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Latest e-mail about IBOC
On Nov 23, 8:23*am, IBOCcrock wrote:
On Nov 23, 2:59*am, RHF wrote: On Nov 22, 5:16*pm, IBOCcrock wrote: On Nov 21, 10:52*pm, D Peter Maus wrote: IBOCcrock wrote: On Nov 21, 2:07�pm, "David Eduardo" wrote: "IBOCcrock" wrote in message ... On Nov 21, 2:00 pm, "David Eduardo" wrote: "D Peter Maus" wrote in ... � �About 90% of the population still listens to the radio. �Even those with access to, and regular use of, other technologies. Actually, it is over 95%. Roughly the same as it was in 1965. 2005 2006 2007 2008 2009 2010 2015 2020 Ah, you called Miss Cleo. Ask what Google stock will be at, will you? In the mid-60's, pundits said FM would never make it and radio would die due to TV. Those predictions are as accurate as yours. The satellite numbers are totally bogus, as sat radio has hit a brick wall on new subscriptions and the churn rate is huge after the free trial offers expire. Poor argument - the 1960's didn't have cell phone/streaming, Satellite Radio, the Internet, Internet Radio, etc...no nearly the same situation Bud! * *What's not acknowledged is that FM failed. Twice. * *Before it didn't. FCC mandates were in part responsible.. * *Don't underestimate the power of commitment. * *There's been a huge investment in this technology. There's been an FCC mandate that all new modulation schemes be digital. *And there's been a half a billion dollars spent in promotion. The point is not that HD's success is assured, but rather that HD's demise is not assured either. This is not going away anytime soon. It may go away, but it's far from over. * *And the forces that have sway are in a good position to make it a full-on madated conversion. * *If you really want to fight this, you'll not be successful by reporting it's premature demise.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - "6/1/07 - FCC Releases Detailed Digital Audio Broadcast Rules" "At some point in the future, when the Commission determines there is sufficient market penetration of digital receivers, iBiquity asserts that the public interest will be best served by reversing this presumption to favor digital operations....We decline to adopt iBiquity’s presumption policy because it is too early in the DAB conversion process for us to consider such a mechanism. We find that such a policy, if adopted now, may have unknown and unintended consequences for a new technology that has yet to be accepted by the public or widely adopted by the broadcast industry." http://www.diymedia.net/archive/0607.htm “4/4/07 - FCC: Market to Decide Fate of HD Radio” "Though it appears that the FCC has stopped short of a full-on, enthusiastic endorsement of the technology, it has removed all marketplace barriers to its proliferation. I don't believe this is because the FCC thinks it's the best DAB technology available, but it is the horse that the broadcast industry has its money on. We'll now see whether that bet is a good investment or not, and we'll be forced to learn the hard way whether the technology's shortfalls are as egregious as feared." http://www.diymedia.net/archive/0407.htm - - As I stated, it is up to the marketplace to determine the fate - of HD Radio - with total consumer apathy and zero uptake of - HD radios in two years, HD/IBOC will never happen - I win! - IBOC Crock -proclaims- I Win ! DOH ! - Your Hate of All-Things-Radio Makes You An A#1 Loser - now crock on ~ RHF *.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - - You are just jealous! IBOC Crock - Yeah - I Only Wish I Could Be . . . As Big An "A#1 Loser" As You ! ~ RHF |
IBOC "HD" Radio - The Radio Listening Public Is Just Being TakenAlong For The Ride
RHF wrote:
On Nov 23, 7:15 am, D Peter Maus wrote: IBOCcrock wrote: On Nov 22, 3:40 pm, D Peter Maus wrote: IBOCcrock wrote: On Nov 22, 11:38 am, D Peter Maus wrote: IBOCcrock wrote: On Nov 21, 10:52 pm, D Peter Maus wrote: IBOCcrock wrote: On Nov 21, 2:07�pm, "David Eduardo" wrote: "IBOCcrock" wrote in message ... On Nov 21, 2:00 pm, "David Eduardo" wrote: "D Peter Maus" wrote in ... � �About 90% of the population still listens to the radio. �Even those with access to, and regular use of, other technologies. Actually, it is over 95%. Roughly the same as it was in 1965. 2005 2006 2007 2008 2009 2010 2015 2020 Ah, you called Miss Cleo. Ask what Google stock will be at, will you? In the mid-60's, pundits said FM would never make it and radio would die due to TV. Those predictions are as accurate as yours. The satellite numbers are totally bogus, as sat radio has hit a brick wall on new subscriptions and the churn rate is huge after the free trial offers expire. Poor argument - the 1960's didn't have cell phone/streaming, Satellite Radio, the Internet, Internet Radio, etc...no nearly the same situation Bud! What's not acknowledged is that FM failed. Twice. Before it didn't. FCC mandates were in part responsible. Don't underestimate the power of commitment. There's been a huge investment in this technology. There's been an FCC mandate that all new modulation schemes be digital. And there's been a half a billion dollars spent in promotion. The point is not that HD's success is assured, but rather that HD's demise is not assured either. This is not going away anytime soon. It may go away, but it's far from over. And the forces that have sway are in a good position to make it a full-on madated conversion. If you really want to fight this, you'll not be successful by reporting it's premature demise.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - You keep repeating the same rhetoric over and over again. I keep repeating the same points because you keep ignoring the most important parts of the argument....1) regardless of the market uptake of this technology, the investors, the FCC and the stations involved are committed to it. They may not be able to make it successful, but they will not let it go easily. Even if IBOC goes no further than AM stereo, they're simply NOT going to let it go. Not after all the money that's been spent. If IBOC is to die, it will die slowly, and over a long period of time. Stations will tire of the internal costs associated with running HD/IBOC, and with no ROI ever possible from total consumer apathy, stations will tire of paying the on-going fees to iBiquty. Stations refuse to invest in it, Gen Y thinks the concept is lauable, old consumers don't want it, and retailers can't sell it. All of which is true. But the boat is in the water. They're not going to just abandon ship. Not after all the costs of launch. Radio, iBiquity, and yes, FCC, will hang onto this for as long as they think they can turn it around. Remember, AM stereo was a dud, too. With international uptake. And it took 20 years to die. FM failed. Twice. The public didn't care. There was virtually no uptake. Look at it now. Color TV took 15 years to catch on. Look at it now. We're only at the very beginning of the process marketing IBOC technology. If it's not working, but there are enough people driving this who think that it can be made successful, they'll keep flaying the horse until there's nothing left before they give up. And then blame DXers for the failure. Even if it cannot be made successful, IBOC will take years to die. iBiquity has laid out a 5 to 8 year plan...near to a decade, just to break even. Even if they hit the target, that's only the break even point. From there, it will take years to build real growth. Or, if not successful, it will take years for stations, and investors to give up on the money they've thrown at this issue and finally give up and go away. FM failed twice. And once it caught on, took nearly two decades to become what it is. 40 years is a long time to keep swinging....and yet FM, backed with a lot of creative thinking, and two FCC mandates became successful 4 decades after launch. And the only one driving FM for the first 10 years was Edwin Armstrong. There was no public interest. No industry interest. And no FCC support. IBOC has corporate involvement, industry support, and the FCC's mandate that all new modulation schemes be digital. It's not going to simply go away. The FCC learned from the AM Stereo debacle and will not mandate a shutoff of analog radio. Don't count on that, either. They didn't learn anything from AM Stereo. HDTV was supposed to be a market choice, too. Totally voluntary uptake. And no talk of turning off the NTSC broadcast until and unless 85% of each market had moved to digital TV. And this was to be done market by market, allowing market forces to make the decisions. Well, that didn't work. Public interest was low. And new digital services wanted the spectrum. And they were willing to pay huge dollars for it. So, there was an FCC mandate. And now digital TV uptake is strong. I just added an ATSC tuner to my own system. I now have digital over-the-air TV. 30 channels of it. (without an HDTV--btw.) NTSC TV is going away in a little over a year, and the uptake of digital TV technology is brisk. Resulting in a faster conversion, improved technology, and much lower prices. IBOC offers the opportunity for more stations, conditional access...read that 'subscription radio,'... FCC benefits with more licensing and process fees...stations see an end to dictatorial advertisers...they're highly motivated to make IBOC work. No matter what it takes. And what it may take is an FCC mandate. Again, HDTV was to be market driven. FCC specifically said there woudl be no HDTV mandate. Now, there's a mandate. Don't think it can't happen with Radio. There are too many salivating to get it done for that not to be an option. IBOC. It certainly doesn't look good now. You and I agree there. The public is not interested. Costs of implementation are a sore point for broadcasters. iBiquity fees are absurd. We agree here. And nobody is liking where this is going. Not the public. Not the industry. We agree here, as well. But there are too many historic examples of new technology implemetation...even implementation badly executed...that have been turned around by changing the rules. FM benefitted from two FCC mandates. HDTV was mandated into life. History has shown us that FCC can and will mandate what they believe needs to be mandated. Even if reversing previous decisions to do it. And as far as the spectrum issue is concerned...digital broadcasting frees up more local spectra. More stations, more FCC revenues. They've got a financial interest in this too. And the MW broadcast band is being eyed for low bitrate digital services. There is spectrum pressure in favor of IBOC, just as there is HDTV. An FCC mandate is not out of the question. So, take a step back and look at the bigger picture. IBOC isn't working. You're right about that. We agree. This is a boondoggle. And it's an expensive boondoggle. But that's only the picture right now. There is too much history to suggest that with this much support in the industry, with this much money spent, with this much motivation on the part of broadcasters AND FCC....there is just too much historic evidence to make the claim that IBOC will just go away. It may fail. But it will not just go away. It will peter out, and peter out and peter out....just like AM Stereo...and it will take more than a decade to do it.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - "regardless of the market uptake of this technology, the investors, the FCC and the stations involved are committed to it... There is too much history to suggest that with this much support in the industry, with this much money spent, with this much motivation on the part of broadcasters AND FCC....there is just too much historic evidence to make the claim that IBOC will just go away. It may fail. But it will not just go away. It will peter out, and peter out and peter out....just like AM Stereo...and it will take more than a decade to do it." In response to you, here is the FCC's stance on HD/IBOC: “4/4/07 - FCC: Market to Decide Fate of HD Radio” "Other coverage of the FCC's decision notes that iBiquity, the proprietor of HD Radio, reacted in a manner like they exhal[ed] a sigh that's been held in for several years. Though it appears that the FCC has stopped short of a full-on, enthusiastic endorsement of the technology, it has removed all marketplace barriers to its proliferation. I don't believe this is because the FCC thinks it's the best DAB technology available, but it is the horse that the broadcast industry has its money on. We'll now see whether that bet is a good investment or not, and we'll be forced to learn the hard way whether the technology's shortfalls are as egregious as feared. Marketplace forces are not inexorable, and radio's digital transition will most likely take a decade or more to really take hold." http://www.diymedia.net/archive/0407.htm You obviously need to do more research, before you hysterically blow unsubstantiated opinions out of your arse. With no consumer interest after at least two years (really 5 years since HD has been broadcasting), HD/IBOC will never take-hold. The FCC is not interested in freeing-up the broadcast bands, as with TV, for auction. Automakers have no interest in HD/IBOC, just as with the general public - nothing can force consumers or automakers to buy/install HD radios. Who in hell cares about listening to radio anymore, except for radio-geeks, and incidental listening to/from work. iBiquity will be looking at exit stratagies in the near-futu "IBiquity sees digital radio signaling changes to come" "The company has yet to turn a profit and does not expect to do so in 2007 or 2008, Struble said... Mass marketing and consumer adoption is the last hurdle, Struble said... Representatives of investment firms that have spots on iBiquity's board of directors could not be reached for comment, but Struble said they are excited about the progress the company is making. The focus is not on exit strategies yet, he said." http://tinyurl.com/3don5y If you look at my blog, I have acquired far more HD/IBOC knowledge, over 2 years, than you could ever dream about: http://hdradiofarce.blogspot.com/ With all due respect, no, you don't. By your ignorant rants, yes I do! I was active in Broadcasting for 45 years. Started when I was 6. I've seen a lot of things come and go. Including here in Chicago. I still interface the broadcasting business every day. I don't think ignorant is a word that applies. Ok...reading everything here, we agree that IBOC/HD is a boondoggle. You're point is that it can't be revived. My point is that it can't be counted out. We agree that there's no market uptake of the technology, and, as things are, no interest means no future. We disagree on whether or not the end is in sight. You say yes, based on current market. I say probably not, based on the vagaries of public interests, commitment of the industry, and possible FCC involvement. We don't disagree that it COULD be over. I see that as a possibility. Where we diverge is on the commitment that's been made here and the determination of the parties involved to make this technology a standard, and a viable commercial entity. I see possibilities of success, if the parties involved make significant changes to the promotion of the technologies, and/or there is FCC involvement to require either the technology be included in all future receivers, or the end of analog broadcasting. You say neither's going to happen. I say that history says either/both may. You say that IBOC is a failure and will vanish, sooner than later. I say that EVEN IF IBOC is a failure it won't vanish anytime soon. Is that about right? Is that the conflict that has you so vitriolic? That we agree on the facts, but disagree on the future? I'll put my 50 years of personal experience, history and understanding of the history of the industry, up against your blogs. Care to make a wager? DPM & IBOC Crock, IBOC "HD" Radio - The Radio Listening Public Is Just Being Taken Along For The Ride http://groups.google.com/group/hd-ra...4081349a8fdbf1 1 - The Market for the Product "IBOC 'HD' Radio" is Radio Stations {The Broadcasters} at the Corporate Media Level. ? Do They 'Believe' That IBOC "HD" Radio Is Good For Their Corporate Business Model and the Broadcast Industry as a Whole ? -=YES=- ? Do They 'Believe' That IBOC "HD" {Digiital} Radio Is A Better Media Product Then The Current Analog Media Product ? -=YES=- ? Do They 'Believe' That IBOC "HD" {Digiital} Radio Will Give Them a Better Competitive Edge/Footing Against 'Other' Newer Digital Media Products ? -=YES=- ? Do They 'Believe' That FM IBOC "HD" {Digiital} Radio Will Give Them An Additional Income Source Per FM Radio Station An Add To Their Corporate Profits ? -=YES=- 2 - The Radio Stations {The Broadcasters} at the Corporate Media Level -Believe- That the Free Over-the-Air Radio Listening Public Will Accept and Adapt To : What They Can Get For Free From The Radio Stations {The Broadcasters}. 3 - As far as the FCC issuing Mandates and Requirements : The FCC Will Do What The Market Tells Them To Do : The Market Is Not 'The Radio Listening Public' : The Market Is In-Fact "Radio Stations {The Broadcasters} at the Corporate Media Level". The-Bottom-Line - The Slow Road {Years} To 100% Digital Broadcasting -Via- IBOC "HD" Radio Is Being Driven By Corporate Media -and- The Radio Listening Public Is Just Being Taken Along For The Ride [.] And That Is How I See It - As An Avid 'Free' Over-the-Air Radio Listener. hy dee ray dee oh ~ RHF Hello and Welcome to the "HD Radio" NewsGroup HD RADIO = http://groups.google.com/group/hd-radio/ . The FCC answers to congress. There is theoretically some check and balance there. |
IBOC "HD" Radio - The Radio Listening Public Is Just Being TakenAlong For The Ride
On Nov 23, 6:24*pm, David wrote:
RHF wrote: On Nov 23, 7:15 am, D Peter Maus wrote: * IBOCcrock wrote: On Nov 22, 3:40 pm, D Peter Maus wrote: IBOCcrock wrote: On Nov 22, 11:38 am, D Peter Maus wrote: IBOCcrock wrote: On Nov 21, 10:52 pm, D Peter Maus wrote: IBOCcrock wrote: On Nov 21, 2:07�pm, "David Eduardo" wrote: "IBOCcrock" wrote in message ... On Nov 21, 2:00 pm, "David Eduardo" wrote: "D Peter Maus" wrote in ... � �About 90% of the population still listens to the radio. �Even those with access to, and regular use of, other technologies. Actually, it is over 95%. Roughly the same as it was in 1965.. 2005 2006 2007 2008 2009 2010 2015 2020 Ah, you called Miss Cleo. Ask what Google stock will be at, will you? In the mid-60's, pundits said FM would never make it and radio would die due to TV. Those predictions are as accurate as yours. The satellite numbers are totally bogus, as sat radio has hit a brick wall on new subscriptions and the churn rate is huge after the free trial offers expire. Poor argument - the 1960's didn't have cell phone/streaming, Satellite Radio, the Internet, Internet Radio, etc...no nearly the same situation Bud! * *What's not acknowledged is that FM failed. Twice. * *Before it didn't. FCC mandates were in part responsible. * *Don't underestimate the power of commitment. * *There's been a huge investment in this technology. There's been an FCC mandate that all new modulation schemes be digital. *And there's been a half a billion dollars spent in promotion. The point is not that HD's success is assured, but rather that HD's demise is not assured either. This is not going away anytime soon. It may go away, but it's far from over. * *And the forces that have sway are in a good position to make it a full-on madated conversion. * *If you really want to fight this, you'll not be successful by reporting it's premature demise.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - You keep repeating the same rhetoric over and over again. * *I keep repeating the same points because you keep ignoring the most important parts of the argument....1) regardless of the market uptake of this technology, the investors, the FCC and the stations involved are committed to it. They may not be able to make it successful, but they will not let it go easily. Even if IBOC goes no further than AM stereo, they're simply NOT going to let it go. Not after all the money that's been spent. * *If IBOC is to die, it will die slowly, and over a long period of time. Stations will tire of the internal costs associated with running HD/IBOC, and with no ROI ever possible from total consumer apathy, stations will tire of paying the on-going fees to iBiquty. Stations refuse to invest in it, Gen Y thinks the concept is lauable, old consumers don't want it, and retailers can't sell it. * *All of which is true. But the boat is in the water. They're not going to just abandon ship. Not after all the costs of launch. *Radio, iBiquity, and yes, FCC, will hang onto this for as long as they think they can turn it around. Remember, AM stereo was a dud, too. With international uptake. And it took 20 years to die. * *FM failed. Twice. The public didn't care. There was virtually no uptake. * *Look at it now. * *Color TV took 15 years to catch on. * *Look at it now. * *We're only at the very beginning of the process marketing IBOC technology. If it's not working, but there are enough people driving this who think that it can be made successful, they'll keep flaying the horse until there's nothing left before they give up. And then blame DXers for the failure. * *Even if it cannot be made successful, IBOC will take years to die. iBiquity has laid out a 5 to 8 year plan...near to a decade, just to break even. Even if they hit the target, that's only the break even point. From there, it will take years to build real growth. Or, if not successful, it will take years for stations, and investors to give up on the money they've thrown at this issue and finally give up and go away. * *FM failed twice. And once it caught on, took nearly two decades to become what it is. 40 years is a long time to keep swinging....and yet FM, backed with a lot of creative thinking, and two FCC mandates became successful 4 decades after launch. * *And the only one driving FM for the first 10 years was Edwin Armstrong. There was no public interest. No industry interest. And no FCC support. * *IBOC has corporate involvement, industry support, and the FCC's mandate that all new modulation schemes be digital. * *It's not going to simply go away. The FCC learned from the AM Stereo debacle and will not mandate a shutoff of analog radio. * *Don't count on that, either. They didn't learn anything from AM Stereo. *HDTV was supposed to be a market choice, too. Totally voluntary uptake. And no talk of turning off the NTSC broadcast until and unless 85% of each market had moved to digital TV. And this was to be done market by market, allowing market forces to make the decisions. * *Well, that didn't work. Public interest was low. And new digital services wanted the spectrum. And they were willing to pay huge dollars for it. * *So, there was an FCC mandate. And now digital TV uptake is strong. I just added an ATSC tuner to my own system. I now have digital over-the-air TV. 30 channels of it. (without an HDTV--btw.) NTSC TV is going away in a little over a year, and the uptake of digital TV technology is brisk. Resulting in a faster conversion, improved technology, and much lower prices. * *IBOC offers the opportunity for more stations, conditional access...read that 'subscription radio,'... FCC benefits with more licensing and process fees...stations see an end to dictatorial advertisers...they're highly motivated to make IBOC work. No matter what it takes. And what it may take is an FCC mandate. * *Again, HDTV was to be market driven. FCC specifically said there woudl be no HDTV mandate. Now, there's a mandate. Don't think it can't happen with Radio. There are too many salivating to get it done for that not to be an option. * *IBOC. It certainly doesn't look good now. You and I agree there. The public is not interested. Costs of implementation are a sore point for broadcasters. iBiquity fees are absurd. We agree here. * *And nobody is liking where this is going. Not the public. Not the industry. We agree here, as well. * *But there are too many historic examples of new technology implemetation...even implementation badly executed...that have been turned around by changing the rules. * *FM benefitted from two FCC mandates. HDTV was mandated into life. * *History has shown us that FCC can and will mandate what they believe needs to be mandated. Even if reversing previous decisions to do it. |
Latest e-mail about IBOC
In article 4746935f@kcnews01, K Isham wrote:
D Peter Maus wrote: IBOCcrock wrote: On Nov 21, 10:52 pm, D Peter Maus wrote: IBOCcrock wrote: On Nov 21, 2:07?pm, "David Eduardo" wrote: "IBOCcrock" wrote in message ... On Nov 21, 2:00 pm, "David Eduardo" wrote: "D Peter Maus" wrote in .. . ? ?About 90% of the population still listens to the radio. ?Even those with access to, and regular use of, other technologies. Actually, it is over 95%. Roughly the same as it was in 1965. 2005 2006 2007 2008 2009 2010 2015 2020 Ah, you called Miss Cleo. Ask what Google stock will be at, will you? In the mid-60's, pundits said FM would never make it and radio would die due to TV. Those predictions are as accurate as yours. The satellite numbers are totally bogus, as sat radio has hit a brick wall on new subscriptions and the churn rate is huge after the free trial offers expire. Poor argument - the 1960's didn't have cell phone/streaming, Satellite Radio, the Internet, Internet Radio, etc...no nearly the same situation Bud! What's not acknowledged is that FM failed. Twice. Before it didn't. FCC mandates were in part responsible. Don't underestimate the power of commitment. There's been a huge investment in this technology. There's been an FCC mandate that all new modulation schemes be digital. And there's been a half a billion dollars spent in promotion. The point is not that HD's success is assured, but rather that HD's demise is not assured either. This is not going away anytime soon. It may go away, but it's far from over. And the forces that have sway are in a good position to make it a full-on madated conversion. If you really want to fight this, you'll not be successful by reporting it's premature demise.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - You keep repeating the same rhetoric over and over again. I keep repeating the same points because you keep ignoring the most important parts of the argument....1) regardless of the market uptake of this technology, the investors, the FCC and the stations involved are committed to it. They may not be able to make it successful, but they will not let it go easily. Even if IBOC goes no further than AM stereo, they're simply NOT going to let it go. Not after all the money that's been spent. If IBOC is to die, it will die slowly, and over a long period of time. Stations will tire of the internal costs associated with running HD/IBOC, and with no ROI ever possible from total consumer apathy, stations will tire of paying the on-going fees to iBiquty. Stations refuse to invest in it, Gen Y thinks the concept is lauable, old consumers don't want it, and retailers can't sell it. All of which is true. But the boat is in the water. They're not going to just abandon ship. Not after all the costs of launch. Radio, iBiquity, and yes, FCC, will hang onto this for as long as they think they can turn it around. Remember, AM stereo was a dud, too. With international uptake. And it took 20 years to die. FM failed. Twice. The public didn't care. There was virtually no uptake. Look at it now. Color TV took 15 years to catch on. Look at it now. We're only at the very beginning of the process marketing IBOC technology. If it's not working, but there are enough people driving this who think that it can be made successful, they'll keep flaying the horse until there's nothing left before they give up. And then blame DXers for the failure. Even if it cannot be made successful, IBOC will take years to die. iBiquity has laid out a 5 to 8 year plan...near to a decade, just to break even. Even if they hit the target, that's only the break even point. From there, it will take years to build real growth. Or, if not successful, it will take years for stations, and investors to give up on the money they've thrown at this issue and finally give up and go away. FM failed twice. And once it caught on, took nearly two decades to become what it is. 40 years is a long time to keep swinging....and yet FM, backed with a lot of creative thinking, and two FCC mandates became successful 4 decades after launch. And the only one driving FM for the first 10 years was Edwin Armstrong. There was no public interest. No industry interest. And no FCC support. IBOC has corporate involvement, industry support, and the FCC's mandate that all new modulation schemes be digital. It's not going to simply go away. The FCC learned from the AM Stereo debacle and will not mandate a shutoff of analog radio. Don't count on that, either. They didn't learn anything from AM Stereo. HDTV was supposed to be a market choice, too. Totally voluntary uptake. And no talk of turning off the NTSC broadcast until and unless 85% of each market had moved to digital TV. And this was to be done market by market, allowing market forces to make the decisions. Well, that didn't work. Public interest was low. And new digital services wanted the spectrum. And they were willing to pay huge dollars for it. So, there was an FCC mandate. And now digital TV uptake is strong. I just added an ATSC tuner to my own system. I now have digital over-the-air TV. 30 channels of it. (without an HDTV--btw.) NTSC TV is going away in a little over a year, and the uptake of digital TV technology is brisk. Resulting in a faster conversion, improved technology, and much lower prices. IBOC offers the opportunity for more stations, conditional access...read that 'subscription radio,'... FCC benefits with more licensing and process fees...stations see an end to dictatorial advertisers...they're highly motivated to make IBOC work. No matter what it takes. And what it may take is an FCC mandate. Again, HDTV was to be market driven. FCC specifically said there woudl be no HDTV mandate. Now, there's a mandate. Don't think it can't happen with Radio. There are too many salivating to get it done for that not to be an option. IBOC. It certainly doesn't look good now. You and I agree there. The public is not interested. Costs of implementation are a sore point for broadcasters. iBiquity fees are absurd. We agree here. And nobody is liking where this is going. Not the public. Not the industry. We agree here, as well. But there are too many historic examples of new technology implemetation...even implementation badly executed...that have been turned around by changing the rules. FM benefitted from two FCC mandates. HDTV was mandated into life. History has shown us that FCC can and will mandate what they believe needs to be mandated. Even if reversing previous decisions to do it. And as far as the spectrum issue is concerned...digital broadcasting frees up more local spectra. More stations, more FCC revenues. They've got a financial interest in this too. And the MW broadcast band is being eyed for low bitrate digital services. There is spectrum pressure in favor of IBOC, just as there is HDTV. An FCC mandate is not out of the question. So, take a step back and look at the bigger picture. IBOC isn't working. You're right about that. We agree. This is a boondoggle. And it's an expensive boondoggle. But that's only the picture right now. There is too much history to suggest that with this much support in the industry, with this much money spent, with this much motivation on the part of broadcasters AND FCC....there is just too much historic evidence to make the claim that IBOC will just go away. It may fail. But it will not just go away. It will peter out, and peter out and peter out....just like AM Stereo...and it will take more than a decade to do it. Mr Maus: I sincerely hope you are wrong about the FCC mandate. I recently purchased a Sangean HD1-X to replace my worn out tuner for my stereo system and now wish that it had a IBOC stop switch. I grate my teeth every time it goes digital. It truncates the high end and over emphasis es the low (ie. Bass). The one AM station that I can receive in IBOC out of two currently is the worst of the bunch. The drop- outs at home some fifteen miles from the antenna are worse than my DRM reception from Radio New Zealand 6000 miles away. The DRM sounds better also. I use a Ten Tec 320D plus DREAM . FM IBOC sounds worse than CD quality, especially if they are broadcasting another channel. It sounds worse than a highly compressed MP4 or MP3 stream, and drops out worse than my dial up streaming channels. To sell it they are going to have to make improvements both on AM and FM. The subscription service won't sell if you cannot reliably pick it up. I think I'm going to subscribe to Satellite once the merger is through. At least they have a reliable portable unit. I was hoping that Sangean would have released the DRM-40 here in the states, but the FCC is dragging their feet in approving it. What a surprise. God help us if the FCC tries to make all the domestic short-wave stations switch to IBOC, at least the DRM signal is only 12kHz wide, not 30kHz. Drm sounds better than IBOC if we should mandated to digital, plus it is open technology and most receivers could be modified to a 12KHZ filter and run on most newer computers without having to replace the receiver. Later on the manufactures could show how to improve reception by purchasing a dedicated DRM set. As it is I not going to be spending any more money on IBOC equipment until they improve the sound. Ken I. There are people that will continue to argue that you can get something for nothing. This never works in engineering solutions to a problem. These people think that if you don't have enough bandwidth for a good level of reliable service and high quality sound you can just compress the hell out of it and use some kind of magic modulation scheme to get around laws of physics. Well the magic tricks have failed and they will continue to fail. Call it HD, DRM or something else will not change the outcome. If you want both a higher level of service and better sound quality than what you now get on analog AMBCB or SW you are going to have to do way better than HD and DRM. HD and DRM both suck. I said so before either got trials going and nothings changed since. -- Telamon Ventura, California |
Latest e-mail about IBOC
On Nov 23, 5:42 pm, RHF wrote:
On Nov 23, 11:24 am, Steve wrote: On Nov 23, 2:28 am, RHF wrote: On Nov 22, 7:25 pm, " wrote: On Nov 22, 4:14 pm, "David Eduardo" wrote: "Brenda Ann" wrote in message m... "D Peter Maus" wrote in message ... FM failed. Twice. The public didn't care. There was virtually no uptake. Look at it now. FM didn't require people to throw out their old radios and buy new ones. It didn't? How did you listen to FM on an AM radio. Similarly, HD does not require anyone buy a new radio unless they want to... the analog signals continue to be broadcast. Of course, you had the choice of simply not buying an FM radio, which is what 99% of the people did for the first 25 years of FM broadcasting. Color TV didn't require people to throw out their B/W sets and buy an expensive new color set. Color TV didn't interfere with existing B/W television services and was still viewable on existing B/W sets. Just as current radios will continue to receive analog signals. So, then are you saying that HD radio, once all stations go to that, will require everyone to purchase an HD radio - or could one still listen to the station on a regular radio - with just poorer quality reception??- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - BAJ, You can not listen to the "HD" Radio 'Digital' Signal on an Anolog Radio. 1 - Buy a HD Radio and Listen for Free. 2 - Buy a Internet Radio and Pay a Month Fee. 3 - Buy a Satellite Radio and Pay a Month Fee. Your Future Choice : Free -or- Monthly Fee ~ RHF .- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Internet radio requires a fee? I'm still waiting for my first bill in the mail.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Steve, Do You Pay For Internet Access ? Via a Land Line or Cable ? [ ISP Costs ] The average Table Radio is ~25 Watts -while- The average Home PC is ~250 Watts [ 10X ] -extra- "WiFi" Whole House System you pay-through-the-nose month-after-month ~ RHF .- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Yes, but it seems pretty deceptive to call that an internet radio 'fee'. It's a bit like saying you pay a monthly 'fee' to listen to over-the-air radio when you pay your power bill or buy batteries. |
Latest e-mail about IBOC
On Nov 23, 8:21 pm, Steve wrote:
On Nov 23, 5:42 pm, RHF wrote: On Nov 23, 11:24 am, Steve wrote: On Nov 23, 2:28 am, RHF wrote: On Nov 22, 7:25 pm, " wrote: On Nov 22, 4:14 pm, "David Eduardo" wrote: "Brenda Ann" wrote in message m... "D Peter Maus" wrote in message ... FM failed. Twice. The public didn't care. There was virtually no uptake. Look at it now. FM didn't require people to throw out their old radios and buy new ones. It didn't? How did you listen to FM on an AM radio. Similarly, HD does not require anyone buy a new radio unless they want to... the analog signals continue to be broadcast. Of course, you had the choice of simply not buying an FM radio, which is what 99% of the people did for the first 25 years of FM broadcasting. Color TV didn't require people to throw out their B/W sets and buy an expensive new color set. Color TV didn't interfere with existing B/W television services and was still viewable on existing B/W sets. Just as current radios will continue to receive analog signals. So, then are you saying that HD radio, once all stations go to that, will require everyone to purchase an HD radio - or could one still listen to the station on a regular radio - with just poorer quality reception??- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - BAJ, You can not listen to the "HD" Radio 'Digital' Signal on an Anolog Radio. 1 - Buy a HD Radio and Listen for Free. 2 - Buy a Internet Radio and Pay a Month Fee. 3 - Buy a Satellite Radio and Pay a Month Fee. Your Future Choice : Free -or- Monthly Fee ~ RHF .- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Internet radio requires a fee? I'm still waiting for my first bill in the mail.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Steve, Do You Pay For Internet Access ? Via a Land Line or Cable ? [ ISP Costs ] The average Table Radio is ~25 Watts -while- The average Home PC is ~250 Watts [ 10X ] -extra- "WiFi" Whole House System you pay-through-the-nose month-after-month ~ RHF .- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Yes, but it seems pretty deceptive to call that an internet radio 'fee'. It's a bit like saying you pay a monthly 'fee' to listen to over-the-air radio when you pay your power bill or buy batteries.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Here's the way I see it. You pay a "fee" for a service if your using that service requires you to pay something over and above what you'd pay were you *not* using that service. Your monthly power bill is not a monthly 'over the air' radio "fee" because you'd be paying your power bill even if you didn't listen to or own a radio. By the same token, your monthly ISP bill is not an internet radio "fee" because you'd be paying it even if you weren't listening to internet radio. |
Point-of-Fact : Internet Radio -is- Anti-Green -and- AnEnvironmentally Un-Sound Media Distribution System [.]
On Nov 23, 5:21 pm, Steve wrote:
On Nov 23, 5:42 pm, RHF wrote: On Nov 23, 11:24 am, Steve wrote: On Nov 23, 2:28 am, RHF wrote: On Nov 22, 7:25 pm, " wrote: On Nov 22, 4:14 pm, "David Eduardo" wrote: "Brenda Ann" wrote in message m... "D Peter Maus" wrote in message ... FM failed. Twice. The public didn't care. There was virtually no uptake. Look at it now. FM didn't require people to throw out their old radios and buy new ones. It didn't? How did you listen to FM on an AM radio. Similarly, HD does not require anyone buy a new radio unless they want to... the analog signals continue to be broadcast. Of course, you had the choice of simply not buying an FM radio, which is what 99% of the people did for the first 25 years of FM broadcasting. Color TV didn't require people to throw out their B/W sets and buy an expensive new color set. Color TV didn't interfere with existing B/W television services and was still viewable on existing B/W sets. Just as current radios will continue to receive analog signals. So, then are you saying that HD radio, once all stations go to that, will require everyone to purchase an HD radio - or could one still listen to the station on a regular radio - with just poorer quality reception??- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - BAJ, You can not listen to the "HD" Radio 'Digital' Signal on an Anolog Radio. 1 - Buy a HD Radio and Listen for Free. 2 - Buy a Internet Radio and Pay a Month Fee. 3 - Buy a Satellite Radio and Pay a Month Fee. Your Future Choice : Free -or- Monthly Fee ~ RHF .- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Internet radio requires a fee? I'm still waiting for my first bill in the mail.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - - - Steve, - - - - Do You Pay For Internet Access ? - - - - Via a Land Line or Cable ? [ ISP Costs ] - - - - The average Table Radio is ~25 Watts - - -while- The average Home PC is ~250 Watts [ 10X ] - - -extra- "WiFi" Whole House System - - - - you pay-through-the-nose month-after-month ~ RHF - - . - - - Yes, but it seems pretty deceptive to call that an internet radio - 'fee'. It's a bit like saying you pay a monthly 'fee' to listen to - over-the-air radio when you pay your power bill or buy batteries. Steve - Deceptive [ D E C E P T I V E ] - It's The Truth [.] It is part of the cost-of-doing-business just like the True Power-Cost of In-Home Internet Radio is actually Ten Times [10X] the Cost of a Single AM/FM Table Radio Point-of-Fact : Internet Radio -is- Anti-Green -and- Presently An Environmentally Un-Sound Media Distribution System [.] SAVE THE PLANET - LISTEN TO 'FREE' OVER-THE-AIR RADIO ! When an Internet Radio can Function like an basic 'kitchen' AM/FM Radio and be Plug-and-Use like a basic Toaster : * AC Power Plug * Telephone Power Plug [No PC or WiFi] IMHO - Then Internet Radio will have come of Age for Use by the Average Radio Listener. ~ RHF |
Internet Radio Proponents : What Part of the "Free" in 'Free'Over-the-Air Radio Do You Not Understand ?
On Nov 23, 5:33 pm, Steve wrote:
On Nov 23, 8:21 pm, Steve wrote: On Nov 23, 5:42 pm, RHF wrote: On Nov 23, 11:24 am, Steve wrote: On Nov 23, 2:28 am, RHF wrote: On Nov 22, 7:25 pm, " wrote: On Nov 22, 4:14 pm, "David Eduardo" wrote: "Brenda Ann" wrote in message m... "D Peter Maus" wrote in message ... FM failed. Twice. The public didn't care. There was virtually no uptake. Look at it now. FM didn't require people to throw out their old radios and buy new ones. It didn't? How did you listen to FM on an AM radio. Similarly, HD does not require anyone buy a new radio unless they want to... the analog signals continue to be broadcast. Of course, you had the choice of simply not buying an FM radio, which is what 99% of the people did for the first 25 years of FM broadcasting. Color TV didn't require people to throw out their B/W sets and buy an expensive new color set. Color TV didn't interfere with existing B/W television services and was still viewable on existing B/W sets. Just as current radios will continue to receive analog signals. So, then are you saying that HD radio, once all stations go to that, will require everyone to purchase an HD radio - or could one still listen to the station on a regular radio - with just poorer quality reception??- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - BAJ, You can not listen to the "HD" Radio 'Digital' Signal on an Anolog Radio. 1 - Buy a HD Radio and Listen for Free. 2 - Buy a Internet Radio and Pay a Month Fee. 3 - Buy a Satellite Radio and Pay a Month Fee. Your Future Choice : Free -or- Monthly Fee ~ RHF .- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Internet radio requires a fee? I'm still waiting for my first bill in the mail.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Steve, Do You Pay For Internet Access ? Via a Land Line or Cable ? [ ISP Costs ] The average Table Radio is ~25 Watts -while- The average Home PC is ~250 Watts [ 10X ] -extra- "WiFi" Whole House System you pay-through-the-nose month-after-month ~ RHF .- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Yes, but it seems pretty deceptive to call that an internet radio 'fee'. It's a bit like saying you pay a monthly 'fee' to listen to over-the-air radio when you pay your power bill or buy batteries.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - - Here's the way I see it. You pay a "fee" for a service if your using - that service requires you to pay something over and above what you'd - pay were you *not* using that service. Your monthly power bill is not - a monthly 'over the air' radio "fee" because you'd be paying your - power bill even if you didn't listen to or own a radio. By the same - token, your monthly ISP bill is not an internet radio "fee" because - you'd be paying it even if you weren't listening to internet radio. Steve, Yours is a Distorted View 'wink' of the Real Underlaying Monthly Costs of having and using an Internet Radio -via- PC or WiFi. Internet Radio Proponents : What Part of the "Free" in 'Free' Over-the-Air Radio Do You Not Understand ? * No Monthly Fees * Nothing Extra Required to Operate {Stand-A-Lone} -If- Power Cost are Excluded from Both. ~ RHF |
IBOC "HD" Radio - The Radio Listening Public Is Just Being Taken Along For The Ride
"IBOCcrock" wrote in message ... iBiquty has already mentioned exit-strategies: Exit strategies are usually focused on the point where venture capital cashes in, and takes a company public or sells to a larger one. That can occur well before the company is profitable and only requires a perception of value. iBiquity has nearly all the viable AM and FM stations in the top 100 markets on board. If the market improves, they could probably do a very profitable LBO immediately. |
IBOC "HD" Radio - The Radio Listening Public Is Just Being TakenAlong For The Ride
On Nov 23, 3:24 pm, David wrote:
RHF wrote: -snip- DPM & IBOC Crock, IBOC "HD" Radio - The Radio Listening Public Is Just Being Taken Along For The Ride http://groups.google.com/group/hd-ra...4081349a8fdbf1 1 - The Market for the Product "IBOC 'HD' Radio" is Radio Stations {The Broadcasters} at the Corporate Media Level. ? Do They 'Believe' That IBOC "HD" Radio Is Good For Their Corporate Business Model and the Broadcast Industry as a Whole ? -=YES=- ? Do They 'Believe' That IBOC "HD" {Digiital} Radio Is A Better Media Product Then The Current Analog Media Product ? -=YES=- ? Do They 'Believe' That IBOC "HD" {Digiital} Radio Will Give Them a Better Competitive Edge/Footing Against 'Other' Newer Digital Media Products ? -=YES=- ? Do They 'Believe' That FM IBOC "HD" {Digiital} Radio Will Give Them An Additional Income Source Per FM Radio Station An Add To Their Corporate Profits ? -=YES=- 2 - The Radio Stations {The Broadcasters} at the Corporate Media Level -Believe- That the Free Over-the-Air Radio Listening Public Will Accept and Adapt To : What They Can Get For Free From The Radio Stations {The Broadcasters}. 3 - As far as the FCC issuing Mandates and Requirements : The FCC Will Do What The Market Tells Them To Do : The Market Is Not 'The Radio Listening Public' : The Market Is In-Fact "Radio Stations {The Broadcasters} at the Corporate Media Level". The-Bottom-Line - The Slow Road {Years} To 100% Digital Broadcasting -Via- IBOC "HD" Radio Is Being Driven By Corporate Media -and- The Radio Listening Public Is Just Being Taken Along For The Ride [.] And That Is How I See It - As An Avid 'Free' Over-the-Air Radio Listener. hy dee ray dee oh ~ RHF Hello and Welcome to the "HD Radio" NewsGroup HD RADIO =http://groups.google.com/group/hd-radio/ . - The FCC answers to congress. - There is theoretically some check and balance there. David - Congress is 'beholding' to Corporate Media. ~ RHF [ In the Fusion of Politics and Business : Money Talks ! ] |
IBOC "HD" Radio - The Radio Listening Public Is Just Being TakenAlong For The Ride
On Nov 23, 4:23 pm, IBOCcrock wrote:
- Notice the sentence: "... At some point in the future, when the - Commission determines there is sufficient market penetration of - digital receivers" - that equals number of receivers puchased by the - general public. LOL! IBOC Crock, Review the History of FM Radio - History Repeats Itself. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radio_station#FM Review the History of HDTV - Evolving History Learns From The Past Mistakes -and- Does Not Repeat Itself. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High-de...alog_ shutoff ~ RHF |
Point-of-Fact : Internet Radio -is- Anti-Green -and- AnEnvironmentally Un-Sound Media Distribution System [.]
On Nov 23, 8:08 pm, Steve wrote:
On Nov 23, 9:07 pm, RHF wrote: On Nov 23, 5:21 pm, Steve wrote: On Nov 23, 5:42 pm, RHF wrote: On Nov 23, 11:24 am, Steve wrote: On Nov 23, 2:28 am, RHF wrote: On Nov 22, 7:25 pm, " wrote: On Nov 22, 4:14 pm, "David Eduardo" wrote: "Brenda Ann" wrote in message m... "D Peter Maus" wrote in message ... FM failed. Twice. The public didn't care. There was virtually no uptake. Look at it now. FM didn't require people to throw out their old radios and buy new ones. It didn't? How did you listen to FM on an AM radio. Similarly, HD does not require anyone buy a new radio unless they want to... the analog signals continue to be broadcast. Of course, you had the choice of simply not buying an FM radio, which is what 99% of the people did for the first 25 years of FM broadcasting. Color TV didn't require people to throw out their B/W sets and buy an expensive new color set. Color TV didn't interfere with existing B/W television services and was still viewable on existing B/W sets. Just as current radios will continue to receive analog signals. So, then are you saying that HD radio, once all stations go to that, will require everyone to purchase an HD radio - or could one still listen to the station on a regular radio - with just poorer quality reception??- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - BAJ, You can not listen to the "HD" Radio 'Digital' Signal on an Anolog Radio. 1 - Buy a HD Radio and Listen for Free. 2 - Buy a Internet Radio and Pay a Month Fee. 3 - Buy a Satellite Radio and Pay a Month Fee. Your Future Choice : Free -or- Monthly Fee ~ RHF .- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Internet radio requires a fee? I'm still waiting for my first bill in the mail.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - - - Steve, - - - - Do You Pay For Internet Access ? - - - - Via a Land Line or Cable ? [ ISP Costs ] - - - - The average Table Radio is ~25 Watts - - -while- The average Home PC is ~250 Watts [ 10X ] - - -extra- "WiFi" Whole House System - - - - you pay-through-the-nose month-after-month ~ RHF - - . - - - Yes, but it seems pretty deceptive to call that an internet radio - 'fee'. It's a bit like saying you pay a monthly 'fee' to listen to - over-the-air radio when you pay your power bill or buy batteries. Steve - Deceptive [ D E C E P T I V E ] - It's The Truth [.] It is part of the cost-of-doing-business just like the True Power-Cost of In-Home Internet Radio is actually Ten Times [10X] the Cost of a Single AM/FM Table Radio Point-of-Fact : Internet Radio -is- Anti-Green -and- Presently An Environmentally Un-Sound Media Distribution System [.] SAVE THE PLANET - LISTEN TO 'FREE' OVER-THE-AIR RADIO ! When an Internet Radio can Function like an basic 'kitchen' AM/FM Radio and be Plug-and-Use like a basic Toaster : * AC Power Plug * Telephone Power Plug [No PC or WiFi] IMHO - Then Internet Radio will have come of Age for Use by the Average Radio Listener. ~ RHF .- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - - Then just answer one simple question for me. - If what you're saying is correct, then if I stop listening - to internet radio tomorrow, - I'll begin saving money. - How, exactly, will this happen? - What money will I save? Steve - DOH ! - Savings -do-not-equal- Costs ~ RHF |
Point-of-Fact : Internet Radio -is- Anti-Green -and- AnEnvironmentally Un-Sound Media Distribution System [.]
On Nov 24, 3:50 am, RHF wrote:
On Nov 23, 8:08 pm, Steve wrote: On Nov 23, 9:07 pm, RHF wrote: On Nov 23, 5:21 pm, Steve wrote: On Nov 23, 5:42 pm, RHF wrote: On Nov 23, 11:24 am, Steve wrote: On Nov 23, 2:28 am, RHF wrote: On Nov 22, 7:25 pm, " wrote: On Nov 22, 4:14 pm, "David Eduardo" wrote: "Brenda Ann" wrote in message m... "D Peter Maus" wrote in message ... FM failed. Twice. The public didn't care. There was virtually no uptake. Look at it now. FM didn't require people to throw out their old radios and buy new ones. It didn't? How did you listen to FM on an AM radio. Similarly, HD does not require anyone buy a new radio unless they want to... the analog signals continue to be broadcast. Of course, you had the choice of simply not buying an FM radio, which is what 99% of the people did for the first 25 years of FM broadcasting. Color TV didn't require people to throw out their B/W sets and buy an expensive new color set. Color TV didn't interfere with existing B/W television services and was still viewable on existing B/W sets. Just as current radios will continue to receive analog signals. So, then are you saying that HD radio, once all stations go to that, will require everyone to purchase an HD radio - or could one still listen to the station on a regular radio - with just poorer quality reception??- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - BAJ, You can not listen to the "HD" Radio 'Digital' Signal on an Anolog Radio. 1 - Buy a HD Radio and Listen for Free. 2 - Buy a Internet Radio and Pay a Month Fee. 3 - Buy a Satellite Radio and Pay a Month Fee. Your Future Choice : Free -or- Monthly Fee ~ RHF .- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Internet radio requires a fee? I'm still waiting for my first bill in the mail.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - - - Steve, - - - - Do You Pay For Internet Access ? - - - - Via a Land Line or Cable ? [ ISP Costs ] - - - - The average Table Radio is ~25 Watts - - -while- The average Home PC is ~250 Watts [ 10X ] - - -extra- "WiFi" Whole House System - - - - you pay-through-the-nose month-after-month ~ RHF - - . - - - Yes, but it seems pretty deceptive to call that an internet radio - 'fee'. It's a bit like saying you pay a monthly 'fee' to listen to - over-the-air radio when you pay your power bill or buy batteries. Steve - Deceptive [ D E C E P T I V E ] - It's The Truth [.] It is part of the cost-of-doing-business just like the True Power-Cost of In-Home Internet Radio is actually Ten Times [10X] the Cost of a Single AM/FM Table Radio Point-of-Fact : Internet Radio -is- Anti-Green -and- Presently An Environmentally Un-Sound Media Distribution System [.] SAVE THE PLANET - LISTEN TO 'FREE' OVER-THE-AIR RADIO ! When an Internet Radio can Function like an basic 'kitchen' AM/FM Radio and be Plug-and-Use like a basic Toaster : * AC Power Plug * Telephone Power Plug [No PC or WiFi] IMHO - Then Internet Radio will have come of Age for Use by the Average Radio Listener. ~ RHF .- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - - Then just answer one simple question for me. - If what you're saying is correct, then if I stop listening - to internet radio tomorrow, - I'll begin saving money. - How, exactly, will this happen? - What money will I save? Steve - DOH ! - Savings -do-not-equal- Costs ~ RHF .- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - I'm not asking whether savings equal costs. I'm asking you to clarify your claim that people who listen to internet radio are charged a monthly fee for that privilege. We're not in disagreement about the fact that internet radio requires internet access. Nor do we disagree about what stand alone internet radios cost, so far as I can tell. I am not denying that there are costs, and if you think I am denying some of the costs, just say so. We can discuss it. In the meantime, I would appreciate it if you would clarify your statement that people who listen to internet radio are charged a monthly fee for doing so. The question is not whether they're charged a monthly fee for internet access. The question is not whether they pay for their electricity. The question is not whether they had to purchase their internet radios. The question is whether people are charged a monthly fee that is specifically for listening to internet radio. You've asserted numerous times that they are charged such a fee. I would appreciate it if you would explain this--assuming of course that you really meant it. |
IBOC "HD" Radio - The Radio Listening Public Is Just Being TakenAlong For The Ride
On Nov 23, 9:22 pm, "David Eduardo" wrote:
"IBOCcrock" wrote in message ... iBiquty has already mentioned exit-strategies: Exit strategies are usually focused on the point where venture capital cashes in, and takes a company public or sells to a larger one. That can occur well before the company is profitable and only requires a perception of value. iBiquity has nearly all the viable AM and FM stations in the top 100 markets on board. If the market improves, they could probably do a very profitable LBO immediately. Conversions to HD/IBOC are stalling: "Bellwether BE Makes Some Changes?" "BE is going through some less pleasant changes right now. Within a few weeks' time the manufacturer of transmitters and digital audio and data products lost its global sales VP; it laid off some of its employees; and it announced the retirement of its CEO of eight years, John Pedlow -- news that came, at least to me, suddenly... It's probably no secret that the rate of HD Radio adoption has slowed in the United States. There are new opportunities that exist in other countries; Mexico and Brazil come to mind; sales there are few but promising. The whole industry is in a bit of a null in the HD transition but I don't think anyone's long-term plans have changed." http://www.rwonline.com/pages/s.0044/t.9546.html "IBiquity Digital's Make-or-Break Point Approaches" February 2005 "If we had this conversation seven years ago and you were to tell me that in 2004 this company would still be private and raising funds, I'd probably have keeled over, said Thomas Uhlman, a managing partner at iBiquity's largest shareholder, New Venture Partners LLC." http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...2005Feb27.html So, iNiquity has only the $50/radio HD chipset fees to keep themselves and the dying radio industry afloat. Investors have been waiting forever to cash-in, hence the "couldn't be reached for comment". If iBiquty could sell 100,000,000 HD radios, that would mean $5,000,000,000 - the only reason they are looking at exit-strategies is because the investors are mad-barking dogs at their door, and the company is going nowhere! |
IBOC "HD" Radio - The Radio Listening Public Is Just Being TakenAlong For The Ride
On Nov 23, 9:22 pm, "David Eduardo" wrote:
"IBOCcrock" wrote in message ... iBiquty has already mentioned exit-strategies: Exit strategies are usually focused on the point where venture capital cashes in, and takes a company public or sells to a larger one. That can occur well before the company is profitable and only requires a perception of value. iBiquity has nearly all the viable AM and FM stations in the top 100 markets on board. If the market improves, they could probably do a very profitable LBO immediately. "A Significant Sign in the Death of HD Radio" "The radio industry is giving off signs that HD Radio is dead, even though we keep hearing bright comments being uttered by iBiquity execs... While the public's pulse on HD isn't beating, the latest glaze over this problem is in a rebuilt HD Radio Alliance web site to educate retailers and sales personnel on the benefits of HD Radio...This is death sign #1... HD Radio's death is imminent. It's only a matter of time, if you read the signs." http://www.audiographics.com/agd/102607-1.htm More death signs: "Have 200 HD Radio stations gone missing?" "The HD Radio camp is advertising that there are currently over 1,500 radio stations now broadcasting in HD (from its website, to press releases as well as in various other promotions)... but yet only 1,300 have filed with the FCC." http://www.orbitcast.com/archives/ha...e-missing.html "IS IBIQUITY RENEGING ON A REBATE OFFER?" "CGC #791 mentioned a limited-time price for the entry-level Radiosophy HD100 digital radio receiver and there was a handsome rebate offered from iBiquity. It now appears that iBiquity's rebate contractor is balking on issuing some rebates, and we'd like to determine the extent of the problem... We'll let you know if significant trends develop." http://www.bext.com/_CGC/2007/cgc807.htm And, you can't undo the damage - HD/IBOC just doesn't work: "Is HD Radio Toast?" "There are serious issues of coverage. Early adopters who bought HD radios report serious drop-outs, poor coverage, and interference. The engineers of Ibiquity may argue otherwise and defend the system, but the industry has a serious PR problem with the very people we need to get the word out on HD... In other words, everything you can find on the regular FM dial... The word has already gotten out about HD Radio. People who have already bought an HD Radio are telling others of their experience (mostly bad) and no amount of marketing will reverse this." http://www.fmqb.com/article.asp?id=487772 Lots-of-luck! |
IBOC "HD" Radio - The Radio Listening Public Is Just Being TakenAlong For The Ride
On Nov 23, 9:22�pm, "David Eduardo" wrote:
"IBOCcrock" wrote in message ... iBiquty has already mentioned exit-strategies: �Exit strategies are usually focused on the point where venture capital cashes in, and takes a company public or sells to a larger one. That can occur well before the company is profitable and only requires a perception of value. iBiquity has nearly all the viable AM and FM stations in the top 100 markets on board. If the market improves, they could probably do a very profitable LBO immediately. Let's not forget how Peter Ferrera spouted off that HD Radio would appear in Apple products: "Radio on the iPod? Only if it's Internet Radio" "He said (with a straight face) that Apple had no immediate plans for a 'radio-type' function on its players because "Steve considers traditional radio to be a an old technology and he doesn't want to 'taint' his cutting edge technology. How about Internet radio? That's a different story" my contact stated!" http://www.hear2.com/2007/11/radio-on-the-ip.html Here is one of Ferrera's most-famous quotes: "...I can tell you that 30 different product lines of automobiles will have HD Radio as optional or standard equipment by the 2008 model year." Your whole industry is full-of-****! |
The Great Debate : Free Internet Radio - It Ain't Free ! -while- FreeOver-the-Air Radio Is FREE !
On Nov 24, 4:37 am, Steve wrote:
On Nov 24, 3:50 am, RHF wrote: On Nov 23, 8:08 pm, Steve wrote: On Nov 23, 9:07 pm, RHF wrote: On Nov 23, 5:21 pm, Steve wrote: On Nov 23, 5:42 pm, RHF wrote: On Nov 23, 11:24 am, Steve wrote: On Nov 23, 2:28 am, RHF wrote: On Nov 22, 7:25 pm, " wrote: On Nov 22, 4:14 pm, "David Eduardo" wrote: "Brenda Ann" wrote in message m... "D Peter Maus" wrote in message ... FM failed. Twice. The public didn't care. There was virtually no uptake. Look at it now. FM didn't require people to throw out their old radios and buy new ones. It didn't? How did you listen to FM on an AM radio. Similarly, HD does not require anyone buy a new radio unless they want to... the analog signals continue to be broadcast. Of course, you had the choice of simply not buying an FM radio, which is what 99% of the people did for the first 25 years of FM broadcasting. Color TV didn't require people to throw out their B/W sets and buy an expensive new color set. Color TV didn't interfere with existing B/W television services and was still viewable on existing B/W sets. Just as current radios will continue to receive analog signals. So, then are you saying that HD radio, once all stations go to that, will require everyone to purchase an HD radio - or could one still listen to the station on a regular radio - with just poorer quality reception??- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - BAJ, You can not listen to the "HD" Radio 'Digital' Signal on an Anolog Radio. 1 - Buy a HD Radio and Listen for Free. 2 - Buy a Internet Radio and Pay a Month Fee. 3 - Buy a Satellite Radio and Pay a Month Fee. Your Future Choice : Free -or- Monthly Fee ~ RHF .- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Internet radio requires a fee? I'm still waiting for my first bill in the mail.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - - - Steve, - - - - Do You Pay For Internet Access ? - - - - Via a Land Line or Cable ? [ ISP Costs ] - - - - The average Table Radio is ~25 Watts - - -while- The average Home PC is ~250 Watts [ 10X ] - - -extra- "WiFi" Whole House System - - - - you pay-through-the-nose month-after-month ~ RHF - - . - - - Yes, but it seems pretty deceptive to call that an internet radio - 'fee'. It's a bit like saying you pay a monthly 'fee' to listen to - over-the-air radio when you pay your power bill or buy batteries. Steve - Deceptive [ D E C E P T I V E ] - It's The Truth [.] It is part of the cost-of-doing-business just like the True Power-Cost of In-Home Internet Radio is actually Ten Times [10X] the Cost of a Single AM/FM Table Radio Point-of-Fact : Internet Radio -is- Anti-Green -and- Presently An Environmentally Un-Sound Media Distribution System [.] SAVE THE PLANET - LISTEN TO 'FREE' OVER-THE-AIR RADIO ! When an Internet Radio can Function like an basic 'kitchen' AM/FM Radio and be Plug-and-Use like a basic Toaster : * AC Power Plug * Telephone Power Plug [No PC or WiFi] IMHO - Then Internet Radio will have come of Age for Use by the Average Radio Listener. ~ RHF .- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - - Then just answer one simple question for me. - If what you're saying is correct, then if I stop listening - to internet radio tomorrow, - I'll begin saving money. - How, exactly, will this happen? - What money will I save? Steve - DOH ! - Savings -do-not-equal- Costs ~ RHF .- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - I'm not asking whether savings equal costs. I'm asking you to clarify your claim that people who listen to internet radio are charged a monthly fee for that privilege. We're not in disagreement about the fact that internet radio requires internet access. Nor do we disagree about what stand alone internet radios cost, so far as I can tell. I am not denying that there are costs, and if you think I am denying some of the costs, just say so. We can discuss it. In the meantime, I would appreciate it if you would clarify your statement that people who listen to internet radio are charged a monthly fee for doing so. The question is not whether they're charged a monthly fee for internet access. The question is not whether they pay for their electricity. The question is not whether they had to purchase their internet radios. The question is whether people are charged a monthly fee that is specifically for listening to internet radio. You've asserted numerous times that they are charged such a fee. I would appreciate it if you would explain this--assuming of course that you really meant it.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Steve, The Great Debate : Free Internet Radio - It Ain't Free ! -while- Free Over-the-Air Radio Is FREE ! [ Arguing-the-Absurd ] Question - Do You Pay For Internet Service {Access} ? Hell No ! - I Have 'Free' Internet Access - * Its Free -and- Therefore Your Internet Radio Too "Is Free" ! - Lucky You :o} -OR- Are You Like the Vast Majority of Internet Users -and- Must Honestly Say : Oh Yeah ! - I "Paid" For Internet Acce$$ - It Does Cost Me Money - Every Month / Every Year . Therefore Your Internet Radio Too "Is Not Free" ! - Reality :-{ -cause- WIthout the Fees for Intenet Acce$$ : You would NOT have Your Internet Radio as Part of the Acce$$ / $ervice [.] -TBL- Internet Radio It Ain't Free [.] Now it is true that -if- you get your Internet Radio "At Work" : It Cost You Nothing -but- Your Employer Is Paying For Internet Acce$$. Plus -if- you get your Internet Radio "Via WiFi" at StarBucks : It Cost You Nothing -but- StarBucks Is Paying For Internet Acce$$. -and- Your Two Dollar Cup-of-Coffee was Not Free. Now 'At-Home' My Pocket AM/FM Radio -IS- "Free". * Any Where Around The House Inside and Out. Now 'At-Work' My Pocket AM/FM Radio -IS- "Free". * Any Where In The Work Place. Now 'In-Any-Store' My Pocket AM/FM Radio -IS- "Free". * Any Where Throughout The Mall - StarBucks included. Now 'In-the-Car' My Car AM/FM Radio -IS- "Free". * Any Where I Drive. Yes I Am Free-To-Be-Me -with- My "Free" Over-the-Air Radio ~ RHF |
IBOC "HD" Radio - The Radio Listening Public Is Just Being TakenAlong For The Ride
On Nov 24, 11:48*am, wrote:
On Nov 23, 9:22�pm, "David Eduardo" wrote: "IBOCcrock" wrote in message ... iBiquty has already mentioned exit-strategies: �Exit strategies are usually focused on the point where venture capital cashes in, and takes a company public or sells to a larger one. That can occur well before the company is profitable and only requires a perception of value. iBiquity has nearly all the viable AM and FM stations in the top 100 markets on board. If the market improves, they could probably do a very profitable LBO immediately. Let's not forget how Peter Ferrera spouted off that HD Radio would appear in Apple products: "Radio on the iPod? Only if it's Internet Radio" "He said (with a straight face) that Apple had no immediate plans for a 'radio-type' function on its players because "Steve considers traditional radio to be a an old technology and he doesn't want to 'taint' his cutting edge technology. How about Internet radio? That's a different story" my contact stated!" http://www.hear2.com/2007/11/radio-on-the-ip.html Here is one of Ferrera's most-famous quotes: "...I can tell you that 30 different product lines of automobiles will have HD Radio as optional or standard equipment by the 2008 model year." - Your whole industry is full-of-****! PocketRadio - 'full-of-****!' - Finally An Opinion On Something That You Are An Expert On ! ~ RHF |
IBOC "HD" Radio - The Radio Listening Public Is Just Being TakenAlong For The Ride
On Nov 24, 6:53*pm, RHF wrote:
On Nov 24, 11:48*am, wrote: On Nov 23, 9:22�pm, "David Eduardo" wrote: "IBOCcrock" wrote in message .... iBiquty has already mentioned exit-strategies: �Exit strategies are usually focused on the point where venture capital cashes in, and takes a company public or sells to a larger one. That can occur well before the company is profitable and only requires a perception of value. iBiquity has nearly all the viable AM and FM stations in the top 100 markets on board. If the market improves, they could probably do a very profitable LBO immediately. Let's not forget how Peter Ferrera spouted off that HD Radio would appear in Apple products: "Radio on the iPod? Only if it's Internet Radio" "He said (with a straight face) that Apple had no immediate plans for a 'radio-type' function on its players because "Steve considers traditional radio to be a an old technology and he doesn't want to 'taint' his cutting edge technology. How about Internet radio? That's a different story" my contact stated!" http://www.hear2.com/2007/11/radio-on-the-ip.html Here is one of Ferrera's most-famous quotes: "...I can tell you that 30 different product lines of automobiles will have HD Radio as optional or standard equipment by the 2008 model year." - Your whole industry is full-of-****! PocketRadio - 'full-of-****!' - Finally An Opinion On Something That You Are An Expert On ! ~ RHF *.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - The HD Radio industry: http://www.forumspile.com/You-Are-Fu...t_(Toilet).jpg |
The Great Debate : Free Internet Radio - It Ain't Free ! -while-Free Over-the-Air Radio Is FREE !
On Nov 24, 6:50 pm, RHF wrote:
Steve, The Great Debate : Free Internet Radio - It Ain't Free ! -while- Free Over-the-Air Radio Is FREE ! [ Arguing-the-Absurd ] Question - Do You Pay For Internet Service {Access} ? Of course I pay for internet access. Hell No ! - I Have 'Free' Internet Access - * Its Free -and- Therefore Your Internet Radio Too "Is Free" ! - Lucky You :o} -OR- Are You Like the Vast Majority of Internet Users -and- Must Honestly Say : Oh Yeah ! - I "Paid" For Internet Acce$$ - It Does Cost Me Money - Every Month / Every Year . Therefore Your Internet Radio Too "Is Not Free" ! - Reality :-{ -cause- WIthout the Fees for Intenet Acce$$ : You would NOT have Your Internet Radio as Part of the Acce$$ / $ervice [.] -TBL- Internet Radio It Ain't Free [.] Of course my internet access isn't free. Nor is the electricity that I use to run my over the air radios. So what? You said that there is a monthly fee SPECIFICALLY for listening to internet radio. I would appreciate it if you would explain this, as I've yet to receive any internet radio bills in the mail. Now it is true that -if- you get your Internet Radio "At Work" : It Cost You Nothing -but- Your Employer Is Paying For Internet Acce$$. Plus -if- you get your Internet Radio "Via WiFi" at StarBucks : It Cost You Nothing -but- StarBucks Is Paying For Internet Acce$$. -and- Your Two Dollar Cup-of-Coffee was Not Free. Now 'At-Home' My Pocket AM/FM Radio -IS- "Free". * Any Where Around The House Inside and Out. Now 'At-Work' My Pocket AM/FM Radio -IS- "Free". * Any Where In The Work Place. Now 'In-Any-Store' My Pocket AM/FM Radio -IS- "Free". * Any Where Throughout The Mall - StarBucks included. Now 'In-the-Car' My Car AM/FM Radio -IS- "Free". * Any Where I Drive. Yes I Am Free-To-Be-Me -with- My "Free" Over-the-Air Radio ~ RHF .- Hide quoted text - So far as I can tell, we're in complete agreement about all of this. We only seem to disagree about whether there's a monthly fee that is not for electricity and not for internet but is specifically for internet radio. Can you tell us more about this fee? |
Is Pacific Gas and Electric charging you a monthly fee forlistening to over-the-air radio?????!!!!!
This is an outrage!
|
The Great Debate : Free Internet Radio - It Ain't Free ! -while-Free Over-the-Air Radio Is FREE !
On Nov 24, 4:47 pm, Steve wrote:
On Nov 24, 6:50 pm, RHF wrote: Steve, The Great Debate : Free Internet Radio - It Ain't Free ! -while- Free Over-the-Air Radio Is FREE ! [ Arguing-the-Absurd ] Question - Do You Pay For Internet Service {Access} ? Of course I pay for internet access. Hell No ! - I Have 'Free' Internet Access - * Its Free -and- Therefore Your Internet Radio Too "Is Free" ! - Lucky You :o} -OR- Are You Like the Vast Majority of Internet Users -and- Must Honestly Say : Oh Yeah ! - I "Paid" For Internet Acce$$ - It Does Cost Me Money - Every Month / Every Year . Therefore Your Internet Radio Too "Is Not Free" ! - Reality :-{ -cause- WIthout the Fees for Intenet Acce$$ : You would NOT have Your Internet Radio as Part of the Acce$$ / $ervice [.] -TBL- Internet Radio It Ain't Free [.] Of course my internet access isn't free. Nor is the electricity that I use to run my over the air radios. So what? You said that there is a monthly fee SPECIFICALLY for listening to internet radio. I would appreciate it if you would explain this, as I've yet to receive any internet radio bills in the mail. Now it is true that -if- you get your Internet Radio "At Work" : It Cost You Nothing -but- Your Employer Is Paying For Internet Acce$$. Plus -if- you get your Internet Radio "Via WiFi" at StarBucks : It Cost You Nothing -but- StarBucks Is Paying For Internet Acce$$. -and- Your Two Dollar Cup-of-Coffee was Not Free. Now 'At-Home' My Pocket AM/FM Radio -IS- "Free". * Any Where Around The House Inside and Out. Now 'At-Work' My Pocket AM/FM Radio -IS- "Free". * Any Where In The Work Place. Now 'In-Any-Store' My Pocket AM/FM Radio -IS- "Free". * Any Where Throughout The Mall - StarBucks included. Now 'In-the-Car' My Car AM/FM Radio -IS- "Free". * Any Where I Drive. Yes I Am Free-To-Be-Me -with- My "Free" Over-the-Air Radio ~ RHF .- Hide quoted text - So far as I can tell, we're in complete agreement about all of this. We only seem to disagree about whether there's a monthly fee that is not for electricity and not for internet but is specifically for internet radio. Can you tell us more about this fee?- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Steve, Built-in-Cost - Internet Radio as a 'Sub-Set' of the Internet Service {Access} Fee is a Built-in-Cost. -Note- This is a Direct Payment. BUT - Technically everytime that I buy a Product or Service that is Advertised on the Radio - It Too Has The Built-in-Cost of Radio Advertising [IN-IT]. -Note- This is an In-Direct Payment. In Reality - We (As Consumers) Pay for Both : At Some-Point-In-Time [.] - yes it is that simple ~ RHF |
The Great Debate : Free Internet Radio - It Ain't Free ! -while-Free Over-the-Air Radio Is FREE !
On Nov 24, 8:08 pm, RHF wrote:
On Nov 24, 4:47 pm, Steve wrote: On Nov 24, 6:50 pm, RHF wrote: Steve, The Great Debate : Free Internet Radio - It Ain't Free ! -while- Free Over-the-Air Radio Is FREE ! [ Arguing-the-Absurd ] Question - Do You Pay For Internet Service {Access} ? Of course I pay for internet access. Hell No ! - I Have 'Free' Internet Access - * Its Free -and- Therefore Your Internet Radio Too "Is Free" ! - Lucky You :o} -OR- Are You Like the Vast Majority of Internet Users -and- Must Honestly Say : Oh Yeah ! - I "Paid" For Internet Acce$$ - It Does Cost Me Money - Every Month / Every Year . Therefore Your Internet Radio Too "Is Not Free" ! - Reality :-{ -cause- WIthout the Fees for Intenet Acce$$ : You would NOT have Your Internet Radio as Part of the Acce$$ / $ervice [.] -TBL- Internet Radio It Ain't Free [.] Of course my internet access isn't free. Nor is the electricity that I use to run my over the air radios. So what? You said that there is a monthly fee SPECIFICALLY for listening to internet radio. I would appreciate it if you would explain this, as I've yet to receive any internet radio bills in the mail. Now it is true that -if- you get your Internet Radio "At Work" : It Cost You Nothing -but- Your Employer Is Paying For Internet Acce$$. Plus -if- you get your Internet Radio "Via WiFi" at StarBucks : It Cost You Nothing -but- StarBucks Is Paying For Internet Acce$$. -and- Your Two Dollar Cup-of-Coffee was Not Free. Now 'At-Home' My Pocket AM/FM Radio -IS- "Free". * Any Where Around The House Inside and Out. Now 'At-Work' My Pocket AM/FM Radio -IS- "Free". * Any Where In The Work Place. Now 'In-Any-Store' My Pocket AM/FM Radio -IS- "Free". * Any Where Throughout The Mall - StarBucks included. Now 'In-the-Car' My Car AM/FM Radio -IS- "Free". * Any Where I Drive. Yes I Am Free-To-Be-Me -with- My "Free" Over-the-Air Radio ~ RHF .- Hide quoted text - So far as I can tell, we're in complete agreement about all of this. We only seem to disagree about whether there's a monthly fee that is not for electricity and not for internet but is specifically for internet radio. Can you tell us more about this fee?- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Steve, Built-in-Cost - Internet Radio as a 'Sub-Set' of the Internet Service {Access} Fee is a Built-in-Cost. -Note- This is a Direct Payment. BUT - Technically everytime that I buy a Product or Service that is Advertised on the Radio - It Too Has The Built-in-Cost of Radio Advertising [IN-IT]. -Note- This is an In-Direct Payment. In Reality - We (As Consumers) Pay for Both : At Some-Point-In-Time [.] - yes it is that simple ~ RHF .- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - That what I hoped you meant. Thanks for the clarification. Steve |
Is Pacific Gas and Electric charging you a monthly fee forlistening to over-the-air radio?????!!!!!
On Nov 24, 5:02 pm, Steve wrote:
- - This is an outrage! - We Are Now 'Off-the-Grid' and have Free Solar Electricity ! http://www.links2love.com/love_lyrics_203.htm Oops - It Cost $135K for the Solar Power System . . . free can be very expensive - sometimes ~ RHF |
IBOC "HD" Radio - The Radio Listening Public Is Just Being TakenAlong For The Ride
On Nov 24, 4:04*pm, wrote:
On Nov 24, 6:53*pm, RHF wrote: On Nov 24, 11:48*am, wrote: On Nov 23, 9:22�pm, "David Eduardo" wrote: "IBOCcrock" wrote in message ... iBiquty has already mentioned exit-strategies: �Exit strategies are usually focused on the point where venture capital cashes in, and takes a company public or sells to a larger one. That can occur well before the company is profitable and only requires a perception of value. iBiquity has nearly all the viable AM and FM stations in the top 100 markets on board. If the market improves, they could probably do a very profitable LBO immediately. Let's not forget how Peter Ferrera spouted off that HD Radio would appear in Apple products: "Radio on the iPod? Only if it's Internet Radio" "He said (with a straight face) that Apple had no immediate plans for a 'radio-type' function on its players because "Steve considers traditional radio to be a an old technology and he doesn't want to 'taint' his cutting edge technology. How about Internet radio? That's a different story" my contact stated!" http://www.hear2.com/2007/11/radio-on-the-ip.html Here is one of Ferrera's most-famous quotes: "...I can tell you that 30 different product lines of automobiles will have HD Radio as optional or standard equipment by the 2008 model year." - Your whole industry is full-of-****! PocketRadio - 'full-of-****!' - Finally An Opinion On Something That You Are An Expert On ! ~ RHF *.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - - - The HD Radio industry: - - http://www.forumspile.com/You-Are-Fu...t_(Toilet).jpg - PocketRadio, Think more creatively - You wrote : 'The HD Radio Industry' http://www.forumspile.com/You-Are-Fu...t_(Toilet).jpg - - - Gets a 'Ho Hum' Reader Reaction. When you could have wrote : 'This Is Your Mind On "HD" Radio' http://www.forumspile.com/You-Are-Fu...t_(Toilet).jpg - - - Gets a 'Ha Ha Ha' reader Reaction. posting should be both informational and entertaining creating reader interest in what you have to say ~ RHF |
The Great Debate : Free Internet Radio - It Ain't Free ! -while-Free Over-the-Air Radio Is FREE !
On Nov 24, 8:37 pm, RHF wrote:
On Nov 24, 5:15 pm, Steve wrote: On Nov 24, 8:08 pm, RHF wrote: On Nov 24, 4:47 pm, Steve wrote: On Nov 24, 6:50 pm, RHF wrote: Steve, The Great Debate : Free Internet Radio - It Ain't Free ! -while- Free Over-the-Air Radio Is FREE ! [ Arguing-the-Absurd ] Question - Do You Pay For Internet Service {Access} ? Of course I pay for internet access. Hell No ! - I Have 'Free' Internet Access - * Its Free -and- Therefore Your Internet Radio Too "Is Free" ! - Lucky You :o} -OR- Are You Like the Vast Majority of Internet Users -and- Must Honestly Say : Oh Yeah ! - I "Paid" For Internet Acce$$ - It Does Cost Me Money - Every Month / Every Year . Therefore Your Internet Radio Too "Is Not Free" ! - Reality :-{ -cause- WIthout the Fees for Intenet Acce$$ : You would NOT have Your Internet Radio as Part of the Acce$$ / $ervice [.] -TBL- Internet Radio It Ain't Free [.] Of course my internet access isn't free. Nor is the electricity that I use to run my over the air radios. So what? You said that there is a monthly fee SPECIFICALLY for listening to internet radio. I would appreciate it if you would explain this, as I've yet to receive any internet radio bills in the mail. Now it is true that -if- you get your Internet Radio "At Work" : It Cost You Nothing -but- Your Employer Is Paying For Internet Acce$$. Plus -if- you get your Internet Radio "Via WiFi" at StarBucks : It Cost You Nothing -but- StarBucks Is Paying For Internet Acce$$. -and- Your Two Dollar Cup-of-Coffee was Not Free. Now 'At-Home' My Pocket AM/FM Radio -IS- "Free". * Any Where Around The House Inside and Out. Now 'At-Work' My Pocket AM/FM Radio -IS- "Free". * Any Where In The Work Place. Now 'In-Any-Store' My Pocket AM/FM Radio -IS- "Free". * Any Where Throughout The Mall - StarBucks included. Now 'In-the-Car' My Car AM/FM Radio -IS- "Free". * Any Where I Drive. Yes I Am Free-To-Be-Me -with- My "Free" Over-the-Air Radio ~ RHF .- Hide quoted text - So far as I can tell, we're in complete agreement about all of this. We only seem to disagree about whether there's a monthly fee that is not for electricity and not for internet but is specifically for internet radio. Can you tell us more about this fee?- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Steve, Built-in-Cost - Internet Radio as a 'Sub-Set' of the Internet Service {Access} Fee is a Built-in-Cost. -Note- This is a Direct Payment. BUT - Technically everytime that I buy a Product or Service that is Advertised on the Radio - It Too Has The Built-in-Cost of Radio Advertising [IN-IT]. -Note- This is an In-Direct Payment. In Reality - We (As Consumers) Pay for Both : At Some-Point-In-Time [.] - yes it is that simple ~ RHF .- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - That what I hoped you meant. Thanks for the clarification. Steve- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Internet Radio -can-it-be- "Kindle"d ?http://www.amazon.com/Kindle-Amazons...evice/dp/B000F... .- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - More specifically an "eRadio" Stand-A-Lone Internet Radio * Table Top AC Powered -or- Portable Long Life (40~60 Hours) Battery Powered * Phone Line / Cable Connection -or- Direct Cellular Service * No PC / No WiFi Still looking for a Toaster Like Internet Radio {eRadio} ~ RHF |
The Great Debate : Free Internet Radio - It Ain't Free ! -while-Free Over-the-Air Radio Is FREE !
On Nov 24, 11:46 pm, RHF wrote:
On Nov 24, 8:37 pm, RHF wrote: On Nov 24, 5:15 pm, Steve wrote: On Nov 24, 8:08 pm, RHF wrote: On Nov 24, 4:47 pm, Steve wrote: On Nov 24, 6:50 pm, RHF wrote: Steve, The Great Debate : Free Internet Radio - It Ain't Free ! -while- Free Over-the-Air Radio Is FREE ! [ Arguing-the-Absurd ] Question - Do You Pay For Internet Service {Access} ? Of course I pay for internet access. Hell No ! - I Have 'Free' Internet Access - * Its Free -and- Therefore Your Internet Radio Too "Is Free" ! - Lucky You :o} -OR- Are You Like the Vast Majority of Internet Users -and- Must Honestly Say : Oh Yeah ! - I "Paid" For Internet Acce$$ - It Does Cost Me Money - Every Month / Every Year . Therefore Your Internet Radio Too "Is Not Free" ! - Reality :-{ -cause- WIthout the Fees for Intenet Acce$$ : You would NOT have Your Internet Radio as Part of the Acce$$ / $ervice [.] -TBL- Internet Radio It Ain't Free [.] Of course my internet access isn't free. Nor is the electricity that I use to run my over the air radios. So what? You said that there is a monthly fee SPECIFICALLY for listening to internet radio. I would appreciate it if you would explain this, as I've yet to receive any internet radio bills in the mail. Now it is true that -if- you get your Internet Radio "At Work" : It Cost You Nothing -but- Your Employer Is Paying For Internet Acce$$. Plus -if- you get your Internet Radio "Via WiFi" at StarBucks : It Cost You Nothing -but- StarBucks Is Paying For Internet Acce$$. -and- Your Two Dollar Cup-of-Coffee was Not Free. Now 'At-Home' My Pocket AM/FM Radio -IS- "Free". * Any Where Around The House Inside and Out. Now 'At-Work' My Pocket AM/FM Radio -IS- "Free". * Any Where In The Work Place. Now 'In-Any-Store' My Pocket AM/FM Radio -IS- "Free". * Any Where Throughout The Mall - StarBucks included. Now 'In-the-Car' My Car AM/FM Radio -IS- "Free". * Any Where I Drive. Yes I Am Free-To-Be-Me -with- My "Free" Over-the-Air Radio ~ RHF .- Hide quoted text - So far as I can tell, we're in complete agreement about all of this. We only seem to disagree about whether there's a monthly fee that is not for electricity and not for internet but is specifically for internet radio. Can you tell us more about this fee?- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Steve, Built-in-Cost - Internet Radio as a 'Sub-Set' of the Internet Service {Access} Fee is a Built-in-Cost. -Note- This is a Direct Payment. BUT - Technically everytime that I buy a Product or Service that is Advertised on the Radio - It Too Has The Built-in-Cost of Radio Advertising [IN-IT]. -Note- This is an In-Direct Payment. In Reality - We (As Consumers) Pay for Both : At Some-Point-In-Time [.] - yes it is that simple ~ RHF .- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - That what I hoped you meant. Thanks for the clarification. Steve- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Internet Radio -can-it-be- "Kindle"d ?http://www.amazon.com/Kindle-Amazons...evice/dp/B000F... .- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - More specifically an "eRadio" Stand-A-Lone Internet Radio * Table Top AC Powered -or- Portable Long Life (40~60 Hours) Battery Powered * Phone Line / Cable Connection -or- Direct Cellular Service I'm not sure why this matters to you. Why do you object to wireless? A cellular connection would have horrible audio quality, and so would a phone line connection. In five years it's going to be hard to find a direct, wired connection between a computer and anything else. And you know what? When internet radio finally takes hold, some of the big threats to our AM spectrum that we fret about today will be squashed like bugs. Then you can enjoy your over the air AM radio under nice, quiet conditions again. You of all people ought to be thanking the producers of internet radio. |
The Great Debate : Free Internet Radio - It Ain't Free ! -while-Free Over-the-Air Radio Is FREE !
RHF wrote:
On Nov 24, 5:15 pm, Steve wrote: On Nov 24, 8:08 pm, RHF wrote: On Nov 24, 4:47 pm, Steve wrote: On Nov 24, 6:50 pm, RHF wrote: Steve, The Great Debate : Free Internet Radio - It Ain't Free ! -while- Free Over-the-Air Radio Is FREE ! [ Arguing-the-Absurd ] Question - Do You Pay For Internet Service {Access} ? Of course I pay for internet access. Hell No ! - I Have 'Free' Internet Access - * Its Free -and- Therefore Your Internet Radio Too "Is Free" ! - Lucky You :o} -OR- Are You Like the Vast Majority of Internet Users -and- Must Honestly Say : Oh Yeah ! - I "Paid" For Internet Acce$$ - It Does Cost Me Money - Every Month / Every Year . Therefore Your Internet Radio Too "Is Not Free" ! - Reality :-{ -cause- WIthout the Fees for Intenet Acce$$ : You would NOT have Your Internet Radio as Part of the Acce$$ / $ervice [.] -TBL- Internet Radio It Ain't Free [.] Of course my internet access isn't free. Nor is the electricity that I use to run my over the air radios. So what? You said that there is a monthly fee SPECIFICALLY for listening to internet radio. I would appreciate it if you would explain this, as I've yet to receive any internet radio bills in the mail. Now it is true that -if- you get your Internet Radio "At Work" : It Cost You Nothing -but- Your Employer Is Paying For Internet Acce$$. Plus -if- you get your Internet Radio "Via WiFi" at StarBucks : It Cost You Nothing -but- StarBucks Is Paying For Internet Acce$$. -and- Your Two Dollar Cup-of-Coffee was Not Free. Now 'At-Home' My Pocket AM/FM Radio -IS- "Free". * Any Where Around The House Inside and Out. Now 'At-Work' My Pocket AM/FM Radio -IS- "Free". * Any Where In The Work Place. Now 'In-Any-Store' My Pocket AM/FM Radio -IS- "Free". * Any Where Throughout The Mall - StarBucks included. Now 'In-the-Car' My Car AM/FM Radio -IS- "Free". * Any Where I Drive. Yes I Am Free-To-Be-Me -with- My "Free" Over-the-Air Radio ~ RHF .- Hide quoted text - So far as I can tell, we're in complete agreement about all of this. We only seem to disagree about whether there's a monthly fee that is not for electricity and not for internet but is specifically for internet radio. Can you tell us more about this fee?- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Steve, Built-in-Cost - Internet Radio as a 'Sub-Set' of the Internet Service {Access} Fee is a Built-in-Cost. -Note- This is a Direct Payment. BUT - Technically everytime that I buy a Product or Service that is Advertised on the Radio - It Too Has The Built-in-Cost of Radio Advertising [IN-IT]. -Note- This is an In-Direct Payment. In Reality - We (As Consumers) Pay for Both : At Some-Point-In-Time [.] - yes it is that simple ~ RHF .- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - That what I hoped you meant. Thanks for the clarification. Steve- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Internet Radio -can-it-be- "Kindle"d ? http://www.amazon.com/Kindle-Amazons.../dp/B000FI73MA . When I'm mo-bile... ....I still have the Sirius and the ATS-606A. When I'm home I can listen to thousands of radio stations on the old $200 Green gPC. If I want to read I'll kill a tree. http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16883118003 |
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