Walter Maxwell wrote:
Cecil, the following is a direct quote from Steve's Comm Quart Article, Oct
1999:
"For the impedance matching network to 'work', this analysis must demonstrate
that the steady-state traveling backward power developed at the matching network
input is equal in magnitude but 180 degrees out of phase with the initial power
reflected at the matching network input. For this to occur Vback must be the
negative of VR. In this case ALL POWER TRAVELING BACKWARD TOWARDS THE
TRANSMISTTER WILL BE CANCELED, resulting in the steady-state matched condition."

Joules/sec possesses phase? Joules/sec can be canceled?
--
73, Cecil http://www.qsl.net/w5dxp

Cecil Moore wrote:

Walter Maxwell wrote:
Cecil, the following is a direct quote from Steve's Comm Quart Article, Oct
1999:
"For the impedance matching network to 'work', this analysis must demonstrate
that the steady-state traveling backward power developed at the matching network
input is equal in magnitude but 180 degrees out of phase with the initial power
reflected at the matching network input. For this to occur Vback must be the
negative of VR. In this case ALL POWER TRAVELING BACKWARD TOWARDS THE
TRANSMISTTER WILL BE CANCELED, resulting in the steady-state matched condition."

Joules/sec possesses phase? Joules/sec can be canceled?

Therein lies part of the problem with thinking that the unit
(Joules/sec) moves along a transmission line. Energy in Joules moves.
(Joules/sec) of power does not.

73, Jim AC6XG

On Thu, 03 Jun 2004 12:44:10 -0700, Jim Kelley wrote:



Cecil Moore wrote:

Walter Maxwell wrote:
Cecil, the following is a direct quote from Steve's Comm Quart Article, Oct
1999:
"For the impedance matching network to 'work', this analysis must demonstrate
that the steady-state traveling backward power developed at the matching network
input is equal in magnitude but 180 degrees out of phase with the initial power
reflected at the matching network input. For this to occur Vback must be the
negative of VR. In this case ALL POWER TRAVELING BACKWARD TOWARDS THE
TRANSMISTTER WILL BE CANCELED, resulting in the steady-state matched condition."

Joules/sec possesses phase? Joules/sec can be canceled?

Hi Jim,

Of course you're right, but that's not the point. The point is that reflected
energy is not canceled, nor does it disappear at the matching point, instead it
is re-reflected into the forward direction. This is the point that Steve
apparently doesn't understand. And this is the reason his power budget is
incorrect in his 3-part article, he ignored the energy appearing at the match
point, assuming that it disappeared, though his word is 'canceled'.

I thought my emphasis with capitalization would contain the necessary info, but
I can see now that I should have made the emphasis show that the 'canceled
energy' was erroneous, because energy cannot be canceled. In this case it is
re-reflected, a concept Steve ignores.

Therein lies part of the problem with thinking that the unit
(Joules/sec) moves along a transmission line. Energy in Joules moves.
(Joules/sec) of power does not.

73, Jim AC6XG

Sorry, Jim, I put my response in the wrong place.

Walt

Jim Kelley wrote:
Therein lies part of the problem with thinking that the unit
(Joules/sec) moves along a transmission line. Energy in Joules moves.
(Joules/sec) of power does not.

What about the Poynting Vector and Power Flow Vectors?
What about the 60 Hz "power generation" and "power
distribution" system?

Are you saying that the trailing edge of an ExH wave
is not moving? Are you saying that the ExB power in
the light from Alpha Centauri didn't come from Alpha
Centauri?
--
73, Cecil http://www.qsl.net/w5dxp

Cecil Moore wrote:

Jim Kelley wrote:
Therein lies part of the problem with thinking that the unit
(Joules/sec) moves along a transmission line. Energy in Joules moves.
(Joules/sec) of power does not.

What about the Poynting Vector and Power Flow Vectors?

What about them?

What about the 60 Hz "power generation" and "power
distribution" system?

What are you trying to imply about power generation?

"Power distribution system" is really a misnomer. In the present day
venacular it would be called exactly what it is - an "energy
distribution system".

Are you saying that the trailing edge of an ExH wave
is not moving?

I don't recall ever expressing the opinion that traveling waves don't
travel.
However mathematical formulas do not propagate along transmission
lines. Fields do, but there is no such thing as an ExB "field".

73, Jim AC6XG

Jim Kelley wrote:
... there is no such thing as an ExB "field".

Good grief, Jim, ExB is proportional to the irradiance of a light beam.
I'm sorry if my ASCII-limited character set hairlips you.
--
73, Cecil http://www.qsl.net/w5dxp



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Cecil Moore wrote:

Jim Kelley wrote:
... there is no such thing as an ExB "field".

Good grief, Jim, ExB is proportional to the irradiance of a light beam.

Good grief, Cecil, irradiance isn't a field and doesn't propagates
either!

73, Jim AC6XG

On Fri, 04 Jun 2004 09:55:56 -0700, Jim Kelley
wrote:
Cecil Moore wrote:
Good grief, Jim, ExB is proportional to the irradiance of a light beam.

Good grief, Cecil, irradiance isn't a field and doesn't propagates
either!

Hi Jim,

Nearly every posting that Cecil pens with his rustic understanding of
Optics suffers from the obvious lack of experience.

There is a certain amount of pretense in this irradiance (an archaic
radiometric term used incorrectly for photometrics in an argument that
calls for luminous flux), much like quoting I²R and not knowing what
Ohms or Amperes are.

He's lucky there are so very few that appreciate the gaffs of his
unintended humor.

73's
Richard Clark, KB7QHC

Jim Kelley wrote:
Good grief, Cecil, irradiance isn't a field and doesn't propagates
either!

As I said earlier, irradiance is proportional to the cross product
of the E-field and B-field. Why do you think we call them fields
if they are not fields?

Exactly how does the irradiance from Alpha Centauri get to
us without propagating? Methinks you are playing word games.
--
73, Cecil http://www.qsl.net/w5dxp