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HOW OLD are you?
On Oct 2, 12:10 am, "Brenda Ann" wrote:
Sure there were. I was using web based forums at least as far back as 1983, with my Commodore 64 and a 300 baud acoustic modem [....] No, you're wrong. There was no Web in 1983. Usenet existed in 1983, but the Web was not invented until 1990, and it was not practical until Mosaic in 1992. I called attention specifically to the Web because the growth of Web-based forums is the reason Usenet has fallen into disuse. |
HOW OLD are you?
Phil Kane wrote: On Mon, 01 Oct 2007 03:24:02 -0700, wrote: I've worked in sales, but I tried to avoid lying. For example when I was in college I worked for Sears. They instructed me to "sell extended warranties" I complied, but I also told the customers that I thought it was un-necessary. Recently I had an expensive Nikon camera damaged by being knocked off a table to a concrete floor. Had I not had an extended warranty policy (read: insurance) the repairs would have cost me almost half of what the camera cost, because they had to send to Japan for major repair parts to rebuild it. .......... Well there are exceptions to every rule, and your hyper-expensive camera is that exception. But in the case of a GE Refrigerator or a Sony stereo, an extended warranty would be a waste. These items are so cheap & readily available that, should they fail, you can easily take the ~$100 from the "extended warranty" (which I the salesman told you not to buy), and use it as downpayment to buy a new fridge or stereo. The thing is: Most appliances DON'T fail. They follow a mortality curve: - HIGH - birth mortality (as a result of manufacturing flaws) - covered for FREE by the manufacturer - LOW - middle-of-life - virtually no failures. - HIGH - geriatric mortality - around 15-20 years - the parts are old & die - which is NOT covered by extended warranties, because these are only 5-7 years in length. The reason why Sears pushes salespeople to sell "extended warranties" is because that's where the money's at. 99% of customers have no problem whatsoever (or if they do, it's covered by the manufacturer's FREE warranty, not sears), and thus Sears gets to pocket the money as almost-100% profit. ----- Want to get rich? Sell insurance on brand-new products, and make sure it expires at around 5 years, that way you won't have to pay out, other than a few dollars here & there. I bought an extended warranty for my Dodge Avenger. You know how many times I used it? - zero - and when the Avenger eventually started failing (10 years), the warranty was expired. - and thus I wasted $700 for nothing. I'll never do that again. Similarly, I had a hard disk die a few days after the extended warranty period expired, and CompUSA was good enough to "stretch" the expiration date and give me a new one at no cost. Yeah. But. You probably could have bought a brand-new hard drive, same size, for the same amount of $$$ or just slightly more expensive, as the extended warranty cost. I just bought a 300 gig drive for only $70. They are dirt cheap Cheaper than buying the crummy service plan. I believe in extended warranties. I don't. Everything I buy seems to last forever. If I bought "extended warranties" I would just be wasting my money (see the Avenger example), since I would never use them. |
HOW OLD are you?
"David Kaye" wrote in message oups.com... On Oct 2, 12:10 am, "Brenda Ann" wrote: Sure there were. I was using web based forums at least as far back as 1983, with my Commodore 64 and a 300 baud acoustic modem [....] No, you're wrong. There was no Web in 1983. Usenet existed in 1983, but the Web was not invented until 1990, and it was not practical until Mosaic in 1992. I called attention specifically to the Web because the growth of Web-based forums is the reason Usenet has fallen into disuse. Not this time cowboy. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet " The first TCP/IP-wide area network was made operational by January 1, 1983 when all hosts on the ARPANET were switched over from the older NCP protocols to TCP/IP. In 1985, the United States' National Science Foundation (NSF) commissioned the construction of a university 56 kilobit/second network backbone using computers called "fuzzballs" by their inventor, David Mills. The following year, NSF sponsored the development of a higher speed 1.5 megabit/second backbone that become the NSFNet. A key decision to use the DARPA TCP/IP protocols was made by Dennis Jennings, then in charge of the Supercomputer program at NSF." |
HOW OLD are you?
Brenda Ann wrote: "David Kaye" wrote in message oups.com... On Oct 2, 12:10 am, "Brenda Ann" wrote: Sure there were. I was using web based forums at least as far back as 1983, with my Commodore 64 and a 300 baud acoustic modem [....] No, you're wrong. There was no Web in 1983. Usenet existed in 1983, but the Web was not invented until 1990, and it was not practical until Mosaic in 1992. I called attention specifically to the Web because the growth of Web-based forums is the reason Usenet has fallen into disuse. Not this time cowboy. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet "first TCP/IP-wide area network was made operational by January 1983" Bzzz. We're not discussing the internet (which has been around a long, long time). We're discussing the World Wide Web, which sits inside browsers called Mosaic, Netscape, Explorer, Firefox, Safari, et al..... and uses hyperlinks to jump from one server to another server. THAT was not invented until circa 1992, and did not "boom" until around 1995 when Mosaic/Netscape hit Windows and Macintosh machines, and lots of users started experimenting with it for the first time. The WWW did not exist in the 1980s. We've told you this several times. Please try to listen. If you still are not convinced, try to imagine stepping into a time machine, and carrying your modern-day PC back to 1990, and signing-up with an Internet Provider. Would your web browser work? No. It absolutely would not work, because web-servers did not exist back then. The WWW had not been invented yet. |
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SFTV_troy wrote:
Phil Kane wrote: That's not electrical engineering, that's computer science. And thus you make yourself sound like an idiot. (rolls eyes) Oh, THIS should be good... |
HOW OLD are you?
"Brenda Ann" wrote:
Not this time cowboy. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet " The first TCP/IP-wide area network was made operational by January 1, 1983 when all hosts on the ARPANET were switched over from the older NCP protocols to TCP/IP. In 1985, the United States' National Science Foundation (NSF) commissioned the construction of a university 56 kilobit/second network backbone using computers called "fuzzballs" by their inventor, David Mills. The following year, NSF sponsored the development of a higher speed 1.5 megabit/second backbone that become the NSFNet. A key decision to use the DARPA TCP/IP protocols was made by Dennis Jennings, then in charge of the Supercomputer program at NSF." That's TCP/IP. Hate to side with these guys, but they're right this time. The World Wide Web and HTTP were invented in 1990 by Tim Berners-Lee. -- Eric F. Richards, "It's the Din of iBiquity." -- Frank Dresser |
HOW OLD are you?
"Brenda Ann" wrote in message
"David Kaye" wrote in message ups.com... On Oct 1, 8:47 am, (G) wrote: On these newsgroups, I get the impression the young people do not use, or do not like to use USENET. Perhaps they are somewhere else. It was not like this10 to 15 years ago. And, there is a lot of frustrated old people around here. 10 to 15 years ago there weren't Web-based forums. In fact, 15 years ago there wasn't a Web as we know it. Google Groups may have been the salvation of Usenet. Sure there were. I was using web based forums at least as far back as 1983, with my Commodore 64 and a 300 baud acoustic modem (even the crude graphics of the era took forever to load. Usenet? There were other networks of BBSs in those days. There was no pracical, widely usable web in the 1980s. This is typical of histories of the web: http://www.w3.org/History.html From it, the web seems to date back to the early 1990s, maybe 1992 or 1993. The bad old days of CompuSlave et al when net time was charged by the minute (about two dollars IIRC). Been there, done that. Even then, the forums were very popular, taking over the job that was mostly done by BBS's. The trouble with local BBSs was the lack of traffic. There were national and regional BBSs like ExecPC that addressed that problem. |
HOW OLD are you?
"David Kaye" wrote in message
oups.com On Oct 2, 12:10 am, "Brenda Ann" wrote: Sure there were. I was using web based forums at least as far back as 1983, with my Commodore 64 and a 300 baud acoustic modem [....] No, you're wrong. There was no Web in 1983. Usenet existed in 1983, but the Web was not invented until 1990, and it was not practical until Mosaic in 1992. I called attention specifically to the Web because the growth of Web-based forums is the reason Usenet has fallen into disuse. Agreed. |
HOW OLD are you?
"Eric F. Richards" wrote in message
"Brenda Ann" wrote: Not this time cowboy. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet " The first TCP/IP-wide area network was made operational by January 1, 1983 when all hosts on the ARPANET were switched over from the older NCP protocols to TCP/IP. In 1985, the United States' National Science Foundation (NSF) commissioned the construction of a university 56 kilobit/second network backbone using computers called "fuzzballs" by their inventor, David Mills. The following year, NSF sponsored the development of a higher speed 1.5 megabit/second backbone that become the NSFNet. A key decision to use the DARPA TCP/IP protocols was made by Dennis Jennings, then in charge of the Supercomputer program at NSF." That's TCP/IP. Hate to side with these guys, but they're right this time. The World Wide Web and HTTP were invented in 1990 by Tim Berners-Lee. Agreed. |
HOW OLD are you?
It's True,,,,, the older you get, the younger you are.
cuhulin |
HOW OLD are you?
You are crazy if you go to google.There are hundreds of other search
engines all over the World.F..K google!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! cuhulin |
HOW OLD are you?
Ventura is really not Ventura.I wonder if Telamon knows that? He has me
in his killfile, so he probally doesn't know. cuhulin .................................................. ... Telamon, tell all them cutie pie gals over there,,, auld Hansom Larry Loves over here in Mississippi them. .................................................. ... |
HOW OLD are you?
Brenda Ann, my old time friend.How long you going to be stuck over there
in South Korea? cuhulin |
HOW OLD are you?
On Oct 2, 10:07 am, "Arny Krueger" wrote:
"David Kaye" wrote in message oups.com On Oct 2, 12:10 am, "Brenda Ann" wrote: Sure there were. I was using web based forums at least as far back as 1983, with my Commodore 64 and a 300 baud acoustic modem [....] No, you're wrong. There was no Web in 1983. Usenet existed in 1983, but the Web was not invented until 1990, and it was not practical until Mosaic in 1992. I called attention specifically to the Web because the growth of Web-based forums is the reason Usenet has fallen into disuse. Agreed. Wait a minute...Arpanet was around and operational long before 1990. |
HOW OLD are you?
On Oct 2, 9:31 am, wrote:
Ventura is really not Ventura.I wonder if Telamon knows that? He has me in his killfile, so he probally doesn't know. cuhulin .................................................. .. Telamon, tell all them cutie pie gals over there,,, auld Hansom Larry Loves over here in Mississippi them. .................................................. .. Cuhulin, Technically "Ventura" is the 'City of San BuenaVentura' and is the County Seat of Ventura County, California. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ventura,_California The 'City of San BuenaVentura' gets it name from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mission_San_Buenaventura "Mission San BuenaVentura" which was founded by Father Junípero Serra a Spanish Franciscan Friar http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jun%C3%ADpero_Serra http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Franciscan one of the Spanish "Catholic" Missions in California http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish..._in_California and now you know ~ RHF . |
HOW OLD are you?
Roadie wrote: On Oct 2, 10:07 am, "Arny Krueger" wrote: "David Kaye" wrote in message oups.com On Oct 2, 12:10 am, "Brenda Ann" wrote: Sure there were. I was using web based forums at least as far back as 1983, with my Commodore 64 and a 300 baud acoustic modem [....] No, you're wrong. There was no Web in 1983. Usenet existed in 1983, but the Web was not invented until 1990, and it was not practical until Mosaic in 1992. I called attention specifically to the Web because the growth of Web-based forums is the reason Usenet has fallen into disuse. Agreed. Wait a minute...Arpanet was around and operational long before 1990. We're not discussing ARPAnet. We're discussing the WWW. What you are doing is equivalent to saying "Ipods existed in the 80s!" just because some MP2s existed back then. |
HOW OLD are you?
I am a dirty auld bastid.
cuhulin |
HOW OLD are you?
I need to squish a little bitty tube of Bayer Advantage 55 on top of
doggy's neck. cuhulin |
HOW OLD are you?
On Oct 2, 4:16 am, "Brenda Ann" wrote:
Not this time cowboy. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet The Internet is not the Web. I haven't said word one about the Internet. Go back and look. I am talking *solely* about the Web. The Web didn't exist until 1992. This is an important difference because Usenet predates the Web, which was my whole point all along. Actually, Usenet slightly predates the Internet as we know it. |
HOW OLD are you?
On Sep 30, 2:42 pm, wrote:
I'm 35. Engineer. And you? I'm curious about the demographic that occupies these groups. 0 and 100 I'm a Personal Consumer Consumption Facilitator |
HOW OLD are you?
On Sep 30, 2:42 pm, wrote:
I'm 35. Engineer. And you? I'm curious about the demographic that occupies these groups. Old enough. I'm a Personal Consumer Consumption Facilitator |
HOW OLD are you?
Arny Krueger wrote: "Brenda Ann" wrote in message Even then, the forums were very popular, taking over the job that was mostly done by BBS's. The trouble with local BBSs was the lack of traffic. There were national and regional BBSs like ExecPC that addressed that problem. Also national nets like Usenet and Fidonet. Usenet is still alive-and- well thanks to News servers being integrated into the WWW browsers, but Fidonet is essentially dead since BBSes don't really exist anymore. (There's still a few, but none local to my area, and I'm not going to call long-distance.) Those networks were cool. You would go visit, for example rec.arts.startrek, read & reply to messages, and then log off. During the night the messages would travel across the phonelines. And the next morning you would have a fresh batch of messages. Things moved a lot slower back then. Typically if you asked a question today (Oct 2), you had to wait until Oct 3 to receive the replies to it. BTW: Here's the oldest message I could find. I got a modem in late 1987, and was posting to Usenet throughout 1988, 89, and so on, but apparently those messages never got archived. Oh well. This message was posted just prior to my high school graduation..... sooooo long ago. ;-) http://groups.google.com/group/rec.a...3f568ceec580b/ From: Newsgroups: rec.arts.startrek Subject: Trek symbols Date: 27 May 91 15:07:23 GMT Organization: Rabbit Hutch BBS, East Earl, Pa., (717)354-5027 Lines: 16 The change from the "one ship one symbol" to everyone wearing the "Enterprise Arrowhead" is supposed to serve two functions. The first, (not totally cannon) is that it is to celebrate that the Enterprise was the only ship to make it back to earth after its five year mission, in completely good shape, where as other ships barely made it back, or not at all. Exactly what do you mean by "one ship one symbol"? Did each ship have its on triangle? I thought the Arrowhead was the symbol of the Federation and was universal among all Starfleet starships? Why was Enterprise crew the only to wear the arrowhead? -- ....rutgers!devon!rhutch!troy (Troy Heagy) Rabbit Hutch BBS -- +1 717 354 5027 |
HOW OLD are you?
On Tue, 02 Oct 2007 01:14:52 -0700, SFTV_troy
wrote: I suspect if you took this poll in a "hip" group like rec.arts.tv or alt.tv.smallville, you'd find a lot of young people. It would still skew older, but there'd also be lots of teens and 20-somethings in the mix. We were all teens and 20-somethings once. -- Phil Kane Beaverton, OR |
HOW OLD are you?
On Tue, 02 Oct 2007 01:27:55 -0700, SFTV_troy
wrote: I was thinking about going back to earn a law degree (since I'm bored with engineering). If you think engineering is boring, law will be even more boring. What you see on TV as "law" bears little relationship to real life. -- Philip M. Kane P E / Esq. VP - Regulatory Counsel & Engineering Manager CSI Telecommunication Consulting Engineers San Francisco, CA - Beaverton, OR |
HOW OLD are you?
On Tue, 02 Oct 2007 01:54:51 -0700, SFTV_troy
wrote: James Cash Penney would disagree with you. (He was an extremely religious and honest man - he even refused to accept credit cards, on the grounds that he thought it wrong to drive people into debt. He would rather lose a sale than do that.) He would be spinning in his grave. Of course we use our JCPenney card as a convenience card, paying it off each month without interest accruing. -- Phil Kane Beaverton, OR |
HOW OLD are you?
SFTV_troy writes:
[...] Usenet is still alive-and- well thanks to News servers being integrated into the WWW browsers, News servers are not integrated into WWW browsers, but news clients are. -- % Randy Yates % "Remember the good old 1980's, when %% Fuquay-Varina, NC % things were so uncomplicated?" %%% 919-577-9882 % 'Ticket To The Moon' %%%% % *Time*, Electric Light Orchestra http://www.digitalsignallabs.com |
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In article . com,
SFTV_troy wrote: Telamon wrote: wrote: I've worked in sales, but I tried to avoid lying. That's an impossibility. James Cash Penney would disagree with you. (He was an extremely religious and honest man - he even refused to accept credit cards, on the grounds that he thought it wrong to drive people into debt. He would rather lose a sale than do that.) Fine. Then it would be an impossibility for you. For example when I was in college I worked for Sears. They instructed me to "sell extended warranties" I complied, but I also told the customers that I thought it was un-necessary. Sears didn't like me very much - what with telling the truth. That would be an expected result. Uh huh. Good thing I became an engineer - I wouldn't be able to work for long lying to Sears' customers. I don't think you are an engineer. I'd expect an electrical engineer to be more knowledgeable than your posts indicate. If you think one person can possibly know EVERYTHING there is to know about the subject of electronics/electrical devices. Not really. Just what you promote. Just because we don't share the same opinion, does not mean one of us is idiotic. It does not exclude it either. That premise is false Telemon. It could be that we are both 100% correct (with respect to targeting different interest groups). You are correct that AM is better for long-distance listening for old people. So you believe in age based reality? That does not sound like an engineer to me. And I am correct that young people want many, many more stations on the dial (they like variety). That's not what you wrote. You wrote about more possible channels. We are both correct. Nope. I find nothing endearing in a sock puppet. -- Telamon Ventura, California |
HOW OLD are you?
I'm 39 and nearly 40 (in November). Aghhhhhh!!!!!!
MOSFET wrote in message oups.com... I'm 35. Engineer. And you? I'm curious about the demographic that occupies these groups. |
HOW OLD are you?
SFTV_troy wrote:
Phil Kane wrote: On Mon, 01 Oct 2007 03:24:02 -0700, wrote: - Do you know what VHDL is? - How about a state machine? - Synchronous DDR? - PCI Express? - Flip-flop? - What does GCLK mean in the context of FPGAs? - What are constraints? That's not electrical engineering, that's computer science. And thus you make yourself sound like an idiot. Hardware design is *not* computer science (aka programming). ------ Besides my title is "Electrical Engineer". Always has been, no matter where I worked. This is just a small sample of what I know, because this is what I work upon every day..... but I suspect a lot of it you have no clue what it's about. And that's fine. Because I don't expect one person to know everything there is to know about EE. Not to denigrate Penn State, but graduates of the major EE (as differentiated from CS) schools are expected to be fluent in most if not all areas of ELECTRICAL engineering. ... Phil, Please define what you mean by fluent. I'm not trolling; I would like a serious answer. This has actually been a topic of discussion in some other forums. I don't have an EE degree (I have bachelor's and master's in CS), but my bachelor's degree required some EE classes. I had plenty of EE major friends, many of whom went on to EE-related careers. That sounds like a denigration of Penn State. They did teach me all the basics, but not the advanced stuff (like synchronous AM reception - whatever that is). To expect me to know that is unrealistic. And not fair to the profs at Penn State. Every engineer has his or her own specialty. I am inclined to agree with this. --gregbo gds at best dot com |
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HOW OLD are you?
On Oct 2, 1:27 am, SFTV_troy wrote:
Phil Kane wrote: On Mon, 01 Oct 2007 03:24:02 -0700, wrote: - Do you know what VHDL is? - How about a state machine? - Synchronous DDR? - PCI Express? - Flip-flop? - What does GCLK mean in the context of FPGAs? - What are constraints? That's not electrical engineering, that's computer science. And thus you make yourself sound like an idiot. Hardware design is *not* computer science (aka programming). ------ Besides my title is "Electrical Engineer". Always has been, no matter where I worked. This is just a small sample of what I know, because this is what I work upon every day..... but I suspect a lot of it you have no clue what it's about. And that's fine. Because I don't expect one person to know everything there is to know about EE. Not to denigrate Penn State, but graduates of the major EE (as differentiated from CS) schools are expected to be fluent in most if not all areas of ELECTRICAL engineering. ... That sounds like a denigration of Penn State. They did teach me all the basics, - but not the advanced stuff (like synchronous AM reception - - whatever that is). AM Synchronous Detector - These Links may Help to Open-Up Your Mind's Eye. http://www.radio-electronics.com/inf...t/sync_det.php http://www.sherweng.com/indepth.html http://www.universal-radio.com/catal.../0800sync.html http://www.universal-radio.com/catal.../0175sync.html http://www.usna.edu/EE/ee302/Handout...ng2007CH03.pdf If All Else Fails . . . Read a Book ! - To expect me to know that is unrealistic. SFTV - You chose to 'cross-post' to a Shortwave Radio Listener's Newgroup (rec.radio.shortwave) most of the SWLs here have some idea or concept of what an "AM-Sync" does and to some degree how they function and perform within their Radios. Clearly you have more than the Education and the Ability to Inform Yourself and Communicate with the Members of this Newsgroup in a Meaninful Way. - Please Do So. i didn't know - i don't know - is not a valid answer for a person of your education and ability ~ RHF |
HOW OLD are you?
I'm "this" many fingers!
Can you count? Excellent! |
HOW OLD are you?
Brenda's disappeared. She's not about to admit she was wrong (a sign
of maturity is someone being able to say, "Ooops my mistake."). Arny Krueger wrote: "Eric F. Richards" "Brenda Ann" " The first TCP/IP-wide area network was made operational by January 1, 1983 when all hosts on the ARPANET were switched over from the older NCP protocols to TCP/IP That's TCP/IP. Hate to side with these guys, but they're right this time. The World Wide Web and HTTP were invented in 1990 by Tim Berners-Lee. Agreed. |
HOW OLD are you?
Randy Yates wrote: SFTV_troy writes: [...] Usenet is still alive-and- well thanks to News servers being integrated into the WWW browsers, News servers are not integrated into WWW browsers, but news clients are. Ooops. Thanks for the correction; that was pretty stupid of me. ;-) (A news client could also be called news reader, or news- reading software.) |
HOW OLD are you?
On Oct 3, 3:02 am, SFTV_troy wrote:
- Brenda's disappeared. - She's not about to admit she was wrong (a sign of maturity - is someone being able to say, "Ooops my mistake."). SFTV -aka- "Hybrid Digital" Man, And this post has the 'sound' of "Maturity ? - NOT ! ~ RHF BAD comes and goes as her schedule permits. Until then consider actually Listening to a Shortwave Radio : So that you can Hear What We Hear and Communicate About All These Great Changes Toward A Digital World : Based On Your Own Personal Experience Listening To Over-the-Air Radio Broadcasts. Remember one of the Newsgroups that you chose to Cross-Post the original Message to was Rec.Radio.Shortwave which happens to be a Newsgroup populated by many Avid Shortwave Radio Listeners (SWLs) and AM & FM Radio Broadcast Listeners (BCLs). |
HOW OLD are you?
On Oct 3, 5:46 am, RHF wrote:
On Oct 3, 3:02 am, SFTV_troy wrote: - Brenda's disappeared. - She's not about to admit she was wrong (a sign of maturity - is someone being able to say, "Ooops my mistake."). BAD comes and goes as her schedule permits. She just posted 30 minutes ago. The fact is, she doesn't want to admit that she was wrong when she kept insisting (again and again) that the Web existed in the 1980s. Even AFTER we explained to her she was mistaken, she still refused to listen. I hate stubborn people who refuse to listen, even when others are trying to be helpful. |
HOW OLD are you?
Phil Kane wrote:
On Tue, 02 Oct 2007 01:14:52 -0700, SFTV_troy wrote: I suspect if you took this poll in a "hip" group like rec.arts.tv or alt.tv.smallville, you'd find a lot of young people. It would still skew older, but there'd also be lots of teens and 20-somethings in the mix. We were all teens and 20-somethings once. But then you grew old & close-minded. |
HOW OLD are you?
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