Jimmie D wrote:


Hopefully you are not really using the water pipe for a ground for your
electrical service. Hopefully your plumbing is just bonded to the electrical
ground. Dont even think about using this for lightning protection. Nothing
like having lightning run in on your plumbing while taking a bath or have it
run in on yor ground and eat about $7K worth of test equipment(my bad).

Jimmie



Electrical service grounding via water pipes is common and acceptable.
Quoting from the 2005 NEC, which is the standard used in many or most
jurisdictions in the US:

250.52 Grounding Electrodes.
(A) Electrodes Permitted for Grounding.
(1) Metal Underground Water Pipe. A metal underground water pipe in
direct contact with the earth for 3.0 m (10 ft) or more (including any
metal well casing effectively bonded to the pipe) and electrically
continuous (or made electrically continuous by bonding around insulating
joints or insulating pipe) to the points of connection of the grounding
electrode conductor and the bonding conductors. Interior metal water
piping located more than 1.52 m (5 ft) from the point of entrance to the
building shall not be used as a part of the grounding electrode system
or as a conductor to interconnect electrodes that are part of the
grounding electrode system.


I agree this is not a good solution for lightning protection.

73,
Gene
W4SZ

"Gene Fuller" wrote in message
...
Jimmie D wrote:


Hopefully you are not really using the water pipe for a ground for your
electrical service. Hopefully your plumbing is just bonded to the
electrical ground. Dont even think about using this for lightning
protection. Nothing like having lightning run in on your plumbing while
taking a bath or have it run in on yor ground and eat about $7K worth of
test equipment(my bad).

Jimmie


Electrical service grounding via water pipes is common and acceptable.
Quoting from the 2005 NEC, which is the standard used in many or most
jurisdictions in the US:

250.52 Grounding Electrodes.
(A) Electrodes Permitted for Grounding.
(1) Metal Underground Water Pipe. A metal underground water pipe in direct
contact with the earth for 3.0 m (10 ft) or more (including any metal well
casing effectively bonded to the pipe) and electrically continuous (or
made electrically continuous by bonding around insulating joints or
insulating pipe) to the points of connection of the grounding electrode
conductor and the bonding conductors. Interior metal water piping located
more than 1.52 m (5 ft) from the point of entrance to the building shall
not be used as a part of the grounding electrode system or as a conductor
to interconnect electrodes that are part of the grounding electrode
system.


I agree this is not a good solution for lightning protection.

73,
Gene
W4SZ

Very common for local code to overide this and for good reason. You never
know when a piece of metal pipe is going to be replaced with plastic so a
ground rod has to be used with the electrical service.The plumber dont know
it is being used as a ground. and the electrician doesnt know all the metal
pipe has been replaced with PVC.Ground rods are cheap and easy to install.

Jimmie

On Tue, 2 Jan 2007 00:33:03 -0500, "Jimmie D"
wrote:



Very common for local code to overide this and for good reason. You never
know when a piece of metal pipe is going to be replaced with plastic so a
ground rod has to be used with the electrical service.The plumber dont know
it is being used as a ground. and the electrician doesnt know all the metal
pipe has been replaced with PVC.Ground rods are cheap and easy to install.

Jimmie

There was a time when the expression "water pipe ground" was common.

Extra ground rods actually contribute to the risk unless the are tied
together with at least #6 wire. (NEC) Allowing the grounds to be
commoned through the power distribution will put appliances in the
loop with expensive results.

John Ferrell W8CCW

John Ferrell wrote:
On Tue, 2 Jan 2007 00:33:03 -0500, "Jimmie D"
wrote:



Very common for local code to overide this and for good reason. You never
know when a piece of metal pipe is going to be replaced with plastic so a
ground rod has to be used with the electrical service.The plumber dont know
it is being used as a ground. and the electrician doesnt know all the metal
pipe has been replaced with PVC.Ground rods are cheap and easy to install.

Jimmie

There was a time when the expression "water pipe ground" was common.

Extra ground rods actually contribute to the risk unless the are tied
together with at least #6 wire. (NEC) Allowing the grounds to be
commoned through the power distribution will put appliances in the
loop with expensive results.

John Ferrell W8CCW


Yep, that why we use "grounding" and "bonding" and why work should be
done by a certified electrician. Grounding should be taken back to a
single point so you dont get loops running through expensive
appliances.

Jimmie

"John Ferrell" wrote in message
...


snip


There was a time when the expression "water pipe ground" was common.

Extra ground rods actually contribute to the risk unless the are tied
together with at least #6 wire. (NEC) Allowing the grounds to be
commoned through the power distribution will put appliances in the
loop with expensive results.

John Ferrell W8CCW


I had an upgrade (by professional electrician) about five years ago on my 35
y/o house. He upgraded the service level from 100A to 200A, added some
outlets in the house and garage, etc ... stuff I've wanted since I moved in.
The house was built with cold-water-pipe ground and it appears to be at
least #8, maybe #6. The electrician said it could stay BUT he said code
required an additional ground stake driven into the soil near the service
entrance.

This is San Diego County CA. "Your mileage may vary."

One more thing, subject line "Yes, It's Really This Bad:" When I was a
teenager, two families in the neighborhood went all-out at Christmas with
the big outside lights. One guy said he kept blowing fuses (15A was the
standard for all the branches in all the houses), so he "solved" the problem
by substituting 25A fuses. Even as a snot-nosed kid I knew better.