N2EY wrote:
In article . net, "Bill Sohl"
writes:


Newsgroup BPL, Carl. If there is an upside to this sad state of
affairs, it is pretty easy to see who all is posting the acrimony and
avoid it.
- Mike KB3EIA -

I much agree...which is why I have stopped the
posting that I used to.

I also agree with Carl's concerns and would "HOPE" that enough
of us can just ignore the obvious dumb, stupid bickering about
individuals and personalities and just try to stay on topic.


Agreed, Bill. I find myself deleting most posts here, adn ignoring certain
regular posters because no matter how civilly they are approached, they
inevitably resort to name calling, false information and insults.

But what do we do about those who post information that is simply not true?

Do you reply to all the spam email that you get that promises you cheap
prescription drugs, some poor schmedlock from Nigeria needs YOU to
participate in some weird scam he's pulling off, or to increase the size
of little willie to gargantuan proportions?

You probably don't, I know I don't. Point is that 90 percent of the
email I get is worthless spam. I'm not going to control it, and my
option is therefore to opt out of email if I really can't handle it.
This newsgroup has a higher s/n ratio than my personal email.

If we approach the newsgroup noise as spam, it might make it a little
easier to handle.

Do you think that any of us can modify Len's behavior? Or Steve or
Brian's? Not hardly likely! I don't even want to. I like 'em all just
the way they are. If a person has problems with what they post, they can
avoid reading them. Not a hard thing to do, as aside from Brian changing
his addy to avoid spam, they aren't disguising themselves.

- Mike KB3EIA -

In article , Mike Coslo
writes:

N2EY wrote:
In article . net, "Bill
Sohl"
writes:

Newsgroup BPL, Carl. If there is an upside to this sad state of
affairs, it is pretty easy to see who all is posting the acrimony and
avoid it.
- Mike KB3EIA -

I much agree...which is why I have stopped the
posting that I used to.

I also agree with Carl's concerns and would "HOPE" that enough
of us can just ignore the obvious dumb, stupid bickering about
individuals and personalities and just try to stay on topic.

Agreed, Bill. I find myself deleting most posts here, adn ignoring certain
regular posters because no matter how civilly they are approached, they
inevitably resort to name calling, false information and insults.

But what do we do about those who post information that is simply not true?

Do you reply to all the spam email that you get that promises you cheap

prescription drugs, some poor schmedlock from Nigeria needs YOU to
participate in some weird scam he's pulling off, or to increase the size
of little willie to gargantuan proportions?

You probably don't, I know I don't. Point is that 90 percent of the
email I get is worthless spam. I'm not going to control it, and my
option is therefore to opt out of email if I really can't handle it.
This newsgroup has a higher s/n ratio than my personal email.

If we approach the newsgroup noise as spam, it might make it a little
easier to handle.

Do you think that any of us can modify Len's behavior?

Why do you think anyone's "behavior" needs modification?

Consider that the few clues of just written words are not always
interpreted the same by different human beans.

Some folks cannot write well. Others can. A very few others
have considerable practice with writing in many different venues.

Individual perception needs honing in written-only environments.

Or Steve or
Brian's? Not hardly likely! I don't even want to. I like 'em all just
the way they are.

I don't think you "like" them, but that's beside the point. :-)

Since Arpanet started, since Usenet spun off of Arpanet, since
BBSs emulated both and, finally, Internet took over for the majority
of computer-modem communication, and the behavior patterns
have all been the same. Some folks think their magnificent
words are golden words of wisdom from veritable gods and are,
as Hans Brakob once pointed out, filled with murderous rage at
any who DARE challenge that magnificence! A verbal firefight
then erupts from the furious volcano of the noble slighted.

If a person has problems with what they post, they can
avoid reading them.

Extremely easy for normal folks. Most browsers will just skip
to the next message with the Enter/Return key.

Obsessive-compulsives with a Fight! attitude cannot skip them.

Not a hard thing to do, as aside from Brian changing
his addy to avoid spam, they aren't disguising themselves.

Anyone with some normal practice in reading can see the word,
phrase, syntactic structure of individuals and thus identify them.
[that's much easier than the alleged "fist" of telegraphers...
there are far more clues to identities with written languages]

However, individual emotions can override such identitification
clues, particularly true of obsessive-compulsives with some sort
of grudge bias...or they need the cathartic effects of safely tossing
snit on others as a relief from daily frustrations away from the
newsgroups. [time and distance separation insures no risk from
physical retribution, hence so many, usually new modemists,
will toss away normal social manners and let their inner rages
predominate] Those who've been members of social types of
Bulletin Board Systems will know this by experience of
comparing on-screen appearance with in-person identity clues
and spoken communication, the in-person identification offering
many more clues to the inside workings of others.

Meanwhile, back at the raunch, there's still 4 petitions alive for
comments at the FCC. While the ECFS is in standby over the
weekend, it's hard to see who contributed on Saturday or Sunday,
but I don't see many rrap-ers' names in the ECFS listings. Not
enough "dedication and committment to the amateur community?"
:-)

LHA / WMD

Subject: Proposal to rename RRAP ... (was - New Candidate for
'Youngest
From: (Len Over 21)
Date: 4/4/2004 1:37 PM Central Standard Time
Message-id:

In article , Mike Coslo
writes:

You probably don't, I know I don't. Point is that 90 percent of the
email I get is worthless spam. I'm not going to control it, and my
option is therefore to opt out of email if I really can't handle it.
This newsgroup has a higher s/n ratio than my personal email.

If we approach the newsgroup noise as spam, it might make it a little
easier to handle.

Do you think that any of us can modify Len's behavior?

Why do you think anyone's "behavior" needs modification?

Consider that the few clues of just written words are not always
interpreted the same by different human beans.

Some folks cannot write well. Others can. A very few others
have considerable practice with writing in many different venues.

Individual perception needs honing in written-only environments.

Coming from someone who is always demanding that others "seek mental
health counselling", this was precious.

"Why", indeed, Lennie..."why" indeed...

Steve, K4YZ

Len Over 21 wrote:

In article , Mike Coslo
writes:


N2EY wrote:

In article . net, "Bill

Sohl"

writes:


Newsgroup BPL, Carl. If there is an upside to this sad state of
affairs, it is pretty easy to see who all is posting the acrimony and
avoid it.
- Mike KB3EIA -

I much agree...which is why I have stopped the
posting that I used to.

I also agree with Carl's concerns and would "HOPE" that enough
of us can just ignore the obvious dumb, stupid bickering about
individuals and personalities and just try to stay on topic.

Agreed, Bill. I find myself deleting most posts here, adn ignoring certain
regular posters because no matter how civilly they are approached, they
inevitably resort to name calling, false information and insults.

But what do we do about those who post information that is simply not true?

Do you reply to all the spam email that you get that promises you cheap


prescription drugs, some poor schmedlock from Nigeria needs YOU to
participate in some weird scam he's pulling off, or to increase the size
of little willie to gargantuan proportions?

You probably don't, I know I don't. Point is that 90 percent of the
email I get is worthless spam. I'm not going to control it, and my
option is therefore to opt out of email if I really can't handle it.
This newsgroup has a higher s/n ratio than my personal email.

If we approach the newsgroup noise as spam, it might make it a little
easier to handle.

Do you think that any of us can modify Len's behavior?


Why do you think anyone's "behavior" needs modification?

I don't. Do you think I do from what I posted?


Consider that the few clues of just written words are not always
interpreted the same by different human beans.

Some folks cannot write well. Others can. A very few others
have considerable practice with writing in many different venues.

Individual perception needs honing in written-only environments.


Or Steve or
Brian's? Not hardly likely! I don't even want to. I like 'em all just
the way they are.


I don't think you "like" them, but that's beside the point. :-)

Sorry, but I actually do like both of them. You too.`

- Mike KB3EIA -

In article , Mike Coslo
writes:

N2EY wrote:
In article . net, "Bill
Sohl"
writes:


Newsgroup BPL, Carl. If there is an upside to this sad state of
affairs, it is pretty easy to see who all is posting the acrimony and
avoid it.
- Mike KB3EIA -

I much agree...which is why I have stopped the
posting that I used to.

I also agree with Carl's concerns and would "HOPE" that enough
of us can just ignore the obvious dumb, stupid bickering about
individuals and personalities and just try to stay on topic.


Agreed, Bill. I find myself deleting most posts here, adn ignoring certain
regular posters because no matter how civilly they are approached, they
inevitably resort to name calling, false information and insults.

But what do we do about those who post information that is simply not true?

Do you reply to all the spam email that you get that promises you cheap

prescription drugs, some poor schmedlock from Nigeria needs YOU to
participate in some weird scam he's pulling off, or to increase the size
of little willie to gargantuan proportions?

You make an excellent point. I used to read that stuff, but soon got to the
point where I could tell from the subject line and sender that it was spam, and
I'd delete it unread.

You probably don't, I know I don't. Point is that 90 percent of the
email I get is worthless spam. I'm not going to control it, and my
option is therefore to opt out of email if I really can't handle it.
This newsgroup has a higher s/n ratio than my personal email.

In my case it's lower - there is more signal and less noise in my personal
email than here. Part of that is due to the high volume of good stuff from the
various reflectors, though.

If we approach the newsgroup noise as spam, it might make it a little
easier to handle.

Good point. I have been doing that for a while, without really thinking about
it.

Do you think that any of us can modify Len's behavior?

Only Len can do that.

Or Steve or Brian's?

It's up to them.

Not hardly likely!

Agreed.

I don't even want to. I like 'em all just the way they are.

You like the noise? I don't.

And I agree with Carl that their behavior has helped drive away good people
like W1RFI.

If a person has problems with what they post, they can
avoid reading them. Not a hard thing to do, as aside from Brian changing
his addy to avoid spam, they aren't disguising themselves.

Aside from Len's use of no less than five different screen names he







that's pretty true.

Newsgrouo BPL - very descriptive.

73 de Jim, N2EY

N2EY wrote:

In article , Mike Coslo
writes:


N2EY wrote:

In article . net, "Bill

Sohl"

writes:



Newsgroup BPL, Carl. If there is an upside to this sad state of
affairs, it is pretty easy to see who all is posting the acrimony and
avoid it.
- Mike KB3EIA -

I much agree...which is why I have stopped the
posting that I used to.

I also agree with Carl's concerns and would "HOPE" that enough
of us can just ignore the obvious dumb, stupid bickering about
individuals and personalities and just try to stay on topic.


Agreed, Bill. I find myself deleting most posts here, adn ignoring certain
regular posters because no matter how civilly they are approached, they
inevitably resort to name calling, false information and insults.

But what do we do about those who post information that is simply not true?

Do you reply to all the spam email that you get that promises you cheap


prescription drugs, some poor schmedlock from Nigeria needs YOU to
participate in some weird scam he's pulling off, or to increase the size
of little willie to gargantuan proportions?


You make an excellent point. I used to read that stuff, but soon got to the
point where I could tell from the subject line and sender that it was spam, and
I'd delete it unread.


You probably don't, I know I don't. Point is that 90 percent of the
email I get is worthless spam. I'm not going to control it, and my
option is therefore to opt out of email if I really can't handle it.
This newsgroup has a higher s/n ratio than my personal email.


In my case it's lower - there is more signal and less noise in my personal
email than here. Part of that is due to the high volume of good stuff from the
various reflectors, though.

My big problem is that one of my addys is a .edu, and it has what many
places did at one time (perhaps some still do) my initials followed by a
number.

Many of the spammers simply use a random group of letters followed by a
semi-random group of numbers, and viola, "you have spam!"

It is chilling to think of how much bandwidth that wastes.

If we approach the newsgroup noise as spam, it might make it a little
easier to handle.


Good point. I have been doing that for a while, without really thinking about
it.


Do you think that any of us can modify Len's behavior?


Only Len can do that.

And I think he is quite happy with the way he is!


Or Steve or Brian's?


It's up to them.


Not hardly likely!


Agreed.


I don't even want to. I like 'em all just the way they are.


You like the noise? I don't.

Oh no! But I separate the noise from the person

And I agree with Carl that their behavior has helped drive away good people
like W1RFI.

That is too bad, but I liken the situation to stopping driving because
there are wild drivers out on the road.

Once I left a group because of problems with certain posters. It was an
amateur telescope making SIG. I was getting personal email nastygrams
from one member on every post I made, and a couple others seemed to
agree with him. So I left the group. A week after that, I found out the
person doing this had passed away. Turns out he was a terminal cancer
case, and was on a LOT of pain killing drugs. I felt pretty awkward for
being so p****d off at him earlier.

Point is, maybe some people are less than pleasant, but we aren't
always sure why.

If a person has problems with what they post, they can
avoid reading them. Not a hard thing to do, as aside from Brian changing
his addy to avoid spam, they aren't disguising themselves.


Aside from Len's use of no less than five different screen names he







that's pretty true.

Although I think that he always puts His name in the post somewhere.

Newsgroup BPL - very descriptive.

I think so.

- Mike KB3EIA -

Mike Coslo wrote in message ...
N2EY wrote:

In article , Mike Coslo
writes:

N2EY wrote:
In article . net, "Bill
Sohl"

writes:

Newsgroup BPL, Carl. If there is an upside to this sad state of
affairs, it is pretty easy to see who all is posting the acrimony and
avoid it.
- Mike KB3EIA -

I much agree...which is why I have stopped the
posting that I used to.

I also agree with Carl's concerns and would "HOPE" that enough
of us can just ignore the obvious dumb, stupid bickering about
individuals and personalities and just try to stay on topic.

Agreed, Bill. I find myself deleting most posts here, adn ignoring certain
regular posters because no matter how civilly they are approached, they
inevitably resort to name calling, false information and insults.

But what do we do about those who post information that is simply not true?

Do you reply to all the spam email that you get that promises you cheap
prescription drugs, some poor schmedlock from Nigeria needs YOU to
participate in some weird scam he's pulling off, or to increase the size
of little willie to gargantuan proportions?

You make an excellent point. I used to read that stuff, but soon got to the
point where I could tell from the subject line and sender that it was spam, and I'd delete it unread.

You probably don't, I know I don't. Point is that 90 percent of the
email I get is worthless spam. I'm not going to control it, and my
option is therefore to opt out of email if I really can't handle it.
This newsgroup has a higher s/n ratio than my personal email.

In my case it's lower - there is more signal and less noise in my personal
email than here. Part of that is due to the high volume of good stuff from the various reflectors, though.

My big problem is that one of my addys is a .edu, and it has what many
places did at one time (perhaps some still do) my initials followed by a
number.

Just askin' for it.

Many of the spammers simply use a random group of letters followed by a
semi-random group of numbers, and viola, "you have spam!"

It is chilling to think of how much bandwidth that wastes.

Better than junkmail, though.

If we approach the newsgroup noise as spam, it might make it a little
easier to handle.

Good point. I have been doing that for a while, without really thinking
about it.

Do you think that any of us can modify Len's behavior?

Only Len can do that.

And I think he is quite happy with the way he is!

He appears to be quite pleased with himself. And extremely critical,
insulting and condemnatory of anyone who dares to disagree with him or
prove him wrong about anything.

Or Steve or Brian's?

It's up to them.

Not hardly likely!

Agreed.

I don't even want to. I like 'em all just the way they are.

You like the noise? I don't.

Oh no! But I separate the noise from the person

In some cases if you separate the noise from the person there isn't
much left!

And I agree with Carl that their behavior has helped drive away good people
like W1RFI.

That is too bad, but I liken the situation to stopping driving because
there are wild drivers out on the road.

It's more like this: Stopping driving on certain roads because of the
wild drivers on those roads.

Once I left a group because of problems with certain posters. It was an
amateur telescope making SIG. I was getting personal email nastygrams
from one member on every post I made, and a couple others seemed to
agree with him. So I left the group. A week after that, I found out the
person doing this had passed away. Turns out he was a terminal cancer
case, and was on a LOT of pain killing drugs. I felt pretty awkward for
being so p****d off at him earlier.

His behavior wasn't your doing, Mike.

Point is, maybe some people are less than pleasant, but we aren't
always sure why.

Very true. However, that does not mean we must accept their behavior
as "normal" or "acceptable".

If a person has problems with what they post, they can
avoid reading them. Not a hard thing to do, as aside from Brian changing
his addy to avoid spam, they aren't disguising themselves.

Which is what I do much of the time.

Aside from Len's use of no less than five different screen names he







that's pretty true.

Although I think that he always puts His name in the post somewhere.

No, he doesn't. In fact the reverse is true - most of Len's posts here
do not contain his name or other clear identifier. Of course he posts
here so much that if only 1 in 100 posts is clearly identified, it is
soon clear who is who.

Newsgroup BPL - very descriptive.

I think so.

73 de Jim, N2EY

Subject: Proposal to rename RRAP ... (was - New Candidate for
'Youngest
From: (N2EY)
Date: 4/5/2004 11:11 AM Central Standard Time
Message-id:

Mike Coslo wrote in message
...

Although I think that he always puts His name in the post somewhere.

No, he doesn't. In fact the reverse is true - most of Len's posts here
do not contain his name or other clear identifier. Of course he posts
here so much that if only 1 in 100 posts is clearly identified, it is
soon clear who is who.

Or he let's his ego override his situational awareness and signs his name
to a post under one of his nomme-de guerre's and let's it slip who he is...

73

Steve, K4YZ

N2EY wrote:
Mike Coslo wrote in message ...

snippage

My big problem is that one of my addys is a .edu, and it has what many
places did at one time (perhaps some still do) my initials followed by a
number.


Just askin' for it.

and they won't let me change it either! 8^(


snippage

In some cases if you separate the noise from the person there isn't
much left!


Okay, now that reminds me of one of my favorite jokes:


Q. What weighs 5 pounds and is obnoxious?

A. A (insert statehood of a person here) after an enema!


snippage



- Mike KB3EIA -

In article ,
(Holy man, still mad as heck and not taking it
any more) writes:

Mike Coslo wrote in message
...
N2EY wrote:

In article , Mike Coslo
writes:

N2EY wrote:
In article . net, "Bill
Sohl"

writes:

Newsgroup BPL, Carl. If there is an upside to this sad state of
affairs, it is pretty easy to see who all is posting the acrimony and
avoid it.
- Mike KB3EIA -

I much agree...which is why I have stopped the
posting that I used to.

I also agree with Carl's concerns and would "HOPE" that enough
of us can just ignore the obvious dumb, stupid bickering about
individuals and personalities and just try to stay on topic.

Agreed, Bill. I find myself deleting most posts here, adn ignoring
certain
regular posters because no matter how civilly they are approached, they
inevitably resort to name calling, false information and insults.

But what do we do about those who post information that is simply not
true?

Do you reply to all the spam email that you get that promises you cheap
prescription drugs, some poor schmedlock from Nigeria needs YOU to
participate in some weird scam he's pulling off, or to increase the size
of little willie to gargantuan proportions?

You make an excellent point. I used to read that stuff, but soon got to
the
point where I could tell from the subject line and sender that it was
spam, and I'd delete it unread.

You probably don't, I know I don't. Point is that 90 percent of the
email I get is worthless spam. I'm not going to control it, and my
option is therefore to opt out of email if I really can't handle it.
This newsgroup has a higher s/n ratio than my personal email.

In my case it's lower - there is more signal and less noise in my
personal
email than here. Part of that is due to the high volume of good stuff
from the various reflectors, though.

My big problem is that one of my addys is a .edu, and it has what many
places did at one time (perhaps some still do) my initials followed by a
number.

Just askin' for it.

Many of the spammers simply use a random group of letters followed by a

semi-random group of numbers, and viola, "you have spam!"

It is chilling to think of how much bandwidth that wastes.

Better than junkmail, though.

If we approach the newsgroup noise as spam, it might make it a little
easier to handle.

Good point. I have been doing that for a while, without really thinking
about it.

Do you think that any of us can modify Len's behavior?

Only Len can do that.

And I think he is quite happy with the way he is!

He appears to be quite pleased with himself. And extremely critical,
insulting and condemnatory of anyone who dares to disagree with him or
prove him wrong about anything.

Or Steve or Brian's?

It's up to them.

Not hardly likely!

Agreed.

I don't even want to. I like 'em all just the way they are.

You like the noise? I don't.

Oh no! But I separate the noise from the person

In some cases if you separate the noise from the person there isn't
much left!

And I agree with Carl that their behavior has helped drive away good
people
like W1RFI.

That is too bad, but I liken the situation to stopping driving because
there are wild drivers out on the road.

It's more like this: Stopping driving on certain roads because of the
wild drivers on those roads.

Once I left a group because of problems with certain posters. It was an
amateur telescope making SIG. I was getting personal email nastygrams
from one member on every post I made, and a couple others seemed to
agree with him. So I left the group. A week after that, I found out the
person doing this had passed away. Turns out he was a terminal cancer
case, and was on a LOT of pain killing drugs. I felt pretty awkward for
being so p****d off at him earlier.

His behavior wasn't your doing, Mike.

Point is, maybe some people are less than pleasant, but we aren't
always sure why.

Very true. However, that does not mean we must accept their behavior
as "normal" or "acceptable".

If a person has problems with what they post, they can
avoid reading them. Not a hard thing to do, as aside from Brian changing
his addy to avoid spam, they aren't disguising themselves.

Which is what I do much of the time.

Aside from Len's use of no less than five different screen names he







that's pretty true.

Although I think that he always puts His name in the post somewhere.

No, he doesn't. In fact the reverse is true - most of Len's posts here
do not contain his name or other clear identifier. Of course he posts
here so much that if only 1 in 100 posts is clearly identified, it is
soon clear who is who.

Forgive me, holiest of holy men of the Church of St. Hiram.

My name and current postal address has been given over two
dozen times in 5 electronics publications, a minimum printing of
over 50,000 per issue.

My name and current postal address appear the same on 90
documents on 22 different proceedings in the FCC Electronic
Comment Filing System.

Forgive me for the impertinence of appearing anonymous, your
emminence. I am but a humble servant of independent thought,
unable to bask in the etheral shining glow of your magnifence.


"Captain, I sense much hostility out there..." - Troi

LHA / WMD