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Observations and predictions on the NPRM
Observations:
- Although the majority of individuals who commented on the 18 proposals supported code testing, FCC proposes to completely eliminate it. - There were a lot of ideas in the 18 proposals other than the code test. FCC simply denied all suggestions for change *except* dumping Element 1. Free upgrades for Advanceds and Novices? New entry level classes? More HF bandspace/modes for Novices and Tech Pluses? "No" to all of them. - The changes of 2000 brought a lot of upgrades and some short-term growth, but now the number of individuals with unexpired US ham licenses is almost 10,000 below what it was in May of 2000. Nor has there been any sort of "techno-revolution" from the reductions in code testing. Predictions: - There will be a lot of debate and commentary. But in the end FCC will just dump Element 1 and make no other changes. - There will be a lot of upgrades and a short-term peak in licenses. But not long term growth. - The HF/MF bands will not be overrun with more activity. - There will not be a "revolution" in technology used by hams brought by the new folks. - The focus will shift to a debate about widening the 'phone subbands or even having no mode subbands at all. 73 de Jim, N2EY |
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K4YZ wrote: wrote: Observations: - Although the majority of individuals who commented on the 18 proposals supported code testing, FCC proposes to completely eliminate it. Amazing, isn't it? why that is the way the system is set up why are you amazed it is being followed They ask for public opinion then say "We'll do what we want anyway..." they have to ask for it so they do you can't make listen to it gorw up and learn how the world works - There were a lot of ideas in the 18 proposals other than the code test. FCC simply denied all suggestions for change *except* dumping Element 1. Free upgrades for Advanceds and Novices? New entry level classes? More HF bandspace/modes for Novices and Tech Pluses? "No" to all of them. They said it in 98...They want to reduce all administrative burden to an absolute minimum... The fewer regulations there are on the books, the less enforcement they have to do. I am surprised they haven't tried to "outsource" their enforcement duties. I do hear rumous they have looked into that - The changes of 2000 brought a lot of upgrades and some short-term growth, but now the number of individuals with unexpired US ham licenses is almost 10,000 below what it was in May of 2000. Nor has there been any sort of "techno-revolution" from the reductions in code testing. Predictions: - There will be a lot of debate and commentary. But in the end FCC will just dump Element 1 and make no other changes. I'm still holding out for 5WPM for Extra, but prudence says you're right. a few sign of light stevie - There will be a lot of upgrades and a short-term peak in licenses. But not long term growth. There never has been, there never will be. Reducing testing, either the number of written test or the 13/20WPM Code tests, has not done a thing to move the service forward. esp with attitudes like your it will be hard - The HF/MF bands will not be overrun with more activity. Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.....For a while there will be...All those new "Generals" will plop down some bucks on HF stations, work some DX, then go back to whining about how tough it is to get to Extra. yea right grow up and drink your sour grapes - There will not be a "revolution" in technology used by hams brought by the new folks. They've had their chance since 1991 to do that if they wanted. if they wanted? what have you done to advance the radio in your time as a ham I have tried to add a mode or band or something each year to my operating I have not made it (was just too busy moving and building) but I try you just want to sit back and let "Them" carry the freight - The focus will shift to a debate about widening the 'phone subbands or even having no mode subbands at all. As I was saying in another thread...! been around as long as I have been likely longer 73 Steve, K4YZ |
an_old_friend wrote: K4YZ wrote: wrote: Observations: - Although the majority of individuals who commented on the 18 proposals supported code testing, FCC proposes to completely eliminate it. Amazing, isn't it? why that is the way the system is set up why are you amazed it is being followed It's not being followed if the public says "A" and the government does "B". They ask for public opinion then say "We'll do what we want anyway..." they have to ask for it so they do you can't make listen to it Sure you can. gorw up and learn how the world works Why don't you, Deviant Boy? - There were a lot of ideas in the 18 proposals other than the code test. FCC simply denied all suggestions for change *except* dumping Element 1. Free upgrades for Advanceds and Novices? New entry level classes? More HF bandspace/modes for Novices and Tech Pluses? "No" to all of them. They said it in 98...They want to reduce all administrative burden to an absolute minimum... The fewer regulations there are on the books, the less enforcement they have to do. I am surprised they haven't tried to "outsource" their enforcement duties. I do hear rumous they have looked into that Uh huh. Rumors. Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight. - The changes of 2000 brought a lot of upgrades and some short-term growth, but now the number of individuals with unexpired US ham licenses is almost 10,000 below what it was in May of 2000. Nor has there been any sort of "techno-revolution" from the reductions in code testing. Predictions: - There will be a lot of debate and commentary. But in the end FCC will just dump Element 1 and make no other changes. I'm still holding out for 5WPM for Extra, but prudence says you're right. a few sign of light stevie - There will be a lot of upgrades and a short-term peak in licenses. But not long term growth. There never has been, there never will be. Reducing testing, either the number of written test or the 13/20WPM Code tests, has not done a thing to move the service forward. esp with attitudes like your it will be hard It's not MY attitude that needs to be dealt with, Markie. It's the attitudes of the people who keep making these assinine assertions about how this change or that change is going to be the salvation of the Amateur Radio service. The FCC has said it so many times now they even believe thier own rhetoric and repeat it in this NPRM. - The HF/MF bands will not be overrun with more activity. Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.....For a while there will be...All those new "Generals" will plop down some bucks on HF stations, work some DX, then go back to whining about how tough it is to get to Extra. yea right It happened with "Novice Enhancement" It happened with the introduction of the NCT. It happened with the last Restructuring round. What makes Deviant Markie even the least bit doubtful that it won't happen THIS time? grow up and drink your sour grapes What sour grapes? It happened. Three times. - There will not be a "revolution" in technology used by hams brought by the new folks. They've had their chance since 1991 to do that if they wanted. if they wanted? If they wanted, Markie. W H E R E are all the "engineering types that the NCT was supposed to bring into Amateur Radio? what have you done to advance the radio in your time as a ham A lot more than you, Markie. Starting with being an Elmer and a VE. Add to that ARES, MARS, etc etc etc I have tried to add a mode or band or something each year to my operating I have not made it (was just too busy moving and building) but I try you just want to sit back and let "Them" carry the freight There's that "carry the freight" line again. Still not applicable, but at least you spelled "freight" right this time. - The focus will shift to a debate about widening the 'phone subbands or even having no mode subbands at all. As I was saying in another thread...! been around as long as I have been likely longer No doubt. Steve, K4YZ |
K4YZ wrote: an_old_friend wrote: K4YZ wrote: wrote: Observations: - Although the majority of individuals who commented on the 18 proposals supported code testing, FCC proposes to completely eliminate it. Amazing, isn't it? why that is the way the system is set up why are you amazed it is being followed It's not being followed if the public says "A" and the government does "B". yes it is the public is allowed coment, not control the system as I understand it at one time did not even allow coment by the public this is not a democratic govt but a republican one They ask for public opinion then say "We'll do what we want anyway..." they have to ask for it so they do you can't make listen to it Sure you can. not realy you can try gorw up and learn how the world works Why don't you, Deviant Boy? I have. I know how it works. you don't - There were a lot of ideas in the 18 proposals other than the code test. FCC simply denied all suggestions for change *except* dumping Element 1. Free upgrades for Advanceds and Novices? New entry level classes? More HF bandspace/modes for Novices and Tech Pluses? "No" to all of them. They said it in 98...They want to reduce all administrative burden to an absolute minimum... The fewer regulations there are on the books, the less enforcement they have to do. I am surprised they haven't tried to "outsource" their enforcement duties. I do hear rumous they have looked into that Uh huh. Rumors. even in agreeing with you can't be polite Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight. - The changes of 2000 brought a lot of upgrades and some short-term growth, but now the number of individuals with unexpired US ham licenses is almost 10,000 below what it was in May of 2000. Nor has there been any sort of "techno-revolution" from the reductions in code testing. Predictions: - There will be a lot of debate and commentary. But in the end FCC will just dump Element 1 and make no other changes. I'm still holding out for 5WPM for Extra, but prudence says you're right. a few sign of light stevie - There will be a lot of upgrades and a short-term peak in licenses. But not long term growth. There never has been, there never will be. Reducing testing, either the number of written test or the 13/20WPM Code tests, has not done a thing to move the service forward. esp with attitudes like your it will be hard It's not MY attitude that needs to be dealt with, Markie. it certainly is as you diatribe against Kim clearly shows It's the attitudes of the people who keep making these assinine assertions about how this change or that change is going to be the salvation of the Amateur Radio service. Nobody is saying that only the oponents of change are saying someone is saying it It will certainly help but you may yet manage to help kill the ars stevie I hope you will then be happy but I doubt it you likely will find some way in your head of blaming me personaly The FCC has said it so many times now they even believe thier own rhetoric and repeat it in this NPRM. You saying the FCC was lying when it said it found no reason for code testing besides the treaty. It found none, none have been advanced that meet the laugh test, and now they are lowing the boom on your egomania - The HF/MF bands will not be overrun with more activity. Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.....For a while there will be...All those new "Generals" will plop down some bucks on HF stations, work some DX, then go back to whining about how tough it is to get to Extra. yea right It happened with "Novice Enhancement" wouldn't know, but I doubt it It happened with the introduction of the NCT. not likely, it almost can't have It happened with the last Restructuring round. nope I was there What makes Deviant Markie even the least bit doubtful that it won't happen THIS time? looking at reality grow up and drink your sour grapes What sour grapes? yours the sour grapes you ares pilling all over the group It happened. Three times. I know better on at least one of those case - There will not be a "revolution" in technology used by hams brought by the new folks. They've had their chance since 1991 to do that if they wanted. if they wanted? If they wanted, Markie. right you are lazy and let other do your work for you W H E R E are all the "engineering types that the NCT was supposed to bring into Amateur Radio? Stevie can't coment on the claims made by those before NCT but I have seen your (lack of) track record for honesty and do not accept your accessment beside it is clear you did not do YOUR part in bring that about what have you done to advance the radio in your time as a ham A lot more than you, Markie. Starting with being an Elmer and a VE. Add to that ARES, MARS, etc etc etc realy lets see I am not aloowed to be a VE done ares stuff, not done anything with Mars. I elmer (even elmer generals and extras in digital modes) but all that is operating. what have you done to advance radio? I have tried to add a mode or band or something each year to my operating I have not made it (was just too busy moving and building) but I try you just want to sit back and let "Them" carry the freight There's that "carry the freight" line again. yes becuase it is true you want everyone else to work while you rest on your laurels Still not applicable, but at least you spelled "freight" right this time. yep it is you still have not advanced any occasion when you have even tried something new on the air - The focus will shift to a debate about widening the 'phone subbands or even having no mode subbands at all. As I was saying in another thread...! been around as long as I have been likely longer No doubt. Steve, K4YZ |
Can you blame them for not wanting comment.
Bet that only fills their mailbox with those expecting special treatment, action for historical reasons, and a demand for them to be observant of the writers wants and desires! John "an_old_friend" wrote in message ups.com... K4YZ wrote: an_old_friend wrote: K4YZ wrote: wrote: Observations: - Although the majority of individuals who commented on the 18 proposals supported code testing, FCC proposes to completely eliminate it. Amazing, isn't it? why that is the way the system is set up why are you amazed it is being followed It's not being followed if the public says "A" and the government does "B". yes it is the public is allowed coment, not control the system as I understand it at one time did not even allow coment by the public this is not a democratic govt but a republican one They ask for public opinion then say "We'll do what we want anyway..." they have to ask for it so they do you can't make listen to it Sure you can. not realy you can try gorw up and learn how the world works Why don't you, Deviant Boy? I have. I know how it works. you don't - There were a lot of ideas in the 18 proposals other than the code test. FCC simply denied all suggestions for change *except* dumping Element 1. Free upgrades for Advanceds and Novices? New entry level classes? More HF bandspace/modes for Novices and Tech Pluses? "No" to all of them. They said it in 98...They want to reduce all administrative burden to an absolute minimum... The fewer regulations there are on the books, the less enforcement they have to do. I am surprised they haven't tried to "outsource" their enforcement duties. I do hear rumous they have looked into that Uh huh. Rumors. even in agreeing with you can't be polite Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight. - The changes of 2000 brought a lot of upgrades and some short-term growth, but now the number of individuals with unexpired US ham licenses is almost 10,000 below what it was in May of 2000. Nor has there been any sort of "techno-revolution" from the reductions in code testing. Predictions: - There will be a lot of debate and commentary. But in the end FCC will just dump Element 1 and make no other changes. I'm still holding out for 5WPM for Extra, but prudence says you're right. a few sign of light stevie - There will be a lot of upgrades and a short-term peak in licenses. But not long term growth. There never has been, there never will be. Reducing testing, either the number of written test or the 13/20WPM Code tests, has not done a thing to move the service forward. esp with attitudes like your it will be hard It's not MY attitude that needs to be dealt with, Markie. it certainly is as you diatribe against Kim clearly shows It's the attitudes of the people who keep making these assinine assertions about how this change or that change is going to be the salvation of the Amateur Radio service. Nobody is saying that only the oponents of change are saying someone is saying it It will certainly help but you may yet manage to help kill the ars stevie I hope you will then be happy but I doubt it you likely will find some way in your head of blaming me personaly The FCC has said it so many times now they even believe thier own rhetoric and repeat it in this NPRM. You saying the FCC was lying when it said it found no reason for code testing besides the treaty. It found none, none have been advanced that meet the laugh test, and now they are lowing the boom on your egomania - The HF/MF bands will not be overrun with more activity. Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.....For a while there will be...All those new "Generals" will plop down some bucks on HF stations, work some DX, then go back to whining about how tough it is to get to Extra. yea right It happened with "Novice Enhancement" wouldn't know, but I doubt it It happened with the introduction of the NCT. not likely, it almost can't have It happened with the last Restructuring round. nope I was there What makes Deviant Markie even the least bit doubtful that it won't happen THIS time? looking at reality grow up and drink your sour grapes What sour grapes? yours the sour grapes you ares pilling all over the group It happened. Three times. I know better on at least one of those case - There will not be a "revolution" in technology used by hams brought by the new folks. They've had their chance since 1991 to do that if they wanted. if they wanted? If they wanted, Markie. right you are lazy and let other do your work for you W H E R E are all the "engineering types that the NCT was supposed to bring into Amateur Radio? Stevie can't coment on the claims made by those before NCT but I have seen your (lack of) track record for honesty and do not accept your accessment beside it is clear you did not do YOUR part in bring that about what have you done to advance the radio in your time as a ham A lot more than you, Markie. Starting with being an Elmer and a VE. Add to that ARES, MARS, etc etc etc realy lets see I am not aloowed to be a VE done ares stuff, not done anything with Mars. I elmer (even elmer generals and extras in digital modes) but all that is operating. what have you done to advance radio? I have tried to add a mode or band or something each year to my operating I have not made it (was just too busy moving and building) but I try you just want to sit back and let "Them" carry the freight There's that "carry the freight" line again. yes becuase it is true you want everyone else to work while you rest on your laurels Still not applicable, but at least you spelled "freight" right this time. yep it is you still have not advanced any occasion when you have even tried something new on the air - The focus will shift to a debate about widening the 'phone subbands or even having no mode subbands at all. As I was saying in another thread...! been around as long as I have been likely longer No doubt. Steve, K4YZ |
From: Michael Coslo on Jul 22, 11:03 am
wrote: Observations: - Although the majority of individuals who commented on the 18 proposals supported code testing, FCC proposes to completely eliminate it. That "observation" is ERRONEOUS unless the statistics work can be presented to "prove" that the "majority 'supported' code testing." - There were a lot of ideas in the 18 proposals other than the code test. FCC simply denied all suggestions for change *except* dumping Element 1. Free upgrades for Advanceds and Novices? New entry level classes? More HF bandspace/modes for Novices and Tech Pluses? "No" to all of them. - The changes of 2000 brought a lot of upgrades and some short-term growth, but now the number of individuals with unexpired US ham licenses is almost 10,000 below what it was in May of 2000. Nor has there been any sort of "techno-revolution" from the reductions in code testing. Again, an ERRONEOUS observation based on rather public data websites showing that the peak of licensee numbers happened in July of 2003...and the drop to present-day numbers was only TWO-THIRDS of that "10,000." Predictions: - There will not be a "revolution" in technology used by hams brought by the new folks. No, certainly not brought about by the new folks - as a group. But I don't doubt that some of the new folks may very well involved. What are you saying in that last sentence? Since when has "a group" brought about sudden changes (a "revolution")? Nearly ALL technical innovation in amateur radio has been brought on by INDIVIDUALS or individual corporations. - The focus will shift to a debate about widening the 'phone subbands or even having no mode subbands at all. Yawn! That won't be anywhere near as much fun as the Element 1 debate! TS One more thing that will happen, and I hope it doesn't. I anticipate a bit of class warfare, as (some of) the code tested try to establish superiority over the great unwashed who enter the ARS. Great leaping whatzits! These Mighty Macho Morsemen have been making "superiority" noises over others for DECADES! The "class warfare" stuff was what created the old Byzantine CLASS SYSTEM in U.S. ham radio!!! Quite frankly, that will make those so called elite a worse problem than the newbies coming into the service. What you mean NOW, kimosabe? Try 40 to 20 years before now. Seen it. Part of the reason I never bothered with an amateur radio license was the attitudes of the vocal yokels and their "authorized by the federal government" importance and "superiority." Now will be a time for Elmering and openness. I've sat and listened to enough grumbling about Nickel Extras such as myself, right to my face, from OT's who haven't done a thing for the service for years, talk about how "Any idiot can become a Ham now." This happens more often than it should. Total agreement with you on that! I intend to provide as much help to the newcomers as possible, instead of grousing about the "good old days", and steely eyed F.C.C testing agents. :-) That I support Element 1 testing is of no consequence to the new people. I suggest that the Ham who wants to be thought of as superior establish that superiority by example, not by grousing or ridiculing the new folks. Foster the idea that good manners and technical acumen is a good thing. Will you nominate K4YZ to lead that group? :-) :-) :-) Just some thoughts..... ...and mine, SUPPORTING the elimination of the morse code test. bit bit |
Predictions: - There will be a lot of debate and commentary. But in the end FCC will just dump Element 1 and make no other changes. Probably ...can't see much of anything else happening of note .. - There will be a lot of upgrades and a short-term peak in licenses. But not long term growth. Definately ....I don't really see a mass exodus from 2 meters to the HF phone bands ....come to think about it there isn't a heck of a lot going on about the 2 meter band here either ...... - The HF/MF bands will not be overrun with more activity. I hope that I am wrong but I do agree .... I think that the majority of those who want to be on HF would already be there .... one thing fer sure is that they ain't gonna be on CW ..... again wherein lies the true sadness ..... - There will not be a "revolution" in technology used by hams brought by the new folks. Wait a second Jim ....I know this will happen ...the no-code tech business was just too early and on the wrong bands .... give 'em 6 months and we will all be using those new whizz bang modes with a half watt into a 2 foot antenna on 20 meters ... I may dare say that DXCC will be available to all with in 48 hours with fantistic influx of MIT and CMU grads ..... I personally know 20 engineers who have avoided getting their ticket due to the CW requirement .... 15 of them called me last night to see when the next nocode HF test will be .........yeahhh right .... - The focus will shift to a debate about widening the 'phone subbands or even having no mode subbands at all. I only want Lebensraum fom my people ..... just a little ...... besides the propagation on the freebands have been iffy at best of late ........ That is a for sure there Jim ...the NC tact will rear its head into the true reason of its existance ....we will be calling each other citizen as the guillotine falls on the neck of the CW subbands ..... as crickets can be heard between QSOs on both phone and CW ....... 73 de Jim, N2EY Back to 40 CW and listening for hints of that new whizbang mode ........ 73 KI3R Belle Vernon Pa .... |
- There will be a lot of debate and commentary. But in the end FCC will just dump Element 1 and make no other changes. As far as the FCC is concerned, they are just a regulatory agency. If something serves no regulatory purpose, then why have it? |
wrote in message ups.com... Observations: - Although the majority of individuals who commented on the 18 proposals supported code testing, FCC proposes to completely eliminate it. - There were a lot of ideas in the 18 proposals other than the code test. FCC simply denied all suggestions for change *except* dumping Element 1. Free upgrades for Advanceds and Novices? New entry level classes? More HF bandspace/modes for Novices and Tech Pluses? "No" to all of them. - The changes of 2000 brought a lot of upgrades and some short-term growth, but now the number of individuals with unexpired US ham licenses is almost 10,000 below what it was in May of 2000. Nor has there been any sort of "techno-revolution" from the reductions in code testing. Predictions: - There will be a lot of debate and commentary. But in the end FCC will just dump Element 1 and make no other changes. - There will be a lot of upgrades and a short-term peak in licenses. But not long term growth. - The HF/MF bands will not be overrun with more activity. - There will not be a "revolution" in technology used by hams brought by the new folks. - The focus will shift to a debate about widening the 'phone subbands or even having no mode subbands at all. 73 de Jim, N2EY That's the way I see it too. Dee D. Flint, N8UZE |
"Michael Coslo" wrote in message ... I suggest that the Ham who wants to be thought of as superior establish that superiority by example, not by grousing or ridiculing the new folks. Foster the idea that good manners and technical acumen is a good thing. Just some thoughts..... - Mike KB3EIA - Not superior Mike, just more proficient as a radio operator, with more communication capabilities than those without cw capabilities. Better able to serve his/her community. Etc. Dan/W4NTI |
It's not amazing at all. The FCC consists mainly of Lawyers now a days.
Using a technical argument in a brief is a waste of time. Want proof? Read the BPL garbage. Dan/W4NTI "John Smith" wrote in message ... an_old_pervert: Duh! Think about it, they were not just asking for comments on peoples likes, dislikes and wants... They actually wanted relevant arguments of worth, purpose and logic to be presented--obliviously, when none could be presented which posed sufficient reasons for keeping it--it was decided to drop it. Imagine that, using logic and worth to decide something--now you don't see that type of common sense these days--how dare they do something like that!!! ROFLOL!!!! John "an_old_friend" wrote in message oups.com... wrote: Observations: - Although the majority of individuals who commented on the 18 proposals supported code testing, FCC proposes to completely eliminate it. which show the strengh of the augue emnts against continued code testing - There were a lot of ideas in the 18 proposals other than the code test. FCC simply denied all suggestions for change *except* dumping Element 1. Free upgrades for Advanceds and Novices? New entry level classes? More HF bandspace/modes for Novices and Tech Pluses? "No" to all of them. wrong they considered and rejected them The FCC is taking one of the easist ways out as should have been expected - The changes of 2000 brought a lot of upgrades and some short-term growth, but now the number of individuals with unexpired US ham licenses is almost 10,000 below what it was in May of 2000. Nor has there been any sort of "techno-revolution" from the reductions in code testing. none promised you a revolution i was arround and Know you nor anyone else was promised a revolution Predictions: - There will be a lot of debate and commentary. But in the end FCC will just dump Element 1 and make no other changes. most likely right - There will be a lot of upgrades and a short-term peak in licenses. But not long term growth. maybe all we can hope for form just the rules is to slow the bleeding next stepp is up to us if we can't shakes the notion that Ham radio is still back in what is seen as the dark ages of radio we have some real hope - The HF/MF bands will not be overrun with more activity. - There will not be a "revolution" in technology used by hams brought by the new folks. no revolution was promised merely progress - The focus will shift to a debate about widening the 'phone subbands or even having no mode subbands at all. the discusion hasalways included that so you are safe Your tone seems to me to forsee fear that your your preffered mode is going to squeezed out 73 de Jim, N2EY |
"Michael Coslo" wrote in message ... wrote: Observations: - Although the majority of individuals who commented on the 18 proposals supported code testing, FCC proposes to completely eliminate it. - There were a lot of ideas in the 18 proposals other than the code test. FCC simply denied all suggestions for change *except* dumping Element 1. Free upgrades for Advanceds and Novices? New entry level classes? More HF bandspace/modes for Novices and Tech Pluses? "No" to all of them. - The changes of 2000 brought a lot of upgrades and some short-term growth, but now the number of individuals with unexpired US ham licenses is almost 10,000 below what it was in May of 2000. Nor has there been any sort of "techno-revolution" from the reductions in code testing. Predictions: - There will be a lot of debate and commentary. But in the end FCC will just dump Element 1 and make no other changes. Agreed - There will be a lot of upgrades and a short-term peak in licenses. But not long term growth. Agreed - The HF/MF bands will not be overrun with more activity. MOre activity, but not likely overrun. - There will not be a "revolution" in technology used by hams brought by the new folks. No, certainly not brought about by the new folks - as a group. But I don't doubt that some of the new folks may very well involved. - The focus will shift to a debate about widening the 'phone subbands or even having no mode subbands at all. Yawn! That won't be anywhere near as much fun as the Element 1 debate! One more thing that will happen, and I hope it doesn't. I anticipate a bit of class warfare, as (some of) the code tested try to establish superiority over the great unwashed who enter the ARS. Let's hope not. A prospective ham can only follow the licensing procedure in place at the time he/she licenses. The important issue now, as it has always been, is the post licensing personal development. Quite frankly, that will make those so called elite a worse problem than the newbies coming into the service. Now will be a time for Elmering and openness. I've sat and listened to enough grumbling about Nickel Extras such as myself, right to my face, from OT's who haven't done a thing for the service for years, talk about how "Any idiot can become a Ham now." This happens more often than it should. I would've gotten right in their faces and asked them what they had done lately for ham radio. I intend to provide as much help to the newcomers as possible, instead of grousing about the "good old days", and steely eyed F.C.C testing agents. Yup. There's no point in grousing. Besides one can turn the old requirements into an icebreaker just by telling the story in a humorous way. That I support Element 1 testing is of no consequence to the new people. Absolutely correct. Of course, I'll attempt to foster learning the code and code use. I'll just tell them about the rare and exotic DX that I've found only on CW. And how most contests offer extra points for CW. I suggest that the Ham who wants to be thought of as superior establish that superiority by example, not by grousing or ridiculing the new folks. Foster the idea that good manners and technical acumen is a good thing. That is the only true measure. Just some thoughts..... - Mike KB3EIA - Dee D. Flint, N8UZE |
I think the part in my hair is much better than yours. Yes it is, I
am a much more professional "hair parter!" However, if you wish me wrong, seems like you will need a wig!!! ROFLOL!!!!! John "Dan/W4NTI" wrote in message nk.net... "Michael Coslo" wrote in message ... I suggest that the Ham who wants to be thought of as superior establish that superiority by example, not by grousing or ridiculing the new folks. Foster the idea that good manners and technical acumen is a good thing. Just some thoughts..... - Mike KB3EIA - Not superior Mike, just more proficient as a radio operator, with more communication capabilities than those without cw capabilities. Better able to serve his/her community. Etc. Dan/W4NTI |
Dee:
Oh you and your feminine wiles. I do already hear your "sirens song" and fear for the lives of those men you will sing of CW to... Yes, I will bet that you can wreck more than one young man on the shoals and dangerous reefs of CW. Me, I will just tell 'em about the rare and luscious females I have met in obscure and out-of-the-way pubs and the wonders I have beheld there... grin .... maybe offer to buy 'em a beer and argue antenna theory with 'em... John "Dee Flint" wrote in message ... "Michael Coslo" wrote in message ... wrote: Observations: - Although the majority of individuals who commented on the 18 proposals supported code testing, FCC proposes to completely eliminate it. - There were a lot of ideas in the 18 proposals other than the code test. FCC simply denied all suggestions for change *except* dumping Element 1. Free upgrades for Advanceds and Novices? New entry level classes? More HF bandspace/modes for Novices and Tech Pluses? "No" to all of them. - The changes of 2000 brought a lot of upgrades and some short-term growth, but now the number of individuals with unexpired US ham licenses is almost 10,000 below what it was in May of 2000. Nor has there been any sort of "techno-revolution" from the reductions in code testing. Predictions: - There will be a lot of debate and commentary. But in the end FCC will just dump Element 1 and make no other changes. Agreed - There will be a lot of upgrades and a short-term peak in licenses. But not long term growth. Agreed - The HF/MF bands will not be overrun with more activity. MOre activity, but not likely overrun. - There will not be a "revolution" in technology used by hams brought by the new folks. No, certainly not brought about by the new folks - as a group. But I don't doubt that some of the new folks may very well involved. - The focus will shift to a debate about widening the 'phone subbands or even having no mode subbands at all. Yawn! That won't be anywhere near as much fun as the Element 1 debate! One more thing that will happen, and I hope it doesn't. I anticipate a bit of class warfare, as (some of) the code tested try to establish superiority over the great unwashed who enter the ARS. Let's hope not. A prospective ham can only follow the licensing procedure in place at the time he/she licenses. The important issue now, as it has always been, is the post licensing personal development. Quite frankly, that will make those so called elite a worse problem than the newbies coming into the service. Now will be a time for Elmering and openness. I've sat and listened to enough grumbling about Nickel Extras such as myself, right to my face, from OT's who haven't done a thing for the service for years, talk about how "Any idiot can become a Ham now." This happens more often than it should. I would've gotten right in their faces and asked them what they had done lately for ham radio. I intend to provide as much help to the newcomers as possible, instead of grousing about the "good old days", and steely eyed F.C.C testing agents. Yup. There's no point in grousing. Besides one can turn the old requirements into an icebreaker just by telling the story in a humorous way. That I support Element 1 testing is of no consequence to the new people. Absolutely correct. Of course, I'll attempt to foster learning the code and code use. I'll just tell them about the rare and exotic DX that I've found only on CW. And how most contests offer extra points for CW. I suggest that the Ham who wants to be thought of as superior establish that superiority by example, not by grousing or ridiculing the new folks. Foster the idea that good manners and technical acumen is a good thing. That is the only true measure. Just some thoughts..... - Mike KB3EIA - Dee D. Flint, N8UZE |
Lawyers???
GAWD MAN, that is a joke!!! They need psychiatrists to get these guys over there penis envy.... errr, strike that, I meant "CW FIXATION!" ROFLOL!!!! John "Dan/W4NTI" wrote in message nk.net... It's not amazing at all. The FCC consists mainly of Lawyers now a days. Using a technical argument in a brief is a waste of time. Want proof? Read the BPL garbage. Dan/W4NTI "John Smith" wrote in message ... an_old_pervert: Duh! Think about it, they were not just asking for comments on peoples likes, dislikes and wants... They actually wanted relevant arguments of worth, purpose and logic to be presented--obliviously, when none could be presented which posed sufficient reasons for keeping it--it was decided to drop it. Imagine that, using logic and worth to decide something--now you don't see that type of common sense these days--how dare they do something like that!!! ROFLOL!!!! John "an_old_friend" wrote in message oups.com... wrote: Observations: - Although the majority of individuals who commented on the 18 proposals supported code testing, FCC proposes to completely eliminate it. which show the strengh of the augue emnts against continued code testing - There were a lot of ideas in the 18 proposals other than the code test. FCC simply denied all suggestions for change *except* dumping Element 1. Free upgrades for Advanceds and Novices? New entry level classes? More HF bandspace/modes for Novices and Tech Pluses? "No" to all of them. wrong they considered and rejected them The FCC is taking one of the easist ways out as should have been expected - The changes of 2000 brought a lot of upgrades and some short-term growth, but now the number of individuals with unexpired US ham licenses is almost 10,000 below what it was in May of 2000. Nor has there been any sort of "techno-revolution" from the reductions in code testing. none promised you a revolution i was arround and Know you nor anyone else was promised a revolution Predictions: - There will be a lot of debate and commentary. But in the end FCC will just dump Element 1 and make no other changes. most likely right - There will be a lot of upgrades and a short-term peak in licenses. But not long term growth. maybe all we can hope for form just the rules is to slow the bleeding next stepp is up to us if we can't shakes the notion that Ham radio is still back in what is seen as the dark ages of radio we have some real hope - The HF/MF bands will not be overrun with more activity. - There will not be a "revolution" in technology used by hams brought by the new folks. no revolution was promised merely progress - The focus will shift to a debate about widening the 'phone subbands or even having no mode subbands at all. the discusion hasalways included that so you are safe Your tone seems to me to forsee fear that your your preffered mode is going to squeezed out 73 de Jim, N2EY |
Dan/W4NTI wrote: "Michael Coslo" wrote in message ... I suggest that the Ham who wants to be thought of as superior establish that superiority by example, not by grousing or ridiculing the new folks. Foster the idea that good manners and technical acumen is a good thing. Just some thoughts..... - Mike KB3EIA - Not superior Mike, just more proficient as a radio operator, with more communication capabilities than those without cw capabilities. Better able to serve his/her community. Etc. but cw capcitiy exists without testing for it Indeed I have CW capablities at my station NOW, just use machines to get it Dan/W4NTI |
Dee Flint wrote: "Michael Coslo" wrote in message ... wrote: Observations: - Although the majority of individuals who commented on the 18 proposals supported code testing, FCC proposes to completely eliminate it. - There were a lot of ideas in the 18 proposals other than the code test. FCC simply denied all suggestions for change *except* dumping Element 1. Free upgrades for Advanceds and Novices? New entry level classes? More HF bandspace/modes for Novices and Tech Pluses? "No" to all of them. - The changes of 2000 brought a lot of upgrades and some short-term growth, but now the number of individuals with unexpired US ham licenses is almost 10,000 below what it was in May of 2000. Nor has there been any sort of "techno-revolution" from the reductions in code testing. Predictions: - There will be a lot of debate and commentary. But in the end FCC will just dump Element 1 and make no other changes. Agreed - There will be a lot of upgrades and a short-term peak in licenses. But not long term growth. Agreed - The HF/MF bands will not be overrun with more activity. MOre activity, but not likely overrun. - There will not be a "revolution" in technology used by hams brought by the new folks. No, certainly not brought about by the new folks - as a group. But I don't doubt that some of the new folks may very well involved. - The focus will shift to a debate about widening the 'phone subbands or even having no mode subbands at all. Yawn! That won't be anywhere near as much fun as the Element 1 debate! break One more thing that will happen, and I hope it doesn't. I anticipate a bit of class warfare, as (some of) the code tested try to establish superiority over the great unwashed who enter the ARS. Let's hope not. A prospective ham can only follow the licensing procedure in place at the time he/she licenses. The important issue now, as it has always been, is the post licensing personal development. I have no such such hope. Having watched hams compare there tests as the best and making them better hams for 28 years and still grousing about every change along the way, I know the Class warfare will continue Quite frankly, that will make those so called elite a worse problem than the newbies coming into the service. Now will be a time for Elmering and openness. I've sat and listened to enough grumbling about Nickel Extras such as myself, right to my face, from OT's who haven't done a thing for the service for years, talk about how "Any idiot can become a Ham now." This happens more often than it should. break I would've gotten right in their faces and asked them what they had done lately for ham radio. Good for you. glad to hear it and pleased be prepared to keep it up I intend to provide as much help to the newcomers as possible, instead of grousing about the "good old days", and steely eyed F.C.C testing agents. Yup. There's no point in grousing. Besides one can turn the old requirements into an icebreaker just by telling the story in a humorous way. That I support Element 1 testing is of no consequence to the new people. Absolutely correct. Of course, I'll attempt to foster learning the code and code use. I'll just tell them about the rare and exotic DX that I've found only on CW. And how most contests offer extra points for CW. good luck on that truely I suggest that the Ham who wants to be thought of as superior establish that superiority by example, not by grousing or ridiculing the new folks. Foster the idea that good manners and technical acumen is a good thing. That is the only true measure. Just some thoughts..... - Mike KB3EIA - Dee D. Flint, N8UZE |
|
Dan/W4NTI wrote:
"Michael Coslo" wrote in message ... I suggest that the Ham who wants to be thought of as superior establish that superiority by example, not by grousing or ridiculing the new folks. Foster the idea that good manners and technical acumen is a good thing. Just some thoughts..... - Mike KB3EIA - Not superior Mike, just more proficient as a radio operator, with more communication capabilities than those without cw capabilities. Better able to serve his/her community. Etc. No argument on that, Dan. It's one of the reasons that I support Morse testing. It's a skill that is just plain good to have. But being a better operator is no reason to lord it over others. (I'm not saying that you do - it's just for the discussion) - Mike KB3EIA - |
Dee Flint wrote:
"Michael Coslo" wrote in message ... wrote: Observations: - Although the majority of individuals who commented on the 18 proposals supported code testing, FCC proposes to completely eliminate it. - There were a lot of ideas in the 18 proposals other than the code test. FCC simply denied all suggestions for change *except* dumping Element 1. Free upgrades for Advanceds and Novices? New entry level classes? More HF bandspace/modes for Novices and Tech Pluses? "No" to all of them. - The changes of 2000 brought a lot of upgrades and some short-term growth, but now the number of individuals with unexpired US ham licenses is almost 10,000 below what it was in May of 2000. Nor has there been any sort of "techno-revolution" from the reductions in code testing. Predictions: - There will be a lot of debate and commentary. But in the end FCC will just dump Element 1 and make no other changes. Agreed - There will be a lot of upgrades and a short-term peak in licenses. But not long term growth. Agreed - The HF/MF bands will not be overrun with more activity. MOre activity, but not likely overrun. - There will not be a "revolution" in technology used by hams brought by the new folks. No, certainly not brought about by the new folks - as a group. But I don't doubt that some of the new folks may very well involved. - The focus will shift to a debate about widening the 'phone subbands or even having no mode subbands at all. Yawn! That won't be anywhere near as much fun as the Element 1 debate! One more thing that will happen, and I hope it doesn't. I anticipate a bit of class warfare, as (some of) the code tested try to establish superiority over the great unwashed who enter the ARS. Let's hope not. A prospective ham can only follow the licensing procedure in place at the time he/she licenses. The important issue now, as it has always been, is the post licensing personal development. Quite frankly, that will make those so called elite a worse problem than the newbies coming into the service. Now will be a time for Elmering and openness. I've sat and listened to enough grumbling about Nickel Extras such as myself, right to my face, from OT's who haven't done a thing for the service for years, talk about how "Any idiot can become a Ham now." This happens more often than it should. I would've gotten right in their faces and asked them what they had done lately for ham radio. Well, my mode of operation is not to get in peoples faces. If someone does manage to get me mad, we usually have a private talk. Lets them save face. Usually I just say something like "I resemble that remark!" I intend to provide as much help to the newcomers as possible, instead of grousing about the "good old days", and steely eyed F.C.C testing agents. Yup. There's no point in grousing. Besides one can turn the old requirements into an icebreaker just by telling the story in a humorous way. That I support Element 1 testing is of no consequence to the new people. Absolutely correct. Of course, I'll attempt to foster learning the code and code use. I'll just tell them about the rare and exotic DX that I've found only on CW. And how most contests offer extra points for CW. I suggest that the Ham who wants to be thought of as superior establish that superiority by example, not by grousing or ridiculing the new folks. Foster the idea that good manners and technical acumen is a good thing. That is the only true measure. Will we measure up? - Mike KB3EIA - |
"Mike Coslo" wrote in message ... Dee Flint wrote: "Michael Coslo" wrote in message ... [snip] Now will be a time for Elmering and openness. I've sat and listened to enough grumbling about Nickel Extras such as myself, right to my face, from OT's who haven't done a thing for the service for years, talk about how "Any idiot can become a Ham now." This happens more often than it should. I would've gotten right in their faces and asked them what they had done lately for ham radio. Well, my mode of operation is not to get in peoples faces. If someone does manage to get me mad, we usually have a private talk. Lets them save face. Usually I just say something like "I resemble that remark!" Actually Mike, it depends. If they have spoken in private, I speak in private. If they choose to make a fool of themselves in public, then I'll help them along and point out that foolishness in public. I've had experience with people who will deliberately put you down in public based on the concept that you are too polite to respond in public. I had a former husband who was like that and I finally had to go ahead and speak out in public to get him to stop. Chewing him out in private did no good. [snip] I suggest that the Ham who wants to be thought of as superior establish that superiority by example, not by grousing or ridiculing the new folks. Foster the idea that good manners and technical acumen is a good thing. That is the only true measure. Will we measure up? - Mike KB3EIA - I hope so. I know both you and I and many others will try. Dee D. Flint, N8UZE |
"Dee Flint" wrote in message
... "Mike Coslo" wrote in message Will we measure up? - Mike KB3EIA - I hope so. I know both you and I and many others will try. Dee D. Flint, N8UZE What, exactly, are people supposed to "measure up" to in ham radio? We are all amateur radio operators. None of us has a thing to prove to the other--at least not as far as I can see it. We each have our preferences, etc. I would no more expect anyone to "measure up" to me; than I would have them expect me to "measure up" to them. That is a basic fault of amateur radio, I think--the "competitiveness" of it. I think the minute that limitations are introduced into an environment, it is set up for such a pitfall--because people cannot generally rise above it. By the very nature of the licensing structure, ham radio is a contentious environment. Anyway, came into this late, and it chaps my hide to see people expecting others to "measure up" to, what: their importance, or something? I don't know...maybe I am misunderstanding this one post I've read in this thread. Kim W5TIT Not planning on trying to measure up to anything, but my own expectations of myself. ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==---- http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups ----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =---- |
"Kim" wrote in message ... "Dee Flint" wrote in message ... "Mike Coslo" wrote in message Will we measure up? - Mike KB3EIA - I hope so. I know both you and I and many others will try. Dee D. Flint, N8UZE What, exactly, are people supposed to "measure up" to in ham radio? We are all amateur radio operators. None of us has a thing to prove to the other--at least not as far as I can see it. We each have our preferences, etc. I would no more expect anyone to "measure up" to me; than I would have them expect me to "measure up" to them. That is a basic fault of amateur radio, I think--the "competitiveness" of it. I think the minute that limitations are introduced into an environment, it is set up for such a pitfall--because people cannot generally rise above it. By the very nature of the licensing structure, ham radio is a contentious environment. Anyway, came into this late, and it chaps my hide to see people expecting others to "measure up" to, what: their importance, or something? I don't know...maybe I am misunderstanding this one post I've read in this thread. Kim W5TIT Not planning on trying to measure up to anything, but my own expectations of myself. To me it is doing my best to provide a good example and a good Elmer. That is the standard to which I (and I believe Mike) hope to be able to measure up to. Dee D. Flint, N8UZE |
Dee:
Measure up? Girl, take a look at the man holding the yardstick... a damn midget! 'nuff said... John "Dee Flint" wrote in message ... "Mike Coslo" wrote in message ... Dee Flint wrote: "Michael Coslo" wrote in message ... [snip] Now will be a time for Elmering and openness. I've sat and listened to enough grumbling about Nickel Extras such as myself, right to my face, from OT's who haven't done a thing for the service for years, talk about how "Any idiot can become a Ham now." This happens more often than it should. I would've gotten right in their faces and asked them what they had done lately for ham radio. Well, my mode of operation is not to get in peoples faces. If someone does manage to get me mad, we usually have a private talk. Lets them save face. Usually I just say something like "I resemble that remark!" Actually Mike, it depends. If they have spoken in private, I speak in private. If they choose to make a fool of themselves in public, then I'll help them along and point out that foolishness in public. I've had experience with people who will deliberately put you down in public based on the concept that you are too polite to respond in public. I had a former husband who was like that and I finally had to go ahead and speak out in public to get him to stop. Chewing him out in private did no good. [snip] I suggest that the Ham who wants to be thought of as superior establish that superiority by example, not by grousing or ridiculing the new folks. Foster the idea that good manners and technical acumen is a good thing. That is the only true measure. Will we measure up? - Mike KB3EIA - I hope so. I know both you and I and many others will try. Dee D. Flint, N8UZE |
Kim wrote:
Anyway, came into this late, and it chaps my hide to see people expecting others to "measure up" to, what: their importance, or something? I don't know...maybe I am misunderstanding this one post I've read in this thread. Don't get chapped Kim! There are a lot of different people in the world, with all kinds of different ideas on how things "ought to be". My version of that is that people should have respect for each other, and be considerate of each other. I also like the concept of bettering ones self through acquisition of knowledge and skills, and that people should be an asset to, and to give back to their communities. I'm also aware that a lot of people think that my ideas are some sort of sugar coated dreck. My sole failing is that I get a bit of enjoyment in knowing that that irritates the crap out of some people for some reason! 8^) Well okay - its not my only failing. Mr Anderson and Mr Smith can probably fill you in on the others.... Okay, for them, but I'm not going to change my mind. Kim W5TIT Not planning on trying to measure up to anything, but my own expectations of myself. We can't really ask for much more! - Mike KB3EIA - |
John Smith wrote:
Dee: Measure up? Girl, take a look at the man holding the yardstick... a damn midget! 'nuff said... John doesn't seem to like me much, eh Dee? - Mike KB3EIA - |
Mike:
Actually, I don't even consider whether I "like" you or not--but as long as the discourse here is interesting--count me in! John "Mike Coslo" wrote in message ... John Smith wrote: Dee: Measure up? Girl, take a look at the man holding the yardstick... a damn midget! 'nuff said... John doesn't seem to like me much, eh Dee? - Mike KB3EIA - |
From: "John Smith" on Fri 22 Jul 2005 16:44
Len: Dumb it down a bit man, you have them confused! Not my fault...they were confused when I first got here...:-) Now they think they are clones! They even suspect you of being a clone!!! (too much startrek when young I suppose.) Careful there, "John," I watched the OS since the 3rd episode aired in '67 (was away on biz trip for first two aired). :-) The neo-20s, neo-30s Re-Enactor pioneers of the airwaves with "CW" seem to think that ham radio is some kind of 25th Century subspace radio. HUGE technology gap. But, no different than the re-enactors of Civil War battles, Revolutionary War battles, etc., etc. in this modern age. Back just after the FIRST Gulf War, some BS slinger came in here announcing he was a "colonel" (retired) and that his son "was 'behind enemy lines' (supposedly in Iraq) and that "he sent intel on CW" during that short, brief, brutal, fast-moving ground action. Pure BS, of course. In 1990 the military had grown out of the 1940 era of two-tube modulated oscillator and super-regen battery portables and used a VHF- UHF portable (PSQ-3) having a 1200 BPS "chiclet" keyboard that relayed through the military aviation band and orbiting aircraft (or satellites). The ground war lasted only about four days with Plan 73 Easting topping ANYTHING that famed Rommel panzerfausts couldn't hope to top. This BSing dingbat had overloaded on antiquated History Channel footage or other pipe-dreaming and wanted to be a "name" in here. Back in 1997 - before the announcement of the "restructuring" NPRM - some PCTA (that's Pro-Code Test Advocate if you weren't here back then) types still thought the military USED "CW" for communications. They don't, but I couldn't convince anyone (except a very few) of that. It upset their FANTASIES and the high regard they had for their "valuable skill" (which no other radio service wanted). They want to be thought of as special, with each one having a "stark in contrast" and "special religious fervor" to CW for their own very PERSONAL and UNIQUE reasons... Some seem to NEED being "better than others" on SOMETHING. :-) They have spiffy ready-built radios (designed and built by others) costing many $$$ or they have spiffy designed and built by themselves for less than $100 (using state-of-the- art vacuum tube technology of the 1990s). They use that wonder of all radio modes, On-Off Keying of a Continuous Wave carrier ("OOK CW"). Those PCTAs are probably very good at this "CW" and could get a nice job as a "radio op" of the 1930s era in "shortwave communications." Trouble is, this is the New Millennium and the year 2005. Ain't NO demand for such "radio operators." But, they are the BEST! :-) Some common arguments are "CW is what amateur radio is all about!" or "CW is the heart and soul of amateur radio!" or that "'Anyone' can learn morse"...provided they devote a large part of their free time "to show their dedication and committment to the amateur community!" Whoopee on the last since that makes them top-notch radio ops for the 1930s... 75 years too late. I've never seen the address of this "amateur community" or seen it on a map...nor is there information on how this "community" rates new amateurs...it must all be some kind of transcendental telepathic ability from the epiphany of passing a morse test. Now, it's not all that absurd to label the CW fanatics as members of the ARS...the Archaic Radiotelegraphy Society. [not my original line, just picked up from another in here and used unmercilessly] If they want to be "expert" at a skill that is 75 years out of date, why "FB OM." Thanks, but I prefer this New Millennium just fine after pursuing a radio-electronics career begun over a half century ago, working REAL HF comms en masse on 24/7 "DX" circuits. I am afraid unless you are able to maintain that fantasy for them--there is going to be trouble.... straight-faced-look Well, "that's how it goes..." straight-faced look in return The fantasizers keep insisting They ARE ham radio and everybody (by damn) better well take that morse test in order to be "as good as They." As the old latin phrase has it, screum. :-) bit bit |
Len:
Do you think we should set up a website to help the hams to transition and be accepted by the CB'ers which will be flooding in like a lot of okies ready to pick cotton? Maybe a dictionary of CB Terms and a list of the 10 Codes which are accepted for use by the CB Community? Yanno, "10-fer Good Buddy", and "I gotta go 10-100!", and "I just had a 10-33 in 'ma pants!", etc... And, what about power requirements now? Do these hams here have "BEEG LEENEAIRS?", big enough to be able to compete with monsters which are coming in from CB? You know as well as I, those multi-kilowatt pileups on 160 and 80 ain't gonna be pretty! And, just think, the new pirate chans will probably reach down into AM Broadcast Band... what about the hams down there listening to art bell and his con man guest--wayne green? They aren't going to like that interference yanno... frown And, what about etiquette? Will these hams be able to adopt a quick retarded drawl to their voices and speech, and more important--can they do it and make it believable? OMG, there is a lot to deal with Len, I am afraid we may not have time enough to get the hams prepared for the new way of life on the bands! Got any ideas to ease their transition period--poor buggers? John wrote in message oups.com... From: "John Smith" on Fri 22 Jul 2005 16:44 Len: Dumb it down a bit man, you have them confused! Not my fault...they were confused when I first got here...:-) Now they think they are clones! They even suspect you of being a clone!!! (too much startrek when young I suppose.) Careful there, "John," I watched the OS since the 3rd episode aired in '67 (was away on biz trip for first two aired). :-) The neo-20s, neo-30s Re-Enactor pioneers of the airwaves with "CW" seem to think that ham radio is some kind of 25th Century subspace radio. HUGE technology gap. But, no different than the re-enactors of Civil War battles, Revolutionary War battles, etc., etc. in this modern age. Back just after the FIRST Gulf War, some BS slinger came in here announcing he was a "colonel" (retired) and that his son "was 'behind enemy lines' (supposedly in Iraq) and that "he sent intel on CW" during that short, brief, brutal, fast-moving ground action. Pure BS, of course. In 1990 the military had grown out of the 1940 era of two-tube modulated oscillator and super-regen battery portables and used a VHF- UHF portable (PSQ-3) having a 1200 BPS "chiclet" keyboard that relayed through the military aviation band and orbiting aircraft (or satellites). The ground war lasted only about four days with Plan 73 Easting topping ANYTHING that famed Rommel panzerfausts couldn't hope to top. This BSing dingbat had overloaded on antiquated History Channel footage or other pipe-dreaming and wanted to be a "name" in here. Back in 1997 - before the announcement of the "restructuring" NPRM - some PCTA (that's Pro-Code Test Advocate if you weren't here back then) types still thought the military USED "CW" for communications. They don't, but I couldn't convince anyone (except a very few) of that. It upset their FANTASIES and the high regard they had for their "valuable skill" (which no other radio service wanted). They want to be thought of as special, with each one having a "stark in contrast" and "special religious fervor" to CW for their own very PERSONAL and UNIQUE reasons... Some seem to NEED being "better than others" on SOMETHING. :-) They have spiffy ready-built radios (designed and built by others) costing many $$$ or they have spiffy designed and built by themselves for less than $100 (using state-of-the- art vacuum tube technology of the 1990s). They use that wonder of all radio modes, On-Off Keying of a Continuous Wave carrier ("OOK CW"). Those PCTAs are probably very good at this "CW" and could get a nice job as a "radio op" of the 1930s era in "shortwave communications." Trouble is, this is the New Millennium and the year 2005. Ain't NO demand for such "radio operators." But, they are the BEST! :-) Some common arguments are "CW is what amateur radio is all about!" or "CW is the heart and soul of amateur radio!" or that "'Anyone' can learn morse"...provided they devote a large part of their free time "to show their dedication and committment to the amateur community!" Whoopee on the last since that makes them top-notch radio ops for the 1930s... 75 years too late. I've never seen the address of this "amateur community" or seen it on a map...nor is there information on how this "community" rates new amateurs...it must all be some kind of transcendental telepathic ability from the epiphany of passing a morse test. Now, it's not all that absurd to label the CW fanatics as members of the ARS...the Archaic Radiotelegraphy Society. [not my original line, just picked up from another in here and used unmercilessly] If they want to be "expert" at a skill that is 75 years out of date, why "FB OM." Thanks, but I prefer this New Millennium just fine after pursuing a radio-electronics career begun over a half century ago, working REAL HF comms en masse on 24/7 "DX" circuits. I am afraid unless you are able to maintain that fantasy for them--there is going to be trouble.... straight-faced-look Well, "that's how it goes..." straight-faced look in return The fantasizers keep insisting They ARE ham radio and everybody (by damn) better well take that morse test in order to be "as good as They." As the old latin phrase has it, screum. :-) bit bit |
From: John Smith on Jul 23, 11:59 am
Do you think we should set up a website to help the hams to transition and be accepted by the CB'ers which will be flooding in like a lot of okies ready to pick cotton? No. These olde-tyme hammes will do ALL the "help" just as they have "helped" others in the past. For example, in 1958 the FCC deallocated the 11m band from hams and created Class C and D CB. Oh, the Hue and Cry they raised in the US of A! Imagine, below-30-MHz privileges WITHOUT TESTING FOR MORSE CODE! Imagine, NO TEST AT ALL TO GET A FEDERALLY-AUTHORIZED LICENSE!! All them olde-tymers quickly got into action to Demand Their Big Band Sound BACK! They're still working on getting it back. :-) Maybe a dictionary of CB Terms and a list of the 10 Codes which are accepted for use by the CB Community? Yanno, "10-fer Good Buddy", and "I gotta go 10-100!", and "I just had a 10-33 in 'ma pants!", etc... I'd rather see a "dictionary" of ham terms and what they REALLY mean...like "your sig is 599 here!" or "FB on that, OM" or things like spoken "hi hi." Or all them obscure Q codes that all are supposed to memorize by heart or something...to sound very "IN" to radio. insert sound of stifled laughter here And, what about etiquette? Will these hams be able to adopt a quick retarded drawl to their voices and speech, and more important--can they do it and make it believable? They have and they do. Heard them do it over the years. Not a pretty sound. But they don't really care HOW they sound...they ain't in broadcasting nor do they get paid for what they do. They are HAMS! OMG, there is a lot to deal with Len, I am afraid we may not have time enough to get the hams prepared for the new way of life on the bands! Got any ideas to ease their transition period--poor buggers? None at all...for the money you are offering. I haven't been able to "ease" the olde-tyme hammes out of their stuck-in-the-1930s-standards-and-practices rut for years. So few know "life" in any other radio service and their raddddios seldom tune outside of ham bands. Not to worry, Yanno Smith. Ain't gonna be the "overrun" of the (HF) ham bands. All those elmering olde-tymers done discouraged so many for so long with their obsessive NEEDS to test for morse that most others have simply moved on... The playground is safe for the Mighty Macho Morsemen. Long may they beep. Burp. Say hello to your brother Yanni, Yanno. bit bit |
"Mike Coslo" wrote in message
... John Smith wrote: Dee: Measure up? Girl, take a look at the man holding the yardstick... a damn midget! 'nuff said... John doesn't seem to like me much, eh Dee? - Mike KB3EIA - From what I've even noticed of this nitwit, so far, Mike--you're a far more interesting person than he. And, I suspect, a person I'd find better to be in the company of. Kim W5TIT ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==---- http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups ----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =---- |
"Mike Coslo" wrote in message
... Kim wrote: Anyway, came into this late, and it chaps my hide to see people expecting others to "measure up" to, what: their importance, or something? I don't know...maybe I am misunderstanding this one post I've read in this thread. Don't get chapped Kim! There are a lot of different people in the world, with all kinds of different ideas on how things "ought to be". I suspect if we continue communicating in the way people usually do on newsgroups (by responding to previous text), then Little Johnny will get tired of reading and, well, he just doesn't have time to do it this way :o Anyway, absolutel. I wasn't really miffed about the idea of "it takes all kinds." What gets me is when I am "expected" to live up to something in ham radio. I took my test(s) to get my license(s). That's it. That's all it takes. And, I hope that if anyone is perusing the newsgroup, they will get the idea that they don't have to live up to anything to be an amateur radio operator. They'll find someone just like them on the air...no doubt. My version of that is that people should have respect for each other, and be considerate of each other. I also like the concept of bettering ones self through acquisition of knowledge and skills, and that people should be an asset to, and to give back to their communities. I'm also aware that a lot of people think that my ideas are some sort of sugar coated dreck. Yes, I like that idea as well. But, I don't begrudge anyone who'd rather not and/or who is happy with what they have or where they are. For instance, IF I ever get back into ham radio (other than just having a ticket), I am happy enough playing around on VHF, mostly 2-M, mostly voice. There's lots of us who are and who'll never be much interested in any of the rest of amateur radio. I've played with other modes and always come back home to VHF voice. It "angers" me to think of people who expect more than that. I expect nothing of anyone in, save what you said about just being a decent person. My sole failing is that I get a bit of enjoyment in knowing that that irritates the crap out of some people for some reason! 8^) Aw, that's not a failing. Think about it: it's mostly a failing of THEIRS to get irritated. :) Well okay - its not my only failing. Mr Anderson and Mr Smith can probably fill you in on the others.... I won't speak of Len. I think he's a great agitator and I love great agitators (from an observing perspective, mind you--I can't stand being in it myself...LOL). "Mr. Smith" is somewhat disturbed and that concerns me. However, once on guard with someone and I am always pretty much on guard with that person. I have a feeling he's a bit of a misfit and plays to the meek minded--no offense to anyone. Okay, for them, but I'm not going to change my mind. Kim W5TIT Not planning on trying to measure up to anything, but my own expectations of myself. We can't really ask for much more! - Mike KB3EIA - Well, especially since I really do demand a lot of myself. LOL Kim W5TIT ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==---- http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups ----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =---- |
Len:
Consider it done, Yanni will be greeted in your name... Well, I suppose you know what you are talkin' about, you have been their baby sitter all these years. However, sometimes it is difficult to even know a CB'er is on band and CQ DX'ing... some have accused the CB'er of "hanging a carrier" in an attempt to block communications when this happens... That isn't the case though and the hams should be warned... have them just listen closely, if they hear the sound of drooling--that is the CB'er attempting to communicate--when he un-keys, (the CB'er) on phone, just have 'em go ahead with the QSO--although in this state the CB'ers eyes are glazed over--I am still pretty sure he is able to comprehend every-other-word or so... grin John wrote in message oups.com... From: John Smith on Jul 23, 11:59 am Do you think we should set up a website to help the hams to transition and be accepted by the CB'ers which will be flooding in like a lot of okies ready to pick cotton? No. These olde-tyme hammes will do ALL the "help" just as they have "helped" others in the past. For example, in 1958 the FCC deallocated the 11m band from hams and created Class C and D CB. Oh, the Hue and Cry they raised in the US of A! Imagine, below-30-MHz privileges WITHOUT TESTING FOR MORSE CODE! Imagine, NO TEST AT ALL TO GET A FEDERALLY-AUTHORIZED LICENSE!! All them olde-tymers quickly got into action to Demand Their Big Band Sound BACK! They're still working on getting it back. :-) Maybe a dictionary of CB Terms and a list of the 10 Codes which are accepted for use by the CB Community? Yanno, "10-fer Good Buddy", and "I gotta go 10-100!", and "I just had a 10-33 in 'ma pants!", etc... I'd rather see a "dictionary" of ham terms and what they REALLY mean...like "your sig is 599 here!" or "FB on that, OM" or things like spoken "hi hi." Or all them obscure Q codes that all are supposed to memorize by heart or something...to sound very "IN" to radio. insert sound of stifled laughter here And, what about etiquette? Will these hams be able to adopt a quick retarded drawl to their voices and speech, and more important--can they do it and make it believable? They have and they do. Heard them do it over the years. Not a pretty sound. But they don't really care HOW they sound...they ain't in broadcasting nor do they get paid for what they do. They are HAMS! OMG, there is a lot to deal with Len, I am afraid we may not have time enough to get the hams prepared for the new way of life on the bands! Got any ideas to ease their transition period--poor buggers? None at all...for the money you are offering. I haven't been able to "ease" the olde-tyme hammes out of their stuck-in-the-1930s-standards-and-practices rut for years. So few know "life" in any other radio service and their raddddios seldom tune outside of ham bands. Not to worry, Yanno Smith. Ain't gonna be the "overrun" of the (HF) ham bands. All those elmering olde-tymers done discouraged so many for so long with their obsessive NEEDS to test for morse that most others have simply moved on... The playground is safe for the Mighty Macho Morsemen. Long may they beep. Burp. Say hello to your brother Yanni, Yanno. bit bit |
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The fewer regulations there are on the books, the less enforcement they have to do. I am surprised they haven't tried to "outsource" their enforcement duties. I do hear rumous they have looked into that Uh huh. Rumors. Just set up a few radio monitoring stations in Mexico or India.... |
Cmdr Buzz Corey wrote: wrote: No. These olde-tyme hammes will do ALL the "help" just as they have "helped" others in the past. For example, in 1958 the FCC deallocated the 11m band from hams and created Class C and D CB. Oh, the Hue and Cry they raised in the US of A! Imagine, below-30-MHz privileges WITHOUT TESTING FOR MORSE CODE! Imagine, NO TEST AT ALL TO GET A FEDERALLY-AUTHORIZED LICENSE!! All them olde-tymers quickly got into action to Demand Their Big Band Sound BACK! They're still working on getting it back. :-) And like other fools you attempt to keep the myth alive. In 40+ years of hamming I have never heard one ham (that inclueds the olde-tyme hammes) that complained about about the loss of 11 meters. The hams had 10 meters where they operated and rarely used 11, so the loss to the ham community was nothing. well ole Stvie complained (k4yz) as did yodoc and MD the later too not active heard In person K0HMO coomplain loudly and often a fewe other who's call I don't remeber, and that in less than 10 years |
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