Dave Heil wrote in message ...
William wrote:

(N2EY) wrote in message . com...
TeleTech wrote in message ...


Do people put the /W4 on their QSL cards, etc?
Is this a big deal these days?

No and no.


Maybe, maybe not. Depends if the portable designation makes you a
different "country." If you were portable KL7 or KH6 or even KP4, I'd
definitely put that on my card. Even if it weren't antoher country,
I'd still put it on my card.

bb

Yeah, sort of like T5/N0IMD. Just put it on a card.

Dave K8MN

I did. But you're not in that log book so you don't get one. Sorry.

I could send you another N0IMD/KH2 card, though. You're a legit contact there.

William wrote:

Dave Heil wrote in message ...
William wrote:

(N2EY) wrote in message . com...
TeleTech wrote in message ...


Do people put the /W4 on their QSL cards, etc?
Is this a big deal these days?

No and no.


Maybe, maybe not. Depends if the portable designation makes you a
different "country." If you were portable KL7 or KH6 or even KP4, I'd
definitely put that on my card. Even if it weren't antoher country,
I'd still put it on my card.

bb

Yeah, sort of like T5/N0IMD. Just put it on a card.

I did. But you're not in that log book so you don't get one. Sorry.

We don't know that the logbook exists. We don't know that T5/N0IMD
existed. No one seems to have worked it. It doesn't show up in packet
cluster records. It doesn't show up in DXCC applications. You must
have cancelled everything through Google.

I could send you another N0IMD/KH2 card, though. You're a legit contact there.

I didn't ask for the first one. You requested one of mine through my
QSL manager.

Dave K8MN

In article , Dave Heil
writes:

Yeah, sort of like T5/N0IMD. Just put it on a card.

I did. But you're not in that log book so you don't get one. Sorry.

We don't know that the logbook exists.

I think it does.

We don't know that T5/N0IMD existed.

I think it did.

No one seems to have worked it. It doesn't show up in packet
cluster records. It doesn't show up in DXCC applications. You must
have cancelled everything through Google.

Maybe.

Or consider this:

Suppose you and I found ourselves in a place with no functioning government.

Suppose we had radio sets capable of operation on amateur frequencies. Say on 2
meters, or 440, or 6 meters, or whatever.

Suppose whatever authority existed there at the time said it was OK for us to
use the radio sets.

Could we not work each other and use our stateside callsigns?

Could we not keep logbooks and exchange QSL cards?



73 de Jim, N2EY

Subject: Call Area Etiquette
From: PAMNO (N2EY)
Date: 6/5/2004 6:59 PM Central Standard Time
Message-id:

In article , Dave Heil
writes:

We don't know that T5/N0IMD existed.

I think it did.

Why? Because he "said so"...?!?!

No one seems to have worked it. It doesn't show up in packet
cluster records. It doesn't show up in DXCC applications. You must
have cancelled everything through Google.

Maybe.

Or consider this:

Suppose you and I found ourselves in a place with no functioning government.

Suppose we had radio sets capable of operation on amateur frequencies. Say on
2
meters, or 440, or 6 meters, or whatever.

Suppose whatever authority existed there at the time said it was OK for us to
use the radio sets.

Could we not work each other and use our stateside callsigns?

Could we not keep logbooks and exchange QSL cards?

Sure you can...ie: Antarctica

However even there there are international agreements on who can grant what
authority, to whom, and under what circumstances.

Brain was allegedly in a military unit under United Nations auspices, and
it seems he did NOTHING to get the PROPER authorizations to do what he CLAIMED
to do.

He won't even provide us with the callsign of ONE station he "worked"
while in Somalia.

No proof = Didn't happen.

73

Steve, K4YZ

In article , (Steve
Robeson K4CAP) writes:

Subject: Call Area Etiquette
From: (Steve Robeson K4CAP)
Date: 06 Jun 2004 13:21:45 GMT

Subject: Call Area Etiquette
From: PAMNO (N2EY)
Date: 6/5/2004 6:59 PM Central Standard Time
Message-id:

In article , Dave Heil
writes:

We don't know that T5/N0IMD existed.

I think it did.

Why? Because he "said so"...?!?!

That's one reason. Lacking any proof to the contrary, I'm not going to call
someone a liar.

No one seems to have worked it. It doesn't show up in packet
cluster records. It doesn't show up in DXCC applications. You must
have cancelled everything through Google.

Maybe.

Or consider this:

Suppose you and I found ourselves in a place with no functioning government.

Suppose we had radio sets capable of operation on amateur frequencies. Say
on 2 meters, or 440, or 6 meters, or whatever.

Suppose whatever authority existed there at the time said it was OK for us
to use the radio sets.

Could we not work each other and use our stateside callsigns?

Could we not keep logbooks and exchange QSL cards?

Sure you can...ie: Antarctica

Well, there you have it. It could have happened, and all of the above-named
conditions would have been met.

However even there there are international agreements on who can grant
what authority, to whom, and under what circumstances.

Of course. I didn't say such operation would be 100% in agreement with
international requirements, just that it could happen.

Brain was allegedly in a military unit under United Nations auspices,
and
it seems he did NOTHING to get the PROPER authorizations to do what he
CLAIMED to do.

Maybe. But that has no bearing on whether the alleged /T5 operation took place,
whether logbooks existed, and whether QSLs were exchanged.

Remember that all it would take to meet all of these conditions would be one
QSO in a ham band using stateside calls and portable designation.

He won't even provide us with the callsign of ONE station he "worked"
while in Somalia.

Of course not. Same goes for bands/modes/antennas/rigs used. But the lack of
detail doesn't mean the alleged operation didn't happen.

The lack of detail is a different issue completely.

No proof = Didn't happen.

Not at all.

No proof = Reasonable doubt.

Nothing more or less.

73 de Jim, N2EY

Subject: Call Area Etiquette
From: PAMNO (N2EY)
Date: 6/6/2004 11:58 AM Central Standard Time
Message-id:

In article ,
(Steve
Robeson K4CAP) writes:

Subject: Call Area Etiquette
From: PAMNO (N2EY)
Date: 6/5/2004 6:59 PM Central Standard Time
Message-id:

In article , Dave Heil

writes:

We don't know that T5/N0IMD existed.

I think it did.

Why? Because he "said so"...?!?!

That's one reason. Lacking any proof to the contrary, I'm not going to call
someone a liar.

Then you're a bit more liberal than I am, I guess! =)

I figure after two years of being asked yet proactively dodging the ante
earns Brain the title.

Sure you can...ie: Antarctica

Well, there you have it. It could have happened, and all of the above-named
conditions would have been met.

And I have yet to meet anyone who WAS "there" that didn't have SOME
memento of the occassion. I know three guys who were /KC4 who at least had
pics taken at the McMurdo and Little America signs outside the outpost's
complex.

However even there there are international agreements on who can grant
what authority, to whom, and under what circumstances.

Of course. I didn't say such operation would be 100% in agreement with
international requirements, just that it could happen.

Sure it could...and J.Lo might leave her NEW husband and show up on my
doorstep begging for me to pleasure her...

I ain't holding my breath. However if she DOES show up, you can be darned
sure I will have SOME sort of proof before making outlandish claims!

Brain was allegedly in a military unit under United Nations auspices,
and
it seems he did NOTHING to get the PROPER authorizations to do what he
CLAIMED to do.

Maybe. But that has no bearing on whether the alleged /T5 operation took
place,
whether logbooks existed, and whether QSLs were exchanged.

It has all the bearing in the world, Jim.

How can you say that a lack of proper authorization to operate DOESN'T
ahve bearing on the operation...?!?! There's not a single Amateur Radio award
by any organization that I am aware of that is not predicated on the legitimacy
of the operating credentials of the claimant.

He can "operate" all he wants to and exchange a ton of QSL cards, but no
license (or authorization or permit or certificate...what ever you want to call
it...) and all that operation is worthless.

Remember that all it would take to meet all of these conditions would be one
QSO in a ham band using stateside calls and portable designation.

As long as the legal criteria was met.

In Brain's case, it appears as though it wasn't. He was not in
Antarctica...he was allegedly in Somalia.

He won't even provide us with the callsign of ONE station he "worked"
while in Somalia.

Of course not. Same goes for bands/modes/antennas/rigs used. But the lack of
detail doesn't mean the alleged operation didn't happen.

Please tell me you're just playing "Devil's Advocate", Jim...!

The lack of detail is a different issue completely.

You've GOT to be kidding me.

I can tell you in INTIMATE detail the sation I had set up in my barracks
on Oki in 81...Equipment, antennas, I even still have the log. Although I
don't have my copy of the AMRS authorization, I can give specifics about
who/what/where, callsign, and even have a couple of QSL cards from folks I
worked...

He can't even TELL us ONE callsign of anyone he worked...?!?!

No proof = Didn't happen.

Not at all.

No proof = Reasonable doubt.

No proof on short notice = reasonable doubt.

No proof after two years = didn't happen.

Nothing more or less.

His "nothing more" can't be much less than what it's been, Jim!

73

Steve, K4YZ

In article , (Mighty
Morphing Power Ham Newsgroup Ranger) writes:

Subject: Call Area Etiquette
From: PAMNO (N2EY)
Date: 6/6/2004 11:58 AM Central Standard Time
Message-id:

In article ,
(Steve
Robeson K4CAP) writes:

Subject: Call Area Etiquette
From: PAMNO (N2EY)
Date: 6/5/2004 6:59 PM Central Standard Time
Message-id:

In article , Dave Heil

writes:

We don't know that T5/N0IMD existed.

I think it did.

Why? Because he "said so"...?!?!

That's one reason. Lacking any proof to the contrary, I'm not going to call
someone a liar.

Then you're a bit more liberal than I am, I guess! =)

I figure after two years of being asked yet proactively dodging the ante
earns Brain the title.

"Dodging?" :-)

Nursie, the Hero of "seven hostile actions?"

[as yet unidentified as to where and when... :-) ]

Nursie who stated (flatly): "MARS is amateur radio?"

Nursie who knows all about electronics engineering whose entire
electronics career has been a few months at a mid-sized TN
set-top box maker as a Purchasing Agent?

Sure you can...ie: Antarctica

Well, there you have it. It could have happened, and all of the above-named
conditions would have been met.

And I have yet to meet anyone who WAS "there" that didn't have SOME
memento of the occassion. I know three guys who were /KC4 who at least had
pics taken at the McMurdo and Little America signs outside the outpost's
complex.

Right..."seven hostile actions!" Lots of identifying "mementos" there.

:-)

However even there there are international agreements on who can grant
what authority, to whom, and under what circumstances.

Of course. I didn't say such operation would be 100% in agreement with
international requirements, just that it could happen.

Sure it could...and J.Lo might leave her NEW husband and show up on my
doorstep begging for me to pleasure her...

Oh, my...Fantasy Island time again! :-)

I ain't holding my breath. However if she DOES show up, you can be
darned
sure I will have SOME sort of proof before making outlandish claims!

You must have gotten some 190 proof to even think such a thing!

:-)

Brain was allegedly in a military unit under United Nations auspices, and
it seems he did NOTHING to get the PROPER authorizations to do what he
CLAIMED to do.

Maybe. But that has no bearing on whether the alleged /T5 operation took
place,
whether logbooks existed, and whether QSLs were exchanged.

It has all the bearing in the world, Jim.

How can you say that a lack of proper authorization to operate DOESN'T
ahve bearing on the operation...?!?! There's not a single Amateur Radio award
by any organization that I am aware of that is not predicated on the
legitimacy
of the operating credentials of the claimant.

Oh, my, there he goes...drinking and deriving... :-)

Ah...there was NO mention of any "awards" or even "dxpedition"
or anything like that.

Brian was THERE, on assignment, in the military, and subject to
military authority.

But, nursie doesn't seem to want to obey any military since he
stated "MARS is amateur radio" and never once admitted that
the military (from DoD downwards) stated that MARS is a
military radio service.

He can "operate" all he wants to and exchange a ton of QSL cards, but no
license (or authorization or permit or certificate...what ever you want to
call
it...) and all that operation is worthless.

Nursie be da Final Authority.

Nothing in radio takes place without he be da Judge! :-)

Remember that all it would take to meet all of these conditions would be one
QSO in a ham band using stateside calls and portable designation.

As long as the legal criteria was met.

It's called "obeying the UCMJ." [ever hear of it?]

In Brain's case, it appears as though it wasn't. He was not in
Antarctica...he was allegedly in Somalia.

Nursie is also supposed to have "seven hostile actions" in his
jacket. :-)

Where and when be those "hostile actions?" :-)

He won't even provide us with the callsign of ONE station he "worked"
while in Somalia.

Of course not. Same goes for bands/modes/antennas/rigs used. But the lack of
detail doesn't mean the alleged operation didn't happen.

Please tell me you're just playing "Devil's Advocate", Jim...!

Running out of support for your nastygram statements? :-)

The lack of detail is a different issue completely.

You've GOT to be kidding me.

Nursie obviously cannot take any view opposite of his. :-)

I can tell you in INTIMATE detail the sation I had set up in my barracks
on Oki in 81...Equipment, antennas, I even still have the log. Although I
don't have my copy of the AMRS authorization, I can give specifics about
who/what/where, callsign, and even have a couple of QSL cards from folks I
worked...

Okay, tell us. In "INTIMATE" detail. [dreams about J.Lo. don't have
to be included]

FULL DETAIL. Official permission, da whole magilla.

He can't even TELL us ONE callsign of anyone he worked...?!?!

No proof = Didn't happen.

Not at all.

No proof = Reasonable doubt.

No proof on short notice = reasonable doubt.

No proof after two years = didn't happen.

Proof on "seven hostile actions?" [didn't happen]

Proof on "MARS is amateur radio?" [DoD says otherwise]


Nothing more or less.

His "nothing more" can't be much less than what it's been, Jim!

Poor nursie, still hating and raging, meanmouthing everyone who
doesn't believe him...and then wanting "meaningful discussion" !

Fine example of an amateur extra class radio amateur.

Too bad the ARRL doesn't have a "Cover Plague" award. :-)

LHA / WMD

(Steve Robeson K4CAP) wrote in message ...
Subject: Call Area Etiquette
From: PAMNO (N2EY)
Date: 6/6/2004 11:58 AM Central Standard Time
Message-id:

In article ,
(Steve
Robeson K4CAP) writes:

Subject: Call Area Etiquette
From: PAMNO (N2EY)
Date: 6/5/2004 6:59 PM Central Standard Time
Message-id:

In article , Dave Heil

writes:

We don't know that T5/N0IMD existed.

I think it did.

Why? Because he "said so"...?!?!

That's one reason. Lacking any proof to the contrary, I'm not going to call
someone a liar.

Then you're a bit more liberal than I am, I guess! =)

Not liberal. Accurate.

I figure after two years of being asked yet proactively dodging the ante
earns Brain the title.

Nope. A liar is someone who intentionally says things he/she knows are
untrue in an attempt to deceive. For all we know, the statements made
about the alleged operation by the alleged operator could all be true.

Sure you can...ie: Antarctica

Well, there you have it. It could have happened, and all of the above-named
conditions would have been met.

And I have yet to meet anyone who WAS "there" that didn't have SOME
memento of the occassion. I know three guys who were /KC4 who at least had
pics taken at the McMurdo and Little America signs outside the outpost's
complex.

But the alleged operation wasn't allegedly in Antartica.

However even there there are international agreements on who can grant
what authority, to whom, and under what circumstances.

Of course. I didn't say such operation would be 100% in agreement with
international requirements, just that it could happen.

Heck, it might not even be 1% in agreement. But it still could have
happened.

Sure it could...and J.Lo might leave her NEW husband and show up on my
doorstep begging for me to pleasure her...

I ain't holding my breath. However if she DOES show up, you can be darned
sure I will have SOME sort of proof before making outlandish claims!

That's you.


Brain was allegedly in a military unit under United Nations auspices,
and
it seems he did NOTHING to get the PROPER authorizations to do what he
CLAIMED to do.

Maybe. But that has no bearing on whether the alleged /T5 operation took
place,
whether logbooks existed, and whether QSLs were exchanged.

It has all the bearing in the world, Jim.

Not at all. Either it happened or it didn't. If it was unauthorized,
yet it happened, it still happened. It just doesn't count for any
awards.

How can you say that a lack of proper authorization to operate DOESN'T
ahve bearing on the operation...?!?!

I'm saying it doesn't have any bearing on whether it happened or not.

There's not a single Amateur Radio award
by any organization that I am aware of that is not predicated on the legitimacy
of the operating credentials of the claimant.

Sure. And to our knowledge nobody has claimed any QSOs with the
alleged operation for any awards.

He can "operate" all he wants to and exchange a ton of QSL cards, but no
license (or authorization or permit or certificate...what ever you want to call
it...) and all that operation is worthless.

Of course. But the *claims* that there was an operation would still be
true.

Remember that all it would take to meet all of these conditions would be one
QSO in a ham band using stateside calls and portable designation.

As long as the legal criteria was met.

Even if they weren't, it would still be an operation. Just not a legit
one.

In Brain's case, it appears as though it wasn't. He was not in
Antarctica...he was allegedly in Somalia.

He won't even provide us with the callsign of ONE station he "worked"
while in Somalia.

Of course not. Same goes for bands/modes/antennas/rigs used. But the lack of
detail doesn't mean the alleged operation didn't happen.

Please tell me you're just playing "Devil's Advocate", Jim...!

I'm simply being accurate.

Folks keep focusing on the wrong things.

What has actually been claimed? Operation from /T5, nothing more. No
mention of modes, bands, rigs, number of QSOs, etc.

Can't you see that if even *one* QSO was made, on *any* ham band, over
*any* distance, it would constitute "operation from /T5"? Even if said
operation was not in agreement with international agreements?

The lack of detail is a different issue completely.

You've GOT to be kidding me.

Not at all.

I can tell you in INTIMATE detail the sation I had set up in my barracks
on Oki in 81...Equipment, antennas, I even still have the log. Although I
don't have my copy of the AMRS authorization, I can give specifics about
who/what/where, callsign, and even have a couple of QSL cards from folks I
worked...

That's you.

Being secretive isn't lying. It's...being secretive. Of course the
lack of detail reduces credibility, but it doesn't make the secretive
person a liar.

He can't even TELL us ONE callsign of anyone he worked...?!?!

Not can't.

Won't.

Big difference.

No proof = Didn't happen.

Not at all.

No proof = Reasonable doubt.

No proof on short notice = reasonable doubt.

No proof after two years = didn't happen.

Not at all, Steve. Objective reality states that if a thing happened,
it happened whether anyone believes it happened or not.

Nothing more or less.

His "nothing more" can't be much less than what it's been, Jim!

Of course.

Don't you realize by now that you won't get answers to your questions?

73 de Jim, N2EY

"N2EY" wrote in message
...

No proof = Reasonable doubt.

Nothing more or less.

You just don't get it, do you Jim. On rrap you must either agree with
K4CAP/K4YZ and accede to every whimsical demand of his, or you are a
low-life lying scum sucking weasel. Reasonable doubt is not an option.

K4CAP/K4YZ ** IS ** amateur radio.

73,

Avery

Subject: Call Area Etiquette
From: "Avery Hightower"
Date: 6/7/2004 3:57 PM Central Standard Time
Message-id: .net

"N2EY" wrote in message
...

No proof = Reasonable doubt.

Nothing more or less.

You just don't get it, do you Jim. On rrap you must either agree with
K4CAP/K4YZ and accede to every whimsical demand of his, or you are a
low-life lying scum sucking weasel. Reasonable doubt is not an option.

What "reasonable doubt"...?!?! Two years of dodging requests for
validation of claims made...?!?!

And what "demands"...?!?! Again...Someone makes claims of having had
experiences that allegedly makes them "knowldegeable" of certain skills or
techniques, yet NO EVIDENCE of having actually done them...

Eh, Brain...?!?!

Steve, K4YZ