On 9/1/2013 9:22 PM, wrote:
Jerry Stuckle wrote:
On 9/1/2013 6:38 PM, rickman wrote:
I am going to be providing shore monitoring for a kayak trip and will be
using a VHF radio from my pickup. I am thinking of installing a unit
rather than using a handheld. I took a look at what there is available
and it seems like the prices start at just over $100 for the unit itself
running up to $500 for a fancy unit that is mounted somewhere hidden and
all the controls in a hand held mic.

Other than the obvious features like the remote mic unit, what should I
look for in getting a quality unit that will work the best without
breaking the bank. I don't want to pay $500, but I will pay $200 or
more if there is a useful difference with the ~$100 units.

I doubt I'll be mounting this in a boat although that is a possibility
someday, I do have a ski boat. But more likely is that I'll mount it at
my house on a lake to provide some amount of emergency monitoring. So I
expect to mount it in the pickup so it can be easily removed and brought
into the house. I guess that means a second antenna too.

Words of advice?


The first question would be - what country are you in?

From the wording of the post, most likely the US. The use of $100 and
$500 is a big clue, though he could be in Canada, Autralia, New
New Zealand, or Trinidad. I would highly doubt it is any of the Asian
countries that have the dollar as the national currency.


Yes, but those make a difference. And BTW, last time I was in Hong
Kong, they also used $. It has been close to 20 years, though.

And I wouldn't want to get the op in trouble by providing information
incorrect to the country he is in.

The next question woulds be - what licenses do you hold? (Very little
is available without a license). I am assuming since you are asking
these questions you don't hold an amateur radio license.

If it is the US, no licence is required for VHF marine radio for any
vessel that is NOT required to carry radio equipment and traveling in
US waters.


Are you sure about that? I do remember Dad had to get a radio license
for his boat, even though he was operating in U.S. waters off the Gulf
coast of Florida. That was a few years ago, though. And the license
was free.

However, he also was talking about SHORE monitoring - which definitely
requires a license, even for marine band.

If it is Canada, essentially the same applies.

The third question would be - what radios/bands are legal for that license?

VHF marine radios are legal for the VHF marine radio band without regard
for country.


Not entirely true. Depending on the country. Some still require
licenses, for various reasons.

Without even knowing what country you are in, the rest of the questions
are meaningless.

Anyway...

Like everything else these days, the Internet is full of reviews of VHF
marine radios.

Google is your friend.




And many of those are illegal to operate in some countries, even though
they aren't marked as such. Since he is asking here, I would expect he
wants to ensure he is legal.


--
==================
Remove the "x" from my email address
Jerry Stuckle
JDS Computer Training Corp.

==================

Jerry Stuckle wrote:
On 9/1/2013 9:22 PM, wrote:
Jerry Stuckle wrote:
On 9/1/2013 6:38 PM, rickman wrote:
I am going to be providing shore monitoring for a kayak trip and will be
using a VHF radio from my pickup. I am thinking of installing a unit
rather than using a handheld. I took a look at what there is available
and it seems like the prices start at just over $100 for the unit itself
running up to $500 for a fancy unit that is mounted somewhere hidden and
all the controls in a hand held mic.

Other than the obvious features like the remote mic unit, what should I
look for in getting a quality unit that will work the best without
breaking the bank. I don't want to pay $500, but I will pay $200 or
more if there is a useful difference with the ~$100 units.

I doubt I'll be mounting this in a boat although that is a possibility
someday, I do have a ski boat. But more likely is that I'll mount it at
my house on a lake to provide some amount of emergency monitoring. So I
expect to mount it in the pickup so it can be easily removed and brought
into the house. I guess that means a second antenna too.

Words of advice?


The first question would be - what country are you in?

From the wording of the post, most likely the US. The use of $100 and
$500 is a big clue, though he could be in Canada, Autralia, New
New Zealand, or Trinidad. I would highly doubt it is any of the Asian
countries that have the dollar as the national currency.


Yes, but those make a difference. And BTW, last time I was in Hong
Kong, they also used $. It has been close to 20 years, though.

$100 Hong Kong is $12.89 US; I doubt you will find many VHF marine
radios $12.89 US.


And I wouldn't want to get the op in trouble by providing information
incorrect to the country he is in.

The next question woulds be - what licenses do you hold? (Very little
is available without a license). I am assuming since you are asking
these questions you don't hold an amateur radio license.

If it is the US, no licence is required for VHF marine radio for any
vessel that is NOT required to carry radio equipment and traveling in
US waters.


Are you sure about that? I do remember Dad had to get a radio license
for his boat, even though he was operating in U.S. waters off the Gulf
coast of Florida. That was a few years ago, though. And the license
was free.

And at one time CB and private aircraft had to have a license; none do
anymore. Air and marine radars also used to require a license; not
anymore.

However, he also was talking about SHORE monitoring - which definitely
requires a license, even for marine band.

Nope, there is a VHF marine channel specifically for chit chat from ship
to shore.

If it is Canada, essentially the same applies.

The third question would be - what radios/bands are legal for that license?

VHF marine radios are legal for the VHF marine radio band without regard
for country.


Not entirely true. Depending on the country. Some still require
licenses, for various reasons.

That wasn't the issue.

The VHF marine band seems to be essentially the same with some differences
in channel assignment world wide.

Without even knowing what country you are in, the rest of the questions
are meaningless.

Anyway...

Like everything else these days, the Internet is full of reviews of VHF
marine radios.

Google is your friend.




And many of those are illegal to operate in some countries, even though
they aren't marked as such. Since he is asking here, I would expect he
wants to ensure he is legal.

I don't think reviews are illegal to operate in any country, though maybe
North Korea...

Oh, perhaps you meant buying a radio from the Internet; no I wouldn't
reccomend that unless the dealer was in my country if for no other reason
than to make sure the channels were set up for the idiosyncrasies of my
country.


--
Jim Pennino

wrote:

I don't think reviews are illegal to operate in any country, though maybe
North Korea...

The US has specific rules and regulations about land use of marine
frequencies. It would be best to find them out, there is a rumor floating
around the internet about an FCC officer happening to be at return end
of a boat rental stopping people and issuing NALs for people using
non approved or unlicensed radios for FRS GMRS and marine services.

Basically, you are licensed by use of a VHF marine radio ON A BOAT, but
having or using that radio in a car or building, or using it on land,
for example in a boat in your backyard is restricted.

There also is a story floating around the internet of a logging company
using marine radios on their boats and trucks being fined by the FCC.

Best to check it out from someone who knows the right answer before you
spend any money or get in trouble.

Geoff.


--
Geoffrey S. Mendelson, N3OWJ/4X1GM/KBUH7245/KBUW5379

Geoffrey S. Mendelson wrote:
wrote:

I don't think reviews are illegal to operate in any country, though maybe
North Korea...

Another speed reader...

What I said was "I don't think *reviews* are illegal.

The US has specific rules and regulations about land use of marine
frequencies. It would be best to find them out, there is a rumor floating
around the internet about an FCC officer happening to be at return end
of a boat rental stopping people and issuing NALs for people using
non approved or unlicensed radios for FRS GMRS and marine services.

Basically, you are licensed by use of a VHF marine radio ON A BOAT, but
having or using that radio in a car or building, or using it on land,
for example in a boat in your backyard is restricted.

He said he wanted to monitor on land. Monitoring on land is not restricted.

There also is a story floating around the internet of a logging company
using marine radios on their boats and trucks being fined by the FCC.

Which is an obvious violation.



--
Jim Pennino

You can monitor anything - that does not require a license to do.

However, there is a range restriction when operating on land.
So many feet away from the water.

Your groups needs would be better served with a bunch of bubble pack GMRS radios - the amount of power has very little to do with the range.

Range is dependent on a clear line of sight and the height of the antenna's and the loss in the feed lines.

On 9/2/2013 1:03 PM, wrote:
Geoffrey S. wrote:

He said he wanted to monitor on land. Monitoring on land is not restricted.

Perhaps I shouldn't have used the word "monitor". I do expect to
communicate with the kayaks.


There also is a story floating around the internet of a logging company
using marine radios on their boats and trucks being fined by the FCC.

Which is an obvious violation.

Where is the violation? As long as the trucks are only transmitting to
the ships, isn't that ok? Just having them shouldn't be a problem. The
issue is how you use them, no?

--

Rick

rickman wrote:

Where is the violation? As long as the trucks are only transmitting to
the ships, isn't that ok? Just having them shouldn't be a problem. The
issue is how you use them, no?


No. It is NOT OK.

http://wireless.fcc.gov/services/ind...stations#Using Hand-Held Marine VHF Radios on Land

Geoff.

--
Geoffrey S. Mendelson, N3OWJ/4X1GM/KBUH7245/KBUW5379

Geoffrey S. Mendelson wrote:
rickman wrote:

Where is the violation? As long as the trucks are only transmitting to
the ships, isn't that ok? Just having them shouldn't be a problem. The
issue is how you use them, no?


No. It is NOT OK.

http://wireless.fcc.gov/services/ind...stations#Using Hand-Held Marine VHF Radios on Land

Geoff.

Note that the question asked was "Just having them".

If the trucks just have them, only monitor, and never transmit, they are
legal.


--
Jim Pennino

rickman wrote:
On 9/2/2013 1:03 PM, wrote:
Geoffrey S. wrote:

He said he wanted to monitor on land. Monitoring on land is not restricted.

Perhaps I shouldn't have used the word "monitor". I do expect to
communicate with the kayaks.


There also is a story floating around the internet of a logging company
using marine radios on their boats and trucks being fined by the FCC.

Which is an obvious violation.

Where is the violation? As long as the trucks are only transmitting to
the ships, isn't that ok? Just having them shouldn't be a problem. The
issue is how you use them, no?

It depends.

Each truck has to have a license to transmit, but boats do not. If the
trucks are just monitoring and never transmit, they do not need a license.

Even if the trucks have licenses, the VHF marine band is restricted to
communications related to marine "stuff".

Do something like scheduling trucks would be a business use and would
not be appropriate for the marine band.





--
Jim Pennino

On 9/2/2013 4:49 AM, Geoffrey S. Mendelson wrote:
wrote:

I don't think reviews are illegal to operate in any country, though maybe
North Korea...

The US has specific rules and regulations about land use of marine
frequencies. It would be best to find them out, there is a rumor floating
around the internet about an FCC officer happening to be at return end
of a boat rental stopping people and issuing NALs for people using
non approved or unlicensed radios for FRS GMRS and marine services.

Basically, you are licensed by use of a VHF marine radio ON A BOAT, but
having or using that radio in a car or building, or using it on land,
for example in a boat in your backyard is restricted.

There also is a story floating around the internet of a logging company
using marine radios on their boats and trucks being fined by the FCC.

Best to check it out from someone who knows the right answer before you
spend any money or get in trouble.

I have to say I didn't expect quite so much drama in what I thought was
a simple request. I don't mean you specifically, but the thread as a
whole.

Yes, I am in the US. The radio will be used to support marine
communications which is legal by my understanding. Shore operation is
ok as long as one end is a ship. My specific purpose is to support a
kayak trip in a couple of weeks. We have had some bad weather before
and found it difficult to communicate with the kayaks depending on their
location because of the limited power of the hand held units. I'd like
to improve on this by using a higher power transmitter and a better
antenna. This will likely be used for monitoring the emergency channel
at a lake house when not used to support kayaks. I thought I explained
this in my original post other than the country. Oh, and I don't have a
license.

BTW, I didn't find much in the way of reviews. Mostly I find ads. Is
there a good review site for marine VHF? For kayaks that would be
paddling.com

I also would appreciate any advice on mounting in the pickup. I'm
thinking on the back of the cab but I'm not sure how the cable would
then run. It might poke out behind a passenger's head...

--

Rick