Alun wrote in message . ..
(N2EY) wrote in news:20031129115807.23307.00004755@mb-
m29.aol.com:

In article ,
(Brian) writes:

Blowhard libs have tried soooo hard to wreck this country.

So have blowhard conservatives.

They've nearly succeeded,

How is this country "wrecked", compared to how things used to be?

but there are still a few people who give a damn about America, and GW
is one of them.

There are lots of others, including many who disagree with Mr. Bush.

It's the methods, not the person.






Well, I'm a foreigner in your country, but you can't deny that the economy
boomed under Clinton and is now on it's knees.

I'm not fond of the present government, but mainly for other reasons.
Civil liberties and John Ashcroft, mostly.

All in all, I can't really think of anything GW Bush has done domestically
that is anything to shout about. Tax cuts for the rich. Deficit spending.
I'm really trying to think of anything good (honestly), but nothing comes
to mind.

As for the war, why open that can of worms? Yes, Saddam is/was a very bad
guy. Do I beleive the reasons given for going to war? No. And yes, Blair
went along with it, but I don't like him a lot either.

... but then I'm an anti-code test liberal, so what did you expect?

However, I actually do think it was a nice gesture for Dubbya to go to
Baghdad for Thanksgiving.

I'm sure this post will draw the usual 'love it or leave it' garbage from
at least someone, but never mind. I can take it.

Do you really believe that Clinton had anything to do with the
economy?

I think if Clinton had come in to office with the economy waning and a
terrorist attack around the corner he would have performed extremely
poorly.

On Sun, 30 Nov 2003 06:58:49 -0500, Brett wrote:

And it could very well delay a new artificial limb for my friend
who was on board the USS LIBERTY

The same USS LIBERTY about which the United States National
Security Agency told the Israeli Kirya (the equivalent of the
Pentagon) THREE TIMES "it's not ours" even after the second time
the Israelis warned the Pentagon that "if it isn't yours we are going
to blast it out of the water"?

The same USS LIBERTY that, when the Mirages came over to assess the
damage caused by the first strike, THEN showed the US flag and the
Mirages pulled back.

The same USS LIBERTY about which the US government has never come
clean about the cover-up with either the public or the troops that
were aboard, and even in the release of the formerly-classified
communications transcripts a few months ago never 'fessed up to
their part in getting the ship attacked?

which was attacked by the JEWS.

Ah. now we are getting down to your agenda......

Don't bother to reply. It's not going to be read.

--
73 de K2ASP - Phil Kane

In article , "Phil Kane"
writes:

On Sun, 30 Nov 2003 06:58:49 -0500, Brett wrote:

And it could very well delay a new artificial limb for my friend
who was on board the USS LIBERTY

The same USS LIBERTY about which the United States National
Security Agency told the Israeli Kirya (the equivalent of the
Pentagon) THREE TIMES "it's not ours" even after the second time
the Israelis warned the Pentagon that "if it isn't yours we are going
to blast it out of the water"?

The same USS LIBERTY that, when the Mirages came over to assess the
damage caused by the first strike, THEN showed the US flag and the
Mirages pulled back.

The same USS LIBERTY about which the US government has never come
clean about the cover-up with either the public or the troops that
were aboard, and even in the release of the formerly-classified
communications transcripts a few months ago never 'fessed up to
their part in getting the ship attacked?

You can find a good accounting of the USS Liberty in Chapter 7,
"Blood," in James Bamford's "Body of Secrets," Doubleday, 2001.

As to "coming clean," Bamford blew you out of the water on the
details over two years ago.

LHA

On 30 Nov 2003 08:39:47 -0800, N2EY wrote:

Hillary made a big show of going, so Dubya trumped her. Neat trick.

Another bozo.

Or bozoette?

It's accurate to call her that. I prefer the gender-neutral version ggg

Point is, she got trumped soundly by Dubya's move.

Serves her right.

"Forgotten heroes of a forgotten war" (from the song "And The Band
Played Waltzing Matilda")

Yup.

And to our service people - spending next Thanksgiving with their
families at home.

Amen, brother.

Regardless of politics or policies, our prayers and thoughts are with
them.

Mine also.

--
73 de K2ASP - Phil Kane

In article , "Phil Kane"
writes:

On 30 Nov 2003 08:39:47 -0800, N2EY wrote:

Hillary made a big show of going, so Dubya trumped her. Neat trick.

Another bozo.

Or bozoette?

It's accurate to call her that. I prefer the gender-neutral version ggg

See "I Think We're All Bozos On This Bus" (Firesign Theatre)

Point is, she got trumped soundly by Dubya's move.

Serves her right.

'zactly. Her attempt at free publicity got lost in the noise.

"Forgotten heroes of a forgotten war" (from the song "And The Band
Played Waltzing Matilda")

Yup.

And to our service people - spending next Thanksgiving with their
families at home.

Amen, brother.

Regardless of politics or policies, our prayers and thoughts are with
them.

Mine also.

73 de Jim, N2EY

(N2EY) wrote in message . com...
"Phil Kane" wrote in message t.net...
On 29 Nov 2003 01:58:17 GMT, N2EY wrote:

And to our service people - spending next Thanksgiving with their
families at home.

Amen, brother.

Regardless of politics or policies, our prayers and thoughts are with
them.

73 de Jim, N2EY

There you go, Jim. Your prayers and moral support is all that you can
give to those deployed. Tearing down their CIC hurts them, not helps
them, and won't bring them home any sooner for Thanksgiving or
anything else. There will always be deployed service people over
Thanksgiving and Christmas holidays. That's just the way it works
when you raise your right hand and swear in. And all the people who
raise their right hands know it.

In article ,
(Brian) writes:

73 de Jim, N2EY

There you go, Jim. Your prayers and moral support is all that you can
give to those deployed. Tearing down their CIC hurts them, not helps
them, and won't bring them home any sooner for Thanksgiving or
anything else. There will always be deployed service people over
Thanksgiving and Christmas holidays. That's just the way it works
when you raise your right hand and swear in. And all the people who
raise their right hands know it.

...he isn't aware of that "know," Brian.

It's one thing to know OF it, quite another to DO it.

I was away for four Thanksgivings and three Christmases.

salute

LHA

In article ,
(Brian) writes:

(N2EY) wrote in message
.com...
"Phil Kane" wrote in message
st.net...
On 29 Nov 2003 01:58:17 GMT, N2EY wrote:

And to our service people - spending next Thanksgiving with their
families at home.

Amen, brother.

Regardless of politics or policies, our prayers and thoughts are with
them.

73 de Jim, N2EY

There you go, Jim. Your prayers and moral support is all that you can
give to those deployed.

No, there's more.

Tearing down their CIC hurts them, not helps
them, and won't bring them home any sooner for Thanksgiving or
anything else.

So no one should criticize the president whenever there are troops deployed
anywhere? That's what you seem to be saying.

Who sent American military personnel to the Balkans? Should no one have
criticized him until they all came home?

There will always be deployed service people over
Thanksgiving and Christmas holidays.

Why must it be that way?

I was told growing up that there would *always* be a need for more and more
nuclear weapons and delivery systems, because we had to counter the Soviet
threat, and they'd *never* agree to dismantling their weapons or even seriously
reducing their numbers. SAC bombers in the air, boomers on patrol under the
sea, ICBMs in silos all over the country - and there was serious talk of
development of space-based systems, hypersonic cruise missiles, and many other
systems.

How much threat is the the old Soviet Union now? The biggest threat they pose
is if some of their weapons wind up in a terrorist's hands.

Recall that Gorbachev proposed massive dismantling of nukes 20 years ago but
Reagan would not agree because Gorby tied a ban on serious SDI development to
it.

That's just the way it works
when you raise your right hand and swear in. And all the people who
raise their right hands know it.

A lot of things thought to be impossible have become reality, though.

In article , Alun
writes:

The USA's open-door policies are one reason terror groups were able
at come here and operate the way they did on Sept 11.

Actually, US immigration is amongst the toughest in the world. I can't
help but smile to see it called 'open door'.

I don't mean immigration policies. I mean the the way the USA allows
people in on visas, and doesn't control those who stay illegally.

The main strategy to control this is the I-9 form that everyone fills in
to get a job, even US citizens. The easiest way around that is probably to
work "off the books" for cash. I'm not sure how this could ever be
stopped.

One way to reduce it is high penalties for employers found to be doing such
things, and high rewards and protection for whistle-blowers.

In the case of student visas, as were used in the 911 attacks, it does
seem that immigration ought to check with colleges to see if the students
are still there.

Exactly! That's what I mean by "open-door" - they let lots of folks in and then
don;t check to see what they're really doing.

How did the 9/11 terrorists get into the USA?

On student visas

See above.

This also illustrates one of the conflicts in the way the US economy operates.
Colleges and universities *love* student visas, because foreigners studying in
the USA usually pay cash and help with the institution's need for "diversity".
Such students also help the trade deficit - and considering what a US degree
costs, we're talking serious hard currency per student. So there's pressure to
admit as many cash-paying foreign students as possible.

And the vast majority of them are hard-working, intelligent students whose
purpose in the USA is exactly what they say it is: to get an education.

How much trouble was it
for them to get past INS and set up shop here?

Not much, as it happens. Doing it legally is much more difficult.

There's the problem. It should be easy to do legally and tough to do illegally.

As for tough immigration, check out what is required to immigrate to
New Zealand.

Two words: "Bring money"

73 de Jim, N2EY

(N2EY) wrote in message ...
In article , Alun
writes:

As for tough immigration, check out what is required to immigrate to
New Zealand.

Two words: "Bring money"

73 de Jim, N2EY

Ditto Canada. They admit lots of wealthy Chinese, but few Somalis.