Can you help me roughly CALCULATE how to increase the range of my home
Internet wireless WiFi setup to a shed 300 feet away from my house?

Presently, I can walk about half the way through the wooded area to the
shed with my laptop in hand before I lose the connection to the PCMCIA
802.11b,g Linksys card. Basically I need to gain 150 feet in "range".

But how?

At the store, I immediately become confused as I try to compare $30 USD
omnidirectional antennas (D-Link ANT24-070) that boost "power" by a claimed
7 db; $50 USD directional corner antennas (Hawking HAI15SC) that claim 15
dbi (whatever a dBi is); and $150 USD 802.11N routers that claim to boost
omnidirectional "range" by 4x (Linksys WRT300N).

How does an omnidirectional 7 db or directional 15 dBi boost in "power"
equate to range?

Approximately how many decibels of (omnidirectional or directional) power
do I really need to boost my WiFi range from about 150 feet to the 300 feet
I need?

Looking up what a decibel is
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decibel#Definition), I
calculate the D-Link ANT24-070 omnidirectional antenna gives me about 5
times the power (assuming 7 db = 10^7/10 ~= 5); but does this get me the
additional 150 feet of range to my shed?

Spending almost twice as much money on the Hawking HAI15SC directional
antenna gets me roughly 30 times the power (assuming 15 db = 10^15/10 ~=
32); but is that enough power to get me the range to my shed?

Indeed, is there some way to add a Hawking 15db antenna on the receiving
end to get 1,000 times the power (15 db + 15 db = 30 db = 10^30/10 ~=
1,000); but what would I hook the wire output from this receiving antenna
to in the shed (I can't hook it to the pcmcia card, can I)?

Given those db calculations, how do I compare the antenna options with
replacing my home 802.11b,g router with the 4X range $150 USD Linksys
802.11n WRT300N router and the required $120 USD Linksys WPC300N PCMCIA
card (assuming 6 db = 10^6/10)?Will this three-antenna 802.11n router be
forced to drop down to 1X speeds because inside my house my kid's laptops
will all be using 802.11b or 802.11g? Or can the router work on both
802.11g to one computer and on 802.11n to the other computer at the same
time?

I'm so confused!

All I want is to make a well-informed buying decision to increase my WiFi
range reliably to 300 feet to a known point.

Can you help me sort out all these very confusing variable (to me anyway)?
I have no training in electrical engineering; but I can google.

Thank you,
Beverly

"Beverly Erlebacher" wrote in message
.. .
Can you help me roughly CALCULATE how to increase the range of my
home
Internet wireless WiFi setup to a shed 300 feet away from my house?

Presently, I can walk about half the way through the wooded area to
the
shed with my laptop in hand before I lose the connection to the
PCMCIA
802.11b,g Linksys card. Basically I need to gain 150 feet in
"range".

But how?

At the store, I immediately become confused as I try to compare $30
USD
omnidirectional antennas (D-Link ANT24-070) that boost "power" by a
claimed
7 db; $50 USD directional corner antennas (Hawking HAI15SC) that
claim 15
dbi (whatever a dBi is); and $150 USD 802.11N routers that claim to
boost
omnidirectional "range" by 4x (Linksys WRT300N).

How does an omnidirectional 7 db or directional 15 dBi boost in
"power"
equate to range?

Approximately how many decibels of (omnidirectional or directional)
power
do I really need to boost my WiFi range from about 150 feet to the
300 feet
I need?

Looking up what a decibel is
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decibel#Definition), I
calculate the D-Link ANT24-070 omnidirectional antenna gives me
about 5
times the power (assuming 7 db = 10^7/10 ~= 5); but does this get me
the
additional 150 feet of range to my shed?

Spending almost twice as much money on the Hawking HAI15SC
directional
antenna gets me roughly 30 times the power (assuming 15 db =
10^15/10 ~=
32); but is that enough power to get me the range to my shed?

Indeed, is there some way to add a Hawking 15db antenna on the
receiving
end to get 1,000 times the power (15 db + 15 db = 30 db = 10^30/10
~=
1,000); but what would I hook the wire output from this receiving
antenna
to in the shed (I can't hook it to the pcmcia card, can I)?

Given those db calculations, how do I compare the antenna options
with
replacing my home 802.11b,g router with the 4X range $150 USD
Linksys
802.11n WRT300N router and the required $120 USD Linksys WPC300N
PCMCIA
card (assuming 6 db = 10^6/10)?Will this three-antenna 802.11n
router be
forced to drop down to 1X speeds because inside my house my kid's
laptops
will all be using 802.11b or 802.11g? Or can the router work on both
802.11g to one computer and on 802.11n to the other computer at the
same
time?

I'm so confused!

All I want is to make a well-informed buying decision to increase my
WiFi
range reliably to 300 feet to a known point.

Can you help me sort out all these very confusing variable (to me
anyway)?
I have no training in electrical engineering; but I can google.

Thank you,
Beverly
==========================================

Very simply - four times the transmitter power ( +6 dB ) doubles the
range.

Is your receiver sufficiently sensitive? Or is the received signal
below the noise level?
----
Reg.

Beverly Erlebacher wrote:
Can you help me roughly CALCULATE how to increase the range of my home
Internet wireless WiFi setup to a shed 300 feet away from my house?

Presently, I can walk about half the way through the wooded area to the
shed with my laptop in hand before I lose the connection to the PCMCIA
802.11b,g Linksys card. Basically I need to gain 150 feet in "range".

But how?
====================================
Having followed today's postings on this topic , I see that there is a
wooded area between your house and shed, hence there seems to be no free
line of sight between the house and the shed.
That's why it is difficult to calculate/predict the Gain you need to
penetrate the wooded area with a 2.4 GHz signal.

If you wish to use the laptop inside the shed at a fixed location it
MIGHT be good enough if you install (for example)a corner reflector yagi
(High Gain)antenna at both the house AND the shed. However then your
laptop needs a plug-in PCMCIA WiFi tansceiver with a connection for an
external antenna.
One of such units is the Make: Buffalo - Air Station Turbo G ,High Power
-unit which also has a built-in antenna.
Note : The coaxial cable between the 2 devices and their associated
antenna should be limited to only a few metres because of the high
frequency being 2.4GHz

Communication here is 2 way . Your laptop might receive the ( antenna
amplified) signal from your router located in the house ,but that does
not mean the router will receive the signal from the laptop without
additional facilities at the laptop.

Again , because of the probably partly obstructed path (wooded area) it
is difficult making any sensible calculations.

Frank GM0CSZ / KN6WH

"Highland Ham" wrote in message
...

Having followed today's postings on this topic , I see that there is a
wooded area between your house and shed, hence there seems to be no free
line of sight between the house and the shed.
That's why it is difficult to calculate/predict the Gain you need to
penetrate the wooded area with a 2.4 GHz signal.

YES - exactly.

I have been able to go laptop to laptop almost a mile with normal PCMCIA
cards, using patch antennas. (Well - normal cards modified to bring out the
signal to the antenna.) These antennas can be astonishingly directional.
Indeed, at 2.4 MHz, it is pretty easy to get antennas with amazing amounts
of gain. This translates into VERY CAREFUL aiming of the antenna. Also keep
in mind that at 2.4 GHz, RG-58 ain't gonna cut it. Most of what you put in
to one end of any normal coax will be sucked up by the coax and won't make
it out the other end. You need to use cable appropriate to the frequency.

With a wooded area, not only is it very difficult to calculate, but tiny
differences in the positioning of the two ends is going to make a huge
difference, as is summer to winter. Even a windy day is going to change
things.

Because of the small size, it can be pretty simple to build a yagi for
wireless. Yagis won' t have the gain of some of the other types of antennas,
but at the same time, they won't be nearly as critical.

Depending on your situation, you may find a directional antenna a better
choice than more power. Lots of people driving by like to "borrow" your
wireless, and I personally don't like the idea of strangers roaming my LAN,
even if they aren't typical crackers. (Seems to me that salesmen are the
most common intruders. They have learned that they can find a wireless
connection almost anywhere). I find getting coverage into the back yard,
while NOT getting coverage well into the street is a bit of a challenge.
Yes, I use encryption and MAC filtering, but I'd still rather not have lots
of wardrivers trying to break in.

...

xpyttl wrote:

I have been able to go laptop to laptop almost a mile with normal PCMCIA
cards, using patch antennas. (Well - normal cards modified to bring out the
signal to the antenna.) These antennas can be astonishingly directional.
Indeed, at 2.4 MHz, it is pretty easy to get antennas with amazing amounts
of gain.

There are restrictions on the RADIATED power, transmitter output power,
etc of unlicensed 2.4gHz transmitters, such as WiFi. You should check
them out. They vary from country to country.

If you have a ham license, then you can use 2.4gHz for data transmission,
but then you are restricted in transmission mode, encryption and data
content.

For example, the infamous Pringles can antenna was developed in the U.S. by
an FBI agent in the course of an investigation. It's use as a WiFi transmission
antenna is illegal in many places. The well pubicised long distance link in
Egypt was illegal.

Here in Israel we are limited to 100mW EIRP for civilian useage, except
for ham satellite operations which are limited to 25w.

BTW, there are limitations in the U.S. too, I just don't know them.

Geoff.

--
Geoffrey S. Mendelson, Jerusalem, Israel N3OWJ/4X1GM
IL Voice: (07)-7424-1667 IL Fax: 972-2-648-1443 U.S. Voice: 1-215-821-1838
Visit my 'blog at http://geoffstechno.livejournal.com/

"Geoffrey S. Mendelson" wrote in message
...

If you have a ham license, then you can use 2.4gHz for data transmission,
but then you are restricted in transmission mode, encryption and data
content.

And wireless channels, as well. Some of the channels are outside the U.S.
ham bands. Since this is an amateur radio newsgroup, I made the (possibly
rash) assumption that OP was aware of these limitations. For amateurs in
the U.S., the main issue is encryption. Few of us can afford to get
anywhere near the power limits at these frequencies!

...

On Tue, 4 Jul 2006 08:30:46 -0400, xpyttl wrote:

....
Indeed, at 2.4 MHz, it is pretty easy to get antennas with amazing amounts
of gain. ......

Sigh... If only that were true! HI!HI!

Jonesy
--
Marvin L Jones | jonz | W3DHJ | linux
38.24N 104.55W | @ config.com | Jonesy | OS/2
*** Killfiling google posts: http//jonz.net/ng.htm

hehe -- getting gain at the antenna isn't such a big deal ... getting the
goo TO the antenna is a whole 'nuther can of worms. It's pretty easy to
come up with 10 dB of gain and 20 dB of feedline loss! Of course, for WiFi,
we're often interested in gain AND omnidirectional -- that is something of a
challenge.

...

"Allodoxaphobia" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 4 Jul 2006 08:30:46 -0400, xpyttl wrote:

...
Indeed, at 2.4 MHz, it is pretty easy to get antennas with amazing
amounts
of gain. ......

Sigh... If only that were true! HI!HI!

Jonesy
--
Marvin L Jones | jonz | W3DHJ | linux
38.24N 104.55W | @ config.com | Jonesy | OS/2
*** Killfiling google posts: http//jonz.net/ng.htm

xpyttl wrote:
hehe -- getting gain at the antenna isn't such a big deal ... getting the
goo TO the antenna is a whole 'nuther can of worms. It's pretty easy to
come up with 10 dB of gain and 20 dB of feedline loss! Of course, for WiFi,
we're often interested in gain AND omnidirectional -- that is something of a
challenge.

POE! POE! POE! (Power over ethernet). Put the access point at the antenna,
run a cat-5 cable (4 twisted pairs) to it. Four get used for the network
connection, 4 get used for DC.

Not only does it work well, but CAT-5 wire is cheap, 2.4gHz low loss coax
is not.

Geoff.
--
Geoffrey S. Mendelson, Jerusalem, Israel N3OWJ/4X1GM
IL Voice: (07)-7424-1667 IL Fax: 972-2-648-1443 U.S. Voice: 1-215-821-1838
Visit my 'blog at http://geoffstechno.livejournal.com/