Some of us have encountered the wrath of our local planning
committees when erecting antennae that seemed reasonable to us,
but perhaps unreasonable to SFB neighbours.

Could we conceive of an antenna, even possible an HF beam, that
folds away into a single rod-like structure when not in use?

I have in mind the way in which quite elaborate antennae and solar
cells unfold from a satellite once it reaches orbit.

Such an antenna, if it were to be deployed only during the hours
of darkness, might also serve the needs of those who are obliged
to use stealth antennae due to restrictive covenants on the buildings
used as their shacks!

Airy R. Bean wrote:

Some of us have encountered the wrath of our local planning
committees when erecting antennae that seemed reasonable to us,
but perhaps unreasonable to SFB neighbours.

Could we conceive of an antenna, even possible an HF beam, that
folds away into a single rod-like structure when not in use?

Have you never seen a _wind-up_ mast with a beam on top?

You really need to get out more!

David.

"Airy R. Bean" wrote in message
...
Some of us have encountered the wrath of our local planning
committees when erecting antennae that seemed reasonable to us,
but perhaps unreasonable to SFB neighbours.
Could we conceive of an antenna, even possible an HF beam, that
folds away into a single rod-like structure when not in use?
I have in mind the way in which quite elaborate antennae and solar
cells unfold from a satellite once it reaches orbit.
Such an antenna, if it were to be deployed only during the hours
of darkness, might also serve the needs of those who are obliged
to use stealth antennae due to restrictive covenants on the buildings
used as their shacks!


Simple Gareth, buy a scam mast, less than 12 foot tall so no planning
problems. even Liz might approve...
Or you could try an underground dipole, perfect for inter G on the lower
bands, No RFI and a nice quiet receive. Even in your 70 foot garden you
should be able to fit an 80M dipole in a straight line.

Steve H

--
Brian Reay
www.g8osn.org.uk
www.amateurradiotraining.org.uk
FP#898

"Steve H" wrote in message
...
"Airy R. Bean" wrote in message
...
Some of us have encountered the wrath of our local planning
committees when erecting antennae that seemed reasonable to us,
but perhaps unreasonable to SFB neighbours.
Could we conceive of an antenna, even possible an HF beam, that
folds away into a single rod-like structure when not in use?
I have in mind the way in which quite elaborate antennae and solar
cells unfold from a satellite once it reaches orbit.
Such an antenna, if it were to be deployed only during the hours
of darkness, might also serve the needs of those who are obliged
to use stealth antennae due to restrictive covenants on the buildings
used as their shacks!


Simple Gareth, buy a scam mast, less than 12 foot tall so no planning
problems. even Liz might approve...
Or you could try an underground dipole, perfect for inter G on the lower
bands, No RFI and a nice quiet receive. Even in your 70 foot garden you
should be able to fit an 80M dipole in a straight line.


There is also a commercial 'roll out' antenna about. I'm sure someone
competent with a model engineering workshop could emulate it.

I've used the flat metal tape from a retractable tape measure in the past
for antenna elements- this could be the basis of a 'roll out' design.
--
Brian Reay
www.g8osn.org.uk
www.amateurradiotraining.org.uk
FP#898

"Brian Reay" wrote in message
...


--
Brian Reay
www.g8osn.org.uk
www.amateurradiotraining.org.uk
FP#898

"Steve H" wrote in message
...

There is also a commercial 'roll out' antenna about. I'm sure someone
competent with a model engineering workshop could emulate it.

I've used the flat metal tape from a retractable tape measure in the past
for antenna elements- this could be the basis of a 'roll out' design.
--
Brian Reay
www.g8osn.org.uk
www.amateurradiotraining.org.uk
FP#898


Nice idea, what about combining that with the feed mechanism from an old
printer. I was going to dump an old OKI microline printer, the feed motor is
a reversible stepper motor so should be PC controllable.

Steve H

"Steve H" wrote in message
...

There is also a commercial 'roll out' antenna about. I'm sure someone
competent with a model engineering workshop could emulate it.

I've used the flat metal tape from a retractable tape measure in the
past
for antenna elements- this could be the basis of a 'roll out' design.


Nice idea, what about combining that with the feed mechanism from an old
printer. I was going to dump an old OKI microline printer, the feed motor
is
a reversible stepper motor so should be PC controllable.


Sounds good.

I'd thought of using a similar motor for a remote ATU.

--
Brian Reay
www.g8osn.org.uk
www.amateurradiotraining.org.uk
FP#898

Steve H wrote:


Simple Gareth, buy a scam mast, less than 12 foot tall so no planning
problems. even Liz might approve...

Not so, GPDO 1995 states that structures (masts and antennas) under 3m
(~9'9") do not require planning permission, if sited at least 2m (~6'6")
from any boundary, and at least 5m (~16'3") from a neighbours building.
This is modified to the height of your ridge line (not chimney)
visible by an average sized adult standing on the pavement at the front
of your dwelling, if you have the structure attached to one of the
existing walls of your property (not the front wall visible from the
pavement). Exclusions are made for non-commercial antennas that are
similar in size to a Broadcast TV Antenna & Mast, which may be erected
on the chimney (I've had a 2 ele 6m beam on a rotator excluded under
this provision).

At my last QTH, I had no planning permission for a ground mounted
Butternut HF9V, the Planning Enforcement Officer that made a visit, said
that an application was not required as it was under 4m tall (~13'0")?!?

I'm still within the area managed by the same Planning Authority, ;-)

M5WJF

wrote:
Steve H wrote:

Simple Gareth, buy a scam mast, less than 12 foot tall so no
planning
problems. even Liz might approve...

Not so, GPDO 1995 states that structures (masts and antennas) under 3m
(~9'9") do not require planning permission, if sited at least 2m
(~6'6") from any boundary, and at least 5m (~16'3") from a neighbours
building. This is modified to the height of your ridge line (not
chimney) visible by an average sized adult standing on the pavement at
the front of your dwelling, if you have the structure attached to one
of the existing walls of your property (not the front wall visible from
the pavement). Exclusions are made for non-commercial antennas that
are similar in size to a Broadcast TV Antenna & Mast, which may be
erected on the chimney (I've had a 2 ele 6m beam on a rotator excluded
under this provision).

At my last QTH, I had no planning permission for a ground mounted
Butternut HF9V, the Planning Enforcement Officer that made a visit,
said that an application was not required as it was under 4m tall
(~13'0")?!?

Sounds like when he actually saw it, he realised it wasn't worth
bothering about after all. Since he couldn't change the law for you, he
re-valued the metre instead.

Actually Planning Officers have more discretion about "minor
developments" than they will readily admit to. By going in for an
informal chat, and taking along some mocked-up digital photographs
showing what the proposed antennas would look like, I got a letter
formally stating that my small crank-up mast and VHF yagis would not
require planning permission.

The Planning Officer came out with a big multi-part ring binder
(something along the lines of "How To Become A Planning Officer In 26
Weekly Instalments"). This had a whole chapter on amateur radio
antennas, including photos of masts and antennas that had received
planning permission, and even bigger ones that had gone through on
appeal. After he had compared those with my own modest proposal, he
became much more co-operative.

Your experience may vary, but an informal preliminary chat with the help
of some mocked-up images can never do any harm.


--
73 from Ian G3SEK 'In Practice' columnist for RadCom (RSGB)
http://www.ifwtech.co.uk/g3sek

Ian White, G3SEK wrote:


Your experience may vary, but an informal preliminary chat with the help
of some mocked-up images can never do any harm.



Yes, the very approach I'm considering for two masts in the garden, one
at 20ft to support one end of a 180ft doublet, and the other at 30ft to
support some VHF/UHF antennas, a 2.4GHz fixed dish towards an VHF NFD
Contest Site (line-of-sight at 23Km!), and I'm also considering another
Dipole or Inverted-V for HF.

The 20ft mast will shadow an existing BT telegraph pole (had thought
about using it!), and shouldn't be a problem in terms of planning or
interference (well my telephone isn't connected to it), but the 30ft
mast will have to be a wind up design as I want to experiment, and
because I'm a long way down the rear garden, it could be 60ft tall and
still wouldn't be seen from the pavement at the front of the house.
30ft or 40ft would be ample here as I'm on a hill anyway, and shall only
initially be using two small beams on a rotator, for 2m and 23cms.

M5WJF

wrote:
Ian White, G3SEK wrote:

Your experience may vary, but an informal preliminary chat with the
help of some mocked-up images can never do any harm.


Yes, the very approach I'm considering for two masts in the garden, one
at 20ft to support one end of a 180ft doublet, and the other at 30ft to
support some VHF/UHF antennas, a 2.4GHz fixed dish towards an VHF NFD
Contest Site (line-of-sight at 23Km!), and I'm also considering another
Dipole or Inverted-V for HF.

The 20ft mast will shadow an existing BT telegraph pole (had thought
about using it!), and shouldn't be a problem in terms of planning or
interference (well my telephone isn't connected to it), but the 30ft
mast will have to be a wind up design as I want to experiment, and
because I'm a long way down the rear garden, it could be 60ft tall and
still wouldn't be seen from the pavement at the front of the house.
30ft or 40ft would be ample here as I'm on a hill anyway, and shall
only initially be using two small beams on a rotator, for 2m and 23cms.

OK then, try to get into the neighbours' gardens and take some
photographs you can draw on.


--
73 from Ian G3SEK 'In Practice' columnist for RadCom (RSGB)
http://www.ifwtech.co.uk/g3sek