neither one of us makes a big thing of a college diploma. [hers are in storage up north, for example] Some who are skilled in an archaic form of "communications" keep up the pretense of their being "superior" to others. That's just a pretense fueled by an ego...and worse considering that the old license class standards were set by even older egos brought about when such OOK CW standards were a norm in old radio communications. That time is past but the old standards are still triumphed by those who've gotten enormous emotional sustenance from the Titles they thus obtained. I'm not about to give up my time to feed those egos nor agree to maintain the federal welfare that kept those egos fed. Modernization in ALL communications standards and practices has been happening...and the hobby of amateur radio has lagged behind the rest of the radio world. There's finally some hope of ending the federal welfare of egos who think that OOK CW is the end-all, be-all of radio and thus some sort of God-given "superiority" over mere mortals. I am secure in what I know and do, do not need fancy titles or certificates or awards to stoke my ego. If something new happens in electronics I take the trouble to find out more about it, to continue a lifelong learning endeavor that is itself most fascinating. I don't bother with trying to be a "champion" of some skill that was already old when I was born and see little use for such skill now. Now, all that said, amateur radio MIGHT be a fun thing for me to do, something to ADD to the many means of communication I already have. I first communicated on radio over a half century ago and have since done so from ground, from the air (at the controls of an airplane), and from the sea (okay, a harbor on the Pacific shore). I once sent commands to a station ON the moon and received a reply that such commands were accepted. I don't need a radio or a hobby license just to show that I can use a radio or communicate by radio...nor do I need a lot of wallpaper to "prove" such communications. I'm one of the very few in here who has the technological smarts and experience to be able to cobble together a "radio" from an amorphous collection of components, often cited as the "reason" simple comms such as CW "is needed for its simplicity." I don't bother trying that since it is much better to design-build something better, something more state-of-the-art than the pipe-dream stuff spouted in this newsgroup in the past by morse mavens. My advocacy in here has been to end the morse code test for an amateur radio license. It has never been one of getting my own amateur license. Given that I've read just about all the propaganda issued by the ARRL on their idea of What Is Best For Amateurs, I'm rather immune to their "reasons." If you have some NEW reasons to get an amateur radio license, I'll listen. Old reasons haven't worked so far. |
So who won the "when does NoCode happen" pool?
wrote:
Alun L. Palmer wrote: " wrote in ups.com: Alun L. Palmer wrote: " wrote in oups.com: From: Dave Heil on Fri, Dec 29 2006 7:33 am wrote: From: Dave Heil on Wed, Dec 27 2006 10:22 am John Smith I wrote: Dave Heil wrote: Len, get a ham licence. You might even enjoy it. 73 de Alun, N3KIP Hello, Alun. Okay, I'll write a letter to the FDA and post it Wednesday... I wasn't aware one needed a ham license to purchase and eat ham. My wife and I had ham during the holidays. He tasted like chicken... The thing is Len, you don't need a licence to comment on the subject, but if you are that interested then why don't you get one? Len isn't interested in being a radio amateur. There's no reason you couldn't get an Extra licence now, so why not do it? Len could have gotten a Technician 15+ years ago, but never did. Sigh...Alun, this whole "charge" of "PROMISING to get an extra out of the box" dates back six years and is, itself, a FALSE charge of "impropriety." Who said you promised anything, Len? Or said it was improper? All you did, way back on January 19, 2000, was to write that you were going to get an extra license "right out of the box", But here it is almost *seven* years later, and you haven't. Seems to me that you write all sorts of stuff here but don't take any responsibility for it. has the "polite insult" tactic of taking things out of context, then fabricating some kind of "indignation" or even "outrage" at such alleged perfidy. :-) Len, you consider any disagreement with your views, or disproof of your claims, as a direct insult. SIX YEARS AGO (actually, almost seven) I wrote what amounts to a throw-away comment as part of a longer message and Throw-away comment? Let's allow the reader to decide: http://groups.google.com/group/rec.r...e=source&hl=en apparently got hit in his mental eye and remembered it. He then manufactured a FALSE charge of my "not keeping promises." Decades ago I promised myself to never get married again. Then I re-connected with my high-school sweetheart and "broke" my "promise." Sure doesn't look like a throw-away comment. COULD I get an extra class amateur license now? Yes, I COULD. I don't think so. You'd have to pass all the current license elements - including Element 1. But I am NOT promising to do so. I never promised to do so six years ago...despite what "charges." Promised? Or simply stated your intention? Seems to me you are saying that we should not believe your words. If your statement was out of context, please explain how the context could mean anything different than a statement that you were going for an amateur Extra license. Radio-electronics is - to me - a totally fascinating part of still- advancing technology. So much so that I changed my life career goals from being an illustrator-artist to electronic engineering. I've never regretted that despite having an aptitude and some skill and experience in professional illustration before my military service. There is no visible end to changes possible or forth- coming in radio-electronics (or electronics-radio) and it is fun to see it all evolve, grow, become a part of our lives. I look forward every month to see what is new, exciting, indeed revolutionary in electronics technology described in the many trade magazines I receive. That's nice, Len. So why are you so interested in changing *amateur radio* regulations if you don't want a license? Do I "need" an amateur radio license? Personally speaking, NO. But, it might be fun...or it might not...depending who there is to communicate with and how to communicate. Judging by your inaction, Len, I'd say you don't want one. Having gotten into HF radio communications over a half century ago (on a more massive scale than most amateurs in this group experienced), I have absolutely NO desire to do, learn (once again), or bother with on-off keying CW just on the HF bands. Then you could not get an Amateur Extra class license now. You'll have to wait until the rules change. If one has spent three years of their life keeping 40+ HF transmitters running 24/7 on long-distance (over 2000 miles) radio circuits, the thought of collecting 10, 100, or a 1000 "DX" contacts (each one a sporadic, minimal exchange of information) just for the act of collecting them is a non-starter to me. But not to many others. Do I "need" some fancy certificates framed and hung on the wall or a federally-authorized operator license station callsign so that I can put that next to my name (as if it were a PhD or similar)? No. I have no use for Titles and the only thing on my home office wall is paint. Yet you tell us all about yourself here, Len. Your Commercial licenses and RA-number and much more. Seems like you only dislike titles you don't have. [one 13-foot long wall is mostly bookshelves which are fairly well filled] One of the LAST things I need is some certificate announcing "expertise" in a manual skill that was already mature before the turn of the century befoe the latest one. My wife has two post-graduate degrees which makes her two up on mine, yet neither one of us makes a big thing of a college diploma. [hers are in storage up north, for example] Yet you mention them here - even though *she* earned them, not you. Some who are skilled in an archaic form of "communications" keep up the pretense of their being "superior" to others. That's just a pretense fueled by an ego...and worse considering that the old license class standards were set by even older egos brought about when such OOK CW standards were a norm in old radio communications. That time is past but the old standards are still triumphed by those who've gotten enormous emotional sustenance from the Titles they thus obtained. I'm not about to give up my time to feed those egos nor agree to maintain the federal welfare that kept those egos fed. Len, when it comes to egos, yours is most obvious here. Modernization in ALL communications standards and practices has been happening...and the hobby of amateur radio has lagged behind the rest of the radio world. How so? Sounds to me like you're saying you want radio amateurs to stop *using* Morse Code, not just testing for it. There's finally some hope of ending the federal welfare of egos who think that OOK CW is the end-all, be-all of radio and thus some sort of God-given "superiority" over mere mortals. I am secure in what I know and do, do not need fancy titles or certificates or awards to stoke my ego. Seems to me like you stoke it by telling us over and over again about yourself and your accomplishments, Len. If you were *really* secure, you wouldn't have to put others down by making fun of their names, ethnicity, education, job/military/govt. service experience, gender, etc. But you do all those things and more. That tells me you are really not secure, and are threatened by anyone who disagrees with you. If something new happens in electronics I take the trouble to find out more about it, to continue a lifelong learning endeavor that is itself most fascinating. I don't bother with trying to be a "champion" of some skill that was already old when I was born and see little use for such skill now. Stoker set to "HIGH".... Now, all that said, amateur radio MIGHT be a fun thing for me to do, something to ADD to the many means of communication I already have. I first communicated on radio over a half century ago and have since done so from ground, from the air (at the controls of an airplane), and from the sea (okay, a harbor on the Pacific shore). Using somebody else's license and somebody else's radio, right? I once sent commands to a station ON the moon and received a reply that such commands were accepted. Using somebody else's license and somebody else's radio, right? I don't need a radio or a hobby license just to show that I can use a radio or communicate by radio...nor do I need a lot of wallpaper to "prove" such communications. Then don't get one, Len. But why not let those who do such things alone? What is wrong with live and let live? I'm one of the very few in here who has the technological smarts and experience to be able to cobble together a "radio" from an amorphous collection of components, often cited as the "reason" simple comms such as CW "is needed for its simplicity." Yet we haven't seen a single example of such. No website, no magazine articles, no pictures, no results. Some of us (such as myself) have built complete amateur radio stations and used them on the air to contact many others. Could you do that, Len? I think not. I don't bother trying that since it is much better to design-build something better, something more state-of-the-art than the pipe-dream stuff spouted in this newsgroup in the past by morse mavens. IOW, you'd rather insult what others *have* done than do something yourself. My advocacy in here has been to end the morse code test for an amateur radio license. And a lot more. Like the addition of a minimum age requirement for a US amateur license, even though no such requirement has ever existed. It has never been one of getting my own amateur license. Jan 19, 2000: http://groups.google.com/group/rec.r...e=source&hl=en Never is a long time. Given that I've read just about all the propaganda issued by the ARRL on their idea of What Is Best For Amateurs, I'm rather immune to their "reasons." If you have some NEW reasons to get an amateur radio license, I'll listen. Old reasons haven't worked so far. The big question is why Len is so interested in changing the rules of amateur radio, when he's not involved with amateur radio in any other way. Perhaps it just bothers him that someone is having fun? |
So who won the "when does NoCode happen" pool?
|
So who won the "when does NoCode happen" pool?
John Smith I wrote in news:cGYlh.25$WW2.223285
@news.sisna.com: wrote: ... The big question is why Len is so interested in changing the rules of amateur radio, when he's not involved with amateur radio in any other way. Perhaps it just bothers him that someone is having fun? Now I'd say that must be a trick question, as certainly, on the surface, it appears only a moron would ask such a thing! I'd say Len would do little or nothing to hinder anyone from having "fun." Now, for instance, say they were hogging up all the radio freqs for a good 'ole boys club, he'd be a ****ed as hell--and rightly so! That is all you are seeing. Len don't give a chit about children having fun ... JS I must admit he could be annoyed at a load of Morse code operators monopolising a chunk of phone spectrum. I always was too, but only because I wanted to use that spectrum. He apparently doesn't want to use it, which is a little harder to understand. BTW, Len, I have an EE degree and used to work in an EMC lab (EMC being what most people call radio interference, approximately speaking). Some people hear that and jump to the conclusion that I was in ham radio enforcement, which makes me laugh, because I never was. I could just add that I moved into the law, but the same people would probably think that I was prosecuting interference cases (!) whereas in fact I am a patent agent. My point is that many hams are (or were) radio professionals, but not all of us drop references to our professional experience when we are talking in a group of hams, except where it's actually relevant to the discussion. I have met a few people who claim they could never be hams because they have professional experience in radio, but I have never understood that point of view. Get a licence and try 'slumming' on the ham bands, Len. You won't be the only one, you know! 73 de Alun, N3KIP |
So who won the "when does NoCode happen" pool?
"Alun L. Palmer" wrote in message . .. John Smith I wrote in news:cGYlh.25$WW2.223285 @news.sisna.com: wrote: ... The big question is why Len is so interested in changing the rules of amateur radio, when he's not involved with amateur radio in any other way. Perhaps it just bothers him that someone is having fun? Now I'd say that must be a trick question, as certainly, on the surface, it appears only a moron would ask such a thing! I'd say Len would do little or nothing to hinder anyone from having "fun." Now, for instance, say they were hogging up all the radio freqs for a good 'ole boys club, he'd be a ****ed as hell--and rightly so! That is all you are seeing. Len don't give a chit about children having fun ... JS I must admit he could be annoyed at a load of Morse code operators monopolising a chunk of phone spectrum. I always was too, but only because I wanted to use that spectrum. He apparently doesn't want to use it, which is a little harder to understand. BTW, Len, I have an EE degree and used to work in an EMC lab (EMC being what most people call radio interference, approximately speaking). Some people hear that and jump to the conclusion that I was in ham radio enforcement, which makes me laugh, because I never was. I could just add that I moved into the law, but the same people would probably think that I was prosecuting interference cases (!) whereas in fact I am a patent agent. My point is that many hams are (or were) radio professionals, but not all of us drop references to our professional experience when we are talking in a group of hams, except where it's actually relevant to the discussion. I have met a few people who claim they could never be hams because they have professional experience in radio, but I have never understood that point of view. Get a licence and try 'slumming' on the ham bands, Len. You won't be the only one, you know! 73 de Alun, N3KIP Very well put, Alun. I oft wonder whether Len, with his condescending attitude, considers or takes into mind that there are many of us in these groups that are fairly well educated. Len quite obviously views himself as being a self-appointed, master "wordsmith" and finds a great amount of smug pleasure jousting with licensed Amateurs. I once saw it written that Mister Len was a Master of Flatus. It was an accurate descriptor. To date I've seen nothing to rebut that description. |
So who won the "when does NoCode happen" pool?
John Smith I wrote:
wrote: ... The big question is why Len is so interested in changing the rules of amateur radio, when he's not involved with amateur radio in any other way. Perhaps it just bothers him that someone is having fun? Now I'd say that must be a trick question, as certainly, on the surface, it appears only a moron would ask such a thing! Well, CB John, it seems to have aroused some interest in you. I'd say Len would do little or nothing to hinder anyone from having "fun." I'm of the opinion that attending a social event where Len was present would virtually guarantee an absence of fun. He has a gift. Now, for instance, say they were hogging up all the radio freqs for a good 'ole boys club, he'd be a ****ed as hell--and rightly so! Len isn't involved in the use of amateur radio frequencies. How is it his right to be upset? Len isn't a licensed radio amateur. That is all you are seeing. Len don't give a chit about children having fun ... That's incorrect, "John". Len has told us that he has a problem with children participating in what he sees as an adult activity. Dave K8MN |
So who won the "when does NoCode happen" pool?
"Alun L. Palmer" wrote:
Get a licence and try 'slumming' on the ham bands, Len. You won't be the only one, you know! Alun, You have to understand... Lennie doesn't *WANT* to get a ham license. He has pretty much been posting the same drivel to this newsgroup for a decade. I refer you to the following posting I made *7* years ago on this very topic: -=- Begin Dejanews Quote From: (Mike Deignan) Subject: Anderson proposes new licensing restrictions Date: 1999/02/17 Message-ID: #1/1 References: X-Trace: news15.ispnews.com 919249817 155.212.1.12 (Wed, 17 Feb 1999 06:10:17 EDT) Organization: S.S. Minnow Island Charter NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 06:10:17 EDT Newsgroups: rec.radio.amateur.policy In article , N2EY wrote: LAAh yes, the warm-hearted convivial stormtrooper from central africa LAMUST make his SUPERIORITY known! Four year olds who can beep (along LAwith parents who have conned the VEs into passing them) are considered LA"superior" to those who are not licensed in the amateur radio service. Anderson is challenged to show that there were any irregularities in the testing of the young people involved. Actually Jim, the above quote summarizes Lennie's problem in a nutshell. It ****es him off to no end that 4-year olds are able to get ham radio licenses, and he, well, can't (or won't). Lennie's vitrol is sometimes amusing, most of the time boring. A cursory review of DejaNews will show that Lennie has never had a kind word for amateurs, or the amateur radio service. Almost 2 decades ago when I was in my teens, we had a grandmother living with us. She used to constantly bitch, moan, and complain. She was a lonely, bitter old woman whose time had passed by, and her goal in life was to make everyone else equally as miserable as her. She couldn't be happy, then by golly neither would anyone else. That's pretty much the Lennie Anderson of today. As a CB Radio operator, for decades he has been on the outside of ham radio looking in. That nasty code test has been 'holding him back'. And, by golly, if *HE* can't be a ham operator, and be worshiped by the masses (the intellectual giant he is), well, then nobody should be able to enjoy ham radio. That's pretty much my mental image of Lennie. A senile old fart, rocking in his corner rocking chair, who occasionally wipes the drool of his face, plugs in his telephone to his 300 baud acoustic-coupler modem, and uses his VT100 green-screen to spread hate and discontent. MD -=- End Quote So, as you see Alun, nothing has changed over the past 7 years, except the email address he uses when he posts. 73 KH6HZ |
So who won the "when does NoCode happen" pool?
Dave Heil wrote:
Well, CB John, it seems to have aroused some interest in you. "CB John?" Hey, I kinda like the ring to that, it has potential, thanks! :) I'd say Len would do little or nothing to hinder anyone from having "fun." Really? Looks like Len knows how to have fun to me, I can almost hear him snickering now--perhaps just my imagination ... I'm of the opinion that attending a social event where Len was present would virtually guarantee an absence of fun. He has a gift. Really? Darn, his dry wit makes me bust a gut often ... wonder how you could miss that? Now, for instance, say they were hogging up all the radio freqs for a good 'ole boys club, he'd be a ****ed as hell--and rightly so! Len isn't involved in the use of amateur radio frequencies. How is it his right to be upset? Len isn't a licensed radio amateur. What does being an amateur radio operator have to do with deciding how to use the peoples radio frequencies? That is all you are seeing. Len don't give a chit about children having fun ... That's incorrect, "John". Len has told us that he has a problem with children participating in what he sees as an adult activity. Now that is just plain false, misleading and outrageous, look at all the fun Len has here--playing with the children! JS |
So who won the "when does NoCode happen" pool?
John Smith I wrote:
Len don't give a chit about children having fun ... Well, actually he does - and not in a positive way. There's never been a minimum age requirement for a US amateur radio license. Len thinks there should be such a requirement. He thinks no one under the age of 14 years should be able to get any class of US amateur license, regardless of their ability to pass the license tests. That's not just from his postings here - he put such a proposal into one of his official comments to FCC. When asked what problems were caused by lack of such a requirement, he could not name a single case where the youth of a licensed radio amateur caused an enforcement problem. (In fact, many of the worst violators of Part 97 are about Len's age....;-) ) Every so often, there's a mention of some youngster who earned an amateur radio license at a very early age. One such news item caused Len to claim here that there must have been some kind of fraud at the VE session, because he somehow knew that the youngsters pictured could not have passed the license tests honestly. Looks like Len doesn't want anyone under 14 years of age to experience the fun of amateur radio, regardless of what other qualifications they have, tests passed, etc. |
So who won the "when does NoCode happen" pool?
|
So who won the "when does NoCode happen" pool?
"John Smith I" wrote in message ... wrote: ... Len thinks there should be such a requirement. He thinks no one under the age of 14 years should be able to get any class of US amateur license, regardless of their ability to pass the license tests. There is some concern I have mulled over in my mind, about youngsters getting a ticket too young. Until fairly recently, I thought it would be great ... However, having seen quite a few individuals who might be of a "pedo nature", now not only do I have a concern about youngsters with internet access but also with a ham ticket! Regards, JS Actually youngsters and their parents need to be concerned about every person the youngster comes in contact with. Look at the news reports of teachers who have taken advantage of young people. Keeping youngsters out of an activity because they *might* run into a pedophile basically means keeping them locked up at home. That just isn't going to work. Dee, N8UZE |
So who won the "when does NoCode happen" pool?
Dee Flint wrote:
Actually youngsters and their parents need to be concerned about every person the youngster comes in contact with. Look at the news reports of teachers who have taken advantage of young people. Keeping youngsters out of an activity because they *might* run into a pedophile basically means keeping them locked up at home. That just isn't going to work. Dee, N8UZE Yes Dee, a proper balance is difficult to achieve. Being the product of a two parent family, where one parent was always at home to supervise my activities and assist in providing for my well being, I now look back and see the advantages and safety I enjoyed. It is difficult to see that at a young age! I certainly didn't, but now I know I may be here and alive just because of it. With two parents working the youth of this day and age will have much more difficulty in obtaining such safety, advantages and head start. And, not only that, the world just seems to filled with more evil ... Regards, JS |
So who won the "when does NoCode happen" pool?
wrote:
Len thinks there should be such a requirement. He thinks no one under the age of 14 years should be able to get any class of US amateur license, regardless of their ability to pass the license tests. Len has a (small) point. Generally speaking, 14 year olds lack the knowledgebase to properly pass the theory elements in higher license classes -- that is, without "memorization" or "association" of the question pool contents. That's not to say there are not child prodigies who can do it. Certainly, I'm sure there are. However, if you took your average 10 or 12 year old and tried to teach him/her algebra, geometry, etc... it simply isn't going to happen. Thus, the only real way such an individual -- again, generally speaking -- can pass the theory examinations is thru a) fraud, b) rote memorization, or c) associative learning of the questions to answers. What would be nice is, perhaps, a license class with very little theory, mostly regulations, which younger generations could "step into" the hobby with, gives them a broad spectrum of operating modes on limited frequencies, and as they mature, they can upgrade into higher a higher license class. Oops. That almost sounds like the novice license. We know the FCC isn't going to introduce any MORE license classes, the trend for the past 20? years has been to REDUCE licensing requirements and make it easier for anyone to get a ham license. 73 KH6HZ |
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