wrote:

...
Wayyyyy too many anony-mousies in here. :-)

73, LA

Pretty much ... hard to tell fiction from fact, huh?

Regards,
JS

Brenda Ann wrote:
I want them gone, gov't bureaucrats are enough to put up with, private
sector idiots sneaking into gov't regs, rules, exams and policy is much
more than any citizen should endure. I already pay taxes to have these
things taken care of, they don't need to hire maids and butlers to do
their work ...

Well, most of us don't. Fact is, there are very very few FCC field offices
left. People from Oregon would have to go to Seattle or San Francisco to
take their tests (as would hams from Idaho, Montana, Wyoming, Utah, etc.. )
I was fortunate when I originally got my ham ticket that the Portland field
office was still in existance. It's no longer there. Most can't take the
time off work in the middle of the week to drive 200 miles (more or less,
from Portland to Seattle) just to take a test. With the Volunteer Examiner
program, it allows hams to take tests usually at a place within a few miles
of their own home town, with flexible times, usually on a weekend when they
don't have to give up valuable work time.

Well, I feel for ya Brenda Ann ...

But trading convenience for right is a mistake ... but then, you already
know that.

Warmest regards,
JS

Personally, I think you're just acrybaby.

Nope. I'm not crying about it and never have. I don't need any
stinking ham bands. I have fifty-nine channels (actually more) that I
can legally use without any liscence whatsoever.

With a GMRS liscence, I can use sixteen more channels for a total of
seventy-five channels (actually more) that I can legally use without a
ham liscence at all.

And recently, someoe at my house just purchased a new "two way radio"
that gives me an extra FRS channel that doesn't use any of the
standard 14 FRS channels and doesn't use any of te GMRS channel;s, and
is perfectly legal for use in the U.S.

It was even advertised as "use it at sporting events and shopping
malls to stay in contact with your family and friends".and as "two-
watt radio".

I'm not sure what the range is of it yet. I'll test it out when the
weather gets warmer. This radio also doesn't have any way of
monitoring for other people's transmissions before you tansmit.

But you don't need to since it automatically sends a code that ollows
only the people in your group to heaar it, You can't set it to hear
other people's transmissions even if you try to., even if they're on
the same channel.

And it can't be picked up by radio scanners the genreal public uses,
it can't be picked up by frs radios that use the standard 14 frs
channels. It can't be picked up by GMRS radios or ham radios either.
Although I'm sure the hams will try to.

It seems to truly be a radio with your own private lFRS channel.

And yes, it's FCC-approved. So don't give me any of this "you're using
an illegal radio transmitter on frequencies you're not authorized to
transmit on" garbage.

On Feb 11, 10:26 pm, james wrote:
On 11 Feb 2007 13:45:13 -0800, "policy-ham"
wrote:

+++Found on qrz.com. The ARRL now only wants only no code hams. And as
+++for the rest of us?

**************

Just think of it this way, you know more than they will by knowing how
to use Morse Code at any speed. Now you hae a conversation with some
otehr Ham that knows CW and the newbies wont understand what your
talking about. Think of it as a benefit, not as disadvantage.

james

I disagree. Not know more. Just know different. Other people have said
there hasn't been any new improvements in ham radio technology in
decades.

The morse code requirement was probably holding them back.

Look at other industries. The latest improvements made were made by
people not familiar with the old technology, but familiar with the
newer technology.

In the computer industry, most of the recent improvements have been
made by people not familiar with the punch card sysyem.

If they were still required to learn and use the punch-card system,
they wouldn't have as much time to study all the newer technologies
and the improvements either wouldn't have gotten made at all, or at
least not as fast.

They would still bee stuck uing the old very slow computers that use
punch cards.

The same goes for a lot of other industries, also.

Although with other things instead of computers and punch cards.

"John Smith" wrote in message
...
David G. Nagel wrote:

...
You can become a VEC if you so desire. All you have to do is find enough
hams to support your efforts and create an organization to conduct
examination sessions.
There is nothing magic about the VEC. It just takes a lot of unpaid work
on the part of a lot of people. Yes some get paid to process the
paperwork and file the actual application for your license. No one is
getting rich on this program.

Dave WD9BDZ

Dave:

Actually, I know all this ... I don't like the system.

Gives too much power to the forces I am opposed to ... but then, you
already knew that ...

Regards,
JS

So you want to give this much power to the government?? Not me. This was an
extremely progressive idea and actually gives a great deal of control to the
people. It maximizes the personal freedom and choices of the participants.
Would you really like to go back to the repressive "old" day??

Dee, N8UZE

"John Smith I" wrote in message
...
Brenda Ann wrote:
I want them gone, gov't bureaucrats are enough to put up with, private
sector idiots sneaking into gov't regs, rules, exams and policy is much
more than any citizen should endure. I already pay taxes to have these
things taken care of, they don't need to hire maids and butlers to do
their work ...

Well, most of us don't. Fact is, there are very very few FCC field
offices left. People from Oregon would have to go to Seattle or San
Francisco to take their tests (as would hams from Idaho, Montana,
Wyoming, Utah, etc.. ) I was fortunate when I originally got my ham
ticket that the Portland field office was still in existance. It's no
longer there. Most can't take the time off work in the middle of the week
to drive 200 miles (more or less, from Portland to Seattle) just to take
a test. With the Volunteer Examiner program, it allows hams to take tests
usually at a place within a few miles of their own home town, with
flexible times, usually on a weekend when they don't have to give up
valuable work time.

Well, I feel for ya Brenda Ann ...

But trading convenience for right is a mistake ... but then, you already
know that.

Warmest regards,
JS


The Volunteer Examiner program puts control where it belongs, directly in
the hands of the citizens rather than the government. The government then
takes its rightful place in promulgating, administering and enforcing the
rules rather than dealing with all the minutia on a day to day basis
required to run the program itself.

Michigan has done the same thing with its driver's licensing. Both the
written and driving tests have been contracted out to private companies.
The state monitors the program and handles the broader functions such as
maintaining the database and enforcement.

Dee, N8UZE

------------ wrote:

But you don't need to since it automatically sends a code that ollows
only the people in your group to heaar it, You can't set it to hear
other people's transmissions even if you try to., even if they're on
the same channel.

PL tones are nothing new and anybody can tune into the same frequency and
PL...

--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

On Mar 1, 3:15�pm, "Dee Flint" wrote:
"John Smith" wrote in message
...

David G. Nagel wrote:

...
You can become a VEC if you so desire. All you have to do is find enough
hams to support your efforts and create an organization to conduct
examination sessions.
There is nothing magic about the VEC. It just takes a lot of unpaid work
on the part of a lot of people. Yes some get paid to process the
paperwork and file the actual application for your license. No one is
getting rich on this program.

Dave WD9BDZ

Dave:

Actually, I know all this ... I don't like the system.

Gives too much power to the forces I am opposed to ... but then, you
already knew that ...

So you want to give this much power to the government?? Not me. *This was an
extremely progressive idea and actually gives a great deal of control to the
people. *It maximizes the personal freedom and choices of the participants.
Would you really like to go back to the repressive "old" day??

I don't regard privatization as "progressive," only economical
for the government...and, perhaps, less economical for the
individual depending on where they live relative to any testing
location.

COLEMs have it a bit easier since they can both teach a
commercial licensee and test them in a continuous course.
That is more convenient for the newbie commercial license
applicant. That is similar to school courses with the FCC
exam as the "final."

VECs - usually - do not sequentially teach and then test.
They can if they so desire, but few VEs are qualified or
have experience as teachers. VEs can proctor a test
with little experience other than handling paper and seeing
that all the blanks are properly filled-in and check answer
sheets against a template. That is not a Masters or
Doctorate level work. :-)

73, LA

Dee Flint wrote:

...
The Volunteer Examiner program puts control where it belongs, directly in
the hands of the citizens rather than the government. The government then
takes its rightful place in promulgating, administering and enforcing the
rules rather than dealing with all the minutia on a day to day basis
required to run the program itself.
...
Dee, N8UZE

If you are speaking about putting control in all 350 million citizens
hands (well, those over 18 and citizens of the united states) in some
form of vote--ABSOLUTELY!

If you are speaking about putting control in only those hands which
possess amateur tickets--ABSOLUTELY NOT!

A gov't agency, responsible to ALL citizens of the US is then the
correct means to implement a democratic republic. But then, you already
knew that from your HS and college civic classes ...

Letting the fox run the hen house is NOT American!

JS

Dee Flint wrote:
"John Smith I" wrote in message
...
Dee Flint wrote:
"John Smith I" wrote in message
...
Dee Flint wrote:
"John Smith I" wrote in message
...
wrote:

...
73s,


Len:

Just for starters, it pieces me off that the FCC doesn't even host the
download of the amateur pool questions "right-out-and-openly" on their
web page. This alone gives the VEC and arrl MUCH more credibility
then the toothless old grumps deserve. And, I have complained about
this ... I will continue to do so, use the public funds and keep this
outta private hands and influence!

The arrl need to go, and Carl is NOT looking like a good replacement
with NCI when he boot licks ... amateur radio needs a new start and
some new blood ... someone needs to kick some real booty here.

Regards,
JS
There are at least 12 VECs. These VECs create a Question Pool
Committee and create the pool and maintain it. Since the question pool
is available in its entirety for free from a number of websites and
since the FCC does not create nor maintain the pool, there is little
reason for it to be on the FCC web site.

Dee, N8UZE
Did I vote for these VECs? Are these VECs responsible to me under law?
Do these VECs' use public resource monies, and if so, why? Were these
VEC elected? Appointed by a congressman of mine? By the house? By the
senate?

Tell me more about why these VECs should have their A$$E$ kicked down
the stairwell ...

JS
No, you did not vote for the VECs. However, anyone could have sent an
objection to the FCC if they thought a given organization was unsuitable
for this program.

Yes they are responsible to you under the law since they are accountable
to the FCC. If any VEC (these are organizations by the way), is found to
be remiss in its duties, they can loose their standing as a VEC. At the
time the system was being developed, any organization could have applied
and if they met the FCC's standards could have been certified as a VEC.

Yes the VECs are responsible to you under the law since you have both the
right and responsibility to file a complaint with the FCC if you find
that they are not acting according to the requirements of the FCC.

The VECs do not use any public resource monies. The expenses of testing
are covered by the testing fees, which are set by the FCC.

The VECs were selected and appointed by the FCC from various
organizations applying for this task.

You may not like the VE system, but amateur radio experienced a surge of
growth once exams became available at times and locations that candidates
could get with ease and without having to take time off work.

Dee, N8UZE
I want them gone, gov't bureaucrats are enough to put up with, private
sector idiots sneaking into gov't regs, rules, exams and policy is much
more than any citizen should endure. I already pay taxes to have these
things taken care of, they don't need to hire maids and butlers to do
their work ...

JS

Be sure to include the proposed tax increase for funding when you get the
FCC to resume doing the testing. Their budget no longer includes money for
such as they are getting the testing done for FREE by volunteers like
myself.

Dee, N8UZE



Yep, FCC should design/implement the exam forms and get the money it
costs to print/disperse and implement said exams--the citizens pay for
this, naturally, there is no "money tree" which provides money, we the
citizens foot EVERY cost of ours, whether someone hides these costs from
us or not.

That is American, we pay our own way here.

JS