"D Peter Maus" wrote in message
...
. And now, twice, in front of the group, he's promised to get his engineers
out here to take signal strength measurements at my location to determine
why I can't hear a local 50kw station, but immediately dropped all
conversation about it.

And that, whille none of your business, is due to the fact that Paul Easter,
an talented and wonderful engineer, moved to a corporate position at Salem,
and we are short handed in the middle of two transmitter moves.

To date the only one who's bothered to investigate my reception issues,
is me.

Good for you.

. And some blatant inconsistencies in his claims about agencies/sales.

Your experiences of a decade or more ago have little to do with the current
situation, where interactive media is far more attractive to advertising
agencies than radio because there are more creative dollars to be made
there.

And his experience. These things make me suspect that, though, he's still
the David we've all come to know and love, that he's getting low on the
calm, educational patience he's showed a year ago, and is now running out
of both patience, and appreciation of the intercourse.

I'm out of patience with the people who insist that there is listening to
distant skywave signals, when there is no such thing documented and with
those who think AM is not on a horrible decline, with its main and majority
format, news talk, moving to FM. And I'm out of patience with you, who think
a radio station in 2007 can change the demos on a buy because he once saw a
station changed on a buy. I spoke with the head or our naitonal rep about
changing demos on a campaign, and she simply laughed.

But when David speaks, he speaks like a policy statement. There's only
a level of personal interaction after it's been brought to his attention
that there is none. Hell, even Eric Richards, with whom I share no
personal cordiality, will address a post as though he's talking TO me, but
not AT me. David doesn't do that. He speaks AT his opponent. Overwhelming
with statistics, where a conversational sentence will do. Jumping into
conversations with material that brings nothing to the topic at hand, but
definitely puts his expertise and policy positions on display.

When the responses I get are idiotic, I react as one does to an idiot. At
some point, it came to me that DXers were now enemies of radio stations...
which is when I dropped my Northamerican radio club memberships... because
supporting one's enemies with money is hardly rational. The inability of the
DX community to realize that AM has changed from a music medium to a talk
one, and that shows like Noory are necessary, and that technical changes
have to come if there is any chace of AM survival make the DXer a Luddite of
the first order.

Then there was the issue of his ham credentials. When pressed he gave a
credible story about corruption in the testing process in Ecuador. Nothing
out of the ordinary, actually. Nothing outside the realm of possibility.
Certainly, something we'd all believe based on the politics of the region.
But when pressed, he gave no clarification, with any personal experiential
content. Just something that sounds a likely story.

Drivers licences, visas, import permits, bulding permits, licences, tax
audits, etc., were all facilitated in a way that is accepted outside the US,
and not called "corrupt" as you have called it. It's just a different
system. And while I was there, there was no exam for a ham license at all...
you had to be sponsored by the RCE (Radio Club del Ecuador) or other of the
ham associations, and you got a license. My sponsor was Ing. Fred Simon.

But, with about 30 years of living outside the US, and even more working
there, I am used to US gringo standards being applied to other cultures as a
metric. Other cultures do not work like the American system, and can not be
compared to it, either.

Colleagues, whether vocational or avocational, don't address each other
like that. He claims to be a DXer, but disdains DXers.

Anyone with over 2000 AM veries has, I think, earned the right to be called
a DXer. But I am not a club member of any of the DX orgainzations because
the hobby, which led me into radio, now pretty universally hates
broadcasters and the very stations they listen to.

As I said, I've known people in the Radio business like that. But then
don't rise to the level of corporate oversight, or management. And they
are certainly not leaders. Usually they're middle manglement. And
consultants.

Of which I am neither.

On Sep 29, 4:57 pm, Telamon
wrote:
In article ,
"David Eduardo" wrote:





"dxAce" wrote in message
...

SFTV_troy wrote:

I don't really understand why people are upset about the loss of
DX'ing over AM (only temporarily; it will be restored when AM goes
pure digital). You can still do DX'ing via using services like
shoutcast.com. Just yesterday at work I was listening to an
Australian station. Another favorite of mine is located in England.
DX'ing is still alive and well on the internet.

Uh... that's NOT DX'ing.

It may well become the DXing of the 21st Century.

That may work out for you but most people do not have the self
delusional capacity you possess.

--
Telamon
Ventura, California- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

d'Eduardo 'invents' 21st Century DXing
- - - and add's it to his Bio.

d'Eduardo Wins the Al Gore
"Hey I Invented That" Award.

~ RHF

"Eric F. Richards" wrote in message
...
Steve wrote:


Sorry Tardo, but you'll never stop the internet or internet radio.

He (or those who think like him) can destroy conventional radio, and
where it is useful is in times of emergency, such as 9/11 or when a
major river-crossing bridge suddenly ceases to exist.

And an FM can not provide the needed service in the Minneapolis case? Or did
the bridge extend across the entire Great Plains.

WWL was one of the really lucky stations, as it had been hardened. Nearly
nowhere on the Gulf Coast or FL is there a station that sould survive what
WWL went through. The first to go in a hurricane are usually AMs, as the
sites tend to be low and damp. FMs with backups on buildings are the most
robust today. I have been through a bunch of big hurricanes while in PR, and
the AMs never stayed on.... the FMs did.

For a commuter, all that chit-chat between the musical pieces or the
news stories is very useful.

And an FM can not do that?

FMs are highly viable still; with few exceptions, AMs are not.

On Sep 29, 4:38 pm, "David Eduardo" wrote:
"dxAce" wrote in message

...



SFTV_troy wrote:

I don't really understand why people are upset about the loss of
DX'ing over AM (only temporarily; it will be restored when AM goes
pure digital). You can still do DX'ing via using services like
shoutcast.com. Just yesterday at work I was listening to an
Australian station. Another favorite of mine is located in England.
DX'ing is still alive and well on the internet.

Uh... that's NOT DX'ing.

It may well become the DXing of the 21st Century.

d'Eduardo is SFTV_troy on your Pay Roll ?

Eric F. Richards wrote:
D Peter Maus wrote:


Hell, even Eric Richards, with whom I
share no personal cordiality,

Laf.

That's YOUR choice, Peter, not mine. And, FWIW, it inspired some
interesting email from former participants in this group.


No doubt. What doesn't.


will address a post as though he's talking
TO me, but not AT me. David doesn't do that. He speaks AT his opponent.
Overwhelming with statistics, where a conversational sentence will do.

Actually, I disagree. He overwhemlms with statistical buzzwords
rather than statistics. It's easy to talk about normal distributions
if you have read about statistics, but what if you don't know where a
normal distribution simply doesn't apply?


Both good points.



Jumping into conversations with material that brings nothing to the
topic at hand, but definitely puts his expertise and policy positions on
display.

Just an ego trip. "Let me show you how much I know." Only it doesn't
work.

Generally a post I would agree with. It doesn't take a radio insider
to see it, though.


And that's my point...a real conversation doesn't.

On Sep 29, 6:21 am, SFTV_troy wrote:
Rfburns wrote:
Despite the fact that both the AM and FM versions of HD radio are a
good example of out-of -control technology that nobody really wants,
the FCC has mandated that all broadcasting will be digital.
Therefore, I see no turning back regardless of what the consumer does
or doesn't want or understand.

Switching to digital just makes sense. Digital makes better use of
the limited space available. With digital the FM band would
effectively triple or even quadruple the number of channels on the
dial. (Alternatively Classical FM stations could boost the sound from
2 channel stereo to 5.1 surround.)

That's good for the consumer, and something I'd like to see happen.

As for AM... well to be honest, I don't even care. AM is largely
ignored by myself, since there's little there worth hearing. (Rush
Limbaugh? Michael Medved? Some Liberal Nutjob? Pu-leeze. Not
thanks.) But as long as I'm upgrading my FM to digital, we might as
well bring AM along for the ride, too.

I want to see FM upgraded with three to four times more programs to
choose from.

SFTV_troy are you on d'Eduardo's Pay Roll ?
-or- Work for any of the Companies that Employ Him ?
-or- Work for a Radio Station using his Programming ?

David Eduardo wrote:
"D Peter Maus" wrote in message
...
. And now, twice, in front of the group, he's promised to get his engineers
out here to take signal strength measurements at my location to determine
why I can't hear a local 50kw station, but immediately dropped all
conversation about it.

And that, whille none of your business, is due to the fact that Paul Easter,
an talented and wonderful engineer, moved to a corporate position at Salem,
and we are short handed in the middle of two transmitter moves.
To date the only one who's bothered to investigate my reception issues,
is me.

Good for you.

. And some blatant inconsistencies in his claims about agencies/sales.

Your experiences of a decade or more ago have little to do with the current
situation, where interactive media is far more attractive to advertising
agencies than radio because there are more creative dollars to be made
there.

And his experience. These things make me suspect that, though, he's still
the David we've all come to know and love, that he's getting low on the
calm, educational patience he's showed a year ago, and is now running out
of both patience, and appreciation of the intercourse.

I'm out of patience with the people who insist that there is listening to
distant skywave signals, when there is no such thing documented and with
those who think AM is not on a horrible decline, with its main and majority
format, news talk, moving to FM. And I'm out of patience with you, who think
a radio station in 2007 can change the demos on a buy because he once saw a
station changed on a buy. I spoke with the head or our naitonal rep about
changing demos on a campaign, and she simply laughed.

But when David speaks, he speaks like a policy statement. There's only
a level of personal interaction after it's been brought to his attention
that there is none. Hell, even Eric Richards, with whom I share no
personal cordiality, will address a post as though he's talking TO me, but
not AT me. David doesn't do that. He speaks AT his opponent. Overwhelming
with statistics, where a conversational sentence will do. Jumping into
conversations with material that brings nothing to the topic at hand, but
definitely puts his expertise and policy positions on display.

When the responses I get are idiotic, I react as one does to an idiot. At
some point, it came to me that DXers were now enemies of radio stations...
which is when I dropped my Northamerican radio club memberships... because
supporting one's enemies with money is hardly rational. The inability of the
DX community to realize that AM has changed from a music medium to a talk
one, and that shows like Noory are necessary, and that technical changes
have to come if there is any chace of AM survival make the DXer a Luddite of
the first order.
Then there was the issue of his ham credentials. When pressed he gave a
credible story about corruption in the testing process in Ecuador. Nothing
out of the ordinary, actually. Nothing outside the realm of possibility.
Certainly, something we'd all believe based on the politics of the region.
But when pressed, he gave no clarification, with any personal experiential
content. Just something that sounds a likely story.

Drivers licences, visas, import permits, bulding permits, licences, tax
audits, etc., were all facilitated in a way that is accepted outside the US,
and not called "corrupt" as you have called it. It's just a different
system. And while I was there, there was no exam for a ham license at all...
you had to be sponsored by the RCE (Radio Club del Ecuador) or other of the
ham associations, and you got a license. My sponsor was Ing. Fred Simon.

But, with about 30 years of living outside the US, and even more working
there, I am used to US gringo standards being applied to other cultures as a
metric. Other cultures do not work like the American system, and can not be
compared to it, either.
Colleagues, whether vocational or avocational, don't address each other
like that. He claims to be a DXer, but disdains DXers.

Anyone with over 2000 AM veries has, I think, earned the right to be called
a DXer. But I am not a club member of any of the DX orgainzations because
the hobby, which led me into radio, now pretty universally hates
broadcasters and the very stations they listen to.

As I said, I've known people in the Radio business like that. But then
don't rise to the level of corporate oversight, or management. And they
are certainly not leaders. Usually they're middle manglement. And
consultants.

Of which I am neither.



You've underscored all my points. Thank you.

I may keep you around.


p

On Sep 29, 8:48 pm, "David Eduardo" wrote:
"Telamon" wrote in message

...





In article ,
"David Eduardo" wrote:

"Telamon" wrote in message
...

I just do not believe your contention that the numbers of people that
listen to night time AMBCB are small. I think there is a great deal of
regional listening at night and non-local stations during the day where
reception is of good quality such as where I live on the coast. There
are plenty of people that listen to stations that are not local in
order
to hear a program not broadcast locally.

There are no facts to support your contention. Listening to out of market
stations is very small (by the way, Ventura, Riverside West and San
Bernardino West are all in the LA DMA... the metro definition that
matches
the TV metro area). Still, in your county, there is pretty limited
in-market
listening to out of market stations.

You have no facts to support your contention since all the waking hours
revolve around the commercial radio books. The statistics you look at
don't address the regional listening. Now don't go back on the word of
your previous posts.

You have a mistaken impression of radio audience measurement. The fact is,
ANY radio station listened to in an Arbitron diary is processed. It does not
matter if it is commercial, public, religious, local, internet, satellite,
or a rare DX catch.

If enough mentions for enough time to create statistical reliability are
made the station is considered "in the book" but the Arbitron software
stations use lets us look at stations that may have a share of 0.0% but did
get one mention....

A sign that out of market listening is insignificant to radio and
advertisers comes with the already started roll out of the electronic People
Meter, which senses encoding on each station. Most "out of market" stations
so far are not encoded as it will not be till the end of next year that the
top 10 markets are on PPM; none of us cares about the 0.3% of listening to
out of market signals, by the way.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

d'Eduardo,

Thank You Once Again For Reminding Us
That We Don't Count As Sellable Numbers.

we are just plain old radio listeners ~ RHF

On Sep 29, 8:28 pm, "David Eduardo" wrote:
"Brenda Ann" wrote in message

...



"David Eduardo" wrote in message
news
The other way to see this is from the perspective that there are not many
AM (MW) DXers left. The combined IRCA and NRC membership is around or
less than a thousand in North America... compare that to when RaDex was
sold at the news rack at the corner drugstore and DXing was engaged in by
millions.

You DO realize, don't you, that most AMBCB DX'ers (or SWL's for that
matter) do not belong to clubs?

If someone is using a station in its skywave protected contour, that is not
DXing. That is listening to the station in its coverage area.

That most are not even aware these clubs exist? Do you think that I cared
about clubs when I was lying in the grass when I was 14 listening to
Wolfman Jack (or the Grand Ol' Opry on weekends) on my pocket radio?

Wolfman is something of a different time and a different generation. He was
got audience on AM, at XERF and then XERB, because there was not much local
radio. It was pre-FM.

Where I spent some time, north of Traverse City, MI, at night we listened to
Chicago's WLS because there was no local station you could hear, at all.
Today, there are a dozen FMs and an AM putting primary signals over the
little town of Omena,
- and nobody listens to AM who is under about 50 there.


Since most 'folks' here are over 50 or around 50 :

No Body Here Listens To You - d'Eduardo ! ~ RHF


And the Opry can be heard on the web much better than WSM ever could be
picked up.

Do you think that those kids listening to a ball game from a distant
station when they should have been sleeping know or care about DX clubs?

I don't see a heck of a lot of kids going to or listening to baseball games
any more. Another sign of the times... baseball is a slow, oldeer person's
sport (or a ticket out of the Dominican Republic).

Or the trucker tuning across the dial to find something worth listening to
(hard to do these days when all you got at night is George Noory)?

Most truckers have Satellite now... an excellent solution for drivers who
move from market to market, too.

Only the hardcore DX nerds know or care about DX clubs. Most just listen
for fun or the excitement of hearing something from far away.

Static, fading and noise are fun? It may have been when there were no
alternatives, but between the web and the FM dial and other portable
devices, it is not 1966 any more..

And, by the way.....


David Eduardo wrote:

Your experiences of a decade or more ago have little to do with the current
situation,


Actually, I worked for CBS until December 20, 1999. The last contract
work I did for them was in 2001.

The last work I did for WLS was some production this spring.


Not exactly a decade or more ago, Brother David.






"But if it makes you more comfortable to think so, by all means...you
be comfortable."

-- John Newland.