Thank you for responding.
I know that it is unfair to draw generalizations about the amateur community
from posts on a newsgroup. And I am not trying to say that it's the
old-timers who are causing all the trouble. I'm sorry it came out that way
(and I realize that it's mostly the immature jerks, not the old-timers,
doing the name-calling). It just gets me really depressed to see that well
more than half of the posts in this group have nothing to do with the hobby,
and were written for the sole purpose of hurting other people.
I would like to state that, despite being a no-code tech, and despite the
fact that learning morse is the only thing keeping me from a general-class
license, I support the code test. I agree that ham radio has drastically
"dumbed-down" over the past several years, and I agree that it's not good
for the hobby. However, I hate it when I see people looked down upon simply
because they're lowly technicians. I hate seeing the "code/no-code"-related
flame-wars that erupt every day. If people confined their comments to
civilized discussion and debate, we wouldn't have this problem. There will
never be a total agreement as to whether the code requirement should be
dropped, but there's no reason for people to express their opinions like
raving lunatics. People who just want to exchange clever insults should find
a different newsgroup.
On a side-note, I have not ever been insulted by any member of this group. I
am basing my opinion solely on the threads I read every day.
I hope I have not offended anybody by what I have posted so far, and I
encourage further response.

-KG6SGY



"Dick Carroll" wrote in message
...


Greg Courville wrote:

I've been a ham for only a month now, and been using these groups for
about 6 weeks.
I really can't stand some of the things that go on here.
Has anybody ever noticed that 8 out of 10 threads on this group (and
many other amateur radio groups) end in a flame war?
It's really shocking how people can start an argument over nothing
which can escalate to vicious strings of insults complete with
profanity, sexual references and terms such as "CBplusser" and
"Knuckle-Dragger".

Greg if you want to see how all this began just spend some time in Google
and you canget an educaion. It sure didn't start by old timers belittling
newcomers. In fact it was and IS the exact reverse. Not all newcomers, by
any means, just those on this board who decided to do it, and persist to
this day.



It's just unbelievable to me that while all of the
books talk about how wonderful and helpful hams are, a significant
number of them spend their time cutting each other down over random
issues. I see "newbies" come to these boards for help, and get cut
down by inconsiderate jerks who just feel like making people feel
stupid.

You're making assumptions here that shouldn't, indeed can't, be made.
The jerks who show up her complaining about the code test requrement and
blaming all us who just did it, without complaining. That in so doing
learned that Morse code does indeed add substantially to ham radio, to the
point that we believe code testing has a permanent place in ham radio, is
just so much nonsense to them. They already know all about it.



How many hams didn't start out with a lower-level license?
People need to stop beating up on us poor no-coders.

Come into ham radio with a proper attitude (note I didn't say THE proper
attitude) and you'll be received just as well as anyone ever was.



Don't they
realize that the new people look up to the old-timers?

You REALLY must have not been reading here very closely at all, Greg.
Were that the case *here* you wouldn't have a report to make.



I must say that
after reading books about how hams help people all over the world and
are generally just a wonderful bunch, these groups have really changed
my view of the amateur radio community.

Don't feel lonesome.
It sure changed my view of ham radio, too. I showed up here several years
ago to engage in civil, sincere discourse on the merits of code testing,
and was immediately set upon by the code haters for my views. It's been
all downhill from there.



I don't doubt that even this
thread will end in a violent exchange of profanities and become just
another flame war.


Once again, you will get the treatment you deserve here, at least from me.

So far you're doing OK, I don't blame you for your concern. But I suggest
you might benefit from a bit more knowledge of the background of what has
happened here.

"Greg Courville" wrote in message
...
Thank you for responding.
I know that it is unfair to draw generalizations about the amateur
community
from posts on a newsgroup. And I am not trying to say that it's the
old-timers who are causing all the trouble. I'm sorry it came out that way
(and I realize that it's mostly the immature jerks, not the old-timers,
doing the name-calling). It just gets me really depressed to see that well
more than half of the posts in this group have nothing to do with the
hobby,
and were written for the sole purpose of hurting other people.
I would like to state that, despite being a no-code tech, and despite the
fact that learning morse is the only thing keeping me from a general-class
license, I support the code test. I agree that ham radio has drastically
"dumbed-down" over the past several years, and I agree that it's not good
for the hobby. However, I hate it when I see people looked down upon
simply
because they're lowly technicians. I hate seeing the
"code/no-code"-related
flame-wars that erupt every day. If people confined their comments to
civilized discussion and debate, we wouldn't have this problem. There will
never be a total agreement as to whether the code requirement should be
dropped, but there's no reason for people to express their opinions like
raving lunatics. People who just want to exchange clever insults should
find
a different newsgroup.
On a side-note, I have not ever been insulted by any member of this group.
I
am basing my opinion solely on the threads I read every day.
I hope I have not offended anybody by what I have posted so far, and I
encourage further response.

-KG6SGY

There are many of us who do not look down on Technicians or consider them
lowly. In the club to which I belong, our most expert satellite operator is
a Technician. Everyone respects his knowledge in this area. Another
Technician was our expert on VHF SSB including propagation, antennas, etc.
Although now a General, he was well respected when he was still a
Technician.

Unfortunately, there are way too many people who get their licenses and
become strictly "repeater creatures". Those who combine this with being
disrepectful of experienced hams tend to rub people the wrong way. As in
anything else, we tend to be unduly affected by the few bad apples and
forget that there are a lot of good people working at their personal
development.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE