On Mar 8, 10:16*am, bpnjensen wrote:
On Mar 8, 4:32*am, dave wrote:





Bob Dobbs wrote:
Clive wrote:
Even on CW or
SSB I doubt most listeners can even detect 100 cycles of instability..

I can definitely tell when some station is ten or more kcs off where I'm tuned,
and go to the RIT automatically. If they continue to drift, I might chase them
awhile, but usually move on, suggesting they sober up and quit leaning on the
VFO knob.

My receiver is stable to less than a twentieth of a cycle over several months.
(Using WWV as a reference)

100 Hz is a noticeable change in pitch. *A 50 Hz step makes listening to
music on SSB very difficult. *I do my major DXing through a 250 Hz
filter, so if you drift you go bye-bye.

No kidding. *I find even 10 Hz offset uncomfortable to listen to in
music.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

That depends on the music!

On Mar 8, 1:26*pm, wrote:
On Mar 8, 10:16*am, bpnjensen wrote:





On Mar 8, 4:32*am, dave wrote:

Bob Dobbs wrote:
Clive wrote:
Even on CW or
SSB I doubt most listeners can even detect 100 cycles of instability.

I can definitely tell when some station is ten or more kcs off where I'm tuned,
and go to the RIT automatically. If they continue to drift, I might chase them
awhile, but usually move on, suggesting they sober up and quit leaning on the
VFO knob.

My receiver is stable to less than a twentieth of a cycle over several months.
(Using WWV as a reference)

100 Hz is a noticeable change in pitch. *A 50 Hz step makes listening to
music on SSB very difficult. *I do my major DXing through a 250 Hz
filter, so if you drift you go bye-bye.

No kidding. *I find even 10 Hz offset uncomfortable to listen to in
music.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

* That depends on the music!- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

True, true - I suppose some might even be improved by adjustments of
this type...

In article ,
says...
Bob Dobbs wrote:
Clive wrote:
Even on CW or
SSB I doubt most listeners can even detect 100 cycles of instability.

I can definitely tell when some station is ten or more kcs off where I'm tuned,
and go to the RIT automatically. If they continue to drift, I might chase them
awhile, but usually move on, suggesting they sober up and quit leaning on the
VFO knob.

My receiver is stable to less than a twentieth of a cycle over several months.
(Using WWV as a reference)

100 Hz is a noticeable change in pitch. A 50 Hz step makes listening to
music on SSB very difficult. I do my major DXing through a 250 Hz
filter, so if you drift you go bye-bye.


My NRD-515 tunes in 100 HZ steps and SSB would be really annoying if it
didn't have the (modified) delta tune for pitch control. 10HZ is fine,
but 1HZ, is better.
--

BDK..
Leader of the nonexistent paid shills.
Non Jew Jew Club founding member.
Former number one Kook Magnet, title passed to Iarnrod.

On Mar 8, 12:18*pm, BDK wrote:

My NRD-515 tunes in 100 HZ steps and SSB would be really annoying if it
didn't have the (modified) delta tune for pitch control. 10HZ is fine,
but 1HZ, is better.

If you have perfect pitch, it is essential! :-D

Bruce
*******
-

BDK..
Leader of the nonexistent paid shills.
Non Jew Jew Club founding member.
Former number one Kook Magnet, title passed to Iarnrod.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

In article 0161192e-0219-4616-bc73-
, says...
On Mar 8, 12:18*pm, BDK wrote:

My NRD-515 tunes in 100 HZ steps and SSB would be really annoying if it
didn't have the (modified) delta tune for pitch control. 10HZ is fine,
but 1HZ, is better.

If you have perfect pitch, it is essential! :-D

Bruce
*******
-



Apparently I do, since I've never met anyone who is as picky about pitch
as I am. When I was doing RTTY, I had a scope, but it was just something
to watch that was neat looking, I could even tune in FDM stuff by ear. I
got a 5" scope at a pawn shop not too far from where the old Universal
store was for $60. It had a blue filter on it, and visitors were always
impressed by the giant + sign.

I miss the RTTY stuff. I did have about 5 years of that and FAX before a
lot of the good stuff disappeared in January 1990, and about 10 years
later, a lot of SITOR stuff was gone too. There was some really funny
stuff on the marine channels. I have a huge, like 20 feet long, printout
of a list of "issues" on a cruise ship, including the chief engineer
going nuts and attempting to attack people with a wrench. The "issues"
ranged from not enough lifeboats, and the ones they had were rotten, the
food coolers were almost dead, and a bunch of food had spoiled. There
were no life preservers, no fire extinguishers, and on and on, and on.

After a while, I thought, "Why don't they sink the damn thing?"
--

BDK..
Leader of the nonexistent paid shills.
Non Jew Jew Club founding member.
Former number one Kook Magnet, title passed to Iarnrod.

On Mar 7, 6:56*pm, Bob Dobbs wrote:
Clive wrote:
Even on CW or
SSB I doubt most listeners can even detect 100 cycles of instability.

I can definitely tell when some station is ten or more kcs off where I'm tuned,
and go to the RIT automatically. If they continue to drift, I might chase them
awhile, but usually move on, suggesting they sober up and quit leaning on the
VFO knob.

My receiver is stable to less than a twentieth of a cycle over several months.
(Using WWV as a reference)

--

Operator Bob
Echo Charlie 42

What radio can do that? And what is the master oscillator consist of-
does it contain a cesium/rubidium stage?

On Mar 8, 1:23*pm, wrote:
On Mar 7, 6:56*pm, Bob Dobbs wrote:

My receiver is stable to less than a twentieth of a cycle over several months.
(Using WWV as a reference)

Operator Bob
Echo Charlie 42

*What radio can do that? And what is the master oscillator consist of-
does it contain a cesium/rubidium stage?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I keep wondering how you'd measure such a thing. Leave it on for
several years to see if the oscillator drifts one hertz?

Not to be too precious, but that does not sound like the best use of
one's hobby dollar to me ;-)

On 3/8/10 15:41 , bpnjensen wrote:
On Mar 8, 1:23 pm, wrote:
On Mar 7, 6:56 pm, Bob wrote:

My receiver is stable to less than a twentieth of a cycle over several months.
(Using WWV as a reference)

Operator Bob
Echo Charlie 42

What radio can do that? And what is the master oscillator consist of-
does it contain a cesium/rubidium stage?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I keep wondering how you'd measure such a thing. Leave it on for
several years to see if the oscillator drifts one hertz?

Not to be too precious, but that does not sound like the best use of
one's hobby dollar to me ;-)



I worked with one engineer who built a frequency standard using
WWV as a reference. He would hook that up to the air monitor and
compare our carrier to the reference when he did a proof.

With a fairly simple scope you could see the smallest differences
between the two frequencies. He plotted drift over a month at a
time. And could extrapolate out months at a time with surprising
precision.

He showed me how it would be a fairly simple implementation to
use the WWV derived reference signal to control the local
oscillator's stability outright.

When we went to AM stereo, we had a serious issue with platform
motion near the nulls of our 6 tower array. He synced to WWV to
reduce that locally, and did a presentation to the state
broadcasters association describing how platform motion could be
eliminated entirely by syncing to WWV as a standard across the
implementation.

It's not difficult to do. Requires little expense, and can be
applied to every receiver in one's stable.

It's possible for Bob's receivers to be as stable as WWV by
simply using WWV as a controlling reference.

On Mar 8, 3:14*pm, Bob Dobbs wrote:
bpnjensen wrote:
On Mar 8, 1:23 pm, wrote:
On Mar 7, 6:56 pm, Bob Dobbs wrote:

My receiver is stable to less than a twentieth of a cycle over several months.
(Using WWV as a reference)

Operator Bob
Echo Charlie 42

What radio can do that? And what is the master oscillator consist of-
does it contain a cesium/rubidium stage?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I keep wondering how you'd measure such a thing. *Leave it on for
several years to see if the oscillator drifts one hertz?

It might drift more that a hertz over that extended time frame,
I'm too impatient to see.
Usually check it about every other month on a boring Sunday.

Not to be too precious, but that does not sound like the best use of
one's hobby dollar to me ;-)

I don't dwell on stability to the point of obsession,
It's just one of many assets the radio has going for it.
And the hobby dollar cost, once made, is better justified
for the totality of features than any single one.
At least I'm not constantly pouring cash into the black hole of some other
hobbies. I used to be heavily into film photography g

--

Operator Bob
Echo Charlie 42- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

(sigh) the black hole of other hobbies - mine are myriad! and none
are cheap.

BJ

In article fddabec4-088d-4a74-9e3e-
, says...
On Mar 8, 3:14*pm, Bob Dobbs wrote:
bpnjensen wrote:
On Mar 8, 1:23 pm, wrote:
On Mar 7, 6:56 pm, Bob Dobbs wrote:

My receiver is stable to less than a twentieth of a cycle over several months.
(Using WWV as a reference)

Operator Bob
Echo Charlie 42

What radio can do that? And what is the master oscillator consist of-
does it contain a cesium/rubidium stage?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I keep wondering how you'd measure such a thing. *Leave it on for
several years to see if the oscillator drifts one hertz?

It might drift more that a hertz over that extended time frame,
I'm too impatient to see.
Usually check it about every other month on a boring Sunday.

Not to be too precious, but that does not sound like the best use of
one's hobby dollar to me ;-)

I don't dwell on stability to the point of obsession,
It's just one of many assets the radio has going for it.
And the hobby dollar cost, once made, is better justified
for the totality of features than any single one.
At least I'm not constantly pouring cash into the black hole of some other
hobbies. I used to be heavily into film photography g

--

Operator Bob
Echo Charlie 42- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

(sigh) the black hole of other hobbies - mine are myriad! and none
are cheap.

BJ


I can't think of a good one that is.

Mine a

Guns.
PCs.
Ham and SW radio
Hifi
Cars.
Dogs.

And sooner or later, I'll be biting on an RC truck or helicopter, it's
just a matter of time. I'll go out with the friend who is into all that,
and I get hooked again. About 20 years ago, I got into it pretty heavy,
but the constant wrecking of the car I had got to be ridiculous.
They have some trucks and buggies now, electric ones, that go well over
60 MPH, and if you have the $$, you can go over 80.

If you fly, and have insane money, you can get yourself something like
these, and really fly:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1IXQVh5IbHc

http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...45173757764810
&ei=WnCWS4q7EJneqwL99_mZAw&q=turbine+rc+jet&hl=en# docid=-
5898267244965694370

http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...45173757764810
&ei=WnCWS4q7EJneqwL99_mZAw&q=turbine+rc+jet&hl=en# docid=-
2494969889829583173

And what has to be the ultimate:

http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...45173757764810
&ei=WnCWS4q7EJneqwL99_mZAw&q=turbine+rc+jet&hl=en# docid=-
5948024731098191553


--

BDK..
Leader of the nonexistent paid shills.
Non Jew Jew Club founding member.
Former number one Kook Magnet, title passed to Iarnrod.