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  #852   Report Post  
Old September 12th 06, 09:55 PM posted to rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.scanner
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Default If you had to use CW to save someone's life, would that person die?

It's Not a Code, no code problem, it's a generational problem!



In the past week, the articles that seemed to get the most play on ham sites
were the Southern Border Volunteers and the lack of brotherhood in ham
radio.



I was amazed at the responses that were both negative and critical of
supporting a group that wanted to protect our borders. I suspect some
passengers were probably tsk tsking the only guy in four airplanes with the
guts to do something to stop the rag heads on 9/11. How else can you explain
rag heads armed ONLY with box cutters were able to control three airplanes?
Many of the younger generation find it easier to criticize than take action.



Ham radio went to hell when Dick Bash got involved with his published "cheat
sheets".



This piece is from the prospective of a ham with over 50 years spewing RF
throughout the world. At 68 years of age, I look back at my start in ham
radio, appearing before a steely eyed FCC examiner in Norfolk Virginia. I
missed the distance for a Conditional license by about 11 miles. I had to
walk between school and home in the snow, uphill both ways.



Do I think that everyone should have to do what I did to become a ham?
Nope, I can live with the memorized exams, the no code, etc. Like the
parable of the workers in the vineyard, I accept the rules have changed. At
no place in the parable does it tell the late arriving workers to ridicule
those that worked all day.



Just as sure as these words are on your screen, you too will someday be an
old fart just like me. As you enter the dotage of your life, health concerns
and the condition of your aged friends, becomes more of a concern. We, like
you, used to talk about more contemporary subjects. Unlike a number of you,
we allowed the older folks to have their conversations without ridicule. It
is called respect, and is a two way street. Realize that when I was a newby,
I suffered the same as you at the hands of the old farts. They believed that
for you to enter their group, you should first show respect and learn to
snatch the pebble from their hand.



None of you started in your working life as the CEO of the company, yet many
of today's generation feel that a newly minted license conveys total
knowledge. What you have is a license to learn, take advantage of it and the
brotherhood will naturally follow.



If we all took the time to show each other respect, and be less quick to
judge, not only would ham radio be better, but our lives as well.



wrote in message
oups.com...
Newsflash: ALL radio operators, code or no-code, are "appliance
operators" as you colloquially state. A radio is a means to
communicate. Knowing code just adds another way to use that radio.


Quite true, Opus! Thank you for pointing that out.

Let us hope that Blowcode sticks to his ARRL "Archie" comic
books while he mimes the "Wizard of Oz's" scarecrow wishing
he had a brain. :-(





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Old September 13th 06, 12:53 AM posted to rec.radio.amateur.antenna,rec.radio.amateur.policy,rec.radio.scanner
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Default If you had to use CW to save someone's life, would that person die?

Fred Hambrecht wrote:
It's Not a Code, no code problem, it's a generational problem!


In the past week, the articles that seemed to get the most play on ham sites
were the Southern Border Volunteers and the lack of brotherhood in ham
radio.


I was amazed at the responses that were both negative and critical of
supporting a group that wanted to protect our borders. I suspect some
passengers were probably tsk tsking the only guy in four airplanes with the
guts to do something to stop the rag heads on 9/11.


The hijackers on Flight 93 were stopped by more than one guy. And the
people on the other planes did not know the hijackers were on a suicide
mission.

How else can you explain
rag heads armed ONLY with box cutters were able to control three airplanes?


Simple:

- The hijackers killed one or two people who tried to resist.
- Then they said they had a bomb aboard.
- They also said that if the passengers did as they were told, nobody
else would get hurt.

You have to remember that before that terrible morning 5 years ago,
suicide-hijacking was unknown. Hijackers took over planes to get
ransom, or to get transportation somewhere, or for political reasons.
They always had demands and always promised that if their demands were
met, nobody would get hurt or killed. And the conventional way of
dealing with them was to do what they wanted, get the plane on the
ground safely, negotiate, and then go after them on the ground.

All that changed on Sept 11, 2001. Look what happened when that
shoe-bomb guy tried it.

The folks on Flight 93 had two things the people on the other flights
did not:

1) They *knew* the rules had changed - they knew what the hijackers
were going to do.

2) They had time to formulate a plan and time to implement it.

Many of the younger generation find it easier to criticize than take action.


Just like their predecessors.

Ham radio went to hell when Dick Bash got involved with his published "cheat
sheets".


Well, I don't know if it "went to hell" but I agree 100% that Bash's
"cheat sheets" were a very bad thing for amateur radio.

Remember, though, that it was the top folks at FCC who decided not to
prosecute Bash. Lower-level FCC officials had evidence against him, and
wanted to go after him with criminal charges - but the leadership said
no. Those FCC folks who decided to let Bash get away with his "cheat
sheets" almost 30 years ago were not young people then.

This piece is from the prospective of a ham with over 50 years spewing RF
throughout the world. At 68 years of age, I look back at my start in ham
radio, appearing before a steely eyed FCC examiner in Norfolk Virginia. I
missed the distance for a Conditional license by about 11 miles. I had to
walk between school and home in the snow, uphill both ways.


HAW! That's a good one!

Do I think that everyone should have to do what I did to become a ham?
Nope, I can live with the memorized exams, the no code, etc. Like the
parable of the workers in the vineyard, I accept the rules have changed. At
no place in the parable does it tell the late arriving workers to ridicule
those that worked all day.


But is it fair that someone who works an hour should get the same pay
as someone who works ten hours doing the same thing?

Just as sure as these words are on your screen, you too will someday be an
old fart just like me. As you enter the dotage of your life, health concerns
and the condition of your aged friends, becomes more of a concern. We, like
you, used to talk about more contemporary subjects. Unlike a number of you,
we allowed the older folks to have their conversations without ridicule. It
is called respect, and is a two way street. Realize that when I was a newby,
I suffered the same as you at the hands of the old farts. They believed that
for you to enter their group, you should first show respect and learn to
snatch the pebble from their hand.


Well, I'm 52, and next month I will have 39 years as a radio amateur.

None of you started in your working life as the CEO of the company, yet many
of today's generation feel that a newly minted license conveys total
knowledge. What you have is a license to learn, take advantage of it and the
brotherhood will naturally follow.


If we all took the time to show each other respect, and be less quick to
judge, not only would ham radio be better, but our lives as well.

That I can agree with!

73 de Jim, N2EY

Not an appliance operator.

  #855   Report Post  
Old September 13th 06, 01:32 AM posted to rec.radio.amateur.policy
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Default trolling right along

wrote:
Dave Heil wrote:


I recall pointing out to Brian Burke that we were discussing ARRL
elections and *not* the U.S. Judicial System.



I recall Jim Miccolis saying more about the US Judicial System than
anyone else.


I recall your bringing up the comparison.

Dave K8MN



  #856   Report Post  
Old September 13th 06, 04:08 AM posted to rec.radio.amateur.policy
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From: on Tues, Sep 12 2006 3:37 am

Dave Heil wrote:
As I told you earlier, you get what you dish out. You'd no sooner blown
back into this newsgroup when you started with the cutesy names. Brian
is guilty of the same technique. As for Mark, his posting record speaks
for itself. He *is* the group Myna bird.


Who is "Brian?"

You NEVER seem to have a problem with Robesin's use of "Brain." Ever.


Hypocrisy in action, Brian. :-)

Heil belongs to the cute coterie of elite morsemen extras. As
such he thinks he has "federal authorization" to do whatever
he pleases anywhere. :-)

But here you are complaining about other people again.


No sweat, Brian, it's business as usual with the elite, smug,
arrogant, and oh-so-"superior" extras... :-)

Their dictum is "Morsemen are NEVER at fault, ever!"

Really BAD public relations for US amateur radio.



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Old September 13th 06, 04:10 AM posted to rec.radio.amateur.policy
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From: Dave Heil on Tues, Sep 12 2006 7:48 am

wrote:
Dave Heil wrote:



Who is "Brian?"


If you don't know that information, all of your latest diatribe is
rather pointless.


PRICELESS quote. Kept as an "approved answer" for future use.
:-)

You NEVER seem to have a problem with Robesin's use of "Brain." Ever.


You've NEVER been advised of my position on the matter. Ever.


Perhaps you should hold a State Department PRESS CONFERENCE
to explain it to the public? :-)


But here you are complaining about other people again.


For the record, tell us what it is that you were doing in the post to
which I am now responding.


"For the record" tell us about your quite-evidence hypocrisy
rationales in here. :-)

Were you and Len not complaining about K4YZ in recent days?


Who is "K4YZ?"

Why can't you use this individual's NAME?

After all, you tacitly condone his conduct in this newsgroup.
You must be "good buddies" in the treehouse, both of you
being amateur extra morsemen.

Tsk, BAD public relations for US amateur radio.



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Old September 13th 06, 04:14 AM posted to rec.radio.amateur.policy
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From: Dave Heil on Mon, Sep 11 2006 9:45 pm

wrote:
From: Dave Heil on Mon, Sep 11 2006 2:46 pm
wrote:
From: Dave Heil 940 on Sun, Sep 10 2006 3:26 pm
wrote:
From: on Sun, Sep 10 2006 7:55 am
wrote:
From: on Thurs, Sep 7 2006 6:53 pm
wrote:



As I told you earlier, you get what you dish out.


Tsk, I've gotten no "dishes" from this newsgroup. Most of it
is 'macaroni and chiz." :-)

You'd no sooner blown
back into this newsgroup when you started with the cutesy names.


"Blown back?" :-) Tsk, tsk, I've been in here since
before the world's greatest DXer was here, back when he
WAS DX (paid for by the US taxpayer). :-)

Brian is guilty of the same technique.


Brian got "dishes?" I'll have to ask him. Maybe we can
compare the cooking up of ersatz "food" by all the extra
super-special morsemen. [overcooked by them, as usual]

As for Mark, his posting record speaks
for itself. He *is* the group Myna bird.


Tsk. No sooner had you blown back into this newsgroup when
you stated with the cutesy names.

But, you hypocritically rationalize that as "approved" and
"condoned" since you are an extra super-special morseman.


YOU are not of the FCC, not an official thereof...


No, I am not. You just stated who regulates U.S. amateur radio.
You are not one who does.


True. But YOU pretend to be the RULER (by some posturing
and preening and smug superiority) of it, the one who
"approves" and "disapproves" of conduct. :-)


... Nobody has given more commands or invited more
people to leave than Len Anderson.


Who is this "Len Anderson"? How did you arrive at the
numbers of "leave commands?" Did you check with the
person who has the callsign N2EY? Remember, only HIS
numbers are the "correct" ones. :-)


Well, Foghorn, you told you what to do.


Hypocrisy in action. It is "approved" for extra super-
special morsemen to use any words they see fit, but NOT
good conduct for NON-morsemen to do the same. Tsk, tsk.

You can capitalize words and stomp your tired old feet all day long.


Tsk. CAPITALIZING words needs to be done in some cases
to get through to the tired, closed-mind morsemen who
cannot comprehend anyone having opinions other than
morsemen's imaginings of glory.

Sometimes there's no other recourse but to use a 2x4
to bang on the heads of 1x2s. :-)

As
long as I'm able to continue enjoying amateur radio and you stand on the
outside, pouting, life is pretty good, Len. Have a nice day.


Tsk, tsk. All I'm doing is advocating the elimination
of the morse code test for US amateur radio licensing...for
the benefit of anyone who might want to enjoy the HOBBY of
amateur radio.

While you thought you were high up in some kind of amateur
morse treehouse, I was way up in the big REAL radio
high-rise some distance away, much higher up and
communicating with many more humans.

Enjoy your ham radio. We all see you have lots of pickles
to go with that ham. [the pickel dill is making your face
and words all puckered?] Bon apetit.

My day is dandy. I have some free time to consider more
about the retrograde attitudes of olde-tyme elite morsemen
who wish to keep US amateur radio forever in the standards
and practices of Their youth. That without thinking that
Their youth is long gone. Yet they posture and preen
about their (self-described) greatness without realizing
that they are simply imagining things.

I am a citizen of the United States of America.


What'd I just write? Your citizenship is acknowledged.


Amazing! Heil actually "conceded" that I was correct!

Now, if only the person known as "N2EY" can concede
to my statements being right, it would be a cause for
celebration! :-)

You commented to the FCC. Happy now?


No. The FCC has taken NO VISIBLE ACTION on the NPRM of
last year.


... I got INTO radio in 1953.


You keep flipping the channel, OM. You wrote "AMATEUR" RADIO above.


No, I wrote just "radio."

Now you've switched to the generic "radio".


"Generic?" :-)

You mean to say that the ARRL and Hiram Percy Maxim did NOT
INVENT all radio? :-)

You've never gotten into "AMATEUR radio".


Tsk. Sorry Old Man (from the "CW" abbreviation of "OM"
approved by all extra super-special morsemen), but I've
designed and built radios of my own as a HOBBYIST. That
HOBBY activity included buying and converting two surplus
ARC-5 HF stations back in 1947, then selling-trading
those to others. Good introduction to radio technology
as a teenager.

OH! You must mean FEDERALLY LICENSED "amateur" radio!
I keep forgetting that you keep forgetting adjectives
whenever you write that. My bad.

Alternatively, you've told us that you don't
have any desire to obtain an amateur radio license


True. I was granted a Commercial First 'Phone in 1956. That's
a license for a professional. I lost interest in being an
amateur after being a professional.


It looks as if you have your wish.


"Wish?!?" No "wish," senior, er senor. Turned out to be
both intellectually stimulating, interesting (not to mention
financially rewarding - without subsidy from the US taxpayer)
to be a professional in radio-electronics.

You needn't worry about amateur radio.


No "worries," senor Gordo, er HEIL. My advocacy is just a
bit of campaigning to both modernize US amateur radio
regulations and to enable more US citizens to enter and
enjoy that HOBBY. [it IS a hobby despite no specific use
of that word by the FCC in Title 47 C.F.R.] [neither does
the FCC use the word "ham" in Title 47]

I am not in the least "worried." YOU seem to be worried
since you spend so much time in here trying to denigrate
and defame all no-code-test advocates. YOU have the
"superior" license, why don't you USE that instead of
making all the smug, arrogant stuff against others in here?

Feel free to appoint yourself advocate for something-or-other in
professional radio.


I do that also. I AM a Life Member of the IEEE (Institute
for Electrical and Electronic Engineers, a professional
association with 397 thousand members worldwide). I stay
aware and informed of the much larger electronics industry
activity that is happening now.

I've had a decades-long interest in RADIO and ELECTRONICS.


That isn't what you wrote. You used the words "amateur radio".


"Amateur radio" is a small subset of the larger ("generic?")
activity of ELECTRONICS.

"Amateur radio" is not restricted to just being federally
licensed as a US radio amateur (complete with a pretty
certificate suitable for framing) or the transmission of
EM energy on allocated amateur bands. "Amateur" means
"without pecuniary interest." Non-professional. The
definition is semantically equivalent to a HOBBY, an
avocation.

You've limited yourself by not including "amateurism". You're a victim
of inertia.


"Inertia?!?" We are ALL subject to Isaac Newton's laws.
[like it or not...:-)]

Are you having another out-of-body experience? Tsk, tsk.

"Out of body experiences" do not follow Newton's laws.

Your "truisms" don't seem to be true, Leonardo. What's "Anti-Pesto",
another thing you're against?


Had you seen a full-length animated film called "The
Curse of the Were-Rabbit" in 2005 you would understand.


I didn't choose to see it. It sounds awful.


Tsk, MILLIONS have seen and enjoyed it. Lots of subtle
humor in it.

However, I can understand how elitist super-special
morsemen with smug, arrogant attitudes would not take
to enjoying much except putting down the no-code-test
advocates. Some of those elitists prefer "Monty Python's
Flying Circus." :-)


You don't give orders here, Len.


You mean this ISN'T the Domino's Pizza newsgroup? :-(

Okay, I'll use the telephone to order one.


It's much too warm for the hot buttered rum. I'm still enjoying mint
juleps. We don't generally light a fire in the fireplace until sometime
in October. It is rare that we laugh at anyone other than the wrinkled
kid with his pants at half mast. He stands outside and periodically
barks an order.


Tsk, you are hallucinating again. Must be the alcohol...


On the other hand, you don't see your own actions as selfish and you
don't see that is possible that you are wrong.


Tsk, the elitist super-special morsemen amateurs keep
telling me "I'm wrong" all the time... :-)

You've shown no tolerance for those whose views is opposite your own.


Tsk, a typical comment from an elitist super-special extra
amateur morseman: Not favoring their personal desires is
defined by them as "intolerant!" :-)


You've claimed in the past to only be here for civil debate.


NAH...I've desired civil debate...but never got it from
day one in here. :-)

The elitist super-special extra morsemen amateurs were
never about to accept the inevitable of elimination of
the amateur radio code test! :-)

Your record shows otherwise.


My "record?!?" :-) I've never "cut" a record, taped
anything, or produced a CD on that subject. :-)

Your words are disingenuous.


Wow! You've been at the dictionary again!


There has been no evidence that you accept *anything* they say.


Tsk. Go back to the dictionary again. "Acceptance" is not
synonymous with Blind Obedience. ;-)

[are you "homonym-phobic?" :-) ]


I don't "play" with arrogant retrogrades intent on being
the ruler in some archaic radiotelegraphy society...


I know of no such organization.


You should. It is known as the US 'ARS.' You ARE a member.


The above statement points the way to your failure to win converts in
this venue.


"Win converts?!?" Is this some sort of evangelical moment
for you? A religious experience? :-)

My bad. I forgot this newsgroup was created for the extra
super-special amateur morsemen to have their last gasp in
putting down all the no-code-test advocates.

Well, I suppose you think God spoke to you. Wheels have
spokes. You fancy yourself a "wheel." "Wheels" think
they can roll all over their opponents...but ONLY on
smooth highways of their own choosing. [imagination of
the extra super-special amateur morsemen is astounding]

beep, beep,



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Old September 13th 06, 04:18 AM posted to rec.radio.amateur.policy
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Default Jimmy's Follies In Bad Analogies

From: Dave Heil on Mon, Sep 11 2006 10:07 pm

wrote:
From: Dave Heil on Mon, Sep 11 2006 3:13 pm
wrote:
From: 951 on Sun, Sep 10 2006 3:28 pm
wrote:
From: on Thurs, Sep 7 2006 6:42 pm
wrote:
From: on Mon, Sep 4 2006 5:30 pm
Dave Heil wrote:
wrote:
wrote:
From: an old friend on Sun, Sep 3 2006 10:09 am



N2EY tried to magnify one of my old statements, taking it well
out of context, attempting to MANUFACTURE some personal
"defect" of mine. His product QC was terrible and the product
FAILED.


That's funny. I don't see it that way at all. You stepped on a bear
trap and it clanked shut on you. Now you're busy attempting to explain
how much you know about bear traps.


"Bear traps?!?" Are you now trying to manufacture something
else?

Tsk, that "product" failed in fabrication!


One does NOT need to be a licensed realtor to understand Los Angeles
ares real estate matters.


"Ares?" :-)

So, you and the person formerly known as "N2EY" consider
yourself "expert" on Los Angeles ordinances concerning
residential areas and homes?

No doubt you both do, deep into the fantasy of extra super-
special morsemen KNOWING EVERYTHING because they once
passed a telegraphy test. :-)


There is all kinds of information on Los Angeles area real estate
available on the web. There are additional sources of infomation
including libraries and even Los Angeles real estate agents.


Okay, go there and whatever newsgroup covers real estate.
I'm sure you will be welcomed with open arms, being the
"expert" on matters 3000 miles from where you live. :-)


Others aren't required to read or respond. It has worked well and it
reveals a horse's patoot with one leg clamped in a bear trap.


It's not nice to describe the person formerly known as "N2EY"
in that way. You should apologize to him.

beep, beep,



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Old September 13th 06, 04:41 AM posted to rec.radio.amateur.policy
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wrote:
Dave Heil wrote:

wrote:

Dave Heil wrote:



As I told you earlier, you get what you dish out. You'd no sooner blown
back into this newsgroup when you started with the cutesy names. Brian
is guilty of the same technique. As for Mark, his posting record speaks
for itself. He *is* the group Myna bird.


Who is "Brian?"


If you don't know that information, all of your latest diatribe is
rather pointless.



Point made.

That you can't answer the question shows that you are as clueless as
you actually pretend to be.


Don't ask me, "who is Brian" and expect me to take your question seriously.


You NEVER seem to have a problem with Robesin's use of "Brain." Ever.


You've NEVER been advised of my position on the matter. Ever.



I have by your actions.


No, you assuredly have not. I have taken no actions regarding the matter.

You complain about Len, Mark, and for whatever reason, my use of
"cutesy" names.


Len uses 'em. You jump on his band wagon. You've used the same cutesy
names as Len.

Never have you mentioned Robesin's use of "Brain."


That's right. I haven't.


But here you are complaining about other people again.


For the record, tell us what it is that you were doing in the post to
which I am now responding.

Were you and Len not complaining about K4YZ in recent days?



His constant use of "cutesy" names which you seem to have an objection
to, but only when other people use them.


To be quite honest, I don't often read his posts. When he and Mark get
into a contest, I find that I often have better things to do. I don't
read Mark's posts at all unless someone responds to one of them.

You're as two-faced as a person can be.


That's simply not right, Brian. You often pop into the group for no
other purpose than to snipe at Steve or to take a poke at me. Then you
sit back and take objection if something similar is tossed back your
way. If you're swinging at Steve and he calls you "Brain", what do you
think I should be doing about it? What action should I take? Should I
place a quarter page ad in QST, condemning his action? Most of the time
I don't give a rat's patoot about it.

Get over yourself.


I have no reason to do so. I'm lquite comfortable in my skin.

Dave K8MN

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