All,

Thanks so much for getting back on this... I am located about 50 miles
west of Gallup, NM.
I am in a trailer park so I do not have a very large lot. Also while
my super is a nice person, amything large enough to seriously ding a
trailer if it fell would not be not okay with him. My wife also wants
to put a storage shed next to the trailer fairly well adjacent to where
I mounted my first pipe into concrete. That limits my choices further.

My YF is generous enough to allow me to keep trying with this antenna,
but she is already concerned that I put $300 into it ($175 parts and
concrete, $50 tools, $75 to hire someone who speaks propane torch) and
thinks that I should leave the design and installation to a
professional, hence my question about decent mounting for less than
$1000.

For purposes of discussion the dimension limits to be about 25 to 35
foot vertical, and about 8 foot radius for mounted radials. I am
allowed to create ground counterpoises up to 40 feet long as long as
they snake into the back lot. Severe sway is not allowed as it could
spank the trailer.

One thing I have noticed is that street lamps and telephone poles are
unguyed but have no problem with this wind. Unfortunately, I am not
close enough to either of them to use them for a mounting.

(I cannot move, I am committed to staying. I got laid off by my
company in mid-september and we moved to a place where my wife could
use her new master's degree in education... and we have to stay in this
trailer right next to her school as a condition of her employment... it
is, fortunately, low rent forced housing).

Questions:

1) Since I have an 8 foot limit for radials, could I have 1/4
wavelength helical radials for 40m that could fit into an 8 foot
length?

1a) Could I do the same helical trick for the radiator as well?

2) My base 1 inch diameter galvanized pipe is presently 2 1/2 foot into
a 2 1/2 foot cube concrete filled hole with 2 1/2 foot exposed. What
could I screw in it that would not need guying, and would not bend nor
sway in 100 mph wind, and how high could I make that?

3) If I run up a metal pipe to 20 foot and then an insulated wire from
the dirt to the top alongside the pipe as my radiator, what effect will
the pipe have on the radiating wire?

Thanks again,

The Eternal Squire

wrote:

3) If I run up a metal pipe to 20 foot and then an insulated wire from
the dirt to the top alongside the pipe as my radiator, what effect will
the pipe have on the radiating wire?


*Install the pipe.

*Build a 16-17 foot tapered radiator made from telescoping lengths of
6061-T6 aluminum tubing. See the Texas Towers site for the tubing.
E-mail me about doing the design of the radiator, I'm equipped to do
the FEA stress analysis.

*Build an aluminum adapter plate to attach the radiator to the pipe.
See any "how to" type ham antenna book which includes the construction
of yagis. Use a pair of stainless steel u-bolts to attach the adapter
plate to the pipe. Use a pair of insulated clamps to attach the
radiator to the adapter plate. These are available from DXengineering.

http://www.dxengineering.com/Section...&DeptID=21#Top

*Run ONE 16-17 foot wire to the the adapter plate but do not ground it.
Instead attach it the braid of the coax. Attach the radiator to the
center conductor of the coax. Pull the "radial wire" as far away from
the trailer as possible in some direction or another.

This arrangement would give you a "sorta" inverted L or vertical dipole
type antenna instead of a ground plane.

Thanks again,

The Eternal Squire

w3rv

I have one problem... I can only get stuff from Home Depot, about 50
miles away.

The Eternal Squire

On 5 Dec 2005 13:35:11 -0800, wrote:

I have one problem... I can only get stuff from Home Depot, about 50
miles away.

You received some good detailed advice, and dismiss it because it
isn't on the shelf at Home Depot (whoever they are, presumably a major
hardware chain that has squeezed competition out of the market place).

Gee, I can get stuff from DX Engineering and a whole lot of other US
based suppliers, and I am ~ 10,000 miles away.

Think positively, go find some solutions, select the best and
implement it.

Owen
--

Excuse me very much, but isn't shipping for exotic alloy pipe going to
be more expensive than the pipe itself?

That's not negative, that's practical!

The Eternal Squire

wrote:

Excuse me very much, but isn't shipping for exotic alloy pipe going to
be more expensive than the pipe itself?

It's not "pipe", it's thin-walled very light weight high-strength
aluminum TUBING. which is about as "exotic" as CW in ham circles. Don't
ask us what the shipping costs would be, push back yer keyboard and
dial Texas towers @ (800) 272-3467 and ask them.

As to your problem with hundred-mile round trips to your nearest Home
Despot sto I have two of 'em 15 +/- minutes from here and except
for some occasional stainless nuts, bolts and cheap wire they're
useless as far as decent sources of antenna materials go.

The Mother of All REAL Hardware Stores is McMaster-Carr. 3,000 + page
of industrial-quality bits and pieces which make great antenna parts
only a phone call away. They have staineless u-bolts on top of
stainless u-bolts, aluninum stock for adapter plates, all of it . .

http://www.mcmaster.com/

(330) 342-6100 for help with finding what you want if their website
catalog comes up overwhelming.

If you're averse to online purchasing that's OK, order all your antenna
"stuff" by telephone, then sit on yer butt and wait to have it dropped
on you by UPS or FedEx within a couple days at most.

Ditto DXengineering: (800)-777-0703

That's not negative, that's practical!

You have problem with your priorities and what's up out here in
practical ham antenna realities.

The Eternal Squire

w3rv

wrote:
I have one problem... I can only get stuff from Home Depot, about 50
miles away.

If you don't have access to ordering over the internet,
how are you posting to this newsgroup?
--
73, Cecil http://www.qsl.net/w5dxp

On 5 Dec 2005 13:35:11 -0800, wrote:

I have one problem... I can only get stuff from Home Depot, about 50
miles away.

The Eternal Squire

Texas Towers, for aluminum tubing, and The Wireman, for any kind of
antenna paraphernalia, both have web sites, and phone numbers.

Jeez...

bob
k5qwg

I actually found what I hope is a solution. The KANGA 33' Telescoping
Fiberglass mast for $99 is guaranteed against breaking or shattering in
winds such as I might encounter, free replacement of broken sections if
this is so. Weighs only 4 lbs, base is 2 inches. K1CRA, the
distributor, suggested that all I needed to do was mount this against
my pipe mount with a 2X4 and U-bolts. He also distributes a sealing
agent for permanent installations. With this, he said, all I needed to
do was run wire up the mast and work against my pipe mount as connected
to the overall ground systems.

Sometimes it is the obvious which is the hardest to conceive of. I
always though high winds and high heights always needed big iron (or
copper), but I never thought that something made of an aerospace
material would be within my reach... let alone that of a ten foot Pole
or a seven foot Texan...

I'll let you know how it goes...

Thanks,

The Eternal Squire

wrote:

Questions:

1) Since I have an 8 foot limit for radials, could I have 1/4
wavelength helical radials for 40m that could fit into an 8 foot
length?

1a) Could I do the same helical trick for the radiator as well?

2) My base 1 inch diameter galvanized pipe is presently 2 1/2 foot into
a 2 1/2 foot cube concrete filled hole with 2 1/2 foot exposed. What
could I screw in it that would not need guying, and would not bend nor
sway in 100 mph wind, and how high could I make that?

3) If I run up a metal pipe to 20 foot and then an insulated wire from
the dirt to the top alongside the pipe as my radiator, what effect will
the pipe have on the radiating wire?


Sounds to me like you are trying to fit the wrong antenna into the
wrong space.

Can you put radials in/on the ground? Can they be longer than 8 feet then?

And finally, can you put up a dipole or other wire antenna? If so, your
wife isn't going to be too happy when she sees the cost difference
between the dipole and what you already spent on the vertical. Dunno if
you have many trees in your area or not. But a dipole can be pretty
good, esp if money is tight. I have both a dipole (OCF) and a vertical.
They both work better than each other.... at certain times. 8^)

ALso, what bands are you trying to run?

- 73 de Mike KB3EIA -