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Peter Newman July 24th 05 09:37 AM

The true Prophet?
 
Folks, here is an interesting (and in my view brilliant) excerpt from
a book by Sir Winston Churchill. He wrote this in 1899, when he was 25
years old.

I apologise for posting this as this is not exactly related to radio,
but given the existing world situation with Islam, I thought that I
would share this.

Peter Newman

------------------------------------------


"How dreadful are the curses which Mohammedanism lays on its votaries!
Besides the fanatical frenzy, which is as dangerous in a man as
hydrophobia in a dog, there is this fearful fatalistic apathy. The
effects are apparent in many countries. Improvident habits, slovenly
systems of agriculture, sluggish methods of commerce, and insecurity
of property exist wherever the followers of the Prophet rule or live.
A degraded sensualism deprives this life of its grace and refinement;
the next of its dignity and sanctity. The fact that in Mohammedan law
every woman must belong to some man as his absolute property, either
as a child, a wife, or a concubine, must delay the final extinction of
slavery until the faith of Islam has ceased to be a great power among
men. Individual Moslems may show splendid qualities - but the
influence of the religion paralyses the social development of those
who follow it. No stronger retrograde force exists in the world. Far
from being moribund, Mohammedanism is a militant and proselytizing
faith. It has already spread throughout Central Africa, raising
fearless warriors at every step; and were it not that Christianity is
sheltered in the strong arms of science, the science against which it
had vainly struggled, the civilisation of modern Europe might fall, as
fell the civilisation of ancient Rome."

Sir Winston Churchill, from The River War, first edition, Vol. II,
pages 248-50 (London: Longmans, Green & Co., 1899).


David July 24th 05 02:14 PM

On Sun, 24 Jul 2005 08:37:04 GMT, (Peter Newman)
wrote:


Folks, here is an interesting (and in my view brilliant) excerpt from
a book by Sir Winston Churchill. He wrote this in 1899, when he was 25
years old.

I apologise for posting this as this is not exactly related to radio,
but given the existing world situation with Islam, I thought that I
would share this.

Peter Newman

------------------------------------------


"How dreadful are the curses which Mohammedanism lays on its votaries!
Besides the fanatical frenzy, which is as dangerous in a man as
hydrophobia in a dog, there is this fearful fatalistic apathy. The
effects are apparent in many countries. Improvident habits, slovenly
systems of agriculture, sluggish methods of commerce, and insecurity
of property exist wherever the followers of the Prophet rule or live.
A degraded sensualism deprives this life of its grace and refinement;
the next of its dignity and sanctity. The fact that in Mohammedan law
every woman must belong to some man as his absolute property, either
as a child, a wife, or a concubine, must delay the final extinction of
slavery until the faith of Islam has ceased to be a great power among
men. Individual Moslems may show splendid qualities - but the
influence of the religion paralyses the social development of those
who follow it. No stronger retrograde force exists in the world. Far
from being moribund, Mohammedanism is a militant and proselytizing
faith. It has already spread throughout Central Africa, raising
fearless warriors at every step; and were it not that Christianity is
sheltered in the strong arms of science, the science against which it
had vainly struggled, the civilisation of modern Europe might fall, as
fell the civilisation of ancient Rome."

Sir Winston Churchill, from The River War, first edition, Vol. II,
pages 248-50 (London: Longmans, Green & Co., 1899).

Another crazed white guy.


Peter Newman July 24th 05 02:21 PM

On Sun, 24 Jul 2005 13:14:53 GMT, David wrote:


Sir Winston Churchill, from The River War, first edition, Vol. II,
pages 248-50 (London: Longmans, Green & Co., 1899).

Another crazed white guy.


This "crazed white guy" (as you call him) helped to save the world
from the nazis. I guess you don't like that he did that, do you?
I wonder where you live?

And I suppose you also sympathize with the islamic terrorists?

Peter Newman


dxAce July 24th 05 02:25 PM



Peter Newman wrote:

On Sun, 24 Jul 2005 13:14:53 GMT, David wrote:


Sir Winston Churchill, from The River War, first edition, Vol. II,
pages 248-50 (London: Longmans, Green & Co., 1899).

Another crazed white guy.


This "crazed white guy" (as you call him) helped to save the world
from the nazis. I guess you don't like that he did that, do you?
I wonder where you live?


He lives in California.

And I suppose you also sympathize with the islamic terrorists?


That almost certainly seems to be the case. At any rate he is certainly a menace
to civilization as we know it.

dxAce
Michigan
USA

http://www.iserv.net/~n8kdv/dxpage.htm



David July 24th 05 02:41 PM

On Sun, 24 Jul 2005 13:21:54 GMT, (Peter Newman)
wrote:


On Sun, 24 Jul 2005 13:14:53 GMT, David wrote:


Sir Winston Churchill, from The River War, first edition, Vol. II,
pages 248-50 (London: Longmans, Green & Co., 1899).

Another crazed white guy.


This "crazed white guy" (as you call him) helped to save the world
from the nazis. I guess you don't like that he did that, do you?
I wonder where you live?

And I suppose you also sympathize with the islamic terrorists?

Peter Newman

Then you suppose erroneously.

The ****ing English in large part created the Middle East mess. Don't
give me that tired old Churchill crap.


David July 24th 05 02:42 PM

On Sun, 24 Jul 2005 09:25:17 -0400, dxAce
wrote:



Peter Newman wrote:

On Sun, 24 Jul 2005 13:14:53 GMT, David wrote:


Sir Winston Churchill, from The River War, first edition, Vol. II,
pages 248-50 (London: Longmans, Green & Co., 1899).

Another crazed white guy.


This "crazed white guy" (as you call him) helped to save the world
from the nazis. I guess you don't like that he did that, do you?
I wonder where you live?


He lives in California.

And I suppose you also sympathize with the islamic terrorists?


That almost certainly seems to be the case. At any rate he is certainly a menace
to civilization as we know it.

dxAce
Michigan
USA

http://www.iserv.net/~n8kdv/dxpage.htm


If you see ''civilization'' anywhere, it's a mirage.


dxAce July 24th 05 03:01 PM



David wrote:

On Sun, 24 Jul 2005 09:25:17 -0400, dxAce
wrote:



Peter Newman wrote:

On Sun, 24 Jul 2005 13:14:53 GMT, David wrote:


Sir Winston Churchill, from The River War, first edition, Vol. II,
pages 248-50 (London: Longmans, Green & Co., 1899).

Another crazed white guy.


This "crazed white guy" (as you call him) helped to save the world
from the nazis. I guess you don't like that he did that, do you?
I wonder where you live?


He lives in California.

And I suppose you also sympathize with the islamic terrorists?


That almost certainly seems to be the case. At any rate he is certainly a menace
to civilization as we know it.

dxAce
Michigan
USA

http://www.iserv.net/~n8kdv/dxpage.htm


If you see ''civilization'' anywhere, it's a mirage.


If you don't then perhaps it's that LSD kicking in again you drug addled 'tard.

dxAce
Michigan
USA

http://www.iserv.net/~n8kdv/dxpage.htm



[email protected] July 24th 05 03:14 PM

Winston Churchill was part American,sort of.His mother was born in
America.
cuhulin


David July 24th 05 03:16 PM

On Sun, 24 Jul 2005 10:01:43 -0400, dxAce
wrote:


If you don't then perhaps it's that LSD kicking in again you drug addled 'tard.

dxAce
Michigan
USA

http://www.iserv.net/~n8kdv/dxpage.htm


????


dxAce July 24th 05 03:20 PM



David wrote:

On Sun, 24 Jul 2005 10:01:43 -0400, dxAce
wrote:

If you don't then perhaps it's that LSD kicking in again you drug addled 'tard.

dxAce
Michigan
USA

http://www.iserv.net/~n8kdv/dxpage.htm


????


Confused 'tard boy? Of course you are! It's that LSD... you're probably having a
flashback.

dxAce
Michigan
USA

http://www.iserv.net/~n8kdv/dxpage.htm



Peter Newman July 24th 05 04:11 PM

On Sun, 24 Jul 2005 13:41:59 GMT, David wrote:

On Sun, 24 Jul 2005 13:21:54 GMT, (Peter Newman)
wrote:


On Sun, 24 Jul 2005 13:14:53 GMT, David wrote:


Sir Winston Churchill, from The River War, first edition, Vol. II,
pages 248-50 (London: Longmans, Green & Co., 1899).

Another crazed white guy.


This "crazed white guy" (as you call him) helped to save the world
from the nazis. I guess you don't like that he did that, do you?
I wonder where you live?

And I suppose you also sympathize with the islamic terrorists?

Peter Newman

Then you suppose erroneously.


In that case, explain this "another crazed white guy" reply of yours.
Do I suppose correctly that perhaps you are not white and are not
entirely happy about your colour? Would it be also perhaps correct to
assume that you are a racist?

The ****ing English in large part created the Middle East mess. Don't
give me that tired old Churchill crap.


The English certainly did not create Al Qaeda. And that "old tired
Churchill" description of Islam is certainly more fitting than
anything that any politician of today would dare to say publicly.

The problem of today is Islam and its crazed Muslims - certainly not
"crazed white guys".

Peter Newman


David July 24th 05 04:37 PM

On Sun, 24 Jul 2005 15:11:21 GMT, (Peter Newman)
wrote:


The problem of today is Islam and its crazed Muslims - certainly not
"crazed white guys".

Peter Newman

The problem today is people refusing to live within their means, both
personally and nationally.

The problem today is people see the differences between one another,
not the similarities.

If you want to defeat the jihadists you do not attack their religion.
You stop giving them reasons to kill you.

Bono is right. If the West would use their riches to truly help the
starving and infirm (most of whom are incidently Muslim), while
cutting back on the greed and gluttony at home that forces us to kill
for oil, then the jihadists wouldn't be able to recruit.


John S. July 24th 05 04:41 PM



Peter Newman wrote:
Folks, here is an interesting (and in my view brilliant) excerpt from
a book by Sir Winston Churchill. He wrote this in 1899, when he was 25
years old.

I apologise for posting this as this is not exactly related to radio,
but given the existing world situation with Islam, I thought that I
would share this.

Peter Newman

------------------------------------------


"How dreadful are the curses which Mohammedanism lays on its votaries!
Besides the fanatical frenzy, which is as dangerous in a man as
hydrophobia in a dog, there is this fearful fatalistic apathy. The
effects are apparent in many countries. Improvident habits, slovenly
systems of agriculture, sluggish methods of commerce, and insecurity
of property exist wherever the followers of the Prophet rule or live.
A degraded sensualism deprives this life of its grace and refinement;
the next of its dignity and sanctity. The fact that in Mohammedan law
every woman must belong to some man as his absolute property, either
as a child, a wife, or a concubine, must delay the final extinction of
slavery until the faith of Islam has ceased to be a great power among
men. Individual Moslems may show splendid qualities - but the
influence of the religion paralyses the social development of those
who follow it. No stronger retrograde force exists in the world. Far
from being moribund, Mohammedanism is a militant and proselytizing
faith. It has already spread throughout Central Africa, raising
fearless warriors at every step; and were it not that Christianity is
sheltered in the strong arms of science, the science against which it
had vainly struggled, the civilisation of modern Europe might fall, as
fell the civilisation of ancient Rome."

Sir Winston Churchill, from The River War, first edition, Vol. II,
pages 248-50 (London: Longmans, Green & Co., 1899).


That was written during the time that Britain and Russia were engaged
in "The Great Game", or a contest of imperial superpowers to acquire
large stretches of land in central asia.


dxAce July 24th 05 04:43 PM



David wrote:

On Sun, 24 Jul 2005 15:11:21 GMT, (Peter Newman)
wrote:

The problem of today is Islam and its crazed Muslims - certainly not
"crazed white guys".

Peter Newman

The problem today is people refusing to live within their means, both
personally and nationally.


Really? Or is it simply jealousy on your part, 'tard boy?

The problem today is people see the differences between one another,
not the similarities.


Speak for yourself, 'tard boy.

If you want to defeat the jihadists you do not attack their religion.
You stop giving them reasons to kill you.


They are using their 'religion' as a reason to KILL YOU, 'tard boy.

Bono is right.


Bono is a passable musician. Other than that, he's just another 'tard boy.

If the West would use their riches to truly help the
starving and infirm (most of whom are incidently Muslim), while
cutting back on the greed and gluttony at home that forces us to kill
for oil, then the jihadists wouldn't be able to recruit.


Aha... more income re-distribution, eh, Komrade 'tard boy?

LMAO at the clueless 'tard yet again.

dxAce
Michigan
USA

http://www.iserv.net/~n8kdv/dxpage.htm



dxAce July 24th 05 04:48 PM



"John S." wrote:

Peter Newman wrote:
Folks, here is an interesting (and in my view brilliant) excerpt from
a book by Sir Winston Churchill. He wrote this in 1899, when he was 25
years old.

I apologise for posting this as this is not exactly related to radio,
but given the existing world situation with Islam, I thought that I
would share this.

Peter Newman

------------------------------------------


"How dreadful are the curses which Mohammedanism lays on its votaries!
Besides the fanatical frenzy, which is as dangerous in a man as
hydrophobia in a dog, there is this fearful fatalistic apathy. The
effects are apparent in many countries. Improvident habits, slovenly
systems of agriculture, sluggish methods of commerce, and insecurity
of property exist wherever the followers of the Prophet rule or live.
A degraded sensualism deprives this life of its grace and refinement;
the next of its dignity and sanctity. The fact that in Mohammedan law
every woman must belong to some man as his absolute property, either
as a child, a wife, or a concubine, must delay the final extinction of
slavery until the faith of Islam has ceased to be a great power among
men. Individual Moslems may show splendid qualities - but the
influence of the religion paralyses the social development of those
who follow it. No stronger retrograde force exists in the world. Far
from being moribund, Mohammedanism is a militant and proselytizing
faith. It has already spread throughout Central Africa, raising
fearless warriors at every step; and were it not that Christianity is
sheltered in the strong arms of science, the science against which it
had vainly struggled, the civilisation of modern Europe might fall, as
fell the civilisation of ancient Rome."

Sir Winston Churchill, from The River War, first edition, Vol. II,
pages 248-50 (London: Longmans, Green & Co., 1899).


That was written during the time that Britain and Russia were engaged
in "The Great Game", or a contest of imperial superpowers to acquire
large stretches of land in central asia.


Actually, 'The River War' deals with his experiences in the Sudan, which most of
us know is in Africa, rather than Asia.

dxAce
Michigan
USA

http://www.iserv.net/~n8kdv/dxpage.htm



David July 24th 05 05:15 PM

On Sun, 24 Jul 2005 11:43:53 -0400, dxAce
wrote:



If the West would use their riches to truly help the
starving and infirm (most of whom are incidently Muslim), while
cutting back on the greed and gluttony at home that forces us to kill
for oil, then the jihadists wouldn't be able to recruit.


Aha... more income re-distribution, eh, Komrade 'tard boy?

LMAO at the clueless 'tard yet again.

dxAce
Michigan
USA

http://www.iserv.net/~n8kdv/dxpage.htm

''Income redistribution''?

Like giving billions and billions to Halliburton?

Think of meaningful foreign aid as another kind of defense spending.

Big problems require radical solutions. Otherwise, we will all go
down together.


dxAce July 24th 05 05:17 PM



David wrote:

On Sun, 24 Jul 2005 11:43:53 -0400, dxAce
wrote:



If the West would use their riches to truly help the
starving and infirm (most of whom are incidently Muslim), while
cutting back on the greed and gluttony at home that forces us to kill
for oil, then the jihadists wouldn't be able to recruit.


Aha... more income re-distribution, eh, Komrade 'tard boy?

LMAO at the clueless 'tard yet again.

dxAce
Michigan
USA

http://www.iserv.net/~n8kdv/dxpage.htm

''Income redistribution''?

Like giving billions and billions to Halliburton?

Think of meaningful foreign aid as another kind of defense spending.

Big problems require radical solutions. Otherwise, we will all go
down together.


I ain't going down anywhere with you, 'tard boy!

dxAce
Michigan
USA

http://www.iserv.net/~n8kdv/dxpage.htm



Brian Hill July 24th 05 05:31 PM


"David" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 24 Jul 2005 11:43:53 -0400, dxAce
wrote:



If the West would use their riches to truly help the
starving and infirm (most of whom are incidently Muslim), while
cutting back on the greed and gluttony at home that forces us to kill
for oil, then the jihadists wouldn't be able to recruit.


Aha... more income re-distribution, eh, Komrade 'tard boy?

LMAO at the clueless 'tard yet again.

dxAce
Michigan
USA

http://www.iserv.net/~n8kdv/dxpage.htm

''Income redistribution''?

Like giving billions and billions to Halliburton?

Think of meaningful foreign aid as another kind of defense spending.

Big problems require radical solutions. Otherwise, we will all go
down together.


You know why HB gets the work? Because their the only MFs that can handle
projects of the size their getting.

B.H.



David July 24th 05 05:34 PM


I ain't going down anywhere with you, 'tard boy!

dxAce
Michigan
USA

http://www.iserv.net/~n8kdv/dxpage.htm


In flames, Sweetheart. In flames.


David July 24th 05 07:39 PM

On Sun, 24 Jul 2005 11:31:49 -0500, "Brian Hill"
wrote:




You know why HB gets the work? Because their the only MFs that can handle
projects of the size their getting.

B.H.

Cheney and Herbert Bush set the whole deal up. It's a scam.

$60 dollars a day per soldier for spoiled food.

Sailboat fuel convoys.

Billions of dollars missing.

During WW2 there was commission to provide oversight and prevent
profiteering, set up by a Democratic congress to oversee a Democratic
president. Republicans have no intention of checking up on their own.
They are swine.



running dogg July 24th 05 07:46 PM

dxAce wrote:



"John S." wrote:

Peter Newman wrote:
Folks, here is an interesting (and in my view brilliant) excerpt from
a book by Sir Winston Churchill. He wrote this in 1899, when he was 25
years old.

I apologise for posting this as this is not exactly related to radio,
but given the existing world situation with Islam, I thought that I
would share this.

Peter Newman

------------------------------------------


"How dreadful are the curses which Mohammedanism lays on its votaries!
Besides the fanatical frenzy, which is as dangerous in a man as
hydrophobia in a dog, there is this fearful fatalistic apathy. The
effects are apparent in many countries. Improvident habits, slovenly
systems of agriculture, sluggish methods of commerce, and insecurity
of property exist wherever the followers of the Prophet rule or live.
A degraded sensualism deprives this life of its grace and refinement;
the next of its dignity and sanctity. The fact that in Mohammedan law
every woman must belong to some man as his absolute property, either
as a child, a wife, or a concubine, must delay the final extinction of
slavery until the faith of Islam has ceased to be a great power among
men. Individual Moslems may show splendid qualities - but the
influence of the religion paralyses the social development of those
who follow it. No stronger retrograde force exists in the world. Far
from being moribund, Mohammedanism is a militant and proselytizing
faith. It has already spread throughout Central Africa, raising
fearless warriors at every step; and were it not that Christianity is
sheltered in the strong arms of science, the science against which it
had vainly struggled, the civilisation of modern Europe might fall, as
fell the civilisation of ancient Rome."

Sir Winston Churchill, from The River War, first edition, Vol. II,
pages 248-50 (London: Longmans, Green & Co., 1899).


That was written during the time that Britain and Russia were engaged
in "The Great Game", or a contest of imperial superpowers to acquire
large stretches of land in central asia.


Actually, 'The River War' deals with his experiences in the Sudan, which most of
us know is in Africa, rather than Asia.


Sudan is run by Muslims, mostly of Arab descent. There are Christians in
Sudan, but they're an oppressed minority, as are the blacks (as opposed
to the Arabs, who run things). The people in Darfur who have been
subjected to genocide by Arab Muslims are Black Christians. The Arab
Muslims in Sudan have been fighting civil wars against Black Christians
for decades, mostly in the south, but now in the west. One other thing:
Sudan is full of oil, most of which is inaccessible because of the wars.


----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==----
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Brian Hill July 24th 05 08:05 PM


"David" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 24 Jul 2005 11:31:49 -0500, "Brian Hill"
wrote:




You know why HB gets the work? Because their the only MFs that can handle
projects of the size their getting.

B.H.

Cheney and Herbert Bush set the whole deal up. It's a scam.

$60 dollars a day per soldier for spoiled food.

Sailboat fuel convoys.

Billions of dollars missing.

During WW2 there was commission to provide oversight and prevent
profiteering, set up by a Democratic congress to oversee a Democratic
president. Republicans have no intention of checking up on their own.
They are swine.



Yea right



Peter Newman July 24th 05 11:56 PM

On Sun, 24 Jul 2005 15:37:18 GMT, David wrote:

On Sun, 24 Jul 2005 15:11:21 GMT, (Peter Newman)
wrote:


The problem of today is Islam and its crazed Muslims - certainly not
"crazed white guys".

Peter Newman

The problem today is people refusing to live within their means, both
personally and nationally.

The problem today is people see the differences between one another,
not the similarities.

If you want to defeat the jihadists you do not attack their religion.
You stop giving them reasons to kill you.

Bono is right. If the West would use their riches to truly help the
starving and infirm (most of whom are incidently Muslim), while
cutting back on the greed and gluttony at home that forces us to kill
for oil, then the jihadists wouldn't be able to recruit.



You have not responded to my questions enquiring about your racism
implicit in your earlier "crazed white guys" statement. I understand
you have now realized its silliness.

The assertion that terrorism is somehow related to the West
not "living within their means" is a popular cliche amongst the left,
but entirely erroneous. None of the 9/11 terrorists were recruited
from poor people. Moreover, none of them specified poverty as the
cause of their act. For example, Mohammed Atta's father claims that
his son's act (of which he remains immensely proud) is just a first
shot in a long religious war.

To always look for "white man's guilt" as root causes of events is
misleading and disingenuous at the least.

Bono and Geldof are not right at all - they are simply skillful
publicity seekers. Throwing money on poor countries won't help them -
this will only promote their culture of dependency and corruption and
achieve an entirely opposite effect. What would help is establishing a
strong legal system combined with responsible law enforcement where
local business can safely take roots, and where foreign business can
safely invest to.

People like Bono and Geldof should demonstrate en masse against real
"crazy black guys" like Mugabe, the true culprits of poverty, not
against this mythical "crazy white man" supposedly responsible for all
the world's ills.

It is all too easy to blame responsibility on the West, closing one's
eye's to the real causes - which seem too politically incorrect and
uncomfortable to speak out.

The West needs to make no excuses for living well - we have worked
hard many long centuries to achieve our standard of living. We are
always happy to help - as we indeed do. But to blame us for other
countries' failures, in this case for the obvious failures of Islamic
countries, is a bit too much.

The root cause of economic and social failures of Islamic countries is
simply Islam.

Peter Newman



David July 25th 05 12:18 AM

On Sun, 24 Jul 2005 22:56:07 GMT, (Peter Newman)
wrote:


You have not responded to my questions enquiring about your racism
implicit in your earlier "crazed white guys" statement. I understand
you have now realized its silliness.

I am racist. I am an exception. Who isn't?
Otherwise, it's a popular perception.

The assertion that terrorism is somehow related to the West
not "living within their means" is a popular cliche amongst the left,
but entirely erroneous. None of the 9/11 terrorists were recruited
from poor people. Moreover, none of them specified poverty as the
cause of their act. For example, Mohammed Atta's father claims that
his son's act (of which he remains immensely proud) is just a first
shot in a long religious war.


I was speaking more in the sense that we tend to exploit the locals
while carting-off all their bananas. And we do have a record of
genocide and slavery.


Bono and Geldof are not right at all - they are simply skillful
publicity seekers. Throwing money on poor countries won't help them -
this will only promote their culture of dependency and corruption and
achieve an entirely opposite effect. What would help is establishing a
strong legal system combined with responsible law enforcement where
local business can safely take roots, and where foreign business can
safely invest to.

Fascinating.


The West needs to make no excuses for living well - we have worked
hard many long centuries to achieve our standard of living. We are
always happy to help - as we indeed do. But to blame us for other
countries' failures, in this case for the obvious failures of Islamic
countries, is a bit too much.

I don't think they want our help. I think they want us to go away.




[email protected] July 25th 05 01:28 AM

Swine? I thought we were Infadels.
cuhulin


[email protected] July 25th 05 01:42 AM

Throwing money and food to other countries,some countries,results in the
rulers of those countries siphoning off the food and money for things
that does not help those countries.
cuhulin


John Smith July 25th 05 01:55 AM

Y3VodWxpbjoNCg0KU29tZSBvZiB1cyBhcmUgIkluZmlkZWwgU3 dpbmUiLCB3ZSB0aGluayBvdXJz
ZWx2ZXMgYmV0dGVyIHRoYW4ganVzdCBtZXJlIGluZmlkZWxzIG 9yIHBsYWluIHN3aW5lLi4uDQoN
CkpvaG4NCg0KPGN1aHVsaW5Ad2VidHYubmV0PiB3cm90ZSBpbi BtZXNzYWdlIG5ld3M6ODUwOC00
MkU0MzIxMC0xNjdAc3RvcmVmdWxsLTMyNTMuYmF5LndlYnR2Lm 5ldC4uLg0KPiBTd2luZT8gSSB0
aG91Z2h0IHdlIHdlcmUgSW5mYWRlbHMuDQo+IGN1aHVsaW4NCj 4=


Peter Newman July 25th 05 01:58 PM

On Sun, 24 Jul 2005 23:18:38 GMT, David wrote:

On Sun, 24 Jul 2005 22:56:07 GMT, (Peter Newman)
wrote:


You have not responded to my questions enquiring about your racism
implicit in your earlier "crazed white guys" statement. I understand
you have now realized its silliness.

I am racist. I am an exception. Who isn't?


Well, for example, I am not a racist.

Otherwise, it's a popular perception.


What exactly?

The assertion that terrorism is somehow related to the West
not "living within their means" is a popular cliche amongst the left,
but entirely erroneous. None of the 9/11 terrorists were recruited
from poor people. Moreover, none of them specified poverty as the
cause of their act. For example, Mohammed Atta's father claims that
his son's act (of which he remains immensely proud) is just a first
shot in a long religious war.


I was speaking more in the sense that we tend to exploit the locals
while carting-off all their bananas. And we do have a record of
genocide and slavery.


If we stop buying their bananas, they will suffer even more.
And we are not "carting them away". We are buying them. The point is
that their corrupt governments steal the proceeds from their own
people - and then put them in our banks because they can't even trust
their own.

Bono and Geldof are not right at all - they are simply skillful
publicity seekers. Throwing money on poor countries won't help them -
this will only promote their culture of dependency and corruption and
achieve an entirely opposite effect. What would help is establishing a
strong legal system combined with responsible law enforcement where
local business can safely take roots, and where foreign business can
safely invest to.

Fascinating.


Perhaps so. But in any case simple and logical.

I am impressed that you have at least paused and thought about it.
Most followers of Bono and Geldof don't use their brain - they only
make agreeable noises accompanied by ape-like body movements in the
general rhythm of loud repetitive noise that is made to pass for
"music". Very impressive indeed.

The West needs to make no excuses for living well - we have worked
hard many long centuries to achieve our standard of living. We are
always happy to help - as we indeed do. But to blame us for other
countries' failures, in this case for the obvious failures of Islamic
countries, is a bit too much.

I don't think they want our help. I think they want us to go away.


Yes, the Mugabes of this world certainly want us go away (so they can
steal from and enslave their own people with impunity) - but they
still do scream for more of our "help". The impoverished populations
are desperate for us *not* to go away. But we can't help them without
first throwing out their leaders, which would be kinda politically
incorrect and unpopular. That's why "gentlemen" such as Mr Mugabe can
continue destroying their countries with impunity.

I personally recommend that you go to these impoverished places (any
of your choice) and see the primary causes of poverty for yourself -
not through the politically correct pre-chewed-for-your-consumption
rhetorics of Mr Bono, but using your own brain and observation.
Perhaps you'll then change your mind.

Peter Newman


David July 25th 05 02:33 PM

On Mon, 25 Jul 2005 12:58:39 GMT, (Peter Newman)
wrote:



Well, for example, I am not a racist.


Everyone is. It's natural to have an affinity for your own race.
That's why it's hard for white people to tell black people apart.

Otherwise, it's a popular perception.


What exactly?


That Europeans are crazy and dangerous.



If we stop buying their bananas, they will suffer even more.
And we are not "carting them away". We are buying them. The point is
that their corrupt governments steal the proceeds from their own
people - and then put them in our banks because they can't even trust
their own.

Therefore, we are complicit with their opressors. Like the Al Sauds.






David July 25th 05 02:34 PM

On Sun, 24 Jul 2005 19:42:21 -0500, wrote:

Throwing money and food to other countries,some countries,results in the
rulers of those countries siphoning off the food and money for things
that does not help those countries.
cuhulin

Mr. Bono circumvents the corrupt state authorities by using NGOs to
administer the help.


Peter Newman July 25th 05 04:15 PM

On Mon, 25 Jul 2005 13:33:53 GMT, David wrote:

On Mon, 25 Jul 2005 12:58:39 GMT, (Peter Newman)
wrote:



Well, for example, I am not a racist.


Everyone is. It's natural to have an affinity for your own race.


I would like to know your own definition of "affinity", but in its
original sense, "afinity for your own race" is certainly not the same
as racism. Racism is hatred for other races.

That's why it's hard for white people to tell black people apart.


And hard for black people tell apart white people. But this has again
absolutely nothing to do with racism; this is a well known and often
described phenomenon which deals with the way our brain cognition
processes work: Initially, we perceive only the most fundamental
distinguishing features of objects (and people's faces). Gradually,
when we are closely exposed to more such similar objects (or people's
faces), when the fundamental distinguishing details are no longer
sufficient, then we automatically add finer and finer details. As if
our brain first tries to minimize the necessary amount of descriptive
information attached to visual cues, only the bare minimum needed to
enable us to distinguish one set of features from the other, then adds
more and more as required for sufficient recognition.

For example, when I first saw an Asian, many years ago, I could not
determine if I was looking at a Chinese, Japanese, Vietnamese, Thai or
Korean, etc. - to me all Asians were looking the same. Now I can
determine this very easily, in fact easier than (for example) a
Vietnamese who never left his country. And as I have made more friends
amongst Asians, and some of my best friends are in fact Asian, I have
of course no problems at all distinguishing their faces.

Otherwise, it's a popular perception.


What exactly?


That Europeans are crazy and dangerous.


Which European countries have you been to? I don't find them in any
way more crazy and dangerous than most other peoples. Certainly very
much less so than radical Islamic immigrants in their midst.

If we stop buying their bananas, they will suffer even more.
And we are not "carting them away". We are buying them. The point is
that their corrupt governments steal the proceeds from their own
people - and then put them in our banks because they can't even trust
their own.


Therefore, we are complicit with their opressors. Like the Al Sauds.


Damned if we do (help), damned if we don't. In Afghanistand and Iraq,
we certainly did. We can't do it all, and we can't do it all at once.

Peter Newman


David July 25th 05 04:52 PM

On Mon, 25 Jul 2005 15:15:49 GMT, (Peter Newman)
wrote:


Main Entry: rac·ism
Pronunciation: 'rA-"si-z&m also -"shi-
Function: noun
1 : a belief that race is the primary determinant of human traits and
capacities and that racial differences produce an inherent superiority
of a particular race
2 : racial prejudice or discrimination

Damned if we do (help), damned if we don't. In Afghanistand and Iraq,
we certainly did. We can't do it all, and we can't do it all at once.

Peter Newman

We should quit making deals with bad guys who oppress their own
people. We need to learn to live in a sustainable manner, within our
means, in harmony with nature.

Otherwise, doom city.


Mark Zenier July 25th 05 07:02 PM

In article ,
running dogg wrote:

Sudan is run by Muslims, mostly of Arab descent. There are Christians in
Sudan, but they're an oppressed minority, as are the blacks (as opposed
to the Arabs, who run things). The people in Darfur who have been
subjected to genocide by Arab Muslims are Black Christians. The Arab


No, both sides in Dafur are Muslims. It's between the Arab pastoralists
raising their livestock, and the African farmers.

Muslims in Sudan have been fighting civil wars against Black Christians
for decades, mostly in the south, but now in the west. One other thing:
Sudan is full of oil, most of which is inaccessible because of the wars.


Mark Zenier
Googleproofaddress(account:mzenier provider:eskimo domain:com)

Peter Newman July 25th 05 11:47 PM

On Mon, 25 Jul 2005 15:52:39 GMT, David wrote:

On Mon, 25 Jul 2005 15:15:49 GMT, (Peter Newman)
wrote:


Main Entry: rac·ism
Pronunciation: 'rA-"si-z&m also -"shi-
Function: noun
1 : a belief that race is the primary determinant of human traits and
capacities and that racial differences produce an inherent superiority
of a particular race
2 : racial prejudice or discrimination


In that case, do you believe that your race is inherently superior? In
which particular regard(s)?

Damned if we do (help), damned if we don't. In Afghanistand and Iraq,
we certainly did. We can't do it all, and we can't do it all at once.

Peter Newman

We should quit making deals with bad guys who oppress their own
people. We need to learn to live in a sustainable manner, within our
means, in harmony with nature.


We are a significant part of nature, and we are certainly living in
harmony with it, precisely within our means, perfectly sustainably.
All that noble leftie talk about "unsustainability" is pure hogwash -
designed by power and publicity seekers to make us feel guilty about
ourselves.

Take it easy and enjoy life: It is surely better than it ever was, and
it is getting even better. And do something more productive than
beating everyone around yourself and preaching guilt, loathing and
hatred.

Peter Newman


David July 26th 05 12:47 AM

On Mon, 25 Jul 2005 22:47:16 GMT, (Peter Newman)
wrote:


On Mon, 25 Jul 2005 15:52:39 GMT, David wrote:

On Mon, 25 Jul 2005 15:15:49 GMT,
(Peter Newman)
wrote:


Main Entry: rac·ism
Pronunciation: 'rA-"si-z&m also -"shi-
Function: noun
1 : a belief that race is the primary determinant of human traits and
capacities and that racial differences produce an inherent superiority
of a particular race
2 : racial prejudice or discrimination


In that case, do you believe that your race is inherently superior? In
which particular regard(s)?


Of course not.

We are a significant part of nature, and we are certainly living in
harmony with it, precisely within our means, perfectly sustainably.
All that noble leftie talk about "unsustainability" is pure hogwash -
designed by power and publicity seekers to make us feel guilty about
ourselves.


That sounds faith based.

Take it easy and enjoy life: It is surely better than it ever was, and
it is getting even better. And do something more productive than
beating everyone around yourself and preaching guilt, loathing and
hatred.

You are living in a fantasy construct.



dxAce July 26th 05 01:21 AM



David wrote:

On Mon, 25 Jul 2005 22:47:16 GMT, (Peter Newman)
wrote:


On Mon, 25 Jul 2005 15:52:39 GMT, David wrote:

On Mon, 25 Jul 2005 15:15:49 GMT,
(Peter Newman)
wrote:


Main Entry: rac·ism
Pronunciation: 'rA-"si-z&m also -"shi-
Function: noun
1 : a belief that race is the primary determinant of human traits and
capacities and that racial differences produce an inherent superiority
of a particular race
2 : racial prejudice or discrimination


In that case, do you believe that your race is inherently superior? In
which particular regard(s)?


Of course not.

We are a significant part of nature, and we are certainly living in
harmony with it, precisely within our means, perfectly sustainably.
All that noble leftie talk about "unsustainability" is pure hogwash -
designed by power and publicity seekers to make us feel guilty about
ourselves.


That sounds faith based.

Take it easy and enjoy life: It is surely better than it ever was, and
it is getting even better. And do something more productive than
beating everyone around yourself and preaching guilt, loathing and
hatred.

You are living in a fantasy construct.


And you're not?

LMAO @ the 'tard.

dxAce
Michigan
USA

http://www.iserv.net/~n8kdv/dxpage.htm



David July 26th 05 02:02 AM

On Mon, 25 Jul 2005 20:21:54 -0400, dxAce
You are living in a fantasy construct.


And you're not?

LMAO @ the 'tard.

dxAce
Michigan
USA

http://www.iserv.net/~n8kdv/dxpage.htm

wrote:
Main Entry: 2con·struct
Pronunciation: 'kän-"str&kt
Function: noun
1 : something constructed by the mind: as a : a theoretical entity
the deductive study of abstract constructs -- Daniel J. Boorstin b :
a working hypothesis or concept a point of view which made "abroad"
singularly containable as a literary construct -- Jonathan Raban c :
a product of mental invention the novel... a verbal construct in
which invented human characters appear -- Anthony Burgess
2 : something produced by human effort the East bloc was always an
unnatural construct -- Walter Isaacson



Peter Newman July 26th 05 01:09 PM

On Mon, 25 Jul 2005 23:47:48 GMT, David wrote:

On Mon, 25 Jul 2005 22:47:16 GMT, (Peter Newman)
wrote:


On Mon, 25 Jul 2005 15:52:39 GMT, David wrote:

On Mon, 25 Jul 2005 15:15:49 GMT,
(Peter Newman)
wrote:


Main Entry: rac·ism
Pronunciation: 'rA-"si-z&m also -"shi-
Function: noun
1 : a belief that race is the primary determinant of human traits and
capacities and that racial differences produce an inherent superiority
of a particular race
2 : racial prejudice or discrimination


In that case, do you believe that your race is inherently superior? In
which particular regard(s)?


Of course not.


"Of course"? That's really good. In that case, how do you justify your
earlier statement about "crazy white guys"?

We are a significant part of nature, and we are certainly living in
harmony with it, precisely within our means, perfectly sustainably.
All that noble leftie talk about "unsustainability" is pure hogwash -
designed by power and publicity seekers to make us feel guilty about
ourselves.


That sounds faith based.


Firstly, it is up to those who make claims for us to be blindly
believed such unsustainability, the benefits of this mysterious
"harmony with nature", etc., to prove they are not faith-based. I
don't make any such claims which would require a proof. The onus of
proof is on the other side.

Secondly, there is a lot of objective scientific evidence to show that
all this fashionable alarmist talk about unsustainability is a
hogwash, and the romantic notions about "harmony with nature" are not
grounded in reality (and never were at any given time in the past).
But I am sure you would not want to hear the truth.

There are many folks who seem to loathe the society they are living
in, yet enjoying all its benefits; full of a pent-up anger and
inferiority complex, looking for an outlet. If you ever develop a
heart problem, I suggest you to go to a witch doctor, perfectly in
harmony with nature. Just avoid the "crazy white guy's" science at all
cost.

Take it easy and enjoy life: It is surely better than it ever was, and
it is getting even better. And do something more productive than
beating everyone around yourself and preaching guilt, loathing and
hatred.

You are living in a fantasy construct.


It would have been enough to say simply "you are living in a fantasy",
or "you are living in a fantasy world". But you just had to use the
oh-so-fashionable (in the leftie world) word "construct", didn't you.
It makes you look oh-so-smart!

I guess it's OK if you are content to *look* smart instead of *be*
smart.

Peter Newman


David July 26th 05 02:32 PM

On Tue, 26 Jul 2005 12:09:33 GMT, (Peter Newman)
wrote:

Are you a Dominionist?


Peter Newman July 26th 05 03:18 PM

On Tue, 26 Jul 2005 13:32:53 GMT, David wrote:

Are you a Dominionist?


No, I don't see the need for a human of a sound mind to subscribe to
any religion at all. (Sadly, unlike most; including yourself, it
would seem.) I rely solely on reason, logic and the scientific
method. You might perhaps say that I am an objectivist.

Peter Newman



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