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#501
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If you had to use CW to save someone's life, would that person die?
Um.... you know, just saying "I agree" would have been a lot simpler and
saved you 2 pages of typing.... LOL. rb wrote in message oups.com... From: Woody on Tues, Aug 22 2006 12:50 pm The Titanic knew their coordinates.... didn't slow the influx of H20.... The responding ships had radios too... didn't turn their props any faster.... The year was 1912...NINETY-FOUR YEARS AGO. Answer to the question.... there was no system then. The predecessor organization for SOLAS had not yet made 500 KHz the international distress and safety frequency. "SOLAS" is an acronym for Safety Of Life At Sea. CW can punch through if there is a human on the other end, where GPS/packet says 'no signal'.... GPS is faster, where CW takes longer.... so one is obsolete, the other inferior. The International Maritime Community settled the 'morse issue.' They DROPPED it in favor of GMDSS (Global Marine Distress and Safety System), a semi-automated system which can be operated by anyone of the bridge crew on a ship (it needs little instruction on use). GMDSS messages are automatically routed to ground stations (note plural) via satellite relay. Those ground stations can coordinate rescue missions. A shipboard GMDS station doesn't HAVE to have a GPS receiver to feed it position data but all those which have one have no complaint about this alleged "loss of signal." Position data can be entered manually to a GMDS station. The bridge crew will have a running record of the ship's position in either event. The United States Coast Guard has DROPPED continuous monitoring of the 500 KHz distress frequency some years ago. Several other countries have done so. A following question is WHO will you believe on the efficacy of communications? The entire international maritime community or a bunch of myth-happy amateur morsemen? In a sentient, intelligent mind, ANY form of communications is good for use in matters involving life and death. The FCC thinks (rightly) so and says as much in Part 1 of Title 47 C.F.R. [Part 97 is not the entirety of regulations on amateur radio in the USA] -------------------- In a preceding message set: "Cecil Moore" wrote in message Dave wrote: David G. Nagel wrote: A ham operator intercepted the SOS from the RMS Titanic. Yep!! It happened once! It happened NINETY-FOUR YEARS AGO. If CW had not existed at the time, how would things have turned out differently? If the present GPS-based system had existed at the time, how would things have turned out? I have to fault Cecil's erudite and intelligent mindset on that...although his motor looks good in his picture. :-) One CANNOT base any intelligent argument about ALTERNATE universes of different times and places. It hasn't happened in our present time-space continuum. In 1912 "radio" was in its infancy, having been first shown and demonstrated as a communications medium just 16 years prior. There were extremely few ships which had vacuum tubes as active devices to aid those first "radios." The tube was only 6 years old, the triode invented in 1906. To argue about "GPS" (which is not an integral part of GMDSS but can be) versus morse code is ludicrous. GPS relies on a time-frequency standard within each of the 24 GPS satellites which is comparable to the best time- frequency source at NIST. [the quartz crystal oscillator wasn't yet invented in 1912] Each satellite needs solid-state circuitry to make it function within a relatively small package. [the best "solid-state" device of 1912 was a galena crystal detector with its famous "cat's whisker"] The whole GPSS needed rocketry advanced enough to put all the satellites into orbit. [rocketry wasn't perfected for that purpose until after WW2] Those rockets needed launch guidance aided by radar systems. [radar, or rather a primitive system of it, wasn't tried until 1932 in a harbor area of France] However, "morse code" was used in the landline Morse-Vail Telegraph System working before the American Civil War and simple enough to turn a spark transmitter on and off as on the Titanic. Which system is presently inferior and virtually obsolete? On-off keyed CW. Except in the mindset of the ARRL. The IARU knows better. |
#502
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If you had to use CW to save someone's life, would that person die?
"Woody" wrote in message news:N6JGg.27193$uV.6302@trnddc08... uhhhh..... good point. Not sure what your point applies to... but OK, we all agree that radio is a useful invention. What were we talking about again? rb "David G. Nagel" wrote in message ... an old friend wrote: David G. Nagel wrote: Cecil Moore wrote: Dirk wrote: Ham's care more about operating appliances than knowing how to save a lives. How many times in the entire history of amateur radio has a ham used CW to actually save a life? One would think there would be a book full of examples by now. A ham operator intercepted the SOS from the RMS Titanic. how many life were saved thereby the Carpathia wheard the call and arrived to save some folks what role did the ARS playing in saving even one life that sorry day? We aren't talking about failure to receive a CW SOS. Those ships that responded did so after receiving word of the sinking by radio. They saved many lives from the lifeboats which would otherwise have been lost to the cold. Dave N |
#503
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If you had to use CW to save someone's life, would that person die?
"Cecil Moore" wrote in message
t... jawod wrote: If MENSA membership is important to you, fine. Most of us find it a bit pretentious and downright silly. Ditto for the Morse code testing requirement. That was the whole point. -- 73, Cecil http://www.qsl.net/w5dxp As the little munchin said in the Wizard of Oz - opening up the window to Dorothy's insistent knocking - and she finally got her point across - "well now - that's a horse of a different color - why didn't you say so!" L. |
#505
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If you had to use CW... would robesin still be an idiot?
K4YZ wrote: LenCan'tPassThe wrote: From: on Sun, Aug 20 2006 2:57 pm Geee? Robesin is still forging attributes... Some things just never change. Don't know if you've heard yet, but the ARRL and robesin announced that MARS and TSA have an agreement for armageddon communications. Heh heh, I wouldn't doubt it... "Armageddon"...?!?! No one announced "armageddon" in any release that I am aware of. Why did you? Yet more evidence of why it's better to have Lennie "Can't Pass An Exam" Anderson on the outside looking in. Steve, K4YZ The ARRL Letter, Vol. 25, No. 33, August 18, 2006 ARRL First Vice President Kay Craigie, N3KN, represented the League at the Global Amateur Radio Emergency Communications Conference 2006: "Craigie stressed that Amateur Radio needs to avoid "being dazzled by our own press clippings into thinking that we are the big dog in emergency telecommunications."" |
#506
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If you had to use CW to save someone's life, would that person die?
"Woody" wrote in
news:%RJGg.27319$uV.13889@trnddc08: Well there ya have it folks.... 50wpm saves lives. So how does it work? Turn up the speaker really loud and place it [face down] on the person's chest, while an op in South America tapped out universally accepted words that would mimic an atrioventricular rhythm? Did someone drop you on your head at birth? The reason 50wpm can save lives is probably a bit complex for you to get both your functioning neurons around, but believe me, having done CW for a living for some decades I do know that it can save lives. And if you're faster than the average bear at it, you can tell someone on the scene things they need to know all that much faster. Wrong theatre? OK... Maybe if a person is trapped on a sinking ship in the Indian Ocean you, in Siberia, could tap out a message to someone in Madagascar [who happened to be awake at an odd hour] and that person also owned a large SAR chopper, they could jump in it, saving the time of relaying to anyone else, and go pluck them from certain death? OH, or better yet... if your neighbor is also a ham.... and your wife fell over with an AMI, you could call your neighbor, give him a freq, then the two of you get set up and running, then you can send a 50wpm message asking your neighbor to call an ambulance? BTW, if the phones are down, you ask him to get in his car and drive down to the local EMS agency, and bring them to you. Life saved! I'm impressed. rb So apparently YOUR answer to this question is that you couldn't send your name if your own life depended on it. Believe me, I get it. I don't think CW ought to be mandatory and it isn't where I live. I do think people who intend to use it should learn how to use it properly, though. For CW to be effective, both operators must be competent. IF they are, they can often transcend barriers of language that only digital modes can get over. In my own case, the fact that I could read CW and read written Spanish a bit once enabled me to render aid to a burning fishing boat. (There were other more routine examples of where the language barrier was crossed by CW--many messages I copied were not in English at all, but were readable by their end recipients). -- Dave Oldridge+ ICQ 1800667 |
#507
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If you had to use CW to save someone's life, would that person die?
wrote: From: on Mon, Aug 21 2006 6:30 pm wrote: From: an old friend on Mon, Aug 21 2006 3:16 pm wrote: From: on Sun, Aug 20 2006 2:57 pm If the league pushes the morse testing issue too hard, it will become obvious to the 25% that are members. I don't think so. The Amateur Radiotelegraphy Society is very firmly SET in their ideas of keeping the "heritage" and "tradition" of being a living museum of archaic radio. Those firm believers and worshippers at the Church of St. Hiram are disciples and they haven't had their last supper yet. I have no objection to them trying to prservs thier mode the ARS is big enough even for unproductive thing It's "minority rule" when ARRL lobbies for preservation of morse code test for any amateur radio license class. The ARRL membership is slightly less than a quarter of all US amateur radio licensees. Don't know if you've heard yet, but the ARRL and robesin announced that MARS and TSA have an agreement for armageddon communications. Heh heh, I wouldn't doubt it... :-) [via "giant meteor bounce?" ... off the earth, that is? :-) ] I thought Robesin had put on his (invisible) USMC uniform and was busy pounding brass with the USCG offshore from Beirut to evacuate US civilians? :-) now that remark I must take you to task for the last thing we want to sugest that robeson might wear is something invisible now that image IS a sexauly distrubing one Ahem...my reference was the old fairy tale, "The Emperor's New Clothes." :-) i thougt as much OTOH the image of robeson nude is still well To me it is UNwell... :-) That's the one where a full-of-himself ruler ordered some new clothes and the tailor buttered him up (while not sewing any new clothes) so much that the Emperor bought into this pandering to his ego and appeared in public with his "new clothes" (he was naked). Needless to say, the public laughed and laughed at this ridiculous spectacle. :-) indeed i laugh at him myself ruefully with the added though that this is thebest the procoder can muster Robesin is merely a product of the "incentive" licensing system where all those who hunger for being a "somebody" can get a Title - Rank - Privilege through a singular skill. If it doesn't have rank or a uniform, Robesin isn't interested. I didn't make that system, neither did you, neither did anyone in these four forums. The FCC took a big chunk out of it (license classes and morsemanship skill) with the Restructuring of 2000 and that ****ed off the Title-Rank- Status seekers. Devout morsemen are angry and venting steam because their self-esteem has fallen. Only in their minds. They are the very same good or bad hams that they were with all the layers of hamdom. Robeson has been all full of himself in here about his alleged "USMC service" yet he has presented zero-point-zero evidence from anyone else (or any legitimate agency) that he ever served on active USMC duty for any of his claimed "18 years." Simply amazing. EIGHTEEN years alleged on active duty and he can't supply a single photo or document to support his claim? In November of this year I can truthfully say I've been in the southern California aerospace business 50 years. I have all sorts of documentation and photos on that which I may fully digitize some day (some are already digitized). Some time ago I posted my resume in here...which only made Robesin ballistic then since he has NO comparable experience in industry and cannot prove any radio experience other than amateur and alleged "chief operator" status at some small MARS station long ago. [that was before his less-than-a-half-year as a purchasing agent at a small set top box maker] Yet as "chief operator" or ANCOIC of NMC MARS on Okinawa, he remains woefully ignorant of MARS. I just don't get it. In another recent post, Robesin keeps referring to a "CV." That's an acronym for the Latin 'curriculum vitae,' a list of life experiences (education, work experience). Maybe he meant "constant velocity" as in "CV joints" because he's always "spun up" about one thing or another. In the electronics industry, indeed in MOST industries, those applying for jobs don't present a curriculum vitae, just a RESUME of education-work experience. Some academics may use "CV" but Personnel departments still look over resumes. Just one more little gaffe on Robesin's part, trying to LOOK experienced when he is NOT. Robesin an academic? Not in this lifetime. It's just his inappropriate use of what to him are important sounding words and acronyms. Even though he NOW thinks of himself AS the amateur radio service personified (anything against him is somehow against ALL radio amateurs), he is still parodying the "Emperor." Another sign of his megalomania, purporting to "represent all" and, by extension, anyone against Him is "against all radio amateurs." Robesin desperately needs SOMETHING to hold up his self-esteem and he uses amateur radio for that selfish purpose. It is like his infamous snot-on-the- moustache CAP flight suit picture, big on rank, title, and with implications of status. CAP is NOT about amateur radio but Robesin keeps on harping about it as if it "proved" something about his amateur radio abilities. He does the same with his "ER nurse qualifications" but those have absolutely nothing to do with radio, amateur or professional. But, challenge Robesin or call him in error and one will be inundated with personal insults. Robeson MUST be right and he MUST rule. Civil comportment be damned with Robeson in newsgroups. Those newsgroups were (in his mind) created to showcase Him? The rec.radio newsgroups have showcased Robesin. He HAS earned his reputation. He's worked very hard for it. |
#508
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If you had to use CW... would robesin still be an idiot?
K4YZ wrote: Ninety-nine percent of Lennie's post was about anythig OTHER than AMATEUR RADIO, Morkie. GMDSS is NOT Amateur Radio. SOLAS is NOT Amateur Radio. Lennie Anderson is NOT Amateur Radio. Steve, K4YZ MARS is NOT Amateur Radio. |
#509
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If you had to use CW... would robesin still be an idiot?
wrote: From: an old friend on Mon, Aug 21 2006 3:16 pm wrote: From: on Sun, Aug 20 2006 2:57 pm It's "minority rule" when ARRL lobbies for preservation of morse code test for any amateur radio license class. The ARRL membership is slightly less than a quarter of all US amateur radio licensees. The ARRL is trying to soften their image - the latest QST shows a person using a, gulp, microphone on the FRONT cover! Good grief! The sky is falling! The sky is falling! Just inside is yet another article on building a code key - from a door hinge. Oh, goody...HIGH TECH construction article. Would they follow that with another article on the door itself? Like, I mean, making the door a jar? :-) Ahem...my reference was the old fairy tale, "The Emperor's New Clothes." :-) That's the one where a full-of-himself ruler ordered some new clothes and the tailor buttered him up (while not sewing any new clothes) so much that the Emperor bought into this pandering to his ego and appeared in public with his "new clothes" (he was naked). Needless to say, the public laughed and laughed at this ridiculous spectacle. :-) Robeson has been all full of himself in here about his alleged "USMC service" yet he has presented zero-point-zero evidence from anyone else (or any legitimate agency) that he ever served on active USMC duty for any of his claimed "18 years." Even though he NOW thinks of himself AS the amateur radio service personified (anything against him is somehow against ALL radio amateurs), he is still parodying the "Emperor." This just in from The ARRL Letter, Vol. 25, No. 33, August 18, 2006 "ARRL First Vice President Kay Craigie, N3KN, represented the League at the Global Amateur Radio Emergency Communications Conference 2006." "Craigie stressed that Amateur Radio needs to avoid "being dazzled by our own press clippings into thinking that we are the big dog in emergency telecommunications."" She refers to robesin-like attitudes within the ARS. Oh. My. God. ! ! ! Tsk, just because NBC, CBS, ABC, CNN, FOX, ESPN, and PBS haven't covered the tremendously fantastic wonderfullest huge contribution to saving lives and property via ham radio? Gosh, there are all sorts of clippings from obscure weekly and biweekly newspapers dutifully cut-and-pasted into messages here from Robesin & Co. Maybe I'll have to write the Department of Defense and say that "Major" Robesin said that radio amateurs run MARS! They should fortwith cease and desist publishing DoD Directives on thinking that they started it and keep running it! Maybe I missed the "news" on the Home and Garden Channel...I don't watch that much... Right and all the other radio services are switching to morse code for all emergency communications a la ham radio...the sky has truly fallen! didit! Dahdah comrade. :-) |
#510
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If Lennie Anderson Had To Tell The Truth Once, Would Bill Clinton Swear Off Big Mac's and White House Interns? With "Engineers" Like Lennie, It's No Wonder Everything Says "Made In Someplace Other Than The United States"
From: an old freind on Tues, Aug 22 2006 4:16 pm
K4YZ wrote: an old freind wrote: K4YZ wrote: tried the same old tired rhetoric: But, challenge Robeson or call him in error and one will be inundated with personal insults. Robeson MUST be right and he MUST rule. Civil comportment be damned with Robeson in newsgroups. Those newsgroups were (in his mind) created to showcase Him? Yep. agreeing for once get help Get help for what? well a pro needs to way but Id say meglomanina paranoia, pathological lying for starts Give up on Robesin, Mark. He MUST remain "right" and He "must" rule. He isn't interested in civility. Once an "enemy" of his, always an enemy in his mind. Sick way to be but he is that way, repeatedly. He just proved it in the message you replied to. He is setting the example for all hams. Not going to help the amateur ranks in getting more hams but that is not, apparently, his point. Robesin needs to come out on TOP in his own mind, be chieftan, be the warlord. He also wants rec.radio.amateur. policy all his own to do with as he sees fit. [probably to have his daily fits in...] Ech... but titles like that are Robeson stock in trade my content in his posts just ranting on and on about epople instead of Issues Absolutely true, Mark. He tries to belittle his "enemies" so that He looks good. Problem is, it is working in reverse and he is only belittling himself. |
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